MD-90
Topic Author
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9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Fri Jun 04, 2004 6:18 pm

http://www.911independentcommission.org/bush2162004.html

The Family Steering Committee Statement and Questions
Regarding the 9/11 Commission Interview with President Bush



You can go look for yourself for the full 39 questions (recently updated from 23 questions), but I'm going to point out a few of them here. I think a few of the questions are almost silly, but some of them are very good questions that definately ought to be answered. All emphasis is mine.


3. What defensive action did you personally order to protect our nation during the crisis on September 11th? What time were these orders given, and to whom? What orders were carried out? What was the result of such orders? Were any such orders not carried out?

4. In your opinion, why was our nation so utterly unprepared for an attack on our own soil?

10. Specifically, what did you learn from the August 6, 2001, PDB about the terrorist threat that was facing our nation? Did you request any follow-up action to take place? Did you request any further report be developed and/or prepared?

16. What was the purpose of the several stops of Air Force One on September 11th? Was Air Force One at any time during the day of September 11th a target of the terrorists? Was Air Force One’s code ever breached on September 11th?


(personally, I would think that AF1 is too secure for terrorists of Osama's ilk to jepoardize)

17. Was there a reason for Air Force One lifting off without a military escort, even after ample time had elapsed to allow military jets to arrive?

(Obviously they're unaware that just because you don't see escorts doesn't mean they're not there)

18. What prompted your refusal to release the information regarding foreign sponsorship of the terrorists, as illustrated in the inaccessible 28 redacted pages in the Joint Intelligence Committee Inquiry Report? What actions have you personally taken since 9/11 to thwart foreign sponsorship of terrorism?

19. Who approved the flight of the bin Laden family out of the United States when all commercial flights were grounded, when there was time for only minimal questioning by the FBI, and especially, when two of those same individuals had links to WAMY, a charity suspected of funding terrorism? Why were bin Laden family members granted that special privilege—a privilege not available to American families whose loved ones were killed on 9/11?

(Now I thought this was inaccurate. Didn't the bin Ladens and the other Saudis leave AFTER the ban on flying was lifted?)

20. Please explain why no one in any level of our government has yet been held accountable for the countless failures leading up to and on 9/11?

23. Which individuals, governments, agencies, institutions, or groups may have benefited from the attacks of 9/11? Please state specifically how you think they have benefited.

27. During the second presidential debate on Oct. 11, 2000, as a Presidential candidate you responded to a question about racial discrimination and said that " ...there is other forms of racial profiling that goes on in America. Arab Americans are racially profiled in what's called "secret evidence".
http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/election/2000debates/2ndebate3.html


(interesting...I missed that during the debates)

30. In July, 2001, an executive order was issued which “blocks all property and interests in property of the Taliban and prohibits trade-related transactions by United States persons involving the territory of Afghanistan controlled by the Taliban.”
http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2001/07/20010702-10.html

Please discuss the American government’s role and position, either officially or unofficially in discussions/negotiations with the Taliban in 2001 and their timing and appropriateness with respect to the executive order of July 2, 2001 mentioned above. According to an article in Salon, 6-05-02:

“The Bush White House stepped up negotiations with the Taliban in 2001. When those talks stalled in July, a Bush administration representative threatened the Taliban with military reprisals if the government did not go along with American demands.”
http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2002/06/05/memo/index_np.html

36. On February 29, 2004, the Seattle Times ran this headline “U.S. changes tactics, adds forces in hunt for bin Laden” and went on to say, “President Bush has approved a plan to intensify the effort to capture or kill Osama bin Laden…” Please explain why there has not been a consistently intense push since September 11th to capture or kill bin Laden.
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/text/2001867838_binladen29.html

39. What type of federal rescue measures are in place in the event of an attack on our nation, in terms of personnel and equipment?



While I personally think that some of the 9-11 family members have publicaly disgraced themselves, there are some good questions here. Bush seems to be turning out like his father, and he doesn't communicate well with the public.
 
L-188
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Fri Jun 04, 2004 6:23 pm

A growing percentage of these 9/11 families only raise these questions, to get press time.

I agree with you a lot of their conduct has been discraceful, which is one of the main reasons why the 9/11 commision has become the zoo that it has.

Anybody who thinks that anything worthwhile will come from it is deluding themselves.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
cedarjet
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Fri Jun 04, 2004 6:29 pm

"A growing percentage of these 9/11 families only raise these questions, to get press time." L-188, you never cease to amaze me. You're saying these people are only interested in celebrity?! And therefore that their questions have no merit?!

PS to MD-90: when the Saudis left the US on private jets after 9/11, they were the only civilians in the sky - it was during the lockdown, not after.
fly Saha Air 707s daily from Tehran's downtown Mehrabad to Mashhad, Kish Island and Ahwaz
 
globalexpress
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Fri Jun 04, 2004 6:30 pm

What an insult to those who were killed; what do YOU think should be done to put this commission back on track? After all, every bit of American foreign policy today is affected by what happened to the relatives of those families on that day, so its surely more important to be shrugged off by you, L-188.
 
L-188
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Fri Jun 04, 2004 6:31 pm

In many cases......

Yes.

And in many cases are they trying to dog the current Admin.

Yes.

Fact is the seeds of these event where planted well before the 2000 election, but the rate these people are going, we will never find out what really happened.

Too much politicing is entering the process.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
globalexpress
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Fri Jun 04, 2004 6:32 pm

Cool, it was Clinton's fault anyway.

lol.

 Yeah sure
 
MD-90
Topic Author
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Fri Jun 04, 2004 6:46 pm

Cedarjet, are you sure?
 
L-188
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Fri Jun 04, 2004 6:52 pm

I did not say that Globalexpress.

I am sure there are plenty of accusations and missed opportunties to go around.



[Edited 2004-06-04 11:52:58]
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
globalexpress
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Fri Jun 04, 2004 7:45 pm

True, your implication was clear for us all to see however  Smile Nobody can be absolutely sure.
 
cedarjet
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Fri Jun 04, 2004 8:17 pm

Yes I'm sure about the Bin Ladens being flown out of the country when the rest of us, including those who'd lost people in the catastrophe and had freshly-widowed friends in NYC, were still grounded.
fly Saha Air 707s daily from Tehran's downtown Mehrabad to Mashhad, Kish Island and Ahwaz
 
Alpha 1
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Fri Jun 04, 2004 8:44 pm

Bush seems to be turning out like his father, and he doesn't communicate well with the public.

I think his father was a better president, simply because he wasn't so rigid in his beliefs. And, in his war, he consulted our allies, and interested parties, he didn't piss them off by telling them to shove it up their collective butts.

And it took you THIS long, MD-90, to figure out he doesn't communicate well?  Smile

A growing percentage of these 9/11 families only raise these questions, to get press time.

You treat the 9/11 families worse than I would treat a worn-down dog, L-188, and all to try to protect George W. Bush. It speaks with complete dishonor.

Most families are raising these questions, as many Americans are, because answers have been hard to come by with this President, who treats everything as a secret.

I am sure there are plenty of accusations and missed opportunties to go around.

Sure, but just as so we deflect them away from the Administration, right L-188?  Laugh out loud You blame everyone but this President.

And, once more, tell me again, "I'm not a Republican."  Laugh out loud
 
L-188
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Fri Jun 04, 2004 8:49 pm

Actually Alpha1, I did take some shots at him in regards to his recent souvenir from Iraq.
.
You must have missed that.


Are you keeping score? I wouldn't want you to miss any others
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
Alpha 1
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Fri Jun 04, 2004 8:53 pm

The scale is so far tipped to one side, that a little tidbit about his souvenir (You're referring to Saddam's gun now in the White House, I presume), doesn't mean a whole lot.

You spend most your time on here trying to deflect any criticism of the man. You've become almost as rabid in that quest as B757300.
 
L-188
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Fri Jun 04, 2004 8:56 pm

Nope.

And you explain to me why he can have a pistol from Iraq brought to the states and the GI who actually fought the war can't?

It's a double standard.

Oh and BTW,

Didn't I challenge you to find just one post where I speak positively of the creation of the TSA?

Did you have any luck?
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
Alpha 1
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Fri Jun 04, 2004 9:00 pm

Like I said, L-188, you want me to put more weight on the one or two things (at most) that you mildly critisize Bush for, against your maniacal defense of him on this board, and give them equal weight? Sorry, doesn't work that way.

And which souvenir are you referring to? I've heard how he likes to show off Saddam's pistol, which, to me, strikes me as very childish, especially with a war still raging.
 
L-188
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Fri Jun 04, 2004 9:03 pm

Showing off the pistol isn't that weird.

Especially one with that level of historical significance.

My understanding is that the most requisted item for veiwing in the FBI weapons museum is the Colt .45 that Elvis Prestley gave Richard Nixon.

Apparently nobody knew he had it one him until the metal dectors at the door(even back then) and he had it tucked in his belt.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
Alpha 1
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Fri Jun 04, 2004 9:12 pm

You may think it's no big deal, but I think it's like a little kid showing off something he found at the playground. He's acting like a little kid, as far as I'm concerned. Cowboys and their guns, eh, L-188?  Laugh out loud
 
L-188
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Fri Jun 04, 2004 9:19 pm

Nothing wrong with cowboys Alpha1, but I do caution you, I think the rumors about him sleeping with it under his pillow are just a bit far fetched.

I personally would still like to be my hands on a .357 or .30 Carbine Blackhawk.

Would make a nice intermediate cartridge size between by .22WMR and my .45 Long Colt Blackhawk.

But it is no different then any other gift any other statesman gets.

That is one of the reasons they have those presidental libraries. To house all that stuff since they can't take it home with them.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
globalexpress
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Fri Jun 04, 2004 9:21 pm

It seems like too much of a trophy to me. As if to say "look Dad, I got him for ya and heres the proof"..

I don't think you can compare it to US GI's taking Lugers in WW2, though. Its a bit different even to GI's taking souvenirs from Iraq THIS time around - they fought for them I guess. Did George?
 
L-188
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Fri Jun 04, 2004 9:24 pm

No and that is exactly my point.

Why should he get a pistol from Iraq, when the GI's who are over there can't


OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
globalexpress
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Fri Jun 04, 2004 9:26 pm

Because hes GEORGE W. BUSH. President of the WORLD!!11

He can do anything, even start a war if he fancies  Smile
 
L-188
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Fri Jun 04, 2004 9:41 pm

King of the World?

Wasn't that what's his name....Directed Titanic.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
globalexpress
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Fri Jun 04, 2004 9:50 pm

James Cameron? Hehe.. yeah, he DID create the Terminator after all! Reckon hes a Republican Governor candidate too?
 
b757300
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Fri Jun 04, 2004 10:34 pm

Of course no one mentions that the "9-11" families that the media is always talking about are almost always from a group called "September 11th Families For Peaceful Tomorrows". These people are supported by the a group that is administered by none other than John Kerry's wife, Teresa Heinz Kerry. "Peaceful Tomorrows" has been active in anti-Bush protests for several years now so it is no surprise that they're against the ads. The two main people you hear that are bashing Bush in the media are Colleen Kelly, Andrew Rice, David Potorti, and Kelly Campbell, all of whom are prominent members of "Peaceful Tomorrows". They also has direct ties to Moveon.org, the communist Internet site. Several of "Peaceful Tomorrows" events have been arraigned and funed by Moveon.org. It is already well known that Moveon.org is a group of people that represent the absolute worst of the left in the United States.

19. Who approved the flight of the bin Laden family out of the United States when all commercial flights were grounded, when there was time for only minimal questioning by the FBI, and especially, when two of those same individuals had links to WAMY, a charity suspected of funding terrorism? Why were bin Laden family members granted that special privilege—a privilege not available to American families whose loved ones were killed on 9/11?

By his own admission, Democrat golden boy Richard Clarke.

http://www.thehill.com/news/052604/clarke.aspx
"There is no victory at bargain basement prices."
 
BN747
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Sat Jun 05, 2004 9:10 am

Are you kidding if Dubya tried to answer any of those he suffer a catastrophic anyurism!


BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
JeffM
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Sat Jun 05, 2004 9:32 am

Actually, those families should be asking questions.... Lots and lots of them. But I am afraid some people here may not like the answers...

"Why don't we all just sit back and have a cigar..."

signed,

Bill Clinton

[Edited 2004-06-05 02:33:28]
 
Alpha 1
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Sat Jun 05, 2004 9:42 am

Gee, stop the Press, JeffM tries to interject Bill Clinton in a thread critical of George W. Bush.

Mercy, what an original idea.

 Laugh out loud
 
NWA742
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Sat Jun 05, 2004 9:55 am

Gee, stop the Press, JeffM tries to interject Bill Clinton in a thread critical of George W. Bush.

Mercy, what an original idea.


Alpha 1 stop being a damn hypocrite. Time and time again you always whine about righties bringing Clinton into a thread about Bush, yet you attempt to bring your Bush bashing nonsense into every single thread possible. I could start a thread aboud pens and pencils and I would not be surprised at all if you or another lefty tried to bring in some Bush bashing. I'm not taking sides, I'm just telling you that it happens from BOTH sides all the time.

So, stop crying about others doing the same thing that you always do.



-NWA742
Some people are like slinkies - not good for anything, but they bring a smile to your face when pushed down the stairs
 
MD-90
Topic Author
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Sat Jun 05, 2004 9:59 am

So ANYWAY, back to the questions...

Enough squabbling, although I do think the Bush-Saddam's gun episode is a bit trite.
 
Alpha 1
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Sat Jun 05, 2004 11:43 am

Alpha 1 stop being a damn hypocrite. Time and time again you always whine about righties bringing Clinton into a thread about Bush, yet you attempt to bring your Bush bashing nonsense into every single thread possible.

Mercy, but that hurts, not. I bring up Bush in threads about Bush, or about the war in Iraq, or about American policy. Unlike the right wing lunatics on this forum, NWA, I don't simply interject his name to deflect criticism, as JeffM, B757300, L-188, Jcs, ad naseum, constantly do in trying to bring up Clinton to deflect criticism away from Bush. It's such a part of being Republican now, that it's done like a reflex-like Pavlov's dog, panting and drooling, ready to say "Bill Clinton" any time someone dares critisize Bush.

So take your "hypocrite" lable and stick it somewhere else, bro.

I'm not taking sides, I'm just telling you that it happens from BOTH sides all the time.

And you call me hypocrite.  Laugh out loud That's as bad as L-188 saying he's not a Republican, or JeffM saying he doesn't like conservative Republicans. You took sides long ago. If you didn't take sides, you'd take swipes at the idiots who always bring up Bill Clinton in an attemt to deflect criticism from a President whom, I for one, thinks deserves it. So stop lying thorugh your teeth and tell me you don't take sides. That's just a blatant falsehood.
 
L-188
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Sat Jun 05, 2004 12:59 pm

Alpha1 is right, I am not a republican but rather an Alaskan Independent

http://www.akip.org

However of the national parties, the Republicans tend to agree more with my views and not takes stances that are unacceptable.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
QANTASforever
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Sat Jun 05, 2004 1:08 pm

Of course no one mentions that the "9-11" families that the media is always talking about are almost always from a group called "September 11th Families For Peaceful Tomorrows". These people are supported by the a group that is administered by none other than John Kerry's wife, Teresa Heinz Kerry. "Peaceful Tomorrows" has been active in anti-Bush protests for several years now so it is no surprise that they're against the ads.

SO WHAT if these 9/11 victims families are anti-bush??

Should we only listen to those families who support GWB?

Ridiculous. Regardless of where their politics stand - the families of 9/11 victims have a role to play in the inquiry process! They deserve to be heard and their criticisms are valid - conservative or not!

QFF

Fighting for the glory of the Australian Republic.
 
Alpha 1
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Sat Jun 05, 2004 1:10 pm

Alpha1 is right, I am not a republican but rather an Alaskan Independent.

One of the great falsehoods being foisted on Anet. You are, through and through, one of the most partisian Republicans on this board, and your posts, defending and excusing Bush, and dishonoring all those GI's who have died in Iraq speak for themselves to what hypocricy you're putting out on here.

I get a laugh every time you say you're not a Republican. It's pretty amusing.
 
L-188
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Sat Jun 05, 2004 1:11 pm

The problem lies QANTASFOREVER is that they are so polticising the commisions, that nothing will be found that is worthwhile or actionable.

This commision has turned into a blame circus, rather then trying to find new ways to counter terrorism and prevent this event from happening again.

Why is it that I never heard any of GW's people being asked the following question by the commision, "What do you think we need to do differently to improve the system?"

Seems like that should be one of the first questions asked.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
MD-90
Topic Author
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Sat Jun 05, 2004 1:15 pm

L-188 is hardly a right wing lunatic.
 
Alpha 1
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Sat Jun 05, 2004 1:16 pm

L-188 is hardly a right wing lunatic.

One right-wing lunatic telling me that another one isn't, doesn't exactly fill me with confidence, MD-90.
 
QANTASforever
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Sat Jun 05, 2004 2:00 pm

Everyone holds political views of varying intensity. If these people want to be angry with GWB then fine - they can be angry. That said, they have freely participated in this inquiry - as a result they have an interest in seeing it comes to some sort of a conclusion. It is not the responsibility of the families to conduct this inquiry or ensure it hums along - that is the responsibility of those conducting the investigation.

If the investigation can't take into account the political views of the families without collapsing, then the investigation isn't doing what it's meant to do.

QFF
Fighting for the glory of the Australian Republic.
 
BN747
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Sat Jun 05, 2004 2:43 pm

L-188 is hardly a right wing lunatic.

Holy shit! There are NO living, breathing, right-wing republicans to right of either of you! The other 4 heel-clickers are in that group as well! You guys are so hard right...Pat Buchanan can't get in reach of you guys! David Duke can.. but he's in jail!

BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
NWA742
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Sat Jun 05, 2004 2:49 pm

I bring up Bush in threads about Bush, or about the war in Iraq, or about American policy.

I'll admit that you don't do it as often as other lefties around here Alpha, but I know I've seen you bring your ramblings about Bush into topics with have nothing to do with him. And, besides you, you know that it happens with a lot of the hardcore left on here, a lot of them will stop at nothing to bash Bush, no matter what the topic. If you try and deny this, you're insane.

It's such a part of being Republican now, that it's done like a reflex-like Pavlov's dog, panting and drooling, ready to say "Bill Clinton" any time someone dares critisize Bush.

There you go again, just ignoring one whole side of the coin. Are you trying to say that it's NOT a Democrat thing to do the same? HAH! Anytime a remark is thrown from a rep about Clinton or Kerry, at least 5 remarks are thrown from the left about Bush in response. It's all very simple, it happens on BOTH sides, including the side you're on.

And you call me hypocrite. That's as bad as L-188 saying he's not a Republican

Yeah, I'm sure you know L-188 better than he does. That's just another example of you being a hypocrite, you get pissed when somebody calls you a hardcore liberal, yet you feel it's ok to call someone else something that they say they aren't. If it's unfair to you, how can it be fair to do it to them?  Insane

You took sides long ago. So stop lying thorugh your teeth and tell me you don't take sides. That's just a blatant falsehood.

As did you. I never said I didn't take sides on the interests of politics, I was talking about the situation with bringing Bush/Clinton into unrelated topics. In that, I didn't take sides. Stop making crap up.

If you didn't take sides, you'd take swipes at the idiots who always bring up Bill Clinton in an attemt to deflect criticism from a President whom, I for one, thinks deserves it.

If you didn't take sides, you wouldn't constantly bash every single republican and conservative every single chance you get, you would more look into reality and see both sides of the situation, but you're so hardcore on your one side, that's become irrelevant to you these days.




-NWA742
Some people are like slinkies - not good for anything, but they bring a smile to your face when pushed down the stairs
 
L-188
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Sat Jun 05, 2004 3:42 pm

My god

I never knew my poltical affilliations could be the subject of so much date.

Well let me set the record straight.

I have not now nor have I ever been a....

Socialist
Green
Bull Moose
Reform
Communist
Republican Moderate
National Socialist

OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
Alpha 1
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Sat Jun 05, 2004 10:34 pm

David Duke can.. but he's in jail!

He is? Not that I care one rats ass about that racists, white-sheeted bastard, but I didn't know that.  Big grin

I'll admit that you don't do it as often as other lefties around here Alpha, but I know I've seen you bring your ramblings about Bush into topics with have nothing to do with him.

You go find them for me. Go on. I'm waiting.

There you go again, just ignoring one whole side of the coin.

I IGNORED IT? Sorry, partner, but YOU ignored it! You completely ignored the JeffM's, the B757300's, who, CONSTANTLY have to mention the name Bill Clinton on threads not even relavant to Bill Clinton, and only relavant to criticism of the U.S. or, more specifically, George W. Bush.

George W. Bush IS the sitting President, is he not? He's the one calling the shots, is he not? He's where, allegedly, at least, the buck stops, is that not correct? Then he will come under criticism by those, like me, who usually disagree with him. You can't seem to handle that fact, and you completely ignore the fact that certain elements on here, B737-300, JeffM, Jcs, to a degree, and L-188 sometimes even, does this. And go and tell me this isn't standard Republican practice, when you hear it on Rush, or on Fox, ALL THE TIME!

Are you trying to say that it's NOT a Democrat thing to do the same?

When Clinton was president, how often did you REALLY hear Democrats say "well, it's George Bush's fault", or "It's Ronald Reagan's fault". Not very damn much, did you? There wasn't a concerted, conscious effort to try and deflect criticism from the Democratic party, the way there is now on the part of right-wing politicians and media. You have a plethora of people doing this: Gingrich, Coulter, Hannity, O'Reilly, Limbaugh-all in the right-wing media, making concerted efforts to try and blame everything that has ever plagued man on "liberals" and Bill Clinton. Hell, he's been out of office a full term, and the GOP control BOTH brances of Congress AND the White House, and right-wing media are STILL concentrating on Bill Clinton and "liberals", as if they control the destiny of the nation!!

The fact is you only see me critisizing Bush on issues. I do not call him names, like some lunatics on the far-left do on here, and as some of the lunatics on the far-right do at Clinton ("Dubya, Klintoon", etc) I try to stick to policy and why I think he's on the wrong track. I can't help it if you can't handle that.
 
StarAC17
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Sun Jun 06, 2004 3:36 am

L-188 isn't a Republican and neither is B757300, JeffM, or MD-90 they claim that they are but how they present themselves they are far too right to be republicans or even true conservatives.

L-188 seems the most left of these guys that i mentioned but even that doesn't come close to someone like Matt D or Yyz717
Engineers Rule The World!!!!!
 
NWA742
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Sun Jun 06, 2004 12:15 pm

You go find them for me. Go on. I'm waiting.

Very well Alpha 1, you deny that you bring your ramblings about Bush, conservatives, republicans, etc. into other threads, I took a look of the first page of results for your posts:

Topic: The Pope Is An Idiot Part XII

JeffM, you're the Poster Child for the GOP. I don't put B757300 there because he NEVER critisizes a Republican, but you're a Republican's wet dream, mate!

Of course, it seems to be out of the modern Republican playbook, to dirty anyone who doesn't agree with Bush, or like the U.S. and what it's doing these days. And you guys then sit and wonder why the rest of the world can't stand right-wing Republicans, and their utter arrogance?


Yeah, it took me about five seconds to find a topic completely irrelevant to Bush, republicans, and conservatives, and have you spouting of your senseless bashings. Yeah, you do it left and right, regardless of what the thread is about. Deny it again, and I'll laugh. I think that you sometimes don't realize how much you really do spout off about your political opponents. It's why some people call you a hard lefty, even though your true views may be different.

I IGNORED IT? Sorry, partner, but YOU ignored it! You completely ignored the JeffM's, the B757300's, who, CONSTANTLY have to mention the name Bill Clinton on threads not even relavant to Bill Clinton, and only relavant to criticism of the U.S. or, more specifically, George W. Bush.

Oh bullshit Alpha 1. I'm not ignoring anything, I'm thoroughly aware that a lot of conservatives on here like to bash Clinton all the time. I never denied it, and I already acknowledged it once, was that not enough? YOU are the one that doesn't seem to be aware of the other side of the coin, that lefties bash Bush and other conservatives or republicans time and time again (even if the thread has nothing to do with politics), and just as, if not much more often.

George W. Bush IS the sitting President, is he not? He's the one calling the shots, is he not? He's where, allegedly, at least, the buck stops, is that not correct?

Yeah that's correct, glad you noticed.

Then he will come under criticism by those, like me, who usually disagree with him.

Ok, I have no problem with that. As long as you back yourself up, and don't act like a fool like a lot of Bush bashers on here do.

You can't seem to handle that fact, and you completely ignore the fact that certain elements on here, B737-300, JeffM, Jcs, to a degree, and L-188 sometimes even, does this.

What? You're pissed because people disagree with you on politics? Everybody has as much of a right to an opinion about Bush as you do Alpha 1, and just because they don't reside in the liberal party as yourself, doesn't make their opinions any less credible. There is NOTHING wrong with bashing Clinton's doings. He was the president for 8 years, and his (as any president's) affects to the country, whether people deem them good or bad, will exist for many more years to come. You and other lefties have no problem bashing Reagon who's been out of the office for a couple of decades. You have a problem with Clinton being bashed when he's out of office, but you and other lefties don't mind to bash Reagon. This argument of yours holds no water.

And go and tell me this isn't standard Republican practice, when you hear it on Rush, or on Fox, ALL THE TIME!

When did I tell you it wasn't? All I told you was that you're ignoring another side of the coin, and that it's also a big practice with the Democratic party.

When Clinton was president, how often did you REALLY hear Democrats say "well, it's George Bush's fault", or "It's Ronald Reagan's fault". Not very damn much, did you?

Actually I heard it a hell of a lot times. Were you living under a rock? I still can't believe that you're trying to say that only the Rep. party blames problems on the Dem party, and a vice-versa situation in which Dems blame Reps doesn't exist. Simply unbelievable.

I do not call him names, like some lunatics on the far-left do on here, and as some of the lunatics on the far-right do at Clinton ("Dubya, Klintoon", etc) I try to stick to policy and why I think he's on the wrong track.

That's a very good thing Alpha 1. You are very sensible like that, and that's why I respect you. Although I don't understand why you felt the need to explain that to me, because I never said anything like that about you.



-NWA742
Some people are like slinkies - not good for anything, but they bring a smile to your face when pushed down the stairs
 
Alpha 1
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Sun Jun 06, 2004 12:50 pm

Funny, NWA742, not once in those paragraphs did I mention George W. Bush. Not once. So, what did you prove? That you can't get the gist of what you yourself are charging in a correct fashion?  Laugh out loud

Steeerike one, friend.

Oh bullshit Alpha 1. I'm not ignoring anything..

Sure you are. You've denied it competely up to this point, and just concentrated on the "liberals", simply because you, in your heart, happen to agree with this numbnuts who do this all the time.

Ok, I have no problem with that. As long as you back yourself up, and don't act like a fool like a lot of Bush bashers on here do.

But apprently you DO have a problem, and a big one, with it, because that's what I do!! I don't stoop to personal insults of the President-I respect him for the office he holds, which is more that I can say for certain right wing lunatics and the way they treat a former U.S. president, but I take opposition to him on ISSUES, and where I think he's leading (or misleading) this nation.

So you do have a problem with that, apparently. That's not my problem, though, is it?  Smile

What? You're pissed because people disagree with you on politics?

Hell no. I'm smart enough to realize that probably more than half the world doesn't agree with me, and that's fine by me. If those I've mentioned would debate ISSUES instead of trying to deflect criticism to a former president, or on liberals in general, I wouldn't get annoyed at all, even if I disagree. But that's not what happens, and you know it, and you seemingly turn a blind eye to it. Well, that's your problem, not mine.

There is NOTHING wrong with bashing Clinton's doings.

On the merits of what he did/didn't do as president, you are correct. But I have a big problem with simply using his name, without debating the merits of his incumbency, simply to deflect what I see is just criticism of George W. Bush, or GOP policy.

If anyone on the right wants to critisize Clinton for his economic or military policy, as a discussion of Clinton, that's one thing. But again, simply bringing up his name, in a derragatory way, to try and deflect any critcism from Bush or Republicans, is idiotic. You and I both know it.
 
NWA742
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Sun Jun 06, 2004 1:10 pm

Funny, NWA742, not once in those paragraphs did I mention George W. Bush. Not once.

So what? So all the other constant ramblings about republicans and conservatives suddenly don't count?

So, what did you prove? That you can't get the gist of what you yourself are charging in a correct fashion?

Steeerike one, friend


You know exactly what I'm accusing you of Alpha 1. Plain and simple: You constantly bring ramblins about Bush, conservatives, and republicans, into completely irrelavant topics.

Strike one, hah.

Sure you are. You've denied it competely up to this point, and just concentrated on the "liberals"

Oh really, then why have I acknowledged that both sides do it? You've only said that the conservatives do it. You continue to deny the fact that it happens from the other side just as often, if not much more. I explained that in that paragraph of my previous post that you chose to ignore.

But apprently you DO have a problem, and a big one, with it, because that's what I do!! I don't stoop to personal insults of the President-I respect him for the office he holds

I don't have problems with legitimate criticism of Bush. Not at all.

which is more that I can say for certain right wing lunatics and the way they treat a former U.S. president

Come on Alpha, there you go again, ignoring one whole side of it again. We both know of right wing lunatics and what they do to Clinton, but again you left out the fact that there are just as many left wing nuts (in fact, a lot more on these boards) who do the very same thing to Bush, Bush Sr., Reagon, etc. It happens FROM BOTH SIDES, ALL THE TIME. Sheesh, and you say I'm ignoring a side of it.  Insane

On the merits of what he did/didn't do as president, you are correct. But I have a big problem with simply using his name, without debating the merits of his incumbency, simply to deflect what I see is just criticism of George W. Bush, or GOP policy.

Very well, but why don't you have a problem, or at least admit, the fact that it happens to republican presidents as well, from left wing nuts simply using their names?

Basic questions I'm asking you are: Why is it only a problem to you that there are right wing nuts who will bring their rants against Dem leaders everywhere?

Why don't you acknowledge the FACT that the opposite from the above happens, that there are just as many left wing nuts brining rants against Rep leaders everywhere?

It happens all the time from both sides, you and I both know it. Of course, when a Rep. president is in office, it'll happen more from the right, and vice-versa.



-NWA742
Some people are like slinkies - not good for anything, but they bring a smile to your face when pushed down the stairs
 
Alpha 1
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Sun Jun 06, 2004 1:17 pm

So what? So all the other constant ramblings about republicans and conservatives suddenly don't count?

Here was your original beef:

" but I know I've seen you bring your ramblings about Bush into topics with have nothing to do with him."

It was about Bush that you complained. So, like Bush, when the facts don't fit, you change the name of the game?  Smile
 
NWA742
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Sun Jun 06, 2004 1:24 pm

Here was your original beef:

" but I know I've seen you bring your ramblings about Bush into topics with have nothing to do with him."

It was about Bush that you complained. So, like Bush, when the facts don't fit, you change the name of the game?


Ah, I see the mistake I've made. I left the rest about conservatives and republicans out, sorry about that.

But that was what I intended to accuse you of though  Smile



-NWA742
Some people are like slinkies - not good for anything, but they bring a smile to your face when pushed down the stairs
 
Alpha 1
Posts: 12343
Joined: Sat Feb 03, 2001 12:12 am

RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Sun Jun 06, 2004 1:34 pm

Ah, I see the mistake I've made. I left the rest about conservatives and republicans out, sorry about that.

But that was what I intended to accuse you of though


Sorry mister, you blew it!  Laugh out loud
 
NWA742
Posts: 4505
Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2002 11:35 am

RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Sun Jun 06, 2004 1:36 pm

Sorry mister, you blew it!

Ah don't be an ass about it.  Smile Just a simple typo. In the rest of our argument I made it clear as to what I was accusing you of anyways, and, I'm afraid I put you into your place on those accusations.

 Smile



-NWA742
Some people are like slinkies - not good for anything, but they bring a smile to your face when pushed down the stairs
 
MD-90
Topic Author
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RE: 9-11 Families Have New Questions For Bush

Sun Jun 06, 2004 1:39 pm

SOOOOO

anyone want to discuss any of the questions? Here's a good one.

23. Which individuals, governments, agencies, institutions, or groups may have benefited from the attacks of 9/11? Please state specifically how you think they have benefited.

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