sabenapilot
Posts: 2442
Joined: Sat Feb 26, 2000 6:18 pm

EU Gets First Constitution!

Sat Jun 19, 2004 7:56 am

A deal has been reached on the first constitution for the European Union after hours of talks at the EU summit in Brussels. The final text of the constitution was put to leaders of the 25 EU states, who approved it a short time ago.

The European Constitution sets out the powers of the national governments of the member states and the EU's various institutions as well as a charter of fundamental rights and a detailed catalogue of how the Union will conduct a wide range of internal and foreign policies.

The European Constitution will pave the way for a European President as well as a European Secretary of State.

It also limits veto power of member states, but measures must have the backing of at least 55% of EU states, representing at least 65% of the total population, in order to pass.

The Constitution will make NO reference to any God.

Now every country will have to ratify the Constitution, either in national parliaments or through public referendums.




[Edited 2004-06-19 00:57:15]
 
phxairfan
Posts: 781
Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2001 6:22 am

RE: EU Gets First Constitution!

Sat Jun 19, 2004 7:59 am

I want to congratulate the European Union on this, as from what I've read it took a lot to accomplish. After finally coming to a compromise, everyone toasted each other with champagne. Somehow I don't see Republicans and Democrats do this, at least anytime soon.
 
JAL777
Posts: 2453
Joined: Wed Jun 04, 2003 10:13 pm

RE: EU Gets First Constitution!

Sat Jun 19, 2004 8:00 am

Congratulations on losing your sovereignty.  Big thumbs up
 
zak
Posts: 1926
Joined: Mon Sep 22, 2003 12:17 pm

RE: EU Gets First Constitution!

Sat Jun 19, 2004 8:43 am

"The Constitution will make NO reference to any God."

and thats the best part of it  Smile
10=2
 
jwenting
Posts: 9973
Joined: Mon Apr 23, 2001 10:12 pm

RE: EU Gets First Constitution!

Sat Jun 19, 2004 1:27 pm

I hope this piece of undemocratic crap never gets approved. It signs the national sovereignty of the smaller member nations over verbatim to the two big players: France and Germany.

Napoleon and Hitler would be very pleased, their heirs have done through political backstabbing and bribery what they themselves couldn't through force of arms.
I wish I were flying
 
jwenting
Posts: 9973
Joined: Mon Apr 23, 2001 10:12 pm

RE: EU Gets First Constitution!

Sat Jun 19, 2004 2:50 pm

Say NO now or say OUI for the rest of your life!
I wish I were flying
 
Guest

RE: EU Gets First Constitution!

Sat Jun 19, 2004 5:12 pm

Down with Germany and France!

The rest of Europe Unite
 Big grin
 
L410Turbolet
Posts: 5421
Joined: Wed May 05, 2004 9:12 am

RE: EU Gets First Constitution!

Sat Jun 19, 2004 5:15 pm

My only hope is, that the Constitution will get voted down in referendums and ratifications.
Each and everyone who's against the Constitution will get personally kicked out of the EU by Chirac himself!
 
Leskova
Posts: 5547
Joined: Wed Oct 08, 2003 3:39 pm

RE: EU Gets First Constitution!

Sat Jun 19, 2004 5:55 pm

It is great news, and even though I would have preferred more issues to be decided by a regular majority decision, I am fully aware that, politically, that was just not doable.

The double majority principle will prevent the EU being hijacked by the larger states - to pass something you have to have the yes-votes of 55% percent of the countries in the EU (at 25 states that means if you don't have 14 countries behind your idea, it won't work) - and you have to have 65% of the EU population represented by these countries (with a total population around 450 million that means you need countries representing 293 million - just for those that think Germany and France will rule everything from now on: Germany has 82.2 million, France has 61.2 million - so they're "just" 149.6, or more than the population of these two countries combined, million short of an absolute majority).

So much for Schröder and Chirac ruling everything... people, just on occasion it really helps to look at the numbers behind the, in my view quite far out, accusation one makes...

Regards,
Frank

P.S.: Before you go writing things like "You're from Germany so it's no wonder you'd agree" - I live in Germany, true, but I'm a citizen of one of the smaller EU countries (Austria, population of 8.8 million - about half as many people as the Netherlands has)...
Smile - it confuses people!
 
Klaus
Posts: 20578
Joined: Wed Jul 11, 2001 7:41 am

RE: EU Gets First Constitution!

Sat Jun 19, 2004 7:19 pm

I particularly like the subsidiarity principle that´s been brought in by the german delegation: The EU level shall only regulate issues that are best dealt with on that level; National parliaments will be able to sue at the European Court to reclaim powers that would violate this principle.


Besides: Anything that gets Jwenting into an open panic can´t be all bad...!  Big thumbs up
 
zak
Posts: 1926
Joined: Mon Sep 22, 2003 12:17 pm

RE: EU Gets First Constitution!

Sat Jun 19, 2004 7:55 pm

i thought exactly the same klaus, seeing who is all against it now(and who had been against it before), it cant be such a bad thing.
i also agree about the subsidiarity principle, it is a mighty tool to keep the eu efficient and might prove to be the difference between a behemoth of bureaucracy and the efficient government model of the future.
10=2
 
Klaus
Posts: 20578
Joined: Wed Jul 11, 2001 7:41 am

Zak

Sat Jun 19, 2004 7:56 pm

Well, it might make the administration more efficient...  Wink/being sarcastic
 
777236ER
Posts: 12213
Joined: Sat Aug 18, 2001 7:10 am

RE: EU Gets First Constitution!

Sat Jun 19, 2004 8:43 pm

Please note that there IS an annex which states that the constituion cannot override national laws...so don't worry, member states haven't signed away their soverignty.

It does beg the question of the use and need of the constituion though.
Your bone's got a little machine
 
Gman94
Posts: 1167
Joined: Fri May 28, 2004 2:56 am

RE: EU Gets First Constitution!

Sat Jun 19, 2004 9:25 pm

It's got a single currency, and its getting a constitution, a foreign minister, a secretary of state and president. Sounds like a its heading towards a super state to me.
British Airways - The Way To Fly
 
Gman94
Posts: 1167
Joined: Fri May 28, 2004 2:56 am

RE: EU Gets First Constitution!

Sat Jun 19, 2004 9:38 pm

Oh I forgot one thing it's got it's own parliament, but it's not a super state.
British Airways - The Way To Fly
 
JGPH1A
Posts: 15080
Joined: Thu Aug 14, 2003 4:36 pm

RE: EU Gets First Constitution!

Sat Jun 19, 2004 9:43 pm

Well I'm glad about the removal of the reference to Christian heritage, and about the increase in the number of countries/percentage of population to pass a measure.

The way France has handled the new Commission President is appalling - the insistence that the new person be

a) From inside the Schengen Area
b) Fluent in French

is a total insult to the 80% of Europeans that are not Francophone. I really hope Chris Patten gets it, even though he's a Tory - he might kick some flabby Brussels butt about the whole gravy train bureaucracy.

In the meantime I hope all European countries gang up together and block all Franco-German proposals for the next 5 years, just because they can !
Young and beautiful and thin and gorgeous AND BANNED ! Cya at airspaceonline.com, losers
 
LGW
Posts: 4281
Joined: Thu Jun 01, 2000 6:07 pm

RE: EU Gets First Constitution!

Tue Jun 22, 2004 2:49 am

Hi all,

Booo to the constitution, say NO to it.

Im an English not European.

"Say NO now or say OUI for the rest of your life!"

Thats funny, also worryingly true  Smile

Ben Pritchard
 
Leskova
Posts: 5547
Joined: Wed Oct 08, 2003 3:39 pm

RE: EU Gets First Constitution!

Tue Jun 22, 2004 2:56 am

"Say NO now or say OUI for the rest of your life!"

Thats funny, also worryingly true

I'd say worryingly ridiculous get's a whole lot closer to the truth...  Insane

Regards,
Frank
Smile - it confuses people!

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