zak
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Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sat Feb 02, 2013 9:39 am

Apparently Iran has rolled out a new stealth fighter called Qaher-313. After glancing over the pictures i can't help but firmly conclude that this PR-Stunt of sorts is nothing but a mock up.

Here are pictures:
http://www.mehrnews.com/en/newsdetail.aspx?NewsID=1806008
10=2
 
checksixx
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sat Feb 02, 2013 10:23 am

Freakin' hilarious!!!! Look at the size of the canopy on that thing!!! Is there even room for an engine...let alone weapons in the body???
 
BMI727
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sat Feb 02, 2013 11:09 am

Quoting zak (Thread starter):
After glancing over the pictures i can't help but firmly conclude that this PR-Stunt of sorts is nothing but a mock up.

At most this has to be some sort of proof of concept demonstrator. It may be an actual plane, but just looking at it I see no way it could carry enough fuel and internal weapons to be anything approaching useful. Of course, America also had to go through this stage too in order to come up with a useful fighter, but there's really no reason for anyone to lose sleep over this.
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aloges
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sat Feb 02, 2013 11:35 am

Isn't that thing (whatever it is) a tiny bit small for its pilot?   
Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.
 
GDB
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sat Feb 02, 2013 12:12 pm

Seeing those pics, for some reason this went through my head;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m3dZl3yfGpc

Ah, the wonders of video sharing sites!
 
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ptrjong
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sat Feb 02, 2013 12:41 pm

First, I don't like to ridiculize the Iranians. As far as they're the enemy, I think underestimation is always dangerous, too. For example I read that they can build structures of extremely, extremely tough concrete.

But these aircraft programes, and this thing... who are they trying to fool? A proof of concept demonstrator, maybe, but Ahmadinejad calls it 'one of the most sophisticated fighter jets in the world'. It reminds me of the Chinese communists who told their people of the growing of vegetables of gigantic proportions.

The 'F-313' is also strange, oddly, America still seems to be the promised country for the IRIAF. And the slogan 'We willed and acquired' on the wall... Shakespearean English or simply faulty English?

This is not a scene from Hot Shots part trois, is it?

Seriously, Iran doesn't seem to have produced a simple transport aircraft, or a simple elemenatry trainer, or a basic jet trainer, with any degree of succes. I don't suddenly see them producing succesful combat aircraft out of the blue.

Peter 

[Edited 2013-02-02 04:41:34]
The only difference between me and a madman is that I am not mad (Salvador Dali)
 
Eagleboy
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sat Feb 02, 2013 1:16 pm

Looks like some-one watched FireFox and decided that was the design they would use....
 
Devilfish
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sat Feb 02, 2013 1:30 pm

Eureka!!! One now knows where an inexpensive stealth fighter could be had..... to counter the threats arrayed against them from across the pond.   

'Something' definitely resulted from all that effort of putting twin stabs on old F-5s!   
"Everyone is entitled to my opinion." - Garfield
 
BlueElephant
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sat Feb 02, 2013 6:07 pm

Cross between a Boeing X-36 and an F-22. They didn't do much at all.

P.S. that cockpit looks like an 8th grade science project.
 
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Heavierthanair
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sat Feb 02, 2013 6:42 pm

G'day

I love the "REMOVE BEFORE FLIGHT" flags at the front and rear on this thingie. I was not aware Iran is part of the English speaking world. Maybe we are shown the export version of the bird. Then again, the English language is not widely spoken in North Korea and Venezuela either.  

It appears that visibility out of that obscured canopy leaves to be desired, but maybe the things electronics are so advanced that no external view is required for the pilot to fly the thing, all assuming the thing actually is capable of flight. I cannot see a periscope either.   

The Iranians claim the thing has flown several thousand hours, shame on the western intelligence for not having provided us with pictures previously.   

Cheers

Peter
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe." (Albert Einstein, 1879 - 1955)
 
NoUFO
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sat Feb 02, 2013 7:08 pm

Quoting checksixx (Reply 1):
Is there even room for an engine...let alone weapons in the body

Engine- yes, but judging from the size of the engine exhaust, it can't be that powerful. And is the plane supposed to carry a radar?
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wingscrubber
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sat Feb 02, 2013 8:22 pm

Flight global thinks its using the GE J85 powerplant, which if non after burning puts it in league with a small subsonic western jet trainer level of performance, but if they've given it the afterburning version from the F5, it might achieve supersonic dash speeds(cannot see any tongue of flame in the grainy video clips...) - but that enormous perspex greenhouse canopy they've put on it looks like it won't hold together at that speed!
http://www.flightglobal.com/news/art...-qaher-313-stealth-fighter-381806/
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fridgmus
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sat Feb 02, 2013 8:25 pm

It's a old F-5 with twin tails installed and intake mods.

We've seen these before somewhere here on A.net.

Nothing more.
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ptrjong
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sat Feb 02, 2013 8:34 pm

Quoting fridgmus (Reply 12):
It's a old F-5 with twin tails installed and intake mods.

Except that it looks completely different. Also, the F-5 is twin J85 (afterburning) so it seems to be much smaller.
The only difference between me and a madman is that I am not mad (Salvador Dali)
 
rtfm
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sat Feb 02, 2013 9:43 pm

Well I particularly like the part of the quote in the Flightglobal report from the Iranian defence minister where he boasts that it's "capable of operating and flying in low-altitude," That's always kind of useful if you want to be able to take off and land..... 
 
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glideslope
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sat Feb 02, 2013 9:46 pm

Quoting fridgmus (Reply 12):

It's a old F-5 with twin tails installed and intake mods.

We've seen these before somewhere here on A.net.

Nothing more.

Yes we have.   
To know your Enemy, you must become your Enemy.” Sun Tzu
 
Oroka
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sun Feb 03, 2013 3:01 am

Flying video looks like a really cool RC jet.

Mock-up: worlds first 'stealth' inspired canoe with wings.



Im amazed Iran could make such a large plexi glass canopy in one piece.


Most advanced aircraft Iran owns is a Lockheed Martin RQ-170 Sentinel XD
 
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kanban
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sun Feb 03, 2013 5:13 am

Quoting Oroka (Reply 17):
Im amazed Iran could make such a large plexi glass canopy in one piece.

note the distortion on the display model? looking at the video and at display pictures, I don't believe the display is more than a mock up and the one flying is something else (at least under the skin).
 
sccutler
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sun Feb 03, 2013 5:36 am

It is always nice to use easily-sourced components.

In the panel of the Qaher-313:

http://theaviationist.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/Q-313-cockpit.jpg


One (1) Tru-Trak Sorcerer Autopilot control head: http://www.trutrakflightsystems.com/products/Sorcerer.html
One(1) Garmin SL-30 Nav/Com: http://buy.garmin.com/shop/alt-image...pID=6432&img=productImageLarge
One (1) Dynon D-100 Primary Flight Display: http://www.dynonavionics.com/docs/D100_intro.html
Two (2) Dynon D-10 Primary Flight Displays: http://www.dynonavionics.com/docs/D10A_intro.html
One (1) Garmin GMA340 Audio Panel: http://buy.garmin.com/shop/alt-image...o?pID=93&img=productImageLarge
One (1) Garmin GTX Transponder (sorry, can't tell variant from the photo, either a 327 or a 330): http://buy.garmin.com/shop/alt-image...?pID=201&img=productImageLarge

---

None of which is to suggest that a dedicated team of Iranian engineers cannot develop a viable fighter; merely that, this ain't it. Perhaps a red herring to keep military analysts busy chasing moonbeams?

[Edited 2013-02-02 21:37:09]
...three miles from BRONS, clear for the ILS one five approach...
 
flightsimer
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sun Feb 03, 2013 7:44 am

anyone notice the excessive distortion in the canopy?
Commercial Pilot- SEL, MEL, Instrument
 
airscrews
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sun Feb 03, 2013 7:54 am

I think that the most advanced item used on this "machine", might be the electrical engine they use for the rotating display.....   I bet it is a hoax.
Have a close look on the wiring in the "advanced" cockpit, it is made for heavy G, at least 1 0r 2 G....
And the Pilot helmet was something used in the west in the sixties.
I love them, they have a lot of humour.
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Kiwirob
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sun Feb 03, 2013 8:43 am

Quoting ptrjong (Reply 5):
As far as they're the enemy

I didn't realise Iran was at war with the Netherlands, when did that happen.
 
NoUFO
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sun Feb 03, 2013 8:48 am

Quoting sccutler (Reply 19):

Good job, but what's the display between the two D-10 (under the D-100)?

Still, doesn't look like a radar warning receiver or anything mil-graded for that matter.
I support the right to arm bears
 
NoUFO
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sun Feb 03, 2013 8:59 am

Quoting airscrews (Reply 21):
And the Pilot helmet was something used in the west in the sixties.

In the seventies. Together with the ejection seat that looks like an MB MK7 from one of their F-4s or F-14s.
I support the right to arm bears
 
bilgerat
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sun Feb 03, 2013 9:32 am

Most interesting!

Looking at the pics of the guy sitting in the cockpit a clever western intelligence analyst could deduce that Iran has a cadre of Hobbit pilots for their new stealth fighter.

I also very much like size and placement of the air intakes - perfect for high AoA flight.

The jet exhaust nozzle also looks like a particularly high thrust type with state of the art LO shrouding.

Definitely should be considered as a candidate for Canada's CF-18 replacement instead of the F-35!
 
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ptrjong
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sun Feb 03, 2013 10:01 am

Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 22):
Quoting ptrjong (Reply 5):
As far as they're the enemy

I didn't realise Iran was at war with the Netherlands, when did that happen.

I dislike the warmongering that we often see on this forum, I guess I didn't make myself clear.
The only difference between me and a madman is that I am not mad (Salvador Dali)
 
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Francoflier
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sun Feb 03, 2013 10:11 am

Not to mention the thickness and profile of these (goofy) wings.

It will definitely have a good STOL capability. Though I don't see it flying anywhere above 200 kts with those... Even if it could actually fit a pilot.
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airscrews
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sun Feb 03, 2013 10:40 am

Have a close look, it of made in fibre glass. My son would love to have such as toy machine http://i47.tinypic.com/24zxgsw.jpg

[Edited 2013-02-03 02:52:02]

[Edited 2013-02-03 02:52:18]
Airscrews
 
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Francoflier
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sun Feb 03, 2013 11:18 am

Quoting airscrews (Reply 28):
Have a close look, it is made in fibre glass.

It doesn't even have to be that close. There is no latching or sealing mechanism between the canopy and the fuselage...
I'll do my own airline. With Blackjack. And hookers. In fact, forget the airline.
 
sccutler
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sun Feb 03, 2013 11:47 am

Quoting airscrews (Reply 28):

Have a close look, it of made in fibre glass. My son would love to have such as toy machine http://i47.tinypic.com/24zxgsw.jpg

Good find - the higher-resolution picture really brings it out!

Quoting francoflier (Reply 29):

Quoting airscrews (Reply 28):
Have a close look, it is made in fibre glass.

It doesn't even have to be that close. There is no latching or sealing mechanism between the canopy and the fuselage...

Trust the power of faith.

---

Also love the airspeed indicator with the 265 knot redline.

Quoting NoUFO (Reply 23):
Good job, but what's the display between the two D-10 (under the D-100)?

It took a while, but I smoked it out. IT's an AvMap, though I am uncertain whether it is an EKP-IV or an EKP-V (they both have essentially the same form-factor).

http://www.avmap.us/avionics/instruments/EFIS#
http://www.avmap.it/products/aero/ekp_v-627/introduction

Is that three-way gauge on the right bottom from a Baron? Too grainy to be certain.

I was ready to throw down on the altitude as depicted on the altimeter, but since Tehran is at around 4,000' MSL anyway, the altitude shown is well within what one might see if the barometric pressure had not been set to current conditions...

---

A more robust effort at deception would have been appreciated, unless (again) it is intended as a deception to lull analysts into a false sense of security.
...three miles from BRONS, clear for the ILS one five approach...
 
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ptrjong
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sun Feb 03, 2013 11:53 am

Quoting sccutler (Reply 30):

unless (again) it is intended as a deception to lull analysts into a false sense of security.

But this is way too obvious.
The only difference between me and a madman is that I am not mad (Salvador Dali)
 
sccutler
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sun Feb 03, 2013 11:56 am

Quoting ptrjong (Reply 31):

But this is way too obvious.

One would think...
...three miles from BRONS, clear for the ILS one five approach...
 
bilgerat
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sun Feb 03, 2013 5:00 pm

Quoting sccutler (Reply 29):
Also love the airspeed indicator with the 265 knot redline.

No no no no no. You've got it all wrong. That ASI is not calibrated in knots, it's calibrated in Mach   
 
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kanban
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sun Feb 03, 2013 7:25 pm

The new pictures definitely confirm that the display is a crude mock up... probably doesn't even have an engine.

Now the one flying in post #11 at the bottom of the flightglobal piece, I'm curious about.. the shots are grainy enough to hide the a/c details so it may be something else entirely
 
flightsimer
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sun Feb 03, 2013 7:46 pm

Quoting kanban (Reply 33):

RC model? The video I saw showed no ground to reference size... And it didn't seem to fly as if it was a real plane. I just got the feeling of watching an Rc in the video...
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Francoflier
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sun Feb 03, 2013 10:42 pm

Quoting flightsimer (Reply 34):
And it didn't seem to fly as if it was a real plane. I just got the feeling of watching an Rc in the video...

My feelings to.

On their defense, they seem to have some relatively evolved computer graphics for that frame. It could be actual CATIA-like renderings, but then again it could just be some guys playing with 3DS.

The wing arrangement just doesn't look right. The main wing is too far back, the front wing would have to pick up a lot of lift to move the CL forward enough. It would look cool in Battlestar Galactica though.
I'll do my own airline. With Blackjack. And hookers. In fact, forget the airline.
 
HaveBlue
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sun Feb 03, 2013 11:10 pm

The first thing that struck me was the very small size of the engine air intakes, and of the exhaust as well. Not appropriate scale relative to size/performance that you would expect.

And a bunch of other things, but most have been mentioned already. And as someone else said.. if you're not capable or haven't yet been pumping out regular aircraft.. making a 5th generation stealth fighter is just not gonna happen.
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petertenthije
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Sun Feb 03, 2013 11:58 pm

Is this intended to be a dive bomber? Even a slight increase in angle of attack seems to restrict airflow into the air intakes. The air intakes are very small as it is!
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racercoup
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Mon Feb 04, 2013 12:31 am

Quoting petertenthije (Reply 37):

Is this intended to be a dive bomber? Even a slight increase in angle of attack seems to restrict airflow into the air intakes. The air intakes are very small as it is!

It's not intended to be a dive bomber, or a fighter or even fly. It was Tehran High School"s science project for 2012.
 
RussianJet
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Mon Feb 04, 2013 1:37 am

After seeing how absurdly fake this thing is, and considering how they can actually stand there seriously and try and pass this crap off as real, I suddenly feel that Iran is far less of a threat to anyone than I previously imagined.

Great quote in this article:

Quote:

The Israeli paper Maariv interviewed aeronautical expert Tal Inbar who says the aircraft looked like a model made of fiberglass or cardboard. He said, “It’s not a plane, because that’s not how a real plane looks.”
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013...tealth-fighter-jet-but-is-it-real/

[Edited 2013-02-03 17:55:49]
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Gatorman96
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Mon Feb 04, 2013 4:26 am

Thankfully the local gym and a "Lazy Susan" was available for the unavailing of Iran's most advanced aircraft.
Cha brro
 
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seahawk
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Mon Feb 04, 2013 7:49 am

Quoting petertenthije (Reply 37):
Is this intended to be a dive bomber? Even a slight increase in angle of attack seems to restrict airflow into the air intakes. The air intakes are very small as it is!

The only role I could come up with would be a modern day Kamikaze plane.
 
dlowwa
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Mon Feb 04, 2013 11:07 am

You know, if they released it as a homebuilt kit, I might be interested...
 
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anfromme
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Mon Feb 04, 2013 12:29 pm

Quoting francoflier (Reply 28):
It doesn't even have to be that close. There is no latching or sealing mechanism between the canopy and the fuselage...

That was the first thing that struck me, to be honest. Second then was the reflection in the first photo here:
http://www.mehrnews.com/en/newsdetail.aspx?NewsID=1806008
In that light, the area just in front of the cockpit just looks like modeled plastics or fibreglass.
And then, airscrews posted this:
http://i47.tinypic.com/24zxgsw.jpg
Fibreglass all the way, plus some off-the-shelf avionics, as sccutler pointed out  
Quoting Gatorman96 (Reply 40):
Thankfully the local gym and a "Lazy Susan" was available for the unavailing of Iran's most advanced aircraft.

Yeah, the choice of venue and decoration sure made me wonder... Tastes vary, I guess.
42
 
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Francoflier
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Mon Feb 04, 2013 5:06 pm

Quoting anfromme (Reply 43):
Yeah, the choice of venue and decoration sure made me wonder... Tastes vary, I guess.

They built in in a school gym and then realized that the doors weren't big enough to bring it out...
I'll do my own airline. With Blackjack. And hookers. In fact, forget the airline.
 
Devilfish
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Mon Feb 04, 2013 6:53 pm

Quoting francoflier (Reply 44):
They built in in a school gym and then realized that the doors weren't big enough to bring it out...

Ahh...but the turntable elevates and the skylights retract. In the 2nd photo, looks like there's 'just enough' space between the rigid frames for it to clear. The drooping wingtips may have been necessitated not only by aerodynamics and to mitigate vortexes...but also to fit tight entries into secret hardened shelters .


Quoting Heavierthanair (Reply 9):
I love the "REMOVE BEFORE FLIGHT" flags at the front and rear on this thingie.

Would also explain the red ribbon requiring the removal of the probe  . Although that does leave one to wonder if the flight of the 'real' thing is ever going to happen.
"Everyone is entitled to my opinion." - Garfield
 
MadameConcorde
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Mon Feb 04, 2013 8:58 pm

I think it has to be a mockup not the real size aircraft.

I would fancy a safety card.

  
There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
 
aklrno
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Mon Feb 04, 2013 11:46 pm

Quoting Devilfish (Reply 45):

Quoting francoflier (Reply 44):
They built in in a school gym and then realized that the doors weren't big enough to bring it out...

Ahh...but the turntable elevates and the skylights retract. In the 2nd photo, looks like there's 'just enough' space between the rigid frames for it to clear. The drooping wingtips may have been necessitated not only by aerodynamics and to mitigate vortexes...but also to fit tight entries into secret hardened shelters .

Look a little farther, to photos 5, 6, 7. Looks like sliding hangar doors to me.

The best feature for me is the canopy. Without an obvious locking mechanism I suspect it would simply be blown off during or shortly after takeoff. As seen in the photos staring around number 11 it seems to have the clarity of decorative glass block. I doubt that the pilot could find his way to the runway in the first place, a good thing if he wants to keep his canopy.

Doesn't the eject procedure call for the pilot to force his head back against the seat before pulling the handle? Is the ejection seat in the photos designed to behead the pilot, perhaps as immediate Islamic punishment for destroying government property in the impending crash?
 
fsnuffer
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Tue Feb 05, 2013 2:25 am

Assuming the fighter is real, do you think the metallic dashboard, wiring, and ejection seat sitting that high up into the canopy would provide a nice radar return defeating the "stealth"?
 
timpdx
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RE: Qaher-313 Iranian Stealth Fighter

Tue Feb 05, 2013 6:05 am

The footage is totally an RC plane. Lol. Maybe Photoshop should have been used to make the plane bigger, kinda like how they painted in that missile that never fired. As for the monkey they supposedly put into space, well....

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