BN747
Topic Author
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Guns This Week...

Tue Mar 15, 2005 3:32 pm

I can only shake my head (at the stupidity) at where this trend the last four days has yielded....

First, the church member who was supposed to end this Sunday's service with a closing prayer.. he closed it alright he took out 7 other parisheners with him!

2) Then 4year old kid was in a spat with his 2 year-old brother... goes and gets a gun from his moms' purse (for her protection) and blast his kid brother right in the head with it...

3) Last night, 3 thugs pulled a planned armed-home invasion in Beverly Hills.... but BHPD snagged all three... I'm sure the owners had guns on the premise... but it obvioulsy did them no good whatsoever.


4) Then there's the Atlanta douche (and you can't blame him for taking advantage of the primo situation EVERY criminal only dreams of--being escorted by a lone 50 year old ARMED female deputy--UNCUFFED!!!)

And saving the best for last...

The dumbass who was shot by his cat...

Apparently the gun was on a counter while a Michigan man was cooking and his cat knocked it off and IT went off--wounding the owner...


Only in America...

But we can't worry about that ... Yellow Alert says Al-Quaida has it's eyes on some 10,000 unguarded/minimally guarded airfieds with tons of private planes... but they failed to tell us what to do if a private plane is commandeered and headed for us... I guess the message is 'get ready to get scared'..all over again...


BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
ANCFlyer
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RE: Guns This Week...

Tue Mar 15, 2005 3:43 pm

Quoting BN747 (Thread starter):
but it obvioulsy did them no good whatsoever.

And they won't if they are unloaded and sitting in the closet.

Quoting BN747 (Thread starter):
The dumbass who was shot by his cat...

Yup, pretty damn funny . . . the cat knocks the gun to the floor and bang, guy get shot by his cat.  bouncy 

Quoting BN747 (Thread starter):
Then 4year old kid was in a spat with his 2 year-old brother... goes and gets a gun from his moms' purse (for her protection) and blast his kid brother right in the head with it...

STUPID Mother! I can't say it any plainer than that, STUPID! Too bad there's not a few questions on the background check to account for intelligence of the proposed gun owner in situations like this (criminals don't have background checks you know).
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
L-188
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RE: Guns This Week...

Tue Mar 15, 2005 4:12 pm

You know what the common demoninator is...they where all wearing pants!

Clearly a ban on pants needs to be enforced. Particularly on military or police style fatigues. They have no real use in polite society.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
DC10GUY
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RE: Guns This Week...

Tue Mar 15, 2005 4:43 pm

Excellent thread BN747, What amazes me is that its almost becoming "no big deal" anymore. Just another gun nut mass murder. Someday maybe all guns & ammo will be banned. But hey, until then we can only expect more of the same.
Next time try the old "dirty Sanchez" She'll love it !!!
 
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aerorobnz
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RE: Guns This Week...

Tue Mar 15, 2005 6:43 pm

Natural Selection is at work again in it's inimitable way. Not even stricter gun laws would have done a bloody thing. There is a way to get around almost anything - criminals and idiots know that and continue to plunder the naive, complacent and vulnerable and abuse the rights of others to get themselves ahead- unfortunately an inherently human characteristic that will never be disposed of.

We all have to make the best of the situation at hand, not the idealist hypothetical situations that we all harbor. And the best, as much as it pains me to say it, is what we have at present.  dopey 

Quoting BN747 (Thread starter):
Yellow Alert says Al-Quaida has it's eyes on some 10,000 unguarded/minimally guarded airfields with tons of private planes... but they failed to tell us what to do if a private plane is commandeered and headed for us... I guess the message is 'get ready to get scared'..all over again...

If the Government has something to hold over everyone's heads they can far more easily manipulate them for their own means with the use of fear, it's a tried and true tactic that has been used for many centuries since empires like Rome first used it. It's nothing less than can be expected by the amoral bastards that hold the power in the US currently.
Flown to 120 Airports in 44 Countries on 73 Operators. Visited 55 Countries and counting. Wanderlust is like Syphilis, once you have the itch it's too late for treatment.
 
BN747
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RE: Guns This Week...

Tue Mar 15, 2005 7:11 pm

This has got to be most educated rationale thus far...

Quoting L-188 (Reply 2):
You know what the common demoninator is...they where all wearing pants!

Clearly a ban on pants needs to be enforced. Particularly on military or police style fatigues. They have no real use in polite society.

You can tell this character is purely at ease and perhaps (and eerily) comfortable with these types of occurences. To him... it's another day of someones' cat being stuck up in a tree.

Okay, seriously for the rest...

Rob my man.... I hate to disagree... to an extent anyway.

Quoting Aerorobnz (Reply 4):
Natural Selection is at work again in it's inimitable way. Not even stricter gun laws would have done a bloody thing.

I agree with Natural Selection theory... but giving it a HUGE hand in the process is more than it can ask for.

1) Church guy could not have inflicted so much carnage with knife a machete...? Maybe, but not likely singlehandedly, the diff. being... you don't have to 'chase' people with a gun....

2) The 4 year-old could have gotten a knife and stabbed his brother instead of his moms handgun....clearly the gun option simplified his intent.

3) The Atlanta killer-hard to say... this is clearly a fault of the Atlanta Sheriffs Dept (or whomever the jailers are). It's unheard of a male inmate being escort 'uncuffed' by a lone female deputy/guard or anything... this is just outright bizarre...

4) The '3-thug Home Invasion Gone Wrong'... clearly guns make this crime much more easier to facilitate. The criminals biggest error..selecting a target in Beverly Hills-- good for the payday, awful for logistic getaway...BH is not readily freeway accessible and given it's small boundaries and plentiful policing....someone clearly didn't do their home work!

5) and now 'The Killer Cat'... a knife just probably would have put a hole thru his toe instead of his torso....

BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
CaptOveur
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 12:34 am

Quoting BN747 (Reply 5):
You can tell this character is purely at ease and perhaps (and eerily) comfortable with these types of occurences.

L-188 is just a realist who knows that it isn't the guns fault some moron misused it or some irresponsible dimwit left a loaded gun in their purse where a kid got his hands on it.

Quoting BN747 (Reply 5):
this is clearly a fault of the Atlanta Sheriffs Dept (or whomever the jailers are). It's unheard of a male inmate being escort 'uncuffed' by a lone female deputy/guard or anything... this is just outright bizarre...

And this is the fault of a gun how?

Quoting BN747 (Reply 5):
The 4 year-old could have gotten a knife and stabbed his brother instead of his moms handgun....clearly the gun option simplified his intent.

And by what logic is the gun to blame?

Quoting BN747 (Reply 5):
you don't have to 'chase' people with a gun....

Sometimes you do. It depends on how good of a shot you are, and how fast they can run. You don't really have to chase the slow ones.

Banning the guns is not the answer. I am sure the criminals who use guns every day would give them up willingly if they found them to be illegal one day.

Is the weather nice in your dream world BN747?
Things were better when it was two guys in a dorm room.
 
BN747
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 4:56 am

Quoting Captoveur (Reply 6):
And by what logic is the gun to blame?

If you have to ask.... read no further, your thought process can't afford the answer.

Quoting Captoveur (Reply 6):
And by what logic is the gun to blame?

Quoting BN747 (Reply 5):
you don't have to 'chase' people with a gun....
Sometimes you do. It depends on how good of a shot you are, and how fast they can run. You don't really have to chase the slow ones.

You're a 'Capt' in just what exactly???

StatOuevr... take 3 steps back and put down the remote! You surely are the warped by-product of one having watched too much television.

When some kills someone with a car 9.99 times out of 10, that is an accident. Even when it is done with intent, the car is then made a weapon to carry out a premeditated act.

Above, every single case is the perfect example of a gun being employed to complete a deadly task. The weapon facilitates the crime-- it makes it TOO DAMN easy to follow through (with. or without intent). Killing someone SHOULD be hard.The fault falls squarely on the weapon even if the user is cerebrally deficient! So for the vapid responses of ....

'Well cars kill people, we don't ban them..'

'They all wore pants,let's ban them...' (not the girl who claimed (Sunday) she was attempting to save her dad--now it turns out she tried to off him..'

What's more astonishing is how the guns nuts have an enormous tolerance for this kind of stupidity. Is there no end to what you people will except.. it seems there isn't. Your replies of 'well that's the way it is..' 'the gun didn't do anything' -- you can't possibly be that stupid-- how could the crime/incident have occured without it? It might not be a bad idea to seperate you people from the rest of us who find these stupid killings rather appalling. You guys are a danger to yourselves-- the problem is you just don't know it yet!

Quoting Captoveur (Reply 6):
L-188 is just a realist who knows that it isn't the guns fault some moron misused it or some irresponsible dimwit left a loaded gun in their purse where a kid got his hands on it. Is the weather nice in your dream world BN747?

One thing's for certain, you and L-188 belong together in that same gloomy, dreary 'someone-might-get-me-so I'd-better-be-on-the-lookout' mentally challenged world...

....my world says 'it doesn't have to be this way-- YOURS says 'why the hell not'... I'll take my rather pleasant one oveur YOURS anyday of the week/month/year!

BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
daedaeg
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 5:45 am

As I stated in a previous thread, there needs to be greater investment into non-lethal weapontry. If a non-lethal gun can disable someone without having to kill them, why not use it? Just think how many lives can be saved. Fewer little girls getting shot accidently from a drive-by, fewer boys accidently shooting their siblings, fewer judges getting shot by mad men, fewer teens shooting their schoolmates for fun. I really think the gun industry needs to look into making better non-lethal weapons. They could probably make even more money as more people would purchase these sorts of weapons.
Everyday you're alive is a good day.
 
CaptOveur
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 7:40 am

Quoting BN747 (Reply 7):
When some kills someone with a car 9.99 times out of 10, that is an accident. Even when it is done with intent, the car is then made a weapon to carry out a premeditated act.

And of the hundreds of thousands of rounds of ammunition I have sent downrange not one of them has contacted a human. My gun is probably less dangerous than a car using your reasoning. How many times when a gun is discharged by an ignoramous and the bullet hits someone is that an accident? Probably most of the time.

Quoting BN747 (Reply 7):
You're a 'Capt' in just what exactly?

I thought this was a website for airplane enthusiasts.. do some thinking and get back to me, you are the one that lives in hollywood. I'll give you a hint. "ever seen a grown man naked?"

Quoting BN747 (Reply 7):
Killing someone SHOULD be hard.

I have fired some guns with a pretty heavy trigger pull.. it wasn't easy to blow that watermelon in half.

Quoting BN747 (Reply 7):
how could the crime/incident have occured without it?

You act like making it illegal will make all the guns magically dissapear.

Quoting BN747 (Reply 7):
someone-might-get-me-so I'd-better-be-on-the-lookout' mentally challenged world

Where do I give any indication my guns are for personal defense? Mine are locked away and unloaded. I enjoy shooting them periodically, but I mostly just own them to piss off people like you who think I shouldn't be allowed to own them. I also go out and buy ultra-violent video games just to piss off the people who want to blame the games for killings. The funny thing is, I have the video games that are supposed to train me to kill people, and I have the means of doing so.. Yet I haven't killed one single person yet.. Go figure.

Quoting Daedaeg (Reply 8):
As I stated in a previous thread, there needs to be greater investment into non-lethal weapontry. If a non-lethal gun can disable someone without having to kill them, why not use it?

Just try to buy non-lethal ammo. I tried once and the people treated me like I was Osama bin-laden himself when I tried to buy a box of 12 gauge bean bags.
Things were better when it was two guys in a dorm room.
 
tbar220
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 8:01 am

Quoting Aerorobnz (Reply 4):
Natural Selection is at work again in it's inimitable way.

How insulting. Say that to the seven dead church members in Wisconsin.
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aa757first
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 8:05 am

Quoting Martel Lovelace, NRA:

"A gun is a recreational tool, like a golf club or tennis racket.
You can kill someone with a golf club, you know."



Quote:
"Expecting a carjacker or rapist or drug pusher to care that his possession or use of a gun is unlawful is like expecting a terrorist to care that his car bomb is taking up two parking spaces."



Quoting United States Constitution, Amendment II:
"the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

AAndrew
 
jpetekyxmd80
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 8:08 am

Quoting BN747 (Thread starter):
First, the church member who was supposed to end this Sunday's service with a closing prayer.. he closed it alright he took out 7 other parisheners with him!

Ok, this one hits especially close to home beacuse, well it is. The Sheraton Hotel where this took place is a few miles down the street here in Brookfield. A victim went to my old middle school. The killer worked at GE Healthcare a mile away. These last few days have been extrememly sad, eerie, and alarming. It is surreal seeing your nice Milwaukee suburb as a massacre headline on the BBC. These last few months have been an extreme wake up call to gun violence for me here in my area. It's one thing to see stuff on the news, but entirely different in your community and to people you know. A few months ago my elementary school teacher's daughter was murdered in a robbery while working at Arbys.

I just don't know what to think, and realize why I have heard this from so many people in the last few days: "whats this world coming to?"

More on the shooting:
http://www.themilwaukeechannel.com/news/4285703/detail.html
The Best Care in the Air, 1984-2009
 
aloges
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 8:17 am

Quoting Aa757first (Reply 11):
United States Constitution, Amendment II:
"the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

So every gun owner in the US is part of a "well regulated militia" and him owning a gun is "necessary to the security of a free state"? Following that logic, some of you are implying that the man who killed those seven people during the service defended the security of the United States of America. From religious zealots or what? Interesting, isn't it?
I think you're taking the second amendment way out of context to defend your little-boy yearnings for guns. If it was my constitution, I'd feel offended.

By the way, that shooting is a George Carlin dream come true: "Some nut will go fuckin' apeshit in a church, and they'll refer to him as a 'Disgruntled Worshipper'."

Edit: I'm sure that Mr. Martel Lovelace can show me the tennis racket and the golf club that can be used to kill a dozen people over a fifty foot distance in less than a minute? After all, if guns are just the same as tennis rackets and the golf clubs, there has to be a way to commit mass murder with them.

Bottom line: If the NRA wasn't so full of lying hypocrites, maybe it'd be worth listening to them.

[Edited 2005-03-16 00:26:32]
Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.
 
L-188
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 8:22 am

Quoting Aloges (Reply 13):
So every gun owner in the US is part of a "well regulated militia" and him owning a gun is "necessary to the security of a free state"?

Actually that is quite correct. Every American has an obligation to defend the homeland. Akin, say to the French Resistance in WWII.

A lot of people try to claim that the militia that the amendment referes to is the National Guard but there had to be specific expections made in US law at the start of the 20th century to authorize their creation. It was not mandated by the 2nd amendment.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
aloges
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 8:28 am

Nice job of taking my lines out of context, L-188. It's what you do with the 2nd Amendment, why not continue with my post, right? You know that "all gun owners" includes those idiots mentioned in the opening post of this thread; do you really think these people owning guns makes your country safer?
Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.
 
L-188
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 8:32 am

How did I take your words out of context?

You took a viewpoint that I do not agree with and I simply corrected your error.

Quoting Aloges (Reply 15):
do you really think these people owning guns makes your country safer?

No but it doesn't make the country less safe. Every gun bill that becomes law and fails to stop gun violence and gun crime proves that.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
MaverickM11
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 8:35 am

"I can only shake my head (at the stupidity) at where this trend the last four days has yielded...."

I'm not sure what your point is. Are you trying to use all gun examples to show that guns kill, or that stupidity kills? I can wholeheartedly agree with
the latter. All you've managed to prove is that stupid people and guns don't mix. That's not the gun's fault. Stupid people and ladders don't mix either, and in spite of many ladder-related deaths through misuse, there's no march to ban the ladder.

"Then 4year old kid was in a spat with his 2 year-old brother... goes and gets a gun from his moms' purse (for her protection) and blast his kid brother right in the head with it..."

How many children drowned in open water during the same time? I bet you it was at least double. Time for a ban on pools yet?

"I'm sure the owners had guns on the premise... but it obvioulsy did them no good whatsoever.
"

Just like every other assumption made on airliners.net, there's a 99% chance you're wrong.
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
aloges
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 8:48 am

Quoting L-188 (Reply 16):
You took a viewpoint that I do not agree with and I simply corrected your error.

A viewpoint that you don't agree with is erroneous? Is that really what you said?

Quoting L-188 (Reply 16):
No but it doesn't make the country less safe.

Really? Well, I think a schmuck without a gun is less dangerous than one threatening me with his Magnum. But that seems to be an erroneous viewpoint, if I get you right.

Quoting L-188 (Reply 16):
Every gun bill that becomes law and fails to stop gun violence and gun crime proves that.

Make that "every gun bill that isn't enforced properly". After all, the generations of your parents and grandparents managed to keep African-Americans in the back of the bus for decades, why would yours fail to take away some people's guns?

disclaimer: bus example used for reasons of comparability
Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.
 
L-188
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 8:55 am

Quoting Aloges (Reply 18):
A viewpoint that you don't agree with is erroneous? Is that really what you said?

Ok I admit that was a bit harsh, sorry about that. but I don't agree with your position on this, and will challenge you.

Quoting Aloges (Reply 18):
Well, I think a schmuck without a gun is less dangerous than one threatening me with his Magnum

The whole point is that guns don't cause crime, people do. And eliminating the former is not going to effect the latter....so why do it?

Crime is caused by society, not objects.

Quoting Aloges (Reply 18):
Make that "every gun bill that isn't enforced properly

You know what groups screams the loudest about the fact that gun laws are not enforced....The National Rifle Association. If you can't or aren't willing to enforce exisiting laws, why create new ones. They take a position that if the nation used the ones that exist, they could clamp down on a lot of problems, and some police districts that have done this have had good results.

Lets do that first.

Quoting Aloges (Reply 18):
After all, the generations of your parents and grandparents managed to keep African-Americans in the back of the bus for decades

Sorry, the back of the bus wasn't big in Wisconsin and Alberta, or Germany, if you want to go back 2 generation in my family.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
jpetekyxmd80
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 8:58 am

Quoting L-188 (Reply 19):
Crime is caused by society, not objects.

Having a revolver in your possession when you flip doesnt help!!!!!!!!

Its a 2 way street.
The Best Care in the Air, 1984-2009
 
daedaeg
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 9:02 am

Guns are like mini-WMD's. They don't keep any of us safe. I believe guns should be restricted to law enforcement. Our society is not responsible enough to have them.
Everyday you're alive is a good day.
 
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aerorobnz
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 9:03 am

Quoting BN747 (Reply 5):
but giving it a HUGE hand in the process is more than it can ask for.

Granted, but Humans have accelerated the whole Evolution process to begin with, and that doesn't happen without obvious side effects, in this case an increased natural selection process to combat the rapid advancements we have made. We as a species haven't overcome the natural rules of life, but we have just developed them to an extent we influence the process, as much as we are influenced by it.

Quoting Tbar220 (Reply 10):
Say that to the seven dead church members in Wisconsin.

I can't, they're dead. Unfortunately they were in the wrong place at the wrong time, they could have been any one of us and the point I was trying to illustrate is no matter what you do, and how you do it there is always gonna be something that causes serious harm to someone, and you just have to hope it isn't you or your loved ones this time around.

The newest trend is to go into a hold up with blood in a hypodermic needle and threaten them by saying the blood contains AIDS, but you sure as anything can't make needles illegal.

Since we became human, and probably before that we have come up with new and interesting ways of killing each other - It's the way our species works, and
has played a big part in our continued survival. As long as we have imaginations and sadistic minds we will have new weapons to inflict pain with, so whether you ban Guns will not change the number of people being injured/killed. Besides if you are prepared to kill, you are prepared to ignore laws, so having a gun wouldn't be an issue, even if they were illegal/restricted.

I would love to have a society with no guns, but it ain't gonna happen. In this case it is better to make do with what we have to work with, and try to spot most of the wackos during psychiatric testing for licensing before they get the opportunity to cause major damage. Inevitably though, we are not perfect and there will always be some that slip through the gaps.
Flown to 120 Airports in 44 Countries on 73 Operators. Visited 55 Countries and counting. Wanderlust is like Syphilis, once you have the itch it's too late for treatment.
 
aloges
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 9:07 am

Quoting L-188 (Reply 19):
Ok I admit that was a bit harsh, sorry about that. but I don't agree with your position on this, and will challenge you.

OK, all's fine with that.

Quoting L-188 (Reply 19):
The whole point is that guns don't cause crime, people do. And eliminating the former is not going to effect the latter....so why do it?

Crime is caused by society, not objects.

Old point, but still valid. You're basically right, but people without guns can't shoot others as easily as people with guns can. If there were one or two shootings in the US every year, I'd be as silent as Concorde is nowadays.

The thing is that the US has a gun problem unlike any other "First World" country. One step to take care of that is gun control, which does not mean I'm in favour of taking away everyone's guns. I just want people to recognise the responsibility owning a gun takes, and the best way to make them realise it is to challenge their right to own guns.

Quoting L-188 (Reply 19):
Lets do that first.

Amen. It'd be nice to see if that could solve the problems.
Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.
 
ANCFlyer
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 10:38 am

Yet another stupid, inane, same shit different day, US gun ban thread started and/or perpetuated by the same A-Net members who can't see the forest for the trees and argued by the same a-net members (L-188, Oeuver, ANCFlyer) who possess the sense enough to know a gun ban would be fruitless: The church members would still be dead, the cat would probably have still shot his owner, the 4 year old would likely have popped his little brother anyway, and some rich SOB would still have been robbed in Beverly Hills.

Like I said in the other thread, good thing is we got another gun ban thread out of the way, unfortunately, there will soon be another one.

Can't you folk get more creative - come up with somethnig else to ban, like sharp objects in the UK perhaps?
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
L-188
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 10:44 am

Quoting Daedaeg (Reply 21):
I believe guns should be restricted to law enforcement.

Wouldn't have stopped what happened in Atlanta this last week. The bailiff would no doubt be considered a "Law Enforcement Officer" in this context
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
BN747
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 11:32 am

Quoting CaptOveur (Reply 9):
And of the hundreds of thousands of rounds of ammunition I have sent downrange not one of them has contacted a human. My gun is probably less dangerous than a car using your reasoning. How many times when a gun is discharged by an ignoramous and the bullet hits someone is that an accident? Probably most of the time.

Quoting BN747 (Reply 7):
You're a 'Capt' in just what exactly?
I thought this was a website for airplane enthusiasts.. do some thinking and get back to me, you are the one that lives in hollywood. I'll give you a hint. "ever seen a grown man naked?"

Quoting BN747 (Reply 7):
Killing someone SHOULD be hard.
I have fired some guns with a pretty heavy trigger pull.. it wasn't easy to blow that watermelon in half.

Quoting BN747 (Reply 7):
how could the crime/incident have occured without it?
You act like making it illegal will make all the guns magically dissapear.

Quoting BN747 (Reply 7):
someone-might-get-me-so I'd-better-be-on-the-lookout' mentally challenged world
Where do I give any indication my guns are for personal defense? Mine are locked away and unloaded. I enjoy shooting them periodically, but I mostly just own them to piss off people like you who think I shouldn't be allowed to own them. I also go out and buy ultra-violent video games just to piss off the people who want to blame the games for killings. The funny thing is, I have the video games that are supposed to train me to kill people, and I have the means of doing so.. Yet I haven't killed one single person yet.. Go figure.


Whoa... StartOvuer that's a sh*tload of guilt and self-explanation coming from someone who hasn't been remotedly accused of a gun crime! Who said this was about 'YOU'???? All that's above is 'I... I.. I.. I ...I... me...me..me..me.. no here is anyone saying youy're careless or has done anything....

....how many bodies are buried under your house??? Go figure....

Mav11... not only do you understand what my point is... you don't even have a clue about your own. Ban swimmings pools-- for you perhaps, also toss in pretzels and banana peels for the sake your safety!

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 24):
Yet another stupid, inane, same shit different day, US gun ban thread started and/or perpetuated by the same A-Net members who can't see the forest for the trees and argued by the same a-net members (L-188, Ouevr, ANCFlyer) who possess the sense enough to know a gun ban would be fruitless:

You forgot to throw the 'I'm a cop in here again....' so far it's about every ten post and you're due any minute. The problem with the nihilistic approach you take re:this matter (esp. as a law enforcement officer) and endorse your A.net pals attitudes ...is akin to telling the fat guy what kind of crap is in that Six Dollar Carls Jr. Burger he's about to cram down his gullet... and he's nods and says 'I know...' and keeps chompiing away. The point is you guys can offer no solution nor defense whatsoever-- none... to address this problem.

All you guys have done in this and the other 10 'anti-gun threads' is say 'Yeah, that's bad...' or 'they were stupid...' as if they're gonna stop making stupid people. It's either that or go run behind the 'right to bear arms'... as if that's a solution.

A near Columbine was averted today in Bellflower/Fullerton (LA satellite community).... good job cops! But had it occured, it's probably a safe bet that you guys would have invoked the same 'canned responses' shown above.... 'gee that's awful... but we have a right to bear arms...' Just how much of this can you guys stomach??? I don't know what jpetekYXMD80's position was on this before it hit his community... but I'm bothered by the fact that it did. I don't believe right now he's thinking 'I need to go out and get a gun so I can be 'safer' next time at church.... Or according to you--should he?

I just hope you 'gun nut guys' don't have to ever endure what he's going thru now... because if you do....I don't think shooting a watermelon will be the same for you ever again...

BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
ANCFlyer
Posts: 21391
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 11:33 am

Quoting Daedaeg (Reply 21):
They don't keep any of us safe. I believe guns should be restricted to law enforcement.

And another post borne out of ignorance.

What part of "Criminals will have them anyway" don't you (and a couple thousand others) seem to understand?!?!?

Wake up out there!
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
jpetekyxmd80
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 11:53 am

Quoting BN747 (Reply 26):
I don't know what jpetekYXMD80's position was on this before it hit his community...

Always been for extensive regulations on firearms and anti-NRA- For their agenda, and their abusive use of political power and influence. These views are certainly re-affirmed.
The Best Care in the Air, 1984-2009
 
L-188
Posts: 29881
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 11:58 am

Quoting JpetekYXMD80 (Reply 28):
Always been for extensive regulations on firearms and anti-NRA- For their agenda, and their abusive use of political power and influence. These views are certainly re-affirmed.

I too wish that the NRA would get back to their original goals of education and promotion. However the Sarah Brady's of the world prevent that from happening so they have to spend a lot of resources protecting our rights.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
daedaeg
Posts: 627
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 12:11 pm

L-188 and ANCFlyer, why in the world do you two people who live in the wilderness a.k.a Alaska even need a gun? Is Smokey the Bear gonna attack you? Come on now.

What part of "Criminals will have them anyway" don't you (and a couple thousand others) seem to understand?!?!?

Oh so let's just throw in the towel folks. Let's pretend that there is nothing that can be done. Let's continue to produce these deadly machines anyway. Why? Well because the criminals already got them anyway. Look if the UK, Japan, Australia, and many other countries can reduce gun violence by limiting guns, so can the US. As long as there are inner city communities being terrorized by these lethal weapons, you won't get my support for them.
Everyday you're alive is a good day.
 
ANCFlyer
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 12:15 pm

Quoting Daedaeg (Reply 30):
L-188 and ANCFlyer, why in the world do you two people who live in the wilderness a.k.a Alaska even need a gun? Is Smokey the Bear gonna attack you? Come on now.

Ha Ha Ha - more ignorance . . . .

As for the rest of your post - it's like a broken record - same shit over and over . . . .

Geez, I can't believe I'm even responding - again - to this sort of drivel.
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
L-188
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 12:19 pm

Quoting Daedaeg (Reply 30):
ook if the UK, Japan, Australia, and many other countries can reduce gun violence by limiting guns

Some guy in England just got Be-headed, and the prohibition of guns didn't stop it.

Quoting Daedaeg (Reply 30):
why in the world do you two people who live in the wilderness a.k.a Alaska even need a gun?

I am not going to speak to ANCflyer, but I used to live in a place where I had to hunt and fish for dinner. It didn't come shrink wrapped in plastic on a styrofoam plate.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
BN747
Topic Author
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 2:29 pm

Quoting L-188 (Reply 32):
Some guy in England just got Be-headed, and the prohibition of guns didn't stop it.

....great analogy.. but more holes than a spaghetti strainer....

Permit me to loan you a few brain cells....

If 10 people were beheaded (plus one by a cat....) in the span of 4-5 days... do you seriously think everyone would be sitting on their laurels and not taking notice today??? Iraq doesn't even see that many beheadings in a day!


BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
MaverickM11
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 2:36 pm

"Mav11... not only do you understand what my point is..."

What's your point then?

When you say "I can only shake my head (at the stupidity) at where this trend the last four days has yielded...." one can assume that your point is that stupidity is to blame.
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
MD-90
Posts: 7835
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 2:58 pm

Every American male between the ages of about 17 and 50 is a member of the citizen militia. They ought to have access to all personal weapons that the modern American soldier has: fully automatic rifles (although single-shot MBR are much more practical), Stinger missiles, and unguided rockets. "To protect the nation from all enemies, foreign AND DOMESTIC."

The whole point of the 2nd Ammendment is that the citizen soldiers not in the military will vastly outnumber the government's troops. Helps prevent tyranny, you know. Aside from some very wise founding fathers, there's no reason why what has happened in Germany, Russia, and China couldn't happen here.

Quoting Daedaeg (Reply 30):
UK, Japan, Australia, and many other countries can reduce gun violence by limiting guns, so can the US.

Too bad that statement is blatantly false. Gun crime in the UK and Australia has gone up, and the Japanese populace has been disarmed throughout history, and their homogenous culture is really not comparable to Western nations such as the USA or UK.
 
jamesag96
Posts: 2007
Joined: Sat Dec 01, 2001 2:59 am

RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 3:11 pm

Ban all axes...


Filler filler filler
Why Kate, You're not wearing a bustle. How lewd.
 
N228UA
Posts: 109
Joined: Wed May 26, 2004 1:34 pm

RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 3:13 pm

Quoting MD-90 (Reply 35):
Too bad that statement is blatantly false. Gun crime in the UK and Australia has gone up, and the Japanese populace has been disarmed throughout history, and their homogenous culture is really not comparable to Western nations such as the USA or UK.

Gun crime has gone up in Australia because the state governments aren't willing to spend money on the police force. Banning guns does not lower crime, it just forces people to look for other methods to kill people.

An American person once said to me "An unarmed person deserves to die" Based on this theory I don't deserve to live because I have do not and never will own a gun. Where is the freedom and liberty that Americans preach in that statement?
 
L-188
Posts: 29881
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 3:42 pm

Quoting Jamesag96 (Reply 36):
Ban all axes...

No just require registration of full length single bit axes.

Double bit axes should be under stricter rules, including fingerprinting and local law enforcement approval.

Easily hiden short handle hatchets and camp axes need to be banned, there is no room for them in society.

Quoting MD-90 (Reply 35):
They ought to have access to all personal weapons that the modern American soldier has: fully automatic rifles

At this point I think it is worthwhile to note in Switzerland every male is a member of the militia and is issued a weapon by the state, along with ammo.

This is the one point where I think that people who want the draft may have a point. It is hard to argue we didn't have a more diciplined and generally better society in 1973 when the draft ended. Maybe having that large percentage of the population go through military training did some good.

I am not in favor of bringing back the draft period, but I see where that arguement comes from.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
ANCFlyer
Posts: 21391
Joined: Mon Nov 15, 2004 3:51 pm

RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 3:46 pm

Quoting BN747 (Reply 26):
The point is you guys can offer no solution nor defense whatsoever-- none... to address this problem.

Your only solution is to toss out the standard issue Ban Gun Bullshit every time someone gets shot . . .

Your posts are boring and laughable on this issue. I look forward to the day when you can come up with something original.

Responsible gun owners aren't the problem. Irresponsible gun owners, and illegal gun owners are. The sooner you realize this, the sooner we can get rid of this weekly "Ban Gun" thread bullshit on A-net . . .
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
BN747
Topic Author
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 9:56 pm

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 39):
Your posts are boring and laughable on this issue. I look forward to the day when you can come up with something original

wow... you caught me off guard... I expected the standard

'waste of bandwith' retort.

Very disturbing as one so close to this issue that you of all people see a repeated discussion of this very subject as "bullshit" your position of ‘leave as it is’ only invites more of it… anti-gun discussion at least attempts try a new way or seeks an answer, you and people like you are appallingly content with the status quo. When I saw the news report (last week) of the cops watching a nightclub burn in Texas – and they had fun sending messages over their dashboard computers reading ‘burn baby burn… and hey if the need more gasoline, I can spare a few gallons….’ I gotta admit, I was thinking what kind of cops still in this day and age engage in such arrogant, careless irresponsibility and the answer that came to mind was ‘…the type who has minimal regard to property and distant lives’ not their own. And we know these guys aren’t last…

It's boring because it's something don't want lend thought to... if it's different from your point of view... it's not worth entertaining. Whats' even scarier still is this... as law enforcement person who's mainstay is constantly in the world of 'the negative' (...sure there are some light-hearted moments and days), your dismissive and accepting attitude reflects a callousness that's going to do nothing but petrify as you age (in fact it seems you're past the point of no return). So I ask which is more powerful... the gun or a badge (and the responsibility that comes with each)? Anyone can get a gun... but not many people can get that badge--well actually that depends on where you apply. But the point is if the badge bears enormous authority vs the guns' 'just sign here on the dotted line...' There's a big problem there.... HUGE! Still laughing....or bored? Now let me tie this in with L-188's militia approach...

Quoting L-188 (Reply 38):
At this point I think it is worthwhile to note in Switzerland every male is a member of the militia and is issued a weapon by the state, along with ammo.

That works in an isolated homogenous society... if Israel was in the Alps there'd be less violence there as well... the US is now irreversibly immersed in a deeply diversed social arrangement.... crime elements are emerging from aspects law enforcement can't begin to comprehend. A one-size-fits-all law enforcement approach is finding that it cannot fully function when investigating crimes among cultural arenas it's unfamiliar with... say the Turkish or Hmong mob (example only) .. the locals 'in fear' will be reluctant to cooperate with a law enforcement body it's unfamiliar with... criminals of various cultural persuasions know this.. and know exactly how to exploit it! They know the cops will through up their arms and a say 'fcuk this!' and the locals will continue to cower in fear.

As for the citizenry being on guard against a tyrannical gov't... you guys who are dreaming out this scenario are wasting some serious 'dream time'... it'll never happen! And if it did... you've already lost it before it could ever get started. The US gov't would unleash some shit you've never dreamed of... and it would render your AR-15s and 12 gauges into a pea-shooters! If you think your gun collection can matchup against the high-tech weaponry (known and unknown).. odds are you'd get a date with Julia Roberts before you get that matchup... or even have chance if it got that far...

Let's just say for the sake of argument it did... there's no organization among the rank and file on any level... whites, blacks, arabs, latinos, asians of diff. persuasions would be blasting each other apart on mere suspicions -- they're already flooding police dispatchers with 'terrorist suspicious behavior' calls.... and no one's really up to anything! So imagine all bets off and everyone packin' (armed) and you're on your own.....anarchy. One things for certain...the gov't will make sure that it's (meaning it's bureacracy) will be the last man standing..

So your 'arms' to protect yourself as 'a militia' holds no water whatsoever! As for protecting Americas' shores... HA! That's gone high-tech too... but if you want a crack at it....go for the Arizona Vigilante Border gangs... that's as close as you'll get to assisting in 'protecting our borders'!

Quoting MD-90 (Reply 35):
Quoting Daedaeg (Reply 30):
UK, Japan, Australia, and many other countries can reduce gun violence by limiting guns, so can the US.

Too bad that statement is blatantly false. Gun crime in the UK and Australia has gone up, and the Japanese populace has been disarmed throughout history, and their homogenous culture is really not comparable to Western nations such as the USA or UK.

No MD90.... you are blantantly false....Daedaeg has it correct! It would do you well to get out of Mississippi a little more often.... what did UK gun crimes do jump from 39 to 49??? Australia from 65 to 75??? Are you high??? We're sure to breach 12,000 this year for sure! Japan, more textbook-travel wisdom huh? .... go there first and get back to us after your visit! (the thought of MD90 in Tokyo just caused me to split my spleen!)


BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
ANCFlyer
Posts: 21391
Joined: Mon Nov 15, 2004 3:51 pm

RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 10:04 pm

Quoting BN747 (Reply 40):
'waste of bandwith' retort.

Morning, you've gotten me confused with someone else, because I have never used the "waste of bandwidth" line - I simply call it bullshit.

Your short story of Texas cops is heart breaking . . . if it's true, they need to be disciplined. That's bullshit too.

Quoting BN747 (Reply 40):
your dismissive and accepting attitude reflects a callousness that's going to do nothing but petrify as you age (in fact it seems you're past the point of no return).

As I mentioned, provide something new besides your normal drivel and I'll consider it. Until you and the other anti-gun widgets figure out that ouot-lawing weapons is the only way to ensure that only outlaws will have them, then we've nothing else to discuss. You're wasting my time, and everyone elses, "and bandwidth too"  Smile

Quoting BN747 (Reply 40):
So I ask which is more powerful... the gun or a badge (and the responsibility that comes with each)?

The answer is simple - but might be above your comprehension . . . the answer the person behind that gun and that badge.
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
Banco
Posts: 14343
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 10:16 pm

If guns are freely available in an open society such as the US, you're going to get gun deaths. It's inevitable. It's far too late to do anything like banning guns, they're already out there. Whether the laws could be tightened is rather more pertinent.

Anyway, it comes down to this: if you strongly believe that everyone has the right to bear arms then you have to accept the concomitant high death rate through firearms. If you believe the trade off between that particular freedom and the casualty figures is worth it, then fine, that's a logical and consistent position.

Just don't pretend the two aren't related, because they clearly are.
She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
 
ANCFlyer
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RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 10:31 pm

I think there needs to be laws, tough laws, on owning weapons. And NO, everyone does not deserve to own a weapon.

That said, Banco - banning guns is THE only sure way to make sure on the bad guys have them. . . . it's really that simple.
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
Banco
Posts: 14343
Joined: Mon Oct 29, 2001 11:56 pm

RE: Guns This Week...

Wed Mar 16, 2005 10:36 pm

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 43):
That said, Banco - banning guns is THE only sure way to make sure on the bad guys have them. . . . it's really that simple.

Well, I tend to agree from where you are now. It's like the old joke about asking directions from a country yokel who answers "Well, I wouldn't start from here". Given the history of the US, and the free availability of weapons, I don't see how you could get rid of them all, given their prevalence. I suspect that you are right, and that the only people left with them would be the criminals. This, of course, is why so many other countries do everything they can to prevent guns becoming that commonplace in the first place.
She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
 
L-188
Posts: 29881
Joined: Wed Jul 07, 1999 11:27 am

RE: Guns This Week...

Thu Mar 17, 2005 2:49 am

Quoting BN747 (Reply 40):
That works in an isolated homogenous society

Anybody from Switzerland want to answer that?

Last time I checked Switzerland was in the middle of Europe, right on the trade routes from North to South, and has citizens who speak 3 different languages, and come from those three backgrounds.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
BN747
Topic Author
Posts: 5344
Joined: Thu Mar 28, 2002 5:48 am

RE: Guns This Week...

Thu Mar 17, 2005 10:38 am

Quoting L-188 (Reply 45):
Last time I checked Switzerland was in the middle of Europe, right on the trade routes from North to South

ummm trading by horse-drawn wagons went out 100s of years ago....

What trade routes?

Quoting Banco (Reply 42):
If guns are freely available in an open society such as the US, you're going to get gun deaths. It's inevitable. It's far too late to do anything like banning guns, they're already out there. Whether the laws could be tightened is rather more pertinent

Uh huh and let's see..

Adding more guns to that mix does what exactly???

1) Reduces gun deaths??? Esp. accidental ones?

2) Makes who safer?

3) None of the above.

Forbidding anymore additional weapons does what exactly?

1) Makes the criminals more dangerous? (how can that even be possible?)

2) More and more gun deaths (intentional and accidental?)

3) Increases beheadings

4) None of the above

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 43):
That said, Banco - banning guns is THE only sure way to make sure on the bad guys have them. . . . it's really that simple.

True... and now you know exactly how you (cops) are dealing with and looking for....

BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
Banco
Posts: 14343
Joined: Mon Oct 29, 2001 11:56 pm

RE: Guns This Week...

Thu Mar 17, 2005 6:15 pm

Quoting BN747 (Reply 46):
Uh huh and let's see..

Adding more guns to that mix does what exactly???

1) Reduces gun deaths??? Esp. accidental ones?

2) Makes who safer?

3) None of the above.

Forbidding anymore additional weapons does what exactly?

1) Makes the criminals more dangerous? (how can that even be possible?)

2) More and more gun deaths (intentional and accidental?)

3) Increases beheadings

4) None of the above

I think in your desire to be sarcastic you missed my point completely. I was referring to the impossibility of getting rid of all guns.
She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
 
ANCFlyer
Posts: 21391
Joined: Mon Nov 15, 2004 3:51 pm

RE: Guns This Week...

Thu Mar 17, 2005 6:22 pm

Quoting Banco (Reply 47):
I think in your desire to be sarcastic you missed my point completely. I was referring to the impossibility of getting rid of all guns.

Banco - ole Buddy - that would be the normal response for Mr. B747. Sarcasm, ignorance and missing the point.

As you can see by the last quote and last line of his response - he missed my point as well . . .  crazy 
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
BN747
Topic Author
Posts: 5344
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RE: Guns This Week...

Thu Mar 17, 2005 7:21 pm

Quoting Banco (Reply 47):
I think in your desire to be sarcastic you missed my point completely. I was referring to the impossibility of getting rid of all guns.

Yes my reply to your quote was a bit sarcastic.. but the questions posed are very sincere indeed and a questions than the chronically-in-denial types like ANCflyer dare not answer.

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 48):
Banco - ole Buddy - that would be the normal response for Mr. B747. Sarcasm, ignorance and missing the point

Best you can come up with response to such a serious issue--and one you choice to build your life around is words like 'bullshit, sarcasm and ignorance'..oh yeah and your 'add more gun laws' to the ones that don't already work. For man of your age and job experience... I have a word that perfectly sums it up...pathetic.

You're so vehemently opposed to anti-gun laws/bans that you haven't paused to think 'well we've tried it one way...what have we to lose to try it the other way..'

You hate this topic with such a passion it makes me wonder...

Ahhh.... but I suspect the answer to that... you're either retired or about to retire and would have to hangup your holster. A power trip you cannot fathom living without. Worse than that, without a gun in the house...you'd be at the mercy of bad guys you've either accumulated over the years or just have to join the ranks and be sitting ducks like the rest of us... welcome to our world! It's not so bad once you get over the jitters--which many of us never had in the first place.

BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson

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