SYRGuy
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The Paying Of College Athletes, Your Thoughts?

Fri Jan 27, 2006 9:12 am

Just as the thread title says.

My opinion is that it's absolutely wrong in many ways. I think they receive enough when they get full ride scholarships when other students are having to pay their way through. Some could argue that the poor or less fortunate athletes need it to support their families, but how does that make them any different from any other less fortunate students attending school?

It may make more sense now as the NCAA has implemented the age limit on high school basketball recruits. But I think they will make their money soon enough, whether it's in pro sports or something else. I think getting a free education is fair enough, paying the athletes is going to far.

I'm not saying I think this will ever come to light, but its interesting to think about.
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VSlover
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RE: The Paying Of College Athletes, Your Thoughts?

Fri Jan 27, 2006 9:14 am

Quoting SYRGuy (Thread starter):
Some could argue that the poor or less fortunate athletes need it to support their families, but how does that make them any different from any other less fortunate students attending school?

it isnt. and i agree fully that the payment to college athletes is 100% wrong.
 
tbar220
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RE: The Paying Of College Athletes, Your Thoughts?

Fri Jan 27, 2006 9:43 am

I guess "paying" seems a bit of a wrong term to use here. Its not like they're getting paid like proffessional athletes do, rather they are getting scholarships. Scholarships are available to academic overachievers just as much as it is for those who are athletic achievers. Both worked very hard at what they are good at prior to entering higher education, and I think scholarship is a perfectly reasonable reward for it. You need some sort of incentive in today's world.
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AirCop
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RE: The Paying Of College Athletes, Your Thoughts?

Fri Jan 27, 2006 9:43 am

The athletes should have some kind of financial allowance. The fact is the NCAA prevents them from having any type of part time job, and the NCAA and TV benefits far more than the athletes do from the sporting events. What is a shame is the poor graduation rates of the student athletes at the big time schools. One couple told me about their son being recruited by both California and Kentucky to play tennis. UC-Berkeley offered a 1/4 scholarship while Kentucky offered a full ride. The Kentucky coach made the mistake to telling the parents that the kid didn't have to go to class. Yes, for the big sports like football and basketball at one of the big 6 football conferences pay the kids $400-$500 a month.
 
PIA777
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RE: The Paying Of College Athletes, Your Thoughts?

Fri Jan 27, 2006 9:55 am

Quoting SYRGuy (Thread starter):
The Paying Of College Athletes, Your Thoughts?

The Universities make a bunch of money on those athletes. In return they
get a $100,000 education in some cases. They also get room and board.
My thinking is that they do get paid.

PIA777
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Gilligan
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RE: The Paying Of College Athletes, Your Thoughts?

Fri Jan 27, 2006 10:00 am

Quoting AirCop (Reply 3):
The athletes should have some kind of financial allowance. The fact is the NCAA prevents them from having any type of part time job, and the NCAA and TV benefits far more than the athletes do from the sporting events

A person who is attending a university on a academic scholarship can have a part time job, why not an athelete? I think these rules were imposed when the Olympics were still an amatuers only event. Since their rules have changed, why can't the NCAA's?
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SYRGuy
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RE: The Paying Of College Athletes, Your Thoughts?

Fri Jan 27, 2006 10:35 am

Quoting Tbar220 (Reply 2):
I guess "paying" seems a bit of a wrong term to use here. Its not like they're getting paid like proffessional athletes do, rather they are getting scholarships.

You missed the point of the thread, I wasn't arguing that athletes shouldn't receive full ride scholarships, its that they shouldn't receive paychecks, and believe me it has been brought up by various sources. That's what I was meaning in the thread title.

Quoting PIA777 (Reply 4):
The Universities make a bunch of money on those athletes. In return they
get a $100,000 education in some cases. They also get room and board.
My thinking is that they do get paid.

That's pretty much my point exactly.
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AirCop
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RE: The Paying Of College Athletes, Your Thoughts?

Fri Jan 27, 2006 10:42 am

You can't tell me that an education from a Florida, Mississippi, Arkansas, Northern Colorado,etc is worth $100,000. For the record Ivy league schools do not give scholarships for athletes, and at most schools, minor sports get only partial scholarships.
 
SYRGuy
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RE: The Paying Of College Athletes, Your Thoughts?

Fri Jan 27, 2006 10:45 am

Quoting AirCop (Reply 7):
minor sports get only partial scholarships.

Mostly because they are just that, MINOR sports. Which means they don't make nearly as much money as the major ones.
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MattCLE
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RE: The Paying Of College Athletes, Your Thoughts?

Fri Jan 27, 2006 10:51 am

My (female) friend got a full ride for golf!

If the athletes need money, why don't they take out a loan like 99% of the other students who don't/can't work?
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Logan22L
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RE: The Paying Of College Athletes, Your Thoughts?

Fri Jan 27, 2006 10:59 am

Quoting Gilligan (Reply 5):
A person who is attending a university on a academic scholarship can have a part time job, why not an athelete?

Truth of the matter is, many NCAA athletes don't even have time to study properly let alone work a low-level job, which is why:

Quoting PIA777 (Reply 4):
In return they
get a $100,000 education in some cases.

Scholarship is enough.
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ilikeyyc
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RE: The Paying Of College Athletes, Your Thoughts?

Fri Jan 27, 2006 11:06 am

I'll go ahead and stir the pot on this topic- I don't see much wrong with paying the students (although receiving a scholarship for playing is a form of payment).

College sports teams are nothing more than a giant promotional tool for universities and colleges. a football game is a 2.5 hour advertisement for each university, not to mention all of the air time they get on ESPN and the 11 o'clock news. Kids grow up hearing about Michigan, UCLA, etc. etc. from watching college sports. Meanwhile, what normal person has heard of Embry-Riddle? So they apply to the campus' they hear all the time through sports.

So the way I see it, college athletes do a service for a university and athletes should be compensated for that service. If a university sees an upcoming star, they should have every means to attract and retain that talent.
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Gilligan
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RE: The Paying Of College Athletes, Your Thoughts?

Fri Jan 27, 2006 11:22 am

Quoting Logan22L (Reply 10):
Truth of the matter is, many NCAA athletes don't even have time to study properly let alone work a low-level job, which is why:

So then what you are saying is that they are not attending college to get an education, they are attending college to further their chosen sporting career? If that is so the university should pay them to play since the university is making big bucks off them and expecting them to perform even to the detriment of their education.
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Logan22L
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RE: The Paying Of College Athletes, Your Thoughts?

Fri Jan 27, 2006 11:34 am

Quoting Gilligan (Reply 12):
So then what you are saying is that they are not attending college to get an education, they are attending college to further their chosen sporting career? If that is so the university should pay them to play since the university is making big bucks off them and expecting them to perform even to the detriment of their education.

The students are, in many cases, attending a University to further their sporting career. Thus the students are rolling the dice, let them take their own chances if they cannot get a good job if they don't make it to the pros. Tuition, board, and a degree sounds like enough compensation to me.
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Gilligan
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RE: The Paying Of College Athletes, Your Thoughts?

Fri Jan 27, 2006 11:44 am

Quoting Logan22L (Reply 13):
Thus the students are rolling the dice, let them take their own chances if they cannot get a good job if they don't make it to the pros.

How much money does a professional field hockey player make?
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SYRGuy
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RE: The Paying Of College Athletes, Your Thoughts?

Fri Jan 27, 2006 11:49 am

Quoting Gilligan (Reply 14):
How much money does a professional field hockey player make?

No one is making them play professional field hockey. Your forgetting that the college has paid for the EDUCATION as well, they could always USE that education that was paid for and do something else.
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Gilligan
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RE: The Paying Of College Athletes, Your Thoughts?

Fri Jan 27, 2006 11:58 am

Quoting SYRGuy (Reply 15):
Your forgetting that the college has paid for the EDUCATION as well, they could always USE that education that was paid for and do something else.

The student is paying for his/her education by providing the college with a means of making money via their prowess at a particular sport. It seems to me that if the student has another way to make money such as endorsements they should not be precluded from doing so.
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USAFHummer
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RE: The Paying Of College Athletes, Your Thoughts?

Fri Jan 27, 2006 12:12 pm

Quoting AirCop (Reply 7):
For the record Ivy league schools do not give scholarships for athletes, and at most schools, minor sports get only partial scholarships.

In addition, there are no athletic scholarships at all on the D-III level...

Quoting Logan22L (Reply 13):
The students are, in many cases, attending a University to further their sporting career.

The NCAA has had a TV commercial out for a while (despite the date on the PR below, Ive seen the spot again recently, its been on for ages) stating "There are over 360,000 NCAA student-athletes, and just about all of us will be going pro in something other than sports..."

http://www.ncaa.org/releases/miscellaneous/2003031101ms.htm

Greg

[Edited 2006-01-27 04:30:41]
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Logan22L
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RE: The Paying Of College Athletes, Your Thoughts?

Fri Jan 27, 2006 12:28 pm

Quoting Gilligan (Reply 14):
How much money does a professional field hockey player make?



Quoting Gilligan (Reply 12):
since the university is making big bucks off them

How much money does a collegiate field hockey player bring into a school?
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ltbewr
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RE: The Paying Of College Athletes, Your Thoughts?

Fri Jan 27, 2006 12:39 pm

To me I would like a total end to all 'athletic' scholarship. Far too often those whom are 'athletes' whom get the athletic scholarships are admited just on or mostly well below the standards of non-athletic students. Far too often, athletic schlorship students are a way to increase the numbers of non-white students to look better to government Affirmation Action goals/demands. Yet, many 1,000's of students who meet the full standard academic qualifications may have to forgo going to college or work full or part time to pay for their college and living costs, hurting their grades and job opportunites as they cannot get the schlorships they needed or build up obscene student loan debts that will hurt them in their life after the complete college.
Colleges and Universities are for EDUCATION, not basketball, football or golf. Schlorships should be for qualified schlors, especially those from the middle or lower economic classes and backgrounds and fully academically qualified. Also, if athletes were to get cash payments in additon to their athletlic schlorships, then why not cash payments to those whom get academic schlorships? They are no less needy?
As to why the NCAA rules against jobs for athletic schlorships students, that is because in the dark past athletes would get overpaid or no-work/no-show 'jobs' with rich or connected alumni.
 
MD-90
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RE: The Paying Of College Athletes, Your Thoughts?

Fri Jan 27, 2006 12:41 pm

Quoting Logan22L (Reply 18):

How much money does a collegiate field hockey player bring into a school?

None. No benefit unless it's a female player who can help satisfy Title IX quotas.


I'm against paying athletes, unless it was a set amount by the NCAA, this much and no more. Otherwise huge schools (like Texas) would have an insurmountable advantage over smaller schools.
 
cptkrell
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RE: The Paying Of College Athletes, Your Thoughts?

Fri Jan 27, 2006 12:42 pm

I suppose I don't disagree with a PARTIAL scholorship for sports in college, but I'd like to see more scolorships readily available to other majors too, like the unimportant stuff; science, engineering, biology/medicine, architecture/design, etc.

Problem is, of course, that collegiate sports is just another business. That a guy could advance to millions/year for playing a kid's game before graduation vs. a bright micro-biologist major having to "shop" for a scholorship is rather disgusting. But, I guess that's just me and my old-timey attitude. Regards...jack
all best; jack
 
senorcarnival
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RE: The Paying Of College Athletes, Your Thoughts?

Fri Jan 27, 2006 2:07 pm

Quoting AirCop (Reply 7):
You can't tell me that an education from a Florida, Mississippi, Arkansas, Northern Colorado,etc is worth $100,000.

If the student-athlete in question would be an out-of-state student had not been for a full-ride scholarship, it can be that much, if not more. Case in point, UF. Here's an estimated cost of attendence at UF:
http://www.admissions.ufl.edu/annualcosts.html
$27,019 for an out-of-state on-campus student X 4 = $108,076

An out-of-state estimated cost of attendence between $25-$30k is actually pretty average for most public institutions.
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VSlover
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RE: The Paying Of College Athletes, Your Thoughts?

Fri Jan 27, 2006 2:23 pm

even in the ivies where most people who need assistance are more than well funded...when it comes to athletes, it has been well-documented that certain applicants are given a gloss-over in his/her application depending on the needs of sports at that time.

so while there is no out and out scholarship...there is indeed recruiting and admissions preference, for lack of a better term. this brings into question: what is the purpose of an institution of higher learning? especially the ivies? a majority would argue academia, yet there are plenty of alums among us that are from the "good old days" and base much of their donations on sports and sports programs which carries over from generation to generation--so this preference will always be there.
 
tbar220
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RE: The Paying Of College Athletes, Your Thoughts?

Fri Jan 27, 2006 2:33 pm

Quoting SYRGuy (Reply 6):
You missed the point of the thread, I wasn't arguing that athletes shouldn't receive full ride scholarships, its that they shouldn't receive paychecks, and believe me it has been brought up by various sources.

My bad, I thought that's what you meant. I always believed that student athletes weren't allowed to be paid for playing collegiate sports. I have no problem giving sports scholarships, but being paid on top of that should not be allowed. BTW, is it? Are there examples of this?
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CaptOveur
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RE: The Paying Of College Athletes, Your Thoughts?

Fri Jan 27, 2006 3:53 pm

Quoting SYRGuy (Thread starter):
I think they receive enough when they get full ride scholarships when other students are having to pay their way through.

The part of the whole college athlete thing that really pisses me off the most is the fact a lot of them never see the inside of a classroom, because they don't have to. Does anyone here honestly believe Vince Young ever even sat in a class at UT. If so, why does he still have a third grade interview vocabulary?

Quoting Tbar220 (Reply 2):
Both worked very hard at what they are good at prior to entering higher education, and I think scholarship is a perfectly reasonable reward for it.

Thats fine, but don't compromise the academics in the interest of athletics. Too many schools are losing sight of what they are really supposed to be doing.

Quoting AirCop (Reply 3):
The athletes should have some kind of financial allowance.

No argument here but lets keep it reasonable. Vince Young was driving a brand new H2, not bad considering his family income was probably well below the poverty line. The ROTC scholarship students get something like a $600 a month stipend, after their tuition, books, and housing is paid for, this is more than reasonable. Plus, the ROTC scholarship students have to go to class and maintain a GPA.

Quoting Ilikeyyc (Reply 11):
College sports teams are nothing more than a giant promotional tool for universities and colleges. a football game is a 2.5 hour advertisement for each university, not to mention all of the air time they get on ESPN and the 11 o'clock news. Kids grow up hearing about Michigan, UCLA, etc. etc. from watching college sports.

This is because college is no longer about education, it is about making money. Every decision my university makes results in students paying more for less. The basketball team here gets away with murder (almost litterally) and gets paid to do it, all because we are soooo proud of our division 1 team that nobody watches.
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airtran737
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RE: The Paying Of College Athletes, Your Thoughts?

Fri Jan 27, 2006 4:10 pm

I played Division II football in college, so I can chime in a bit. It was very hard to get by without some kind of outside financial assistance. Imagine being an 18 year old kid from a lower middle class home, my family didn't have a lot of money to buy me clothes or a new car when I went to college. The boosters and coaches always helped us out if we needed it. They weren't giving us thousands of dollars or anything, but they would give us enough to help us out. Think of it like this. Athletics are a billion dollar business for the NCAA. The athletes who are fueling that business deserve some form of compensation. Maybe a $3,000 allowance for clothing and the basic necessities. College athletes don't deserve millions of dollars, but they do need something, to help them get by. Remember as an athlete you cant accept a plane ticket home to see your family at Christmas, or if you need to get home for a family members death or anything like that. And to top it all of you cant have a part time job. It really hamstrings you.
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MD-90
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RE: The Paying Of College Athletes, Your Thoughts?

Fri Jan 27, 2006 5:44 pm

Quoting Captoveur (Reply 25):
The part of the whole college athlete thing that really pisses me off the most is the fact a lot of them never see the inside of a classroom, because they don't have to.

I see plenty of football players and basketball players in class, or hear of them being in certain classes. Mostly they're not in the majors that I've tried (aerospace engineering, landscape architecture, music education), but I have had a few classes with known athletes (sadly, while they look good as a group, no one knows who MSU's girls soccer team members are individually).

I wish Coach Croom was known for winning, but he is known for going to football players' classes and sitting in on them to make absolutely certain that they are going to class. Of course, MSU has the highest athlete graduation rate in the conference, behind only Vanderbilt.

Quoting Captoveur (Reply 25):
No argument here but lets keep it reasonable. Vince Young was driving a brand new H2, not bad considering his family income was probably well below the poverty line.

Could be a gift from an agent that wants to sign him.

Quoting AirTran737 (Reply 26):
The boosters and coaches always helped us out if we needed it. They weren't giving us thousands of dollars or anything, but they would give us enough to help us out.

Damn. That kind of activity gets SEC schools in big time trouble. Perhaps it's deliberately overlooked for Div II schools?
 
airtran737
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RE: The Paying Of College Athletes, Your Thoughts?

Fri Jan 27, 2006 6:05 pm

Quoting MD-90 (Reply 27):
Damn. That kind of activity gets SEC schools in big time trouble. Perhaps it's deliberately overlooked for Div II schools?

Believe me it happens at all levels. I have a friend who played for a Big Ten school who got much more than small handouts. Boosters give athletes all kinds of crap. Ever go on campus and see some freshman from one of the poorest neighborhoods imaginable driving an new Denali and living in an off campus apartment? There are ways around the rules, and it happens. Athletes need money for toothpaste, deodorant, clothing, and the basic needs like all of us do.
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legend500
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RE: The Paying Of College Athletes, Your Thoughts?

Fri Jan 27, 2006 6:23 pm

College athletes should be treated equally as all other students are (although I understand this to be somewhat fanciful). Do normal college students get money from the school for toothpaste or scholarships for their extracurricular activities (or in the same amounts)? No. Student athletes should be allowed to work. Otherwise, they should receive no special accommodation.
 
senorcarnival
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RE: The Paying Of College Athletes, Your Thoughts?

Sat Jan 28, 2006 1:26 am

Quoting Captoveur (Reply 25):
The basketball team here gets away with murder (almost litterally) and gets paid to do it, all because we are soooo proud of our division 1 team that nobody watches.

They do? Every semester thus far, I've ended up with at least one basketball or baseball player in one or more of my classes. Except for the days they have away games, they are always in class. So could you give me an example of this getting away with murder?
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