MD11Engineer
Topic Author
Posts: 13916
Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2003 5:25 am

Were The London Bombers Duped?

Thu Aug 04, 2005 8:36 pm

According to a BBC article, the bombs set off on July 7th, which killed 66 people in London were detonated using mobile phones.
See:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/4744211.stm

So the question is: Did the bombers know what they were carrying or not?
Were they true suicide bombers or were they of the traditional kind of terrorists placing bombs and then disappearing?
Then, since they probably met the bomb builder and people from higher up in the terror organisation, were they killed to prevent them from talking or changing their minds?

In Israel, suicide bombers have been found, who's hands were taped to the firing switch, and in some cases tjhe bombs had a second detonating circuit to be fired by some observer, in case the bomber should change his mind. In some cases retarded persons have been used as mules and the bombs remotely detonated.

If it is proven that they got duped, this might break up support for the terrorist leadership.

Jan
Je Suis Charlie et je suis Ahmet aussi
 
saintsman
Posts: 2037
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RE: Were The London Bombers Duped?

Thu Aug 04, 2005 8:57 pm

I understood that mobiles do not work underground - no signal?

I think they knew what they were doing (or what they thought they were doing).

Its funny how the leaders never become bombers......
 
MD11Engineer
Topic Author
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RE: Were The London Bombers Duped?

Thu Aug 04, 2005 9:01 pm

Quoting Saintsman (Reply 1):
I understood that mobiles do not work underground - no signal?

Depends.
I don't know how London underground is equiped, but e.g. Berlin U-Bahn has transceivers inside the tunnels, so that there is cellphone coverage underground as well.

Jan
Je Suis Charlie et je suis Ahmet aussi
 
7FTwinOtter
Posts: 169
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RE: Were The London Bombers Duped?

Thu Aug 04, 2005 9:04 pm

I think they certainly new they where carrying bombs but they may have been tricked, the first rule of assassination - kill the assassin.
 
MD11Engineer
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RE: Were The London Bombers Duped?

Thu Aug 04, 2005 9:12 pm

7FTwinotter, I agree.

They were probably considered expendable, but in case of capture could at least identify the person who gave them the bombs.

Jan
Je Suis Charlie et je suis Ahmet aussi
 
ME AVN FAN
Posts: 12970
Joined: Fri May 31, 2002 12:05 am

RE: Were The London Bombers Duped?

Thu Aug 04, 2005 9:38 pm

All things known point towards them NOT expecting to die but to get out after having placed the devices. Suppose, the leaders knew that the four men, thanks to scientific research and to video-surveillance, would have been found fairly soon, and therefore carefully eliminated them.
 
7LBAC111
Posts: 2427
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RE: Were The London Bombers Duped?

Thu Aug 04, 2005 9:41 pm

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 5):
All things known point towards them NOT expecting to die but to get out after having placed the devices.

How can you say that???? What on earth do you know that the rest of us don't?
Debate is what you put on de hook when you want to catch de fish.
 
ME AVN FAN
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Joined: Fri May 31, 2002 12:05 am

RE: Were The London Bombers Duped?

Thu Aug 04, 2005 10:00 pm

Quoting 7LBAC111 (Reply 6):
How can you say that???? What on earth do you know that the rest of us don't?

Are you joking ???? I followed BRITISH press reports in the internet.
> They purchased return-tickets on public transport
> They purchased parking-tickets for a full day
> They prepared things for the evening when getting home
> They took all their papers carefully with them
- and so on, etc, and so on --- HEAPS of such indications. True, nothing is proven and possibly never will.
-
All this, to repeat it, has been discussed and elaborated in the British media. I checked things up on the internet WEBsites of BBC, SkyNews, theTimes, DailyTelegraph, EveningStandard, DailyMail, DailyMirror, News-of-the-World, FinancialTimes. AGAIN, nothing is proven, nothing is clear, nothing is confirmed. BUT it is well possible that many things will remain unclear.
-
Just last year had a lengthy discussion with an Imam of a CentralEuropean mosque who wanted to tell me that 11Sep01 in reality had been all different. True enough, many points ARE unclear and others a bit "shrouded in mystery" but HIS position lacked ANY proof and has/had a very low "probability-rating". While I accept that many things of older and recent history can never be proven, I reject the notion that only fully proven things can be discussed or taken as "given". Just look at the Lusitania. Even in your country, reality about the sinking of the Lusitania only became known many decades after those events. Most people alive in those days had died long before the full reality became known.
 
GoAround
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RE: Were The London Bombers Duped?

Thu Aug 04, 2005 10:06 pm

To clarify, I believe there is no signal anywhere on the underground parts of the Tube. You will, of course, receive signals on the overground parts of the network.
GoAround
 
L410Turbolet
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RE: Were The London Bombers Duped?

Thu Aug 04, 2005 10:07 pm

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 7):
Just last year had a lengthy discussion with an Imam of a CentralEuropean mosque who wanted to tell me that 11Sep01 in reality had been all different.

Isn't this guy a certain Sudanese called Mohammed Abbas?
 
MD11Engineer
Topic Author
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RE: Were The London Bombers Duped?

Thu Aug 04, 2005 10:07 pm

Another thing is that most suicide bombers so far left elaborate written or video statements, and in most cases shaved off their body hair, all things the London bombers didn't do.
My information comes from early BC texts released shorly after the bombings. Unfortunately I can not find them anymore.

Jan
Je Suis Charlie et je suis Ahmet aussi
 
Gman94
Posts: 1167
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RE: Were The London Bombers Duped?

Thu Aug 04, 2005 10:11 pm

Mobile phones do not work on the below surface parts of the London Underground, this was confirmed recently by the Met Police and the Underground after a hoax email that went around after the attacks saying that you can contact emergency services on the Underground even if you have no signal.

Quoting 7LBAC111 (Reply 6):
Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 5):
All things known point towards them NOT expecting to die but to get out after having placed the devices.

How can you say that???? What on earth do you know that the rest of us don't?

ME AVN FAN is the Anet king of drawing conclusions from zero facts about an event, you just need to look at his thoughts on the shooting of the man at Stockwell tube station to confirm this. Either that or he has a crystal ball.
British Airways - The Way To Fly
 
ME AVN FAN
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RE: Were The London Bombers Duped?

Thu Aug 04, 2005 10:32 pm

Quoting L410Turbolet (Reply 9):

no, he is NOT a Sudanese and NOT named that way

Quoting Gman94 (Reply 11):
has a crystal ball.

I of course have a crystal ball !
 yes 
 
7LBAC111
Posts: 2427
Joined: Sun Jul 18, 2004 9:17 am

RE: Were The London Bombers Duped?

Thu Aug 04, 2005 10:32 pm

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 7):
They purchased return-tickets on public transport

These are often cheaper than oneways!

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 7):
They purchased parking-tickets for a full day

Maybe it was pay and display???

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 7):
They prepared things for the evening when getting home

Did they? Did they leave a chicken out for tea??

OF COUSE THEY DID. They had to maintain a sense of normaility so as not to rouse suspicion.

7LBAC111
Debate is what you put on de hook when you want to catch de fish.
 
ME AVN FAN
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RE: Were The London Bombers Duped?

Thu Aug 04, 2005 11:49 pm

Quoting 7LBAC111 (Reply 13):
THEY DID. They had to maintain a sense of normaility so as not to rouse suspicion

-
May be, or NOT. Maybe we will NEVER really know. That I do NOT know does NOT bother me much. What is embarassing however is the feeling that those who SHOULD know do NOT.
 
MD11Engineer
Topic Author
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RE: Were The London Bombers Duped?

Fri Aug 05, 2005 3:17 am

Ok, I just heard similar news on CNN World TV news. Apparently the information was given to NYPD officials, who went to London shortly after the attacks, so that they could brief their own police force. This, confident, information was leaked out to private security contractors by the New York police, who spread it.
According to CNN, while London Metropolitan Police are refusing to comment officially, an inofficial source told CNN that they are less than pleased about another police department disclosing confident information about an ongoing investigation.

Jan
Je Suis Charlie et je suis Ahmet aussi
 
User avatar
nighthawk
Posts: 4795
Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 2:33 am

RE: Were The London Bombers Duped?

Fri Aug 05, 2005 4:18 am

the news here in the UK is reporting that mobile phone alarms were set to 8:50 to trigger the bombs, so no signal was required.

It may be a case that they didnt know they were to die when the bomb went off, on the other hand they may well have knew and the alarms were used to coordinate the explosions for maximum effect.
 
bristolflyer
Posts: 2103
Joined: Fri May 14, 2004 1:35 am

RE: Were The London Bombers Duped?

Fri Aug 05, 2005 4:22 am

Quoting Saintsman (Reply 1):
I understood that mobiles do not work underground - no signal?

Correct, they don't. One of the bombs was in a particularly deep tunnel, no chance of a signal down there.

BF
Fortune favours the brave

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