bmi330
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Europe On The Verge Of Splitting In 2.

Tue Mar 18, 2003 9:42 am

Could we possibly be seeing Europe split? AS The gap between the UK, Spain etc and France, Germany etc Could this be a water shed in European history where we see 2 europes one made up of Central European countries and one made up of Scandinavian countries, UK, Ireland, Spain, Portugal etc as there seems to be many differences arising think this may be a good thing as Europe is about to increase in size and if it was to split it would be in 2 more dynamic sections and easer to please all members and even see them expand possibly into northern Africa.
 
LH423
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RE: Europe On The Verge Of Splitting In 2.

Tue Mar 18, 2003 9:44 am

Well, it's feasible, but there goes the whole idea of the European Union.

LH423
« On ne voit bien qu'avec le cœur. L'essentiel est invisible pour les yeux » Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
 
bmi330
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RE: Europe On The Verge Of Splitting In 2.

Tue Mar 18, 2003 9:50 am

Yeah but with the increased size it may end up 2 European Unions of ruefully the size of the one there is now plus you cant see the British, French, Spanish, German all agreeing for long this might be the better in the long run there is to much of a cultural difference between them all.
 
Klaus
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RE: Europe On The Verge Of Splitting In 2.

Tue Mar 18, 2003 10:26 am

You might want to remember than the european populations are standing united as never before on this particular point.

It´s only some of the governments who decided to snub their people and follow GWB in the opposite direction.

And finally, it would take much much more to "split" Europe.
 
Andreas
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RE: Europe On The Verge Of Splitting In 2.

Tue Mar 18, 2003 5:42 pm

I've said this about a hundred times in all sorts of threads...ok, so what's another one hundred and first time:

No, it will not split the EU, why should it...and even if so, I don't actually understand the list of countries that was mentioned:
(ATTENTION I GETTING A LITTLE BIT SARCASTIC NOW!!!)

Portugal and Spain to split away from Germany...very well, I'd love that. Germany could lower its payments so much, there would be room for a tax cut...wow!!! Wouldn't we all love that?? And as our favorite holiday resort...well I guess they'd still have the hots for our money, so no disadvantages there.

The same goes for Greece and Italy, especially the latter one...remember, little Berlusconi is a little napoleon, desperately wanting to be with the big boys. When money comes into the game, he's a good European boy again.

Ireland..how did you come up with that one?? In matters of Europe Ireland is one of Germany's closest ally, always has been, and in this so-called Iraq crisis, not one bad word has been said between those two countries!!

Scandinavia...at the worst they stay a bit more on the neutral side, as a North countries block, sort of.

And the new members to be? If they decide to be Bush's new pet dogs...BE MY GUEST!!! Even less payments for Germany, and that is exactly what the German economy needs right now!!

So where does that leave you? I'm not so sure about UK, looking at the damage Tony Blair is currently doing to his Labour party.

EU split-up?? No way, that's what the US hawks would just love, as they just hate the idea of another strong economic block beside the USA...except they won't be able to keep this from happening!!
I know it's only VfB but I like it!
 
Turin_airport
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RE: Europe On The Verge Of Splitting In 2.

Tue Mar 18, 2003 9:53 pm

Berlusconi is not a little Napoleon: he's just a criminal son of a bi**h! Almost all Italians, both right and left wing supporters, are now united (as never before since a long time) condemning this war, and, hopefully, they will remember how he acted (together with an endless list of bull@hit he did)
when we'll vote again.

Regard the others Bush leccaculo (I don't know how to say in English, maybe something like "ass kisser"...) like Blair and Aznar, the first will face serious problems in his country, and the second can't be re-elected so he doesn't care what Spanish people think.

In the end, as Klaus very well stated, the whole Europe speaks with one voice, saying no to this imperialist war.

T_a
 
bmi330
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RE: Europe On The Verge Of Splitting In 2.

Tue Mar 18, 2003 9:58 pm

belive it or not lates poles show the UK public are for action in iraq so there not really standing united.
 
Arsenal@LHR
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RE: Europe On The Verge Of Splitting In 2.

Tue Mar 18, 2003 9:58 pm

Forget the war for a minute, this just goes to show that the idea of a European superstate is simply a whacked-out pipe dream.
In Arsene we trust!!
 
bmi330
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RE: Europe On The Verge Of Splitting In 2.

Tue Mar 18, 2003 10:04 pm

Exactly I'm thinking culturally where the UK, Spain and most Scandinavian countries are still monarchies where as central euro countries are republics and views on many things are wide ranging so if it was to happen it would give a more accurate representation of these countries views
 
Arsenal@LHR
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RE: Europe On The Verge Of Splitting In 2.

Tue Mar 18, 2003 10:15 pm

There are still many significant differences between the UK and Europe, culturally, socially, politically and economically. Just look at the Iraq crisis. The fact is, Euro politicians are kidding themselves if they think they can achieve a common ground when it comes to important foreign policy decisions and disputes, a country will always look to find a way in which their interests and needs are fulfilled.

In Arsene we trust!!
 
sebolino
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RE: Europe On The Verge Of Splitting In 2.

Tue Mar 18, 2003 10:30 pm

a country will always look to find a way in which their interests and needs are fulfilled.

Precisely. When the EU will be more or less like a country, we'll be united.
 
ryanb741
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RE: Europe On The Verge Of Splitting In 2.

Tue Mar 18, 2003 10:31 pm

There is no way the majority of Brits are against this war. The majority are pro war, but would have preferred to go down the UN route. Unfortunately the French prevented us from taking that option so we have to do what is best for our people regardless of what anyone else thinks. You don't simply go into war with all the costs involved lightly. Blair thinks he is doing the right thing, and now it is time to get behind the troops
I used to think the brain is the most fascinating part of my body. But, hey, who is telling me that?
 
Arsenal@LHR
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RE: Europe On The Verge Of Splitting In 2.

Tue Mar 18, 2003 10:48 pm

Precisely. When the EU will be more or less like a country, we'll be united.

And how are you gonna be "United" when the EU can't even decide on a simple Yes/No decision on Iraq? Fact is, a one-size-fit's-all policy is bad for member states and bad for democracy. Individual countries will no longer have a say in imoprtant decisions instead Brussels will be making all the legislative decisions without the consent of member states.
In Arsene we trust!!
 
aloges
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RE: Europe On The Verge Of Splitting In 2.

Tue Mar 18, 2003 11:41 pm

Maybe unifying Europe would be a lot easier if the UK just decided to keep things as they are for them... "The United States of Europe and Great Britain", for example. Don't get me wrong, I don't want to bash the British, but for what I am aware of they have never ever been keen on close ties with continental Europe.
Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.
 
Klaus
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Arsenal@LHR

Thu Mar 20, 2003 11:14 am

Arsenal@LHR: And how are you gonna be "United" when the EU can't even decide on a simple Yes/No decision on Iraq?

Yeah, when the question came up: "Do you have the balls to stand up for international law, even if it should be in opposition to the Bush administration?"

Several of the governments promptly wimped out.  Wink/being sarcastic
Maybe more courage next time...
 
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STT757
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RE: Europe On The Verge Of Splitting In 2.

Thu Mar 20, 2003 11:19 am

And Chirac told the one's who support disarming Iraq to "shut up", Europeans should be proud of people like Prime Minister Tony Blair. He went against his own party to do what he thinks is right.

Chirac to please his constituents told Eastern European Leaders to "Shut up".

Eastern Europe put up with the Nazi and then the Soviet Bullshit for most of the 20th Century, I don't think they should put up with Chirac and the EU's crap.

Eastern Europe can work with Britain, the US, Spain, Australia etc.

And tell France and Germany to take a long walk off a short pier.
Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
 
IndianGuy
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RE: Europe On The Verge Of Splitting In 2.

Thu Mar 20, 2003 1:30 pm

Well, the British are like the pig in the movie "Babe", trying to be something they clearly arent. They are going through an identity crisis here, and prefer to identify with the Americans rather than Europeans.

Well if thats what they want then so be it! THey could leave the EU to chart its own course. Mebbe even a United States of Europe, while the UK becomes an American state.

-Roy
 
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yyz717
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RE: Europe On The Verge Of Splitting In 2.

Thu Mar 20, 2003 1:38 pm

the British are like the pig in the movie "Babe", trying to be something they clearly arent. They are going through an identity crisis here, and prefer to identify with the Americans rather than Europeans.

Well if thats what they want then so be it! THey could leave the EU to chart its own course. Mebbe even a United States of Europe, while the UK becomes an American state.


The British are simply drawn to their fellow anglo-saxon nations of the US, Canada, Australia & NZ. English-speaking, prosperous & democratic for over 100 years.

I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
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STT757
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RE: Europe On The Verge Of Splitting In 2.

Thu Mar 20, 2003 1:47 pm

We (the US) used to be part of the Britain, and I forget the exact number but atleast 70-78% of Americans can trace their lineage back the the British Isles.
Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
 
Guest

RE: Europe On The Verge Of Splitting In 2.

Thu Mar 20, 2003 2:23 pm

STT757 wrote:

"Eastern Europe put up with the Nazi and then the Soviet Bullshit for most of the 20th Century, I don't think they should put up with Chirac and the EU's crap."


Actually, most Eastern European nations are very enthusiastic about joining the EU next year... and the rest are expected to join in the years ahead. Sure, there have been some disagreements over Iraq, and Chirac's statement was definitely not appropriate, but that does not change the fact that most people from the applicant countries see their future -- whether political, economic, cultural, or otherwise -- in a united Europe.

Similarly, the issue Iraq will not cause a parmanent rift between the US and the EU, unless Bush makes any further political missteps between now and 2004. These two places, after all, are linked in so many ways -- culturally, economically, politically, historically, ethnically (most Americans are of European descent, continental even more than British), and, last but certainly not least, in their common embrace of democratic values.
 
Guest

RE: Europe On The Verge Of Splitting In 2.

Thu Mar 20, 2003 2:30 pm

STT757 wrote:

"We (the US) used to be part of the Britain, and I forget the exact number but atleast 70-78% of Americans can trace their lineage back the the British Isles."


According to the 1990 census, you are incorrect (as quoted at http://home.att.net/~wee-monster/1990.html):

The Top Fifteen Ancestry Groups
as reported in the 1990 census:
(numbers have been rounded)

German 23% 58 million
Irish 16% 39 million
English 13% 33 million
Afro-American 10% 24 million
Italian 6% 15 million
American 5% 12 million
Mexican 5% 12 million
French 4% 10 million
Polish 4% 9 million
American Indian 4% 9 million
Dutch 3% 6 million
Scotch-Irish 2% 6 million
Scottish 2% 5 million
Swedish 2% 5 million
Norwegian 2% 4 million


Clearly, your numbers seem to be vastly inflated; in fact, more Americans are of continental European than British descent.
 
Andreas
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RE: Europe On The Verge Of Splitting In 2.

Thu Mar 20, 2003 5:51 pm

and Germany way upfront...ROFLMAO!!! I guess some of you guys should actively think about giving back US citizenship now, you don't really want to be part of a nation that is nearly one-quarter German Big grin Big grin Big grin

PHX...that was absolutely great, I was thinking about posting something similar but didn't know the website,thanx a lot, you're in my respected user list now!! ...and not only because of this post, btw!
I know it's only VfB but I like it!
 
Arsenal@LHR
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RE: Europe On The Verge Of Splitting In 2.

Thu Mar 20, 2003 10:58 pm

Well, the British are like the pig in the movie "Babe", trying to be something they clearly arent. They are going through an identity crisis here, and prefer to identify with the Americans rather than Europeans.

Well if thats what they want then so be it! THey could leave the EU to chart its own course. Mebbe even a United States of Europe, while the UK becomes an American state.


WTF are you talking about? You seem to have an agenda against anything British/American. The fact is, this relationship goes back decades, it's nothing new, agreeing on issues does not make us "another american state". If we disagree with certain issues, if something isn't in our national interests, we reject it, simple as that. You seem to forget this is a mutual relationship, we agree, we disagree. If you don't have the mental capacity to grasp this then that's too bad.
In Arsene we trust!!
 
Andreas
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RE: Europe On The Verge Of Splitting In 2.

Thu Mar 20, 2003 11:36 pm

Arsenal calm down, the current situation is somewhat special, and nobody in his right mind wants the UK to be American!
Stay European as you always have.
As for the EU, that's a very complex field of problems that cannot be solved in a short time, I'm afraid.
Please keep in mind, that most clear-minded Continental Europeans see it that way, there's just so much rhethorics going on right now that we would be all on the safer side if we didn't believe every word somebody says!
I know it's only VfB but I like it!
 
Arsenal@LHR
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RE: Europe On The Verge Of Splitting In 2.

Fri Mar 21, 2003 12:21 am

Apologies for the bad language, couldn't help it. Hate it when people accuse us of being America's 51st state, just goes to show they know nothing about the UK, or it's international policies.
In Arsene we trust!!
 
Scotty
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RE: Europe On The Verge Of Splitting In 2.

Fri Mar 21, 2003 12:28 am

I am

1. Scottish by birth, nature and national pride
2. British only on my passport and optional
3. European, people and cultures I admire and am impressed by and want to be part of
4. An empathiser with Canada/US, places where I feel at home

5. But against the war.

Scotty
 
Krushny
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RE: Europe On The Verge Of Splitting In 2.

Fri Mar 21, 2003 12:43 am

he he he, don't be hard on Arsenal@LHRtoday he must not be in his best mood. His beloved team got badly burned yesterday in the final day of our Fallas (the main celebration in my city, with plenty of fire - firecrackers, fireworks & burnings).
Go Valencia !!!!!!!

Anyway, I am sure football is one matter where he is a proud European. More fun to watch the Champions League than any interatlantic competition.  Big thumbs up

[Edited 2003-03-20 16:47:42]
 
Arsenal@LHR
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RE: Europe On The Verge Of Splitting In 2.

Fri Mar 21, 2003 12:53 am

he he he, don't be hard on Arsenal@LHRtoday he must not be in his best mood. His beloved team got badly burned yesterday in the final day of our Fallas (the main celebration in my city, with plenty of fire - firecrackers, fireworks & burnings).
Go Valencia !!!!!!!


Correct!

Anyway, I am sure football is one matter where he is a proud European. More fun to watch the Champions League than any interatlantic competition.

Correct! Big grin
In Arsene we trust!!
 
Andreas
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RE: Europe On The Verge Of Splitting In 2.

Fri Mar 21, 2003 12:54 am

Yes I know. Usually I cannot resist bringing up football when English teams are concerned...but in this case I didn't do it. Germany's situation is even worse with Leverkusen giving one of the most embarassing performances of German football ever.
But Krushny remember: You might be feeling well now, still England is one world championship ahead of Spain, and Germany...ahem...well, you know.
 Big grin Big grin Big grin
I know it's only VfB but I like it!
 
gkirk
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RE: Europe On The Verge Of Splitting In 2.

Fri Mar 21, 2003 1:07 am

If it comes to football, Spainand Italy beats us all!
When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
 
bmi330
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RE: Europe On The Verge Of Splitting In 2.

Fri Mar 21, 2003 1:44 am

Yep they sure do GKirk exsept from one team that's simple the best better than all the rest better than any team RANGERS. I like the Spanish football the best cant Argue with Real Madrid, Valencia and poor Depor are out funny I not a Barca fan.
 
Scotty
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RE: Europe On The Verge Of Splitting In 2.

Fri Mar 21, 2003 8:28 am

I see 330 has been on the waccy baccy again!

Scotty

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