CHRISBA777ER
Topic Author
Posts: 3715
Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2001 12:12 pm

I Quite Like America Actually...

Fri Jul 11, 2003 9:10 pm

I really like America.

America is a wonderful place, and Americans are nice people. I’ve lived in London for a few years and can say with certainty that it is as nice a place to live in as New York – I’ve been there four times. I like the way Americans are fully aware that they are open to other cultural influences – Bill Clinton said:

“We are living in the most multi-ethnic, multi-racial, multi-cultural society in human history”

If only us Europeans were so tolerant and open to new ethnic groups, people, and cultures. We are still arguing over who hates whom more, and generally screwing each other over, and getting screwed (some more than others), and this will not change – there is too much history in the past, lies and greed in the present, and uncertainty of the future for this to get any better anytime soon. The US has an awful lot going for it.

I’ve had a hot air balloon flight at dawn over the Grand Canyon. A helicopter flight over the same place at sunset. I’ve rafted down the Colorado, and skied in Mammoth Lakes. I’ve walked all round Yosemite, and cruised around Lake Tahoe. I’ve eaten clam chowder in Boston, Steaks in Rawhide, and fine, fine ribs and cornbread in Atlanta. I’ve cooked in Pasadena, and been cooked in Monument and Death Valley. I’ve gambled in Vegas, and rambled around Fresno. I’ve cheesed it in Monterrey, and freezed it in Maine. I’ve eaten more Taco-Bell than is probably good for me. Point is, ive been to America and I know it pretty well.

· I like getting the life story of random people when you go and buy coffee.
· I like having normal, sane, sober people talking to you on the tube/subway.
· Popeye’s chicken.
· BBQ Ribs.
· Biscuits and Gravy
· Breakfast Burrito
· The ranch chicken and bacon burger they do at McDonalds for 99c.
· Pancakes.
· Waffles.
· Bottomless coffee cups.
· Onion rings you can put your fist through.
· Betty Crocker.
· Rootbeer
· Proper steaks.
· The 777
· Phoenix Suns basketball team.
· Boston Red Sox baseball team.
· Pittsburgh Steelers American Football team.
· San Francisco.
· Hollywood movies.
· Very large trucks.
· Humvees.
· Dodge Vipers.
· Abercrombie and Fitch clothes.
· The M1A2 Abrams.
· Aegis Class Guided Missile Cruisers
· Seawolf class AB / Sinchonri (K-16) (SSN / RKSM), South Korea">SSN’s.
· Miami cruise Terminal.
· Key West.
· Breast enhancement technology.
· Steven King
· Jack Nicholson.
· Helen Hunt
· Jay and Silent Bob
· Seattle and specifically, Pearl Jam and Counting Crows.
· Metallica.
· The Gibson Les Paul.
· Eddie Van Halen
· Danny Tenaglia, Roger Sanchez, Todd Terry and Erick Morillo.
· New York House Music.
· Very, very tall buildings.
· Snoop Dogg.
· A 4.2 litre sunburst red softtop Ford Mustang and very straight roads.
· The MD11.
· FedEx.
· New Orleans style food.
· Stupidly busy airports.
· A CBG. Usually several.
· Very large pockets on American Pool tables making it very easy to win lots and lots of money as long as you have a good cue (I do!)
· Twinkies.
· Shania Twain.
· Jackass.
· MTV
· Massive expanses of land where hardly anyone lives – like Wyoming or Nebraska
· Really cool fire trucks.
· Having the two largest oceans on either side.
· The Remington pump action twelve gauge.
· Jimi Hendrix.
· Star Wars.
· Tom Clancy.
· The B52.
· The B2 Spirit.
· Dodge Ram Charger.
· RV’s that are actually recreational.
· Automatic cars.
· Yellow taxis driven by people who are sure they will die unless they travel at 50 mph the whole time. Even in Traffic.
· Motown.
· The Kennedy Space Centre.
· The Space Shuttle.
· The Saturn V rocket.
· Route 66
· Block Parties in the Projects.
· London Bridge somewhere in Arizona.
· Being able to see both concordes together.
· Miller Time.
· Rolling Rock.
· Art Deco architecture.
· The sexual revolution.
· Perfect teeth.
· Fat bottomed girls.
· Loyal, honest patriotism.
· A penal system that works (better than ours)
· A Government that actually governs.
· Trains and Buses that people use.
· Miami Vice, and Magnum PI.
· Fraggle Rock and the Muppet Show.
· Having racial minorities, and now an HIV Positive muppet on Sesame Street.
· Bill Cosby, Richard Pryor, and Chris Tucker – great standup.
· Mullets and rednecks called Cletus, with wives called Arlene, and about ten kids.
· Texan BBQ beans.
· Matt Groening.
· Ghiradellis.
· Cookie Dough Heaven Ben n Jerrys.
· Hershey Bars.
· Reese’s butter cups.
· Cheery Coke
· CNN


I’m sure there is a whole lot more besides, but these are a few of the things that I really really like about America. Might sound shallow and crap, but the list for most other countries aren’t nearly as long. What with all the US bashing going on in here, I thought I’d stand up in defence of the US from a steadfast European such as myself. I know the above list is a bit trivial, but it’s the trivial stuff that matters to trivial people like me, and lets be honest – there’s a bunch of things on there that are pretty damn good. It’s a great place and I’d move there tomorrow if I could – and whilst I can understand why they (the Americans) get vilified worldwide for their ways, perhaps if we were more decisive, direct, and not so worried about what people think of us, things may be better. Yes they can be arrogant, (though for my money not even in the same ballpark as some of the French folks I’ve met) and yes they can be overbearing. Remember I am British, and therefore naturally brought us to respect restraint, control and emotionlessness. Yes they can be tasteless and tacky – (There is no excuse for Jerry Springer, Oprah, endless Charity records etc) but at least they have an opinion and are prepared to share it, and are not worried about whether it is tacky or not – Brits are obsessed with being seen as tasteful and cool, and hence don’t often express themselves in this way. I think there’s a lot to be said for being expressive. American guys cry and are sensitive. European men are not. American women are more pragmatic and restrained – they do not have sex at 13 like British girls and boys do. Some even wait till College to do it, and at that age, if you are still a virgin in the UK- you are either ugly or fat or both – either way you get teased like it was some kind of defect. There’s a lot to be said for waiting till you are twenty-one to drink – most 18 year olds here are alcoholics. I certainly was when I was 18. Smoking. Horrible habit, and we, Europeans do it far more than the US folks do. 9/11. That is an example of how a nation can come together and get some kind of comfort out of unity and a patriotic pride – not wishing to appear cynical but would any of the European nations have done the same? Probably not, though I am obviously not qualified to make such an assumption – but I imagine it would have denigrated into backbiting, infighting and recrimination, blame, and anger. I don’t think its wrong to feel a sense of duty and patriotism, and occasionally some on here writing in defence of their beloved Boeing do tend to go above and beyond this, into the realms of blind pig headedness and crass small mindedness. But the Europeans all do the same right back, so it just becomes boring.

So fellow Europeans on here: sound off like you got a pair! What do you like about the US? Anyone agree that they do sometimes get a raw deal on here from us EU folks? Anyone else agree with anything I’ve said?


What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
 
mirrodie
Posts: 6789
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Fri Jul 11, 2003 9:42 pm

well....

I'm an American but wanted to thank you for that insight.

Often times I have to wonder where this country is headed. However, your insight offers such a fresh perspective from the other side.

I respect that you 'have a pair' and took the higher road, as you mentioned the pros and not the cons, as every country has their problems.

I love the UK and Australia and may want to retire there one day, but I still love the USA.

take care,

mirrodie-an American of euro-carribean descent.
Forum moderator 2001-2010; He's a pedantic, pontificating, pretentious bastard, a belligerent old fart, a worthless st
 
CX747
Posts: 5566
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Fri Jul 11, 2003 10:02 pm

Thank you for that post. Sometimes we need to take a step back when things get heated up. There are actually only 2 things I disagree with you on in your list.

1. You can never eat too much Taco Bell. My last boss proved that time and time again. He would complain that we were going there for lunch and then get 6 tacos and a few burritos!

2. As an American Male I do not cry  Smile/happy/getting dizzy This the land of John Wayne and Clint Eastwood!

There is a pool party going on at my friends house tonight. You are more than welcome to come! Fine beer, fine women and endless possibilities.
"History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or timid." D. Eisenhower
 
CHRISBA777ER
Topic Author
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Fri Jul 11, 2003 10:09 pm

Miroddie:

Nice idea about retiring in the UK but try Aus - its sooooo much nicer.
I would miss my beloved Chelsea Football Club, "The Full Welsh" Breakfast, and my Mum and family, but for sure i'd move to America tomorrow if i could though.

Oh, and add Oreos to my list above.  Smile

CM

What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
 
Scotty
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Fri Jul 11, 2003 10:11 pm

I think the point being made in general on the other thread is that most Europeans actually LIKE the US, but NOT the current incumbent of the White House or his Government.

personally, I dont agree with the death penalty or the liberal gun usage but if that's the way Americans want it, thats up to them - I dont have to live there so I can't really comment. My problem comes when the US Government starts to think it can export its "way" to other countries.

But the citizens of the US are generally great.
 
CHRISBA777ER
Topic Author
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Fri Jul 11, 2003 10:11 pm

CX747 - Your points duly noted and re. the pool party - fine women and good beer - this is when you regert eating all that Taco Bell - but yeah thanks for thew offer dude, shame i'm 3500 miles away but there ya go. Thanks for your comments re. the post too - nice to be appreciated - i'll be interested to see how many Europeans agree with me. I have my suspicions...

CM
What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
 
Klaus
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CHRISBA777ER

Fri Jul 11, 2003 10:31 pm

CHRISBA777ER: We are still arguing over who hates whom more, and generally screwing each other over, and getting screwed (some more than others), and this will not change – there is too much history in the past, lies and greed in the present, and uncertainty of the future for this to get any better anytime soon.

Outside of Britain, there is far less fascination with these things. Most Europeans have better things to do than hate each other...  Wink/being sarcastic


CHRISBA777ER: 9/11. That is an example of how a nation can come together and get some kind of comfort out of unity and a patriotic pride – not wishing to appear cynical but would any of the European nations have done the same? Probably not, though I am obviously not qualified to make such an assumption – but I imagine it would have denigrated into backbiting, infighting and recrimination, blame, and anger.

Nope.

Remember the great flood in eastern Germany and the neighbouring countries last year? It was a great and inspiring example of what people can and will do when others are in need. Help was given freely within Germany and across the borders - in all directions (even russian emergency teams came to help).


The USA have a lot going for them; And among the biggest assets are the ordinary, decent people living there. It doesn´t take more to love another country, even though there is quite a bit more than that.

And the same is true for Europe. Maybe you should just experience a bit more of it to appreciate it.

There´s no need and no valid reason to look down on anybody. In any direction.


Be well!  Big thumbs up
 
FDXmech
Posts: 3219
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Fri Jul 11, 2003 10:52 pm

You know what's curious about Americans.

If let's say a visiting Belgian citizen visiting the U.S. got into a conversation with the average U.S. citizen and asked; By the way what are you?

He or she would say, "I'm Irish" (or Russian, Chinese, German, etc, etc).
This is odd since the overwhelming majority of Americans don't feel a higher allegiance to their ancestors birthplace yet feel reluctant or actually the thought never crosses their mind that being American is indeed their nationality when asked, "What are you?

In all my years I've heard only one guy say, "I'm American".

I might be wrong and this is not meant too offend (so please straighten me out if I'm out of line) but being American is not a nationality in the strictest sense of the word. I mean being French, Spanish, etc there is little ambiguity that these nations have a distinct sense of who they are and are relatively distinct from other nationalities. In other words, in being *French* you are French.

Being an American on the other hand is such an open ended and informal nationality that when talking among ourselves, only the rarest of individuals would describe his nationality as American and most naturally revert back to his *proper* ancestral origin for identity.
You're only as good as your last departure.
 
Leezyjet
Posts: 3540
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Fri Jul 11, 2003 10:59 pm

I like America too.

I dragged my mate all the way from England to Panama City Beach for Spring Break this year too. I kinda hoped that 2 English dudes would go down a storm with the chicks, but I was sadly dissapointed. So much so that we drove down to Daytona Beach to try our luck there.

One thing I'd love to do is go to the US and hang out with some likeminded Americans who could take us round the clubs and show us how you guys party (we could show you how us Brits drink too  Big grin ). I'd like to be able to understand what all that Fraternity (sp??) stuff is all about too - that really looks like my kind of thing.

I was hoping when we went to P.City that we would meet some people like that, but when we spoke to people they just didn't seem interested and couldn't beleive that we would actually fly half way round the world then drive half way across Florida just to party - I think they must have thought we were lying or something.

I'm hoping to come back to New York later this year to go out and party in some of the bars and clubs there.

I do hope that one day I could meet someone from America who I could become friends with who could take me round and show me how you guys really do it.

 Smile
"She Rolls, 45 knots, 90, 135, nose comes up to 20 degrees, she's airborne - She flies, Concorde Flies"
 
CHRISBA777ER
Topic Author
Posts: 3715
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Fri Jul 11, 2003 11:10 pm

Klaus,

I can only speak from experience - and my experience has been that generally, Europeans fight amongst themselves and are not particularly tolerant of each other - Lord knows my post on how much i dislike the French "input" to the EU proceedings illustrates this properly. I wasnt looking down on anyone because that implies that i do so from an elevated position. I do not do this. I am not elevating myself at all. I think Britain can be a truly horrible, God foraken place that epitomises everythign thats wrong with the world, so no, i am certainly no better mate, of that I assure you.

As for the floods - what i really meant was if a big terrorist attack happened - something man made - so that instead of rallying round and helping each other, all we do is have the scum tabloids telling us who to hate becasue they thing so and so is to blame, and then you get Tony Blair using the situation for political gain etc - and the Middle Eastern folks living here get a rough time off the small minded gutter dwelling scum that are taking over this continent. Thats what i meant by recriminations, anger and hate etc. If there is someone to blame, then Europeans will do it - the Americans could have done that in 9/11 but chose to rally round and save the recriminations for later. Blair would have been making speeches and kissing firemen with his crocodile tears wife before the dust had settled, trying to gain political advantage before the dust had settled had that been London. Thats what I mean.
What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
 
VonRichtofen
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Fri Jul 11, 2003 11:35 pm

Shania Twain is Canadian
 
silver_wing767
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Fri Jul 11, 2003 11:36 pm

Shania Twain..........Is Canadian...... Just thought I would add that in!!!
 
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modernArt
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Fri Jul 11, 2003 11:40 pm

Where is "The Alamo" on that list?
 
VonRichtofen
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Fri Jul 11, 2003 11:45 pm

Hehehe, Silver_wing767! I beat you by 58 seconds.  Big grin  Big grin
 
Andreas
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Fri Jul 11, 2003 11:48 pm

What I find highly interesting is the fact that this sort of thread is now started by Brits, Aussies, discussing with Americans with the inevitable occasional European speaking up...just a few months ago, this sort of thread was generally started by Germans who were completely flabbergasted about the harsh reactions of the Americans concerning the German Iraq position.

Times are changing...  Big grin
I know it's only VfB but I like it!
 
Soku39
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Fri Jul 11, 2003 11:50 pm

Canadian, well close enough.  Big grin

How about Niagra Falls you get Canada and America there.
The Ohio Player
 
CHRISBA777ER
Topic Author
Posts: 3715
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Fri Jul 11, 2003 11:52 pm

Apologies - replace Mrs Twain's name with that of Vanessa Carlton and Norah Jones.

Better....


CM
What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
 
cedarjet
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Sat Jul 12, 2003 12:01 am

I agree with the list, except for the guns and the government. The rest of it makes me want to go there right now. Of course it's a great country, packed with great people - it's just that none of them live in Washington.
fly Saha Air 707s daily from Tehran's downtown Mehrabad to Mashhad, Kish Island and Ahwaz
 
727_Gal
Posts: 318
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Sat Jul 12, 2003 12:11 am

What a great thread starter, I am so impressed - welcome to my respected users list  Smile
 
CHRISBA777ER
Topic Author
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Sat Jul 12, 2003 12:29 am

Thanks 727_gal - wasnt meant to be obsequious, but cheers anyway - i think it needed saying.

CM
What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
 
vafi88
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Sat Jul 12, 2003 12:40 am

The ranch chicken and bacon burger they do at McDonalds for 99c.
Breast enhancement technology.  Big thumbs up
I'd like to elect a president that has a Higher IQ than a retarted ant.
 
CHRISBA777ER
Topic Author
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Sat Jul 12, 2003 1:25 am

Oh and FYI - In case you were wondering, the "Full Welsh" breakfast is as follows:

Three sausages
Three rashers of bacon
8-10oz Steak
Baked Beans
Scrambled Eggs
Fried Egg
Mushrooms
Black Pudding
Fried Bread
Fried Tomato half
Fried saute potatoes or bubble and squeak
Fried kidneys
Toast
Coffee
Rennies  Smile

...Ok i admit there is nothing welsh about that, but its done best by the welsh - its sounds like a heart attack waiting to happen, and it probably is, but its real good when you have a hangover!

Another clear illustration as to why USA is good - Breakfast is better than the above!
What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
 
CX747
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Sat Jul 12, 2003 1:42 am

CHRISBA77ER: At 5'8", 125lbs, I can eat just about anything I want! They are correct in stating that Shania Twain is Canadian. She lives down here in the U.S. now though  Wink/being sarcastic

Leezyjet: You too are welcome at the upcoming party this evening. As stated earlier. Fine beer, fine women and endless possibilities. Speaking of Shania Twain, did I tell you that I socialize with a female who is pretty much a dead on look alike? Ahh the lovely Stacey, like I said, endless possibilities. Sorry to hear that Spring Break didn't work out for you. I think NYC will work out for you. Spring Break is a crazy time and people are out there to do 2 things. Drink and have relations. Half drunk women aren't going to be impressed with where you are from. Just how much more alcohol you can buy them. The more sophisticated crowd that socializes in Manhattan's bars etc should be more than hungry for you.

An earlier poster asked a question on why Americans answer "I'm Belgian" when asked what nationality they are. It might just be a difference in our culture. When a friend asks you that question they are looking to see what your history is. We are all Americans, but where were your grandparents from etc? I am American. My ancestors came from etc, etc, etc.

While Europe is a great place, I agree with the statement that a 9/11 type act would have lead to fighting etc among the countries. Individually the countries are fantastic. But try as you might, bringing 10+ personalities and nationalities to the table only results in spinning of the wheels.

"History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or timid." D. Eisenhower
 
Klaus
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CHRISBA777ER

Sat Jul 12, 2003 1:56 am

CHRISBA777ER: I can only speak from experience - and my experience has been that generally, Europeans fight amongst themselves and are not particularly tolerant of each other - Lord knows my post on how much i dislike the French "input" to the EU proceedings illustrates this properly.

That´s got very little - if anything - to do with europeans fighting each other. It´s simply politicians in the ring for different interest groups, trying to serve their respective constituencies, which just happen to be spread over several nations. You´ve got almost exactly the same effect when you´re watching a fight in any national (or regional) parliament when it´s about who gets what and who has to give up what else.

My experiences meeting fellow european civilians (or non-european ones, for that matter) are rather positive and I can therefore say with some authority that your observations are not representative of our societies as a whole.


CHRISBA777ER: I think Britain can be a truly horrible, God foraken place that epitomises everythign thats wrong with the world, so no, i am certainly no better mate, of that I assure you.

Home will always be the best and the worst of all places. Everywhere.  Wink/being sarcastic


CHRISBA777ER: all we do is have the scum tabloids telling us who to hate becasue they thing so and so is to blame, and then you get Tony Blair using the situation for political gain etc - and the Middle Eastern folks living here get a rough time off the small minded gutter dwelling scum that are taking over this continent.

You´re speaking of the british continent, I´m sure?  Big grin
Sorry, couldn´t resist. Just kidding.

I agree that it´s highly strange how many britons (and americans!) let a formerly-australian-now-american media modul tell them to distrust foreigners...  Big thumbs up

But the real world is still inhabited mostly by people who think and feel for themselves.


CHRISBA777ER: Thats what i meant by recriminations, anger and hate etc. If there is someone to blame, then Europeans will do it - the Americans could have done that in 9/11 but chose to rally round and save the recriminations for later. Blair would have been making speeches and kissing firemen with his crocodile tears wife before the dust had settled, trying to gain political advantage before the dust had settled had that been London. Thats what I mean.

Excuse me, but wasn´t that exactly what G.W.Bush did? The styles differ; But there´s nothing inherent in either the american or the european political culture that magically turns selfish and manipulative politicians into altruistic saints. As nice as that would be...  Wink/being sarcastic
 
aloges
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Sat Jul 12, 2003 2:49 am

The thing I like most about the US is that it's a whole continent-size country still left for me to discover!  Smile/happy/getting dizzy
Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.
 
DoorsToManual
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Sat Jul 12, 2003 4:13 am

A few things I like about that great country:

New England

Boston

All Boeing aircraft

Great airports, with lovely big glass windows to see all the action

Taco Bell

Seattle

Landing in San Diego on a 777

Dunkin' Donuts

Walter and 'The Dude' in that Coen Brothers' film......'Duuuuuuuude.....you're being very unDude......'

Being able to hire a car at 21 (not possible in Europe, afaik)

All-American girls (dumb, but very nice...)

Hooters (logical extension to the above)

And, the US's arrogance (let's be honest, the Bush Admin. can be quite arrogant), but it's kinda attractive....(ok, maybe I should stop!!)

Really crappy movies like "Final Destination 2" and "Passenger 57"  Big grin
 
Guest

RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Sat Jul 12, 2003 4:50 am

I'm an American now, but because I'm European-born, here's my list (that I've posted here before):

Old-Fashioned small towns
Breathtaking mountains (can even rival the Alps in some ways)
Deserts that bloom
World-class artists... and doctors... and scientists...
Vibrant cities with great skylines
Air-conditioning virtually everywhere
PBS
The Simpsons
Lots of cable TV choice
Friendly people
Wonderful blend of cultures
Real lemonade
Incredible museums
Smoking bans in most public places (Europe, I like you, but please take note)
Diverse music scene
Great customer service (with notable exceptions...)
Calvin & Hobbes
Great weather coverage on TV
California (again, with notable exceptions...), and most other states I've visited (and I've been to the vast majority west of Texas and some to the east)
The Southwest, its nature and fascinating cultures
College towns
No shortage of personal space
Trader Joe's
No need to ask for ice in drinks
Seinfeld
Plenty of bookstores (both the big chains and the independents)
Diverse weather (to put it mildly...)
Quality universities
Lots of great restaurants
Steakhouses
The Prescott Brewing Company (I don't drink, but I love their fabulous affordable food)
No-questions-asked money-back guarantees
American "style" of broadcasting (but not always the contents)
The New York Times
Great graphic design
amazon.com
Wonderful architecture
Thriving film industry (particularly "artsy" and independent movies, but many mainstream flicks as well)
Tree-lined neighborhoods
Tons of motels everywhere, making traveling easy (if a bit unromantic)
The West Wing
Woody Allen
The Daily Show with John Stewart
Bacon cheeseburgers with caramelized onions
Lots of oldies radio stations
 
GDB
Posts: 12652
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Sat Jul 12, 2003 9:01 am

Of the parts of America I've visited, I've liked San Francisco and NY the most, I realize that those two are pretty liberal and cosmopolitan so more attractive to most Europeans.
I like the 'can-do' attitude in science/technology for example.
In NY last year, something struck me when going around the Ellis Island museum, while much of the events it recorded were fairly unique, you could not help but be very impressed at the integration, not that the problems and very occasional hostility some got was glossed over at all.
I said to my friends "they got this right didn't they? We could use the oath of allegiance and the rest if it."
It was certainly food for thought.
And that was in itself instructive as to how the US became so successful.
 
AC320
Posts: 2809
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Sat Jul 12, 2003 9:07 am

Remember, every time a European says they like America, an angel gets its wings

 Big grin
fuddle duddle
 
CHRISBA777ER
Topic Author
Posts: 3715
Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2001 12:12 pm

RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Mon Jul 14, 2003 5:10 pm

Klaus,

I do not want to get in an argument with you matey- but EU is NOT the "british Continent" - ok? In the terms of what I said, the unpleasant faction i was referring to are all over Europe and not just here - despite your insistance to the contrary.

And as for the Bush thing - I should say that Bush didnt visit the site for a long time after the events - he gave it a respectful time and distance - and did NOT use the events for Political gain. Blair, Prescott etc would have been down there right away having invited all the sky news cameras to see him and his wife crying and covered in dust, so that he can play the martyr - then as the local police try to use Fat Boy's Two Jags to help carry the injured to hospital and getting an expletive ridden tirade and probably a punch or two from Prescott, THEN Blair would make a speech about how this wouldnt have happened had the BBC/Conservatives/Railtrack/Peter Mandelson/El-Nino/Saddams WMD etc not interfered with him and his constant spin, and how this whole event is symptomatic of the sickness and pain being propagated by the Tories and how if Labour were re-elected this would not be allowed to happen - to hell with Bin-Laden, this is clearly the Fault of the Tories.

Thats what i meant - let me know if you need me to explain it again, ok Klaus.
What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
 
CHRISBA777ER
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Mon Jul 14, 2003 6:01 pm

I have two points to raise having read through the thread again.

First - the only people who are disagreeing (over semantics and detail no less) on here are me and Klaus. Europeans. Do you remember my point about Europeans who are too busy disagreeing with each other to actually contribute (the thread was about the things we LIKE about America in comparison to Europe). Point proven.

Second - Anyone remember when i said that i wondered how many Europeans (Brits aside, Cedarjet, Scotty, Leezyjet et al) would voice an opinion in agreement or even acknowledgement of the point i was making. Well its been there all weekend, and only one person (Aloges - well done mate) has voiced an opinion. Klaus has just disagreed with me over details and politics and stuff that in the overall scheme of the thread is of tenous relevance.

Im not having a dig nor do i wish to cause offence or project my views onto others, but i thought i was in a minority in being someone who likes America, and now i know. Oh well.

Whats the number for American Airlines then?  Smile
What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
 
CHRISBA777ER
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Mon Jul 14, 2003 6:59 pm

Doors_to_Manual = the film to which you refer is "The Big Lebowski". Ive been meaning to start an appreciation thread for this movie on here. One of the funnyest and most enjoyable films.

The bit when The Dude is in the car driving home from Maude's "doing a J" out of the window, listening to "(Dude) Walkin' out my back door" by Creedence Clearwater Revival - and he drops said J in his lap crashing the car. Very amusing and very catchy song too.

Great Quotes:

"Do you see what happens? When you f*** a stranger in the ass!"

"Are you surprised at my tears Sir?"
"Dude, f***in' A..."

"Vee come back and cut of your Johnson - vee are nilists and vee beelive in narsing Lebowski, und vee come back and step on it and squvash it and squish it"

"Nice Marmet"

"F**k it Dude, lets go bowling"

"This is not a fifth amendment thing, Walter!"

"Donny you have no frame of reference here, so shut the f**k up - the conversation does not stop and at your convenience you miserable piece of s***..."

"I'll just go find a cash machine..."

 Smile Great Film....

Rgds,

CM
What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
 
GDB
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Mon Jul 14, 2003 8:08 pm

Jeff Bridges reckoned his role in that film 'was the nearest I've ever been to playing me'.
So he's got funny burn marks in the laps of his trousers then?!
I do like that that film, and Fargo too.
 
Klaus
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Tue Jul 15, 2003 7:48 am

GDB: I do like that that film, and Fargo too.

Oh, yeah!  Big thumbs up


CHRISBA777ER: Do you remember my point about Europeans who are too busy disagreeing with each other to actually contribute (the thread was about the things we LIKE about America in comparison to Europe). Point proven.

So your "Please kick me: I´m european!" signs haven´t been catching on? How surprising!  Wink/being sarcastic

My whole point is that my sympathy for the USA doesn´t have to do with frustration about my immediate neighbours. Both Europe and the USA deserve better than that!

You seem to underestimate yourself and our shared continent-plus-islands; And that alone is not a good reason for the appreciation of our relatives across the pond.

I´ll rather appreciate them for what they are doing right. And they got quite a few things, there.  Big thumbs up


CHRISBA777ER: Whats the number for American Airlines then?

Here you go:
UK tel 0345/789789
Ireland tel 01/602 0550
http://www.aa.com

 
AerLingus
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Tue Jul 15, 2003 8:48 am

CHRISBA777ER...
Thanks for the great note about the US...you've listed a lot of the things that we take for granted here. I've been exploring the midwestern US for the last few weeks, and I've felt a renewed consciousness as an American. I've seen big trucks, giant warehouse grocery stores, and cities with skylines disproportionately large, compared to their actual populations. Exploring this (really freakin' big) country really puts a lot of things in perspective.

-Austin

(p.s.: what does a "rasher" mean, and how much bacon is that?)
Get your patchouli stink outta my store!
 
LH423
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Tue Jul 15, 2003 3:17 pm

Thanks, CHRISBA777ER. I'm glad you like my country so much.

You can now keep the following in the UK with you (PLEASE!):

Popeye’s chicken
Humvees
Abercrombie and Fitch clothes
Shania Twain (although, you'll have to talk to the Canadians about that first. She's their problem)
Fat bottomed girls (actually...i take that back. Even for a gay man, there's nothing sexier than a big 'ol BOOTY and a nice body)
Loyal, honest patriotism (Shania Twain and our patriotism. This boy has a penchant for the annoying)


Otherwise, we can share the rest.

LH423
« On ne voit bien qu'avec le cœur. L'essentiel est invisible pour les yeux » Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
 
CHRISBA777ER
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Tue Jul 15, 2003 5:35 pm

Klaus,
Having seen much of Europe, and much of the States - i know where i would rather be - its not that i hate this country (though sometimes i devoutly do) and its not that I love America (Obesity Lawsuits!) but seeing how things are over there, just makes me ashamed to be European in all honesty. Im not saying the US is great by default because Europe is so crap, as for one thing i am hardly qualified to make this assertion now am i? No, I meant that we, as Europeans should stop thinking we are so great and wonderful, and start taking notice of how the US does things - the arrogance displayed by Europeans in the face of Americans is truly something to see. It seems that if they have a black cat, we have to have a blacker one - why do we have to compete with them all the time? Why does national pride and stupid politicking prevent us from learning how the US deals with issues that are incredibly relevant in the EU currently. Asylum seekers, gun law, terrorism law, agriculture and industry regulations, military issues and future planning etc. But No. Of course we Europeans know better, and dont need to learn from those stupid, loud, brash, arrogant yanks. Varous people throughout history have underestimated the Americans, and the way they do things. Hitler, the Japanese in WW2, Khruschev, Norieaga, Saddam Hussein, etc. I find it unbelievable that the EU does the same.

AerLingus:
A rasher is one strip of back bacon - i like mine honey smoked, and if required, you can add a couple of potato waffles to the list (in lieu of the saute potatoes)

LH423:
I can keep Popeyes! Welcome to my respected user list! Thats a lovely gesture and I will treasure my fried chicken gut as long as I live while i drive around in my Humvee with several fat bottomed girls in the back. Nice!  Smile
What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
 
CX747
Posts: 5566
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Tue Jul 15, 2003 9:54 pm

CHRISBA777ER: Next time you are in the U.S. let me know. You definately have an invite to a party.


One great American restaraunt that has yet to be mentioned is "In and Out". It is a burger joint that is outstanding. It has a retro 50's theme and makes the food when you order it. When I was living in Phoenix, I had to go there at least once a week. Their burgers, fries and shakes put McDonalds, Burger King, Wendys etc to shame. Next time your in the U.S. and see one STOP and EAT!!!!!!!!
"History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or timid." D. Eisenhower
 
Klaus
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CHRISBA777ER

Tue Jul 15, 2003 11:59 pm

CHRISBA777ER: Having seen much of Europe, and much of the States - i know where i would rather be - its not that i hate this country (though sometimes i devoutly do) and its not that I love America (Obesity Lawsuits!) but seeing how things are over there, just makes me ashamed to be European in all honesty.

My, oh my. You´ve got problems, for sure.

Outside of agenda-driven propaganda, neither Europe nor the USA are hellholes filled with vicious subhumans jumping at each other´s throats. Here and there most people are rather decent and most of them respect each other (the occasional falling-out notwithstanding, both internally and externally).

Your view of Europe seems rather strange; Except through the british tabloids, I can´t imagine how someone could come to such a lopsided and - above all - unrealistic image...

Weird.
 
Guest

RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Wed Jul 16, 2003 12:37 am

Klaus wrote:

"Outside of agenda-driven propaganda, neither Europe nor the USA are hellholes filled with vicious subhumans jumping at each other´s throats. Here and there most people are rather decent and most of them respect each other (the occasional falling-out notwithstanding, both internally and externally)."


Exactly right! I'm always annoyed by some arrogant Europeans (a minority) who, often led by ideology, think that they have nothing to learn from the US and fail to appreciate the place, and by some arrogant Americans (likewise a minority) who, also led by ideology, think that they have nothing to learn from Europe and fail to appreciate that place. Fortunately, most people who make the effort to vist the other side of the Atlantic rarely have such simplistic views.

I strongly believe that all Europeans with the necessary financial means to do so should visit the US and vice versa (along with other continents, of course). These two parts of the world will always be closely linked to each other, and such travel is a great benefit to both. Of course, one can always decide where he or she would rather live, but anyone approaching this with an open mind will hopefully come to appreciate both places -- and their people.

[Edited 2003-07-15 17:52:58]
 
CX747
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Klaus

Wed Jul 16, 2003 12:46 am

Give it a rest. The entire point of this post is to discuss why one likes the United States of America. You have proven his point over and over and over again throughout this post.
"History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or timid." D. Eisenhower
 
CHRISBA777ER
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Wed Jul 16, 2003 2:06 am

CX747 - Cheers mate. Couldnt have said it better myself.

Klaus,

I'm weird? Lopsided? Unrealistic? Can I just ask you to leave the condescending tones to one side for a minute? I was not suggesting that the US was a heavenly place filled with lovely, innocent, kind hearted folk where there is no crime, and no hate etc. Nor was i saying that Europe was a dark and dank place filled with murderous, hateful, bitter, recriminating monsters who enjoy living only in a scum filled hellhole. Despite your insinuation to the contrary, I am fully capable of holding balanced views and...wait for it...stating an educated preference (sharp intake of breath!). This has been stated that yes, US is a great place in my opinion, and certainly gets a bad deal off a LOT of Europeans on here, but no its not perfect. Its just a whole lot nicer than a lot of folks on here would have us believe, hence the thread.

Of course such a view is pointless unless you have an academic comparison, and i sought to point out (another sharp intake of breath) that Europe is no better, and in many ways, a great distance behind the US.

Right, are you with me thus far? Are you sure? I can recap if you didnt quite get what i was getting at (Being condescended to isnt nice is it?)

So, it seems that (shock horror!) you and me actually agree! Surely not!

Its just that I have lived in the UK, and find the gross hypocracy, lies, abject poverty, hate, crime, hate crime, spin, mendacity etc, (separate post to follow below) to be far, far worse in this country than I have experienced in the States. Added to this that fact that we are being inoxerably pulled in to a union that benefits far more the other members of it, and that any benefits afforded us as a nation are only at the sayso of people like Berlusconi, and renowned Brit hater Chirac etc. My views on the EU are well documented on this forum, but I shall recap in one sentence. Why should we feel compelled to join fully a union populated by people and states who dislike, distrust, disapprove of us, condescend to us, patronise us, regard us as "untermenchen", and treat us like recalcitrant children?

I am not suggesting the US is that much better, but it sticks in my throat when i read posts my Europeans on here who approve wholeheartedly of the abovementioned union, and then treat Americans as dumb idiots who know nothing about anything. Why does it always have to be us v them, Klaus I ask you that. "Its not about that!" I hear you exclaim.

Well if thats the case then why are you and i having this discussion? Why do you not flatly agree with my sentiments (no matter how much you disagree with clearly uneducated and ill-informed semantics) that there are things about Europe, and the UK in particular that annoy and upset people, and that we have much to learn from the US. Furthermore, why do the US and EU factions on here always end up polarised and fractious? Might it be because many Europeans such as yourself (and i'm sure you have a number of US Counterparts) see themselves and their respective camps as perfect and lovely and wonderful (an oversimplification i'll admit but i'm trying to make a point), whilst the rest of the world is "darkness and barbarism" - if you think my views on Europe are "lopsided" then perhaps you yourself need a dose of what Europe is really like. Try spending an evening in a East End pub,getting threatened by Serbs, Bosnians, Albanians etc, who claimed "refuge" only last week, but now are out killing Londoners, selling drugs, and peddling crack whores. Or any length of time in any of the horribly deprived, crime and filth ridden council estates that litter "this green and pleasant land". Hang loose and put your feet up on the foredeck of a Cornwall based fishing boat, while the crew sit idle. Spend a few hours at Sangatte. Have a heart warming discussion about what Brussels has done for the average British Beef Farmer with an avergage British Beef Farmer. Go on a big, extensive tour to find out what a lovely place Britain and Europe is. I dont mean the "nice places" - i mean where the EU is supposed to be helping. Matter of fact, how bout going round to Uganda and Rwanda and Liberia and all those other African countries. I bet they are really grateful for all the "help" the EU is giving them. Using them by forcing them to buy excess grain and corn so as to drive prices up and make more money for French and Belgian farmers perhaps? What about those interest payments on those loans we so kindly gave them? Yeah I bet they really f****g love the EU there.

And you ask "Well how is the US any different?" Its not. Only I dont see Berlusconi, or Schroeder or whoever on a tour of the place to actually LEARN about it do you? Thought not.

Yeah go and have a look at what a wonderful place the EU is.

Then come back and tell me ive got an "lopsided" view of the European "superstate". Im sure its a wonderful organisation when it works well. Its just that it only works well when some people want it to. At least in the US you dont get states screwing each other over for fishing rights/beef exports etc.

Im done discussing this now.
What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
 
747-451
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Wed Jul 16, 2003 8:18 am

"Why does national pride and stupid politicking prevent us from learning how the US deals with issues that are incredibly relevant in the EU currently"

and visa versa  Insane
 
CX747
Posts: 5566
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Wed Jul 16, 2003 11:38 am

Actully we formed a "Union" several hundred years ago and learned how to get along with one anothe relatively well using one currency.
"History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or timid." D. Eisenhower
 
CHRISBA777ER
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RE: I Quite Like America Actually...

Thu Jul 17, 2003 1:44 am

CX747 - of course it is going to happen, and i welcome it, but i have reservations about the practicality of it how things stand.

But lets hope it goes ok anyway. Hopefully i'll be in Manhattan by then! : )
What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???

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