bthebest
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RAF BAe146 C3 - Rare Example Of Good Procurement?

Fri Apr 19, 2013 9:09 am

Converted BAe 146s cleared for RAF operations

The 'newest' transports for the RAF have been released to service and should join operations in Afghanistan shortly. There were a couple of things that struck me about the programme - specifically how well it seemed to run!

In short, since contract award in January 2012, two BAe 146s have been bought, converted, trialled and certified within 15 months and received release to service just 1 month later than originally scheduled. The total cost of the programme is expected to be circa £47 million.

This was achieved under an Urgent Operational Requirement so some of the red tape is bypassed, and the aircraft role isn't particularly sophisticated, but given it is a defence procurement it seems to be a particularly well thought out, planned, budgeted and overall managed programme.

Are there any other good examples of well managed State procurement programmes?
 
GDB
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RE: RAF BAe146 C3 - Rare Example Of Good Procurement?

Fri Apr 19, 2013 5:32 pm

Quoting Bthebest (Thread starter):
Are there any other good examples of well managed State procurement programmes?

Most of the previous UOR's?
But they happened under the previous government, so you won't hear much about them.

But then again, the House Of Commons Defence Select Committee once castigated the procurement of C-17's.
So the watchdogs don't always get it right.
 
L-188
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RE: RAF BAe146 C3 - Rare Example Of Good Procurement?

Fri Apr 19, 2013 9:01 pm

Its amazibg what hapoens when you buy pff shelf isnt it?

Its when the generals start tinkeribg with specs that things get screwed up.
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A342
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RE: RAF BAe146 C3 - Rare Example Of Good Procurement?

Sun Apr 21, 2013 9:22 pm

Quoting Bthebest (Thread starter):
The total cost of the programme is expected to be circa £47 million.

Me thinks you could get a brand-new C130 or two C295s for that amout of money. Seems like a lot for two spiced-up old 146s'...
Exceptions confirm the rule.
 
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kc135topboom
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RE: RAF BAe146 C3 - Rare Example Of Good Procurement?

Sun Apr 21, 2013 10:20 pm

Quoting A342 (Reply 3):
Me thinks you could get a brand-new C130 or two C295s for that amout of money. Seems like a lot for two spiced-up old 146s'...

Wasn't the BAe-146 purchased as an interim aircraft due to delays in the A-400M program? If that is true, they may be in service with the RAF for a while.
 
bthebest
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RE: RAF BAe146 C3 - Rare Example Of Good Procurement?

Sun Apr 21, 2013 10:39 pm

Quoting A342 (Reply 3):
Me thinks you could get a brand-new C130 or two C295s for that amout of money. Seems like a lot for two spiced-up old 146s'..

1 C295 and change, bit more for a C130. Probably a queue for C130s and C295 would be new type so more expensive.
 
ssteve
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RE: RAF BAe146 C3 - Rare Example Of Good Procurement?

Mon Apr 22, 2013 3:54 pm

Part of the benefit sounds like the RAF already operated two VIP 146s. There are short term and long term savings because of that.
 
GDB
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RE: RAF BAe146 C3 - Rare Example Of Good Procurement?

Mon Apr 22, 2013 10:34 pm

Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 4):
Wasn't the BAe-146 purchased as an interim aircraft due to delays in the A-400M program? If that is true, they may be in service with the RAF for a while.

No. It's about the imminent retirement of C-130K's.
Specifically for transport within the Afghan area of operations. So after late 2014 that part of the tasking will be over.
Nothing really to do with the A400M.

Possibly it's also seen as being able to avoid taking C-130J's from the UK to Afghan air-bridge, to do that tasking.
Thus maintaining the whole force for that and for any other contingencies, rather than having a couple of them in Afghanistan.
 
 
ThePointblank
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RE: RAF BAe146 C3 - Rare Example Of Good Procurement?

Thu May 16, 2013 5:25 am

Quoting Bthebest (Reply 5):
Probably a queue for C130s and C295 would be new type so more expensive.

Not to mention that UK C-130J's are not identical to USAF C-130J's; I remember there was talk about the UK in the past wanting to unload the 'short' C-130J's and Canada was bandied about as a potential taker and there was a lot of talk about the UK spec C-130J's and how it differed from the USAF C-130J's, particularly in the back area. If my memory serves me correctly, UK spec C-130J's don't have a cargo management system in the back which makes loading and securing certain payloads more difficult and time consuming.

The UK could have gotten a C-130J on short notice like how Canada got it's first C-130J, but they would probably would have been forced to accept a non-standard aircraft which would had created sustainment issues.
 
Devilfish
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RE: RAF BAe146 C3 - Rare Example Of Good Procurement?

Thu May 16, 2013 5:04 pm

Quoting Bthebest (Thread starter):
Are there any other good examples of well managed State procurement programmes?

This might qualify.....

http://www.flightglobal.com/news/art...s-for-new-c-27j-contractor-385932/

Quote:
"'The Air Force Life-Cycle Management Center [AFLCMC] at Wright-Patterson Air Force Base, Ohio, is conducting market research to identify potential sources that possess the expertise, capabilities, and experience to manufacture and deliver C-27J aircraft,' the document reads. 'Responses to this survey will be used to influence the programme's acquisition strategy.'

[.....]

The USAF terminated its C-27J programme in an effort to save money in its fiscal year 2013 budget. The service also says that it will dispose of the 38 aircraft that are currently in service with the Air National Guard. Air Force leaders testified earlier in the year that the fate of those C-27Js will be decided before the end of this year."


Quoting Bthebest (Reply 5):
1 C295 and change, bit more for a C130.

Other forces could luck out and land a bargain should the USAF go ahead and unload those 38 Spartans.   
"Everyone is entitled to my opinion." - Garfield
 
MD-90
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RE: RAF BAe146 C3 - Rare Example Of Good Procurement?

Fri May 17, 2013 5:56 pm

Still a month behind shedule (you don't make fun of me for saying nuculer and I'll ignore the fact that Brits can't seem to pronounce schedule), though.

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