UTA_flyinghigh
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Opel/Vauxhall And Chevy - Potato, Potahto

Mon Apr 07, 2003 11:14 pm

I've got a friend who has an old beat-up Vauxhall Astra and keeps on saying his ride is German; however a lot of the bits and pieces in the interior look like they've been lifted from the Chevrolet Cavalier I used to have.
The Quad-4 engine also looks very GM-designed.
So is Vauxhall roast beef, Opel kartoffelzalat or is it all hamburgers and fries ? (a bit hungry - ate only a sandwich at lunch  Sad )
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707CMF
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RE: Opel/Vauxhall And Chevy - Potato, Potahto

Mon Apr 07, 2003 11:30 pm

Exactly the same... to an extent.

Early Vauxhall Astra are the same as Opel Kadett, whle more recent Astra are the same on the continent as in UK.

Vauxhall Cavalier = Opel Vectra 1, and Vauxhall Vectra = Opel Vectra 2.

Most of the time, the difference is only in the name and in the place of the steering wheel, but...

2 years ago, I was living in the UK, and I bought a French Opel Astra. There were some insurance companies that refused to insure it, as it was not referenced in their books. I tried to tell them "But it's exactly the same as a Vauxhall Astra !!!", but they only accepted to insure it for 1,800 pounds/year (and that's third party only). Needless to say I did not call back.

As for Opel/Vauxhall being german or american, I prefer driving my Opel than riding in my flatmate's Ford...

cheers,

Antoine
 
bmi330
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RE: Opel/Vauxhall And Chevy - Potato, Potahto

Mon Apr 07, 2003 11:48 pm

It is actually dearer to insure an Opel than a Vauxhall in the UK even if its the exact same car just different baggies. Most GM cars are the same underneath example being the new saab 9.3 has a Vectra chacey ( not sure about spelling) and engine blocks in some they also share common parts with fiat cars as GM Owens 40% of fiat auto but a wont boar you with all the different facts from all the manufactures.
 
desertjets
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RE: Opel/Vauxhall And Chevy - Potato, Potahto

Tue Apr 08, 2003 12:57 am

Until very recently GM has not done a lot of sharing between the European product and North American product. Which means that the platforms between the two markets are unique and engines (to a degree) as well.

But this is all changing. The new epsilon platform is the basis for the new Vectra, 9-3, Chevy Malibu, Pontiac Grand Am, and the eventual replacement for the Saturn L series (which itself is an enlarged Vectra).

Additionally the 2.0 Ecotec four (for better or worse) is being standardized across lines as the primary engine in the medium sized cars. V-6s are another issue. The NA market Malibu and Grand Am will be using a new 3.5 liter OHV 60 degree 6. I presume it is based off of the current lineage of the 2.8, 3.1 and 3.4 liter engines. Some NA market cars are seeing the Ecotec sixes... notably the 2.5 liter in the L series and 3.2 liter in the CTS. Which will be getting a 3.6 liter version for '04.


By 2010 differences between Opels, Vauxhauls, Holdens, Chevys, et al will definately go away. GM just has way too many brands, too many platforms, and too many engine families. Ford has certainly done a much better job in that regard.
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FACT
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RE: Opel/Vauxhall And Chevy - Potato, Potahto

Tue Apr 08, 2003 3:31 am

GM have been into badge engineering for their non-North American brands for a couple of decades now ... a further example to those given before would be the Corsa, which is sold as a Opel Corsa (continental Europe & Africa), Vauxhall Corsa (UK & Ireland), Holden Barina (Australasia), Chevy Corsa & Chevrolet Corsa (various Latin American countries). There's another name used in some Asian markets that I can't remember off-hand.

Here in South Africa we have the Australian Holden Commodore sold as a Chevrolet Lumina - quite different from the namesake in the USA! In some Asian markets it sells as an Opel Commodore.

But different markets do have different tastes when it comes to the packaging of the product. For example, like Brazil and some other Latin American countries, the South African market has a taste for small half-ton pickups (called "bakkies") and the two best sellers are currently the Opel Corsa Utility and the Ford Fiesta Bantam. Fiat might still launch their Palio pickup here, which is already available in Brazil.

Ford did a lot of badge engineering with Mazda in our market (and in Australasia as well), but the days of Mazda 323s masquerading as Ford Lasers and 626s being Ford Telstars are fortunately over, and we now have the "true blue" Focus and Mondeo instead - both fully imported, though, so a bit more expensive than their Mazda equivalents.
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desertjets
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RE: Opel/Vauxhall And Chevy - Potato, Potahto

Tue Apr 08, 2003 3:36 am

GM has been notorious for badge engineering in the US as well. When you have 5 passenger car divisions you kinda have to do that. But there are still too many platforms.

Here is another twist on the Corsa story. At some point (late 80s early 90s) the Corsa was manufactered by Daewoo and sold in the US as the Pontiac LeMans in 3dr and 4dr models. Don't know if it was before or after Opel/Vauxhaull product was off the market.
Stop drop and roll will not save you in hell. --- seen on a church marque in rural Virginia
 
747-451
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RE: Opel/Vauxhall And Chevy - Potato, Potahto

Tue Apr 08, 2003 3:47 am

I recall when GM shared the Chevette chasiss, originally Opel's T-car and used it for Isuzu, the T1000 etc etc. (as a matter of fact they imported Isuzu I Mark coupes and marketed them as Buick/Opels in the late 70's).

The J-car, which was a US design was spread to Europe as the Astra/ Cavalier (Europe) and in Japan for the Isuzu Aska as well as badge enginereed versions called Buick Skyhawk, Pontiac 2000 Sunbird and Oldsmobile Firenza for the US.
 
FACT
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RE: Opel/Vauxhall And Chevy - Potato, Potahto

Tue Apr 08, 2003 4:10 am

Desertjets, the Pontiac LeMans was based on the car one size up from the Corsa, the Opel/Vauxhall Astra (the so-called 'T' car).

Daewoo gave that car a re-skin after their contract with GM-Pontiac expired and they continued to sell it as the Daewoo Cielo (or Nexia in some markets). Their current Lanos model is a further rework of the basic design - same mechanicals and chassis, different body.

Daewoo also sold a re-work of the Opel/Vauxhall Vectra as the Daewoo Espero, which was the basis for their current Nubira (same mechanicals and chassis, new body - sound familiar?). So GM buying the company last year was a logical thing to do - their products are very GM-based anyway.

Funny thing about the early Daewoos that sold in Australia (and I don't know if the US "Pontiacs" had the same problem) - the panel fit was so bad that a used car guide told potential buyers that most of them looked like they were repaired wrecks, but that was the way they'd come out the factory!
there are 10 kinds of people: those who understand binary, and those who don't
 
bmi330
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RE: Opel/Vauxhall And Chevy - Potato, Potahto

Tue Apr 08, 2003 4:10 am

But daewoo are not a GM owned company. But GM did sell them old astra presses to them to make the daewoo lanos I think its name was and obviously done the usually body work modifications.
 
lubcha132
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RE: Opel/Vauxhall And Chevy - Potato, Potahto

Tue Apr 08, 2003 4:54 am

i think Opels are nicer than Vauxhalls and most chevies tho.
 
bmi330
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RE: Opel/Vauxhall And Chevy - Potato, Potahto

Tue Apr 08, 2003 5:00 am

A Opel is a Vauxhall with an Opel badge so what you slavering about if its the same thing ?
 
747-451
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RE: Opel/Vauxhall And Chevy - Potato, Potahto

Tue Apr 08, 2003 5:02 am

The LeMans sold here was a disgrace.
 
FACT
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RE: Opel/Vauxhall And Chevy - Potato, Potahto

Tue Apr 08, 2003 5:54 am

B747-451, I thought as much ...

Bmi330, it would be more correct to say that a Vauxhall is an Opel with a Vauxhall badge ... all of the current cars sold in the UK owe far more to Russelheim than Luton. The last "pure" Vauxhall was probably the Viva from the early 70s (my guess). And Daewoo Motor is now (as of last year) a GM owned company, but they started in car manufacturing by licence building the Astra for the North American market as the Pontiac Le Mans.

DesertJets, I believe there was a slight overlap between the Astra production in Europe and the Daewoo/Pontiac production in Korea ... the Astra was 1984 - 1990 as I remember, and the Pontiac Le Mans was 1988 - 1993.
there are 10 kinds of people: those who understand binary, and those who don't
 
desertjets
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RE: Opel/Vauxhall And Chevy - Potato, Potahto

Tue Apr 08, 2003 7:59 am

Thanks for the info FACT.

Now there is another twist to the Daewoo story. With Daewoo gone from the NA market Suzuki will begin selling two new cars for '04, one based on the Leganza, the other the Nubria. The pics that I have seen make it look like it has been significantly reskinned, but it could just be a really clever front and rear facsia job... which I am inclined to believe it is. I would imagine these are based on slightly newer Opel platforms.
Stop drop and roll will not save you in hell. --- seen on a church marque in rural Virginia

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