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Gymnast Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Tue Aug 24, 2004 12:49 am

Great. Thanks to the unfortunate incident in Salt Lake City (where, to be fair, the French judge was found to have been cheating) complaining about the outcome of judged sporting events in hopes of altering the results after the fact have started to become commonplace.

The latest example? Russian silver medalist gymnast Svetlana Khorkina has bitterly complained that the women's all-around gymnastics competition was "fixed" in favor of American Carly Patterson:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2004/olympics/2004/gymnastics/08/22/bc.olympics.gymnastics.khorkina/index.html?cnn=yes

MOSCOW (Reuters) -- Russia's Svetlana Khorkina, who was second to American Carly Patterson in the women's all-round gymnastics competition, has accused the judges of robbing her of the gold medal and said "everything was decided in advance."

"I'm just furious," Khorkina, who had been favorite for the coveted title, was quoted as saying in the daily Izvestia. "I knew well in advance, even before I stepped on the stage for my first event, that I was going to lose."

"Everything was decided in advance. I had no illusions about this when the judges gave me 9.462 for the vault after conferring with one another at length.

"I practically did everything right, still they just set me up and fleeced me," she said in the interview published on Saturday.

Asked why she felt she was marked down by the judges, Khorkina said: "You better ask them. I think it's because I'm from Russia, not from America!"



The self-proclaimed "diva" of Russian gymnastics could conceivably have a lucrative career of endorsements ahead of her if she doesn't screw it up with her whining.

Shut up, Svetlana.

[Edited 2004-08-23 18:00:22]
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Banco
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RE: Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Tue Aug 24, 2004 12:59 am

The trouble is, in "sports" where everything is based on what judges think, you're always going to have this kind of thing. If you watch any coverage for more than five minutes the commentators will invariably express surprise at a mark being too high or low. Not that it means they know any better of course, just that it comes solely down to opinions.

She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
 
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RE: Gymnast Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Tue Aug 24, 2004 1:03 am

The trouble is, in "sports" where everything is based on what judges think, you're always going to have this kind of thing.

While I agree to a point, it seems as if athletes are now attempting to leverage the media to alter the outcome of athletic competition.

"The results didn't suit me, so now I'll try to find ways to invalidate the result - or at least call it into question."

Sounds like they're taking hints from the Gore/Lieberman 2000 playbook!  Big grin
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skyhawk
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RE: Gymnast Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Tue Aug 24, 2004 1:15 am

As one who has watched the Olympics for many years, the difference in abilities has become more and more advanced. The commentators are always telling us that a gymnast has to "stick" their landings. BTW these commentators are not just everyday observers as am I, but they are former champions in their own rights. So to say that they don't know any better than we, it is just not right.

During the competitions the other night, Svetlana did not once "stick" her landings. Carly on the other hand did. Granted she didn't have the greatest of vaults, but everything else was very good. Gymnast after gymnast took little steps after their landings.

For Svetlana to say that she was robbed, to me that is simply poor sportsmanship. She has been an absolutely outstanding gymnast in the past. Some of her inventive moves, especially on the uneven bars, are mind boggling. But like so many wonderful women of the past, she has arrived at the time to go gracefully, not poor mouthing everything around her. To me this really detracts from her and her abilities.

I am very sure there are those that probably agree with what she said, you have your right. I just hold that we have the right to disagree with each other.
 
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RE: Gymnast Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Tue Aug 24, 2004 1:22 am

"So to say that they don't know any better than we, it is just not right."

No, I was saying that they don't necessarily know any better than the judges, not us.
She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
 
dvk
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RE: Gymnast Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Tue Aug 24, 2004 1:27 am

Khorkina is just bitter. She crashed on the uneven bars last night and is leaving Athens with no golds. She's well known for her mercurial temperament, and this is just another example. She probably longs for the days when the east European bloc controlled international gymnastics (she's old enough to remember), and therefore the judges. Want to talk about a fixed competition? How about 1988, when an East German judge misapplied a rule that keeps coaches away from the apparatus during a performance to penalize the US women a half a point (a team member pulled the trampoline away after a teammate had mounted the parallel bars, moved away from the apparatus, and crouched on the floor barely within camera shot), conveniently robbing them of the bronze medal and giving it to her own East German girls. The US protested, but the protest was , of course, rejected.

I think Sweatlana is just trying to stir the pot because of the judging controversy in the men's all around. She's ravenous for any publicity she can get.
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mdsh00
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RE: Gymnast Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Tue Aug 24, 2004 2:04 am

I just read that article and it seems like she's just bitter about getting a silver. Bad sportsmanship.
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KiwiNanday
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RE: Gymnast Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Tue Aug 24, 2004 4:13 am

I'm just furious! I knew well in advance, even before I stepped on the stage for my first event, that I was going to lose. Everything was decided in advance. I had no illusions about this when the judges gave me 9.462 for the vault after conferring with one another at length. I practically did everything right, still they just set me up and fleeced me. You better ask them. I think it's because I'm from Russia, not from America!

Shut up, Svetlana! You were beat by a 16-year old, get over it!
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SSTjumbo
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RE: Gymnast Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Tue Aug 24, 2004 4:33 am

That's nice Svetlana


...and I was supposed to get interviews for a few jobs I didn't, I received a 3.85 GPA last semester instead of a 4.0, I was supposed to land a few music gigs that I didn't, and I should have had a few girls that I never had. Guess what? Life isn't fair, get over it.
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mdsh00
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RE: Gymnast Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Tue Aug 24, 2004 5:07 am

An Ode to Svetlana:



Where's that Kleenex box?
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HOMER71
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RE: Gymnast Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Tue Aug 24, 2004 5:14 am

Hey, Svetlana

You don't know CRAP about being robbed...

Sincerely,
Roy Jones, Jr.
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Tom in NO
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RE: Gymnast Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Tue Aug 24, 2004 7:20 am

Hey, Svetlana

You don't know CRAP about being robbed...

Sincerely,
Roy Jones, Jr.
.....

.....and the 1998-99 Buffalo Sabres
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RE: Gymnast Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Tue Aug 24, 2004 8:35 am

It's an epidemic!

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5800422/

Nemov says judges cheated him on high-bar

'I think everything was decided in advance,' Russian says


ATHENS, Greece - Russian Alexei Nemov said he felt cheated by the judges on Monday after an extraordinary display of "people power" brought pandemonium to the final evening of Olympic gymnastics in a furor over his mark.


“It’s my opinion, but I don’t think it was fair," the 28-year-old showman said after finishing fifth in possibly the most daring and dangerous event of all — the horizontal bars.

“I thought I deserved a bronze. I think everything was decided in advance,” he added.


Well whoop-de-frickin' do, you schmuck! Hell, I think I deserve to win the lottery every week - does it mean that's the way things have to be?!?  Nuts


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DeltaSFO
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RE: Gymnast Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Tue Aug 24, 2004 8:36 am

Supposedly she has posed in the Russian version of Playboy. What I want to know is who the hell would find her attractive. She belongs on the cover of a book about malnutrition, not a porno.
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RE: Gymnast Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Tue Aug 24, 2004 9:26 am

Supposedly she has posed in the Russian version of Playboy. What I want to know is who the hell would find her attractive. She belongs on the cover of a book about malnutrition, not a porno.

I can't find the post, but another person here likened sleeping with the bony Svetlana Khorkina to "rolling around in bed with a duffel bag full of coathangers."  Big thumbs up
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L-188
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RE: Gymnast Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Tue Aug 24, 2004 10:54 am

Hey, we keep a copy of that GI photo in the office for the pilots  Big thumbs up

We also have the John Wayne "Sands of Iwo Jima" one that says, "Life is Tough, it is tougher when you are stupid"

Serious, it is a good thing I wasn't aware of the 88 incident, I would still be bitching about that too, along with the Roy Jones incident, the 72 Mens basketball team.
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Usairwys757
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RE: Gymnast Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Tue Aug 24, 2004 11:16 am

Carly Patterson had a PERFECT routine, how can Khorkina say it was fixed? Just accept your Silver medal with pride, dont try to bring others down just because you couldnt win gold. This kind of pisses me off. If she doesnt want Silver then tell her to give it back.  Insane
Inactive.....
 
L-188
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RE: Gymnast Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Tue Aug 24, 2004 11:23 am

And I agree with whom ever said that this a direct result of the 2nd gold issued in the 2002 games.

Bring in the Lawyers!!!
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Tom in NO
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RE: Gymnast Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Tue Aug 24, 2004 11:27 am

.....and the 1998-99 Buffalo Sabres

My bad.....should have signed it "the 1972 USA Men's Basketball Team". Now those guys got robbed.

Tom at MSY

(.....although the Sabres were screwed out of a possible NHL title)




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airplay
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RE: Gymnast Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Tue Aug 24, 2004 11:53 am

Of course she lost. You can't put someone named "Svetlana" on a Wheaties box.....besides, the US has spend far too much money to let Carly lose now!

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5635413/site/newsweek/

Cool quote from MSNBC: "The U.S. now runs its Olympic program on a venture-capital model, funneling money to likely medal winners, and leaving the rest to pay their own way."

A reason the Olympics have been reduced to a joke....
 
mdsh00
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RE: Gymnast Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Tue Aug 24, 2004 12:12 pm

Of course she lost. You can't put someone named "Svetlana" on a Wheaties box.....besides, the US has spend far too much money to let Carly lose now!

Nice one Airplay  Insane
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L-188
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RE: Gymnast Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Tue Aug 24, 2004 12:15 pm

Question:

With all of these accusations of rigging by officials, why are they rigging in favor of the yanks?

Seems with all the hatred of the US in the world today, they would be riggin in the opposite direction
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Continental
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RE: Gymnast Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Tue Aug 24, 2004 12:19 pm

I knew 'skelator' would end up whining and complaining in the end. She sucks, Carly kicked her bony ass.
 
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RE: Gymnast Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Tue Aug 24, 2004 1:42 pm

It's a royal shame that she couldn't have showed even a trace of dignity that her fellow countrymen Alexei Nemov showed today. On the highbar his routine was above and beyond anything that had been done in the competition (5 jumps just to start) and all he did was miss the landing the smallest bit(step back wards I believe).

The judges gave him a 9.6 or something, and after literally about 10 minutes of constant booing from the crowd and complete disagreement from NBC's commentators, the officials (at the urging of higher authority) changed the score to a 9.712(i believe) putting Nemov in position to win a bronze medal. Meanwhile Paul Hamm(who I find to be very talented) put on a show that was not nearly close to what Nemov did, but stuck the landing, got a 9.812 and eventually took silver. Nemov got knocked out of the medal standings.

Alexei Nemov had a routine on the highbar that was way above and beyond what anybody had performed and while absolutely nobody can figure out how he got such a low score(the judges were Canadian and Malaysian if it means anything), Nemov took it with dignity. Knowing full well he had been robbed, Nemov just stood there quietly and eventually he came out and smiled and got the crowd to calm down after about another 10 minutes.

Svetlana Khorkina may claim she got robbed, as did Alexei Nemov. Alexei Nemov though,much more decorated(4 golds,2 silver,6 bronze), took an unfair defeat with the upmost grace and dignity. It's a shame Svetlana couldn't.

blink
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Russophile
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RE: Gymnast Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Tue Aug 24, 2004 3:41 pm

Nemov absolutely nailed that routine, except for the one small step forward at the end.

And this shows that there is something dreadful happening in gymnastics.

He was given a 9.725. Which after the crowd started booing (and rightly so), the score was changed to 9.762. It was the crowd, and the crowd alone, which caused the Canadian and Malaysian judge to change their score.

Also Blink182, Nemov has also come out and said that it does appear that the scoring has been decided in advance, calling his score 'unfair'.
 
An-225
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RE: Gymnast Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Tue Aug 24, 2004 6:38 pm

Well, Nemov definitely deserved a medal; I'd say that the Italian guy deserved his gold, but Nemov definitely deserved a silver medal. As for scores being fixed, I am not sure about that, but Nemov got robbed for sure.

Alex.
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RE: Gymnast Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Tue Aug 24, 2004 7:27 pm

To top it off, I was zapping back & forward between the high bar even and the horse vault - and on the latter, one the gymnasts botched the landing completely (stepped off the matt), yet he still got a score high enough to gain the first position.

And then zapping back to watch Nemov end his routine and make a minor error on landing, and then recieving a very low score, I was dumbfounded.

But cudos to the spectators for not standing up to it (it wasn't just the Russians as far as I could see).
 
KiwiNanday
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RE: Gymnast Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Tue Aug 24, 2004 9:52 pm

...and I thought the Cold War was over!  Insane

Tell me when you guys are done nuking each other.
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skyhawk
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RE: Gymnast Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Tue Aug 24, 2004 9:55 pm

If anyone got robbed in gymnastics, it was most certainly Nemov. BTW he did 6 releases not 5. In my opinion, such as it is, Alexei deserved the gold, not the Italian. Not to be taking anything away from him, the Italian, he did a most excellent routine, but to compare his with Alexei's and the 6 releases well they just don't compare. Of course Hamm was very good too, but not quite as good as the other two. They all took a tiny step on the landing, so I would think you must compare their "air" time and in doing that Nemov seemed to have scored higher.

But back on topic, Svetlana, while nobody will deny that she is an excellent athlete, in this case she gave away her class. She gave away more that one .1's yet expected the judges to forgive her for some reason. She may or may not be retired, but what she accomplished in gymnastics will never go away. Her inventive moves will live on and possibly be improved on.
 
dvk
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RE: Gymnast Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Wed Aug 25, 2004 1:48 am

It's a well documented fact that the officials in the 72 basketball final made an egregious error at the end of the game, putting time back on the clock that should not have been given and setting the Soviets up to take the shot that won them the gold. Everybody, and I mean EVERYBODY, knew it was a completely unlawful call by the officials at the time, and immediate strong protests occurred to no avail. The call was so bad and without basis that it was unquestionably not just an error, and it was clear that the officials were biased in favor of the Soviets.

The IOC was notoriously more favorable toward the Eastern bloc, and still shows such a tendency towards those athletes today. Why? Because in the midst of the hoopla about doping scandals, the IOC has never taken action regarding the most notorious, nationally sponsored, and unethical doping scandal ever, i.e., the East German program of doping the female ahtletes (most notably swimmers), who went from nowhere to a bunch of Arnold Scharzeneggers in 1-2 years and wiped everyone else out at Montreal in 1976. The records were found after the Berlin wall fell, and prove beyond a reasonable doubt what was going on, but the IOC has done nothing. Yeah, it's ancient history, but until it is rectified, and those athletes are officially stripped of their medals in the record books, it undermines the credibility of sanctions against anyone caught doping today.

I'm not dumb. I just have a command of thoroughly useless information.
 
Russophile
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RE: Gymnast Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Wed Aug 25, 2004 2:24 am

Biased or trying to be fair? That is the question.

Were the Soviets entitled to call the timeout? Is it their fault that the buzzer wasn't working? Should they be penalised for this?

In regards to the time being added, this was simply the time from when they attempted to call the timeout. The timekeeper did not start the clock, correct? What would have happened if the Soviets did score, the Americans could have protested, and rightly so, that there was no way of telling if the shot was gotten off before time ran out. So the clock was put back and started again, when the Soviets did score.

True, it may be against the 'rules' -- but if rules are rules, Phelps (the US swimmer) should have been disqualified and stripped of his gold medal in one of his races for touching the lane ropes before the other swimmers had finished their race. The FINA rule book clearly states this. So why wasn't this done? Is it that the officials are biased towards Phelps? Or is it that they want to be fair?

In regards to the East Germans, I agree wholeheartedly. BUT, to revoke those medals would be nearly impossible to do. Sure, there may be documented evidence that doping was a systematic procedure, but proving, 30 years later, precisely IF they were on drugs at the stage of them winning the events, is going to be a hard call.

And why stop there? Why not go back and scrutinise every medal given since 1896? I am sure there are literally hundreds of gold medals being stripped from athletes of all countries.
 
dvk
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RE: Gymnast Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Wed Aug 25, 2004 3:21 am

No, the evidence IS there regarding the East Germans. There is written documentation, and the video footage of the extremely virilzed athletes is further evidence. Whether or not they were actually taking the drugs at the time of the event is irrelevant, or else athletes would not be subject to random drug testing.

The violation of the rules in that basketball game dramatically altered the outcome. If Phelps touched the lane ropes, that didn't change the outcome. There is a major difference there, including any concern about fairness.

You frequently bash others for their supposed lack of objectivity, especially if they happen to be American, Scotty, but your posts for years have shown your lack of objectivity. Deny it all you want, or claim that you're just offering "constructive criticism", "taking the piss", or whatever, but your hatred of virtually all things American, and of most Americans as well, has been made clear repeatedly. Regarding the posters who bait you, you can't expect those you constantly attack to refrain from striking back.

I'm not dumb. I just have a command of thoroughly useless information.
 
Alpha 1
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RE: Gymnast Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Wed Aug 25, 2004 3:58 am

It's a well documented fact that the officials in the 72 basketball final made an egregious error at the end of the game, putting time back on the clock that should not have been given and setting the Soviets up to take the shot that won them the gold.

They played the final 3 second THREE TIMES! Until the Soviets got it right. I'm convinced that it would have gone on as many times as it took the USSR to score a bucket. It was so fixed, that it wasn't funny, so you go sailing down that river, Russophile. If you know anything about that even, there's no way you can't say it wasn't fixed.

And, it's a fact, that in those days, the Soviet Bloc nations, or those who sympathized with the USSR, told their judges to be favorable to Soviet athletes ,and athlestes from that bloc.

IOC has never taken action regarding the most notorious, nationally sponsored, and unethical doping scandal ever, i.e., the East German program of doping the female ahtletes

Ah, yes, the old GDR "she-men". Remember them well.  Big grin

Were the Soviets entitled to call the timeout? Is it their fault that the buzzer wasn't working?

After the Americans hit a free throw, the Soviets immediately inbounded the ball, and didn't score. But then some jackass, not even with the IOC, walks on the floor (where he doesn't belong), and claims the USSR was trying to call time. The idiot refs then let them replay it a second time.

The balls goes in, the USSR doesn't score-don't even get a shot off, so even if the buzzer didn't sound (and I've never heard that before), the clock expired. Then this same jackass not with the IOC wanders on the floor ,and makes another excuse.

Third time, the ball is inbounded. The Soviet center clearly commits a foul with a push-off, grabs the ball, and puts it in. Game over.

Russophile, it was a fix. The greatest fix in the history of the Olympics. It would have gone on until the USSR won. And the Americans did the nation proud by not going to the medals ceremony, to accept a medal that they didn't deserve-the Soviet team should have been standing there, and, in their heart of hearts, to this day, they know it.

but proving, 30 years later, precisely IF they were on drugs at the stage of them winning the events, is going to be a hard call.

A HARD CALL?? All you had to do is look at those mindless GDR she-men, and you KNEW trhey were drugged up! Women don't look like that. It was so obvious even then. It would be an easy call, and they should be stripped of their medals.
 
Tom in NO
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RE: Gymnast Svetlana Khorkina - "I Was Robbed!"

Wed Aug 25, 2004 4:36 am

I don't always agree with Alpha 1, but his post just above (reply 40) should be carved in stone. I, for one, would salute it once a day, and twice on Sundays.

Tom at MSY
"The criminal ineptitude makes you furious"-Bruce Springsteen, after seeing firsthand the damage from Hurricane Katrina

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