7e72004
Posts: 3440
Joined: Thu Apr 01, 2004 12:15 am

Travel To Europe

Thu Apr 22, 2004 10:08 pm

I am hoping to fly to Europe sometime this year, i would like to see Paris and London but was wondering how the security is in terms of overseas passengers. Is it more stringent than domestic travel? Plus, how "safe" is it in France?? I know that the US is not liked a whole lot by the french right now  Smile
The next generation of aircraft is just around the corner!
 
Guest

RE: Travel To Europe

Thu Apr 22, 2004 10:12 pm

Plus, how "safe" is it in France??

Probably safer than in America
 
TriStar500
Posts: 4411
Joined: Thu Nov 04, 1999 9:50 pm

RE: Travel To Europe

Thu Apr 22, 2004 10:22 pm

Unlike what the media tells you, people in Europe tend to be able to differentiate between you as an "American" and the actions of your government.

I had two friends from Michigan visiting me some weeks ago, and they didn't run into any problems in London, Paris and Germany. They were treated just as friendly as during their previous visits.  Smile

BTW - I think this could be more suited for the non-av forum, because your question is travel-related and not so much about aviation.
Homer: Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true!
 
asuflyer05
Posts: 2054
Joined: Wed Feb 25, 2004 8:53 am

RE: Travel To Europe

Thu Apr 22, 2004 10:22 pm

I've been to Paris and London. I felt safe in both cities although Paris seemed to have a higer pickpocketing problem than other places I have been to. Just keep your passport and cash in one of those pouchs under your shirt and you'll be fine. As far as anti-American sentiment, there's probably more of it in the US than Paris or London. Most people in Europe have other things to worry about than whether or not they like Americans. Many do not agree with OIF, but they are definetly not hostile towards us.

Other than that, Paris and London are two beautiful cities. I guarantee you will like them both.
 
bobnwa
Posts: 4463
Joined: Fri Dec 22, 2000 12:10 am

RE: Travel To Europe

Thu Apr 22, 2004 10:22 pm

Have you heard about a single American who has been picked on by the French. I haven't.

You stand a better chance of being accosted in Indianapolis than in Paris. This is true for all crimes except pickpockets. They rob everyone including Americans.
 
sw733
Posts: 5302
Joined: Wed Feb 25, 2004 6:19 am

RE: Travel To Europe

Thu Apr 22, 2004 10:31 pm

I was just in France a few months ago and it's perfectly safe. It's the ignorant Americans who have a problem with France, not the French who have a problem with the Americans. As far as pickpocketing and crime, it does seem higher then, say, London, Madrid, Brussels, Frankfurt...but nowhere near Rome! You'll be fine, just stay safe and dont do anything stupid that you wouldnt do at home (ie - fly your American flag in the Paris Metro at 3am!  Wink/being sarcastic ) Security is a little tighter on the flights, but all in all it isn't that big of a difference. Show up a little earlier then you would for a domestic flight (2 - 2.5 hours), but other then that, it's about the same. ENJOY!
 
User avatar
Starlionblue
Posts: 17085
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2004 9:54 pm

RE: Travel To Europe

Thu Apr 22, 2004 10:41 pm

If you want to blend in, dress like a local. For Americans this means, for example, no shorts. Wear linen trousers instead. You'd be amazed at how much better you're welcomed.

I feel about as safe in London and Paris as I do in LA or San Francisco. Normal caution rules apply of course.

As for airports, security varies, but is generally on the same level as in the US.


My friend got pickpocketed in Rome. A 20 year old girl flashed him. He was of course pretty surpised, especially when he discovered that her friend had taken his wallet...

I once saw an Englishman at the Spanish Steps. He stepped out of a taxi and looked around. The taxi left, with his luggage. The naivete of some people...

[Edited 2004-04-22 15:43:29]
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
Guest

RE: Travel To Europe

Thu Apr 22, 2004 11:02 pm

Bobnwa is right, actually the places you might visit in Paris (Champs-Elysées, Eiffel tower, etc.) are as tightly guarded by the police as Fort Knox. I think however, that there are some pickpocket problems in the metro in the rush hour but it's marginal.

As far as sympathy is concerned, you won't run into any trouble in my opinion, as long as you don't discuss politics or meals with them French. Even if you agree with them you will end up arguing for hours and hours!
 
User avatar
Starlionblue
Posts: 17085
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2004 9:54 pm

RE: Travel To Europe

Thu Apr 22, 2004 11:05 pm

Never discuss politics or religion. It's not rocket science.

They don't dislike Americans, many of them just dislike GWB. But as PU151 says, even if you agree with them, just shut up about it.
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
Bofredrik
Posts: 1133
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 1999 4:17 pm

RE: Travel To Europe

Thu Apr 22, 2004 11:06 pm

Arab/muslim immigrants have it 10 times worse than you ever can have so welcome and forget about this non-existing problem.

Rent the movie: European Vacation (1985) with Chevy Chase.
 
GSPSPOT
Posts: 2192
Joined: Thu Sep 11, 2003 1:44 am

RE: Travel To Europe

Thu Apr 22, 2004 11:07 pm

Can't speak to France, but I was in Munich during Christmas and felt very well taken care of there. There was a great little Tex-Mex (locally owned/operated, not a chain) place where our waitress just LOVED us. On our way out the door, she shouted "No, no, don't leave yet... I have something for you" She gave us a couple of after-dinner cordials on the house. How nice is that?
Finally made it to an airline mecca!
 
User avatar
Starlionblue
Posts: 17085
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2004 9:54 pm

RE: Travel To Europe

Thu Apr 22, 2004 11:12 pm

GSPSPOT, I'm not even gonna go there about an American eating Tex-Mex in Germany  Big grin No offence intended but it cracks me up.

If any of you need restaurant tips in Northen Italy, Frankfurt, Paris, Stockholm or especially London, pop me an email.
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
doug_or
Posts: 3122
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2000 9:55 am

France

Thu Apr 22, 2004 11:13 pm

went to barcelona and paris a month ago. ditto what sw733 and starlion said. Trying a little to blend in goes a long way, just do your basic research first so you don't compeltely blunder around. Almost everyone in Paris seems to speak english. If you start speaking french with a thick american accent they'll immidiantly switch over to english. (rather than have you further butcher than language?).

Except for the guys trolling around with sub machien guns, I thought security was at least unintrusive (I don't want to say lax because i don't know what goes on behind the scenes). There was no problem at all entering either country. At least for flights from the US to CDG, the customs area appeared to have been converted into a sandwich shop. There is only a sighn adiving you to throw away any contraband items. I hadn't filled out my entry form completely becasue i had a question, but the passport offical just stamped it before i could ask and waived me on.
When in doubt, one B pump off
 
User avatar
Starlionblue
Posts: 17085
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2004 9:54 pm

RE: Travel To Europe

Thu Apr 22, 2004 11:32 pm

The "Lonely Planet" books are an excellent reference, as is their website (http://www.lonelyplanet.com/). Well worth the price. Every one includes extensive practical tips that are worth reading. My wife and I always buy the book before going to a new place. Just reading about the history and people of a country makes the place come alive in a completely different way.

As Doug_Or says, doing some research before you go will make your trip much more memorable. I have met so many people (US and other) who are dissatisfied with their trips for absurd reasons, when just a little preparation would have made it the vacation of a lifetime.

Even knowing one or two words in the foreign language (the books all have phrases at the end) and butchering them will endear you to most locals, since you are clearly making an effort.
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
ultrapig
Posts: 568
Joined: Fri Dec 12, 2003 11:38 pm

RE: Travel To Europe

Thu Apr 22, 2004 11:42 pm

As to the French I tried to order "Soup d'jour" last time I was in France and they pretended not to know what I was talking about. Boy have they corrupted English!
 
User avatar
Starlionblue
Posts: 17085
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2004 9:54 pm

RE: Travel To Europe

Thu Apr 22, 2004 11:48 pm

Lol, Ultrapig!

The problem a lot of Americans face when they go to Europe is how the US has corrupted many European words and expressions. Examples:
- Swedish Massage - I am born and raised in Stockholm, and I had never heard of this until I was in the US.
- Maitre d' - It's just Maitre in Europe.
- Entrée - In the US it's a main course, while in France it's an entrée, which means entrance, and thus comes before the main course.
- Tuxedo - In the US this is tails (white tie) or a smoking jacket (black tie). In Europe, the smoking jacket is (strictly speaking) not formalwear, as opposed to white tie which is.

Of course, it's just as bad for Europeans when we go over there. This whole business of cutting the food up, then putting your knife down and eating with your fork in your right hand is just plain weird to most Europeans, even to the point of being impolite. When I was a kid, I was taught NEVER to eat anything but pasta and rice with the fork in my right.


Having said all that, I LOVE cultural differences. The world is a better place for them.

EDIT: surgically excised offending additional word.


[Edited 2004-04-22 17:10:39]
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
a380900
Posts: 799
Joined: Fri Dec 05, 2003 11:26 pm

RE: Travel To Europe

Thu Apr 22, 2004 11:51 pm

My two cents is that Americans should stay at home and think their foreign policies through before going anywhere. It's one thing to say the F word to the world but travelling around and expect to be congratulated is wishful thinking.
 
User avatar
Starlionblue
Posts: 17085
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2004 9:54 pm

RE: Travel To Europe

Thu Apr 22, 2004 11:54 pm

A380900, I have asked for your post to be deleted.
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
BAViscount
Posts: 1975
Joined: Tue Mar 16, 2004 8:01 am

RE: Travel To Europe

Thu Apr 22, 2004 11:56 pm

Starlionblue, you forgot to include English Muffins in your list - what's one of them when it's at home (as we say in London)?!!
Ladies & gentlemen this is Captain Tobias Wilcock welcoming you aboard Coconut Airways flight 372 to Bridgetown Barb
 
User avatar
Starlionblue
Posts: 17085
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2004 9:54 pm

RE: Travel To Europe

Thu Apr 22, 2004 11:57 pm

BAViscount, LOL!!! And what about "fanny pack"!
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
ultrapig
Posts: 568
Joined: Fri Dec 12, 2003 11:38 pm

RE: Travel To Europe

Thu Apr 22, 2004 11:58 pm

Starlionblue-and how about the "mythical "Swedish bikini Team"-I've personally never had any trouble in France-I speak College French and outside of a pickpocket near the Moulin Rouge never a problem!

Thanks for your Comment A380900-Next time I see my Dad I'll give him your advice-He had a long trip to France from June 6, 1944 until October 1945 with a detour through Belgium and Germany-

By the way Sprechen sie Deutsch-? Nein? You're welcome
 
User avatar
Starlionblue
Posts: 17085
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2004 9:54 pm

RE: Travel To Europe

Fri Apr 23, 2004 12:02 am

The Swedish Bikini team was the invention of a US beer company IIRC, but I must say that few countries have such good looking girls (on average) as Sweden. And they're so easy going and non-calculating (WYSIWYG) too!
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
ultrapig
Posts: 568
Joined: Fri Dec 12, 2003 11:38 pm

RE: Travel To Europe

Fri Apr 23, 2004 12:03 am

Stationblue-i think his post should stay-it is a valid but stupid opinion-Free speech.
 
User avatar
Starlionblue
Posts: 17085
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2004 9:54 pm

RE: Travel To Europe

Fri Apr 23, 2004 12:05 am

Very mature of you, Ultrapig. There should be more like you on A.nut.
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
GSPSPOT
Posts: 2192
Joined: Thu Sep 11, 2003 1:44 am

RE: Travel To Europe

Fri Apr 23, 2004 12:08 am

A380900,

Why would you say something so mean-spirited? We're all trying to have some fun here....
Finally made it to an airline mecca!
 
ultrapig
Posts: 568
Joined: Fri Dec 12, 2003 11:38 pm

RE: Travel To Europe

Fri Apr 23, 2004 12:15 am

A380900-

If you don't like Americans why, as your profile suggests, are you living in New York? Seriously what's the answer
 
a380900
Posts: 799
Joined: Fri Dec 05, 2003 11:26 pm

RE: Travel To Europe

Fri Apr 23, 2004 12:19 am

I say things mean spirited. The US army DOES things mean spirited (stuff like killing civilians, you know). I think I'm on the moral high ground. And if you want to have fun, avoid Iraq. You senseless people should come to realize what's going on in the world.
 
User avatar
Starlionblue
Posts: 17085
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2004 9:54 pm

RE: Travel To Europe

Fri Apr 23, 2004 12:21 am

A380900, shall we start mentioning French atrocities in Indochina? Because the Americans can't hold a candle to those.


Seriously, most Americans are really nice people, and many disagree with GWB. But even if they do agree, this does not make them demons. My wife's uncle is a huge GWB fan, but he's still a nice guy. We just agree to disagree.


Stop believing all you read in the press and apply that thing between your ears.
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
ultrapig
Posts: 568
Joined: Fri Dec 12, 2003 11:38 pm

RE: Travel To Europe

Fri Apr 23, 2004 12:25 am

A380900

What is going on in the world? Tell me-From reading about things in France I can see that there is no sorrow and no pity while your government turns a blind eye to the destruction of Jewish Schools and synagoggues. From where I sit something is very "Vichy" in France!

 
GSPSPOT
Posts: 2192
Joined: Thu Sep 11, 2003 1:44 am

RE: Travel To Europe

Fri Apr 23, 2004 12:30 am

Why would anyone use an Aviation forum to blow off about political opinions???
Finally made it to an airline mecca!
 
GLA MD11
Posts: 264
Joined: Mon Mar 27, 2000 12:16 pm

RE: Travel To Europe

Fri Apr 23, 2004 12:31 am

I am a French man living in Indiana and all this love-hate relationship between Americans and French is a joke. I am very well treated here and Americans are as always welcome in my city, Paris.
Have a lot of fun while travelling in Europe.
 
a380900
Posts: 799
Joined: Fri Dec 05, 2003 11:26 pm

RE: Travel To Europe

Fri Apr 23, 2004 12:32 am

Yes ultrapig, you're right. Whenever there is racial violence in France, the gvt turns a blind eye on it. You are sadly brainwashed, like so many of your compatriots. Very sad and scary.
 
GLA MD11
Posts: 264
Joined: Mon Mar 27, 2000 12:16 pm

RE: Travel To Europe

Fri Apr 23, 2004 12:32 am

I just want to mention that some of my posts have been deleted for less than that!!!
A380900, you are giving a poor image of yourself and of our country... It's sad
 
ultrapig
Posts: 568
Joined: Fri Dec 12, 2003 11:38 pm

RE: Travel To Europe

Fri Apr 23, 2004 12:34 am

GLAMD11-

As I said i have always been treated well in France-A380900 is just being a "en francais?" " a**hole"
 
GLA MD11
Posts: 264
Joined: Mon Mar 27, 2000 12:16 pm

RE: Travel To Europe

Fri Apr 23, 2004 12:37 am

Thanks for your support. As well as some Americans are blind, some Frenchpeople are. That's the way it is everywhere... I am glad I can counterbalance that a little  Big grin
 
User avatar
Starlionblue
Posts: 17085
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2004 9:54 pm

RE: Travel To Europe

Fri Apr 23, 2004 12:46 am

Let's get back to travel in Europe. London tip: Watch out for traffic. Cars don't stop. They rarely even look at pedestrians. Be afraid. Be very afraid.

Trains in Europe are a great way to travel, and if you're an aviation nut the TGV, ICE or X2000 is a fun experience.


EDIT: Nuked spelling mistake.

[Edited 2004-04-22 17:51:01]
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
GLA MD11
Posts: 264
Joined: Mon Mar 27, 2000 12:16 pm

RE: Travel To Europe

Fri Apr 23, 2004 12:49 am

Especially since cars in the UK drive on the other side of the road. I went to Ireland once and it was terrible. One thing not said enough: also be very careful when you come home and check the right side of the road before crossing...
 
asuflyer05
Posts: 2054
Joined: Wed Feb 25, 2004 8:53 am

RE: Travel To Europe

Fri Apr 23, 2004 12:52 am

Let's get back to travel i Europe. London tip: Watch out for traffic. Cars don't stop. They rarely even look at pedestrians. Be afraid. Be very afraid.

HAHAHAHA! Yeah when you stumble out of the pub, remember to look to the right. My friend made that mistake. It wasn't a car that almost hit him though, it was a double-decker bus. Let's just say he was glad I was standing behind him and in a little better shape than he was.

 
phxairfan
Posts: 781
Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2001 6:22 am

RE: Travel To Europe

Fri Apr 23, 2004 12:57 am

Traveling in Europe is not a problem at all. The people of Europe in general are a lot friendlier, more accommodating, and pleasant than most Americans. It's been 2 years since I was there, but I imagine not much has changed. The idea that Europeans don't like Americans because of the policies of our government is ridiculous. Sometimes you have your bad apples aka A380900, but for the most part you shouldn't have any problems. One thing I'd advise you to add to your trip if you can, is a cruise of the Grecian Islands. One of the best experiences of my life. We stopped in Kusadasi, Turkey, and the people there loved Americans. They told me so numerous times.  Smile/happy/getting dizzy 7E72004, Enjoy your trip.
 
User avatar
sebolino
Posts: 3495
Joined: Tue May 29, 2001 11:26 pm

RE: Travel To Europe

Fri Apr 23, 2004 1:02 am

As to the French I tried to order "Soup d'jour" last time I was in France and they pretended not to know what I was talking about.

You mean "soupe du jour" ? Well, you can find a restaurant with such a daily soup, but remember to say each word distinctly.  Big grin

What is going on in the world? Tell me-From reading about things in France I can see that there is no sorrow and no pity while your government turns a blind eye to the destruction of Jewish Schools and synagoggues. From where I sit something is very "Vichy" in France!

???
What are you talking about ?
I wonder if you watch the right TV news programs ...

 
ultrapig
Posts: 568
Joined: Fri Dec 12, 2003 11:38 pm

RE: Travel To Europe

Fri Apr 23, 2004 1:18 am

M. Sebolino:

I was trying to be funny-but some times humor so doesn't translate well-For some reason I understand the French thought Jerry Lewis was very funny-but I never understood his humor-

On the second issue "The Sorrow and the Pity" was a movie o about the French collaboration with the Nazi occupiers. > When I said something was "Vichy' It was a play on words because "Vichy" rhymes with "Fishy" In American/English "Fishy" means-"Not right-Not Kosher" or something to that effect.

There have been stories in the Wall Street Journal about attacks on Jews recently and one of your ministers stated that he thought Jews should resolve the matter by not wearing skullcap. That is what I was referring to.

Thank you for our help on my pronunciation. I also do my best when I am in France-its very difficult for me but I do understand that slight differences in sound can mean a big difference- "La Mer Mediteranne" and not "La Merd".

Merci
 
FFlyer
Posts: 552
Joined: Sat Nov 24, 2001 6:46 am

RE: Travel To Europe

Fri Apr 23, 2004 1:35 am

He propably means the ban of religious symbols and all related things in France. Jewish symbols included.

This reminds me about another difference: Some Americans are used to show religious habits in speech (mention God, prayer, etc.), and excercise religion much more openly than Europeans. That is very often embarassing for Europeans to witness, even offensive. Well, at least for Scandinavians, who couldn't care less about any religions. And would not like you to mention anything about those issues. Maybe the Catholics are different...

But, never start any discussion about religion, and try to keep your beliefs inside.
 
VSlover
Posts: 1860
Joined: Sat Feb 07, 2004 1:36 am

RE: Travel To Europe

Fri Apr 23, 2004 2:31 am

my problem with london traffic is (aside from it going opposite from what i am used to obviously--but you learn) that on the street, it is painted in big letters, with an arrow "LOOK RIGHT-->" or "<--LOOK LEFT"

but anytime i read those, i question to myself which was is left, and which way is right--despite the arrows.  Confused

but i love london, i go every 5 weeks or so, and time permitting on to paris. love them both, never have had a negative experience in either.
 
aloges
Posts: 14842
Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2006 3:38 am

RE: Travel To Europe

Fri Apr 23, 2004 2:41 am

I think every traveller will be fine almost everywhere when he or she follows a few simple rules:

  • Be friendly. "Would you please?" works better than "Do it!" Always.

  • Remember that you are a guest - do not expect to be treated like a client by locals, safe for those people whose services you pay.

  • Do not think that "they" are in any way inferior to "you". If you do anyway, do not let it show.

  • Blend in a bit. Nobody expects you to behave like a perfect Italian when visiting Rome. But you should not enter any church wearing shorts and a muscle shirt.

  • Appreciate and learn from differences. They are why you went there.
  • Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.
     
    MD11Engineer
    Posts: 13916
    Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2003 5:25 am

    RE: Travel To Europe

    Fri Apr 23, 2004 2:42 am

    Most of us Europeans consider religion to be a private business, not to be advertised.
    Concerning traffic, if in Italy, remember traffic rule were made to be broken  Wink/being sarcastic

    If driving on a German Autobahn stay in the right lane if you don´t feel comfortable driving at 120 km/h and more.

    Jan
    Je Suis Charlie et je suis Ahmet aussi
     
    User avatar
    sebolino
    Posts: 3495
    Joined: Tue May 29, 2001 11:26 pm

    RE: Happy New Muslim Year 1425

    Fri Apr 23, 2004 4:07 am

    If driving on a German Autobahn stay in the right lane if you don´t feel comfortable driving at 120 km/h and more.

    You mean 180 km/h ??  Big grin
     
    MD11Engineer
    Posts: 13916
    Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2003 5:25 am

    RE: Travel To Europe

    Fri Apr 23, 2004 4:25 am

    Sebolino,

    The MINIMUM speed I´d recommend for leaving the right lane should be 120 km/h, better around 140 km/h. For the fast lane I´d recommend minimum 150km/h, or you´ll have the BMW´s and Porsches tailgating you.

    Jan
    Je Suis Charlie et je suis Ahmet aussi
     
    doug_or
    Posts: 3122
    Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2000 9:55 am

    RE: Travel To Europe

    Fri Apr 23, 2004 4:56 am

    For major cities I partiularly like the rick steves guides, and for europe in general I'd HIGHLY recomend at least reading his "europe through the backdoor" book before going. You should bew able to find it at any decent public library.

    GLA MD11- I'm glad the hoosiers are treating you alright, where in IN are you?
    When in doubt, one B pump off
     
    User avatar
    Starlionblue
    Posts: 17085
    Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2004 9:54 pm

    RE: Travel To Europe

    Fri Apr 23, 2004 6:13 pm

    Do not venture into the left lane if you don't have a German car and are doing at least 180  Big grin

    I find traffic in Italy much more relaxing than in England. In Italy you get things like courteous behavior. They will often let pedestrians cross even if they don't have to. In England it's just ME! ME! ME! Incidentally, the highest incidence of road rage and bad road behavior in Europe is in the UK.


    One thing I love to do is to take the subway during low traffic hours and just ride around for a couple of hours.. A great way to learn about the city, and many subways are beautiful and interesting in their own right.



    "There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo

    Who is online

    Users browsing this forum: speedygonzales, TheF15Ace, Thunderboltdrgn, zoanandreass and 9 guests