rootsair
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Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 5:22 am

I've always wanted to know what women really thought bout that theme. Many a girls including my girlfriend tell me they prefer when a man is circumcised. Others say they are indifferent about it. I was circumcised at 13 and have been satisftied by the operation ever since . I don't feel i lost any sensitivity so don't go around with the sensitivity story when gining your opinion pls. bye

[Edited 2005-02-08 21:23:14]
A man without the knowledge of his past history,culture and origins is like a tree without roots
 
S12PPL
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 5:23 am

I was circumcised at birth....so I dunno what it's like to have foreskin.

I guess I'm happy the way I am Smile
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rootsair
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 5:24 am

Ya i guess most americans are cut. In costa rica its the only positive american influence I can think so. Ever since the US circumcises, costa ricans do as well. Happy about it
A man without the knowledge of his past history,culture and origins is like a tree without roots
 
S12PPL
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 5:27 am

Well I'm Jewish...We have to get it done Big grin lol.

But seriously, most Jewish boys are circumcised at birth. It is easier to "clean" myself in the shower, as I don't have to pull it back and all that stuff. Don't ask how I know this, but one of my friends growing up wasn't circumcised, and he didn't really care all that much, he just hates the extra time spent in the shower cleaning the thing.
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ScarletHarlot
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 5:28 am

I'm a girl, and it wouldn't affect my opinion of a man. I don't think it's necessary and I wouldn't snip 'n' clip any son I might have.
But that was when I ruled the world
 
Logan22L
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 6:13 am

 Pissed  Pissed  Pissed  Pissed

Signed,

TWFirst
"The deeper you go, the higher you fly. The higher you fly, the deeper you go."
 
S12PPL
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 6:18 am

What's that about TWFirst?? You are angry about circumcision?
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AeroWesty
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 6:30 am

Mitzi: I never heard Trumpet play.

Bernadette: Play? He didn't *play*, dear. Trumpet didn't have a single musical bone in his body. No, Trumpet had an unusually large foreskin. So large that he could wrap the entire thing around a Monte Carlo biscuit.


Dammit, now I'm gonna have to watch Priscilla tonight.  Smile
International Homo of Mystery
 
LifelinerOne
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 6:46 am

In The Netherlands, most girls would find it strange to see a man circumcised, as we keep our for-skins and only get them removed for religious or medical reasons.

Cheers!
Only Those Who Sleep Don't Make Mistakes
 
MD11Engineer
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 6:50 am

Well, I got clipped for medical reasons at the age of 12, and no woman I´ve been with has been complainingabout my performance so far. It might have given me more "staying power"...  Big thumbs up  Smokin cool
Else, what Lifeliner said for the Netherlands also applies to Germany.

Jan
Je Suis Charlie et je suis Ahmet aussi
 
rootsair
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 7:26 am

You know with the weight of foreskins one might say that :

1) An alitalia flight on a 777flight from FCO to HEL with 222 passengers on board is more heavy than a
2) Continental flight on a 777 from EWR to Tel aviv with 222 passengers


if all have about the same constitution ......its the fact that on flight no 2 is a greater chance to find more circumcised men


in tialy and finland its a rareity

A man without the knowledge of his past history,culture and origins is like a tree without roots
 
emiratesa345
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 7:34 am

If you're looking for a woman's opinion, Concordeboy will provide it.

Seriously though, I think you're asking on the wrong website as the amount of women here is limited.

"he just hates the extra time spent in the shower cleaning the thing."

...because it takes an extra hour to get it clean. Come on, let's be serious here. What can it possibly take? An extra 5 seconds?

Mark
You and I were meant to fly, Air Canada!
 
TACAA320
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 7:40 am

"Ya i guess most americans are cut. In costa rica its the only positive american influence I can think so. Ever since the US circumcises, costa ricans do as well. Happy about it"

RootsAir

Don't be so sure about it. It was that way here in Costa Rica, but not in the last 15 years. They do it today "by request only".

I laugh a lot with some Jewish friends [men and women] specially in the Sabbath, [I'm Catholic but don't have any problem participating with them each single Friday night] when we talk about many different topics, and they suppose that I'm circumcised but they don't know that for sure, because I simply don't accept or deny it.

Some things are better to "keep it confidential" at certain point.

'Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind'. Albert Einstein
 
TACAA320
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 7:47 am

'Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind'. Albert Einstein
 
vaporlock
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 8:03 am

Well, I'm a woman and it doesn't matter to me whether or not a guy has a hard top or a convertable......performance is what counts!!!  Big thumbs up

Phyllis  Wink/being sarcastic
 
JOSEMEX
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 8:18 am


>http://www.cirp.org/library/procedure/plastibell/<

Oooouuuch!!!!

How any grown up can choose to have it done is beyond me!

FWIW, when I tried to pass my med to go into flightschool, I was asked by the (female) doctor if I was circumcised. Wonder what that's got to do with flying.
 
vneplus5
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 9:02 am

Thanks for the link TACAA320.

What a barbaric and disgusting thing to do to a baby. I can't stand to watch the video. The pictures are bad enough.

he just hates the extra time spent in the shower cleaning the thing.

So would he get his ears cut off too if it saved him an extra 20 seconds every day?

I am so thankful that my parents gave me the choice - very happy to keep it, thanks! I've never resented the 10 seconds it takes to wash in the shower every day, I've always kept it clean, and no woman has ever complained about it tasting strange when she's reciprocating a favour.
 
aa61hvy
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 9:20 am

Looks like that baby needs a drink..

Shit I'm glad my parents had it done when I was as young as that little guy in the pictures.
Go big or go home
 
FlyVirgin744
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 9:23 am

The fact that you had it done at 13 doesn't really say much since I'm sure you weren't truly using it  Big grin

Some people consider it mutilation of the body, but while I see where they are coming from, I respectfully disagree. I feel that our parents make many decisions for us while we are growing up, and we are who we are based on them. So whats another decision on extra skin around your p.p.
Sometimes I go about in pity for myself and all the while a great wind carries me across the sky.
 
ConcordeBoy
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 10:19 am

If you're looking for a woman's opinion, Concordeboy will provide it.

...somehow the thought of you attempting to belittle me is, well, laughable at best  Laugh out loud






Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
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alberchico
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 10:21 am

I makes me last longer in bed and more sensitive!!!!!!
short summary of every jewish holiday: they tried to kill us ,we won , lets eat !
 
jcs17
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 10:36 am

I was circumcised at 13 and have been satisftied by the operation ever since .

Aghhh! I couldn't imagine going through THAT operation when you're thirteen. I'm glad I got it over with after I was born.

As for the foreskin topic itself, one of my ex-girlfriends told me if she wanted to see the penis of an animal she'd watch the Discovery Channel--she didn't want the Discovery Channel coming alive in bed.
America's chickens are coming home to rooooost!
 
DeskPilot
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 11:03 am

Common is Australia until recent years. So I'm clipped, but my son isn't.

Can't see the point, not with proper hygiene, etc. Probably unnecessary.
By the way, is there anyone on board who knows how to fly a plane?
 
airplay
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 11:39 am

I was circumcised at 13 and have been satisftied by the operation ever since . I don't feel i lost any sensitivity so don't go around with the sensitivity story when gining your opinion pls. bye

Uh...and just what "sensitivity" were you able to experiment with between birth and 13 years old? Men with intact foreskins typically cannot stand to have the foreskin rolled back with their underwear on because the head of the penis is too sensitive. Wouldn't it then be reasonable to assume circumcised males experience less sensitivity?


 
JAGflyer
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 11:51 am

I was circumsised after 8 days of life as I am of the Jewish faith. I personally do not have a problem and I don't notice any problems. It is much cleaner and easy to clean. Uncut guys have to worry about cleaning the crap under the foreskin. People who say "It reduces sexual pleasure" need to learn there is more to life and a relationship than having a slightly better climax point.
Support the beer and soda can industry, your recycle old airplanes!
 
cptkrell
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 12:22 pm

First noticing the thread title, I though this would be about female circumcision, which, IMO, is truely barbaric.

Very young males (considering a "normal" development) can't compare c-vs.non/c, because they are either or neither, and not being mature enough to experience both, opinions are probably moot. Ladie's choice, or course, is a different deal. Besides a preference of aesthetics, and slightly varied physical manipulations, I haven't heard from women a serious and profound like or dislike, however.

Female circumcision, on the other hand, erases the possibility of an important bodily function for the entire life of the recipient. Well, sort of. If she never experienced the big bang to begin with, she won't miss it, no? Still a travesty, though. And much more important. Regards...Jack

all best; jack
 
TWFirst
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 12:24 pm

It is barbaric, and a physical mutilation of a baby. If one wants to be circumcised later in life when one has the ability to know what one is doing and make a conscious decision to permanently alter ones own body, then so be it.

That said... I too was once of the "So what.. I don't remember it and I like my penis as is" crowd until my ex and I had conversations about it, and I realized what a ridiculous violation it is. Using the rationale I see above, one can make the argument that our armpits should be scalped and/or our appendix removed and/or our tonsils removed and/or our toenails removed at birth.... after all, all of the aforementioned are either not necessary (as far as we know) or we're "cleaner" without them.

Circumcision is nothing more than a silly religious ritual gone mad.

And the comment: "People who say it reduces sexual pleasure need to learn there is more to life and a relationship than having a slightly better climax point." is illogical and offensive. Using that logic, there's nothing wrong with slicing off clitorises. THINK about it.

So, nature just provides extra foreskin for no reason... just to be removed at birth and for hospitals and doctors to make more money... I DON'T THINK SO.
An unexamined life isn't worth living.
 
ConcordeBoy
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 12:56 pm

So, nature just provides extra foreskin for no reason

Nature also provides unlimited nail growth and pit-funk for a reason.... should we cease clipping/covering those as well?  Nuts
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
TACAA320
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 2:28 pm

http://www.sexuallymutilatedchild.org/33.htm

Caution: Be careful when open please! I'm serious!
'Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind'. Albert Einstein
 
Airlinerfreak
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 2:35 pm

Well being Jewish I also had it done at birth. I do not want to know what it really feels like though, thank god it was done at birth.

TWFirst,
I think it should be done at Birth so you dont feel the wrath of a knife on the more sensitive area. I am sure a lot of men could agree. For one you dont feel it at birth and also it is something that keeps you healty, does it not?
 
TACAA320
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 2:47 pm

"Thanks for the link TACAA320"

You're very welcome Vneplus5!
'Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind'. Albert Einstein
 
cptkrell
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 2:59 pm

Wow, TACA; I'm glad I don't look like any of those!

TWFirst wrote, in part: "Circumcision is nothing more than a silly religious ritual gone mad."

Mmmm...silly; perhaps. Ritual; definately. Gone mad; how so? Always been around. AND, I gather that it's LESS popular than in the past. Wonder what the percentage of circumcised males really give a shit, if they are having fun, procreating, and getting statues sculpted in their likeness (unless, of course, they are too bored to make the dude work and want to spend all their extra time suing mom and dad). Conversely, circumcising the clitoris totally erases sex-pleasure in the female. Regards...Jack



all best; jack
 
TACAA320
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 3:05 pm

"Wow, TACA; I'm glad I don't look like any of those!"

That's great. Otherwise you'll need Plastic Surgery [just kidding].

'Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind'. Albert Einstein
 
LH423
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 4:30 pm

For one you dont feel it at birth and also it is something that keeps you healty, does it not?

The health issue is no longer a valid reason for circumcision. With todays advancements in personal hygiene there is no reason that a person cannot keep himself clean to prevent the problems that men have had when being "uncut" in the past.

The real reasons why circumcision became popular outside of the Jewish and Islamic faiths is that in Victorian England and the USA masturbation was seen as such a sin that to try and prevent boys from trying to tug the tiger they would circumcise them as a way to lessen sexual feeling and arousal and to make it harder to get the job done. Any one will tell you it's much easier to jerk off when you're uncut. To try and further push the idea they used medical reasons to try and get people to circumcise their boys. And back in those days, they made sense. With lack of proper hygiene the build-up of germs and smegma under the foreskin could cause serious problems for males back in the day. Today, at least in places where regular hygiene is practised, the medical reasons have been debunked.

Really, now I think it's just a way for doctors to squeeze a little extra money out of people. For that, the NHS in the UK no longer pay for circumcision and for that circumcision is a bit of a status ritual. As most people won't bother to pay out of pocket for their child to be circumcised those that can afford it will sometimes have it done. Silly, but I've heard this to be true.

LH423
« On ne voit bien qu'avec le cœur. L'essentiel est invisible pour les yeux » Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
 
TACAA320
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 10:48 pm

Pls pay attention to the last sentence...

"What is a circumcision?
Circumcision means cutting off the foreskin or ring of tissue that covers the head of the penis. If you decide to have your newborn son circumcised, it is usually done the day he goes home from the hospital.

Fewer children in the U.S. are being circumcised now than several years ago. In 1979, 90% of American males were circumcised compared to 60% now.

The following information should help you decide what is best for your son.

What are the cultural aspects of circumcision?
Followers of the Jewish and Moslem faiths perform circumcision for religious reasons. Nonreligious circumcision became popular in English-speaking countries between 1920 and 1950. At this time it was thought that circumcision might help prevent sexually transmitted diseases. Circumcision never became a common practice in Asia, South America, Central America, or most of Europe. Over 80% of the males in the world are not circumcised.

What is the purpose of the foreskin?
The foreskin on the penis is not some cosmic error. The foreskin:

protects the glans (top of the penis) against urine, feces, and other types of irritation
protects against infection or scarring of the urinary opening (although this is rare)
protects the sensitivity of the glans.
What are the pros of circumcision?
Some of the reasons you may want to circumcise are:

Protects against urinary tract infections (UTIs) during the first year of life. However, UTIs are rare and easily treated.
Prevents infections under the foreskin. It also prevents persistent tight foreskin. Both of these problems are rare and are usually due to pulling back the foreskin too often or too hard.
Decreases the risk of getting some sexually transmitted diseases (STDs) later in life. However, it does not completely prevent any STD.
Lowers the risk of cancer of the penis. However, good hygiene offers equal protection against this very rare cancer.
Keeps your son's appearance "like other boys" or "like his father." Boys may not mind looking different from other males in their family. However, they do mind being harassed in the locker room or shower about their foreskin. This could happen if most of their buddies are circumcised. It can be emotionally painful to be a trailblazer about the appearance of one's genitals.
All in all, nonreligious circumcision is mainly cosmetic surgery.

What are the cons of circumcision?
Some of the reasons not to circumcise include:

Surgical complications. Problems that may occur are skin or bloodstream infections, bleeding, gangrene, scarring, and various surgical accidents. A recent study showed that 1 of every 500 circumcised newborns suffered a serious side effect.
Pain. The procedure causes pain. However, the doctor can use some anesthetic around the area to block some of the pain.
Cost. The cost of circumcision is about $100 per procedure in the U.S. You may have to pay for the procedure yourself because many medical insurance companies do not cover the costs of this procedure.
You must decide quickly. Delaying the decision also carries a risk. If you initially decide not to have your son circumcised, and then change your mind after your son is 2 months old, the procedure will require a general anesthesia. So try to make your final decision during the first month of life.
Recommendations
Circumcision of boys for religious purposes will continue. The need to circumcise other boys is open to question. Just because a father was circumcised doesn't mean that the son needs to be circumcised. Because the foreskin comes as standard equipment, you might consider leaving it intact, unless your son will be going to a school where everyone else is likely to be circumcised. The risks and benefits are both too small to swing the vote either way. This is a parental decision, not a medical decision."
'Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind'. Albert Einstein
 
MD11Engineer
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Wed Feb 09, 2005 11:33 pm

Ok, when I was about 11 -12 , my foreskin got too tight (Phimosis) and I couldn´t pull it back anymore without pain, no way to clean beneath it, which lead to inflamations. The cure was a circumsition under sterile conditions IN A HOSPITAL OPERATING THEATRE, under full anaesthesia. I´m the only person in my family who is circumsised.
I might have lost some sensitivity, but I think it gives me more endurance when making love, something most women wouldn´t complain about.

Jan
Je Suis Charlie et je suis Ahmet aussi
 
ConcordeBoy
Posts: 16852
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Thu Feb 10, 2005 2:48 am

M11Eng.

Since you've had the rather rare perspective of seeing both sides... should you have a son, what would your choice be?
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
MD11Engineer
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Thu Feb 10, 2005 2:54 am

Unless it was a medical condition (see above), I´d leave him to his own decision.

Jan
Je Suis Charlie et je suis Ahmet aussi
 
iakobos
Posts: 3255
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Thu Feb 10, 2005 3:03 am

After reading Jan's post, I have decided to keep it a little bit longer (the foreskin)
but will consider removing it if and when endurance will become a subject for critic.
Thanks.
 
Logan22L
Posts: 4464
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Thu Feb 10, 2005 3:12 am

Hey Jan: You had your turtleneck sweater removed in a theatre?

Logan
"The deeper you go, the higher you fly. The higher you fly, the deeper you go."
 
TWFirst
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Thu Feb 10, 2005 3:13 am

>.Nature also provides unlimited nail growth and pit-funk for a reason.... should we cease clipping/covering those as well?<<

Come now ConcordeBoy... you're smarter than that. Not a valid comparison AT ALL. Clipping/not clipping nails and/or applying or not applying deoderant are not permanent, non-reversable, body-altering procedures.
An unexamined life isn't worth living.
 
ConcordeBoy
Posts: 16852
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Thu Feb 10, 2005 3:59 am

are not permanent, non-reversable, body-altering procedures

...nor is circumcision, just that not practically no one CARES enough to reverse it.
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
TACAA320
Posts: 7153
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RE: Women And Circumcision

Thu Feb 10, 2005 4:02 am

So, It's reversable...

" It may have taken him a year but Paul Russo got his foreskin back.

The 31-year-old technical support representative for a Boulder, Colo. software company has been working since November 1995 to restore the flap of skin removed when he was circumcised as a newborn.

And he's got pictures to prove it. Just check out his site on the World Wide Web. Russo is one of a small but growing number of circumcised men, both in the United States and abroad, who have elected to restore their foreskins - at home and for the most part, without the help of a doctor.

"I'm far from over, but I'm very happy with it," said Russo, who anticipates spending another year to 1 1/2 years to complete the process.

The improbable - some would say unspeakable - procedure is virtually unheard of outside medical circles, but it has its advocates. And while nobody can say for sure how many men are currently "restoring" the numbers of men looking for information, both in print and on the Internet, is growing, Russo said.

Most men give two reasons for their decision. The first is that they are trying to regain - often with a fair degree of anger - something taken from them without their consent.

"It's my body and I should have a say in it," Russo said. "They didn't bother to ask me and they didn't bother to use an anesthetic."

The second reason men give is their restoration of the skin over the head of the penis restores a large amount of sensation, making for greater sexual pleasure.

According to Marilyn Milos, a San Anselmo, Calif. registered nurse who runs NOCIRC, the National Organization of Circumcision Information Resource Centers, men who restore say the increased sensation is comparable to "the difference between seeing in black and white and seeing in color."

The restoration process is time-consuming and generally takes anywhere from a year to five years of nearly continuous attention and care. In most men the entire process takes from one to two years. There are number of methods used including the following.

Taping the existing shaft skin with surgical tape and stretching it as far as possible over the head of the penis. This tape is worn virtually all day and night and is seldom removed.
Wrapping a ring of tape snugly around the bunched skin of the shaft, stretching it farther.

Using a weight or tension device that pulls the skin even farther.

Another method uses a length of tape connected to a suspender clipped onto a sock, around a belt or over a shoulder. Most device sell for around $100.00, and can be mail-ordered.

All of the men interviewed for this story said the single hazard in "restoration" lies in pulling the skin too forecfully or with too much weight.

"If you are doing something that's painful you're doing it wrong," said R. Wayne Griffiths, 63, a retired engineer construction inspector in Concord, Calif. Griffiths began restoring in 1987.

"If you're doing the restoration properly then you're aware of your body and you're not going to do damage to it. - it works just fine," Griffiths said.

In 1989, Griffith, a father of five with 13 grandchildren, co-founded NORM, the National Organization of Restoring Men, a support group that helps men get information about restoration.

Griffiths, who began restoring his foreskin after becoming dissatisfied with his diminishing sensation, said he saw results in just a few weeks.

"At that point, I said, `I'm never going to stop restoring,' because the pleasure was just too wonderful for me."

Griffiths said the glans is now "delightfully sensitive to the touch." He added, "The glans is an internal organ just like the tongue. Circumcision denudes the glans."

Griffiths, who spent 10 years restoring is satisfied with the results. "I've fooled doctors he said with a laugh.

Milos, like others in the so-called "restoration movement," said the urge to bring back one's foreskin shouldn't be scoffed at.

"If a woman has a mastectomy, no one thinks it's odd or peculiar that she would want to have a prothesis. But if men want to restore their bodies to the way that they were born, people find it peculiar. It's not peculiar," she said.

Milos pointed out that skin stretching techniques are used regularly in other areas of medicine besides breast reconstruction, such as skin restoration in burn victims.

Dr. Dean Edell, a San Francisco-based general surgeon and host of a popular radio show on medical issues agreed.

"It can work. You definitely stretch skin voluntarily all over the body. We do it in medicine all the time," he said. "Its not so strange for men to want to restore something that was removed against their will. Frankly, I think body piercing is weirder.

He added, if this was women, everyone on every street corner would know about it."

Edell, who has hosted his show and syndicated television new health feature for 17 years, said he's "flooded with mail" every time he mentions foreskin restoration.

He admitted that the procedure, which is not endorsed by the American Urological Association, suffers because of a lack of scientific studies.

"It is not ideal, with no controls, no real studies - and yet, you know if you're doing it wrong you're going to get pain, you're going to get bleeding. So in a sense it's self regulating."

E. Douglas Whitehead, a New York urologist and the director of the Association for Male Sexual Dysfunction, said there's "tremendous resistance" to the practice from his colleagues.

"I don't think you'd find one urologist out of 100 that would begin to get involved in this," he said, adding that he supports men who take up restoring their foreskins, even if most doctors blanche at the idea.

"They don't understand the anguish," Whitehead said. "You're not doing this for a medical reason per se, you're doing this for an emotional and psychological reason."

Babies have been circumcised as part of religious rituals for thousands of years; including those of the ancient Jews and Egyptians. Circumcision also is practiced by Muslims, usually anytime from a boy's birth through age 14. It also serves as an adolescent rite of passage in various cultures. The traditional Jewish bris or religious circumcision, takes place on the eight day of a boy's life.

In the United States, medical circumcision became popular around 100 years ago. Studies showing that the procedure prevents penile cancer, some sexually transmitted diseases and cervical cancer in the female partners of men have made circumcision almost universal in the United States and many other western countries in the past half-century.

Recently, however the practice has come under serious scrutiny. Some studies maintain that the medical benefits of circumcision are not as apparent as previously thought.

An October 1995 study of babies born in 1990 and 1991, which was published in the Journal of Family Practice, found that 85 percent of male babies in four states studied had been circumcised at the time of their birth, and that parents who were covered by heath insurance were 2.5 times more likely to allow the procedure than uninsured parents.

The study continued, "Although circumcision is the most commonly performed surgical procedure in the United States, there is no clear evidence for routinely performing it on newborn male infants."

As of 1994, the circumcision rate was at 60% nationwide down from 85% in the 1980s.

In England, circumcision rates dropped from about 85 percent to near zero in the 1950s, after the National Health Service stopped covering the procedure.

The textbook of the foreskin restoration movement is The Joy of Uncircumcising! a 200-page how to guide first published in 1992, authored by Jim Bigelow, a former evangelical minister, who like Milos, lives in San Anselmo, Calif.

Bigelow pointed out that men have restored their foreskins for a number of more serious reasons than the merely cosmetic or sensual, including painful erections and tearing or bleeding during intercourse. For his part, Bigelow recommends that men work with their doctors while restoring - if they can get the doctor to support their decision.

Tim Hammond, another restoration movement leader and founder of the San Francisco-based NO HARM, the National Organization to Halt the Abuse and Routine Mutilation of Males, said the group has collected about 500 "harm documentation forms" of men who have written describing the injuries that they've suffered as a result of being circumcised. He said those injuries include meningitis, infections and hemorrhages as well as the more common loss of sensation.

People have said, `Get a life,' but my response is, `Get a clue.' There are some very serious consequences to this. Losing the most erogenous part of your genitals is a serious issue," he said.

It's difficult to say how many men have restored their foreskins or are currently undergoing the procedure, but Bigelow's book has gone through two editions and sold nearly 10,000 copies. NORM has a mailing list of more than 3,000 men and operates about a dozen groups in the United States, with another dozen world wide.

Russo recently said he's getting 200 "hits" or people logging on to his Web site every day. As of last week, more than 11,000 people had found Russo's site in the past six months.

I'm getting a lot of really good, positive response," he said of his "restoration journal," a year-long illustrated account of his efforts to bring his foreskin back. "The phones ringing off the hook its crazy."

And the slow process of restoration may soon be a thing of the past.

Whitehead, the New York urologist, is developing a tissue expander for foreskin restoration that could cut the time required for the procedure down to a matter of months.

Placed under the skin, the device - essentially a balloon similar to those use for breast augmentation - could produce enough skin for complete foreskin recovery within three to six months. Whitehead expects to begin testing the device next month. "
'Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind'. Albert Einstein
 
LifelinerOne
Posts: 1497
Joined: Tue Nov 25, 2003 10:30 pm

RE: Women And Circumcision

Thu Feb 10, 2005 4:15 am

Endurance isn't a matter of the for-skin.... It's all between the ears, in your mind!

It's all about controlling yourself... Big grin

Now, think about that!

Cheers!
Only Those Who Sleep Don't Make Mistakes
 
TWFirst
Posts: 5752
Joined: Wed Apr 19, 2000 5:30 am

RE: Women And Circumcision

Thu Feb 10, 2005 4:17 am

My ex tried the "taping" foreskin restoration process for several months... it was stupid and impractical.

Women could also theoretically sew a skin graft back on at the point of their severed clit... doesn't negate the point that having a doctor remove a portion of a baby's body at birth is mutilation. Nature intended there to be extra skin covering the glans.
An unexamined life isn't worth living.
 
rootsair
Posts: 4012
Joined: Sun Feb 06, 2005 3:25 am

RE: Women And Circumcision

Thu Feb 10, 2005 6:21 am

You guys are all so stupid looking at those anti circumcision websites. They are clearly against the operation in a very biased way

Check out this website

http://www.circlist.com

You'll see circumcision in another way . Iam a medicine student and I have to ay its not a lawyer like TACA that will contradict me. If i was circumcised at birth then I would have niot had to go trhough taht operation so late...trust me it was painfuil....but it was definitely worth it I have to find pics in my urology book to show you all the bad things that a foreskin can do ....
A man without the knowledge of his past history,culture and origins is like a tree without roots
 
TACAA320
Posts: 7153
Joined: Fri Aug 06, 2004 3:03 am

RE: Women And Circumcision

Thu Feb 10, 2005 10:58 am

"Iam a medicine student and I have to ay its not a lawyer like TACA that will contradict me."

I'll never ever has the intention of contradict you. Believe me.

If I offend you in any way, please accept my apologies.
'Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind'. Albert Einstein
 
TACAA320
Posts: 7153
Joined: Fri Aug 06, 2004 3:03 am

RE: Women And Circumcision

Thu Feb 10, 2005 11:33 am

"Your son will have a dressing on that may stay in place for up to four days. The doctor will ask you to apply bacitracin to the tip of the penis several times per day. Depending on your child’s age he should avoid straddling toys and similar activities. More specific instructions will be given at the time of your office visit.

Are There Any Problems That Can Happen After Circumcision?

Problems after circumcision are very rare. However, call your pediatrician right away if:

Your baby doesn’t urinate normally within 4 to 6 hours after the circumcision.
There is persistent bleeding.
There is redness around the tip of the penis that seems to be getting worse after 3 to 5 days.
It is normal to have a little yellow discharge or coating around the tip of the penis, but this should not last longer than a week.



Circumcision- Pros And Cons

Most boys in the United States today are circumcised, however, it is far less common worldwide.

Many parents choose to have their sons circumcised because "all the other men in the family were circumcised" or because they don’t want their sons to feel "different." If you choose not to have your son circumcised, you may notice as he gets older that his penis looks different than some of the other boys. If your son seems concerned about this, you may need to talk to him about why he is not circumcised.

Reasons Many Parents Choose Circumcision

Research studies suggest that there are some good medical why your son should be circumcised. These include:

Circumcision lowers your son’s chances of getting a urinary tract infection (UTI) in the first year of life.
Although a rare condition, cancer of the penis is essentially eliminated in circumcised males.
Research shows that males who are circumcised have a slightly lower risk of getting sexually transmitted diseases (STDs).
Circumcision eliminates foreskin infection that occur at the peak ages of 3 to 5 years.
Circumcision prevents phimosis, a narrow opening that makes it impossible to retract the foreskin at a later age.
Genital hygiene, which is particularly important in unsanitary conditions, may be easier after circumcision.
Reasons Many Parents Choose Not To Circumcise

There are also good reasons why parents choose NOT to have their son circumcised. Circumcision may be more risky if done later in life. Parents should try to make a decision about circumcision before or soon after their son is born and not wait until later.

As with all kinds of surgery, circumcision has some risks. Although uncommon, complication such as local infection and bleeding can occur as a result of the circumcision. On rare occasions, the foreskin may be cut too short or too long, or circumcision may heal improperly. Since many parents see circumcision as a cosmetic procedure, they choose not to have their son exposed to these risks.

Many view the foreskin as an important part of the human body that is necessary for the protection of the penis. If the foreskin is removed, the exposed end of the penis may become irritated and cause the opening of the penis to become too small. This may cause difficulty in urination and may need to be surgically corrected.

Many also believe that the removal of the foreskin can desensitize the tip of the penis, causing a decrease in sexual pleasure later in life.

Almost all uncircumcised Boys can be taught proper hygiene that can lower their chances of getting infections, cancer of the penis, and sexually transmitted diseases.

Is Circumcision Painful?

Some parents worry about their child feeling pain. Infants who are circumcised without pain medicine (anesthesia) will feel some pain. They may have an increased heart rate and blood pressure. These symptoms usually disappear within 24 hours. They may also cry loudly, however, they usually calm down shortly after the surgery. A local anesthetic can be injected to produce a penile nerve block and has been shown to lower pain and stress in infants. Also helpful are having the infant suck on a sugar solution and using topical anesthetic ointments. Talk to your pediatrician about the availability of pain medicine and if it is appropriate for you son. Problems with using pain medicine are rare and usually not serious.

What If I Choose Not To Have My Son Circumcised?

If you choose not to have your son circumcised, talk to your pediatrician about the proper way to keep your son’s penis clean. This is important in order to avoid infection. When your son is old enough, he can learn how to keep his penis clean just as he will learn how to keep other parts of his body clean.

The foreskin is easy to care for and the uncircumcised penis is easy to keep clean. The foreskin usually does not fully retract for several years and should never be forced. Gently washing the genital area while bathing is sufficient. Later, when the foreskin is fully retractable, boys should be taught the importance of washing underneath the foreskin every day to remove the smegma (a white cheese) like substance that is found under the foreskin. See the American Academy of Pediatrics (AAP) brochure Newborns: Care of the Uncircumcised Penis for more detailed information on how to care for your son’s uncircumcised penis. Contact your pediatrician if you notice any signs of infection such as redness, swelling, or foul-smelling drainage.

Circumcision is often done for religious , social, and cultural reasons. The Academy suggests parents talk to their pediatrician about circumcision and make a decision after looking at all the facts.

Female Circumcision

Female genital mutilation, sometimes referred to as female circumcision, is a common practice in many cultures. It involves the removal of part or all of a female’s clitoris. Sometimes the opening of the vagina is sewn almost completely shut. It is often done without any pain medicine. The purpose of this practice is to prove that a female is a virgin before she gets married, reduce her ability to experience sexual pleasure after marriage, and promote martial fidelity. There are several serious side effects, including:

Pelvic and urinary tract infections
Negative effect on self-esteem and sexuality
Interference with a female’s ability to have a normal vaginal delivery"
'Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind'. Albert Einstein
 
TACAA320
Posts: 7153
Joined: Fri Aug 06, 2004 3:03 am

RE: Women And Circumcision

Thu Feb 10, 2005 12:46 pm

"You guys are all so stupid looking at those anti circumcision websites."

"You'll see circumcision in another way . Iam[sic] a medicine student and I have to ay its not a lawyer like TACA that will contradict me. If i[sic] was circumcised at birth then I would have niot[sic] had to go trhough[sic] taht[sic] operation so late...trust me it was painfuil[sic]....but it was definitely worth it I have to find pics[sic] in my urology book to show you all the bad things that a foreskin can do ....

Do you really think that was necessary? To called everybody "stupid" in here?
If I posted such links, I'm the only responsible for that. It's not necessary to blame [or insult] anybody else but myself...

Try to be more polite next time! It's worth it!



[Edited 2005-02-10 04:51:07]

[Edited 2005-02-10 04:51:51]
'Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind'. Albert Einstein

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