EmiratesLover
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Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Mon Jan 28, 2002 1:50 am

I feel horrible this Sunday afternoon about the DESPICABLE act of violence against
innocent pedestrians in Israel.
It was yet another suicide bombing that was carried out by the armed thugs of Palestinian
extremist.I hope they are punished in one way or the other by someone or the other.
God bless those who died or who were injured, and their relatives.Needless to say,
I would like everything to be done to make sure nothing of the sort happens ever again,
but I am afraid because what is likely to happen is going to make a bad situation even
worse.
Ariel Sharon is likely to intensify his dreadful repression against the Palestinian people
in the occupied territories, and he is likely to try to destroy Arafat's infrastructure
even more than he has already.Does he really believe that by weakening him Arafat
is likely to be in a position to arrest or weaken the extremists? What I am afraid of is
that the repression of Israel's brutal 34 year long occupation of the Occupied Territories.
which created the terrorist capable of such vicious acts is going to get worse and you end
up with a vicious circle.So what is the solution - could we all have something in a way of
a common ground and a common strategy ?

1) Everyone should condemn the Palestinian terrorists who commit such vile acts of suicide
bombings.

2) There should be CO-OPERATION rather than CONFRONTATION between the two
sides.Israeli intelligence should try to help and work with Palestinian authorities to stop these
acts of terror.Arafat has no reason to want these kind of suicide bombings to happen, and if
given a fair go, I think he would like to do away with these extremists if nothing else then
at least to save his own skin.From what I have seen, since the co-operation between the
two sides has ended the suicide attacks have increased in frequency.....so the policy of
confrontation has NOT worked - there must be a return to cooperation so they can pool
their resources to finght a common enemy.

3) The occupation of Palestinian territories, which was always brutal and absolutely
illegitimate from the start must end.People forget that for every suicide bomber there
are possible a hundred more Palestinian youth who have experienced the same horror-
human rights violations, torture in Israeli jails, collective punishment, deportation and
sheer humiliation and desperation that created the ugly phenomenon of Palestinian
extremism in the first place.Most of the Palestinian youth who are not terrorists too
have suffered - do we wish to concern ourselves with the terrorist alone, or do we
wish to talk about the suffering of the innocent Palestinian population as well ?

I have always been a supporter of Palestinian rights and I do deplore the acts of terror
committed in the name of the Palestinian cause.The world is today remembering the
Holocaust victims, and is united in it's stand against what happened back then.It should
be united today as well.For me there should be no contradiction between deploring
both terror AND despising the injustices - occupation, ethnic cleansing, racial
discrimination, collective punishment and human rights violations that created it in the
first place.There MUST be a common ground in opposing this - what is unacceptable
to some in my opinion must be unacceptable to all.
 
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yyz717
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RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Mon Jan 28, 2002 2:10 am

Your views and comments would seem to be balanced EmiratesLover.

However, I see that you have an Arab name....I presume that you are Arabic. Why do so few Arabs allow Israel any credit or slack? There is a large & strong pro-Arab stance (or balanced view) among many liberal Israelis who deplore the violence. I just don't see the same in Arab countries.

Posting your comments on Anet is easy. Have you tried writing to your own Arab government with your balanced (ie., partially pro-Israeli) viewpoints? If not, why not? If so, how far did you get?



I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
Sonic
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RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Mon Jan 28, 2002 2:13 am

As long as Israel will opress Palestin and destroy their buildings and kill their people for nothing (I do not mean terrorists here, but innocent people, mothers and childs), I fully support Palestine terrorists.

As I see from your profile, you are from Malta. How would you feel if some country would occupy Malta, your friends would be killed for participing in demonstrations, etc. all free words would be banned and the only things you could listen on radio or on TV would be propaganda, your religion would be also banned and churches would be torn down just like as homes, you would be homeless and all your friends, childs, parents would be lost? Wouldn't you get a bomb and just go to the nearest building/radio station/restaurant/temple of a country, occupied yours?
 
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yyz717
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RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Mon Jan 28, 2002 2:20 am

Sonic, the biggest oppressors of the Palestinian people are the PLO themselves. Freedom of expression is denied by the PLO. Regardless of what the Israelis do.

Israel has every right to retaliate against every Palestinian attack. As in all wars, there is fault on both sides. Try to take a more balanced realistic viewpoint as EmiratesLover is doing.

I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
Sonic
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RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Mon Jan 28, 2002 2:32 am

Yyz717, Israel does not gives Palestin freedom. If they would, there wouldn't be Terroristic acts in Israel. Instead, Israel strikes Palestinian towns, destroys their journalists offices to ban their free word. They destroys also Palestinian's property. They keeps Palestinian leader (which is not terrorist) in town, surrounded by forces. Israeli government is pretty much fascistic. Even if they hates Hitler themselves.
 
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yyz717
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RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Mon Jan 28, 2002 2:39 am

Sonic, can you comment on Palestinian injustices? the heavy hand of the PLO with its own people?

I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
Guest

RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Mon Jan 28, 2002 3:12 am

Sonic,

"Yyz717, Israel does not gives Palestin freedom. If they would, there wouldn't be Terroristic acts in Israel."

- that's not correct, Sonic. The Oslo peace process was meant to give the Palestinian the State th Arabs refused to create in 1948; the Palestinian Authority was established, being the very FIRST FORM OF PALESTINIAN INDEPENDANCE IN THE HISTORY OF THE WORLD.
And what happened? Israel was hit by unprecedented suicide attacks, hundreds of civilians were killed in the streets of Israeli cities allover the country: in Jerusalem, in Tel Aviv, in Netanya, in Hedera, Haifa, Binyamina, Naharyia and at many other places. All this began with the advent of the peace process...
Under the governments of Rabin and Peres, there were suicide attacks as soon as peace negociations were to restart after a break; the people who are organizing these massacres have not peace in their mind as an objective...they wanted to destroy the peace process, and they succeeded!



"They keeps Palestinian leader (which is not terrorist) in town, surrounded by forces."

- Arafat is the terrorist in chief there! He should have been given the Terrorism Nobel Prize if one existed...
He tried to smuggle 50 tons of weapons meant for terrorist attacks into his territories!



"Israeli government is pretty much fascistic."

- here you show us that what you've said is not only the result of a lack of information about the situation, but also the result of a serious bias against Israel. I would suggest that you thoroughly study the history of your own country, before spreading hateful stupidities about others...
 
Sonic
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RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Mon Jan 28, 2002 4:18 am

Palestinians wants independance, not to be some kind of sattelite of Israel. Do you know how such authorithies are controlled? I lived in what was known Lithuanian SSR, authority of Soviet Union. We were part of Soviet Union, but we had right to elect our own government. However, the only people in elections were either Russians, either Lithuanians from communist party. All were actually appointed by Moscow to take part in elections. Everyone, who wasn't in 'party' wasn't allowed to be elected, even if constitution stated otherwise. And everyone, who was against the poltics of Soviet Union, were put in jails. Something like that is going in Palestin. Israel just wanted to make them authority, because it is easier to control them that way. This is why Soviet Union didn't taken all the socialistic countries.

Arafat I believe wanted peace... Israel asked him to stop terror, he refused. This was only place where he acted as terrorist.

Toda, you didn't argued why do you think Israel is not fascistic. I think it is (at least government), because some people (in the government) says that Palestinians must be killed. Couldn't give you a proof here, however. This is what I read somewhere in internet.

What I do not understand is why do USA supports Jews? USA did supported Albanians in Kosovo, some other opressed etnic groups...
 
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yyz717
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RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Mon Jan 28, 2002 4:32 am

The US supports all freedom loving people and does not favour Jews. However, Israel is the only democratic country in the Mid East and deserves the West's unqualified support.

The US has actually done more than any other country to support pan-Muslim goals. The US has accepted over 5M Muslim immigrants in the last 30 years, fought Iraq against Kuwait and Serbia against Bosnia. The US has also rid Afghanistan of the Taliban.

Regarding Israel & Palestine, it was Arafat that backed out of the peace deal a couple of years ago, not Israel.

I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
Guest

RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Mon Jan 28, 2002 4:35 am

The Palestinian Authority was to become an independent State.


As you don't have "proof" of what you say, don't say it! Especially when these are grave accusations...
You can read millions of FALSE things on the Internet...
 
LY744
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RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Mon Jan 28, 2002 4:59 am

And just look at what's going on in the Baltic countries nowadays...

LY744.
Pacifism only works if EVERYBODY practices it
 
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yyz717
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RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Mon Jan 28, 2002 5:04 am

It's surprizing that Sonic, being from Lithuania -- a country raped by the Soviets, would find favour with a dictatorship such as the PLO, and not a peace-seeking nation such as Israel.

Lithuanian emigration over the last 100 years has been primarily to the UK, Canada & the US. Certainly not Palestine. Lithuanian Jews fled to Israel.


I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
avi
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RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Mon Jan 28, 2002 6:02 am

Sonic, when the USA envoy, General Zini, sat with Arafat a few weeks ago Arafat tried to convince him that he is really fighting terrorism. Later it is found that at the very same time Arafat knew about the arms ship and that it was on its way to Gaza.
Arafat simply lied to him and this was a very big mistake to do, especially after the September 11th. Now he pays the price.

As said by Toda, the suicide attacks began not with the occupation but with the beginning of the end of it!!!
Before this Intifada started, the Palestinian authority controlled the life of the majority of the Palestinians and was on its way to be a state. Where are they going today (and taking the Israelis with them)? Maybe you can tell me.

For the first time a WOMAN did the attack today and one of the injured was an American who escape from the WTC towers after they were hit.

Long live the B747
 
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RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Mon Jan 28, 2002 6:07 am

What else is new
 
Sonic
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RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Mon Jan 28, 2002 7:00 am

Now I searched the net to found that link I talked about before:

http://www.duke.org/writings/10-03-01.shtml

Go here and read it. I think it pretty much covers my opinion. This text is about sep. 11 attacks, but it also covers Israeli-Palestinian conflict.

I do not support dictatorship, but I do support independance. As far as I know, Palestinians wants independance. I am not talking about Arafat or other leaders now, but the people. So, let them control themselves (I know, bad grammar). If they want Islam dictatorship (there are some, but not many, Islam democracies, but still, many Islam countries are various totalitarism regimes, so, why do we expect from Palestin to go different way?), let them have it.

LY744, what do you mean by "look what's going in Baltic States nowadays"? Lithuania, Latvia and Estonia are all democratic countries. We aren't rich, but we do not have any inside conflicts neither terroristic acts.

Lithuanians emigrated to USA because of better life there. Why would they want to go from already regained independance country to still occupied one?
 
DELL_dude
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RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Mon Jan 28, 2002 7:09 am

YOU'RE EITHER WITH US OR WITH THEM!


"The suicide bombers of today are the noble successors of the Lebanese suicide bombers, who taught the U.S. Marines a tough lesson in [Lebanon].. These suicide bombers are the salt of the earth, the engines of history.. They are the most honorable people among us.."
-- Al Hayat Al Jadida, September 11, 2001 edition. This is Yassir Arafat’s government controlled newspaper.

 
Sonic
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RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Mon Jan 28, 2002 7:12 am

DELL, did you read the text in link I gave?
 
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yyz717
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RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Mon Jan 28, 2002 7:16 am

Sonic, name one (just one) Islamic democracy.

I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
Sonic
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RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Mon Jan 28, 2002 7:38 am

Turkey, for example.
 
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yyz717
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RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Mon Jan 28, 2002 7:54 am

Turkey actually is a secular state with freedom of worship for Christians and Jews. Albeit with a Muslim majority.

Name an Islamic state (with Islam as the state religion) that is also democratic....there are over 50 Islamic nations....surely you would think there would be a democratic one.

Sonic.....while we're at it....name an Islamic state that Christians are flocking to as refugees looking for prosperity and freedom of worship.

I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
Sonic
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RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Mon Jan 28, 2002 8:21 am

Well, Islam is still main religion in Turkey. Islamic country means country with Islam as main religion. Of course all countries, banning christmas are non-democracy. But as well, You couldn't name a christian democratic country with, let's say, Ramadan banned.
 
Guest

RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Mon Jan 28, 2002 9:28 am

Turkey is the only one! And funny, its a strategic ally of......ISRAEL, the most non-Muslim country there is! hahahaha.
 
LY744
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RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Mon Jan 28, 2002 10:45 am

DavidDuke.org?  Laugh out loud

That's a white supermacist website, Sonic. You shouldn't be reading that kind of crap. Big grin No, seriously.
It's funny how this Duke a**hole "defends" the Palestinians, I wonder what he would start writing if a Palestinian family moved to his street. A racist is a racist. Supporting terrorism (ahem, ahem) is not very good either.  Big grin

As for the Baltic states, let's just say you don't wanna be a Russian-speaking (non-baltic would be a better description) person in those countries.


LY744.
Pacifism only works if EVERYBODY practices it
 
Guest

RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Mon Jan 28, 2002 12:12 pm

yeah dude


you lost all your credibility posting from david duke's web site. That guy was in the KKK and he is a disredited scumbag whose run for office and lost. Hes nothing in America and that upsets him so he blames the jews.

what else is new

TNNH
 
avi
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RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Mon Jan 28, 2002 9:43 pm

Turkey is the only one! And funny, its a strategic ally of......ISRAEL

Well, the enemy of my enemy (Syria) is my friend  Smile
Long live the B747
 
Sonic
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RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Mon Jan 28, 2002 10:38 pm

I didn't knew who the writer of the text is, so I read it without "pre-opinion". I think the text is pretty much supported. How could you argue to these qoutes? (by David Duke):
"I think most Americans would be appalled if they were fully aware of the suffering caused by American policy. For instance, most Americans know nothing about the effect of our embargo of food and medicine to Iraq. We caused the death of at least half a million children. That's right; I repeat: we are directly responsible for the death of 500,000 kids. Some of you might not believe what I am telling you. Well, for those who don't believe it, here is an excerpt of an interview between Leslie Stahl of CBS and Madeline Albright when she was US Secretary of State. The segment was called PUNISHING Saddam and Stahl was asking if the death of 500,000 children was worth it to punish this one man.
Leslie Stahl, speaking of US sanctions against Iraq: "We have heard that a half million children have died. I mean, that's more children than died in Hiroshima. And -- and you know, is the price worth it?"
Madeline Albright: "I think this is a very hard choice, but the price -- we think the price is worth it."
How would you view anyone who is willing to cause the death of 500,000 children to punish one man?
How can we not understand why so many people hate the United States when our own Secretary of State says murdering 500,000 children is quote, "worth it?"

"This propagandizing has already had an effect. When CBS and CNN polled the American people and asked them if we should attack the suspected enemies of America even if it will, quote: "cost the lives of thousands of innocent people." Almost 70 percent said yes.
It hurts my heart to think that a vast majority of the American people now take exactly the same view toward innocent human life as did the terrorists of September 11.
How do you think the rest of the world views America when they hear the results of those polls?
So far, I have heard no one, not even one of the great moral media pontificators, the President of the United States, our church leaders, or anyone else of prominence -- courageous enough to point out this blatant moral hypocrisy.
So, we are now going to fight terrorism in a global war. And what happens when America goes out and bombs the hell out of countries and indiscriminately kills "thousands of innocent people?" Will we really end the threat of terrorism? America has done the same thing before. Let's take a look at how it has protected us from terrorism.
In 1986, the Israelis gave America false evidence against Libya and induced us to bomb the hell out of the country. We bombed a nation to "fight terrorism" for a crime it did not even commit. A year later, a couple of members of a radical group in Libya were alleged to have bombed Pan Am flight 103 over Lockerbie, Scotland, causing one of the worst air disasters of all time, killing 270.
We exact our revenge with B-1 bombers; they do it through suicide bombers.
There is no way to completely protect ourselves from those kinds of acts. Even one fanatic person, if he is willing to commit suicide, can easily, with a small amount (non-detectible) plastic explosives, crash a plane with 400 people on it. We live in an era in which deadly biological agents of mass destruction can be made in anyone's basement.
America must take heed; the next terroristic act can be committed by just one person and kill hundreds of thousands of people. The exercise of brute military force can no longer protect any nation.
Let me repeat, we send our B1 bombers and they send their suicide bombers. And now, unless cooler head prevail, we are ready to embark on another war on terrorism that may kill thousands of innocent people and escalate the cycle of violence"

"Bush says we must strike down terrorists wherever they are in the whole world, but he has shared tea and crumpets with Israeli Prime Minister, Ariel Sharon, one of the world's leading most brutal and bloodthirsty terrorists. Sharon committed a number of crimes against humanity, among them the massacre of 2,000 men, women and children in the Sabra and Shatila refugee camps in Lebanon. Mr. Bush did not strike Mr. Sharon, instead he toasted him"

"For instance, we now partially blame Afghanistan for what happened on September 11. Have we conveniently forgotten that we bombed Afghanistan (and killed many innocent civilians) three years ago when we tried to kill Osama Bin Laden. Afghanistan is led by the same people we previously helped against the Soviets. At that time, we actually supported the terroristic activities of Osama Bin Laden against the Soviets and their collaborators. When Bin Laden later turned against us, we attempted to kill him by bombing Afghanistan.
We have seen the intense reaction of Americans to the attack on the Trade Centers. What would be the reaction of Americans to any nation who fired Cruise missiles and dropped thousands of bombs on America?"

"May God Bless America!"

There are more interesting quates, however, I can't writethem all. However, please discuss with idea, not the people created it (please do not post things like "Bin Laden is dumb and Duke is also so, this text is stupid", instead, please say why do you think so).
 
Guest

RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Tue Jan 29, 2002 5:07 am

In 1986, the Israelis gave America false evidence against Libya and induced us to bomb the hell out of the country. We bombed a nation to "fight terrorism" for a crime it did not even commit.

Well this is bullshit. Plain and simple. The Libyans bombed a German disco/club full of American servicemen killing many. The Israelis, Germans, Americans, and British investigated, found the Libyan agents and then attacked Tripoli to prevent the Lbyans from ever wanting to do such a thing again.

This Israel "gave Amierca false testimony" is testimony to only one thing: David Duke's vernomous racism and anti-semitism. No one takes this piece of dirt seriously, neither should you.

We exact our revenge with B-1 bombers;
Exaclty. To destory sensitive and strategic military targets like air fields, military barracks, presidental guards, and missile sights. Bombing cafes, discos, the world trade center is plain and simple evil and neither Israel nor the USA ever do it.

Sharon committed a number of crimes against humanity, among them the massacre of 2,000 men, women and children in the Sabra and Shatila refugee camps in Lebanon.

More lies. Neither Sharon nor any Israeli forces ever committed any massacre at Sabra and Chatila. That terribly deed was perpretrated alony by Lebanese Christian Phalangists.

David Duke is nothing. Do not give him the satisfaction of opening his website, let along reading his angry and desperate words.

TNNH
 
Sonic
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RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Tue Jan 29, 2002 5:36 am

You said...
"We exact our revenge with B-1 bombers;
Exaclty. To destory sensitive and strategic military targets like air fields, military barracks, presidental guards, and missile sights. Bombing cafes, discos, the world trade center is plain and simple evil and neither Israel nor the USA ever do it"

USA killed more people than all terror acts all over the world parts maybe. Let's say in the last war against Afghanistan, not only military targets, but also hospitals, civil homes, were bombarded. There was an interview with ex-soldier of Soviet army at Afghanistan in Lithuanian press (he is not communist, just forced to go to Afghanistan like many others). He called Americans chickens, because they only bombards other countries and not invades with lands army until everything is destroyed. He said that many of the targets are in centers of towns, so, bombarding them also destroyed civilian houses. While even the evilhood itself -- Soviet Union -- did not used air force to attack Afghans. Instead, they used land army and killed only soldiers.

BTW: no, I am not communist neither Soviet Union supporter. In fact I hate both, but I always try to be as objective as possible and listen opinions of all people.
 
tbar220
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RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Tue Jan 29, 2002 7:55 am

You make grave accusations Sonic. Let's see some proof for these statements of yours.
NO URLS in signature
 
Sonic
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RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Tue Jan 29, 2002 9:17 am

Tbar220, what proof do you want?
As for article in newspaper, the URL is www.lrytas.lt . But you have to pay to use the archive and also it is in Lithuanian.
 
Guest

RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Tue Jan 29, 2002 12:04 pm

We used air attacks to minimize loss of life on our side. I remind you we have no obligation to the Afghani people to lose our troops in battle liberating their homeland.

If so many Afghanis were killed from American strikes why is Afghanistan's interim leader in the USA thanking our President and the American people from liberating his country? Why did a country that is a bitter enemy of the USA like Iran cautiously support our action in Afghanistan and other countries like Pakistan and Saudi also support the American attacks?

Why are the only people who complain of them foreigners on airliners.net and Iraq???

TNNH
 
Guest

RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Tue Jan 29, 2002 7:23 pm

Sonic,
what you are saying about the American and Russian warfare is just ridiculous!
1. the Americans make great efforts in order not to hit civilian victims; they have the capability and the desire to hit their targets the most precisely possible.

2....the Russian Army seems to be one of the lowest exemple you could have found concerning civilian casualties...!! Have a look on what is happening in Chechnya before criticizing others. Thousands of civilians were and are being massacrated without any effort to spare them!
 
Sonic
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RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Tue Jan 29, 2002 8:52 pm

Twaneedsnohelp, answers are simple...
The current Afghani leader either says not what he things (because he fears another invasion, etc.) or he is appointed by US (well, at least USA "suggested" who to elect as leader) I think. I of course do not mean that USA officially did this. There are other ways to appoint person to such postion for country like USA.
And also please don't say you are fighting for their liberation. It is not so. If it would be so, you would already be stpped dropping bombs and removed army. You, USA, actually fight different world countries to make loyal govts there. This is why they attacked Yugoslavia let's say -- to weaken Slobodan Miloshevich position and get rid of him. The same about Iraq, Iran, Lybia, etc. And this is why they don't attacks Israel let's say -- because Israel is already loyal.
 
LY744
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RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Tue Jan 29, 2002 10:53 pm

"While even the evilhood itself -- Soviet Union -- did not used air force to attack Afghans. Instead, they used land army and killed only soldiers."

1. The Soviet AF was used extensively in Afghanistan, why do you think they lost dozens of a/c? Those Afghans didn't hit them on the tarmac in Siberia!

2. As in Checnya, the weapons of choice are AS unguided rockets and bombs launched from Su-24's, Su-25's, and Su-17/20/22's. As the opposing forces often hided in towns and cities, that's where the bombs fell, and, as expected, many either missed or caused severe collateral damage. The Mi-24's were much more accurate and succesful in their missions, thus more feared by the Afghans.

3. As for the use of ground forces, it is far from being a compliment in the case of Afghanistan. Sending dozens of thousands of predominantly conscripted soldiers to a strange and foreign country was not a good thing to the Red Army nor the Afghan civilian population.


LY744.
Pacifism only works if EVERYBODY practices it
 
Guest

RE: Tragedy Strikes Israel Again

Wed Jan 30, 2002 4:03 am

After that reply theres no point in my replying to you.

If you see the USA as simply an evil empire hellbent on controlling all of the worlds people and naive to the world's suffering and troubles, you are completely delusional and a waiste of my time.

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