Flying-Tiger
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The Cost Of War In Iraq

Wed Jun 02, 2004 9:04 pm

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QIguy24
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Wed Jun 02, 2004 9:10 pm

This homepage is absolutly made by some liberal who has nothing else to do  Big grin

Signed

Bush Friends  Big grin
 
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JeffM
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Thu Jun 03, 2004 7:27 am

Personally I doubt any of the numbers on that page are credible.

I find the cost just as high as the rest of you, but I don't want the money spent on welfare, and unemployment checks either. I would prefer some of the money be left in our pockets in the form of less tax, and the rest in correcting many of the corrupted social programs that have been draining our economy for so long. Take your pick..

A flat tax could be designed to fill the coffers sufficiently to handle social programs and issues.
 
DC10GUY
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Thu Jun 03, 2004 8:32 am

Yeah right JeffM, Like all that money we piss away on military retirement .... What a waste.
Next time try the old "dirty Sanchez" She'll love it !!!
 
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JeffM
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Thu Jun 03, 2004 8:34 am

To you maybe, I kind of enjoy it.  Big grin
 
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EA CO AS
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Thu Jun 03, 2004 10:02 am

Like all that money we piss away on military retirement .... What a waste.

A waste? Hardly, when you consider it's one of the reasons our Armed Forces are comprised of volunteers who actually want to be there!

The phrase "you get what you pay for" comes to mind - I certainly don't want to see the U.S. Armed Forces be made up primarily of those who had no choice in the matter! You get better people when they want serve, and paying retirement benefits help entice many into military service.

I'd never begrudge any member of the military their pension, nor should any American.
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
Continental
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Thu Jun 03, 2004 10:09 am

Ah crap, not again! Jeff thinks EVERYTHING is wrong and not credible! What else!??!
 
WellHung
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Thu Jun 03, 2004 10:18 am

But the war will get Bush a lot more dough from the oil companies once he's voted out. Certainly that's much more noble than helping children.  Confused He ain't getting shit from Head Start.
 
L-188
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Thu Jun 03, 2004 10:36 am

I love it how people can put a price on the freedom of the Iraqi people and claim it isn't worth the expense.  Yeah sure
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Klaus
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L-188

Thu Jun 03, 2004 10:42 am

The victims of Abu Gureib figure among your "price"; How many people tortured to death is a botched liberation worth?
 
L-188
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Thu Jun 03, 2004 10:45 am

There is no proof any of those allegations are true Klaus.

More likely it is overreported BS by the Arab media.

If it is true, the people involved will get Kansas vacations.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
Klaus
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L-188

Thu Jun 03, 2004 10:53 am

L-188: There is no proof any of those allegations are true Klaus.

There are numerous cases of corpses of former prison inmates very obviously heavily beaten and grossly abused as evidenced by heavy bruises all over the bodies.

The US death certificate disingenously states "natural causes" as cause of death.

"Fortunately", the occupation authorities forbid any further post-mortem examination after a US military death certificate has been issued.

Why is that?


L-188: More likely it is overreported BS by the Arab media.

There are many photographs of the bodies, made by western journalists as well and shown on TV. Together with the US death certificates that are blatantly false.
 
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EA CO AS
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Thu Jun 03, 2004 10:59 am

How many people tortured to death is a botched liberation worth?

Botched liberation? I can't recall ANY liberation that occurred without bloodshed. Freedom isn't free, y'know.

There is no proof that U.S. forces tortured anyone to death - and if that DID occur, those directly responsible will be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.

But to answer your question, even if the number were just one less than the number of people who would otherwise have been tortured to death by Saddam's henchmen, then I'd argue it's probably worth it (meaning X deaths are worse than X deaths minus 1).

"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
Klaus
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EA CO AS

Thu Jun 03, 2004 11:10 am

EA CO AS: Botched liberation? I can't recall ANY liberation that occurred without bloodshed. Freedom isn't free, y'know.

Weak excuse for a long chain of blunders that have cost thousands their lives already, with no end in sight and terrorist recruiting skyrocketing.


EA CO AS: There is no proof that U.S. forces tortured anyone to death - and if that DID occur, those directly responsible will be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.

Would be nice; Experience doesn´t necessarily support that, though. There´s a strong tendency to sweep it under the rug; We can only hope that the will to get to the bottom of this comes through, this time.


EA CO AS: But to answer your question, even if the number were just one less than the number of people who would otherwise have been tortured to death by Saddam's henchmen, then I'd argue it's probably worth it (meaning X deaths are worse than X deaths minus 1).

According to that, repeating the Holocaust in the other direction would have been justified - as long as the allies would have stopped the furnaces in the death camps just one prisoner short of matching Hitler´s death toll?

Sorry, but with moral standards like that you can just pack up, go home and close the door in silent shame.  Sad
 
airplay
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Thu Jun 03, 2004 11:58 am

love it how people can put a price on the freedom of the Iraqi people and claim it isn't worth the expense.

Do you really contend that the average American gives a rat's ass about the freedom of the Iraqi people? Do you guys continue to pretend that GWB launced the invasion of Iraq to liberate the Iraqis?

Well...even if you are living in such a dream world, guess what? Iraqis aren't liberated, they're not better off in fact many are dead, the US has created untold new martyrs and enemies and the end is not anywhere in sight. Bush has drained the surplus, is eating into the rainy day money and will go into the hole soon.

The Iraq war money counter is a wake up call. It is a dramatic (some would say sensational) way to illustrate just how much this whole fiasco is costing. I'm just happy my government didn't get sucked in to that money pit...

Of course our economies are tied so closely together that some of the shyte is splattering us here in Canada. So believe it or not we are all concerned none the less.
 
Goose
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Thu Jun 03, 2004 12:00 pm

There is no proof any of those allegations are true Klaus.

More likely it is overreported BS by the Arab media.


The most interesting thing about all the media coverage about Abu Ghraib is that the outlets all showed mock "shock" about the pictures coming out, and these "previously covered up" abuses coming to light -- when in fact they (or anyone worth their salt) most likely knew about it for some time before.
"Talk to me, Goose..."
 
Klaus
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Goose

Thu Jun 03, 2004 12:08 pm

The US government has asked several media to hold back on the story to "protect US servicemen" and to "conduct their investigation". And for several weeks, the media apparently obliged. The original abuse reports by the red cross, for instance, reach back a full year, however. So the government sat around doing nothing about it for many months, apparently.
 
Alpha 1
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Thu Jun 03, 2004 12:12 pm

I love it how people can put a price on the freedom of the Iraqi people and claim it isn't worth the expense.

I love it how some gullible souls, like you, L-188, think that unending billions, and 800 American lives are worth the expense towards getting George W. Bush re-elected.

That's what this whole freaking idiocy was about-and nothing else. Congratulations on trading American soldiers for a White House. And you say you honor American servicemen and women. What a joke.
 
WellHung
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Thu Jun 03, 2004 12:16 pm

Wait, hold the phone!

This number is about to get even bigger.

http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/afp/20040602/pl_afp/us_iraq_budget_040602232240

The US Senate unanimously approved a 25 billion dollar emergency request to fund military operations in Iraq and Afghanistan.

President George W. Bush requested the extra funding to cover the cost of military operations, which have spiraled upward as US troops combat insurgencies in both countries.

 
DC10GUY
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Thu Jun 03, 2004 12:16 pm

No its about Iraq's oil.
Next time try the old "dirty Sanchez" She'll love it !!!
 
Continental
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Thu Jun 03, 2004 12:16 pm

Nicely said Alpha 1. I have to agree with Klaus here, even though we are intervening in Iraq to stop terrorism, it seems to be creating more terrorists. They are doing it as a result of the US being there. I could see many who lost their families because of the US turning into terrorists. And now having to fuel this war with more of our money which will in the end spawn more terrorists is just strange. Perhaps they should rethink...
 
Alpha 1
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Thu Jun 03, 2004 12:20 pm

Dc10guy, again, you cling to that idiocy. If it were about oil, gas prices wouldn't be going through the roof in the U.S.

It was not about oil. And I'm against this war, remember?
 
jutes85
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Thu Jun 03, 2004 12:20 pm

Man, that number is amazing.

The US should have invested $115 Billion to research in alternative fuel resources. They would have found it by now, and no one would give a shit about the middle-east, WMD or not.
nothing
 
DC10GUY
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Thu Jun 03, 2004 12:36 pm

Alpha 1 , High gas prices is exactly what Dubya wants .... West Texas crude is at record high prices now ... Do you really think we would have invaded Iraq if they didn't have oil ???
Next time try the old "dirty Sanchez" She'll love it !!!
 
Alpha 1
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Thu Jun 03, 2004 12:42 pm

Alpha 1 , High gas prices is exactly what Dubya wants .... West Texas crude is at record high prices now ... Do you really think we would have invaded Iraq if they didn't have oil ???

You don't know much about supply and demand, especially in an election year.

And answer to the second sentence, yes I do, because Bush was bent on revenge, and a trophy to use towards re-election.
 
DC10GUY
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Thu Jun 03, 2004 12:44 pm

You may be right.... But the Texas oil connection is too close IMHO ..
Next time try the old "dirty Sanchez" She'll love it !!!
 
Hamfist
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Fri Jun 04, 2004 8:42 am

Just did a search and didn't find any posts complaining about the $2-5 billion a year we were spending during Slick Willie's term to maintain the Northern/Southern Watch status quo!

Guess 'ol Slick Willie figured as long as he was killing off his own former associates, it wasn't so bad that Saddam was doing it too. Made it really convenient to just sit back, write the checks and do nothing about it.
 
globalexpress
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Fri Jun 04, 2004 10:11 am

As George W. Bush asks Congress for billions more to fund the occupation, your welfare systems are crying out for investment. Oh but its the war on TERROR OMG!!11

What about the war on poverty?
 
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JeffM
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Fri Jun 04, 2004 11:05 am

Welfare is not an investment. That is just plain rediculous. More like cancer. Think about it... Welfare fuels poverty.
 
flyingbronco05
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Fri Jun 04, 2004 12:03 pm

The Cost Of War In Iraq

Never Trust Your Fuel Gauge
 
KYIPpilot
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Fri Jun 04, 2004 12:17 pm

EA CO AS A waste? Hardly, when you consider it's one of the reasons our Armed Forces are comprised of volunteers who actually want to be there!

Volunteer, yes, but I doubt everyone over there actually wants to be there, as you put it. Very few people want to go and fight a war. I would think many of the people there are in it for the college benefits, to further their careers, not occupy a sovereign nation...
"It starts when you're always afraid; You step out of line, the man come and take you away" -Buffalo Springfield
 
Flying-Tiger
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Fri Jun 04, 2004 1:56 pm

@ Jeff: Nice to see that you´re not able to accept ANY other opinion. I can only feel sorry for you... just open a door and look outside, there is another World than the dream-world Mr. Bush is dreaming up for you. Time for you to hear a few other opinions other than those of GWB... might help. But don´t forget - sometimes the truth hurts quite a bit.

Regards
Flying-Tiger
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OO-AOG
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Fri Jun 04, 2004 4:56 pm

I love it how people can put a price on the freedom of the Iraqi people and claim it isn't worth the expense

Bush and his friends are humanists, everybody knows that ... and thanks again!  Big thumbs up
Falcon....like a limo but with wings
 
cedarjet
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Fri Jun 04, 2004 6:24 pm

Jeff M, your heart is cold indeed. In defence of the attack on Iraq, "I don't want the money spent on welfare, and unemployment checks." In other words, you'd rather spend your tax money on killing 55,000 Iraqis than helping the poorest and neediest Americans?! Even mass murder is preferable to a helping hand for your own people?!
fly Saha Air 707s daily from Tehran's downtown Mehrabad to Mashhad, Kish Island and Ahwaz
 
globalexpress
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Fri Jun 04, 2004 6:26 pm

Apparently so. But they're democrats, so it doesn't matter.
 
L-188
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Fri Jun 04, 2004 6:28 pm

Handouts don't help.

Isn't there something about teaching to fish, rather then giving a fish in the bible.

but enough about the US welfare system.

OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
globalexpress
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Fri Jun 04, 2004 6:31 pm

Who gives a shit about the Bible?

Ok then, invest in education and teach them to fish in the LA River  Yeah sure
 
L-188
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Fri Jun 04, 2004 6:32 pm

They have a river in L.A.  Confused

I thought that was a joke.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
globalexpress
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Fri Jun 04, 2004 6:35 pm

It was. They have sewers. Anyway, seriously, the money used in Iraq could be used for far more sensible things. I'm using LA as an example, with its extremely high murder rates and poor education.

More police on the street, better public education - all things you'd expect to find in such an economically developed country as the US, but alas you don't. I've been lucky enough to only have to drive THROUGH South East LA, and I feel for those people.
 
L-188
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Fri Jun 04, 2004 6:38 pm

Hell, I avoid California anyway.

Way too much socialism in that part of the world.

A lot of the problem is the illegals comming over and burning up the tax resources using government services and public assistance.

For the record, If I had the choice to deploy the 1st Cav or any other military unit to Iraq or along the California/Mexico border, without heistation....the latter.



[Edited 2004-06-04 11:39:48]
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
globalexpress
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Fri Jun 04, 2004 6:44 pm

Cool, it would be cheaper anyway now wouldn't it? Before we get into a discussion about immigration its not just California that could do with a bit more investment.

Fair enough, you may want to blame the ethnicity of these regions that have poor conditions. A lot of them are black, hispanic etc neighbourhoods but they make up a large amount of the population, in whatever city and also have a bit of clout when it comes to elections  Big grin

It doesn't ALL depend on the electoral college and Florida !
 
L-188
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Fri Jun 04, 2004 6:57 pm

No not ethnicty, Globalexpress.

But being illegals they are by definition cut out of all the lowest paying wages, no bennies and I don't doubt often, sub-minimum wage-off the books work.

A lot of the socialists think that the public coffers should be opened to help, despite the fact that they contribute nothing directly to it. There have been some efforts to indirectly link the to the legitimate economy, but theirs is truely a black market world. Step one, is to plug the hole in the dike, I.E. the border.

Putting the military on border patrol in the southwest is a very legitmate use of US military forces.

[Edited 2004-06-04 11:58:36]
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
cedarjet
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Fri Jun 04, 2004 7:27 pm

Aaaah gawd, the idea of California being socialist is really, really funny. The state that had Reagan as governor, now with Arnie as the governator. Waaaaay too much socialism. Yeah RIGHT.
fly Saha Air 707s daily from Tehran's downtown Mehrabad to Mashhad, Kish Island and Ahwaz
 
L-188
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Fri Jun 04, 2004 7:29 pm

Cederjet.....

Pat Buchanan, Arnie ain't
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
globalexpress
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RE: The Cost Of War In Iraq

Fri Jun 04, 2004 7:37 pm

I disagree that California is socialist in the manner you describe. You describe a one-way socialist state. I don't think the governor of California currently would agree with your assessment, and he would also want you to be more sympathetic to California - I mean, imagine if there was immigration from Canada, or if New York bordered Mexico.

Just because California is seen as a more liberally minded state doesn't class it as socialist, in my opinion

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