Marcus
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New Law Would Jail War Protesters As Terrorists

Fri Apr 04, 2003 6:23 am

Do you think it will pass?...............................

*****************************
By Lee Douglas

PORTLAND, Oregon (Reuters) - An Oregon anti-terrorism bill would jail street- blocking protesters for at least 25 years in a thinly veiled effort to discourage anti-war demonstrations, critics say.

The bill has met strong opposition but lawmakers still expect a debate on the definition of terrorism and the value of free speech before a vote by the state senate judiciary committee (news - web sites), whose Chairman, Republican Senator John Minnis, wrote the proposed legislation.

Dubbed Senate Bill 742, it identifies a terrorist as a person who "plans or participates in an act that is intended, by at least one of its participants, to disrupt" business, transportation, schools, government, or free assembly.

The bill's few public supporters say police need stronger laws to break up protests that have created havoc in cities like Portland, where thousands of people have marched and demonstrated against war in Iraq (news - web sites) since last fall.

"We need some additional tools to control protests that shut down the city," said Lars Larson, a conservative radio talk show host who has aggressively stumped for the bill.

Larson said protesters should be protected by free speech laws, but not given free reign to hold up ambulances or frighten people out of their daily routines, adding that police and the court system could be trusted to see the difference.

"Right now a group of people can get together and go downtown and block a freeway," Larson said. "You need a tool to deal with that."

The bill contains automatic sentences of 25 years to life for the crime of terrorism.

Critics of the bill say its language is so vague it erodes basic freedoms in the name of fighting terrorism under an extremely broad definition.

"Under the original version (terrorism) meant essentially a food fight," said Andrea Meyer of the American Civil Liberties Union (news - web sites) (ACLU), which opposes the bill.

Police unions and minority groups also oppose the bill for fear it could have a chilling effect on relations between police and poor people, minorities, children and "vulnerable" populations.

Legislators say the bill stands little chance of passage.

"I just don't think this bill is ever going to get out of committee," said Democratic Senator Vicki Walker, one of four members on the six-person panel who have said they oppose the legislation.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/nm/20030403/ts_nm/life_protests_dc_1
Kids!....we are going to the happiest place on earth...TIJUANA! signed: Krusty the Clown
 
KLAX
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RE: New Law Would Jail War Protesters As Terrorists

Fri Apr 04, 2003 6:26 am

If you block a street, go to jail. You protest in a plaza, park or side-walk or an empty lot and I don't have ANY objections.

-CLovis
 
heavymetal
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RE: New Law Would Jail War Protesters As Terrorists

Fri Apr 04, 2003 6:30 am

For 25 years? No objections?

I predict with ideas like this, politicians like this and ATTITUDES LIKE THIS...the United States of America has less than a hundred years left before it splits into regional war.
 
JetService
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RE: New Law Would Jail War Protesters As Terrorist

Fri Apr 04, 2003 6:33 am

25 years is WAAAAAAAAAAAY too harsh. They just need to make it a felony with one year sentence. First offense would have all but 30 days suspended. I bet that would make a lot of them consider protesting peacefully.
"Shaddap you!"
 
goingboeing
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RE: New Law Would Jail War Protesters As Terrorists

Fri Apr 04, 2003 6:34 am

I have no problem with the proposed law - if they will jail all the pro war folks attending the homecoming parades. After all, they tend to block streets to hold those.

I swear, the USA has become so "sensitive" to everything. Vietnam vets were treated like dog shit back in the 60's and 70's. It was flat out wrong, but they were. Now, so that we don't bring back those bad memories, we label anyone who opposes this war as "unpatriotic" or "not supporting our troops" or "terrorists" or worst of all - "liberal democrats".
 
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STT757
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RE: New Law Would Jail War Protesters As Terrorists

Fri Apr 04, 2003 6:36 am

You cannot block traffic, by blocking traffic you are interfering with the Municipalities ability to respond to Medical emergencies, police incidents or fires.

Your also disrupting inocent peoples lives, these protestors have every right to protest and speak their mind (which they do), but they have no right to block the streets so that people who get up before dawn, spend two hours driving to work, work a 8-9 hour day have to have their commute home (where children , dinner and housework need to be attended to) because some beatnicks want to get on CNN.

Most of the protesters are from out of town, they come in and disrupt the lives and busineses of locals.

They have every right to assemble, they have no right to disrupt and create dangerous situations by blocking roads.

God forbid there's a fire and these assholes are blocking the way, they would be responsible for loss of life.

If they really cared about "life" they would take such things into account before taking such reckless and endagering actions.

File for a permit to march or assemble in a park, do not block a major intersection.
Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
 
heavymetal
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RE: New Law Would Jail War Protesters As Terrorists

Fri Apr 04, 2003 6:37 am

I think you need read no farther than this...

We need some additional tools to control

Yah, mein fuhrer.

This is just another publicity stunt from some suckhole right wing radio loser whose career degraded to the point where he had to pander to cranky conservatives on talk radio because he sucked at intro'ing Richard Marx records on FM.
 
cfalk
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RE: New Law Would Jail War Protesters As Terrorists

Fri Apr 04, 2003 6:39 am

i think 25 years is excessive. But otherwise I am in agreement.

Charles
The only thing you should feel when shooting a terrorist: Recoil.
 
goingboeing
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RE: New Law Would Jail War Protesters As Terrorists

Fri Apr 04, 2003 6:41 am

"We need some additional tools to control protests that shut down the city," said Lars Larson, a conservative radio talk show host who has aggressively stumped for the bill.

Is that conservative-talk-show-host-speak for "There oughta be a law"...
 
Staffan
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RE: New Law Would Jail War Protesters As Terrorists

Fri Apr 04, 2003 6:43 am

Sweden is considering a law that makes it forbidden to disguise your face during a protest. This would make it easier to identify and charge the ones who can't do it in a manored way, a good thing.
25 years is too much, but send them in for a short sentance if they can't behave.

Staffan
 
4holer
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RE: New Law Would Jail War Protesters As Terrorists

Fri Apr 04, 2003 6:44 am

It's an absurd idea.
But those who intentionally block any street should do time under existing laws, which enforced with some teeth in it, would do the same thing without making yourself and your constituents a laughingstock.

Definition: Knee jerk reaction: See above article.
Ghosts appear and fade away.....................
 
Arrow
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RE: New Law Would Jail War Protesters As Terrorist

Fri Apr 04, 2003 8:45 am

Do you guys like what's happening to your democracy?

My guess is that Portland and other cities have countless by-laws that serve perfectly well to move people off the street if they are blocking traffic or otherwise getting in the way. Americans have been protesting in the streets for decades about one issue or another. How come all of a sudden they have to be branded terrorists and subjected to a draconian piece of legislation? I mean, 25 years for Crissakes!

If this becomes law -- Martin Luther King could be retroactively declared a terrorist.

You are on a very scary, very slippery slope here folks. Welcome to 1984.
Never let the facts get in the way of a good story.
 
JetService
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RE: New Law Would Jail War Protesters As Terrorist

Fri Apr 04, 2003 8:48 am

We're, Arrow. We're still working on keeping murderers in prison for 25 years.
"Shaddap you!"
 
Glenn
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RE: New Law Would Jail War Protesters As Terrorists

Fri Apr 04, 2003 8:51 am

Am in agreement but only as long as the war. POWs are released why not protestors.
 
DC10GUY
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RE: New Law Would Jail War Protesters As Terrorists

Fri Apr 04, 2003 8:58 am

I have said this from the begining... The Bush admin. needs to build "camps" where protesters and the like can be taken . At the camp the anti-war types can be taught the errors of thier ways .... This will end this costly problem.
Next time try the old "dirty Sanchez" She'll love it !!!
 
david b.
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RE: New Law Would Jail War Protesters As Terrorists

Fri Apr 04, 2003 9:01 am

Does the words "Freedom of expression" mean anything to you or are you brainwash by the Bush admin?

Yah, mein fuhrer tahh agee Insane  Insane


[Edited 2003-04-04 01:05:43]
Teenage-know-it-alls should be shot on sight
 
heavymetal
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RE: New Law Would Jail War Protesters As Terrorists

Fri Apr 04, 2003 9:09 am

Am in agreement but only as long as the war.

So we switch on and off our rights based on the Pentagon's schedule. That's great.


 
david b.
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RE: New Law Would Jail War Protesters As Terrorists

Fri Apr 04, 2003 9:12 am

Am in agreement but only as long as the war.

I think you would be in agreement for the rest of your life in this country.
Agree with the government or spend the rest of your life in prison.
Teenage-know-it-alls should be shot on sight
 
Ilyushin96M
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RE: New Law Would Jail War Protesters As Terrorists

Fri Apr 04, 2003 9:21 am

I'm glad a law this absurd has no chance of being passed. If it were to go through, God only knows what would be next. Police state, anyone?
 
Schoenorama
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RE: New Law Would Jail War Protesters As Terrorists

Fri Apr 04, 2003 9:21 am

Dc10guy:

"I have said this from the begining... The Bush admin. needs to build "camps" where protesters and the like can be taken."

And the Bush Admin. will take them by train and the first thing they have to do when they arrive is take a shower?

Heil Bush!
Utinam logica falsa tuam philosophiam totam suffodiant!
 
jaysit
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RE: New Law Would Jail War Protesters As Terrorists

Fri Apr 04, 2003 9:23 am

Predictably this bill will fall into the intellectual sinkhole that spawned fool of the week, state Republican Senator John Minnis who wrote the proposed legislation.

I can't believe we are even debating it - on this forum, or in the Oregon legislature. Very few, even in the Republican party will buy this junk because it cuts both ways. Protest rallies are held by those of all persuasions (for and against abortion for instance), and marching to the steps of a legislative body to demand justice is a hallmark of free American politics. When we have an anti-abortion rally in Washington, DC, for instance, traffic gets snarled and the city is a mess. As in any protest rally, we have law enforcement officials to ensure that traffic moves and business goes on while the protestors exercise their fundamental rights. Tragic to see that the party that advocates free-market economics does its damndest to advocate for the worst form of constitutional violations.
Atheism is Myth Understood.
 
david b.
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RE: New Law Would Jail War Protesters As Terrorists

Fri Apr 04, 2003 9:24 am

Is it by diesel-hauled boxcar train or Amtrak Acela Express?

Heil mein fuhrer!!!!

Teenage-know-it-alls should be shot on sight
 
Thumper
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RE: New Law Would Jail War Protesters As Terrorists

Fri Apr 04, 2003 9:42 am

David B.: Does the words "Freedom of expression" mean anything to you or are you brainwash by the Bush adenine?

Yah, mein fuhrer tahh agee

Where does it say anything about Bush? This is an Oregon anti- terrorism bill sponsored by an Oregon Senator and a radio talk show host. It is very stupid to even consider something so radical. People have the right to protest but do not have the right to block streets and become disruptive. If they become violent I would agree 30 days would be enough.
 
We're Nuts
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RE: New Law Would Jail War Protesters As Terrorists

Fri Apr 04, 2003 10:30 am

Why couldn't we have gotten a real president!  Sad
Dear moderators: No.
 
Marcus
Topic Author
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RE: New Law Would Jail War Protesters As Terrorists

Fri Apr 04, 2003 11:26 am

25 years for protesting on the streets..........you can get out even sooner with manslaughter
Kids!....we are going to the happiest place on earth...TIJUANA! signed: Krusty the Clown
 
L-188
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RE: New Law Would Jail War Protesters As Terrorists

Fri Apr 04, 2003 4:02 pm

Portland, Oregon has a real problem...

It is full of people who consider Seattle too conservative of a town for them.

I do like that proposed Swedish law.

Nobody says you can't protest as long as you do it on your own property or with the proper permits.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
heavymetal
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RE: New Law Would Jail War Protesters As Terrorists

Fri Apr 04, 2003 9:06 pm

As a student of World War II, I spent most of my youth just baffled by how a nation of educated, Christian, rational people could be so utterly entranced by a slick talking Viennese paper hanger, who conned them into enabling him to perform some of history's most breathtaking evils.

This past 6 months in America has really been an eye opener, and answered a lot of those questions for me.
 
CPH-R
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RE: New Law Would Jail War Protesters As Terrorists

Fri Apr 04, 2003 9:45 pm

Staffan,
we've had that law here in Denmark for a while, and everytime someone is arrested, they use the excuse that it's cold etc. etc. which makes sense since we only have like 2 seasons all year: June & Winter.

Expect the same thing to happen in Sweden (on the other hand, after the turbulence in Gothenburg, I can imagine why the politicians would want that kind of laws).
 
srbmod
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RE: New Law Would Jail War Protesters As Terrorists

Sun Apr 06, 2003 6:24 am

Maybe Jello Biafra needs to update "California Uber Alles" to reflect the new times.
 
NWA
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RE: New Law Would Jail War Protesters As Terrorists

Sun Apr 06, 2003 6:29 am

I think it should. Yes, it is your right to disagree with the goverment. However, you you block traffic, thats over the top. What if there is a fire firefighters need to get to? someone had a heart attack? They need to get through. All they do is hold up traffic, makeing people late for work and ho knows what else. Put anit-war signs in your yard, send letters to your reps. I dont care, its your right. However, when you block streets, thats over the top. And on top of that, look at it form a cops prespective. They have to go and deal with the protestors, and that means other things things that could be attended to, or prevented, are not because of the protestors. I hate them. I would not care if they were all thrown in jail. We have freedom of speech, but you have to know the limit.
23 victor, turn right heading 210, maintain 3000 till established, cleared ILS runwy 24.
 
erj190
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RE: New Law Would Jail War Protesters As Terrorists

Sun Apr 06, 2003 6:39 am


Heavymetal:

I was just thinking about that.

It always starts like that.

I don't remember well, but when I was a little kid, my mother and my aunt used to talk about the prices of things at the grocery.

I remember them, telling me, that I was not supposed to tell anybody that they were saying that.

They told me that the walls had hears.

As a kid, I really created this image in my mind about the kitchen wall having a lot of hears.

Only later I was able to understand what that meant.

A group of more than three persons in the street would be subject to the "inspection" by the Internal Security Police. People could not kiss in public. Women needed the permission of the husband in order to get a job. Our soldiers were sent to Africa, to fight for their country, they were told. Most of them were back in plumb cases.

It always starts like that.
Freedom can only be understood by those that know how it is to live without it.

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