mdsh00
Posts: 3968
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For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Tue Oct 26, 2004 6:48 pm

For all the Californians voting next week. Where is a good site that I can look up each of the propositions and the pro/con arguements for it? I registered somewhat late and wont be getting the handbook in the mail. Also, what are some of your thoughts on the propositions?
"Look Lois, the two symbols of the Republican Party: an elephant, and a big fat white guy who is threatened by change."
 
mdsh00
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Joined: Mon May 17, 2004 11:28 am

RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Wed Oct 27, 2004 4:56 am

Anyone? The sample ballot isn't helping.

[Edited 2004-10-26 21:56:34]
"Look Lois, the two symbols of the Republican Party: an elephant, and a big fat white guy who is threatened by change."
 
TechRep
Posts: 1877
Joined: Sun Jan 13, 2002 6:53 am

RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Wed Oct 27, 2004 4:57 am

Anything Superfly, Barbara Boxer and Diane Fienstein are for - runaway from as quickly as possible.

TechRep
 
mdsh00
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Joined: Mon May 17, 2004 11:28 am

RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Wed Oct 27, 2004 4:59 am

Sorry, I'm voting for Boxer and for sure Prop 71. I still don't know much more about the others.
"Look Lois, the two symbols of the Republican Party: an elephant, and a big fat white guy who is threatened by change."
 
WellHung
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RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Wed Oct 27, 2004 7:51 am

 
User avatar
Aaron747
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RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Wed Oct 27, 2004 8:21 am

How in the hell can *anyone* vote for Barbara Boxer? I am completely unable to understand it.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
mdsh00
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Joined: Mon May 17, 2004 11:28 am

RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Wed Oct 27, 2004 9:13 am

Thanks WellHung  Big thumbs up

Aaron,

I'm voting for her because I think shes done a decent job in the past.


What are some of the other Californians' opinons on the propositions and state candidates?
"Look Lois, the two symbols of the Republican Party: an elephant, and a big fat white guy who is threatened by change."
 
dontlikeairbus
Posts: 80
Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2004 3:37 am

RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Wed Oct 27, 2004 12:37 pm

I wish my absentee ballot would come so i can vote yes on prop 66
anyone who believes the three strikes law needs no modifications is in my opinion quite foolish or seriously misunderstands the way the criminal justice system works
 
Superfly
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RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Wed Oct 27, 2004 2:57 pm

Mdsh00:
Maybe I can help.  Smile

Glad to know you're voting Boxer just as I am. She will be getting the first landslide this time around. It's funny I read in the paper that Bill Jones is running around the state calling her liberal and a poll showed that 59% of Californians are happy with her "liberal" beliefs. Bill Jones would be better suited for Alabama.  Laugh out loud


Superfly will be voing:

Kerry/Edwards
Boxer
Lantos
Yee


PROPOSITION 1A-NO

PROPOSITION 59-YES

PROPOSITION 60-NO

PROPOSITION 61-YES

PROPOSITION 60A–NO

PROPOSITION 62–NO

PROPOSITION 63–YES

PROPOSITION 64–NO

PROPOSITION 65–NO POSITION

PROPOSITION 66– YES

PROPOSITION 67–YES

PROPOSITION 68–NO

PROPOSITION 69–NO

PROPOSITION 70–NO

PROPOSITION 71–YES

PROPOSITION 72–YES


I don't feel strongly about any of the issues on the ballot except Prop. 66 and I am glad it's leading in the polls.
I am split on the Indian gambling casinos issues. I am against building new Las Vegas size casinos in neighborhoods, in fact I don't like the idea of them here in California period!
The reason is that they charge for drinks and they are free at the casinos in Nevada. It also makes visiting Las Vegas, Reno and Lake Tahoe more special.
So I am voting NO on Prop 68 but I am also voting NO on Prop 70 which gives the state authority to shake more money from Indian casinos. Leave the Indian casinos alone and let them do there own thing as long as they don't build mega casinos in neighborhoods. Indians/Native Americans have damn near been wiped of the face of the earth. Ahnold wants to nickel and dime every penny they earn. I am sure he is angry that they didn't fund his campaign so they are a easy target for him.

I am against Prop 62 (open primary).
If you don't join the party then you shouldn't complain about the nominee. I don't like the idea of Republicans being able to vote in the Democratic primary and I am sure the Republicans don't like the idea of Superfly being able to vote in there primaries.
Fair enough?

I support stem cell research so I am voting yes on Prop 71.
Bring back the Concorde
 
itsjustme
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RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Wed Oct 27, 2004 9:30 pm

The facts about Proposition 66: It was initially proposed by a millionaire businessman who's son will be released if it passes (reports put dad's investment at roughly $1.5 Million). This proposition is opposed by the Governor, the Attorney General, every District Attorney (58 total), every California law enforcement agency, and several child protection groups and agencies. Close to 27,000 convicted felons stand to be released should the proposition pass. Those who could be released are convicted rapists, murderers, and child molesters.

Vote as you see fit.
 
Superfly
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RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Thu Oct 28, 2004 3:54 am

Itsjustme:
I guess it's just you.  Big grin


Those who could be released are convicted rapists, murderers, and child molesters.

Prop 66 does NOT apply to convicted rapists, murdurers, and child molesters. It applies to those who steal candy bars, potato chips and pizza slices.

Bring back the Concorde
 
Superfly
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RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Tue Nov 02, 2004 10:50 am

So have you made up your mind Mdsh00
Bring back the Concorde
 
Matt D
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RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Tue Nov 02, 2004 11:16 am

It applies to those who steal candy bars, potato chips and pizza slices.

Someone is not, and should not be locked up for 25 to life for stealing a can of Pringles.

What they are being locked up for is the fact that, after three chances, they aren't getting their $hit together and continue to break the law. This is the reason behind Three Strikes and the one thing that many people overlook.

I mean there's a real easy way to not get thrown away for 25 years:

STOP BREAKING THE LAW ASSHOLES

It's no different then getting fired from work for being 5 minutes late.

Did you REALLY get fired for being 5 minutes late?

Of course not. You got fired for showing that you can't show up on time.


[Edited 2004-11-02 03:21:00]
 
Tom in NO
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RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Tue Nov 02, 2004 11:34 am

This ex-Californian wanted to check out the various propositions, but the friggin' voter guide is 168 pages long! Needless to say, my dial-up (not to mention my patience) has issues with a PDF file that size.

Can someone BRIEFLY summarize, or link a page that summarizes the props? Thanks.

Tom at MSY
"The criminal ineptitude makes you furious"-Bruce Springsteen, after seeing firsthand the damage from Hurricane Katrina
 
Superfly
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RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Tue Nov 02, 2004 11:38 am

Tom in NO:
This is all you need.  Smile



http://www.sfbg.com/39/04/cover_clean_slate.html
Bring back the Concorde
 
N771AN
Posts: 411
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RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Tue Nov 02, 2004 11:39 am

Superfly...

I dunno if I want to trust a newspaper with this kind of advertising on its front page.  Wow!

 
Superfly
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RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Tue Nov 02, 2004 11:46 am

N771AN:
What's the big deal?  Confused

The San Francisco Bay Guardian is the most trusted source of news in the SFO area. We bypass the biased corperate Clear Channel news outlets.
Bring back the Concorde
 
Tom in NO
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RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Tue Nov 02, 2004 12:13 pm

Superfly:
Ah, interesting page. Guess it'd be like the times growing when my parents would say to do something, and I'd do the exact opposite. Must be the rebellious streak in me  Big grin.

Tom at MSY
"The criminal ineptitude makes you furious"-Bruce Springsteen, after seeing firsthand the damage from Hurricane Katrina
 
mdsh00
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RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Tue Nov 02, 2004 12:21 pm

So have you made up your mind Mdsh00

That was my plan this weekend but on account of the unforseen events that took place over the weekend (car accident), I didn't get a chance to read up on stuff. I guess I'll be doing that tonight.
"Look Lois, the two symbols of the Republican Party: an elephant, and a big fat white guy who is threatened by change."
 
Tom in NO
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RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Tue Nov 02, 2004 1:15 pm

Ok, I found a prop summary page http://www.smartvoter.org/2004/11/02/ca/state/prop/:

No real opinion on a lot of the props, but some do stick out:

NO on Prop 62: Open primaries suck, we deal with them all the time down here.
YES on Prop 66.
YES on prop 68.
Tough decision on prop 69. I'd probably vote NO until there was a provision to destroy DNA samples and info for cleared individuals.
NO on Prop 70: I'd leave the casino's alone, as well.
YES on prop 71: Bush and I diverge on this one. I'm for research.
Another tough decision on prop 72. I'd likely go YES here, as well.

Superfly, looks we do have a few thoughts in common.

Tom at MSY
"The criminal ineptitude makes you furious"-Bruce Springsteen, after seeing firsthand the damage from Hurricane Katrina
 
solarix
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RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Tue Nov 02, 2004 1:26 pm

It applies to those who steal candy bars, potato chips and pizza slices.

Sorry but if you're stupid enough to steal and get caught, you deserve to be locked up.

At least use some brains if you commit a crime so you don't look like a dumbass when its all over. Americas dumbest criminals. Who cares about them!!
Bong Hits 4 Jesus
 
Superfly
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RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Tue Nov 02, 2004 1:32 pm

Solarix:
No doubt these are some fools we are dealing with. Do you know how much it cost YOU the tax payers to house these prisoners? Do you know how expensive that sort of 'tough talk' cost?
Bring back the Concorde
 
mdsh00
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RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Tue Nov 02, 2004 4:14 pm

Here's what I came up with:

1A: Yes
59: Yes
60: No
60A:No
61: Yes
62: No
63: No
64: Yes
65: Don't know
66: Yes
67: Yes
68: No
69: No
70: No
71: Yes
72: Yes
"Look Lois, the two symbols of the Republican Party: an elephant, and a big fat white guy who is threatened by change."
 
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Aaron747
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RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Tue Nov 02, 2004 4:20 pm

The San Francisco Bay Guardian is the most trusted source of news in the SFO area

Sure, if you're a bottom feeding modskiteer living with lesbian barista roomies on lower divisadero . Here in the 'loin, the real nature of issues are a bit closer to home and demand less biased scrutiny than that provided in the loony left Guardian.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
sean1234
Posts: 401
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RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Wed Nov 03, 2004 3:22 am

For those of you Boxer supporters, she is on the record in the '91 Gulf War to redraw the map for Iraq with Kuwait and leave it at that, even after we passed the "international test." That doesn't go over well with me.

On the 3 strikes MAttD got it:criminals stop committing the crimes. If you are on strike two, and wish to continue breaking the law, move to another state!

 
BN747
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RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Wed Nov 03, 2004 3:38 am

It applies to those who steal candy bars, potato chips and pizza slices.

Someone is not, and should not be locked up for 25 to life for stealing a can of Pringles.

What they are being locked up for is the fact that, after three chances, they aren't getting their $hit together and continue to break the law. This is the reason behind Three Strikes and the one thing that many people overlook.


No not a can of Pringles, MattD... but you dead wrong about the faulty applications of 3-Strikes. The pizza story is very true, it happened with a down and out guy stealing a slice at the Redondo Beach Pier about 7 or 8 years ago and it was applied as his 3rd strike (offense) and he got 25 years to life.

There has been many more egregious applications of that law.. it certainly does need to be reshaped to apply to serious felony charges and nothing less. We don't need to continue clogging up the jails with pots heads or boneheads!

BN747

"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
mdsh00
Posts: 3968
Joined: Mon May 17, 2004 11:28 am

RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Wed Nov 03, 2004 5:11 am

On the 3 strikes MAttD got it:criminals stop committing the crimes. If you are on strike two, and wish to continue breaking the law, move to another state!

Using a friends ID to get into an 18+ or 21+ club also counts as a three strikes penalty and is NOT something to be clogging up our prisons with.
"Look Lois, the two symbols of the Republican Party: an elephant, and a big fat white guy who is threatened by change."
 
Superfly
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Joined: Thu May 11, 2000 8:01 am

RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Wed Nov 03, 2004 6:33 am

Keep in mind, governors Davis AND Arnold signed pay increases for prison guards in our dozens of prisons. In 1990, prison guards were paid at about $15.50 per hour now make about $72,000.00 per year. The only government job to see a pay hike that large within 13 years.
These 'get tough on the criminals' people must think tax dollars grows on trees. They must think everyone is rich to pay for these prisons.
Sound familiar?  Big grin


Prop 69 was another scarry one. I voted NO on that one too.


Aaron747:
Sure, if you're a bottom feeding modskiteer living with lesbian barista roomies on lower divisadero . Here in the 'loin, the real nature of issues are a bit closer to home and demand less biased scrutiny than that provided in the loony left Guardian.


...and Aaron747 shows & tells some new words added to his vocabulary!  Laugh out loud  Smile/happy/getting dizzy
Bring back the Concorde
 
travelin man
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RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Wed Nov 03, 2004 7:10 am

Well, I voted:
Kerry/Edwards
Barbara Boxer

1A: Yes
59: Yes
60: No
60A:No
61: No
62: Yes
63: No
64: Yes
65: No
66: Yes
67: Yes
68: No
69: Yes
70: No
71: Yes
72: No

So, Mdsh00, it looks like we voted pretty much the same. I voted against children's hospitals (yes, I'm a cold-hearted bastard -- actually I think it's too expensive), I voted FOR the open primary (need to get more middle of the road candidates), I voted FOR the DNA database, and I voted AGAINST universal employer-sponsored healthcare.

Lot's of issues this year, but I really hope the Stem Cell Initiative gets passed (Prop 71). And of course I hope Kerry wins.
 
Superfly
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RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Wed Nov 03, 2004 7:15 am

Travelin man:
Glad to hear moderate like you is supporting Kerry and Boxer.  Smokin cool
I wish you voted NO on 69. That is one scarry initiative.

I'll be at Senator Boxer's re'election party tonight here in San Francisco.
Bring back the Concorde
 
sfointern
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RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Wed Nov 03, 2004 7:21 am

My turn!

Federal
President: John F. Kerry
House: Nancy Pelosi
US Senate: Barbara Boxer

California
State Senate: Carole Migden
State Assembly: Mark Leno
1a - yes
59 - yes
60 - yes
60a - no
61 - yes
62 - no
63 - yes
64 - no
65 - no
66 - yes
67 - no
68 - no
69 - no
70 - no
71 - yes
72 - yes

GO KERRY
RARRR!  Pissed

 
travelin man
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Joined: Tue Mar 14, 2000 10:04 am

RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Wed Nov 03, 2004 7:33 am

Superfly --
Yeah, I'm pretty moderate. I just think a DNA database is a good idea, like a fingerprint database.

I'm sure it's not perfect, but few of these initiatives are.

Have fun tonight! I'm a bigger fan of Feinstein, but Boxer really has toned down some of her stridency, and I think California wins by having more senior senators.
 
Superfly
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RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Wed Nov 03, 2004 7:48 am

Travelin man:
Prop 69 is scarry stuff man. Very Orwelian.

SFOintern:
Great to see you chime in!  Big thumbs up
Did you vote for Starchild? Big grin
Bring back the Concorde
 
mdsh00
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Joined: Mon May 17, 2004 11:28 am

RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Wed Nov 03, 2004 4:56 pm

Here's how it looks according to the LA Times:

US Senate:
Barbara Boxer

Props:
1A: Yes
59: Yes
60: Yes
60A: Yes
61: Yes
62: TBA (leaning to No)
63: TBA (leaning yes)
64: Yes
65: No
66: TBA
67: No
68: No
69: Yes
70: No
71: Yes Big grin
72: TBA
"Look Lois, the two symbols of the Republican Party: an elephant, and a big fat white guy who is threatened by change."
 
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Aaron747
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RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Thu Nov 04, 2004 12:02 am

I couldn't vote for Barbara Boxer in good conscience. She did two absolutely unforgivable things during the last term that left me checking the 'US Senate' box on my ballot blank - coming out against gay marriage for POLITICAL motives and voting against a critical spending increase for the US intelligence/security infrastructure.

Great to see passage of 60A, 61, 63, 64, 69 and 71. Even better to see failure of 67 and ridiculous 72. Utterly dismayed at failure of 65 and 66.

Another f*** up in District 11 as Tracy and Manteca area residents have taken their rural/suburban fanaticism to root by reelecting Richard Pombo. No surprises elsewhere.

Nice to see that the BART bond was AGAIN defeated by MORONS in Contra Costa County!!!! What does it TAKE?! See you all in hell in the next earthquake when the system fails and highway 24/4/680 back up into oblivion.

As for San Francisco, well, several things came out exactly as I'd hoped:

Most importantly, measure F failed. Noncitizen voting? No way. Thank god even the modskiteer loony libs were able to see the light.

Second most important, A failed to secure the needed 2/3 majority. Again, nice to see folks in this town know better from past experience than to give blank checks to the redevelopment agency for so-called affordable housing.

nice to see both insidious attempts at increased citywide taxation failed with J and K.

measure B, another waste, thankfully failed. gavin got his way with H - apparently I wasn't the only one fed up with the 'stick getting a new name every five years.

as for the supes - oh dear god.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
EIPremier
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RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Thu Nov 04, 2004 6:01 am

Well, I voted:
Kerry/Edwards
Barbara Boxer

Props:
1A: Yes
59: Yes
60: NO
60A: NO
61: No...good idea but too costly
62: NO...open primaries are an incredibly misguided idea
63: Yes
64: NO
65: (No)
66: Yes
67: NO
68: NO...awful proposition!
69: NO
70: NO
71: Yes
72: NO
 
johnboy
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RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Fri Nov 05, 2004 10:20 am

It's all fading away now, but I do seem to remember voting for Boxer for Senate and good ol' George Miller Jr. for Congress.

Yes on Stem Cell Research (god yes!),

No on DNA database (hello? wouldn't the Patriot Act fascists love to get their hands on that one?)

Yes on Children's Hospitals money (Jamie Lee Curtis in the commercials put it over the top for me, plus Iz music in the background)

Yes on taxing phones for ER's, etc.

No on 9% tax rate for casinos

Yes on 25% tax rate for casinos

Yes on requiring businesses to provide health care coverage

No on open primaries

Hey I voted Yes on making BART seismically safe(r),

and also Yes on Measure J, which would make transportation improvements in Contra Costa County (widening Hiway 4 out to Brentwood and beyond, plus BART to Antioch, and BEST of all.....drilling a fourth bore thru the Caldecott Tunnel on Hiway 24, my own personal pet peeve).
 
Superfly
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Joined: Thu May 11, 2000 8:01 am

RE: For Fellow Californians Re: The Propositions

Mon Nov 08, 2004 7:14 pm

Aaron747:
I voted in favor of the BART bond measure also.

I voted YES on F and I opposed VERY Newsom appointee running for all offices regardless of the office. I was pleased to see Newsom's handpick gal Heather Hiles get a a$$whippin and come in 6th. place after breaking the spending limits on a school board race. I voted for Starchild and 3 of the Bay Guardian endorsments. They all won except Starchild.  Sad

Gavin's machine failed to get any of his favorite candidates on the board of supervisors to rubber stamp his agenda.
McGoldrick, Peskin, Sandoval and Ammiano all will be going back to city hall with newcomer Haaland representing the interest of there constituants and Newsom's corporate allies will have to find another city with a spineless mayor to rape.




I hope the Courts throw out Prop. 69.
Bring back the Concorde

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