Devilfish
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737 Awacs For India?

Sun Oct 24, 2010 10:43 pm

India Defence reported that Boeing has offered its 737 AEW&C system to India.....

http://www.india-defence.com/reports-4658

Quote:
"2010-10-21 Boeing Vice President and India Chief Mr. Vivek Lall confirmed in an interview to Press Trust of India that the American defense and aerospace major has briefed the Indian Air Force and Indian Navy of the B737-700 AWACS platform in response to a Request for Information (RFI) issued by the Ministry of Defence.

The AWACS platform provides for long distance beyond horizon radar coverage and it encompasses both the B 737-700 aircraft platform with a variety of aircraft control and advanced radar systems."



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It will likely be similar to Turkey's Peace Eagle or Australia's Wedgetail. If successful, India could be the first operator of both ISR variants of the 737.


http://media.defenseindustrydaily.com/images/AIR_P-8i_Concept_lg.jpg
http://media.defenseindustrydaily.com/images/AIR_P-8i_Concept_lg.jpg

It is understood that the RFI was also issued to other ISR platform manufacturers.

http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/...-Moving-Forward-on-2-Fronts-04855/



[Edited 2010-10-24 15:56:10]
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kc135topboom
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RE: 737 Awacs For India?

Mon Oct 25, 2010 12:23 pm

Why would India do this? They already have AWACS versions of the Il-76 and E-145. A B-737 version would make it 3 different types with 3 different radars, spread across an AWACS fleet size of about 12 aircraft.
 
hka098
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RE: 737 Awacs For India?

Mon Oct 25, 2010 2:13 pm

Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 1):

My question too. Though, India seems to love spending money on defense...
 
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bikerthai
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RE: 737 Awacs For India?

Mon Oct 25, 2010 2:36 pm

Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 1):
Why would India do this? They already have AWACS versions of the Il-76 and E-145

The same reason why they are looking for replacement tankers. I think they are dissatisfied with the Il-76 airframe.

The 737 AEW&C would operate nicely in conjunction with the smaller E-145. You also get the increased battle management capabilities with the larger 737 that you can't quite handle in the smaller E-145.

Finally, if the Indian Navy are going to get the P-8I, then of course, the Indian Air Force would need something comparable.   

Here is an update on the Australian Wedgetail.
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nati...e-off/story-e6frg8yo-1225940238011

Apparently the hardware is working fine! It's the software that needs be be ironed out. Which is good news.

Now, if India chooses the 737 as a tanker as well, they will have ubber commonality across their fleet.

After all, they don't need the cargo carrying capability now that they are getting the C-17 and a 737 is much cheaper than a 767 or a A330.

bikerthai
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Devilfish
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RE: 737 Awacs For India?

Tue Oct 26, 2010 10:06 pm

Quoting bikerthai (Reply 3):
Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 1):
Why would India do this? They already have AWACS versions of the Il-76 and E-145

The same reason why they are looking for replacement tankers. I think they are dissatisfied with the Il-76 airframe.

The second linked article at the thread's start gives various reasons for this approach. Also, I guess they have grown wary with Adm Gorshkov and would like to have a fallback position, just in case.


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One nagging question I can't discard is whether India would go after the Sentinels now that the RAF has declared it will retire those after Afghanistan. Second hand, true....but fairly new and capable.
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kc135topboom
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RE: 737 Awacs For India?

Tue Oct 26, 2010 11:24 pm

Quoting bikerthai (Reply 3):
Now, if India chooses the 737 as a tanker as well, they will have ubber commonality across their fleet.

I'm not sure about that. The only B-737NG model that would make a reasonable tanker would be the B-737-700ER, and even then, just a tactical tanker. It would not provide enough fuel for the P-8Is mission, nor the C-17A. India would be better off with a B-767-200ER tanker, either a new build, or a converted one.
 
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bikerthai
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RE: 737 Awacs For India?

Thu Oct 28, 2010 3:20 pm

Quoting DEVILFISH (Reply 4):
whether India would go after the Sentinels now that the RAF

Boeing is pitching the same ground search radar functionality on their P-8A variant. The extra capability you will get with the higher cost would be the ground attack capability (bomb bay and wing pod).

bikerthai
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Devilfish
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RE: 737 Awacs For India?

Wed Feb 02, 2011 3:25 pm

Update:

Aviation Week reports that the EMB-145 platform is to rollout Feb 21 and will be flown to India in August for integration of their indigenous AEW&C radar.....

http://www.aviationweek.com/aw/gener...%20Indian%20AEW&C%20On%20Feb.%2021


..... instead of shipping the set to Brazil as originally planned.....

http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/...-Moving-Forward-on-2-Fronts-04855/

Quote:
"Nov 9/10: IANS reports that India's indigenously-developed AEW&C radar system will be sent to Brazil 'shortly', to be integrated with an Embraer 145 jet. DRDO's Chief Controller (SI) Prahlada, told India Strategic defence magazine that the first base jet for the program is due to roll out in January 2011, and the Indian AEW&C radar will be integrated on it by the end of 2011. That would allow testing and certification, which will take a couple of years."

Quoting bikerthai (Reply 6):

Boeing is pitching the same ground search radar functionality on their P-8A variant.

And this describes the 737-700 based AEW&C platform.....

http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...-by-737-mesa-and-perseverance.html
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redflyer
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RE: 737 Awacs For India?

Thu Feb 03, 2011 6:10 am

Quoting hka098 (Reply 2):
Though, India seems to love spending money on defense...

Given Pakistan's nuclear armament and potential instability, I think they have good reason to love spending money on defense. I'm sure they also have a wary eye on their neighbor, China, which has made huge advances militarily. They've fought wars with both in the last half century so I've no doubt they are keen to keep up as much as they can with the latest military hardware available.

Quoting bikerthai (Reply 3):
The same reason why they are looking for replacement tankers. I think they are dissatisfied with the Il-76 airframe.

Isn't the Il-76 an old design? It would obviously have a lot of shortcomings compared to what's available today.
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Devilfish
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RE: 737 Awacs For India?

Thu Feb 03, 2011 4:27 pm

Quoting redflyer (Reply 8):
Quoting hka098 (Reply 2):
Though, India seems to love spending money on defense...

Given Pakistan's nuclear armament and potential instability, I think they have good reason to love spending money on defense.

It may be a big part of the reason why India is so determined to integrate their indigenous radar on the EMB-145 instead of the usual OTS Erieye which Pakistan now operates on their SAAB 2000.....

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http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...-first-saab-2000-aew-aircraft.html

http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...ve-first-zdk-03-aewc-aircraft.html

Quoting redflyer (Reply 8):
Isn't the Il-76 an old design? It would obviously have a lot of shortcomings compared to what's available today.

Maybe for the tankers, but reportedly, Elta has upgraded the systems on this latest AWACS delivery that it is now much better than the two previous examples.....

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http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/...-Moving-Forward-on-2-Fronts-04855/

Quote:
"Jan 12/11: India’s 3rd Phalcon aircraft is performing long-duration flights over Israel and the Mediterranean using 'some very complex scenarios', with Indian Air Force personnel aboard. The planes also reportedly have some additional features, as India requested 'unspecified additional capabilities' for its 3rd Phalcon plane. The most likely additions would involve additional radar modes for maritime and/or ground coverage, and improved signals intelligence intercept & location capability."

http://media.defenseindustrydaily.com/images/AIR_IL-76_Phalcon_Lands_India_2009-05-25_lg.jpg
http://media.defenseindustrydaily.co...lcon_Lands_India_2009-05-25_lg.jpg


[Edited 2011-02-03 09:22:28]
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redflyer
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RE: 737 Awacs For India?

Thu Feb 03, 2011 5:38 pm

Quoting DEVILFISH (Reply 9):
Maybe for the tankers, but reportedly, Elta has upgraded the systems on this latest AWACS delivery that it is now much better than the two previous examples.....

Very nice looking bird...almost sinister in appearance. Thanks for the photos and info.
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bikerthai
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RE: 737 Awacs For India?

Mon Feb 07, 2011 4:15 pm

Anyone in the know can address the question of whether any of the radar systems above have a better chance of detecting stealthy object like the new Chinese stealth plane?

The 737 AEW&C radar is supposed to improve your chances.

Also remember that not all MESA radar are created equal. The more radar sensor area you have, the more power you can put on a target.

bikerthai
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Devilfish
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RE: 737 Awacs For India?

Wed Dec 07, 2011 6:07 pm

Update:

India's first medium AEW&C aircraft that will carry an indigenous sensor suite has made its first flight.....

.

http://www.defense-aerospace.com/art...irst-indian-aew%26c-aircraft.html#

Quote:
"Based on the proven Embraer ERJ 145 regional jet, the aircraft features an in-flight refueling system, SATCOM capability, a significant increase in electrical and cooling capacities, and a comprehensive set of aerodynamic and structural changes. These improvements will allow the installation of the advanced electronic systems currently being developed by India’s Defence Research & Development Organisation (DRDO) with CABS (Centre for Airborne Systems) as the nodal agency."


This brings the IAF's plan to field both long and medium range AWACS platforms closer to completion.
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