9VSPO
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New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Wed Nov 09, 2005 5:15 pm

MPs are to vote on powers to hold terror suspects for 90 days without charge, in what is being called a test of Tony Blair's leadership credentials.
Labour rebels who say the plans breach human rights have refused to back down. Both Conservative leadership candidates are opposing the 90-day clause, backing instead an amendment put forward by Labour backbencher David Winnick setting the maximum time suspects can be held to 28 days.

But some Tory MPs have indicated they might defy their party line and vote with the government.

The Liberal Democrats and many Labour rebels are expected to back the 28-day plan.

Do you think 28 days is enough? What if an innocent person is held for 90 days?
 
ANCFlyer
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Wed Nov 09, 2005 6:25 pm

Ninety days is fine. . . . while I hope no innocent person is kept there for 90 days (and compensated appropriately if they are innocent) it may take 90 days (or more) to clear this person . . . .

We'll see how it goes . . . . I support it.
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
Banco
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Wed Nov 09, 2005 6:44 pm

Well, I hate it.

90 days without charge is absolutely outrageous. Yes, the police want it, but it is not the purpose of a democracy to do everything the police want. It'd make their jobs easier if everyone was locked in their houses from dusk to dawn too.

Something like 8,000 people have been detained (for up to 14 days) under the Prevention of Terrorism Act so far. Of those, a mere handful have been charged. So you lock them up for 90 days (effective internment) and if they didn't hate us before, they bloody well will by the time they get out.

It's also important to recognise that the chances are, the courts will tend to frown on any evidence garned towards the end of the detention period, as it may be felt to be gained under duress. It might well also fall foul of the Human Rights Act.

It's far too high a price for a pretty nebulous gain. All we've had as an argument in favour is that the police want it (see above). It's too high a price. We're destroying the freedoms that made us different in the first place. And the really depressing thing is how many people are keen to see it happen. We had the IRA for 30 years and there was never any suggestion we'd go down this route on the mainland. We had internment in the early 70's in Northern Ireland, and that was a disaster.

I truly hope MP's will vote this appalling proposal down. It might happen. I really hope so.
She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
 
cornish
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Wed Nov 09, 2005 6:59 pm

Quoting Banco (Reply 2):
90 days without charge is absolutely outrageous. Yes, the police want it, but it is not the purpose of a democracy to do everything the police want. It'd make their jobs easier if everyone was locked in their houses from dusk to dawn too.

Exactly - I'd like to think that if the caught a real terrorist, they'd have worked out long before 90 days is up that they really were one. The thought of having somebody banged up for three months who turns out to innocent of any charges is a decidedly worrying one - we are a democracy, not some totalitarian state.

Quoting Banco (Reply 2):
We had the IRA for 30 years and there was never any suggestion we'd go down this route on the mainland. We had internment in the early 70's in Northern Ireland, and that was a disaster.

Exactly. and people have very short memories - as awful as the recent terrorist bombings are, lets not forget that it isn't as if we are experiencing terrorism for the first time - although you might think so listening to some people. Christ, I remember my old flat shaking when the Ealing IRA bomb went off a few years back. Yes it is a different threat, but in the same way such tactics alienated even more catholic Irish agianst the british in the 70s, the same would happen here to a almost certainly far greater extent - only turning more disaffected muslims into potential terrorists.
Just when I thought I could see light at the end of the tunnel, it was some B*****d with a torch bringing me more work
 
9VSPO
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Wed Nov 09, 2005 8:49 pm

Quoting Banco (Reply 2):
Something like 8,000 people have been detained (for up to 14 days) under the Prevention of Terrorism Act so far. Of those, a mere handful have been charged.

Well you do have a point there.
 
9VSPO
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Wed Nov 09, 2005 9:06 pm

Just to add...

At the end of the day it's what the Police want and we all know the Police are always right and never make mistakes.

Having said that we need to protect the public.
 
MidnightMike
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Wed Nov 09, 2005 9:27 pm

Quoting 9VSPO (Thread starter):
MPs are to vote on powers to hold terror suspects for 90 days without charge, in what is being called a test of Tony Blair's leadership credentials.
Labour rebels who say the plans breach human rights have refused to back down. Both Conservative leadership candidates are opposing the 90-day clause, backing instead an amendment put forward by Labour backbencher David Winnick setting the maximum time suspects can be held to 28 days.

But some Tory MPs have indicated they might defy their party line and vote with the government.

The Liberal Democrats and many Labour rebels are expected to back the 28-day plan.

Do you think 28 days is enough? What if an innocent person is held for 90 days?

If there is another evidence that labels somebody a terrorist, no, 90 days is not to much. It is a brand new world with people trying to kill as many as Non-Muslims as possible.

I know that people are going to scream about innocents and Democracy, and the people that bring that up have a valid point, but, in a way, there is a war going on. I say, vote these measures in, on a temp. basis.....
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Thorben
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Wed Nov 09, 2005 10:09 pm

90 days without charge? Proposed by a prime minister who should sit in jail for 90 years for all the people killed in Iraq? Not a good idea.

Even 14 days is way too long in my opinion. People should be charged within 24 hours or be released.

You can't make politics based on fear!
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LeonB1985
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 12:14 am

Some statistics from Private Eye (admittedly maybe a slightly biased source, but still)

Number of days terrorism suspects may be held before being charged:

24 hrs in Australia (al-Qaeda death toll: 88)
5 days in Spain (al-Qaeda death toll: 191)
7 days in the USA (al-Qaeda death toll: 3000)
90 days proposed in the UK (al-Qaeda death toll: 52)


So - what happens when 90 days is no longer sufficient? 180 days?
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tbar220
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 12:23 am

Quoting LeonB1985 (Reply 8):
7 days in the USA (al-Qaeda death toll: 3000)

In Guantanamo Bay, hundreds of people are being held without being charged. They've been held there for years and only a handful of the hundreds of detainees have been charged.

Is this a democracy? Not if we're treating prisoners (any kind) like this.
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LeonB1985
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 12:44 am

Yeah - the Brits and Americans want to 'install' their brand of democracy in countries such as Afghanistan and Iraq, yet they set the example of imprisoning people who are not proved to be guilty. I by no means sympathise with the terrorists, but there are two sides to every story. I don't think locking up possibly innocent people for three months is going to make people feel any better about Britain. The police do make mistakes, as we saw not long ago at all when a very unfortunate Brazilian electrician paid with his life. Nobody innocent will be held for 90 days? Yeah, right!
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Banco
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 12:53 am

Quoting MidnightMike (Reply 6):
I say, vote these measures in, on a temp. basis.....

Just to provide information on that point, the intention would be to install a "sunset" clause, whereby it would have to be renewed by Act of Parliament every 12 months.

I still hate it. Interesting to note that a couple of the Law Lords came out describing the Bill (Parliamentary Bill, not the police, though now I come to think of it...  Wink ) as "intolerable".
She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
 
gkirk
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 1:03 am

90 days should be fine I think, perhaps 120 days would be better though?
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TheSorcerer
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 1:07 am

Quoting Gkirk (Reply 12):

I wonder if you'd still say that after being stuck in a prison for 120 days and being innocent.
It wouldn't be fine for anyone, but I would go to prison for 90 days if it makes Britain safer(I'm not saying it is).

The Sorcerer
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Banco
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 1:11 am

Quoting Gkirk (Reply 12):
90 days should be fine I think, perhaps 120 days would be better though?

Excellent. Habeas Corpus has only been a fundamental part of our legal system for 900 years. Let's abolish it completely eh?  Yeah sure
She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
 
LeonB1985
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 1:16 am

Quoting Gkirk (Reply 12):
90 days should be fine I think, perhaps 120 days would be better though?

Are you being serious?
 Confused
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Banco
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 1:17 am

Quoting TheSorcerer (Reply 13):
but I would go to prison for 90 days if it makes Britain safer

I'm sorry, that's crap. We're not talking a nice cushy number in Ford Open prison here. Belmarsh prison; constant interrogation. You'd be absolutely terrified. And more to the point, you'd have no avenue of appeal because you hadn't been charged. You'd have no prospect of challenging your imprisonment in front of the courts, you'd be stuck there. And at the end of that 3 months, you'd be let out, with no apology, no compensation, no job, no hope of a job.

And you'd be willing to do that? To make the country somehow "safer"?

Either you've not thought this through, or if you have, I simply don't believe you.
She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
 
9VSPO
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 1:18 am

It is only going to alienate minority communities further. Michael Howard said in the Commons today..."What is going to be the effect on an innocent person jailed for 3 months, their friends and relatives?"

It's a complete joke and it's nothing more than bullying.
 
TheSorcerer
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 1:35 am

Quoting Banco (Reply 16):

Ok , i was exaggerating.
But do you agree that people found with Jihad tapes should be stuck in prison for 90 days?
It's obvious that people with that sort of material are up to something.

I exaggerated banko, please don't roast me for it.
Thanks

The Sorcerer
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Banco
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 1:41 am

Quoting TheSorcerer (Reply 18):
But do you agree that people found with Jihad tapes should be stuck in prison for 90 days?
It's obvious that people with that sort of material are up to something.

No, I don't. If you find a body and someone next to it holding a knife, you could say it's obvious that they are up something. Do you think they should be locked up without a trial? Of coruse not. That's what it's for.

Now, if you want to make possession of such material a criminal offence in its own right (and there is a precedent, possession of pornographic images of children is an offence in its own right) then fine, we can discuss the merits of that. But the fundamental problem with this piece of legislation is that it imprisons people without them being found guilty of anything. To me, that's an absolute. No detention without trial. Short-term detention to allow the police to investigate is one thing, a three month prison term (and let's be clear, that's what it is) without any form of trial is totally unacceptable.

Quoting TheSorcerer (Reply 18):
I exaggerated banko, please don't roast me for it.

OK.
She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
 
9VSPO
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 1:55 am

Quoting TheSorcerer (Reply 18):
But do you agree that people found with Jihad tapes should be stuck in prison for 90 days?

Well if you put it like that, let's lock them up and throw the key away! Big grin
 
Banco
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 1:58 am

And the government have lost the vote:

322-291 against the proposal.

Must admit, the scale of the defeat has surprised me somewhat. But anyway, just occasionally, MP's renew your faith in democracy.
She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
 
BMIFlyer
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 1:59 am

It didn't get the vote  Sad

The 90 day detention has been rejected, voted 322 to 291  Sad

Damn  Sad


Lee
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RichardPrice
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 2:00 am

You can be sentanced by a court to much less than 90 days detention for a lot of crimes. This is punishment by detention without a trial and should be avoided at all costs.

IF you have evidence to hold them, then charge them on that evidence. That gives you enough leeway to convince a Judge that bail should not be given and the suspect should be held in custody until trial. During that time you can continue to investigate for other crimes.

Investigation by trawling is never good policing.
 
9VSPO
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 2:00 am

Quoting Banco (Reply 21):
322-291 against the proposal.

 Wow!

So do they now apply for 28 days?
 
BMIFlyer
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 2:01 am

Quoting 9VSPO (Reply 24):
So do they now apply for 28 days?

Yes, but if that is voted "No" they will then decide on 60 days.


Lee
Sometimes You Can't Make It On Your Own
 
RichardPrice
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 2:08 am

Im glad it didnt pass.

At least there are some same MPs still.
 
Banco
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 2:12 am

28 days is realistically the most that will get through. Not just because of the Commons, but the Lords will throw out anything longer, not least because any more than 28 days is likely to fall foul of the Human Rights Act. Then the government would have to invoke the Parliament Act to force it through, which would be extremely peculiar given they've lost the substantive vote on their own idea.

Of course, if 28 days AND 60 days is thrown out, then we're back to the current 14 days.
She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
 
cornish
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 2:12 am

Quoting Banco (Reply 21):
And the government have lost the vote:

322-291 against the proposal.

Must admit, the scale of the defeat has surprised me somewhat. But anyway, just occasionally, MP's renew your faith in democracy.

Bet Gordon Brown is in a foul mood after getting called back to vote after just arriving in Tel Aviv only to find out his vote wouldn't have made any difference whatsoever......  Wink
Just when I thought I could see light at the end of the tunnel, it was some B*****d with a torch bringing me more work
 
Banco
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 2:15 am

28 days has been accepted by the Commons.

So, short of the Lords rejecting that, that's what we'll have.

I dislike that as well, but I can just about live with it.
She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
 
RichardPrice
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 2:19 am

I can live with 28 days.

Hope Tony gets the message that he isnt God. Yet.
 
9VSPO
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 2:31 am

I think 28 days is more than enough. The Police made a good case but there was no evidence to show that 90 days was needed going off previous cases.

God bless Habeas Corpus.  Wink
 
777236ER
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 2:47 am

Quoting BMIFlyer (Reply 22):
It didn't get the vote Sad

The 90 day detention has been rejected, voted 322 to 291 Sad

Damn



Quoting Gkirk (Reply 12):
90 days should be fine I think, perhaps 120 days would be better though?

What nonsense. The police, headed ostensibly by a man who feels more at home on TV screens than determining whether or not his men shot an innocent man, made no case as to why they should hold people for 90 days without trial. For months all they've said is 'we need to do it. Terrorists use computers, they take a long time to crack.' They have never, after repeated questioning by MPs, point to one case where they would have charged someone with a crime had they held them for 90 days instead of 14. Indeed, the 8000 (!) or so held without charge for the current limit of 14 days has yielded only a handful of prosecutions. That alone should show the limits of power the police should have.
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SQno1
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 3:06 am

Just wondering if the ogvernment could use the parliament act to pass through the bill of holding a terror suspect for ninety days, or was that formed just for the hunting bill?

With Regards,
Alex.B
 
MD-90
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 3:15 am

It is an outrage. One day is long enough. Charge him with a crime if you have reasonable suspicion of involvement in any crime, from a bombing down to petty theft.

28 days is also too long. The Fabians sure have brought down the Land of Hope And Glory.
 
RichardPrice
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 3:34 am

Quoting SQNo1 (Reply 33):
Just wondering if the ogvernment could use the parliament act to pass through the bill of holding a terror suspect for ninety days, or was that formed just for the hunting bill?

No, this cant happen.

The Parliament act dates back to the 1911s, and was updated in the 1940s to add power for the government to force through legislation if required. Mainly this legislation was supposed to include reduction of Lords powers but has never been used for this purpose.

The Parliament act includes a clause that allows the House of Commons to force legislation into act that the Commons have passed but the Lords havent. If the legislation hasnt passed the Commons, it cant be enacted under the Parliament Act as its not a valid bill.
 
ANother
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 4:16 am

90 days, 28 days or even 1 day - no police force should have this 'right'. Checks and balances need to be in place to ensure that the law is not abused. How about 48 hours without charge, extended in 7 day periods with the OK of three judges (three different judges for each 7 day period) - or make it 14 or 28 on 900 days - but not just on the say-so of les flics!
 
RichardPrice
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 4:29 am

Quoting ANother (Reply 36):
90 days, 28 days or even 1 day - no police force should have this 'right'. Checks and balances need to be in place to ensure that the law is not abused. How about 48 hours without charge, extended in 7 day periods with the OK of three judges (three different judges for each 7 day period) - or make it 14 or 28 on 900 days - but not just on the say-so of les flics!

That was pretty much how the 90 day bill was going to be. Suspect detained by police and after each 7 day period the police had to justify the next 7 day period to a judge (and it depended on the judicial rotation of the courts as to which juge they got each time).

This is still unacceptable, as the detainee is still being held without a trial. Im sorry that there are people on this forum and in other places that feel its OK to detain someone for long periods of time without trial, but our entire society is dependant on a fair and just punishment system, and a trial is part of it.

Yes, people also have the right to not be blown up, but once you start treating a group of people differently within the judicial system on the basis that they MAY or MAY NOT have been planning on doing something, then you start the road down to being a police state.

Tony Blair tried justifying this in Parliament earlier today by saying that since the July 7th attacks on London, a further 2 attacks had been foiled. Well, all that I have to say to that is: the police didnt need the 90 day detention period to foil those attacks did they? There hasnt been a case yet wher ethe police have needed anywhere near that amount of time.

The police and security services didnt know anything about the two attacks in July, they admitted as much. The 90 day period wouldnt have helped them in that case.

Britain has suffered 40 years of terrorism under various Irish paramilitary groups and we didnt need 90 day detention periods then.

Why now?

Apparently the police are asking for them. Bit of good advice: never give the police all the powers they want. You will regret it later on.
 
TheSorcerer
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 4:33 am

How long are the suspects in Sydney being held?
They had reconnaissance videos, maps and charts and chemical weapons(I think).
Tony looked like he was close to tears  rotfl 

The Sorcerer
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flylondon
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 4:40 am

Don't be so stupid! When a pensioner heckles Blair at the party conference clearly the police should have the option to hold him without charge for 90 days as well as aresting him under the anti-terrorism act!  sarcastic 
 
Thorben
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 4:48 am

Quoting ANother (Reply 36):
90 days, 28 days or even 1 day - no police force should have this 'right'.

I see it like this: The police should only arrest people if they have an arrest warrant issued by an independent judge, who is responsible for that. In some cases of course, the police needs to arrest people they catch red-handed, so there is no time get an arrest warrant, but the police needs to get it within 24 hours, then. IIRC that is the way we do it in Germany, there are judges ready 24/7 to formally charge the suspects who then go into remand imprisonment.

Anyway, Blair said the UK is not a police state. I say: Not yet, but you're the world leader in CCTV, is that really worthy of the long democratic tradition??

He also said that terrorists want to destroy our life-style. I say: They may want to do that, but they need politicians like Blair to execute that plan.

I'm very grateful that those MPs rebelled and kicked the bill out. Kudos to them! I also hope that the ID card bill does not go through. Issue one for Blair, knock that on his forehead and send him to The Hague.

News are coming in about an explosion in Amman, but I'll stay on my ground. Abandoning the civil liberties in order to fight terrorists is the completely wrong way.

Quoting TheSorcerer (Reply 13):
It wouldn't be fine for anyone, but I would go to prison for 90 days if it makes Britain safer(I'm not saying it is).

I'd rather get killed by terrorists than live in a police state.

Edit: What is this apple or what it is that all British are wearing on their jackets these days? What does it stand for?

[Edited 2005-11-09 20:57:04]
France 1789; Eastern Germany 1989; Tunisia 2011; Egypt 2011
 
GDB
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 5:36 am

That 'Apple' is a Poppy.
This flower that was seen even in the mud and trenches of WW1, so the Poppy became the symbol of UK war remembrance, both World Wars and since, up to and including Iraq.
By purchasing a Poppy you contribute to the welfare of veterans and their families, this happens every November, the formal ceremony being on WW1 Armistice Day, the 11th.
 
ryangooner
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 6:26 am

Quoting MD-90 (Reply 34):
Charge him with a crime if you have reasonable suspicion of involvement in any crime, from a bombing down to petty theft.

I think you need a little bit more than just a "reasonable suspicion" to gain a charge!

Ryan
ooh to ooh to be ooh to be a gooner!
 
9VSPO
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 7:20 am

All my life I have been a Labour supporter but seeing Tony Blair tonight try and defend his actions really turned my stomach.
 
whitehatter
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 8:06 am

Blair was following what the police and numerous public polls have indicated would be the acceptable figure. However the House decided that 90 days was too much and replaced it with 28 days.

Nobody can say that the Government was acting in bad faith. It was asked for by the police and security services, and would have needed oversight before a judge on a regular basis. What stuck in many throats was that the innocent could suffer in the process of trying to catch the guilty, and ninety days in Belmarsh is no holiday camp. People who kill others in car wrecks have got three months on occasions.

If you cannot prove anything after 28 days then bail or discharge from custody should be arranged. The police should know by then if they are going to be able to make a case of it. Just holding someone on the offchance of a breakthrough should never be policy.

Blair was right though, better to be defeated doing something for the right reasons than to win doing something for the wrong reasons.
Lead me not into temptation, I can find my own way there...
 
RichardPrice
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 8:15 am

Now all that needs to be struck down is secret evidence.

Thats the ability for the prosecution to present evidence that only the judge can see. The defendants legal team dont get to see it at all. How are they supposed to defend against that?
 
flyAUA
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RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 8:35 am

Quoting Banco (Reply 2):
90 days without charge is absolutely outrageous.

I can only agree... it's easy to say "I support it" or "90 days is not long", but one day when you are held for 90 days for not doing anything, you will think otherwise. This new law is rediculous!
Not drinking, also isn't a solution!
 
B744F
Posts: 2927
Joined: Sat Jan 21, 2006 4:52 pm

RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 10:17 am

Quoting LeonB1985 (Reply 8):
7 days in the USA (al-Qaeda death toll: 3000)

There are still American citizens locked up with no charges filed against them. Jose Padilla comes to mind as one of them who was locked away for quite a while. Your stat is nonsense
 
LeonB1985
Posts: 690
Joined: Sun Apr 03, 2005 9:21 pm

RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 10:27 am

Quoting B744F (Reply 47):
Quoting LeonB1985 (Reply 8):
7 days in the USA (al-Qaeda death toll: 3000)

There are still American citizens locked up with no charges filed against them. Jose Padilla comes to mind as one of them who was locked away for quite a while. Your stat is nonsense

Only passing on what the text said!  Smile
From the construction site that is better-known as London Heathrow Airport
 
Thorben
Posts: 2713
Joined: Fri Sep 09, 2005 10:29 pm

RE: New Anti-terror Laws: Is 90 Days Too Long?

Thu Nov 10, 2005 5:43 pm

Quoting GDB (Reply 41):

OK, thanks for the explanation.
France 1789; Eastern Germany 1989; Tunisia 2011; Egypt 2011

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