Falcon84
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Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 12:52 am

Why am I not surprised, that such a program, backed by the religious-right, skews facts, and doesn't even report the science right?

http://www.cleveland.com/medical/pla...se/news/111805030118661.xml&coll=2

Abstinence education, in conjunctuion with teaching kids about birth control methods is the only way to go, not an either/or program.
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ANCFlyer
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 1:09 am

Quoting Falcon84 (Thread starter):
Abstinence education, in conjunctuion with teaching kids about birth control methods is the only way to go, not an either/or program

 yes 

A horny teenage couple that is willing and able will in fact experiment . . . better to equip them for all contingencies rather than one . . . especially one that won't or can't work . . .
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
Falcon84
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 1:12 am

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 1):
A horny teenage couple that is willing and able will in fact experiment . . . better to equip them for all contingencies rather than one . . . especially one that won't or can't work . .

Agreed. It's bad enough these abstinence-only programs won't even tell kids about condoms, but then for them to deliberately skew or outright lie about scientific fact is appalling.

Of course, we've come to see with the neocon crowd, who love social issues like this, don't care about science: whether it comes to birth control (at home, and embarrasingly, at the UN when talking about AIDS/overpopulation in Africa), or enviornmental issues.

It's really embarrassing, and quite sad, if you ask me.
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DLKAPA
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 1:18 am

And they wonder why the teen birth rate is going up.
And all at once the crowd begins to sing: Sometimes the hardest thing and the right thing are the same
 
ANCFlyer
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 1:38 am

I'm all for abstinence, being the Father of a blonde haired blue eyed daughter  crazy  but I'm not so naive to think she might not experiment. So why not have her 'armed and ready' so to speak.

So, since Ohio officially professes only abstinence, it now becomes a parental responsibility to discuss the other options. Wonder how many parents will take the time to do that . . .

And I wonder how many parents who don't will be upset when little Janey comes home knocked up? And who they will blame?
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
ZRH
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 1:39 am

This is THE reason why the USA have the highest percentage of teenage pregnancies of all western countries! Bravo to a such stupid hypocrisy!

[Edited 2005-06-06 18:40:50]
 
DLKAPA
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 1:39 am

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 4):

So, since Ohio officially professes only abstinence, it now becomes a parental responsibility to discuss the other options. Wonder how many parents will take the time to do that . . .

Wasn't that always the parent's resposibility?

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 4):

And I wonder how many parents who don't will be upset when little Janey comes home knocked up? And who they will blame?

Public education of course!
And all at once the crowd begins to sing: Sometimes the hardest thing and the right thing are the same
 
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mbmbos
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 1:44 am

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 4):
...when little Janey comes home knocked up?

Who's Janey? Never heard of her. Never had anything to do with her. Swear!
"If I don't manage to fly, someone else will. The spirit wants only for there to be flying. As for who happens to do it, in that he has only a passing interest."
- R.M. Rilke
 
ANCFlyer
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 1:52 am

Quoting DLKAPA (Reply 6):
Wasn't that always the parent's resposibility?

Yes, that's the point I'm trying to make . . . . but it, along with other parental duties, are often shirked in favor of the X-Box babysitter, etc.

Quoting MBMBOS (Reply 7):
Who's Janey? Never heard of her. Never had anything to do with her. Swear!

 laughing 
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
Falcon84
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 1:56 am

Quoting ZRH (Reply 5):
This is THE reason why the USA have the highest percentage of teenage pregnancies of all western countries! Bravo to a such stupid hypocrisy!

I wouldn't go as far to say "hypocrisy", to be honest. Parents are scared not only about pregnancy, but also STD's. And it isn't like the 70's, when the worst think you could come down with was The Clap. Today, STD's can kill you, and that's scary, especially when dealing with the teenage mantra's of "you just don't understand", and increased hormones.

The problem is that just handing out condoms doesn't work; neither does denying their existence, and telling kids "just say no". Kids are curious and many WILL go have sex. So why not have them armed with the best information on everything? Gee, what a concept, eh?

Unfortunately, like everything else, the extremes in this country are shouting past each other while the common-sense middle gets shouted out. The extreme left wants to just give kids condoms and say "have at it!", while the extreme right tells kids to "Just say no!", but doesn't tell them what's out there in case they don't listen.
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mdsh00
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 2:16 am

Wasn't the teen birth rate declining in the 90s when methods of contraception were taught rather than abstinence? Just goes to show how stupid that system is.
"Look Lois, the two symbols of the Republican Party: an elephant, and a big fat white guy who is threatened by change."
 
MD-90
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 2:42 am

State schooling shouldn't be teaching any children about any sex education, period.
 
saxdiva
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 2:49 am

Quoting MD-90 (Reply 11):
State schooling shouldn't be teaching any children about any sex education, period.

Sure thing, Pollyanna. And who should, their scoutmasters?
 
SRQCrosscheck
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 3:07 am

60 minutes did a piece just on this issue the Sunday before last. The curriculum is outrageous. In Fort Myers, FL a group called "Silver Ring Thing" receives federal money and asks kids to pledge abstinence. They also tell them that condoms don't work. The program also includes *very* denominational prayer (it's very evangelical; Jews, Muslums, Catholics, Orthodox, moderate Protestants, Buddhist, Bah'ai, you name it, need not apply...).

Ed Bradley interviewed the lecturer of the program, and he said his daughter has decided not to be abstinent; he in turn told her not to use condoms because they don't work and also won't protect her emotionally. (?!?!?) This man receives federal funding, endangers public health, and is a wacko/irresponsible parent...

Let it be known I don't believe in sex before you've been with your partner for quite a long time (or married). But I also believe that to promote public health, middle/high schoolers should learn about contraception and safe sex. 60 Minutes quoted a statistic that more than 3/4 of students who pledge abstinence break this pledge. To make matters worse, a Columbia U. public health professor critical of these programs said that since these programs give false stats on contraceptives, teens who go through these programs are more likely to contract STDs or become pregnant than teens who learned about safe sex. His study published in a respected scholarly journal on adolscent public health showed this convincingly. (I can't remember the name exactly, but you can refer to 60 Minutes, scroll to find the video )
 
Superfly
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 3:10 am

Quoting SRQCrosscheck (Reply 13):
In Fort Myers, FL a group called "Silver Ring Thing"

Sounds like a Cock Ring.
How ironic!
Bring back the Concorde
 
SRQCrosscheck
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 3:22 am

Quoting MD-90 (Reply 11):
State schooling shouldn't be teaching any children about any sex education, period.

Teaching about sexual health is a public health necessity.

Someday, we'll be hearing about how state schooling shouldn't be teaching history that's critical of the U.S. Government. Trail of Tears? No... people like General/President Jackson were trying to "secure the homeland" to "preserve American freedoms." Those Native Americans were "terrorizing."

...on a related note, just watched Kinsey the other day. very interesting look at how attitudes about sex have (and haven't) changed in the public eye.
 
ZRH
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 3:24 am

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 9):
The problem is that just handing out condoms doesn't work;

I absolutely agree. You have to give a good education and explanation. To tell the kids to say "no" is ok, but it is only normal that some still like to try it and will try it.

Quoting MD-90 (Reply 11):
State schooling shouldn't be teaching any children about any sex education, period.

Why????? This sounds terribly prude. Sex is as natural as many other things. Why should school not teach this? I don't understand. In most European countries sex education is compulsory and they have much less pregnancies and STD. Of course they don't need to encourage the kids to have sex but it is very important to inform and educate.
 
ltbewr
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 3:26 am

I believe that different levels and degrees of sexual responsability education should be taught in our public schools and parents should have the option of their child not participating. The parental option would recognize the wide range of faiths including evangelical Christians, Catholics, Hindus, Muslims, conservitive Jewish and other faiths with strict views on sex. Different levels could include 'Abstance only', moderate and liberal programs, but all would have to give accurate info. All would include education to young people about how to reduce the opportunity of sexual activity (like from the use of alcohol and drugs, going to residences or other places without adult/parental presence), the preference of and the advantages of not having sex until at least out of high school, honest knowelge of the risks of STD's, the risks of pregency, including the substantual emotional and finanancial problems it can lead to, some understanding of birth control and abortion including their true risks.
Religious groups should offer as an alternative to public school programs, sexual responsibility programs at their facilities, with the parents attending too, thus assisting the parents in that responsability and to keep it in line with their faith teachings. Planned Parenthood could also offer programs too, especially where Abstence only programs are the only option in some school districts.
 
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PA110
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 3:41 am

Quoting MD-90 (Reply 11):
State schooling shouldn't be teaching any children about any sex education, period.

Are you kidding me? That's the dumbest thing I've seen in a while on a.net!!!
While conciencious parents might take the time to educate their children about sex and STD's, far too many parents don't. Also how naive can you be to think that most children are going to heed abstinence. If school doesn't teach alternatives, where do you think kids will obtain that information? They get it from their friends! - not the most factual source to rely on. You can't stick your head in the sand and pretend the problem doesn't exist, or that it will go away all by itself. Far better the school system address the issue with clear hard facts than relying on a fraction of parents to address the issue, or worse - equally immature classmates.
It's been swell, but the swelling has gone down.
 
dan2002
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 6:15 am

I go to school(and live) in Cleveland, and at my school(well I graduate in like an hour, but still, also RedNGold may have heard of the school.), we had a group called Operation Keepsake come in and hold classes for about a week, pretty boring, didnt phase me too much, im not the type that sleeps around anyways, and I dont need some strangers telling me that marrage is going to keep me from getting a STD, even if I agree about waiting till marrage.

-Dan
A guy asks 'What's Punk?'. I kick over a trash can and its punk. He knocks over a trash can and its trendy.
 
PHXFLY
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 6:28 am

Quoting Mdsh00 (Reply 10):
Wasn't the teen birth rate declining in the 90s when methods of contraception were taught rather than abstinence? Just goes to show how stupid that system is.

yes the teen pregnancy rate was the lowest in decades. Also, a recent study of abstinence only education programs showed that teens were more likely to engage in others riskier behaviors such as unprotected anal sex. I believe something like 20% of the teens who went through such programs admitted to such behavior. There was also an even higher rate of oral sex.

I knew a girl who had a boyfriend and they were both very religious. She said that admitted to enagaging in anal sex because she wanted to stay a virgin until she was married.

[Edited 2005-06-06 23:30:24]
 
norcal
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 1:01 pm

I'll give my input as a college student who has had to sit through all of these ridiculous abstinence presentations. THEY DON'T WORK. No one pays attention, we end up doing what we want anyways. We are going to experiment anyways, might as well teach us how to do it safely.

Scare tactics about STDs and pregnancy won't work either, we think we are invincible, that it won't happen to us. Always to someone else. Teach us to have safe sex and let us make our own decisions about when we are ready.
 
Falcon84
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 1:05 pm

Quoting NorCal (Reply 21):
We are going to experiment anyways, might as well teach us how to do it safely.

Actually, I detest the "everyone is doing it" copout. In, there are many teens that chose, freely, not to have sex while they're so young, and I have all the respect in the world for them. I cannot sit here and say that these abstinence-only programs don't reach anyone, because they probably do, and that should not be discounted, and certainly those youngsters who are reached, and do abstain, should not face any disdain.

But the point remains that it would be better off if there was an all-encompasing sex-education class, that doesn't just dismiss abstinence as an option, but also doesn't bury itself in the sand when you're talking about youngsters and their hormones.
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norcal
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 1:22 pm

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 22):
Actually, I detest the "everyone is doing it" copout. In, there are many teens that chose, freely, not to have sex while they're so young, and I have all the respect in the world for them.

True, but they are few in number.

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 22):
But the point remains that it would be better off if there was an all-encompasing sex-education class, that doesn't just dismiss abstinence as an option, but also doesn't bury itself in the sand when you're talking about youngsters and their hormones.

This would be the ideal solution
 
Falcon84
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 1:26 pm

Quoting NorCal (Reply 23):
True, but they are few in number.

If one abstains, then a program is worth keeping, even if I think it needs moderation and direction.
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MxCtrlr
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 1:53 pm

Quoting Falcon84 (Thread starter):
Abstinence education

= Sticking Head In Sand

Scary thing here is that I'm agreeing with Falcon84  biggrin 

Seriously, this is garbage. Like Falcon said in the opening post, Abstinence, alongside EVERY other option, is the only sensible, responsible thing to teach kids. They are bombarded from every angle with sex and sexuality (ever watched some of the musical acts they watch day-in, day-out?). To think they aren't at least interested in experimentation is ludicrous.

As some have said here (and I have a just-turned-15-going-on-30-year-old daughter at home) it is the parents' responsibility to ensure that our children are armed with the greatest amount of information to help them make an informed decision.

MxCtrlr  bouncy 
DAMN! This SUCKS! I just had to go to the next higher age bracket in my profile! :-(
 
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TheRedBaron
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 9:42 pm

Those guys who promote religious values and abstinence like nazis, are a sight to see. In Mexico we have this guy that for years went on on T.V. advocation abstinence, non abortion, no sex until Marriage, heck no sex for recreational purposes just for reproduction (also included no sex toys, contraceptives, condoms) and my fave, a fierce attack on "alternate lifestiles" well, in 2000 he was appointed to front a goverment sponsored org. to put his "project" into motion......in 2004 it was discovered that:

His clinics promoted and carried out abortions.
He diverted money to some "personal" affairs
He used gov.money to buy lingerie
in a nutshell, he carried out exactly the opposite that he always spoke on T.V.

My Point, Education is taught AT HOME Instruction is provided at School,YOU as a parent have to educate your children and teens about STD , sex and normal "urges" that go with age. If you dont do your job NO SCHOOL, SYSTEM or T.V. program will do.
My kid is 13 and believe me, his female classmates DO NOT LOOK 13 at all and they dont dress like 13 AT ALL, so I have to be realistic about it, and teach him that his choices have repercusions, that with freedom comes responsability.
BTW I dont know the rates of Teen pregnancy but I am SURE that Mexico must be in the top 5 worlwide, the guy that handles my garden invited me to a celebration last week, I told him what is the celebration about? he told he he is a grandparent! , the guy is 37 years old...!!!

Teach your children about sex, because if you dont...someday they will teach YOU.

Best regards
TRB
The best seat in a Plane is the Jumpseat.
 
ANCFlyer
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 9:47 pm

So, Falcon, reading through this thread this morning (well, it's morning in Alaska anyway), I find with one exception, everyone seems to think the program us uselss . . . how the hell did it get voted into place in the great State of Ohio? What were the polls from the population? Did the guvment even let the people vote on the program? How much money is Ohio wasting on it?
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
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mbmbos
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 10:43 pm

Quoting Superfly (Reply 14):
Sounds like a Cock Ring.

Actually, I've heard that it's quite the trend to get your hands on one of those silver rings and wear it on your middle finger. It's a way of saying F*** abstinence.
"If I don't manage to fly, someone else will. The spirit wants only for there to be flying. As for who happens to do it, in that he has only a passing interest."
- R.M. Rilke
 
Falcon84
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 10:46 pm

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 27):
So, Falcon, reading through this thread this morning (well, it's morning in Alaska anyway), I find with one exception, everyone seems to think the program us uselss . . . how the hell did it get voted into place in the great State of Ohio?

Because Ohio has one of the most ideologically ultra-conservative legislatures in the country. And ideologically, ultra-conservative legislatures care about one thing, it seems: "social issues". The state is losing jobs by the thousands; high-tech companies won't even look at the state; the education system is collapsing, as the Legislature will not find a funding system that works (after being told a dozen years ago to fix it by the Ohio Supreme Court); but the GOP's centerpiece legislations of the last two years has been to twice ban gay marriage; to allow concealed weapons, and this Abstinence-only sex education. They all follow the worst forms, I think of conservatism.

That's how it got there.
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MD-90
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 10:47 pm

Quoting Saxdiva (Reply 12):
Sure thing, Pollyanna. And who should, their scoutmasters?

How 'bout their PARENTS, Saxdiva.

Abstinence-only education (one lecture from a local doctor) sure seems to have worked in the youth group at my church. None of us, that I know of, ever got in a bad situation.

Then again, some of us believe that True Love Waits.

Quoting PA110 (Reply 18):
While conciencious parents might take the time to educate their children about sex and STD's, far too many parents don't.

Parents just can't be trusted to rear their own children to the best of their abilities, can they? Obviously, we need bureaucrats to manage their children for them. Power over people's lives is so addicting, isn't it?
 
JGPH1A
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 10:49 pm

Quoting MD-90 (Reply 30):
Then again, some of us believe that True Love Waits.

Which is Christian-speak for "Nobody wants to sleep with me" Big grin
Young and beautiful and thin and gorgeous AND BANNED ! Cya at airspaceonline.com, losers
 
MD-90
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 11:00 pm

I'll admit that I've seen some girls make such a pledge and thought to myself, why should they bother, no self-respecting man's gonna sleep with them anyway? But we had a lot of beautiful girls at my church, women who are beautiful inside and out. And they (and I) truly believe in not having sex until marriage.

[Edited 2005-06-07 16:03:13]
 
JGPH1A
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 11:03 pm

Quoting MD-90 (Reply 32):
It's been my experience around here that the most beautiful women who aren't shallow so-hoes (or wanna-bes) are Christians.

And I expect if you made discreet enquiries, you'd find that True Love may wait, but Mr/Ms. Right Now In The Back Of My Truck doesn't.
Young and beautiful and thin and gorgeous AND BANNED ! Cya at airspaceonline.com, losers
 
garnetpalmetto
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Tue Jun 07, 2005 11:08 pm

Quoting JGPH1A (Reply 33):
And I expect if you made discreet enquiries, you'd find that True Love may wait, but Mr/Ms. Right Now In The Back Of My Truck doesn't.

On the nose, JGPH. Back when I was dating my last ex, she was a Southern Baptist and was talking about how great it was that so many of the women and young women in the youth groups there believed in the "True Love Waits" credo. Well one night, they were out on a Women's Movie Night and in talking to another member, she found that many, many of the "True Love Waits" crowd engaged in oral and anal sex. Just some good old fashioned hypocrisy for you and yet another reason I shy away from organized churches.
South Carolina - too small to be its own country, too big to be a mental asylum.
 
MD-90
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Wed Jun 08, 2005 1:58 am

Quoting JGPH1A (Reply 33):
Ms. Right Now In The Back Of My Truck doesn't.

Not my kind of girl, thanks.



I would agree about the oral sex part, unfortunately.
 
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PA110
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Wed Jun 08, 2005 4:34 am

Quoting MD-90 (Reply 30):
Parents just can't be trusted to rear their own children to the best of their abilities, can they? Obviously, we need bureaucrats to manage their children for them. Power over people's lives is so addicting, isn't it?

Again, an extremely foolish and simplistic point of view. If parents don't step up, who is going to? Their friends. Would you really rather see that kids get sex education from their friends than from a trained educator? Remember, not all schools are bad, and most are under the control of local school boards, so you can't just paint the subject with one big brush called "state schools". Time to grow up live in the real world.
It's been swell, but the swelling has gone down.
 
N1120A
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RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Wed Jun 08, 2005 5:10 am

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 1):
Quoting Falcon84 (Thread starter):
Abstinence education, in conjunctuion with teaching kids about birth control methods is the only way to go, not an either/or program

A horny teenage couple that is willing and able will in fact experiment . . . better to equip them for all contingencies rather than one . . . especially one that won't or can't work . . .

Bullseye John. As far as Falcon goes, you are on to something, though I think all of these things should be taught as a choice. They should not favor one over another and they should definately teach young people how to use protection.

Quoting ZRH (Reply 5):
This is THE reason why the USA have the highest percentage of teenage pregnancies of all western countries!

Always trust the Swiss to get the correct answer

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 4):
And I wonder how many parents who don't will be upset when little Janey comes home knocked up? And who they will blame?

The schools, minorities, Moslems and the Democratic party of course.

Quoting Mdsh00 (Reply 10):
Wasn't the teen birth rate declining in the 90s when methods of contraception were taught rather than abstinence?

Yep

Quoting MD-90 (Reply 11):
State schooling shouldn't be teaching any children about any sex education, period.

Wrongo. HIV/AIDS is a public health issue. Overpopulation and teenage preganancy are public health and economic issues. Date rape is a public health and societal issue. These are things schools should be teaching

Quoting SRQCrosscheck (Reply 13):
and he said his daughter has decided not to be abstinent; he in turn told her not to use condoms because they don't work and also won't protect her emotionally

Wow, that guy should be fired and have his child taken away

Quoting ZRH (Reply 16):
Why????? This sounds terribly prude. Sex is as natural as many other things. Why should school not teach this? I don't understand. In most European countries sex education is compulsory and they have much less pregnancies and STD. Of course they don't need to encourage the kids to have sex but it is very important to inform and educate.

Why?? Because Jesus told them, remember?

Quoting Dan2002 (Reply 19):
and I dont need some strangers telling me that marrage is going to keep me from getting a STD, even if I agree about waiting till marrage.

Actually, the highest climb in STD rates has been among married couples. Go figure.

Quoting MD-90 (Reply 30):
Then again, some of us believe that True Love Waits.

And the majority believe that you should act like a human being does naturally

Quoting MD-90 (Reply 30):
Power over people's lives is so addicting, isn't it?

Yes, ask your pastor about that one

Quoting JGPH1A (Reply 31):
Which is Christian-speak for "Nobody wants to sleep with me"

 rotfl  rotfl 
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
MD-90
Posts: 7835
Joined: Mon Jan 17, 2000 12:45 pm

RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Wed Jun 08, 2005 8:29 am

Quoting PA110 (Reply 36):
Remember, not all schools are bad, and most are under the control of local school boards, so you can't just paint the subject with one big brush called "state schools".
Under local control my ass. I daily see people who can't spell, can't make change, can't talk properly, and sure can't read "The Last of the Mohicans," a book that if it achieved the success today that it did during its heyday, it would sell 10 million copies. It's embarassing how dumb Americans have become when compared to our forefathers, who didn't have hardly any public schooling.

[Edited 2005-06-08 01:30:11]
 
Stoney
Posts: 199
Joined: Fri Jan 14, 2005 2:37 am

RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Thu Jun 09, 2005 3:16 am

Good Day

As already mentioned above, abstinence alone won't work, not even in extremely religious circles. Here in Switzerland it's pretty normal to sleep with your girlfriend if you have one. And about 30 % of all young people already had a one-night-stand.

The only reasonable thing to teach kids is that saying no to sex is everyone's right, but having sex before marriage is not wrong. This way the teenagers don't have to worry about being in the wrong just because they sleep with someone and they don't have to hide this fact. If a question or a problem arises (like my girlfriend when she thought that she was pregnant cause her "Menstruation" (whatever it's called in English) didn't come as planned) the teenagers can ask the parents for help without having to fear anything. (In the end (after my mom bought her a pregnancy test) it turned out that it was just because she was sick for such a loooong time.)

A couple I know from South Carolina, they don't have any problems with their sexual lives. They sleep together and think it's pretty normal, but they told me their parents would kill them if they found out. At home they aren't even allowed to sleep in the same room. So what happens if they have some sort of problem? Nobody taught them anything about all that stuff, so they would be on their own, afraid from the own family. And that's just plain stupid.

Here we learn just about anything there is to learn about birth control. The pill, condoms, sterilization and just about everything else there is. I could name you like 10 more options in German. And if you know how it works, then you automatically know the dangers of it.

So as a teenager affected by these things just about right now, I personally think this is the only right way to do it. Just thinking about never being told anything about that scares me. Are we still in the middle ages?

Greetz
Stoney
BAZL - Bundesamt gegen Zivilluftfahrt - royally screwing around with swiss aviation
 
mham001
Posts: 4348
Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2005 4:52 am

RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Thu Jun 09, 2005 11:05 am

Whoever said pregnancy rates were up is wrong. Last years stats said it was going down, primarily among younger students who were more likely to be swayed by an abstinence program. This is a good thing, it remains to be seen how that trend matriculates as those students mature.
 
N1120A
Posts: 26468
Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:40 pm

RE: Ohio Abstinence-Only Program Lying To Kids

Sat Jun 11, 2005 4:32 pm

For those who think public schooling does not work, I need only to point to European public schools that beat the pants off any school, public or private, in the US.
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss

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