Ilyushin96M
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Lawer Aids Anti-Gay Minnesota Law-maker

Thu Mar 20, 2003 11:57 pm

Lawyer aids anti-gay Minnesota lawmaker

Wednesday, March 19, 2003 / 04:49 PM

A noted Minnesota lawyer is defending a state legislator who outraged the gay and Jewish communities by alleging that gays were not victims of the Holocaust and that homosexuals were responsible for the rise of Adolf Hitler.

James R. Anderson says he will defend state Rep. Arlon Lindner, R-Corcoran, against an ethics complaint brought by Democratic lawmakers.

Anderson gained national notoriety more than a decade ago defending a Minnesota landlord who refused to rent an apartment to an unmarried heterosexual couple. In a case that went all the way to the state Supreme Court, Anderson successfully argued that the landlord's conservative Christian beliefs took precedence over the couple's rights under Minnesota's laws against discrimination.

Anderson said Tuesday that he was "absolutely thrilled to be representing Arlon."

"These phony ethics charges don't even rise to the level of silly," Anderson said. "This misuse of the House ethics process is intended solely to intimidate Arlon into dropping his defense of Minnesota Christians who oppose liberal efforts to promote the homosexual agenda which targets certain Christian religious beliefs."

The ethics complaint alleges Lindner's words violate a House rule prohibiting conduct that "violates acceptable norms of House behavior" and another barring conduct that "tends to bring the House into dishonor or disrepute."

Lindner made his anti-gay remarks during debate on a bill he is sponsoring that would repeal the state's human rights amendment that protects gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgender Minnesotans from discrimination in employment, housing, education and other areas. The legislation also would remove sexual orientation as a protected class in hate crimes laws.

He has refused to apologize, claiming gays are "trying to rewrite history." Last week took to the floor of the House to defend his statements, adding AIDS patients and African Americans to the groups he has offended by saying he didn't want to "sit around here and wait until America becomes another African continent" with AIDS and other sexually transmitted diseases.

Anderson says he will defend Lindner at no charge and applauded the legislator for standing up to the "gay agenda."


Wonderful. A disgusting, corrupt lawyer defending someone who hates in the name of God. It is pathetic Anderson won the case against the heterosexual couple mentioned. Since when do religious beliefs take precedence over people's rights against discrimination? This is just scary.
 
JetService
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RE: Lawer Aids Anti-Gay Minnesota Law-maker

Fri Mar 21, 2003 12:19 am

Ilyushin, sometimes 'wrong' isn't always 'illegal'. In those cases, like the hetero couple that was denied, you just have to hope justice is served in the form of public opinion and consequences in other forms.

BTW, I understand what the article is explaining that legistator is attempting, but what exactly are the charges against him in the ethics committee? It really didn't specify.
"Shaddap you!"
 
Ilyushin96M
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RE: Lawer Aids Anti-Gay Minnesota Law-maker

Fri Mar 21, 2003 12:25 am

JetService - "The ethics complaint alleges Lindner's words violate a House rule prohibiting conduct that 'violates acceptable norms of House behavior" and another barring conduct that "tends to bring the House into dishonor or disrepute.' "

Lindner has been pretty much universally condemned by everyone from the governor on down, but still has refused to back down. I hope this BS costs him his position.
 
Ilyushin96M
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RE: Lawer Aids Anti-Gay Minnesota Law-maker

Fri Mar 21, 2003 12:30 am

Here's a link to my original post on this issue:

http://www.airliners.net/discussions/non_aviation/read.main/351896/
 
MD-90
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RE: Lawer Aids Anti-Gay Minnesota Law-maker

Fri Mar 21, 2003 1:29 am

Why do you care so much about gays and not others? Why are you not OUTRAGED over Iraqis being killed, and in greater numbers than any homosexuals ever were under Hitler? Planetout.com says 10,000 gays were killed, your article 15,000. That's chump change compared to the number of Iraqis and others that have died under Saddam (not to mention the 6 million Jews).
 
jaysit
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RE: Lawer Aids Anti-Gay Minnesota Law-maker

Fri Mar 21, 2003 1:54 am

10,000 dead = chump change?

How about that? That has to be a new moral low.

What does that make the 3000 killed in the WTC? Play money?

This topic is about murdered gays during the Holocaust, not Iraq. Md-90, please go to the gazillion Iraq topics to vent your concern since you obviously couldn't care two hoots about this topic (or probably didn't know about murdered Iraqis before Bush pretended to be so concerned about them last year in his bid to wage war - Anyways, I digress. Sometimes, the crassness and ignorance exhibited on this site astonishes me.).

Under a 19th-century German law known as Paragraph 175, which forbade homosexuality, more than 100,000 gay people were arrested in the late ‘30s and early ‘40s. As many as 15,000 were sent to concentration camps, where they were at first identified with the words "homo" or "Paragraph 175" on their uniforms, later by pink triangles.

Gays, many of whom were German Christians, were spared the gas chambers that killed millions of Jews. But two-thirds of the gay prisoners died as victims of slave labor, castration, or surgical experimentation. It was part of the Nazis’ campaign to eradicate homosexuality, which they viewed as a threat to the "Aryan purity" deemed essential to Germany’s comeback from World War I humiliation. Heinrich Himmler went so far as to say that the German nation might "fall to pieces because of that plague."

Paragraph 175 became a weapon in Hitler’s hands. Starting in 1935, the Nazis expanded the definition of homosexual behavior and intensified the campaign against gays. "A touch, a look, a gesture" was enough to get a man arrested, Everett says. Lesbians, by contrast, were generally not arrested, but they were essentially driven underground, their gathering places shuttered by German authorities.

As the Nazi storm gathered, realization was slow to dawn among German gays. A survivor recounts how some gays initially believed the Nazis posed no threat to them because Ernst Rohm, a high-ranking aide to Hitler, was homosexual. In fact, illustrating how homosexuality was becoming a political football, communists used Rohm’s gay identity as a propaganda weapon against the Nazis. Eventually Rohm was murdered at Hitler’s behest, along with 300 others, during the "night of the long knives."

Clearly Lindner is trying to rewrite history himself. The man is a disgrace, and no better than the Nazis of WWII.




Atheism is Myth Understood.
 
TWFirst
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RE: MD-90

Fri Mar 21, 2003 2:00 am

When did Ilyushin EVER say he didn't care about Iraqis, Jews, or any other group that's ever been persecuted unjustly???!?? Is he only allowed to post his disgust against discrimination of groups that you approve of?? SOMEBODY has to stand up against gay persecution. He cares about gays because he is gay. I've seen you here defending Christians... because you are one. He is appalled by the situation in Minnesota because an elected official is trying to disenfranchise and demean an entire group of people in the state of Minnesota. Can you imagine the outrage if this legislator said that the genocides of Southeast Asia (a large minority group in Minnesota) didn't happen??? Or that Jews were inferior???

Your logic is absolutely ridiculous.
An unexamined life isn't worth living.
 
MD-90
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RE: Lawer Aids Anti-Gay Minnesota Law-maker

Fri Mar 21, 2003 3:07 am

That chump change comment was wrong. I apologize.
 
MD-90
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RE: Lawer Aids Anti-Gay Minnesota Law-maker

Fri Mar 21, 2003 3:12 am

96M just seemed extremely hypocritical to me.

That doesn't mean that I don't think that Mr. Arlon is very intelligent, either.

[Edited 2003-03-20 19:13:42]
 
Ilyushin96M
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RE: Lawer Aids Anti-Gay Minnesota Law-maker

Fri Mar 21, 2003 4:34 am

MD-90, what a RIDICULOUS thing to say, I care so much about gays and not others. I am completely outraged about the war, but that topic is currently being beaten to death on this forum and everwhere else. Your remark about 10-15,000 gays being murdered being chump change is deplorable.

Why do you INSIST on bringing the war on Iraq into this? Iraq has nothing to do with whether or not gays were persecuted in Nazi concentration camps during World War II.

You're out of line, man. Chill.
 
Guest

RE: Lawer Aids Anti-Gay Minnesota Law-maker

Fri Mar 21, 2003 9:30 am

MD-90,

You really don't like gays do you?

**chump change**

What a revolting thing to say.

Gays have been tortured, murdered, humiliated, experimented on and a host of other nasty ass things for years and years. In the name of *what*?

Extremist Zealots teaching people hatred in the name of god.

Lindner is a moron, rather than damamging the so called *homosexual agenda* (what a stupid term for something as simple as *equal rights*) he's merely helping to publicise the issues.

mb
 
Ilyushin96M
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RE: Lawer Aids Anti-Gay Minnesota Law-maker

Fri Mar 21, 2003 9:36 am

Oh, and MD-90, I'd like to know why you consider me a hypocrite. I don't go around making outrageous statements like you did, and then retracting them.
 
jaysit
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RE: Lawer Aids Anti-Gay Minnesota Law-maker

Fri Mar 21, 2003 10:54 am

He apologized.

He definitely earns my respect for that.

Takes a good man to say "I'm sorry."
Atheism is Myth Understood.
 
Olympic A-340
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RE: Lawer Aids Anti-Gay Minnesota Law-maker

Fri Mar 21, 2003 11:34 am

Ladies, do I have to seperate you 2??  Big grin
 
Guest

RE: Lawer Aids Anti-Gay Minnesota Law-maker

Fri Mar 21, 2003 12:23 pm

Call me MISS thankyou!

 Big grin

mb

*a klown tried to touch me and I threw fireants in it's wig*
 
MD-90
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RE: Lawer Aids Anti-Gay Minnesota Law-maker

Fri Mar 21, 2003 1:11 pm

lol Olympic A-340.

I spouted off. No one deserves to be gassed; gay, Jewish, retarded, whatever.

But Mx5_boy, been tortured, murdered, humiliated, experimented on and a host of other nasty ass things not in the name of God. The Nazis were extremist zealots but they didn't do it in the name of God.
 
777YYC
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RE: Lawer Aids Anti-Gay Minnesota Law-maker

Fri Mar 21, 2003 1:21 pm

Wow, I always thought the more sensible states like Minnesota didn't have wackos like that  Big grin . It seems to me that the Christian right (and I use that term loosely) thinks that homosexuals are trying to take over the world.  Yeah sure
 
TWFirst
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RE: MD-90

Fri Mar 21, 2003 1:32 pm

>>I spouted off. No one deserves to be gassed; gay, Jewish, retarded, whatever.<<

Especially not with the gas I produced today... MY GOD. Must have been the vegetarian chili I ate last night at Bubby's in NYC. Lord, I was like, making sure I didn't turn the stove on today for fear of blowing up the apartment... but I digress...

An unexamined life isn't worth living.
 
Guest

RE: Lawer Aids Anti-Gay Minnesota Law-maker

Fri Mar 21, 2003 2:17 pm

TWF,

LOL Thanks for sharing that.

MD90,

I wasn't referring to the Nazi's.

mb
 
seb146
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RE: Lawer Aids Anti-Gay Minnesota Law-maker

Fri Mar 21, 2003 4:35 pm

I still would like someone to point out how gays are rewriting history and what the gay agenda is. Was there a convention held and I was not invited? Or is it that some people are insecure about something and to cover it up want to make certain others be lower than dogs. In the name of religion, no less.
Gays were killed during WWII. Jews were killed during WWII. Gypsies were killed. Those against the Nazi party, I'm sure, were killed in the camps. In fact, I very well may have had relatives killed in the camps, too. What the Nazis did was evil.
Life in the wall is a drag.
 
Ilyushin96M
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RE: Lawer Aids Anti-Gay Minnesota Law-maker

Fri Mar 21, 2003 11:33 pm

Seb, I hope nobody on this forum answers that question from their own point of view. The accusation is ludicrous and ignorant, but what more could we expect from someone as self-righteous and stupid as Arlon Lindner? I just hope the state of Minnesota holds him accountable for his lies and stupidity and throws him out of office, as well as dismissing his ridiculous push to remove homosexuals from hate-crime legislature.
 
MD-90
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RE: Lawer Aids Anti-Gay Minnesota Law-maker

Sat Mar 22, 2003 4:34 am

But if gays just want equal rights (and I have no reason to suspect that that's not true), why are you crying about homosexuals not being specially protected under hate crimes legislation. Why should someone who murders a gay person receive any more punishment than a white redneck killing another white redneck?

That's not equality.
 
seb146
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RE: Lawer Aids Anti-Gay Minnesota Law-maker

Sat Mar 22, 2003 5:03 am

MD-90: My understanding of the way the laws are written in Oregon and Washington are if person A murders person B it is murder. If person A murders person B only because person B is African/gay/Jewish then it is murder but with a heavier sentance because the hate factor is there.

Once you have been fired from a job or beaten up because of what you do in the privacy of your home, then you will know the need for "special/equal protection."
Life in the wall is a drag.
 
MD-90
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RE: Lawer Aids Anti-Gay Minnesota Law-maker

Sat Mar 22, 2003 11:56 am

Well gays should already be protected from being fired, shouldn't they? That's just like firing a white person because BET doesn't hire whites (just an example).

But it should not be a harsher sentence just because someone's black/gay/Jewish. I'm white and Christian. Just because there are a lot of us around doesn't mean that it doesn't hurt just as much when one of us dies.

Obviously murder is so drastic that I'd be surprised if anyone (who's sane, at least) could do it without hating something.
 
seb146
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RE: Lawer Aids Anti-Gay Minnesota Law-maker

Sat Mar 22, 2003 12:19 pm

Before the equal protection laws for gays were in place, I was fired because of it. I did everything I was assigned to do but I was still fired. They never came out and said it was because I am gay. They just said "don't come back." The owners (my bosses) professed to be Christian. I know not all Christians are like that. The only thing I can figure out is my friend (he is gay too) and I would talk on my lunch break. Not about anything horrid or nasty and certainly not when customers were around.
I understand if people get into shouting matches over land rights, water rights or how-could-you-sleep-with-my-partner stuff, but murder is wrong. Period. But just to murder someone because of the color of their skin, just because of what they worship or who they choose to date, what is that? In some people's mind, that makes murder okay. There are many people out there (even some who claim to be religious) that think "they are beneath me and I must help rid the world of them." The whole idea of these laws is to set an example and say 'it is not okay for any reason.'
It would be good if the record could show that Joe Smith murderd Bob Jones because of his religion and gets the same sentence as Jeffery Dahmer. But that is not the way it always works.......
Life in the wall is a drag.

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