lax777lr
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US Military Leaving Iraq - Airlift

Thu Dec 15, 2011 3:33 pm

WIth the US military formerly ending the war in Iraq (no political snipes please), it seems that it is a massive and immediate departure of troops back to the US. Is there a corresponding massive lift using commercial birds to get the troops home? Any insight or details regarding a/c, flights, etc. from those in the know? Cheers.
 
packcheer
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RE: US Military Leaving Iraq - Airlift

Thu Dec 15, 2011 4:19 pm

I heard this morning that there was about 4,000 troops left in Iraq, and most have already withdrawn to Kuwait.

I'm not sure if this means there are 4,000 left in Iraq and an additional whole bunch in Kuwait, or if it means msot of those 4,000 are already in Kuwait.

Either way, the news showed a DL 744 loading up to bring a bunch back.
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Rdh3e
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RE: US Military Leaving Iraq - Airlift

Thu Dec 15, 2011 4:29 pm

Quoting packcheer (Reply 1):
Either way, the news showed a DL 744 loading up to bring a bunch back.

I'm sure some will also utilize the UA KWI-IAD service.
 
NUAir
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RE: US Military Leaving Iraq - Airlift

Thu Dec 15, 2011 4:45 pm

On the BBC this morning they were showing a North American 767...not sure if it was live/actual footage or just taken from the vaults.
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SANMAN66
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RE: US Military Leaving Iraq - Airlift

Thu Dec 15, 2011 4:54 pm

Quoting NUAir (Reply 3):
On the BBC this morning they were showing a North American 767...not sure if it was live/actual footage or just taken from the vaults.

Most likely it was recent. North American does a lot of military charters. In fact, when I returned from my Iraq
deployment in 2009, we flew back on a North American 763 from KWI. Normally it's World Airways ,North American,
and OAI that does military charters.
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ukoverlander
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RE: US Military Leaving Iraq - Airlift

Thu Dec 15, 2011 5:00 pm

It's time like this when you really need an Air Austral A380!!!!! Maybe they can charter that to bring troops home from the next war.
 
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par13del
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RE: US Military Leaving Iraq - Airlift

Thu Dec 15, 2011 8:01 pm

Quoting ukoverlander (Reply 5):
Maybe they can charter that to bring troops home from the next war.

Or maybe they can use the same urgency they did when initially sending them over, roll out as many AirForce C-17, C-5A's and as much charters as they can get, yes its costly but no one paid too much attention to that when they were needed in theatre.
I hope no one is actually taking the slow boat home with some of the hardware.
 
Spacepope
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RE: US Military Leaving Iraq - Airlift

Thu Dec 15, 2011 9:17 pm

Quoting ukoverlander (Reply 5):
It's time like this when you really need an Air Austral A380!!!!!

Oh come now, haven't they suffered enough?
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canoecarrier
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RE: US Military Leaving Iraq - Airlift

Thu Dec 15, 2011 10:11 pm

Quoting lax777lr (Thread starter):
WIth the US military formerly ending the war in Iraq (no political snipes please), it seems that it is a massive and immediate departure of troops back to the US. Is there a corresponding massive lift using commercial birds to get the troops home? Any insight or details regarding a/c, flights, etc. from those in the know?

I got an email into a friend of mine in Kuwait that would know some of that stuff. I doubt it's something that would go against OpSec but if it is I won't share it. They are training a bunch of support troops on SAWs so they can ride along on the last convoy south.

Quoting par13del (Reply 6):
Or maybe they can use the same urgency they did when initially sending them over, roll out as many AirForce C-17, C-5A's and as much charters as they can get, yes its costly but no one paid too much attention to that when they were needed in theatre.
I hope no one is actually taking the slow boat home with some of the hardware.

It was a pretty rapid demobilization, I doubt anyone was dragging their feet when Obama said we'd be out by the end of the year.
The beatings will continue until morale improves
 
zanl188
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RE: US Military Leaving Iraq - Airlift

Fri Dec 16, 2011 12:06 am

Quoting lax777lr (Thread starter):
Is there a corresponding massive lift using commercial birds to get the troops home? Any insight or details regarding a/c, flights, etc. from those in the know?

Not really. The drawdown has been underway in some capacity since 2008. All you really have to do is stop replacing people that are due to rotate out, & voila, you have a drawdown.

Look at it this way: 4000 troops left in Iraq. That's enough to keep one 747 busy for 8 to 10 days maybe less & that's it.

[Edited 2011-12-15 16:15:29]
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canoecarrier
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RE: US Military Leaving Iraq - Airlift

Fri Dec 16, 2011 12:44 am

Quoting ZANL188 (Reply 9):
Not really. The drawdown has been underway in some capacity since 2008. All you really have to do is stop replacing people that are due to rotate out, & voila, you have a drawdown.

Well there were 45,000 there in September, 39,000 in October. It still requires the removal of equipment. From what I saw today, they left a lot behind as in computers, desks, flat screens, etc. Too expensive to transport home. Don't disagree with you, but I bet it was a little disorganized at the end, otherwise the NY Times wouldn't have found classified documents warming an Iraqi salvage yard workers lunch.

I'm more interested in what they did with the salvage yards full of damaged equipment. I bet we left them there.
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Tugger
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RE: US Military Leaving Iraq - Airlift

Fri Dec 16, 2011 12:51 am

Quoting canoecarrier (Reply 10):
I'm more interested in what they did with the salvage yards full of damaged equipment. I bet we left them there.

Interesting article in Business Week:

Quote:
As the Army’s logistics chief for the Iraq drawdown, it’s Richardson’s job to tally all the equipment and supplies the Pentagon has shipped to Iraq over eight years of war, and to make sure none is inadvertently left behind on Dec. 31, the day the U.S. officially clears out. When he took the assignment in September 2010, the Army had identified just over 2 million items at 92 bases that had to be sent back to the U.S., moved to Afghanistan, sold, given away, or destroyed. He estimated it would take about 20,000 truckloads to get all of it. “In the Army we count everything,” says Richardson, who is based at Camp Buehring in Kuwait, where the U.S. military is staging the withdrawal.

Leaving Iraq has required a mobilization of troops and equipment rivaling a military invasion, only in reverse. Throughout the fall, tens of thousands of trucks traveled from Iraq to Jordan and Kuwait. As of mid-December, all but 50,000 items on Richardson’s massive spreadsheet had been hauled away, and only two bases remained operational. Alan F. Estevez, Assistant Defense Secretary for Logistics and Materiel Readiness, likens the occupation of Iraq to renting a house and spending eight years filling every room, closet, and crawl space with your stuff. “And now you’re leaving that house,” he says. “Massive, massive logistical function.” (Civilian translation: Moving is such a drag.)

The Pentagon will reclaim a lot of the equipment, including Black Hawk helicopters, M1 Abrams tanks, Bradley Fighting Vehicles, body armor, and radios, which will be shipped back to Army units in the U.S. Generators will be sent to U.S. Marines stationed in Bahrain. Armored vehicles known as MRAPs—Mine Resistant Ambush Protected—that once shielded soldiers from roadside bombs will be put to new use protecting troops in Afghanistan. After years of heavy use, some gear such as outdated Internet routers will be incinerated or wind up in Kuwaiti junkyards.
http://www.businessweek.com/magazine...d-to-invade-a-nation-12142011.html

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zanl188
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RE: US Military Leaving Iraq - Airlift

Fri Dec 16, 2011 1:49 am

Quoting canoecarrier (Reply 10):
Well there were 45,000 there in September, 39,000 in October.

Well ok those 6000 folks keep our 1 747 busy for two weeks. Not exactly the massive airlift the OP refers to

Quoting canoecarrier (Reply 10):
It still requires the removal of equipment.

Vast majority of equipment goes by boat. The fast sealift ships might be busy - I haven't checked on them lately.

Quoting canoecarrier (Reply 10):
Too expensive to transport home.

A LOT of the stuff we airlift to a war zone is worth less than the airlift used to transport it. So it either doesn't come home or comes home by boat.
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canoecarrier
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RE: US Military Leaving Iraq - Airlift

Fri Dec 16, 2011 5:02 pm

Quoting ZANL188 (Reply 12):
Vast majority of equipment goes by boat. The fast sealift ships might be busy - I haven't checked on them lately.

In cases like this I'm not sure all or even most of the equipment being shipped would need to go by fast sealift.

Quoting ZANL188 (Reply 12):
A LOT of the stuff we airlift to a war zone is worth less than the airlift used to transport it. So it either doesn't come home or comes home by boat.

It does make sense. Even here in the States if you close a business sometimes it's better to get whatever you can for the equipment or even throw it away rather than pay to have it shipped to another operating office.

Quoting ZANL188 (Reply 12):
Well ok those 6000 folks keep our 1 747 busy for two weeks. Not exactly the massive airlift the OP refers to

Agreed. Any rolling stock the US has left would likely be driven out and shipped to points beyond via Kuwait.
The beatings will continue until morale improves
 
canoecarrier
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RE: US Military Leaving Iraq - Airlift

Fri Dec 16, 2011 7:03 pm

My friend in Kuwait said that the units in theater took all serviceable material and line items containerized them and sent from Iraq to the Theater Redistribution Center at Camp Arifjan, Kuwait. From there they were inspected, classified and redistributed back into the Army supply system.

Over a 3 month period starting around October 16th over 4,000 vehicles and a million tons of other equipment were moved.
The beatings will continue until morale improves
 
zanl188
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RE: US Military Leaving Iraq - Airlift

Fri Dec 16, 2011 10:49 pm

Quoting canoecarrier (Reply 13):
In cases like this I'm not sure all or even most of the equipment being shipped would need to go by fast sealift.

Just a flight o' fancy on my part. Probably Transcom has been rerouting charters during their routine round robins. The fast sealift ships are/were FAST - just the logistics geek in me would like to see'em run!.

edit: Wiki page on the fast sealift ships

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Algol_class_vehicle_cargo_ship

[Edited 2011-12-16 14:53:32]
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Hamfist
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RE: US Military Leaving Iraq - Airlift

Mon Dec 19, 2011 9:54 pm

I'm curious how long we will keep forces in Kuwait. We've been there for right at 20 years now. Seems almost certain that a presence will be kept there to provide transitional support. Maybe something similar to the days of Southern/Northern Watch for a while until the new Iraqi government demonstrates they can fully sustain themselves.

How much support for operations in Afghanistan goes through Kuwait?

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