csavel
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Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 4:15 am

Just read an article on MSNBC about circumcised men trying to stretch their skin to regrow a foreskin. They say it brings enhanced sexual feeling, and is more natural, and it shouldn't be cut off by parents or doctors when the kids are infants and the kids have no choice, just to conform.

I'm Jewish and thus circumcised, so I got snipped when I was 8 days old. Had zero choice about it. Now I'm not one of those nutters who formed support groups to lament their late great organ, but the people seem to me to have a point when they say that it is a permanent body scarification and amputation made just for tribal identification, not medical necessity. What rights do parents have to scarify or permanently alter their children's bodies for ethnic, tribal or religious use?

In parts of Africa, great strides have been made to reduce female circumcision (more aptly termed female genital mutilation) Snipping an infants foreskin for religion or tribal identification does seem like the same thing. Obviously not as bad, because you're not lopping off the whole organ (they usually amputate the clitoris for girls) but I think it is really a question of degree, not of kind.

If you think cutting of a clitoris violates a girl's civil rights, then why not a boy's foreskin (granted the violation is not as bad)?

What are children's rights (if any) in this? When does religion or the rights of the parents to bring up child in a certain religion or cultural tradition that they have chosen have to give way to the rights of the child to body integrity?

< edited to give hyperlink to article >

http://www.msnbc.com/news/964825.asp?0dm=T246H

[Edited 2003-11-03 20:17:15]
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ConcordeBoy
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 4:17 am

Hygienic as well as aesthetic purposes toward it...

...at the risk of TMI, I'm very prejudice against uncircumsized guys as have have nothing but disgusting experiences with them. Anecdotal to compare those said few to the entire population, I know.... but still.  Sad
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
jaysit
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 4:21 am

Recent studies have shown that circumcised males have a lower risk of HIV infection than uncircumcised males. So, at least for now, cut dicks seem to have the upper hand (so to speak).

Size matters. The status of your foreskin is just a cultural tidbit.
Atheism is Myth Understood.
 
csavel
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 4:21 am

That is what people who support Female Genital Mutilation say to defend their practice, It's cleaner, etc., etc.

Again, neither, being uncircumcised, a woman, or gay, I wouldn't know but I gotta figure a guy can just, um, wash down there.
I may be ugly. I may be an American. But don't call me an ugly American.
 
ConcordeBoy
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 4:26 am

I wouldn't know but I gotta figure a guy can just, um, wash down there

You'd think so...

...however, it seems that the whole once a day that many of them do just doesnt cut it!
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
seb146
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 5:29 am

This is one thing I have never understood about Christianity. Some of them get all upset over tattoos and piercings because we need to treat our body like a temple yet they take a newborn child and put him through pain becuase his parents want him to be identified as a Christian. My feeling: That is how males are born. Leave it be.

Contrary to ConcordeBoy, I like it....

GO CANUCKS!!
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Aaron747
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 6:05 am

I was a few days old when it was done. I don't remember, my girlfriend loves it, and it looks beautiful. Verdict? Don't care.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
Superfly
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 6:09 am

Circumcision should be banned period!
We designed to have them.
Stop the brutal practice now!
Bring back the Concorde
 
DeltaMD11
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 6:16 am

I was circumcised within a day of my birth (I'm not jewish, I'm Roman Catholic), as are most males born within the last 30 years in the United States. It was done in my case for aesthetic reasons as well as just the fact that it is easier to maintain oneself. No complaints here! I think it was a good choice.

Seb, you're right when you say that you don't understand some aspects of Christianity. Christians do not promote circumcision via any religious texts or anything of that nature. It was originally a practice performed by the Jews basically as a sign to show ones union with God. It's just becoming a more common practice nowadays, especially here in the US.
Too often we ... enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought. - John Fitzgerald Kennedy
 
b757300
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 6:17 am

Circumcision should be banned period!
We designed to have them.
Stop the brutal practice now!


Oh please. What about our rights to privacy and doing what we want with our bodies as liberals always espouse?
"There is no victory at bargain basement prices."
 
777236ER
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 7:14 am

There's a difference between a consenting adult and doing it to a baby.
Your bone's got a little machine
 
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Aloha717200
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 7:23 am

To be honest I dont consider it to be a mutilation of the male genitals at all. I'm circumcised, I have no issues with it and in fact I'm glad that I am. Just seems cleaner. I'm sorry that it seems to be such an issue for people but I'm just fine with it and if I ever have a son he'll be circumcised too. that's just how I feel. I dont find it wrong whatsoever.
 
Superfly
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 7:27 am

B757300:
Dude, chill on the politcal b/s for just one thread!
This isn't a politcal issue.
Ain't you a gawd fearing christian anyway?
If you believe in God and see God as perfect and our creator, we should expect that he created us without any flaws. Thus God intended for us to have a foreskin.
It's religion that has screwed us up in to beliveing that we need to do this to our bodies.
Bring back the Concorde
 
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Aloha717200
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 7:32 am

Honestly, the issue of circumcision for me has nothing at all to do with God. It's based on appearance alone really, and cleanliness. I dont belong to any set religion so the decision i make in regards to a future child, and the decision that was made when i was born, will not/were not made for religions reasons.

That said, God gave us a foreskin. He also gave us Free Will.  Big grin
 
Superfly
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 7:35 am

Ban infant genital mutilation NOW!

NO circumcision until he is 18 and chooses to do so himself!
Bring back the Concorde
 
POSITIVE RATE
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 8:11 am

It's based on appearance alone


Hmm ok, so you think the appearance is so important that it's worth putting the child through unnecessary pain? Btw it's not like everyone's gonna see it anyway so appearance really doesn't matter.
 
DeltaMD11
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 8:13 am

Put the child through uneccessary pain...yes the child feels it but do you remember it? No. Thus, it never happened mentally. Just physically.
Too often we ... enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought. - John Fitzgerald Kennedy
 
Superfly
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 8:15 am

DeltaMD11:
yes the child feels it but do you remember it?

Still doesn't make it right.
It's WRONG!

Bring back the Concorde
 
DeltaMD11
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 8:22 am

Wrong on what grounds? Women (and men really) are allowed to mutilate their ears by putting holes in them for earrings, people mutilate their faces by having cosmetic surgery to get their desired look, the new thing is the shortening of toes to make your toes proportionate to eachother (smaller in descending order).

Why is it so wrong Superfly? It does not affect the way the organ is used or stops it from functioning to procreate. Thus, it is just a form of cosmetic surgery (as well as a religious ceremony for some).

[Edited 2003-11-04 00:23:41]
Too often we ... enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought. - John Fitzgerald Kennedy
 
Superfly
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 8:25 am

DeltaMD11:
Scroll up and read post #12.
I don't like to repeat myself.
Bring back the Concorde
 
turbulence
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 8:30 am

I wouldn't say so much. Circumcision seems to have been a sanitary rule, as well as many other rules from the oldest ages. It was supposed to prevent STD, or to avoid "cultivation" of bacteries in a moist environment. Today, because cleanliness and sanitary rules are well known and mostly followed, such practices have remained stuck to religious reasons.
This is the same reason why adultery was forbidden, why unmarried sex was forbidden, why adultery was forbidden. Sexually transmittable diseases were quite "popular" by then, and limiting sexual practices to one person was quite an effective way to stop spreading them.
Still in religious rules, why do you think muslims do not eat pork? Today it is a religious rule, when it was "established" it was because in those regions it was too hot, and pigs had developed a number of diseases that were transmitted to humans.

As for the expression "male genital mutilation", do not be so "terrorist", and do not compare it to "FEMALE genital mutilation":

The circumcision is usually done when the child is very young, supposedly for sanitary reasons, a simple cut that almost never has consequences, and their ability to have sexual pleasure remains unchanged.
Ah!! and in little new-born babies, it does not hurt. And before puberty, the pain is so little that in many cases, before 4 or 5 years old, not even anesthesia is applied.

The "clitoris ablation" is a wild agressive practice to young girls who are developping (or have just developped) sexually, that hurts the hell of hells, that usually results in infectious processes that cause a significative number of deaths, for the sole purpose of making women "clean". What does it mean? that they will not try to experience "other sexuall pleasures out of the marriage" because those little women become UNABLE TO FEEL ANY KIND OF PLEASURE with sex (OK, actually they can feel something if they have a sensible man with them, female body is quite more sexually sensible than the male one, but reducing what can be quantificated as 90% of their sensibility).

Circumcision has not prooved to increase or improve anything, but does not become a source of problems.

Clitoris ablation is a wild bestial torture from which girls will NEVER recover, from which they loose the totality of their genital organs and sensibility, from which many young girls cannot survive, adn from which most of them drag psycologic sequels for their whole life.

It was not the best for a comparison.

Enjoy turbulences!!!

[Edited 2003-11-04 00:35:13]
 
DeltaMD11
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 8:30 am

God intends for us to have things, but also he gave us free will which allows us to choose our own fate. What about those who do not believe in the judaic-God? Circumcision comes down to what the parents would like to do. And the parents are within their means to do it as they are the guardians of their children.

You still have not given sound reasoning as to why this practice should not be performed thus I'll dismiss your whims until a reason that is practical is provided.
Too often we ... enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought. - John Fitzgerald Kennedy
 
Superfly
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 8:34 am

Turbulence:
Great to see you back in the forums.  Smokin cool

Soap and water can do amazing things. This is 2003 A.D.
Do we need to hang on to such a barbaric practice?
Like brest implants, it should only be up to the person to decide if they want it done or not.
Stop the infant circumcision NOW!
Bring back the Concorde
 
csavel
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 8:35 am

Aloha717200,
"The decision you make for your child" means that your child will have no free will. "God gave us a foreskin" but by cutting off an infant's, his God-given free will is quite denied, don't you think?

Again, I think those cut men who feel that they are butchered have more problems than just being circumcised, but, operating on and permanently changing the genitals of an infant who by definition cannot consent or complain seems to be a bit barbaric and unfair to the child.

Jaysit,
I do programming work for a research organization (nameless to protect them!) that actually did some of the studies you mention. The ones they did were done in Africa and compared tribes who circumcised to those who didn't. Although I work in their IT department, some of the studies were readable to laypersons and they have a critical flaw, which they also admitted. They could not tell whether it was the circumcision or any other things in the culture of the two tribes that contributed to the two rates. They tried to compare two tribes that were similar except for the circ/nocirc thing, but there is controversy on how well they did that or if it is even possible to do so. There is still controversy, although some studies of the inside of the foreskin show that that is about the only non-keratinized part of the penis and can conceivably allow HIV virus to spread. No foreskin, no non-keratinized point of entry. I would like to know whether or not HIV rates are higher amongst similar groups in, say, the US (mostly circumcised) as opposed to Canada (mostly not) since the cultures are similar in terms of health, hygiene, food, income, etc., etc.
I may be ugly. I may be an American. But don't call me an ugly American.
 
DeltaMD11
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 8:36 am

The defense rests. This is like competing in the special olympics. Even though you might win, you're still retarded.
Too often we ... enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought. - John Fitzgerald Kennedy
 
Superfly
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 8:39 am

DeltaMD11:
Easy way out when you can't back yourself up.  Yeah sure

Bring back the Concorde
 
turbulence
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 8:40 am

Thank, you, Superfly, I have actually never been away, just not very active.

And, about stopping infant circumcision... well, for me it is of no importance, while if one makes use of his right when a little grown up, is going to suffer for a while in case of certain unwanted uncontrolled (and highly undesidered then) eehhrr... "wooden" reactions of the "passive subject"

So, if done, better the youngest possible.

Enjoy turbulences!!!
 
DeltaMD11
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 8:41 am

I'm not going to keep harping on it when you've done nothign to refute my statements  Smile That's just a waste of time and bandwidth.
Too often we ... enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought. - John Fitzgerald Kennedy
 
Superfly
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 8:43 am

Ok, so of uncut guys, what percentage gets infected and need to be hacked?

Should we rip the tonsils out of every newborn because they might get infected?
Bring back the Concorde
 
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Aloha717200
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 9:04 am

To be quite honest with you, I dont think the baby will give a damn. I was circumcised, but I don't remember it, and I certainly don't resent it, so all the stuff about inflicting pain on the baby truly doesn't change my mind.

In fact I think it's better to do it when the baby is young enough to forget about it. If it were done when they were older, they'd remember the pain, and it'd likely be worse. Best not to have that in their memories I think. The best pain is the kind you forget.  Smile


Personally I dont see what the big deal is. It's not mutilation, so why is everyone so up in arms about it. It's not that big of a deal.
 
toady
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 9:35 am

Has any ADULT male had himself circumcised for any (non medical) reason? I mean, what 18 + year-old has said "I will have my foreskin removed because it looks better" or "because it will be cleaner"?

I know there are a very few adults who mutilate their genitals but it is absolutely NOT usual for adult males to get circumcised for appearance or hygiene reasons.

This shows me that when males are allowed to exercise THEIR OWN free will, those choose not to be circumcised.

The sooner parents realise that their duties and obligations to their children do not equate to 'ownership' of them, the better.
Further to Superfly's mention of tonsils, how about the appendix? Should that also be removed from newborns because it may avoid potential future problems?
If parents think their baby's appearance would be enhanced by a head-to-toe tattoo, should they be allowed to have it done?

And I think there's something rather sick about parents who are concerned by the look of their baby's penis. And something wildly amiss with parents who are unable to teach their son to wash properly.

For the record, I am not circumcised. I am happy with the way nature (or God, depending on one's viewpoint) made me - I have no problem washing my penis and I (nor anyone I've been intimate with) has a problem with the way it looks.
If any adult male doesn't like the way his penis looks, or is unable to wash it, by all means lop it off.....
 
Dash8King
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 9:59 am

Why is it that the uncircumised males are really passionate about it and feel it should be band? Yet us who are don't really care either way, and aren't resentful for all that pain we apparently felt?
 
vafi88
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 10:09 am

Hey B757300 - if it is one's choice to do what he/she wants to their bodies, then why do you have a problem with abortion?
I'd like to elect a president that has a Higher IQ than a retarted ant.
 
JAL777
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 10:11 am

Hey B757300 - if it is one's choice to do what he/she wants to their bodies, then why do you have a problem with abortion?


Because the baby doesn't get to decide.
 
toady
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 10:15 am

The issue for me is not so much about that tiny piece of skin, whether it's useful or not, whether its removal hurts or not or whether it will ever be missed or not but about one (or more) people exercising their will over another.

Imagine this scenario:
Mr & Mrs Parent have a son who is ONE DAY short of ceasing to be their legal responsibility - tomorrow he will be an adult, but today he is still a minor in his parents' care.
Mr & Mrs Parent decide that he should be circumcised. After all, they are still fully responsible for him and still bear all parental duties and obligations.
Should they be allowed to have him circumcised?
 
Superfly
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 10:24 am

Jal777:
Because the baby doesn't get to decide.

...and the baby should decide if he wants his foreskin hacked off when HE turns 18 years old!
Bring back the Concorde
 
JAL777
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 10:30 am

...and the baby should decide if he wants his foreskin hacked off when HE turns 18 years old!

I didn't say he shouldn't.
 
DeltaMD11
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 11:39 am

I honestly don't see what the big deal is. It's a piece of skin that is not really useful. I don't resent the fact that I'm circumcised, and honestly I thought my penis was like that when I was born up until about the age of 10 when I inquired as to what circumcision is and that I was circumcised-and some people aren't. The bottom line is, it doesn't bother me and when the time rolls around I will have my own children circumcised as well. It's really not that big of a deal-just personal preference. Those that don't want your children cicumcised so be it, and those that do: More power to you!
Too often we ... enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought. - John Fitzgerald Kennedy
 
airplay
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 11:45 am

Recent studies have shown that circumcised males have a lower risk of HIV infection than uncircumcised males.

I can think of a few other things you can do to lower your risk of HIV infection.....

Let's get serious. People don't get HIV because they have a foreskin.

 
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Aloha717200
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 12:03 pm

I agree 100% with Dash8King and DeltaMD11.....it really isn't that big of a deal.

Really I dont understand the reason for trying to make this all look like a control issue, parents circumcising kids to show ownership. Oh please, I don't believe that. Parents don't circumcise a kid to show ownership, it's not branding a child to show who it belongs to. It's just a preference.

And you're right, someone who's lived for 18 years with an uncircumcised penis isn't going to want to have it circumcised. Why? Number 1...it hurts....number 2...they've lived 18 years with it and are used to it. For them, that penis is the only one they've ever known, why change it?

for those of us who were circumcised...the one we have is the one we know, and so generally, we're partial to the way we have it.



It's not that big of a deal folks. And it shouldnt be banned.
 
jaysit
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 12:07 pm

"Let's get serious. People don't get HIV because they have a foreskin."

No, but the skin underneath the foreskin doesnt have the same epidermal defenses the glans of the penis has. Some very reputable epidemiological studies have indicated a higher rate of HIV infection among uncut males viz a viz circumcised males. Studies were conducted in Africa and India where Muslims are circumcised but Hindus and Christians rarely are.
Atheism is Myth Understood.
 
toady
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 12:31 pm

Number 1...it hurts....number 2...they've lived 18 years with it and are used to it. Number 3....there's absolutely no reason to have it done.

I didn't mention "ownership" to mean that parents "brand" their sons but rather that they feel fit to do whatever they want to their son's body. That they will exert THEIR preference on someone else.

DeltaMD11: You said that you will have your son circumcised. Can you tell me WHY you'll have it done? Is it simply because it's "really not that big of a deal"? Is it because you want him to be just like his daddy? Or is there another reason?

I really cannot understand why tattooing and piercing of babies is illegal, yet circumcision is not.
A tattoo on the inner thigh would be "no big deal" and any kid so marked would assume that is was perfectly normal to have one. A pierced nipple would also be "no big deal".

I asked a question in Reply 34. Is anyone going to answer it?
 
airplay
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 12:44 pm

Jaysit,

People get HIV by indulging in dangerous sexual practices. The statistics you are trying to build linking foreskins to HIV is truly irrelevent to the cause of HIV infection.

If you at least made a statement like, "persons who have unprotected risky sex with HIV positive persons have a higher likelyhood of contracting HIV if they are uncircumcised" would make more sense.

Maybe I'm being nit-picky here for your liking but I think it needs to be clarified. It is an important distinction in my opinion as your original statement implies that circumcision is a good practice to reduce your chances of contracting HIV, when the primary cause is having risky unprotected sex.

 
jaysit
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 12:59 pm

And I thought that the clarification was inherent.

Of course, the folks who were included in this study were not wearing rubbers. But when one variable is usually compared, you have to control for all other variables.

Of course, being circumcised will not prevent HIV infection. All that the study showed was that circumcised males have a lower infection rate, all other variables being equal.
Atheism is Myth Understood.
 
FlyVirgin744
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 1:52 pm

The way I see it is, our parents play a great role in the people we are today. I tend to think, that if I were born into a different family, I would be drastically different in many ways. I feel circumcision goes with these characteristics.

We are all in some way a product of our parent's upbringing, and circumcision is part of that.

Just one in 1000s of decisions our parents made to shape us.
Sometimes I go about in pity for myself and all the while a great wind carries me across the sky.
 
JetService
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 2:08 pm

Toady, I'll answer your question:

I think the parents should legally be allowed to have the baby cut, but in principle, it would be extremely selfish if they did. Knowing the the baby will have new parents, they should let the new parents decide. Leaving him unsnipped gives them the option.
"Shaddap you!"
 
fly727
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 5:19 pm

No one asked me nothing. I bet it hurt like hell; despite that I think it is more hygienic this way. Hard decision for the parents though.

I have a friend who had to have it done at the age of 23 because of a medical condition. It was no easy for him and the recovery was long and painful.

RM  Smile
There are no stupid questions... just stupid people!
 
covert
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 5:22 pm

I'm happy I am circumcised, I don't think it is just some religious drivel, I think it is actually useful, at least I don't have to roll back when I have to piss and I don't have to worry about infections down there.

covert

[Edited 2003-11-04 09:22:22]
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bobrayner
Posts: 2038
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 6:45 pm

I'm happy I am circumcised, I don't think it is just some religious drivel, I think it is actually useful, at least I don't have to roll back when I have to piss and I don't have to worry about infections down there.

Roll back? The foreskin is naturally equipped with a hole anyway. I don't have a cricothyrotomy, but I'm breathing just fine.  Wink/being sarcastic

As for hygiene... I'm skeptical. People can wash. I doubt that many people get infections under the foreskin (&c) who wouldn't otherwise get some other hygiene-related problem if they were circumcised.

If it was a significant hygiene issue thousands/millions of years ago, surely evolution would have played a role, and tended to select guys with minimalist foreskins?

I have no problems with people choosing to get piercings, tattoos, &c; similarly, if somebody chooses to get circumcised, that's their choice. How many people actually choose, though?
Cunning linguist
 
airplay
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RE: Circumcision: Male Genital Mutilation?

Tue Nov 04, 2003 10:50 pm

I have a friend who had to have it done at the age of 23 because of a medical condition.

There have also been cases of baby boys having their penis cut off or mutilated during circumcision. People have numerous body parts whacked for "medical" conditions but cutting for the sake of prevention is a questionable practice.

And I agree. If you have poor hygiene below the belt, I assume the rest of your body isn't any better. I would guess that the percentage of males that have poor habits in this regard are pretty much equal whether or not you've been "shorn".

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