Rai
Topic Author
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Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Wed Oct 09, 2002 1:19 am

A couple of days ago, Israeli helicopters fired missiles in a plazza in the Gaza Strip killing it's intended target, but 14 civilians as well. Every country, including the U.S., has condemned this strike, but Sharon praised this attack and says there will be more.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20021008/ap_wo_en_po/israel_palestinians_7401

 
Guest

RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Wed Oct 09, 2002 1:22 am

This thug is the greatest risk to global peace - bar none. If the Americans are serious about wanting to create stability in the region, they should look at taking him out before they turn their attention to Saddam.
 
david b.
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RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Wed Oct 09, 2002 1:24 am

What do you expect from a war monger. I say it is time for change in Israel. Get rid of Sharon.

Every country, including the U.S., has condemned this strike, but Sharon praised this attack and says there will be more

Im suprise that the US said something......with all the zionist and all. Yep there will be more attacks...........there will also be more Hamas attacks. What good is he doing? How is he helping the peace process?
Teenage-know-it-alls should be shot on sight
 
david b.
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RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Wed Oct 09, 2002 1:28 am

If both Arabs and Jews want peace they will get rid of Arafat and Sharon. Both are bloody killers. And this guy here is praising the murder of 14 innocent people, and over 100 injured. Will he be praising when Hamas kills innocent people in Israel? Because he approved of this operation knowing full well of the result, I sure hope he does.
Teenage-know-it-alls should be shot on sight
 
Rai
Topic Author
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RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Wed Oct 09, 2002 1:30 am

David, the U.S. has been actively criticizing Sharon. They're not exactly fans of him either (Clinton wanted Barak elected). I thought the picture was funny though. LOL
 
david b.
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RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Wed Oct 09, 2002 1:38 am

Looks at him though..................If terrorists don't get him then old age will.
Teenage-know-it-alls should be shot on sight
 
Guest

RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Wed Oct 09, 2002 3:07 am

The IDF believe most of the killed were armed terrorists.

But, I'm shocked he would praise an attack that killed 14 people include some innocent civilians.

Thats disgusting.

TNNH

 
david b.
Posts: 2894
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RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Wed Oct 09, 2002 3:10 am

But, I'm shocked he would praise an attack that killed 14 people include some innocent civilians.

He likes to praise. Apparently killing civilians in a military operation don't count.
Teenage-know-it-alls should be shot on sight
 
Guest

RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Wed Oct 09, 2002 3:22 am

Another article on the IDF attack on Palestinian civilians ... http://www.thescotsman.co.uk/international.cfm?id=1114062002

Some exerpts:

ISRAELI tanks and helicopters struck at the southern Gaza Strip town of Khan Yunis yesterday, killing 14 Palestinians and wounding about 80 others in what the army said was a raid against Hamas, the Islamic Resistance Movement.

Troops also fired on the hospital where wounded were being treated, killing one person and wounding three. Army officials said later that mortar rounds had been fired from a school near the hospital against a Jewish settlement and that the hospital was not the target of the return fire.

There were immediate vows that revenge would be exacted and leaders in Yasser Arafat’s Fatah movement predicted that the Israeli raid would undermine recent calls in Fatah for a cessation of attacks against Israeli civilians. "Killing of civilians must be punished by killing of civilians," said Hamas leader Mahmoud Zahar.

The dead ranged in age from 14 to 52 and doctors said that the lives of 20 of the wounded were "in danger".

The wounded included young children. Palestinian officials said all of the dead were civilians, while Israeli officials disputed this. Saeb Erekat, the Palestinian minister of local government who exaggerated the fatalities during last spring’s army incursion into Jenin, charged Israel with committing "a massacre and war crime".

Wissam Abdeen, 29, told reporters that as troops withdrew, residents emerged from their homes to check on the fate of neighbours. "We heard the sound of helicopters," said Mr Abdeen, who was hit by shrapnel in the arm. "Two minutes later I heard the sound of something coming from the air and I saw the flames. Then a big explosion lifted me and blew me ten yards away."

Troops used machine guns and assault rifles at a hospital where most of the wounded were taken, killing one man and injuring three, witnesses said.

"The army is foiling any effort at de-escalation," said Menachem Klein, a
political scientist at Bar Ilan University near Tel Aviv. "A complete re-occupation of the Gaza Strip is what is on the army’s agenda, and unless stopped, this is exactly what will happen. The handwriting is on the wall."

 
Guest

RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Wed Oct 09, 2002 5:20 am

Interesting how so many "civilians" and "small children" are walking in the streets at 4 am...and it's specially amazing that they're there just when there are tanks in those streets.
 
Stratofish
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RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Wed Oct 09, 2002 5:30 am

"...and it's specially amazing that they're there just when there are tanks in those streets."

So you regard anyone who stands up against tanks, which belong to an occupying force, entering his/her city a terrorist???

That´s just so full of hatred...

Stratofish
The Metro might be the Sub(optimal)way
 
LY744
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RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Wed Oct 09, 2002 5:52 am

"Because he approved of this operation knowing full well of the result, I sure hope he does."

Nice to meet you, Mr Sharon.

LY744.
Pacifism only works if EVERYBODY practices it
 
Guest

RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Wed Oct 09, 2002 6:20 am

The IDF believe most of the killed were armed terrorists.

Well of course the IDF will *claim* this, they always do unless the media catches them out.

Interesting how so many "civilians" and "small children" are walking in the streets at 4 am...and it's specially amazing that they're there just when there are tanks in those streets.

What were the tanks doing there in the first place? Has anyone else noted how often the IDF miss their intended target and get hospitals or schools?

Stratofish: Isreal considers ALL people of Palestinian descent terrorists .. this justifies their actions. It's an interesting theory really considering that Israel also considers it's military personnel to be civilians.




VH-ADG
 
Krushny
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RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Wed Oct 09, 2002 6:25 am

He's a great entertainer. I am not sure if the EU mission visiting the zone appreciated the reception fireworks. After that, it was not necessary to talk with Sharon, and they could just concentrate on having fun.

Interesting how so many "civilians" and "small children" are walking in the streets at 4 am...and it's specially amazing that they're there just when there are tanks in those streets.

Apparently most of the casualties happened after the tanks had retired, when an helicopter fired against the crowd who had got out of the houses when they thought the danger was over. What do you do in Geneva after a raid?
 
bravo45
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RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Wed Oct 09, 2002 7:29 am

David, the U.S. has been actively criticizing Sharon.
Well I would not agree to this. Althought the USA is now speaking skeptical more than before, but it cannot be called as "active". I have heard Bush calling SHARON as a MAN OF PEACE. For the longest time I couldn't believe it, for I don't think even Israelis say this but this was so. The US talk about shifting its embassy from Tel Aviv to Jeruselum and let it be declared as Israel's capital in all US documents doen't help any of it either.

No wonder that this bastard (no apology to Sharon fans here)would say and do such things.

Interesting how so many "civilians" and "small children" are walking in the streets at 4 am...and it's specially amazing that they're there just when there are tanks in those streets.

Would you please tell me a few streets where the Palestinian boys can walk around and play WITHOUT the presence of Israeli tanks and soldiers??????

It's an interesting theory really considering that Israel also considers it's military personnel to be civilians.
True, funny and becomes even more humorous when you see so many people in US and Europe BELIEVING this.
 
avi
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RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Wed Oct 09, 2002 7:48 am

Rai, SAS23, David and even ADG I have a question for you.

I read only small part of the attached report but I saw that PA sources said that ALL of the dead were innocent civilians.
So, do YOU thing ALL of them were innocent civilians or some of them WERE armed people who opened fire at the soldiers as Israel says?

This is a very simple question so please give me a very simple answer.

Long live the B747
 
bravo45
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RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Wed Oct 09, 2002 7:59 am

One answer out of those amny simple ones that you should have thought on your own is a quetion itself: Do you think that EVERY armed person is a terrorist?
Do you think that EVERY person opening fire on an ARMY that is ARMED and comming to destroy your house and your life and your family, is a terrorist??
The answer to one question to you I already have the hint to,
Do you believe EVERY THING that Israel says is RIGHT? The answer ofcourse seems to be yes.

Its one of the views arising from the above mentions truth, "Israel considers its military personel to be civilians."
 
LY744
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RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Wed Oct 09, 2002 8:59 am

Just in case anyone was wondering why the Israelis would commit all these unimagineably horrific unhuman crimes (slaughtering civilians for fun left and right, ethnically cleansing anyone in sight, humiliating and abusing innocent civilians, invading half the region so they can do some more of the first three etc.) again and again and again, the answer is quite simple, like David B. demonstrated in some of his posts, they are simply PURE EVIL. Simple as that.  Acting devilish

LY744.
Pacifism only works if EVERYBODY practices it
 
david b.
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RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Wed Oct 09, 2002 9:00 am

Yes some were armed. But ask yourself this: Why would the army open fire at a bunch of women and kids when they are in Main Battle Tanks and armored vehicles? Does this make sense? To you maybe.......... Yeah sure

Why fire a missile from a gunship at a crowd of innocent civilians? Why did the army open fire at a hospital? How did the hospital full of injured pose a threat?

I will tell you why...........Because Israel and the Sharon  Acting devilish government labels all Arabs as terrorists. Even little babies and women. This is why so many hate Sharon and the Zionist regime. The Israeli people must oust this beast if they ever want peace.
Teenage-know-it-alls should be shot on sight
 
david b.
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RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Wed Oct 09, 2002 9:02 am

Just in case anyone was wondering why the Israelis would commit all these unimagineably horrific unhuman crimes (slaughtering civilians for fun left and right, ethnically cleansing anyone in sight, humiliating and abusing innocent civilians, invading half the region so they can do some more of the first three etc.) again and again and again, the answer is quite simple, like David B. demonstrated in some of his posts, they are simply PURE EVIL. Simple as that.

No..not Israelis, just the Isreal "Defense" Force and the Sharon Zionist regime. Thats all.
Teenage-know-it-alls should be shot on sight
 
Guest

RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Wed Oct 09, 2002 11:07 am

Stratofish: Isreal considers ALL people of Palestinian descent terrorists .. this justifies their actions. It's an interesting theory really considering that Israel also considers it's military personnel to be civilians.


This is one more of your RACIST remarks ADG

Israel also considers it's military personnel to be civilians - only in your own imagination; but it is, on the contrary, Israel-haters like you or sas23 who see Israeli civilians as "non civilians" or "future IDF soldiers"...



* * *


Apparently most of the casualties happened after the tanks had retired, when an helicopter fired against the crowd who had got out of the houses when they thought the danger was over. What do you do in Geneva after a raid?

At 4 am, when there are [or just were] tanks, and when there are helicopters in the air, I can only wonder "why" children are walking in the streets...

I don't send suicide bombers out of Geneva to Annemasse nor anywhere...so I don't fear any French military action on Swiss territory...


* * *



Would you please tell me a few streets where the Palestinian boys can walk around and play WITHOUT the presence of Israeli tanks and soldiers??????

With pleasure...Before Arafat's "strategical decision" to launch his so-called intifada, Palestinian boys were able to walk around and play in EVERY street of EVERY Palestinian city...WITHOUT the presence of Israeli tanks and soldiers.


So...the day ISRAELI children will be able to board a public bus without fearing to be blown up, and the day when ISRAELI teens will be able to go dancing without being cut to bits in front of the disco, and the day when ISRAELI citizens will be able to sit peacefully down in a café or a restaurant....that day, Palestinian children will be able again to tranquilly walk in their streets...even at 4am if they like it...

BTW...these lines are also the answer to the "question" concerning the presence of Israeli tanks...


 
Guest

RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Wed Oct 09, 2002 5:07 pm

Toda, Zionist terror groups were killing Palestinians and Britons and blowing up hotels long before the Palestinian groups started up - Israel has itself to blame for that, no one else.

When Palestinians have their own country free from a brutal occupying force; when they have the right of return to property stolen from them by Zionist terrorists; when Israel withdraws to pre-1967 borders and when Israel's weapons of mass destruction are destroyed - then there will be peace in the region.
 
Guest

RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Wed Oct 09, 2002 5:49 pm

I read only small part of the attached report but I saw that PA sources said that ALL of the dead were innocent civilians.

and nearly all the wounded so i'd suggest that there may be some truth in it. But I wasn't there. I do know one thing, all the wounded and dead were NOT terrorists.

So, do YOU thing ALL of them were innocent civilians or some of them WERE armed people who opened fire at the soldiers as Israel says?

The Palestinians aren't very credible, marginally more credible than the IDF and Herr Sharon so i'm unwilling to say for sure either way. Except to say that as Israel has CHOSEN to stand alone against condemnation from the whole world it's time we took action against them. Firstly pressure should be put on America to stop supporting this murderous regime and they should be immediately expelled from the UN if they are a member. Sanctions should be placed against Israel and the removal of the serving PM should be immediate. War criminals should be tried.






VH-ADG
 
Guest

RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Wed Oct 09, 2002 5:54 pm

ADG - spot on. If Milosevic is on trial for crimes against humanity committed whilst he was head of state of the former Yugoslavia, then so should Sharon be arrested and tried at the Hague.
 
Guest

RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Wed Oct 09, 2002 8:28 pm

Toda, Zionist terror groups were killing Palestinians and Britons and blowing up hotels long before the Palestinian groups started up - Israel has itself to blame for that, no one else.


Revisionnism is so easy...

There has been Arab terror already LONG BEFORE the establishment of the State of Israel....Take for instance the year 1929......when the Jewish community of Hebron was massacrated....there was not ONE Jew left in this holy city....they were all killed by their own neighbors, or fled. And that's just one of the many atrocities committed by the Arabs in the Mandate era.

But...YOU speak of seeing the situation as black and white...?

You try to depict a situation according to which there were peaceful Arabs who didn't do anything wrong...and evil Jewish Zionists who landed there from the planet Mars and began to kill everyone just for the pleasure.....as today...!

 
avi
Posts: 891
Joined: Sat Sep 15, 2001 1:27 am

RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Wed Oct 09, 2002 9:21 pm

Bravo,
Forget the word 'terrorist' now.
Any Palestinian who open fire at Israeli soldiers (or civilians) should expect to be shot back.
If this man open fire when he surrounding himself with innocent civilians, he should expect that they will get killed or injured because of his action.

David, The target of this operation was to capture 2 Hamas terrorist (we failed this time but we succeeded in other times). That means the soldiers were not all the time in their armed vehicles.
I really don’t think they fired at the hospital just for fun. I’m sure the PA opened fire from there first!
Again, do you really think this is not a possibility?
This is not the first time that when the army entered a city the wanted PA are running into hospitals where they feel safe. Again, they are surrounding themselves with innocent, injured civilians.


Long live the B747
 
bravo45
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RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Wed Oct 09, 2002 10:53 pm

Avi,
Any man who tries to put some one out of his land, property and threathen his life as a whole and the future and his generations should expect some fight back NO MATTER HOW WEAK HE IS.
 
Guest

RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Thu Oct 10, 2002 3:36 am

Avi, why don't you try putting yourself in the shoes of the Palestinians? Imagine that you lived in one of the refugee camps, that you were subjected to racism and abuse by the IDF on a daily basis; that you were forced to endure 24 hour curfews, with no food in the house; that you have IDF troops smashing down the door to your house to harass you and your family as they "search for terrorists"; that your 12 year old brother is gunned down in cold blood by the IDF as he searches for food ... and the bullets just miss you; that your father is badly beaten and taken by the IDF as a 'suspected terrorist' even though you know he has nothing to do with any terrorist group ... and you haven't seen or heard from him in over a year, and your family doesn't even know if he is alive; you are forced to queue for hours in the blazing sun to get through IDF barriers whilst Israeli settlers zoom past in their cars, waving Uzis and shouting insults ... after all that, can you honestly say that you, too, wouldn't become a terrorist?

After all, you'd have nothing to lose...
 
LY744
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RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Thu Oct 10, 2002 6:10 am

"Any man who tries to put some one out of his land, property and threathen his life as a whole and the future and his generations should expect some fight back NO MATTER HOW WEAK HE IS."

I'm glad you can finally see the Israeli perspective, Bravo45.  Big grin

LY744.
Pacifism only works if EVERYBODY practices it
 
david b.
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RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Thu Oct 10, 2002 6:24 am

I'm glad you can finally see the Israeli perspective, Bravo45

Thats the Arab side not the Jewish side. The zionist on that side just wants to push the arabs out.
Teenage-know-it-alls should be shot on sight
 
bravo45
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RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Thu Oct 10, 2002 7:39 am

What is the Israeli perspective LY744???
Is it that they are sooooo weak that they only have F-16s againt the Palestinians stones??? Armoured vehicles and tanks against the homeless civilians???? Is it that the countries like the US and all over the world has thrown them out of their homes???? (even if they have been thrown out of their homes they should fight for their own home and not someone elses) Is it that the Israelis are living in refugee camps being bombed to hell????

The last post by SAS explains it all. This story is not exaggeration in ANY way. Same story repeats their only places and names change. What doesn't changes is this cycle thathas continued for long enough.
 
avi
Posts: 891
Joined: Sat Sep 15, 2001 1:27 am

RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Thu Oct 10, 2002 8:05 am

Imagine that you lived in one of the refugee camps, that you were subjected to racism and abuse by the IDF on a daily basis…

SAS23,
Why don’t you get it? We LEFT.
In 1993 (or 94) we withdrew from the PA cities and refugee camps in the GS and in 95-96 we did it from the WB.
They were no "subjected to racism and abuse by the IDF on a daily basis" because there were no IDF soldiers around (and there were no checkpoints, curfews or anything else).
By the way, how did it improve their lives? I said it in the past. It DIDN’T and this is the worst news. They had great expectation and greater disappointment.
Now, they must understand. The times that they attacked Israel and Israel didn’t retaliate ENDED. They, and you, know why Israel reentered. They know what they should do to make us withdraw again. Continuing the terror attacks is not the right way and the first move must be theirs because we tried everything else.

The zionist on that side just wants to push the arabs out.

Taking into a count the number of Arab countries and the vast territory they have, I would say it is going to be a very difficult task  Smile.
Long live the B747
 
bravo45
Posts: 2072
Joined: Sat Sep 22, 2001 5:34 pm

RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Thu Oct 10, 2002 8:23 am

In 1993 (or 94) we withdrew from the PA cities and refugee camps in the GS and in 95-96 we did it from the WB.
WHAT THE HELL???? YOU GOT THEM OUT OF THEIR HOMES OKAY???? YOU need to get this. A REFUGEE CAMP IS NO ONES HOME!!!! THEY were forced out of the homes in which the settlers are living and many other Israeli places.

Taking into a count the number of Arab countries and the vast territory they have, I would say it is going to be a very difficult task
It should be YOU to take into consideration that those people have been living there BEFORE Islam and then they became Muslims. Territories are NOT assigned to someone on the basis of religion as Israel claims to do. ITS THE RIGHT OF THE OWNER and that too THE RIGHTFUL OWNER and NOT someone owning some piece of land through the typical of Israeli LAW OF ABANDONED PROPERTY or something. You are claiming that Muslims have this much square km of land and therefore Israel has the right to wipe out all people living on the same amount of land just because of NOTHING!!!
TRY TO COME TO THE REAL WORLD!!!!!!!

 
david b.
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RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Thu Oct 10, 2002 8:25 am

It was easy back in '67. This week they didnt attack, Israel attacked first. They love to attack first don't they. Why is that? Attack heavy populated areas and use American F-16s and Attack Helos against people with nothing more then rocks and machine guns. The Arabs should put their money together and obtain heavy antitank weapons as well as SAMs.
Teenage-know-it-alls should be shot on sight
 
LY744
Posts: 5185
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RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Thu Oct 10, 2002 8:19 pm

"What is the Israeli perspective LY744???"

Why do you think they voted for Sharon? So they can all gather around at night to watch Palestinians dying on the news for entertainment? Or maybe it is because they share the same fears you said the Palestinians do, towards their own future, the future of their children etc. Thank you noble freedom fighters! But hey, they have no rights for feelings, since every one of them ethnically cleansed Palestinians and was personally responsible for kicking some of them out of their land and opressing them on a regular basis.

"No..not Israelis, just the Isreal "Defense" Force and the Sharon Zionist regime."

So just Israeli Jews then?

LY744.
Pacifism only works if EVERYBODY practices it
 
Krushny
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RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Fri Oct 11, 2002 1:56 am

You can find below an excerpt from a Haaretz article. It is about a quite serious "investigation" by the IDF about a civilian casualty . No wonder so many mistakes and unfortunate accidents happen in the occupied territories , when impunity for the IDF soldiers is almost assured. The excerpt :

In answer to a question by MK Zehava Gal-On of Meretz at the Knesset Foreign and Security Committee debate on the Amnesty Report last week, the defense minister announced that no injury to Palestinian civilians goes unprobed. He let it be understood that every time the investigation points to an offender, he is brought to trial.

The blinking light Rashomon-style

According to the Even Shoshan dictionary, the defense minister is absolutely right. An investigation can be an "examination," a "demand" or even "taking testimony." The B'Tselem organization's extensive experience shows that the military prosecutor too has an extremely broad interpretation of the term "investigation." A salient and unfortunately typical case in point is the inquiry into the death of Ahmed Abdel Rahman al-Qarini.

On August 11, Amos Harel reported in Ha'aretz that al-Qarini, a 54-year-old employee of Nablus Municipality, who was fixing the town's electricity works, was shot to death by IDF soldiers. The IDF spokesman expressed regret over the incident, promised to investigate it, and to take disciplinary (not criminal, A.E.) steps if it transpired the soldiers had acted wrongly. The spokesman said the soldiers testified they had shot at the truck al-Qarini was in as it approached the barrier during curfew and did not stop despite their calls to do so.

A similar version appears in the comment issued by Chief Military Prosecutor Colonel Einat Ron, at B'Tselem's request. In a letter sent to the organization on September 10 she wrote that "during an IDF soldier's patrol, intended to enforce the curfew in the center of Nablus, the soldiers noticed a commercial vehicle which approached them and then stopped in a suspicious way. The soldiers assumed the vehicle, which was not identified as a municipal truck because it did not have a blinking orange light on it, is trying to evade them and therefore fired twice into the air in warning. Since the vehicle stood at the edge of a slight hill, one of the bullets, shot in a relatively flat angle, entered the car window and could have caused the driver's death." In view of the above Col. Ron asserted that the force's action "did not exceed the parameters of feasibility expected from the activity of military force in the region, and in the conditions it was operating" Therefore it was decided there was no suspicion of an offense justifying the opening of a criminal investigation.

Ron's letter indicates that the absence of a blinking light on the truck was a key factor in the decision to close the case. The officer noted that the light is "the identifying mark which the Nablus municipality had agreed to use on any moving municipal vehicle."
Well, a picture from a video from an AP photographer shortly after this incident shows clearly that on the truck, whose windshield was hit by the deadly bullet, there was indeed a blinking orange light.

And a few more elementary questions which should have disturbed any novice investigator: How is it possible that a vehicle which stops when its driver sees IDF soldiers arouses suspicion? What kind of behavior does the IDF expect? And if indeed the truck stopped, as Ron states, why did the soldiers assume he was trying to evade them? Finally, how does the conclusion that the force's actions "did not exceed the parameters of feasibility" fit in with the fact that a warning bullet shot in the air hit the head of a man sitting in the truck and killed him? The prosecution's answers to these questions will be published here in full.
 
LY744
Posts: 5185
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RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Fri Oct 11, 2002 5:55 am

David B., those evil zionist from Ha'aretz make me sick! Akiva Eldar, Amos Harel, sound like male Jewish names, meaning that they were, or still are members of the IDF...

LY744.
Pacifism only works if EVERYBODY practices it
 
bravo45
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Joined: Sat Sep 22, 2001 5:34 pm

RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Fri Oct 11, 2002 7:27 am

Or maybe it is because they share the same fears you said the Palestinians do, towards their own future, the future of their children etc.
They have NO right to live on SOMEONE ELSE's land so their fear is true and it SHOULD be there. They should live peace fully IN THEIR OWN LAND and NOT on SOMEONE ELSE's LAND. Their future should be on their OWN land and NOT someone else's.
 
Guest

RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Fri Oct 11, 2002 11:13 pm

Their future should be on their OWN land and NOT someone else's.

According to PFLP, Hamas, Islamic Jihad, Hezbollah & Co...there isn't ANY land belonging to the Jews...so WHERE do you locate "their OWN land"...?? - in the US? in Europe? in Australia? in the Mediterranean?

 
Guest

RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Sat Oct 12, 2002 6:00 am

This raises the question of why jews should have their own land.

Jews are members of a RELIGION, they're not a race or a community, simply a religion. Like other religions it includes people from all over the world. What gives them the right to demand their own land?

Should christians demand their own land? How then do we cater for that demand? After all, their holiest land is the same as the jewish holiest land. Indeed, the muslim religion comes from the same area, so add that claim to the one piece of land and what do you have?

A three way war over who's religion has more right? Maybe one day common sense will intervene.







VH-ADG
 
bravo45
Posts: 2072
Joined: Sat Sep 22, 2001 5:34 pm

RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Sat Oct 12, 2002 7:18 am

Their land is the land that belongs to them. Ofcourse some Jews have been living in this area for long. I am refering to the lands that have been illegally taken away from Palestinians to be handed back. This would be the justice and this would be good. I am not a Hamas, or Islamic Jihad member.

BTW Guinness Book Of World Records 2001 in my hands, page number 142 of this edition heading and script:

Greatest Passenger Load:
The greatest number of passenger carried by a single commercial airliner is 1088, by an EL AL boeing 747 during operation Solomon, which began on May 24 1991. The purpose of the operation was to evacuate Ethopian Jews to Israel following the toppling of the Ethopian Government. The figure includes two babies born during the flight.

WHICH LAND IS THEIRS HAAN????? Today the will be living on the land taken by force from Palestinians. They got Israeli citizenship as well. Almost all of them had NEVER visited Israel before. This is what you are justifying?????
 
Guest

RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Sat Oct 12, 2002 8:29 am

This raises the question of why jews should have their own land.

What gives them the right to demand their own land?

Should christians demand their own land?

Maybe one day common sense will intervene.




And what gives you the right to deny them their own land...?
 
bravo45
Posts: 2072
Joined: Sat Sep 22, 2001 5:34 pm

RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Sat Oct 12, 2002 8:37 am

And what gives you the right to deny them their own land...?
Who is denying them their land, their land is waitig for them to come back and thats what they should do so that every one can live in peace. It CANNOT be that someone takes a piece of land only because he likes it.
 
LY744
Posts: 5185
Joined: Sat Feb 03, 2001 11:55 pm

RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Sat Oct 12, 2002 8:42 am

"Jews are members of a RELIGION, they're not a race or a community, simply a religion. Like other religions it includes people from all over the world."

So, if I was to accomplish the incredible feat of converting to Judaism, would my nose grow longer?

LY744.
Pacifism only works if EVERYBODY practices it
 
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RE: Sharon Praises Israeli Strike

Sat Oct 12, 2002 9:23 am

And what gives you the right to deny them their own land...?

A question with a question. Guess that indicates you have no answer to mine. I'm not denying them anything, I asked for a justification for the claim that they have a right to their own land. I'm interested in what justification you have to usurp the current land holders in favour of someone who apparently (according to a book the courts have acknowledged can be called a work of fiction) lived there over 200 years ago. Remember also, that a religion can be chosen (you can convert), so therefore there is potentially no direct line from current day jews to those who allegedly lived there 2000 years ago, and even if there is the line is very diluted.

So, when you answer my question, i'll address yours.

So, if I was to accomplish the incredible feat of converting to Judaism, would my nose grow longer?

That would depend on your age.




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