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Aloha717200
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California Judge To Hear Request To Delay Recall

Tue Aug 19, 2003 3:37 am

Here's an article I thought you might find interesting...

Judge to Hear Calif. Recall Delay Request

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=514&e=3&u=/ap/20030818/ap_on_el_gu/davis_recall_339

By BETH FOUHY, Associated Press Writer

SAN FRANCISCO - A federal judge in Los Angeles scheduled a hearing Monday to possibly delay the California's high-stakes recall election until spring after the American Civil Liberties Union (news - web sites) made the request.


Next spring is when new voting machines will fully replace the state's outdated punch-card ballots.


"Democracy in California should not hang by a chad," said ACLU attorney Mark Rosenbaum, referring to the small pieces of paper that voters push out of punch-card ballots.


Meanwhile, the state's recall election is producing fresh cracks in party unity, with the state's second-leading Democrat accusing Gov. Gray Davis (news - web sites) of personal disloyalty and two leading Republicans bickering about which one hates taxes more.


The new disputes erupted Sunday as the candidates intensified their campaigns for the Oct. 7 election, which will decide if Davis stays in office and who among 135 candidates will replace him if he's ousted.

The Republican division arose when conservative candidate Bill Simon ran new radio ads accusing actor Arnold Schwarzenegger of being a liberal, and Schwarzenegger's spokesman fired back by comparing Simon to the Democratic gubernatorial incumbent.


Hours earlier, Democrats had their spat on national television. On NBC's "Meet the Press," Lt. Gov. Cruz Bustamante charged that Davis aides were trying to sabotage the lieutenant governor's efforts to serve as a Democratic fallback in case the governor is recalled.


"If some of the governor's minions would stop trying to undercut my efforts, I think we could have a very coalesced opportunity for Democrats ... and we have a possibility of having a win-win position on the ballot," said Bustamante, who has said he opposes the election but argues Democratic voters deserve a choice if the recall effort is successful.


The Davis camp denied Bustamante's charge.

"As far as I know, and I think I would know, we're not engaged in that," said Steve Smith, Davis' campaign manager. "From the governor on down, I think we've been fairly complimentary of the lieutenant governor."


Republican Simon's campaign announced it was airing the radio ads after Schwarzenegger's top economic adviser, billionaire Warren Buffett (news - web sites), said he believed California's Proposition 13 had lowered the state's property taxes too much.


"Gray Davis tripled our car taxes, and now Arnold Schwarzenegger's team wants to triple our property taxes," Simon said in the ad. "Which just goes to show you, don't send a liberal to do a tax-fighters job."


Schwarzenegger spokesman Rob Stutzman accused Simon, who ran against Davis last year, of misrepresenting the actor's positions.


"Bill Simon looks like he learned a lesson from Gray Davis last year and is putting distortions on the air," Stutzman said. "He knows as well as anyone that Arnold Schwarzenegger is a staunch supporter of Prop 13 and to say anything else is disingenuous."


The latest polling suggests Davis is likely to be recalled and places Bustamante atop the field of replacement candidates. The nonpartisan Field Poll showed Bustamante had the support of 25 percent of likely voters, and Schwarzenegger 22 percent, with a margin of error of 5 percentage points. Other candidates all had single-digit support.


------


Personally, I hope Schwarzenegger wins. I think he's the best man for California at this point. Granted, I don't live in the state, but I really think that Arnold could clean up some of the mess that Davis left behind. I don't trust a man who runs a smear campaign and that's exactly what it looks like Bustamante is trying to do.

Sad to see Arnold's support fall behind Bustamante, a couple weeks ago he was leading in popularity. I hope he gains it back. It's just my opinion, but I think California could really use him in office.

Your thoughts?

 
Superfly
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RE: California Judge To Hear Request To Delay Recall

Tue Aug 19, 2003 3:52 am

Your thoughts?



As a California taxpayer and voter, I will vote NO on the recall. It's a waste of tax dollars and the voters voted Davis in twice. He has 3 years to turn things around.That's why we have elections every 4 years. If the rest of the nation was swimming in huge surpluses and California was the only state with a huge deficit, I'd vote to get rid of Davis also. He is facing the same budget problems all other 49 governors are facing.

It's amazing that Arnold's ratings fell 20% in just one week.
There hasn't been any smear campaigns against Arnold. He got a lot of attention from the media when he announced he was running on Jay Leno's show. Arnold hasn't come forward on how he will deal with the budget crisis. I don't think being a an actor in movies is a qualification for the state's highest job.

If Davis is recalled, I hope Cruz wins. He is a good man and is true liberal unlike Davis.


Bring back the Concorde
 
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modernArt
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RE: California Judge To Hear Request To Delay Recall

Tue Aug 19, 2003 3:55 am

A delaying tactic. Funny, these machines were perfectly fine in the last election and in every one that they were used prior to 2000. Nobody will be disenfranchised...although this kind of talk always plays well in "the concerned" media.

Arnold's talk of possibly raising taxes is certainly not what Californians wanted to hear. Rob Lowe as an advisor?
 
Superfly
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RE: California Judge To Hear Request To Delay Recall

Tue Aug 19, 2003 4:01 am

It's funny that Arnold's advisors are saying 'raise property taxes'. Even Gray Davis wouldn'd do that. Prop. 13 passed in 1978 which is 'sacred' to California Republicans and Arnold's advisors are saying repeal it. Republican diehards aren't getting behind Arnold because of his liberal social stance and hints at raising property taxes. It's Arnold's fellow Republicans that are going to do him in.

I think delaying the recall is rather silly. I'd rather cancel the recall all together.
Bring back the Concorde
 
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Aloha717200
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RE: California Judge To Hear Request To Delay Recall

Tue Aug 19, 2003 4:03 am

According to what the article appears to say, though, Arnold never had mentioned any intentions of raising taxes. It appears that it's just an accusation on the part of Cruz, not an actual announcement from Arnold himself.

But it's true that he needs to start addressing where he stands on the issues because if he continues to have a low profile, the other candidates can easily get away with false accusations ans sway the public opinion. No doubt Arnol'd popularity will suffer tremendously if Cruz makes an accusation that Arnold wants to raise taxes, and Arnold does nothing to counter that accusation. All that does is lead the public onto a (probably false) belief that they'll be no better off with Arnold in office than davis, from a tax standpoint.

Arnold needs to defend himself. The public might be getting the wrong idea.


But here's what I think might explain his reluctance thus far to address the issues:

A candidate has to plan what they say to the public very, very carefully, because there's alot of groups out there with their own interest and any one of them, if they don't like your policies, can do great things to make sure you don't get into office.

I think Arnold is still in the "planning and avising" stage with his advisors, figuring out exactly what his platform is going to be, before launching the full-scale campaign.

If we wait a week or so, maybe we'll se him come out with a solid platform and begin addressing the issues. Hopefully by then it'll be enough to restore confidence in him. His silence has to be happening for a reason as he genuinely seems interested in helping California recover. That's why I'd put my money on the delay being simply because he's still building a solid platform for his campaign. give it time.  Smile
 
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Aloha717200
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RE: California Judge To Hear Request To Delay Recall

Tue Aug 19, 2003 4:06 am

Superfly:

"Arnold Schwarzenegger is a staunch supporter of Prop 13 and to say anything else is disingenuous."

That, to me, say that Arnold has no intentions of repealing Prop. 13. That's one of those false accusations on Cruz' part.
 
DeltaSFO
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RE: California Judge To Hear Request To Delay Recall

Tue Aug 19, 2003 4:06 am

California's recall should not hang on a chad, says the ACLU.

Which simply proves that they're playing politics, just like everybody else.

If Davis would stop being such a goddamn selfish bastard and just resign, Bustamante would become gov, the Dems would still have the governor's mansion in their clutches, and this thing would all end as quickly as it started.

Guess Davis hasn't gotten enough kickbacks and bribes to retire yet, so he has to try to hang onto his job. So here we go.
It's a new day. Every moment matters. Now, more than ever.
 
Alpha 1
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RE: California Judge To Hear Request To Delay Recall

Tue Aug 19, 2003 4:46 am

The Bush Administration should certify the Recall before some idiot judge gets his hands on it. The people of California followed the law pertinent to that state, and collected enough signatures to put a Recall in place. Let them do that which their law provides.
 
Superfly
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RE: California Judge To Hear Request To Delay Recall

Tue Aug 19, 2003 4:58 am

I wouldn't blame Cruz Bustamante for Arnold's slipping ratings. Arnold's advisors are saying a property tax is an order. They are the one's that's going to be telling Arnold what to do anyway. I doubt he will 'terminate' his key advisors.

Cruz Bustamante is just stating his agenda. It's not his fault that the people are warming up to Cruz instead of the Terminator.
I think it's best for the voters to keep Arnold in Hollyweird and leave Sacramento to the politicians.
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EA CO AS
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RE: California Judge To Hear Request To Delay Recall

Tue Aug 19, 2003 5:05 am

I think it's best for the voters to keep Arnold in Hollyweird and leave Sacramento to the politicians.

"Politics are too serious a matter to be left to the politicians." - Charles DeGaulle
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
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Aloha717200
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RE: California Judge To Hear Request To Delay Recall

Tue Aug 19, 2003 5:12 am

I hear we once had this actor become president. I think his name was Reagan.  Wink/being sarcastic

***Disclaimer: NOT trying to start a debate over Reagan policies!!
 
Confuscius
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RE: California Judge To Hear Request To Delay Recall

Tue Aug 19, 2003 6:40 am

Off topic. Trivia Question:

What movie did Prop 13 author Howard Jarvis appeared in a cameo role?





















Hint: aviation related
Ain't I a stinker?
 
Superfly
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RE: California Judge To Hear Request To Delay Recall

Tue Aug 19, 2003 7:25 am

Confuscius:
Airport '77?  Confused



Arnold shouldn't receive any preferential treatment. If he can't take any punches, he should stay in Hollywood. Politics is ugly and nasty and he should face the same scrutiny as all other politicians since he wants to be one so bad.
If he wants the people to stay in love with him, just stick to the bad acting in over budgeted action films.
Bring back the Concorde
 
L-188
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RE: California Judge To Hear Request To Delay Recall

Tue Aug 19, 2003 7:30 am

Sounds like a typical democratic tactic...

Turn to the courts when the voters aren't going your way.

The did it in Florida, they did it in New Jersey, and they are trying to do it here.

[Edited 2003-08-19 00:30:52]
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
Superfly
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RE: California Judge To Hear Request To Delay Recall

Tue Aug 19, 2003 7:52 am

L-188:
Not true.

Cruz Bustamante, Gary Coleman and Larry Flynt don't want a delay in the recall.
Cruz Bustamante certianly wants it on Oct. 7th because the momentum is in his favor.
Bring back the Concorde
 
b757300
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RE: California Judge To Hear Request To Delay Recall

Tue Aug 19, 2003 8:06 am

I bet everyone can guess who appointed this federal judge so its probably a forgone conclusion how he is going to rule. When the lefties can't win, they try to legislate from the bench.

One hint, it wasn't a Republican.
"There is no victory at bargain basement prices."
 
DeltaSFO
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RE: California Judge To Hear Request To Delay Recall

Tue Aug 19, 2003 8:08 am

Cruz Bustamante, Gary Coleman and Larry Flynt don't want a delay in the recall.

If you consider Coleman and Flynt to be typical Democrats, it's certainly an indication of how pathetic California politics have become.

Because as a Republican, I can say that I'm somewhat less than thrilled about Arnold Schwarzenegger running.
It's a new day. Every moment matters. Now, more than ever.
 
Alpha 1
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RE: California Judge To Hear Request To Delay Recall

Tue Aug 19, 2003 8:11 am

When the lefties can't win, they try to legislate from the bench.

So do the "righties", B757300, especially when a presidential election hangs in the balance. Watch what you bitch about, because most likely those you support have done the same damn thing in another context.
 
Superfly
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RE: California Judge To Hear Request To Delay Recall

Tue Aug 19, 2003 8:28 am

DeltaSFO:
Great to see you back in the forums.  Smile

I was making a sarcastic spin of this whole recall circus.


Bring back the Concorde
 
Confuscius
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RE: California Judge To Hear Request To Delay Recall

Tue Aug 19, 2003 8:38 am

Trivia answer:

Airplane!

Howard Jarvis was the man in the taxi that was left behind by Ted Striker. He had the last line in the movie after the credits.



Close Superfly, but no cigars.  Big grin
Ain't I a stinker?
 
777YYC
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RE: California Judge To Hear Request To Delay Recall

Tue Aug 19, 2003 8:43 am

Would it be so hard to do it the old-fashioned way of marking an X in a box?  Confused
 
Superfly
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RE: California Judge To Hear Request To Delay Recall

Tue Aug 19, 2003 8:44 am

 Wow!  Pissed

Gosh darn it!
Bring back the Concorde
 
Boeing4ever
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RE: California Judge To Hear Request To Delay Recall

Tue Aug 19, 2003 12:09 pm

Simple Solution from Boeing4ever:

1) Kick California out of the Union, thus eliminating Federal Support and stripping away the Civil Rights guaranteed under the Federal Constitution.
2) Place economic sanctions on the former state to starve out all the idiots (which constitutes 98% of CA's population)
3) Declaration of war and subsequent carpet bombing and ground invasion.
4) Force California to undergo a humiliating "reconstruction period" like the South did after the Civil War.
5) Repeat until Californians develop common sense, or, until the state is empty of living beings...whichever comes first.

"California is a huge problem in America! The San Andreas Fault, is the solution to that problem!"-B4e

B4e-Forever New Frontiers
 
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Aloha717200
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RE: California Judge To Hear Request To Delay Recall

Tue Aug 19, 2003 3:16 pm

I have some very dear friends who live in California. Can we at least allow them to safely leave the state before the carpet bombing begins?  Wink/being sarcastic

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