tbar220
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Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 5:11 am

Bush Waives Saudi Trafficking Sanctions

Wed Sep 21, 9:40 PM ET

WASHINGTON -
President Bush decided Wednesday to waive any financial sanctions on Saudi Arabia, Washington's closest Arab ally in the war on terrorism, for failing to do enough to stop the modern-day slave trade in prostitutes, child sex workers and forced laborers.

In June, the State Department listed 14 countries as failing to adequately address trafficking problems, subjecting them all to possible sanctions if they did not crack down.


http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/bush_human_trafficking

***

Just a year ago...

***

Human trafficking is one of the worst offenses against human dignity. Our nation is determined to fight that crime abroad and at home.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2004/07/20040716-10.html

***

I don't like the relationship our government has with Saudi Arabia, period. Considering that 15 out of the 19 hijackers on 9/11 were Saudi nationals, this is pretty screwy.
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TedTAce
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 5:14 am

Quoting Tbar220 (Thread starter):
is pretty screwy.

I'd say "is pretty FUCKED UP"

Oh P.S.. once again 'our' "Christian values" President hard at work.. what an ASSHOLE!!
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We're Nuts
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 5:20 am

Not good. If anyone has the ability to disrupt our way of life now, it's the Saud family. And they can do it the smart way: by pretending to be our ally.
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tbar220
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 5:25 am

It just seems so strange to me, that we're fighting this war in Iraq to spread democracy (apparently) and human rights. So why go easy on Saudi Arabia? My first reaction would be oil. Could it also be business connections? I don't know.

I think our representatives, both Republican and Democrat alike should oppose this. Those who support the war in Iraq on the basis of democracy and human rights should oppose this decision.
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MaverickM11
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 5:27 am

Quoting Tbar220 (Thread starter):
President Bush decided Wednesday to waive any financial sanctions on Saudi Arabia...for failing to do enough to stop the modern-day slave trade in prostitutes, child sex workers and forced laborers.

This doesn't make sense....sanctions were waived because the sanctioned failed to do something?
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
TedTAce
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 5:29 am

Quoting Tbar220 (Reply 3):
both Republican and Democrat alike should oppose this

ABSOLUTELY!!!

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 4):
This doesn't make sense....sanctions were waived because the sanctioned failed to do something?

Just like in Cuba eh Maverick?
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tbar220
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 5:43 am

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 4):
This doesn't make sense....sanctions were waived because the sanctioned failed to do something?

Uhhh, you edited that somehow so it wouldn't make sense. The article says that in June sanctions were threatened against 14 countries guilty of the stated. Saudi Arabia got a free pass and never got pressed with sanctions.

From the article:

"In addition to Saudi Arabia, Ecuador and Kuwait another U.S. ally in the Middle East were given a complete pass on any sanctions, Jordan said. Despite periodic differences, oil-rich Saudi Arabia and the United States have a tight alliance built on economic and military cooperation."

[Edited 2005-09-23 22:44:35]
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rjpieces
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 5:49 am

My Congressman tries to end funding of Saudi Arabia every year by inserting amendments in foreign aid bills, but to no avail. He is one of the biggest critics of Saudi Arabia on the Hill...
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rsmith6621a
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 5:53 am

Isnt it time for the Neo-Con segment of this community to chime in??

I was going to post this last night.

Yep bush has great Christian Values if he consulted with his bible on this decession.

If this doesnt wake up people to how tight we are bound to SA nothing will.
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rjpieces
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 5:57 am

Isnt it time for the Neo-Con segment of this community to chime in??

"Neocons" are major, major critics of Saudi Arabia...But it's always nice to see your ignorance.
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NUAir
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 6:05 am

Quoting Tbar220 (Reply 3):
Could it also be business connections

But what sets Carlyle apart is the way it has exploited its political contacts. When Carlucci arrived there in 1989, he brought with him a phalanx of former subordinates from the CIA and the Pentagon, and an awareness of the scale of business a company like Carlyle could do in the corridors and steak-houses of Washington. In a decade and a half, the firm has been able to realise a 34% rate of return on its investments, and now claims to be the largest private equity firm in the world. Success brought more investors, including the international financier George Soros and, in 1995, the wealthy Saudi Binladin family, who insist they long ago severed all links with their notorious relative. The first president Bush is understood to have visited the Binladins in Saudi Arabia twice on the firm's behalf.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/wtccrash/story/0,1300,583869,00.html

In the wake of Judicial Watch and other criticism of its ties to the bin Laden family business, the Carlyle Group reportedly no longer does business with the bin Laden conglomerate. Yet the Group, among other conflicts of interest, reportedly has a major business relationship with the Saudi Arabian government, which many have criticized for its lack of cooperation in America’s war on terrorism and its financial and other support for terrorist attacks on Israel and U.S. interests.


http://www.judicialwatch.org/1685.shtml

It's hard to make it any more transparent. OF course we have interest in Saudi Arabia! What does your car run on?
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MaverickM11
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 6:17 am

Quoting Tbar220 (Reply 6):
Uhhh, you edited that somehow so it wouldn't make sense.

No, read it again:

"President Bush decided Wednesday to waive any financial sanctions on Saudi Arabia, Washington's closest Arab ally in the war on terrorism, for failing to do enough to stop the modern-day slave trade in prostitutes, child sex workers and forced laborers."

All I did was remove "Washington's closest Arab ally in the war on terrorism" so that what remained was "Bush waives sanctions on Saudi Arabia for failing to do enough to stop slave trade".
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
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n229nw
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 6:24 am

Saudi Arabia is one of the worst human rights abusers in the world.

Whether one believes that the Iraq war was directly about oil or not, one must admit that our policy in the middle east (and central Asia) is largely driven by oil and oil money.

The hypocrisy makes me choke when this administration claims that our policy is about spreading human rights, since we support some of the worlds scariest and worst dictators (Turkmenistan anyone?), oppressive regimes such as Mubarrak's in Egypt, and, of course, the house of Saud.

Historically, countries have pursued foreign policies that suit their own interests. But when we are the world's only superpower, I personally believe we have some extra responsibility. Certainly, we shouldn't wonder why we are distrusted when we bully the rest of the world, start wars under false pretenses, then justify them under much falser pretenses once we are there. And we wonder why we are not seen as an honest broker in that part of the world?
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B744F
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 6:30 am

Quoting Tbar220 (Thread starter):
Washington's closest Arab ally in the war on terrorism

Do they mean, closet, as in the people behind the terrorism in the first place? Gotta love the administration, they will stop at nothing to help their business allies.
 
Scorpio
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 6:30 am

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 11):
All I did was remove "Washington's closest Arab ally in the war on terrorism" so that what remained was "Bush waives sanctions on Saudi Arabia for failing to do enough to stop slave trade".

And what exactly is confusing about that? The reason for the sanctions would have been that Saudi Arabia is failing to do enough to stop slave trade...

Quite frankly I can't say I'm surprised. Wondeful message the US is spreading with this! Great way to win more hearts and souls for the "War On Terror"  Yeah sure

Quoting RJpieces (Reply 9):
"Neocons" are major, major critics of Saudi Arabia...

Then why aren't the ones in the White House implementing these sanctions? Why are the neocons in the White House SUCKING UP to Saudi Arabia so much, if they are such 'major critics'?
 
We're Nuts
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 6:36 am

Quoting Scorpio (Reply 14):
Then why aren't the ones in the White House implementing these sanctions? Why are the neocons in the White House SUCKING UP to Saudi Arabia so much, if they are such 'major critics'?

Indeed. I expect to hear UNILATERAL outrage over this.
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n229nw
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 6:44 am

Quoting we're nuts, reply=15:
Indeed. I expect to hear UNILATERAL outrage over this.

You can hope, but "expect"? Don't hold your breath...

PS: Are you aware that the quote button still doesn't work from your posts? I had to cut and paste...
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MaverickM11
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 6:49 am

Quoting Scorpio (Reply 14):
And what exactly is confusing about that?

The official reason that Bush is waiving sanctions is because Saudi Arabia has human rights issues? That makes no sense.
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scbriml
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 6:56 am

Hmm, let me see if I've got this right.

Saudi Arabia has oil.
US needs oil.
Saudi Arabia is generally not nice to people.
US imposes sanctions.
Saudi Arabia stops exporting oil to US.
No wait, that's not good. Er, lets think about this.
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MaverickM11
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 7:00 am

Quoting Scbriml (Reply 18):
US imposes sanctions.
Saudi Arabia stops exporting oil to US.

That I can understand...but to say that Bush ended sanctions because Saudi Arabia failed to end human rights abuses does not make sense. I'm [kinda not really] surprised that more people didn't question the headline.
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tbar220
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 7:01 am

I guess it means that it doesn't matter to our government that they have failed to stop this problem. Our business is more important the human rights? Seems that way.
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AeroWesty
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 7:36 am

Not that it's right, but the U.S. isn't entirely guilt-free from heinous human rights crimes. Our flying suspects around the world to torture-friendly countries out of the reach of habeas corpus is just one famous example.

We can ballyhoo all we want about what others are doing, but as long as all we're doing is rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic when it comes to human rights, it's not going to go very far. One leads by example.
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We're Nuts
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 8:27 am

Quoting N229NW (Reply 16):
PS: Are you aware that the quote button still doesn't work from your posts? I had to cut and paste...

Yeah, I know, there isn't a whole lot I can do about it. If you select my text and hit "quote" from someone else's post, it will paste the text in their name, then you can just type in "We're Nuts".
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TedTAce
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 8:27 am

Quoting Tbar220 (Reply 20):
Our business is more important the human rights?

Yep.. you shouldn't act so surprised..it's only been policy for what? The last 40+ years?

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 21):
One leads by example.

Yes, and we don't USUALLY torture our prisoner, and we certainly do NOT sumarily dismember or execute them. Sure THIS administration has set us back DECADES with AbuGhraib, but on average we are a LOT better.
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searpqx
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 9:25 am

Other than once again showing that current US diplomacy and politics is the art of the convenient, I'm not sure why anybody is surprised or even dissapointed. To be either implies that you have an expectation of something else, and no realistic observer of our current administration would have expected anything other than exactly what they did.

But not to let former administrations off the hook, for far longer that I care to think about, we've been giving the Saudi's a complete pass on matters that we claim to hold dear. Even during the oil embargo and our emerging focus on human rights, I'm not aware that we ever really focused on the well known and documented abuses by the royal family.
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FriendlySkies
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 9:47 am

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 19):
That I can understand...but to say that Bush ended sanctions because Saudi Arabia failed to end human rights abuses does not make sense. I'm [kinda not really] surprised that more people didn't question the headline.

Hey, he told us we were going to Iraq because Saddam had WMDs...what's wrong with this?  Wink
 
CORULEZ05
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 10:02 am

Funny enough the majority of anet Bush supporters have avoided this thread like the plague......interesting....  scratchchin 
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AeroWesty
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 10:37 am

Quoting CORULEZ05 (Reply 26):
Funny enough the majority of anet Bush supporters have avoided this thread like the plague

This surprises you?  stirthepot 
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ANCFlyer
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 10:39 am

I've never thought of Saudi as our friend . . . I don't know how and why we have been snookered by them for so long, but we have. Remember, most of the 9/11 assholes are from Saudi . . . and so is OBL . . .

The sanctions should have stayed - in fact perhaps gotten tougher.

Just their abuse of women alone should be enough to raise billy hell with them. And Bush wasn't the only President to coddle their ass either . . .
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satx
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 11:42 am

Quoting RJpieces (Reply 9):
"Neocons" are major, major critics of Saudi Arabia

Can you supply some sources or examples that show this is anything but lip service?

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 19):
That I can understand...but to say that Bush ended sanctions because Saudi Arabia failed to end human rights abuses does not make sense. I'm [kinda not really] surprised that more people didn't question the headline.

Um, I think you're confused because you think Bush ended some former sanctions because they weren't working, but from my reading, there never were any sanctions. The "failing to do enough to stop the modern-day slave trade in prostitutes, child sex workers and forced laborers" was referring to the foriegn governments, and was not referring to any sanctions.

In June, the State Department listed 14 countries as failing to adequately address trafficking problems, subjecting them all to possible sanctions if they did not crack down.

This was simply another opportunity for Bush to act on his oft-mentioned 'family values' courtesy of the State Department. However, Bush decided to ignore this opportunity by simply waiving the right to impose sanctions and instead let Saudi Arabia off the hook yet again.

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 28):
I don't know how and why we have been snookered by them for so long, but we have. Remember, most of the 9/11 assholes are from Saudi . . . and so is OBL . . .

I don't quite follow you. Can you elaborate at all on exactly how were we snookered?

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 28):
The sanctions should have stayed - in fact perhaps gotten tougher.

Correct me if I'm wrong , but the way I read the article, and from past recollection, there have never been any sanctions on Saudi Arabia during the Bush presidency.

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 28):
Just their abuse of women alone should be enough to raise billy hell with them. And Bush wasn't the only President to coddle their ass either . . .

The decision to waive our right to impose sanctions Saudi Arabia in 2005 lies with Bush.
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ANCFlyer
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 11:55 am

Quoting SATX (Reply 29):
Correct me if I'm wrong , but the way I read the article, and from past recollection, there have never been any sanctions on Saudi Arabia during the Bush presidency.

We read it differently, in that what I read is the Financial sanctions - certain types of foreign aid - will now be allowed to proceed to 6 of the 14 countries failing to do enough to stop the modern-day slave trade in prostitutes, child sex workers and forced laborers.

""Bush concluded that Bolivia, Jamaica, Qatar, Sudan, Togo and the United Arab Emirates had made enough improvements to avoid any cut in U.S. aid or, in the case of countries that get no American financial assistance, the barring of their officials from cultural and educational events, . . . ""

Regardless, this may be a rare time we agree . . . don't spoil it.  biggrin  The trade of human beings for any reason is despicable. The treatment of women by Saudi men is atrocious . . . it is not human.

Quoting SATX (Reply 29):
I don't quite follow you. Can you elaborate at all on exactly how were we snookered?

Almost missed this one . . . sorry . . . too many people think the Saudi's are "our friends". Including our Saudi and holding President. Anyone with any sense has to realize they are not. It's all about the oil and the $$$. If we didn't buy oil from them, and well of course, allow their royals to gamble, drink and carry on in the US, they'd have nothing to do with us . . . .
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searpqx
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 12:27 pm

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 28):
I don't know how and why we have been snookered by them for so long, but we have. Remember, most of the 9/11 assholes are from Saudi . . .

I don't think there is any 'snookering' involved - successive administrations, dating back to at least Kennedy have simply chosen to ignore the abuses perpetrated under the Saudi Royal family, and have actively 'rewarded' (bribed) the Saudi's to be our 'allies'.

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 30):
It's all about the oil and the $$$. If we didn't buy oil from them, and well of course, allow their royals to gamble, drink and carry on in the US, they'd have nothing to do with us . . . .

BINGO!
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Falcon84
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 12:49 pm

Waived it for one reason folks-and this is a card I don't use often: OIL!!!!
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B744F
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 4:26 pm

Quoting RJpieces (Reply 9):
"Neocons" are major, major critics of Saudi Arabia...But it's always nice to see your ignorance.

WHAT???

actual smaller government conservatives are major major critics of Saudi Arabia. neocons have been in bed with the Saudis for decades and look the other way when "allies" they fund are really dangerous extremists
 
AvObserver
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 5:34 pm

No surprise here! Just like when the bin Laden family was allowed to jet out of America after 9/11 when all other aircraft were grounded. They should have been held for questioning but undoubtedly, their long association with Bush, Sr. and Jr., precluded any such protocol. Our oil dependency blinds the government from taking a stand against the Saudis, a supposed ally far more dangerous to the U.S. than the mostly manufactured threat of Saddam's WMDs.
 
We're Nuts
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 5:41 pm

Quoting AvObserver (Reply 34):
a supposed ally far more dangerous to the U.S. than the mostly manufactured threat of Saddam's WMDs.

"mostly"??  rotfl  Don't you think that implies some small degree of the threat was not manufactured? Perhaps you should consider revising that sentence!
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scbriml
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 5:54 pm

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 28):
I've never thought of Saudi as our friend . . . I don't know how and why we have been snookered by them for so long, but we have.

Er, because they have a lot of what you need - oil?
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Doona
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 6:08 pm

I'm the kind of guy who just thinks we should all be friends. But it ain't gonna happen. But when it comes to the war against terrorism, is a country like Saudi Arabia really an ally?

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We're Nuts
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 6:19 pm

They say diplomacy is just the art of saying "nice doggy" until you can find a big enough rock. Who knows, maybe in three years we'll be calling it "Bushi Arabia".  Silly
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AvObserver
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 6:54 pm

"Perhaps you should consider revising that sentence!"

Only to the extent that I concede to a possibility but not probability that Saddam had some small number of WMDs either dismantled or trucked to Syria prior to the invasion, as has been speculated due to claims of spy satellite photos of supposed truck movements to the Iraqi-Syrian border. I certainly agree with the consensus and even Bush's own later-appointed commission that he didn't have significant WMDs and that the U.S. invasion wasn't justified based on that rationale.
 
cfalk
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 7:16 pm

I find it funny that the same people that say that we should stay out of people's affairs, and not try to impose our culture on them, are the same ones who say that the Bush administration is wrong to impose our western abhorance of slavery and lack of human rights on a culture where misogyny and slavery are part of the culture.

Saudi Arabia is a very tricky issue. It is a country with an archaic system of royal absolute rule - a system that most of the world got rid of 500 years ago. Their human rights problems (once again, according to our definitions) are horrible, and when seen purely in that way, there is no question that very strong sanctions should be put in place, whether oil was there or not.

The main problem is that the Saudi royal family is sitting on a tremendous powderkeg of Islamic extremism. Wahhabi, Qutb and Salafi teaching is widely followed throughout the country, and is the source for much of the problems we have today with terrorism. They hate the royal family, and would overthrow it if they could. It is widely believed that the House of Saud will fall sometime soon, and everyone is afraid that should the extremists take over, the world will find itself is a horrible situation, with violently anti-western and aggressive extremists sitting on the world's biggest oil reserves, and all the funding they could wish for to buy WMDs to aid in their desire to rid the world of non-Islamic nations. The question is whether putting sanctions on Saudi Arabia will succeed in forcing reforms by the royal family, thereby further angering the extremists and precipitating such a revolution.

It's a damned-if-do, damned-if-you-don't situation, and frankly I am not sure what I would do if I were in Bush's shoes.
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cfalk
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sat Sep 24, 2005 8:34 pm

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 40):
I find it funny that the same people that say that we should stay out of people's affairs, and not try to impose our culture on them, are the same ones who say that the Bush administration is wrong to impose our western abhorance of slavery and lack of human rights on a culture where misogyny and slavery are part of the culture.

Oops, too late to edit...

I meant, "I find it funny that the same people that say that we should stay out of people's affairs, and not try to impose our culture on them, are the same ones who say that the Bush administration is wrong NOT to impose our western abhorance of slavery and lack of human rights on a culture where misogyny and slavery are part of the culture."

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 41):
The sooner we drop our requirement for oil, the sooner we can tell these oil producing motherfuckers to fuck off and die! I would LOVE to have to see Saudi Arabia turn itself into a tourist economy. That would be funnier then ANY 72 Comedians that have EVER lived!!

 checkmark 
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B744F
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sun Sep 25, 2005 5:14 pm

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 42):
I meant, "I find it funny that the same people that say that we should stay out of people's affairs, and not try to impose our culture on them, are the same ones who say that the Bush administration is wrong NOT to impose our western abhorance of slavery and lack of human rights on a culture where misogyny and slavery are part of the culture."

no those same people are just wondering why we are kissing up and calling these animals our allies. our government and all governments dependent on oil are funding terrorist, period.
 
searpqx
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sun Sep 25, 2005 6:17 pm

Quoting B744F (Reply 43):
our government and all governments dependent on oil are funding terrorist, period.

Gotta agree with that - up until they realized they were signing their own death warrants, many key members of the house of Saud were supporting OBL and similar militant groups. I don't doubt that some still are, just not on such an open level.
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Sun Sep 25, 2005 6:56 pm

Quoting Tbar220 (Thread starter):
Considering that 15 out of the 19 hijackers on 9/11 were Saudi nationals

the 15 were AGAINST the Saudi-Dynasty, so that THIS is another reason for the Bush-dynasty ... sorry I mean Bush-administration to support the Saudi-family

Quoting N229NW (Reply 12):
regimes such as Mubarrak's in Egypt

Mubarak's government is NOT "oppressive" even if not really democratic. What Mubarak "oppresses" are fundamentalist extremists, terrorists and criminals
 
B744F
Posts: 2927
Joined: Sat Jan 21, 2006 4:52 pm

RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Mon Sep 26, 2005 4:56 am

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 45):
the 15 were AGAINST the Saudi-Dynasty, so that THIS is another reason for the Bush-dynasty ... sorry I mean Bush-administration to support the Saudi-family

If they were against the Saudi Dynasty, why were they funded by top officials in said dynasty?
 
DLKAPA
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RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Mon Sep 26, 2005 5:19 am

Quoting Tbar220 (Reply 3):
Could it also be business connections? I don't know.

The Carlyle group, which Bush Sr. Serves as Public Relations director and members of the Bin Laden family preside on the board of directors.

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 4):
This doesn't make sense....sanctions were waived because the sanctioned failed to do something?

Well then what the fuck did we go to Iraq for?

Quoting NUair (Reply 10):
in 1995, the wealthy Saudi Binladin family, who insist they long ago severed all links with their notorious relative.

Which is BS, for the last ten years OBL has been seen at family events such as weddings and the like. He hasn't cut off ties at all, he just happens to have a terrorist organization fighting a "holy war" to run, you think he has time to visit with this family?

Quoting Scbriml (Reply 36):
"mostly"?? rotfl Don't you think that implies some small degree of the threat was not manufactured? Perhaps you should consider revising that sentence!

Replace the word "Manufactured" with the word "Given to." Yes, during the Iran-Iraq war the US supplied extensive chemical and biological warfare tools. Maybe not the actual stuff, but certainly the stuff to produce the stuff.
And all at once the crowd begins to sing: Sometimes the hardest thing and the right thing are the same
 
MaverickM11
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Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2000 1:59 pm

RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Mon Sep 26, 2005 6:09 am

Quoting DLKAPA (Reply 47):
Well then what the fuck did we go to Iraq for?

WEAK. That's the dumbest response I've seen on here yet. Try again.  Yeah sure
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
ANCFlyer
Posts: 21391
Joined: Mon Nov 15, 2004 3:51 pm

RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Mon Sep 26, 2005 6:20 am

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 21):
Not that it's right, but the U.S. isn't entirely guilt-free from heinous human rights crimes. Our flying suspects around the world to torture-friendly countries out of the reach of habeas corpus is just one famous example.

A very broad brush used here Westy - we don't condone (as a general population) nor do we accept wholesale torture of anyone - wholesale torture of women (removal of the clitoris for example). I will absolutely agree torture of any kind is abhorrant and against what this country should stand for, but your commentary makes it sound as though we have 747s full of folks flying off to where ever to have their balls wired to batteries. . . .

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 23):
Yes, and we don't USUALLY torture our prisoner, and we certainly do NOT sumarily dismember or execute them. Sure THIS administration has set us back DECADES with AbuGhraib, but on average we are a LOT better.

{checkmarK} Ted.

Quoting Scbriml (Reply 36):
Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 28):
I've never thought of Saudi as our friend . . . I don't know how and why we have been snookered by them for so long, but we have.

Er, because they have a lot of what you need - oil?

Er, didn't I already say that???? Quote me in context please.

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 30):
It's all about the oil and the $$$. If we didn't buy oil from them, and well of course, allow their royals to gamble, drink and carry on in the US, they'd have nothing to do with us . . . .
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
AeroWesty
Posts: 19551
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 7:37 am

RE: Bush Waives Sanctions On Saudi Arabia

Mon Sep 26, 2005 6:41 am

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 49):
we don't condone (as a general population) nor do we accept wholesale torture of anyone

Excellent counterpoint, to which I agree.

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 49):
your commentary makes it sound as though we have 747s full of folks flying off to where ever to have their balls wired to batteries

LOL! Stunning visual there.  bigthumbsup 

I'm not sure even how to respond to this one, but I do see your point that based upon the general readership here, this example could be misconstrued.

I genuinely felt embarassed for Colin Powell having to give the State Department's Annual Report on the administration's efforts to advance human rights at the same time the Abu Ghraib scandal was brewing, the rights of prisoners at Gitmo was in flux, and domestic civil liberties are increasingly becoming diminished. I wish our current administration held human rights and civil liberties with the same high esteem as do the people they represent.
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