QIguy24
Topic Author
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Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Thu Apr 15, 2004 3:14 pm

Ha anyone heard more about this? That's sounds really amazing!!
Al Jazeera has got a tape from OBL where he is willing to offer peace to the european countries but not the US.

Wow! That is very kind of him I must say. That OBL is a really great guy  Yeah sure
 
L-188
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Thu Apr 15, 2004 3:40 pm

Well considering the former Irish PM suggested that the US should open "negotiations" with Binnie, I think he thinks that he has an opening.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
artsyman
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Thu Apr 15, 2004 3:53 pm

He is just tryng to further divide the US from the rest of the world. Sadly, some may take him up on it...., wouldn't fancy taking OBL's word for anything..

J
 
LoneStarMike
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Thu Apr 15, 2004 3:56 pm

Reuters briefly mentions it here

LoneStarMike

 
saintsman
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Thu Apr 15, 2004 4:03 pm

Running scared?




.
 
Sabena 690
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Thu Apr 15, 2004 4:05 pm

This is utter bullsh*t, since OBL has NOTHING to say anymore.

We are facing a much bigger danger now: small terroristic groups working on their own, under the 'label' Al Qaeda.

Since the war in Afghanistan, there is no central Al Qaeda-organisation anymore. Al Qaeda is dead.

This has resulted in a lot of small 'sleeping' terror groups, spread all over the world, who are working on their own instead of in charge of a big Al Qaeda organisation with OBL as the leader.

A recent report revealed that about 18000 (!!) of those inactif terrorists are currently spread over the world.

The sad thing is: there's nothing you can do about it. Catching OBL doesn't make any sense anymore (only for moral reasons). You have an enemy, but you don't know who it is and when they will become actif.

Watch out for more terror attacks soon. Of course much smaller terror attacks (the chance of getting a second 9/11 is extremely small).

This is also a reason why a lot of paranoia in the US is strongly exaggerated, and one of the reasons why the invasion in Iraq has nothing done to terrorism, except stimulating it.

Europe is as (un)safe as the US, and as the rest of the world. Something we will have to life with. I'm glad I can say that this does not influence my life, while some other people (especially in the US) have the feeling that terrorists are behind all corners.

Frederic
 
tbar220
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Thu Apr 15, 2004 5:14 pm

I'm sorry, but didn't a group connected to Al Qaeda attack Madrid?
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Silver1SWA
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Thu Apr 15, 2004 5:30 pm

"Catching OBL doesn't make any sense anymore (only for moral reasons). You have an enemy, but you don't know who it is and when they will become actif."

A huge benefit of taking out Osama is you cut off a lot of the funding for these terrorists. Without a central, WEALTHY command, these small "independent" cells lack the kind of funding it will take to organize a large scale attack equaling, or exceeding that of 9/11 IMO.
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
CPH-R
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Thu Apr 15, 2004 5:39 pm

Without a central, WEALTHY command, these small "independent" cells lack the kind of funding it will take to organize a large scale attack equaling, or exceeding that of 9/11 IMO.

So, you're suggesting going after the House of Saud? Aka. the Saudi Royal Family, because they've been funding Al Qaeda & OBL for quite a long time. But of course, that's not going to happen as long as Bush is in the White House.

Not to mention that women in Saudi Arabia have very few rights, which also seems to be of great concern for Bush (hello Aghanistan & Iraq). I'll venture to say that they have fewer rights than the Viking Women had more than a 1000 years ago  Wink/being sarcastic
 
Krushny
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Thu Apr 15, 2004 6:08 pm

Nothing from the OBL crowd is credible. After the Madrid attack, they declared a truce in Europe , two weeks later they removed it, now they propose another... BS. I would suggest Osama to follow the same course as his guys in Leganés and blows himself chanting to Allah...

Without a central, WEALTHY command, these small "independent" cells lack the kind of funding it will take to organize a large scale attack equaling, or exceeding that of 9/11 IMO.

The funny things is that the Spanish cell did not need external funding... the financed themselves by petty crimes : drugs, credit card fraud or mobile phones forging. Catching OBL is necessary because he is a symbol and provides "moral fuel" to his followers, but I am not sure about the financial side .

 
MD11Engineer
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Thu Apr 15, 2004 6:36 pm

Fertilizer and diesel are not very expensive and you can cause a lot of damage wih them. But a truce with OBL would be the most stupid thing ever.

Jan
Je Suis Charlie et je suis Ahmet aussi
 
Sabena 690
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Thu Apr 15, 2004 7:49 pm

I'm sorry, but didn't a group connected to Al Qaeda attack Madrid?

No, as I said, smaller groups use the name 'Al Qaeda'. There is no 'Al Qaeda' anymore. Unfortunately the media generalizes all those separate groups with Al Qaeda.

They are Muslim extremists, small groups, get fundings from criminal practics/..., and like this, they can finance terror attacks like the ones in Istanbul/Casablanca/Madrid/...

A huge benefit of taking out Osama is you cut off a lot of the funding for these terrorists.

OBL is currently more busy with saving his own a$$. He has nothing to say anymore. He is currently hiding somewhere in the mountains.

Without a central, WEALTHY command, these small "independent" cells lack the kind of funding it will take to organize a large scale attack equaling, or exceeding that of 9/11 IMO.

That's very true... that's why I said that 'Europe is safe' is not true: we are, due to those small separate working groups, as unsafe as the US. Don't forget that, for an attack like 9/11, you need a HUGE central command with huge fundings. Before the war in Afghanistan, Al Qaeda had the power to make attacks like 9/11. Due to the war in Afghanistan, this central command has dissapeared. But certainly hasn't lead to more safety.

So, you're suggesting going after the House of Saud? Aka. the Saudi Royal Family, because they've been funding Al Qaeda & OBL for quite a long time. But of course, that's not going to happen as long as Bush is in the White House.

We know indeed that a large number of the Al Qaeda 9/11 terrorists came from Saudi Arabia. Of course, Bush could not declare the war to Saudi Arabia. And this is why I'm already saying for months and months that the war in Iraq was important for geopolitical reasons: when Bush manages to turn Iraq into a pro-Western democracy, he will be able to put more pressure on Saudi Arabia. This is, I think, an important reason for the war (of course justified to the public as being for the Iraqi people etc, plain hypocrisy). Bush does not care about the Iraqi people, neither about Saddam Hussein. Of course, when you want to create a pro-Western democracy, you have to work with an INTERNATIONAL coallition. The NATO had to be in charge of all what happened in Iraq. Unfortunately, Bush went the bilateral way (UK-US + some troops out of Italy/...), and he is getting the consequences now.

Frederic
 
CPH-R
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Thu Apr 15, 2004 8:06 pm

Unfortunately, Bush went the bilateral way (UK-US + some troops out of Italy/...), and he is getting the consequences now.

Hey, don't forget the Danes! We supplied some all-important snowplows  Laugh out loud
 
MD11Engineer
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Thu Apr 15, 2004 8:20 pm

If the Iraq campaign had succeeded (not the shambles it is in now!), it would have made the US independend of Saudi oil, giving them a big leverage against the house of Saud (clean up your house or we´ll bankrupt you by boycotting your oil!) and it would have set an example to other Arab and Muslim countries on how to unite Islam with human rights and democracy. But this would have cost more than Bush was willing to invest (no tax rises at home! Minimum of troops sent to Iraq).

I agree that rthe official Al Qaeda is finished,as far as centrally controled attacks are concerned, but OBL is still important as a symbol, the guy who gives the US and the West the finger, which is very important in the Arab machismo world (this is also how Saddam survived so long, he wasn´t strong, but he gave an appearance of strength and defiance). OBL will probably rather blow himself up to be regarded as a martyr than to be caught, and face the disgrace of being sent to court and maybe even be sent to a mental institution as a dangerous crazy.

The danger today comes from small, independent, fanatic groups, often already installed in western countries, who either claim that such "wordly" things as constitutions are of no interest, because they are only responsible to God, or disgrunteled second generation immigrants, who didn´t succeed here (for example I wonder about the need of status symbols by immigrants, in my company the Germans, British and Americans all drive old bangers of cars, while some of our immgrant colleagues, Greek, Turkish,Russian, get themselves into huge debts to buy a big, fat Merc or BMW, to whom do they want to show off?) and blame the nonbelieving mainstream world around them.

Jan
Je Suis Charlie et je suis Ahmet aussi
 
VCE
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Thu Apr 15, 2004 8:42 pm

Italy has immediately replied with our President Carlo Azeglio Ciampi, our Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi, our Foreign Minister Franco Frattini, the cheaf of the Opposition Francesco Rutelli. They've all spoken with one voice. Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi has said on behalf of all Italy that our country "will never discuss with terrorists, and we will never give in to the terrorists".

Yesterday it was also killed an Italian taken hostage by the Iraqi terrorists.
This was the last sentence said by Fabrizio Quattrocchi a few seconds before he was shoted by the terrorists in Iraq.

"Now i show how is able to die an Italian! Viva l'Italia!".

I don't want to say anything more in this tragic day, except to remind that in this moment all Italy is united beyind our Institutions and beyind our Government.
The Opposition has in fact expressed its full support to PM Berlusconi that has immediately said: "They have destroyed a life, they have not cracked our values and our efforts for peace".

Viva la Libertà!
 
N6376M
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Thu Apr 15, 2004 10:11 pm

I think people are missing the point. Al Qaeda was a loose organization of terrorist cell with somewhat of a centralized command and control function. It's not like they wore uniforms that designated them as members. OBL provided funding resources to them and allow them to coordinate their activities.

The absolute worst thing that could happen is for the US to capture OBL alive. Can anyone imagine the wave of terrorist attacks that would follow. Instead, I've always believed that the field commanders have instructions to either take him quitely and not let anyone know that we have him (though that would be very hard to do), keep him for a while, interrogate him then put a bullet through his head or alternatively to kill him on site and move on.

There is no way that the threat of terrorism will ever completely disappear. Look at the Israeli example. That country, above all others, probably has the best vigilance and procedures in place to defend itself against terrorist act, yet individual homicide bombers regularly commit acts of terrorism. If Israel, with its much more restrictive society and restrictions on civil liberties can't stop terrorism NOBODY WILL.

The best anyone can hope for is to disrupt the command, communication and control (c3) apperatus that allows these groups to conduct coordinated or large scale attacks. While clearly, the US is in a mess in Iraq, who would have guess on Sept 12, 2001 that there would not be further large scale terrorist attacks against the US in the following three years?

The best defense is a strong offense. We've put terrorist C3 on the run aroudn the world. Everything we can do to keep them on the run is a victory in our battle against them. But we need to be mentally prepared for the day that a small group conducts another act of terrorism on US soil because it will occur.

Likewise, European leaders need to be mindful that cutting a deal with the devil only reinforces their notion that terrorism can bring them victory. To accept short-term peace at the expense of allowing these groups to re-establish their centralize C3 functionality is short-sighted and will create much bigger problems for everyone in the long-run.
 
Andreas
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Thu Apr 15, 2004 10:24 pm

Likewise, European leaders need to be mindful that cutting a deal with the devil only reinforces their notion that terrorism can bring them victory.


I'm not quite sure what you are trying to say, but so far, no European leaders have even indicated, that they want to negotiate with criminal scum...at least the German and the British government have explicitly said they certainly won't!! EU commission said likewise!
I know it's only VfB but I like it!
 
VCE
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Thu Apr 15, 2004 10:38 pm

Right Andreas. The first two Governments in Europe that have explicity said they will never accept a deal with Al Qaida were today morning the Brit Gov't and the Italian Gov't.
I appreciate the fact that the German Government follows the same line. I'll wait now an answer from Chirac. Smile
 
777236ER
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Thu Apr 15, 2004 10:51 pm

Yesterday it was also killed an Italian taken hostage by the Iraqi terrorists.

Now I'm sorry, but how are Iraqi citizens with mass support in places like Fallujah terrorists? They may be the enemy, but they're not terrorists.
Your bone's got a little machine
 
Klaus
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Thu Apr 15, 2004 11:04 pm

The german government and the current EU presidency have rejected the "offer" as well. Big surprise.  Insane

Our government didn´t negotiate with "our own" terrorists in the 1970s and they most certainly won´t start making deals with criminals now.
 
go canada!
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Thu Apr 15, 2004 11:17 pm

First point to make is that it was NOT the irish prime minister who made those comments, rather the former Northern Irish Head Minister, a UK Labour Goverment Cabient Minister who was dimissed from her job several years ago.

However, onto the main focus, we cannot negogiate with terrorists no more so than to negogiate with nazis. A group built on terror will not end itself in peace talks, besides what can they offer? Al Queda and its linked groups are not a state, they have no democratic legitmacy, rather a collection of criminals and fanatics.

To a left winger though this is all about iraq, the arguement is that if we hadnt attacked iraq none of this would happen. Bin Laden has picked up on this and has frankly managed to link iraq and terrorism better together than bush did in the run up to war. Spain has been stupid enough to think it wouldnt get terror attacked again if it pulled out troops from iraq only to find a massive 2nd bomb on a railway line and comments from Al Queda and from Spainish security services that the attacks were planned since 2002.

Thankfully though the goverments of europe seem to have realised that irrespective of their differing views on Iraq, terrorism has to be defeated.France,Germany and many other anti war countries are still on Al Quedas hit list simply because they represent a western ideal of life, based on judeo-christain morality which is wholly unacceptable to a mad very small bunch of muslims who have been brainwashed into think Allah wants them to blow people up.

FYI Klaus, while your points make sense, Germany didnt exactly come out of the munich hostage crisis smelling of roses, especially after the goverment used a lufthansa flight which was 'accidentally' hijacked to exchange terrorists for civilians.
It is amazing what can be accomplised when nobody takes the credit
 
solarix
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Thu Apr 15, 2004 11:34 pm

Bin Laden knows he is in trouble if he has to create a "truce" with Europe. I think he realized they are quite pissed off especially after what happened in Madrid. The unfortunately thing is that it seems whenever a tape or transcript comes out from Al-Qaeda, there is an attack a short time later. I guess only time will tell us what happens next.

This was said by OBL in an audio tape from early 2004:

"It is enough to know that the economy of all Arab countries is weaker than the economy of one country that had once been part of our [Islamic] world when we used to truly adhere to Islam. That country is the lost Andalusia. Spain is an infidel country, but its economy is stronger than our economy because the ruler there is accountable. In our countries, there is no accountability or punishment but there is only obedience to the rulers and prayers of long life for them."

It was just a few months between this text and the Madrid bombings, but it does show you that in OBL's eyes, Spain is an infidel along with the rest of us.

May Bin Laden rot in hell!
Bong Hits 4 Jesus
 
Scotty
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Thu Apr 15, 2004 11:42 pm

Oh Fecksake take the deal - these guys arent worth bothering about.

Get out of Iraq and let them get on with it their way.

 Big thumbs up
 
MD11Engineer
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Fri Apr 16, 2004 12:12 am

GoCanada,

Big surprise! Bertie Ahern, the PM of Ireland is member of the same party, Fianna Fail, to which the 1930s-1940 PM Eamon de Valera belonged. This guy used to have IRA terrorists hanged whenever he could get a hand on them.

Jan
Je Suis Charlie et je suis Ahmet aussi
 
go canada!
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Fri Apr 16, 2004 12:37 am

Right, Mo Mowlam who said those comments that L-188 refers to is a member of the UK labour party, she is not an irish polictian.

Im not sure what your point about Ahren and de Valera is.
De Valera was a member of the Ira and Sinn Fein and then sought to destroy it after falling out with Michael Collins.
Bertie Ahen is anti terrorist as has been every irish goverment since independence, thats nothing with al queda and Im not sure what this has got to do with Mo Mowlam, a British Mp saying we need to talk to Bin Laden.

No Irish leader has said we need to talk to bin laden in my recollection, if they have please show me where.

Frankly it seems as if a few people are confused.
Northern Ireland is part of the UK, it is not Irish.
Ireland is Irish, Northern Ireland is british.
They are two different countries.
A British MP from the party of the British Goverment,though not a goverment member said we should talk to bin laden.
She used to be the British goverment minister in charge for Northern Ireland.
She is not Northern Irish nor Southern Irish so I fail to see where Bertie Ahern, Eamon De Valera and the Irish republic come in.
It is amazing what can be accomplised when nobody takes the credit
 
Klaus
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Go Canada!

Fri Apr 16, 2004 1:20 am

Go Canada!: FYI Klaus, while your points make sense, Germany didnt exactly come out of the munich hostage crisis smelling of roses, especially after the goverment used a lufthansa flight which was 'accidentally' hijacked to exchange terrorists for civilians.

I think you´re confusing separate incidents.

The hostage-crisis during the 1972 olympics became a disaster when police tried unsuccessfully to free the hostages. No Lufthansa flight involved. The terrorists had demanded the release of palestinians from israeli prisons. Lessons were learned which led to the creation of new police units and improved training.

What you might have been thinking of could have been the hijacking of the Lufthansa 737 "Landshut" in 1977, when the new GSG9 unit successfully stormed the plane and liberated the hostages. This basically marked the final victory over the 1970s terrorism wave.

The Schmidt administration held its ground and refused to give in to terrorist pressure all through the crisis.

I have no idea what you´re talking about.
 
MD11Engineer
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Fri Apr 16, 2004 1:32 am

GoCanada,

I just found it laughable that somebody suggested that it was a former Irish PM suggesting to talk with Al Qaeda, it wasn´t you, but L-188!

Jan
Je Suis Charlie et je suis Ahmet aussi
 
NoUFO
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Fri Apr 16, 2004 5:06 am

VCE: I'll wait now an answer from Chirac.

The French government has already announced that this "offer" would not deserve any comment.
I support the right to arm bears
 
VCE
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Fri Apr 16, 2004 5:11 am

True NoUFO.. they arrived as the last anyway.
But they will not send any soldiers to help. A perfect system to stay with feet in both sides.. terrible! Sad
 
NoUFO
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Fri Apr 16, 2004 5:53 am

they arrived as the last anyway

Says who? And what kind of argument is that, anyway?

But they will not send any soldiers to help.

The first French soldiers had been transferred to Afghanistan on December 02, 2001. They contribute to both, the hunt on OBL and rebuilding Afghanistan.

Edit: The first French soldiers arrived on Dec 02, 2001.

[Edited 2004-04-15 23:03:00]
I support the right to arm bears
 
777236ER
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Fri Apr 16, 2004 5:56 am

True NoUFO.. they arrived as the last anyway.
But they will not send any soldiers to help. A perfect system to stay with feet in both sides.. terrible!


Given that French soldiers are in Afghanistan right now, and were since late November/early December 2001, and they're hunting down OBL as we speak, I think this post shows your prejudice a little.
Your bone's got a little machine
 
ConcordeBoy
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Fri Apr 16, 2004 5:56 am

Bush went the bilateral way (UK-US + some troops out of Italy/...)

Horseshit!  Yeah sure

61 countries supported Op. Iraqi Freedom, and over half of them actively engaged therein.
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
777236ER
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Fri Apr 16, 2004 6:00 am

61 countries supported Op. Iraqi Freedom, and over half of them actively engaged therein.

Care to name them? How many were in the security council? How many are relevant to international affairs right now?
Your bone's got a little machine
 
VCE
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Fri Apr 16, 2004 6:01 am

Dear UFO.. i of course meant that President Chirac is arrived in late respect the other Governments that have said NO to any deal with Al Qaida. Italy and the UK were actually the first. I can tell you even more: in Italy the Government and the Opposition have completely the same line. The cheaf of the Opposition Francesco Rutelli has expressed today his solidariety to Berlusconi and he has promised his total back to the Government in the war against terror. Berlusconi has today said that Italy will never deal with the terrorists.

Regarding the soldiers.. i meant that the French have again refused today the idea to send their troops in Iraq or under the UN or under NATO.
True, France has sent their troops in Afghanistan, but what about Italy and the UK? We also have our troops in Afghanistan! And not only there! But now it's arrived the moment that the western democracies will react with one voice against the terrorism!

Ciao.
 
777236ER
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Fri Apr 16, 2004 6:08 am

i of course meant that President Chirac is arrived in late respect the other Governments that have said NO to any deal with Al Qaida. Italy and the UK were actually the first.

Oh rah rah rah! Clearly that matters...

I can tell you even more: in Italy the Government and the Opposition have completely the same line. The cheaf of the Opposition Francesco Rutelli has expressed today his solidariety to Berlusconi and he has promised his total back to the Government in the war against terror

What an effective Opposition...

Regarding the soldiers.. i meant that the French have again refused today the idea to send their troops in Iraq or under the UN or under NATO.

Iraq? We're talking about Osama bin Laden. And are you sure? There's nothing about France saying that on the BBC or Google.

True, France has sent their troops in Afghanistan, but what about Italy and the UK? We also have our troops in Afghanistan!

So let's clear a few things up:

1. France has condemned dealing with terrorists
2. France has troops rebuilding Afghanistan, and looking for bin Laden
3. This discussion is about bin Laden - not Iraq.

Although if you want to talk about Iraq...http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/2004-04/15/content_1422263.htm
Your bone's got a little machine
 
VCE
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Fri Apr 16, 2004 6:13 am

What an effective Opposition...

In a democracy the foreign policy it's bipartisan my dear. Here it's so, with the exception of the Communists.

Regarding France, i don't find their position so strong and effective. Even Italy has its troops in Afghanistan looking for Bin Laden, we have also our troops in Kosovo, Ethiopia-Eritrea, Bosnia. But we took also the risk to take part with our troops in Iraq. In the name of freedom!
 
777236ER
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Fri Apr 16, 2004 6:52 am

In a democracy the foreign policy it's bipartisan my dear

How do you work that out? Foreign policy is the foreign policy of the government, not of the oposition.

But we took also the risk to take part with our troops in Iraq. In the name of freedom!

Really? Everyone else offered troops to stop Saddam using his WMDs.
Your bone's got a little machine
 
VCE
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Fri Apr 16, 2004 6:54 am

777236ER, in a big democracy the foreign policy doesn't change when it changes the 'colour' of the Government. This is in Italy, this is in the UK.
 
777236ER
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Fri Apr 16, 2004 6:56 am

777236ER, in a big democracy the foreign policy doesn't change when it changes the 'colour' of the Government.

What are you talking about? Foreign policy is dictated by government, government is dictated by the people.
Your bone's got a little machine
 
TYSGoVols
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Fri Apr 16, 2004 6:58 am

First of all to say that any country has no relevance in the world is a bit arogant. Secondly who really gives a crap about teh security council, which some of those countries have been shown to have under teh table dealings with a terrorizing regime that has now been destroyed. Back to the topic though Laden can in the words of Aaron Tipon "Kiss this" ( | ). I don't think that the rest of the world would negotiate with this guy. Especially after seeing what he is capable of.

<>< Garen
Rocky Top You'll Always be home sweet home to me, Good ole' Rocky Top WOOOOO
 
VCE
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Fri Apr 16, 2004 6:59 am

777236ER, this is something really difficult for you to understand it seams..
Do you think that the Tories would have taken a different position than Blair in the war against terrorism? I don't think so. In a big democracy the national interest is the same if you vote for the Conservatives or the Socialists. There are some reasons to say that in many situations the interests of a Nation comes firsly than the political insterests of this party or the other.
 
artsyman
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Fri Apr 16, 2004 7:00 am

I think Bin Laden wrongly thought that anti-American sentiment = pro arab sentiment, and has now found out otherwise.

Look for some huge attacks over Europe to come now.

J
 
777236ER
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Fri Apr 16, 2004 7:01 am

First of all to say that any country has no relevance in the world is a bit arogant

Maybe, but it's true.

Secondly who really gives a crap about teh security council, which some of those countries have been shown to have under teh table dealings with a terrorizing regime that has now been destroyed.

Which ones?

Any sources, evidence, proof?

I'm still waiting for the list of countires in the 'bi-lateral' war?
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TYSGoVols
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Fri Apr 16, 2004 7:05 am

If I am not mistaken wasn't there a report here not to long ago that showed teh French and Russian or was it the French and German governments had higher up officials recieving funds from Iraq under rather shady circumstances. Oh and just a brief list of countries for you.

U.S.A.
U.K.
Spain
Italy
Japan
I believe Austrailia not sure though

Yep some pretty unimportant countries, yep.  Smile/happy/getting dizzy

<>< Garen
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VCE
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Fri Apr 16, 2004 7:05 am

After so many stupid messages i simply say:
God Bless Italy and God Bless the United States of America! God Bless Freedom!
We will never give in to the terrorists!

I simply remind what Fabrizio Quottrocchi, the Italian killed yesterday by the terrorsists, has shouted before to be shoted: "now i'll show you how an Italian dies, Viva l'Italia!". We will never forget those heros!
 
777236ER
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Fri Apr 16, 2004 7:06 am

777236ER, this is something really difficult for you to understand it seams..
Do you think that the Tories would have taken a different position than Blair in the war against terrorism? I don't think so. In a big democracy the national interest is the same if you vote for the Conservatives or the Socialists. There are some reasons to say that in many situations the interests of a Nation comes firsly than the political insterests of this party or the other.

You're wrong. Once again: GOVERNMENTS DICTATE FOREIGN POLICY. The Tories have very different ideas of foreign policy, and the UK's forgein policy would change.

If the Democrats were in power in the US, the Iraq war would probably not have happened. Proof that you're wrong.
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777236ER
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Joined: Sat Aug 18, 2001 7:10 am

RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Fri Apr 16, 2004 7:10 am

U.S.A.
U.K.
Spain
Italy
Japan
I believe Austrailia not sure though

Yep some pretty unimportant countries, yep.


You missed of countries like Afghanistan and Vanuatu.

Given that China, India, France, Germany, Canada, Pakistan etc aren't on the list speaks volumes.

This was NOT the uni-lateral war like the first one.
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TYSGoVols
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Fri Apr 16, 2004 7:19 am

To say that just because countries like China, France, Germany and Russia this was not unilateral is crap. A larger percentage of countries came together to support this effort. To me it shows the cowardice of the other countries that did not support this war. I am going to get flamed for that but, that is how I feel. If your government wants to sit around and wait for this guy who has dismissed UN resolution after UN resolution to finally say screw it and launch and attack on someone most likely one of his neighbors or a European country fine but, don't expect the rest of us to take the same walk in the flowers as you. It was a very justified war and, the outcome is a safer planet, how can one argue against that. Although I am sure someone is going to try to.

<>< Garen
Rocky Top You'll Always be home sweet home to me, Good ole' Rocky Top WOOOOO
 
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RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Fri Apr 16, 2004 7:21 am

TYSGoVols, i TOTALLY agree with You!

God Bless Italy, God Bless America, God Bless Freedom!
 
777236ER
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Joined: Sat Aug 18, 2001 7:10 am

RE: Osama Bin Laden Offers Peace To Europe!

Fri Apr 16, 2004 7:29 am

A larger percentage of countries came together to support this effort.

Really? Source please?

And this is now a war by NUMBERS? Instead of getting sound, international support for a war based on facts and real ideological ideas, should wars be started by counting raised hands?

To me it shows the cowardice of the other countries that did not support this war.

So NOW you're saying that countries who don't follow the majority of countries are cowards?! Surely simply supporting the war - screw the reasons - because everyone else is, is more cowardly?

If your government wants to sit around and wait for this guy who has dismissed UN resolution after UN resolution

You mean Israel?

someone most likely one of his neighbors or a European country fine but, don't expect the rest of us to take the same walk in the flowers as you.

Saddam was NOT A THREAT, to Europe or anyone else.

He had NO WMDs. None.

It was a very justified war and, the outcome is a safer planet, how can one argue against that

A safer planet! How do you work that out? This war has not stopped Islamic terrorism AT ALL, and has in fact seemed to INCREASE it! Saddam had NO WMDs so it was not a DIRECT threat the war stopped.

Could you please explain, in the most simplistic terms because I simply don't understand this, why the world is safer now?

TYSGoVols, i TOTALLY agree with You!

Yet you don't answer my points.

God Bless Italy, God Bless America, God Bless Freedom!

You talk about freedom, but then you say opposing parties should NOT have opposing policies?!
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