texdravid
Posts: 1394
Joined: Fri May 14, 2004 3:21 pm

Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Sun Mar 05, 2006 1:30 am

Here is Spike Lee recently trashing Condoleeza Rice.

http://www.nydailynews.com/front/story/396582p-336150c.html

Memo to Spike: Keep it up. Nothing helps this administration more than thugs like you to denigrate them. Another unhinged liberal becoming even more unhinged.
Tort reform now. Throw lawyers in jail later.
 
stuckinMAF
Posts: 1022
Joined: Tue Oct 25, 2005 9:49 pm

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Sun Mar 05, 2006 1:43 am

Quoting Texdravid (Thread starter):
Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Surprise, surprise. Spike Lee trashes everything except what is already trash. He's just another cockroach, what he doesn't eat, he sh!ts on.
"A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity" -Sigmund Freud
 
Scorpio
Posts: 4764
Joined: Thu Oct 04, 2001 3:48 am

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Sun Mar 05, 2006 1:54 am

Ooh great, another cirkle jerk by the 'with us or against us' crowd.  Yeah sure Exactly what we needed on here...
 
WellHung
Posts: 3299
Joined: Mon Feb 23, 2004 8:50 pm

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Sun Mar 05, 2006 2:04 am

Quoting Texdravid (Thread starter):
Nothing helps this administration more than thugs like you to denigrate them.

Then you better be praying for a whole lotta 'thugs'...

http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/03/...poll/index.html?section=cnn_latest

President Bush's approval rating is mired near its record low amid concerns about his ability to manage the government and pessimism over the war in Iraq, according to a CNN/USA Today/Gallup poll released Thursday.

The poll, conducted Tuesday and Wednesday, found Bush's approval rating at 38 percent -- down a percentage point from a mid-February survey and just a point above his record low of 37 percent in November. His disapproval rating was 60 percent, tying November's worst-ever mark.
 
stuckinMAF
Posts: 1022
Joined: Tue Oct 25, 2005 9:49 pm

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Sun Mar 05, 2006 2:07 am

Quoting WellHung (Reply 3):
Then you better be praying for a whole lotta 'thugs'...

And apparently you include yourself in that group. Congratulations.
"A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity" -Sigmund Freud
 
tbar220
Posts: 6706
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2000 12:08 pm

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Sun Mar 05, 2006 2:08 am

Why is he suddenly an "unhinged liberal"? Is it because he's right? If you want, I can list failure after failure of Condolezza Rice as an official in this government. But hey, everybody praises her as another minority in this administration, so they must not be racist.

Rice is just as bad, just as corrupt, and just as much a liar as Bush, Cheney, and Rove.
NO URLS in signature
 
WellHung
Posts: 3299
Joined: Mon Feb 23, 2004 8:50 pm

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Sun Mar 05, 2006 2:11 am

Quoting StuckinMAF (Reply 4):
And apparently you include yourself in that group. Congratulations.

That doesn't make sense.
 
texdravid
Posts: 1394
Joined: Fri May 14, 2004 3:21 pm

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Sun Mar 05, 2006 2:12 am

I completely agree that Bush is in deep political trouble. No doubt about that.
Most of it has been his own laziness, his unflinching ability to look disinterested, and his inability to fire some of the old hands who have been there for 6 years.

However, when things get rough for Bush, as they did in early 2004 and at other times, the over-reaction and the vitriol from his enemies helps him immeasurably. Thus, Spike Lee's comments, and others, seem like piling on and Americans of all political stripes, look down at that behavior.
Tort reform now. Throw lawyers in jail later.
 
halls120
Posts: 8724
Joined: Sun Jun 05, 2005 3:24 am

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Sun Mar 05, 2006 9:53 am

Quoting Tbar220 (Reply 5):
If you want, I can list failure after failure of Condolezza Rice as an official in this government.

Please do. I'd be interested to see what you think she has failed at.
"Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself." Mark Twain, a Biography
 
AeroWesty
Posts: 19551
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 7:37 am

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Sun Mar 05, 2006 10:04 am

Since there was nothing in the news about Kennedy or Sheehan, the wacko right has stooped to pulling up gossip column quotes that are unattributed as to date, time and place, just to stir the pot.

LOL, I'd hate to be that bored. No more 3 year old quotes from Julian Bond you want to entertain us with today?

(Note: Ted Casablanca is a better source for real gossip than Ben Widdicombe any day.)
International Homo of Mystery
 
halls120
Posts: 8724
Joined: Sun Jun 05, 2005 3:24 am

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Sun Mar 05, 2006 10:26 am

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 9):
Since there was nothing in the news about Kennedy or Sheehan, the wacko right has stooped to pulling up gossip column quotes that are unattributed as to date, time and place, just to stir the pot.

Actually, there was.  biggrin 

Quote:


Sheehan To Participate In Peace Rally At UCSD

Last Updated:
03-03-06 at 7:15AM

Anti-war activist Cindy Sheehan is back in San Diego Friday to take part in a daylong peace rally at UCSD.

The day will also include a march and a concert on the La Jolla campus.

Sheehan will speak as part of a panel discussion Friday night sponsored by the UC San Diego College Democrats.

Sheehan has gained national recognition for her protests outside President Bush's Texas ranch.
"Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself." Mark Twain, a Biography
 
zippyjet
Posts: 5077
Joined: Tue Sep 04, 2001 3:32 pm

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Sun Mar 05, 2006 11:21 am

Quoting WellHung (Reply 3):
President Bush's approval rating is mired near its record low amid concerns about his ability to manage the government and pessimism over the war in Iraq, according to a CNN/USA Today/Gallup poll released Thursday.

The White House to the Right gang need not worry! You are still omnipotent saints out to rid the free world of liberals, poor folk and any other human or for that matter critter that is not with you! And your mouthpiece in the media Fox News still keeps you perched on your holier than thou pedistal. The administration still walks on water according to Fox, Rush and leggy Ann Coulter.

BTW, I am not a Koom Ba Ya Liberal nor a mighty to the righty neo con.
 Smile  airplane 
I'm Zippyjet & I approve of this message!
 
Gilligan
Posts: 1993
Joined: Mon May 02, 2005 12:15 pm

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Sun Mar 05, 2006 11:22 am

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 8):
Quoting Tbar220 (Reply 5):
If you want, I can list failure after failure of Condolezza Rice as an official in this government.

Please do. I'd be interested to see what you think she has failed at.

Seconded. Please, I'd love to see this fairytale take shape.

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 9):
Since there was nothing in the news about Kennedy or Sheehan

How many times do you plan try this....wait ok let me help....  laughing   laughing   laughing   laughing   laughing  Good one Aero!!!
Warm winds blowing, heating blue skies, and a road that goes forever, I'm going to Texas!
 
deltagator
Posts: 6170
Joined: Fri Sep 23, 2005 9:56 am

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Sun Mar 05, 2006 11:44 am

Quoting Texdravid (Thread starter):
Here is Spike Lee recently trashing Condoleeza Rice.

Does he have a movie coming out soon? Indeed he does... http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0454848/

He needs to get his name in the media somehow since the movies he puts out are crap. Unhinged liberal or not, he's in it for the publicity. The old adage of Hollyweird...any publicity is good publicity.
"If you can't delight in the misery of others then you don't deserve to be a college football fan."
 
comorin
Posts: 3857
Joined: Sun May 29, 2005 5:52 am

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Sun Mar 05, 2006 11:54 am

Quoting Texdravid (Thread starter):
Here is Spike Lee recently trashing Condoleeza Rice.

And here is Texdravid trashing Spike Lee!

Seriously, Brother Tex, if it weren't for the liberals, we'd be mopping the OT instead of working on patients! Be Thankful....  duck 
 
tbar220
Posts: 6706
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2000 12:08 pm

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Sun Mar 05, 2006 5:16 pm

Failures of Condolezza Rice:

- The failures and lies about Weapons of Mass Destruction in Iraq (1)

- Her original refusal to testify in the 9/11 comission, even though she was National Security Advisor (2)

- Her failure to notice any threat in memo entitled "Bin Laden Determined to Strike U.S." prior to 9/11 (3)

- As national security advisor, her failure to properly address the spread of nuclear weapons to rogue nations like Iran and North Korea.

- Her ignoring of the now infamous Niger/Uranium misinformation in the president's state of the union, despite being warned on its authenticity (4)

- Her part in the administrations failures involving the war in Iraq and September 11 (5)
NO URLS in signature
 
satx
Posts: 2771
Joined: Mon Apr 11, 2005 7:26 am

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Sun Mar 05, 2006 6:30 pm

Quoting StuckinMAF (Reply 1):
He's just another cockroach, what he doesn't eat, he sh!ts on.

How do you get away with posts like this? Honestly?

Quoting Texdravid (Reply 7):
Most of it has been his own laziness, his unflinching ability to look disinterested, and his inability to fire some of the old hands who have been there for 6 years.

Why complain about him not firing them? Why not instead complain about him hiring them in the first place? Or did they instead hire him before his election? Sometimes it's so hard to tell who's really running the show over there.

Quoting Texdravid (Reply 7):
However, when things get rough for Bush, as they did in early 2004 and at other times, the over-reaction and the vitriol from his enemies helps him immeasurably.

Bush had an unprecedented chance to unify the country and perhaps the world after 9-11 and he blew it royally.

Quoting Texdravid (Reply 7):
Thus, Spike Lee's comments, and others, seem like piling on and Americans of all political stripes, look down at that behavior.

I thought it was mainly just uber-patriots with no stomach for the opposition that look down on public dissent. You know, the same people who had no problem with those slickboat veterans who tried to convince us that John Kerry would rather blow himself up than server his country? Funny how all it took was his eventual disagreement with the war to make an absurd suggestion of self-mutilation suddenly believable in the eyes of most Americans.
Open Season on Consumer Protections is Just Around the Corner...
 
halls120
Posts: 8724
Joined: Sun Jun 05, 2005 3:24 am

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Sun Mar 05, 2006 10:31 pm

Quoting Tbar220 (Reply 15):
- The failures and lies about Weapons of Mass Destruction in Iraq

I think the article cited isn't a "failure," nor do I see any lies. It is an excellent example of what we thought at the time about Saddam's intentions and capabilities. Did some of the assumptions turn out wrong? Yes. That's what happens when you deal with a country that prevents international inspectors from doing their job.

Quoting Tbar220 (Reply 15):
Her original refusal to testify in the 9/11 comission, even though she was National Security Advisor

I'd call that a resounding success. NSA's are NOT senate confirmed officials. They shouldn't be expected to run to the Hill every time some whining senator wags his or her finger. Wait until there is a democrat in the White House. If Congress summons his/her NSA to testify,watch for all the feigned outrage from the WH as to how that is inappropriate.

Quoting Tbar220 (Reply 15):
- Her failure to notice any threat in memo entitled "Bin Laden Determined to Strike U.S." prior to 9/11

Again, no failure. A mistake perhaps, but not a failure. She didn't say Bin Laden wasn't a threat. And you're taking a huge leap saying she failed to notice "any" threat in the memo. As the article said, the memo was considered to be "old news" and not new reporting. Now - if the restrictions on the sharing of intelligence removed by the Patriot Act hadn't been in place, perhaps the memo would have contained new evidence, and it would have been paid more attention to.

Question - do you equate "mistake" with "failure?"

Quoting Tbar220 (Reply 15):
As national security advisor, her failure to properly address the spread of nuclear weapons to rogue nations like Iran and North Korea.

I notice you cited no substantiation for this one, so let's conclude this is just your opinion. And it isn't based on the facts, so to consider it a failure is absurd. The nuclear problem in North Korea started LONG before Secretary Rice became NSA. And we all know who cut the deal that allowed the North Koreans to go forward.

Quoting Tbar220 (Reply 15):
Her ignoring of the now infamous Niger/Uranium misinformation in the president's state of the union, despite being warned on its authenticity

That one was a mistake. Not a failure, but a mistake.

Quoting Tbar220 (Reply 15):
Her part in the administrations failures involving the war in Iraq and September 11

How nice to give us a link to an article we can't access. Were mistakes made before 9/11? Sure. By a number of people in the then-current White House and prior WH, and on Capitol Hill. But to say Rice is a "failure" is simply not supported by the body of evidence. Even the sainted 9/11 Commission didn't point to Rice as the lynch pin of pre-9/11 failure.

I understand you don't like Rice. Not only is she a republican - and from your posts in the past, it is pretty clear that no republican can do anything right. And to make matters worse, she's a black female republican, which further incenses you, I'll bet.

But that's OK. Be as negatively partisan as you you want - you have the right. But those attitudes are part of the reason many of us have abandoned both the republicans and the democrats to be independents.
"Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself." Mark Twain, a Biography
 
deltagator
Posts: 6170
Joined: Fri Sep 23, 2005 9:56 am

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Mon Mar 06, 2006 12:27 am

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 17):
And we all know who cut the deal that allowed the North Koreans to go forward.

Cigar Boy! He also had numerous chance to nab Bin Laden after the first attack on the WTC but passed it up. Is the Bush administration completely free of blame...no. Is Clinton's administration partly to blame...yes. Should we move on and fix the problems...yes. Will we...who knows. It's doubtful anyone will get it right due to the political issues and governmental fiefdoms in place at all levels of government.

[Edited 2006-03-05 16:27:38]
"If you can't delight in the misery of others then you don't deserve to be a college football fan."
 
vaporlock
Posts: 3528
Joined: Sat May 19, 2001 9:22 am

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Mon Mar 06, 2006 12:41 am

Spike Lee is a cockroach for sure!!!! He is trash so it doesn't suprise me that's he'd do something like that.....and yes, he'd would do anything to get his name in the news...

Phyllis  bouncy 
 
cfalk
Posts: 10221
Joined: Mon Dec 04, 2000 6:38 pm

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Mon Mar 06, 2006 1:42 am

So far, the only people I ever hear making a big deal about the fact that Rice and her predecessor are black are those who want to drag them through the mud for it. I don't recall Bush trumpeting their race. He nominated them because they could do the job, and I doubt he notices what race they belong to. Wasn't that MLK's dream?

So who are the racists?
The only thing you should feel when shooting a terrorist: Recoil.
 
7FTwinOtter
Posts: 169
Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2005 10:24 pm

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Mon Mar 06, 2006 1:49 am

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 17):
That's what happens when you deal with a country that prevents international inspectors from doing their job.

And does the U.S let international weapons inspectors do their job in U.S facilities? i dont think so.  Yeah sure
 
sparky
Posts: 16
Joined: Sun Feb 11, 2001 5:30 pm

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Mon Mar 06, 2006 1:58 am

Condoleezza Rice's Credibility Gap

A point-by-point analysis of how one of America's top national security officials has a severe problem with the truth

March 26, 2004
Download: DOC, RTF, PDF

Pre-9/11 Intelligence

CLAIM: "I don't think anybody could have predicted that they would try to use an airplane as a missile, a hijacked airplane as a missile." – National Security Adviser Condoleezza Rice, 5/16/02
FACT: On August 6, 2001, the President personally "received a one-and-a-half page briefing advising him that Osama bin Laden was capable of a major strike against the US, and that the plot could include the hijacking of an American airplane." In July 2001, the Administration was also told that terrorists had explored using airplanes as missiles. [Source: NBC, 9/10/02; LA Times, 9/27/01]
CLAIM: In May 2002, Rice held a press conference to defend the Administration from new revelations that the President had been explicitly warned about an al Qaeda threat to airlines in August 2001. She "suggested that Bush had requested the briefing because of his keen concern about elevated terrorist threat levels that summer." [Source: Washington Post, 3/25/04]
FACT: According to the CIA, the briefing "was not requested by President Bush." As commissioner Richard Ben-Veniste disclosed, "the CIA informed the panel that the author of the briefing does not recall such a request from Bush and that the idea to compile the briefing came from within the CIA." [Source: Washington Post, 3/25/04]
CLAIM: "In June and July when the threat spikes were so high…we were at battle stations." – National Security Adviser Condoleezza Rice, 3/22/04
FACT: "Documents indicate that before Sept. 11, Ashcroft did not give terrorism top billing in his strategic plans for the Justice Department, which includes the FBI. A draft of Ashcroft's 'Strategic Plan' from Aug. 9, 2001, does not put fighting terrorism as one of the department's seven goals, ranking it as a sub-goal beneath gun violence and drugs. By contrast, in April 2000, Ashcroft's predecessor, Janet Reno, called terrorism 'the most challenging threat in the criminal justice area.'" Meanwhile, the Bush Administration decided to terminate "a highly classified program to monitor Al Qaeda suspects in the United States." [Source: Washington Post, 3/22/04; Newsweek, 3/21/04]
CLAIM: "The fact of the matter is [that] the administration focused on this before 9/11." – National Security Adviser Condoleezza Rice, 3/22/04
FACT: President Bush and Vice President Cheney's counterterrorism task force, which was created in May, never convened one single meeting. The President himself admitted that "I didn't feel the sense of urgency" about terrorism before 9/11. [Source: Washington Post, 1/20/02; Bob Woodward's "Bush at War"]
CLAIM: "Our [pre-9/11 NSPD] plan called for military options to attack al Qaeda and Taliban leadership, ground forces and other targets -- taking the fight to the enemy where he lived." – National Security Adviser Condoleezza Rice, 3/22/04
FACT: 9/11 Commissioner Gorelick: "There is nothing in the NSPD that came out that we could find that had an invasion plan, a military plan." Deputy Secretary of State Richard Armitage: "Right." Gorelick: "Is it true, as Dr. Rice said, 'Our plan called for military options to attack Al Qaida and Taliban leadership'?" Armitage: "No, I think that was amended after the horror of 9/11." [Source: 9/11 Commission testimony, 3/24/04]
Condi Rice on Pre-9/11 Counterterrorism Funding

CLAIM: "The president increased counterterrorism funding several-fold" before 9/11. – National Security Adviser Condoleezza Rice, 3/24/04
FACT: According to internal government documents, the first full Bush budget for FY2003 "did not endorse F.B.I. requests for $58 million for 149 new counterterrorism field agents, 200 intelligence analysts and 54 additional translators" and "proposed a $65 million cut for the program that gives state and local counterterrorism grants." Newsweek noted the Administration "vetoed a request to divert $800 million from missile defense into counterterrorism." [Source: New York Times, 2/28/04; Newsweek, 5/27/02]
Richard Clarke's Concerns

CLAIM: "Richard Clarke had plenty of opportunities to tell us in the administration that he thought the war on terrorism was moving in the wrong direction and he chose not to." – National Security Adviser Condoleezza Rice, 3/22/04
FACT: Clarke sent a memo to Rice principals on 1/24/01 marked "urgent" asking for a Cabinet-level meeting to deal with an impending al Qaeda attack. The White House acknowledges this, but says "principals did not need to have a formal meeting to discuss the threat." No meeting occurred until one week before 9/11. [Source: CBS 60 Minutes, 3/24/04; White House Press Release, 3/21/04
CLAIM: "No al Qaeda plan was turned over to the new administration." – National Security Adviser Condoleezza Rice, 3/22/04
FACT: "On January 25th, 2001, Clarke forwarded his December 2000 strategy paper and a copy of his 1998 Delenda plan to the new national security adviser, Condoleezza Rice." – 9/11 Commission staff report, 3/24/04
Response to 9/11

CLAIM: "The president launched an aggressive response after 9/11." – National Security Adviser Condoleezza Rice, 3/22/04
FACT: "In the early days after the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks, the Bush White House cut by nearly two-thirds an emergency request for counterterrorism funds by the FBI, an internal administration budget document shows. The papers show that Ashcroft ranked counterterrorism efforts as a lower priority than his predecessor did, and that he resisted FBI requests for more counterterrorism funding before and immediately after the attacks." [Source: Washington Post, 3/22/04]
9/11 and Iraq Invasion Plans

CLAIM: "Not a single National Security Council principal at that meeting recommended to the president going after Iraq. The president thought about it. The next day he told me Iraq is to the side." – National Security Adviser Condoleezza Rice, 3/22/04
FACT: According to the Washington Post, "six days after the attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon, President Bush signed a 2-and-a-half-page document marked 'TOP SECRET'" that "directed the Pentagon to begin planning military options for an invasion of Iraq." This is corroborated by a CBS News, which reported on 9/4/02 that five hours after the 9/11 attacks, "Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld was telling his aides to come up with plans for striking Iraq." [Source: Washington Post, 1/12/03. CBS News, 9/4/02]
Iraq and WMD

CLAIM: "It's not as if anybody believes that Saddam Hussein was without weapons of mass destruction." – National Security Adviser Condoleezza Rice, 3/18/04
FACT: The Bush Administration's top weapons inspector David Kay "resigned his post in January, saying he did not believe banned stockpiles existed before the invasion" and has urged the Bush Administration to "come clean" about misleading America about the WMD threat. [Source: Chicago Tribune, 3/24/04; UK Guardian, 3/3/04]
9/11-al Qaeda-Iraq Link

CLAIM: "The president returned to the White House and called me in and said, I've learned from George Tenet that there is no evidence of a link between Saddam Hussein and 9/11." – National Security Adviser Condoleezza Rice, 3/22/04
FACT: If this is true, then why did the President and Vice President repeatedly claim Saddam Hussein was directly connected to 9/11? President Bush sent a letter to Congress on 3/19/03 saying that the Iraq war was permitted specifically under legislation that authorized force against "nations, organizations, or persons who planned, authorized, committed, or aided the terrorist attacks that occurred on September 11." Similarly, Vice President Cheney said on 9/14/03 that "It is not surprising that people make that connection" between Iraq and the 9/11 attacks, and said "we don't know" if there is a connection. [Source: BBC, 9/14/03]
 
tbar220
Posts: 6706
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2000 12:08 pm

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Mon Mar 06, 2006 9:39 am

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 17):

Question - do you equate "mistake" with "failure?"

After the number of mistakes she has done, yes, I would say she has had many failures as NSA head. At what point does she get a free pass for her "mistakes"? At what point do we ignore that her "mistakes" may have cost the lives of thousands of people? She and other ignored the threat before 9/11, and 3000 people died. She and others either lied, manipulated, or were just plain wrong about Iraq intelligence, and now over 2000 troops and 30,000 Iraqis are dead. Failures? Absolutely, when so many people are dead.

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 17):
How nice to give us a link to an article we can't access.

Go down to the bottom, you can access the article by clicking "Free Read Salon Now", you will have to watch a short advertisement. The article is completely accessible.

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 17):
Not only is she a republican - and from your posts in the past, it is pretty clear that no republican can do anything right. And to make matters worse, she's a black female republican, which further incenses you, I'll bet.

Way to put words into my mouth. So now you're accusing me of disliking her because she's black? Because she's female? So now I'm a sexist and a racist? You know what happens when you assume, you make a big ol' ass out of yourself.

I will criticize anyone, Republican or Democrat.
NO URLS in signature
 
deltagator
Posts: 6170
Joined: Fri Sep 23, 2005 9:56 am

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Mon Mar 06, 2006 9:52 am

Quoting Tbar220 (Reply 23):
"Free Read Salon Now",

Salon is hardly an unbiased source regarding anything to do with the Bush Administration.

Whoo Hoo! Post 1000. I should have saved it for something a little bit better like "I heard the NW DC-9s are getting retired tomorrow!"

[Edited 2006-03-06 01:53:29]
"If you can't delight in the misery of others then you don't deserve to be a college football fan."
 
halls120
Posts: 8724
Joined: Sun Jun 05, 2005 3:24 am

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Mon Mar 06, 2006 10:17 am

Quoting Tbar220 (Reply 23):
After the number of mistakes she has done, yes, I would say she has had many failures as NSA head. At what point does she get a free pass for her "mistakes"? At what point do we ignore that her "mistakes" may have cost the lives of thousands of people? She and other ignored the threat before 9/11, and 3000 people died.

Setting aside the issue of whether Rice deserves to take the sole blame for every mistake made in this Administration - she doesn't - based on your criteria, Franklin Roosevelt ought to be considered a failure. Do you consider HIM a failure? After all, the warning signs for an attack by Japan were in plain view.....

Quoting Tbar220 (Reply 23):
Way to put words into my mouth. So now you're accusing me of disliking her because she's black? Because she's female? So now I'm a sexist and a racist? You know what happens when you assume, you make a big ol' ass out of yourself.

I assume nothing of the kind. Perhaps I've missed the posts where you've ever said anything remotely favorable about a republican - and if you have, my apology in advance - but you seem to be a reliable knee-jerk republican hater - no matter what the truth on an issue might be. For example - your suggestion that Rice is solely responsible for North Korea is simply wrong. It is a clear bipartisan failure, and your characterization of it as a republican failure is why I suspect you dislike Rice not because she's black or female, but because she isn't a democrat.
"Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself." Mark Twain, a Biography
 
B777-700
Posts: 1244
Joined: Thu Oct 28, 1999 10:52 am

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Mon Mar 06, 2006 10:51 am

Quoting Texdravid (Thread starter):
Memo to Spike: Keep it up. Nothing helps this administration more than thugs like you to denigrate them. Another unhinged liberal becoming even more unhinged.

All those who think what Spike Lee has to say really has an effect on this country, raise your hand!

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 17):
I think the article cited isn't a "failure,"



Quoting Halls120 (Reply 17):
I'd call that a resounding success.



Quoting Halls120 (Reply 17):
Again, no failure.



Quoting Halls120 (Reply 17):
I notice you cited no substantiation for this one, so let's conclude this is just your opinion.



Quoting Halls120 (Reply 17):
That one was a mistake. Not a failure, but a mistake.



Quoting Halls120 (Reply 17):
How nice to give us a link to an article we can't access

Nice, so none of those count. Has this administration ever failed at anything? Please give us some examples.

Quoting DeltaGator (Reply 18):
Cigar Boy!

How dare you sir! When you insult a president, you tear this country apart and take a shit on all those who died to give you your freedom to say that! You sir are a traitor!...

Huh?...Oh...

That only applies to REPUBLICAN presidents...

My bad.  Wink
If you don't chew Big Red, then @#$% you.
 
halls120
Posts: 8724
Joined: Sun Jun 05, 2005 3:24 am

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Mon Mar 06, 2006 11:04 am

Quoting B777-700 (Reply 26):
Nice, so none of those count. Has this administration ever failed at anything? Please give us some examples

I didn't say they didn't "count" - I said they weren't evidence of "failure."

What has this administration failed at? Not the invasion of Iraq, but invading Iraq without a well-thought out plan for what they would do once they defeated Saddam.
"Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself." Mark Twain, a Biography
 
B777-700
Posts: 1244
Joined: Thu Oct 28, 1999 10:52 am

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Mon Mar 06, 2006 11:11 am

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 27):
Not the invasion of Iraq, but invading Iraq without a well-thought out plan for what they would do once they defeated Saddam.

So that's all huh?
If you don't chew Big Red, then @#$% you.
 
cairo
Posts: 889
Joined: Mon Jun 06, 2005 2:41 pm

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Mon Mar 06, 2006 11:12 am

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 25):
Setting aside the issue of whether Rice deserves to take the sole blame for every mistake made in this Administration - she doesn't - based on your criteria, Franklin Roosevelt ought to be considered a failure. Do you consider HIM a failure? After all, the warning signs for an attack by Japan were in plain view.....

Of course FDR was a failure at stopping Pearl Harbor. Does this make him a failure at president? No. It's hard for some to think about the idea that people don't always easily get categorized into 2 simple little boxes (success/failure, liberal/conservative, with us/against us), I know, but grown ups can admit failures and still, where justified, obtain overall success.

It is very aprapos that you brought this up - because, like the Bush White House 60 years later, FDR was looking and waiting for some kind of excuse to get the American public behind an overseas military commitment and evidence is clear that both administrations had a warning board that was 'blinking red' with an upcoming attack against America. Attacks are critical in justifying overseas military adventures.

Cairo
 
deltagator
Posts: 6170
Joined: Fri Sep 23, 2005 9:56 am

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Mon Mar 06, 2006 11:20 am

Quoting B777-700 (Reply 26):
How dare you sir! When you insult a president, you tear this country apart and take a shit on all those who died to give you your freedom to say that! You sir are a traitor!...

Funny!

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 25):
Huh?...Oh...

That only applies to REPUBLICAN presidents...

For some people yes. For me...no. Washington is full of double standards like calling the President names. While I trend Republican I am an equal opportunity pundit on why both parties are sometimes full of it. If Democrats annoy (which they commonly do) I'll say something about it. And if Replublicans annoy me (which they are starting to do in bigger numbers) I'll call them on it as well.
"If you can't delight in the misery of others then you don't deserve to be a college football fan."
 
halls120
Posts: 8724
Joined: Sun Jun 05, 2005 3:24 am

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Mon Mar 06, 2006 11:27 am

Quoting B777-700 (Reply 28):
Quoting Halls120 (Reply 27):
Not the invasion of Iraq, but invading Iraq without a well-thought out plan for what they would do once they defeated Saddam.

So that's all huh?

You didn't ask for an exhaustive list. I thought mentioning their biggest mistake was enough.

Quoting Cairo (Reply 29):
Of course FDR was a failure at stopping Pearl Harbor. Does this make him a failure at president? No. It's hard for some to think about the idea that people don't always easily get categorized into 2 simple little boxes (success/failure, liberal/conservative, with us/against us), I know, but grown ups can admit failures and still, where justified, obtain overall success.

My point exactly. Yet Tbar has easily placed Rice into the failure box - most likely because she doen't fit into his ideological box. He ignores two of her recent sucesses - moving the foreign service out of safe western european countries to places where they are needed more, and her India initiative.
"Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself." Mark Twain, a Biography
 
B777-700
Posts: 1244
Joined: Thu Oct 28, 1999 10:52 am

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Mon Mar 06, 2006 12:32 pm

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 31):
You didn't ask for an exhaustive list. I thought mentioning their biggest mistake was enough.

I did say examples, plural. See?

Quoting B777-700 (Reply 26):
Please give us some examples.

So, just the one?
If you don't chew Big Red, then @#$% you.
 
halls120
Posts: 8724
Joined: Sun Jun 05, 2005 3:24 am

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Mon Mar 06, 2006 12:36 pm

Quoting B777-700 (Reply 32):
Quoting B777-700 (Reply 26):
Please give us some examples.

So, just the one?

Harriet Miers nomination. That's two. Now are you happy?
"Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself." Mark Twain, a Biography
 
B777-700
Posts: 1244
Joined: Thu Oct 28, 1999 10:52 am

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Mon Mar 06, 2006 1:16 pm

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 33):
Harriet Miers nomination. That's two. Now are you happy?

Quite. Now how about Clinton's failures?

I bet you have a list a mile long...
If you don't chew Big Red, then @#$% you.
 
halls120
Posts: 8724
Joined: Sun Jun 05, 2005 3:24 am

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Mon Mar 06, 2006 1:21 pm

Quoting B777-700 (Reply 34):
ng Halls120 (Reply 33):
Harriet Miers nomination. That's two. Now are you happy?

Quite. Now how about Clinton's failures?

I bet you have a list a mile long...

Not really. I prefer not to dwell in the past. But since you asked, here are two - the North Korea nuclear deal and Somalia.
"Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself." Mark Twain, a Biography
 
User avatar
fxramper
Posts: 5837
Joined: Sun Dec 04, 2005 12:03 pm

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Mon Mar 06, 2006 1:29 pm

Spike Lee came to my school to speak. As a requirement of US100 (University Seminar) you had to go watch him speak and write a little deal about what he spoke about. During his presentation a good amount of students got up and left. I know the guy is a good director cause I've seen him films, I just think he had a Kanye West moment and said some silly stuff.
 
halls120
Posts: 8724
Joined: Sun Jun 05, 2005 3:24 am

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Mon Mar 06, 2006 1:37 pm

Quoting FXramper (Reply 36):
Spike Lee came to my school to speak. As a requirement of US100 (University Seminar) you had to go watch him speak and write a little deal about what he spoke about. During his presentation a good amount of students got up and left. I know the guy is a good director cause I've seen him films, I just think he had a Kanye West moment and said some silly stuff

I thinke Spike Lee is an excellent director. I've enjoyed most of his films, and expect to be a continued fan of his work.
"Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself." Mark Twain, a Biography
 
tbar220
Posts: 6706
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2000 12:08 pm

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Mon Mar 06, 2006 2:17 pm

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 25):
Do you consider HIM a failure? After all, the warning signs for an attack by Japan were in plain view.....

First, don't put words in my mouth. I said she has had failures, but is not a failure as a person or as an administrator. If you want to start a thread about the good things she's done, go ahead. That's not what I'm discussing here.

And yes, I consider his either missing or ignoring the warning signs for the attack on Pearl Harbor a failure.

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 25):
It is a clear bipartisan failure, and your characterization of it as a republican failure is why I suspect you dislike Rice not because she's black or female

Well then you should retract the statement you made earlier basically of accusing me of a racist and a sexist.
NO URLS in signature
 
halls120
Posts: 8724
Joined: Sun Jun 05, 2005 3:24 am

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Mon Mar 06, 2006 10:24 pm

Quoting Tbar220 (Reply 38):
Quoting Halls120 (Reply 25):
It is a clear bipartisan failure, and your characterization of it as a republican failure is why I suspect you dislike Rice not because she's black or female

Well then you should retract the statement you made earlier basically of accusing me of a racist and a sexist

LOL, I love it when liberals get so high and mighty about their ideological purity.

Even if I did call you a racist - which I did not - the above post ought to have made it abundantly clear I'm not saying you are. But let's look at my original post that has you so up in arms.

"I understand you don't like Rice. Not only is she a republican - and from your posts in the past, it is pretty clear that no republican can do anything right. And to make matters worse, she's a black female republican, which further incenses you, I'll bet."

What is racist or sexist about this? The clear implication I was making is that I think you can't stand Rice because she's a black female who isn't a sainted democrat. Not because she's black. Not because she's a female. But because she has the audacity to NOT be a liberal democrat.

How you can turn this into me supposedly making a racist statement is beyond belief. Or is it now racism to criticize someone for being a democrat?  Wink

As the saying goes, you shouldn't get your panties in a wad.
"Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself." Mark Twain, a Biography
 
slider
Posts: 6805
Joined: Wed Feb 25, 2004 11:42 pm

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Tue Mar 07, 2006 3:54 am

Quoting DeltaGator (Reply 13):
Does he have a movie coming out soon? Indeed he does... http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0454848/

He needs to get his name in the media somehow since the movies he puts out are crap. Unhinged liberal or not, he's in it for the publicity. The old adage of Hollyweird...any publicity is good publicity.

We have a bingo!!

That's the whole motivation. Just rant on against Condi and her workout routine if you choose, Spike. You're the one who evidently needs to convince the world that you have any relevance anymore. Meanwhile, the world keeps spinning around.
 
andessmf
Posts: 5689
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2006 8:53 am

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Tue Mar 07, 2006 4:14 am

Quoting Zippyjet (Reply 11):

BTW, I am not a Koom Ba Ya Liberal nor a mighty to the righty neo con.

Yes, I know. My friend from SFO doesnt think hes a liberal either, but he certainly spouts their lines. (Denial)

Quoting Tbar220 (Reply 15):
As national security advisor, her failure to properly address the spread of nuclear weapons to rogue nations like Iran and North Korea.

Pick one or the other please. On the one side, there were no WMD in Iraq and BUsh was wrong to go after them. I have not seen any concrete evidence of WMDs in Iran and North Korea, yet you fault Bush for not doing an Iraq on them? I mean, please select one or the other. (Cant keep you people happy, is either damn if you do or damn if you dont.)

Quoting Tbar220 (Reply 15):
Her ignoring of the now infamous Niger/Uranium misinformation in the president's state of the union, despite being warned on its authenticity

How do you explain the British still standing by their claims. Please read about this a little further before making uneducated statements.

Quoting Sparky (Reply 22):

Again, please read my responses above. First you fault the Bush admin for not doing enough and then for doing too much. And the whole story about WMDs? I have read and shown people more than one story (from CNN and others) as to how Bush was at fault for the careless disappearance from Iraq of equipment used to make WMDs.
 
tbar220
Posts: 6706
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2000 12:08 pm

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Tue Mar 07, 2006 11:10 am

Quoting Andessmf (Reply 41):

Pick one or the other please.

Wait a second, why? Under the president's watch, and under Rice's tenure as NSA, North Korea has most likely acqured Nuclear weapons and Iran is well on their way to it. Now don't put words into my mouth, where did I say we should "pull an Iraq" on them? I never said we should invade.

Quoting Andessmf (Reply 41):
How do you explain the British still standing by their claims. Please read about this a little further before making uneducated statements.

Do you have a source? You're telling me I'm uneducated?

- The White House has officially retracted that statement after it was found to be false. (1)
- The Bush Administration has admitted it was a mistake, and yet this evidence was part of the basis for invading Iraq. (2)
- French intelligence had warned the Bush administration up to a year before that there was no evidence to back up this claim (same source as above)

Take a look at the wikipedia source, it has an in depth look at this situation as well as linked sources to reliable main stream media.

As for the Butler Report, the British government is probably just trying to cover its ass for this mistake. The comittee was a secret comittee with only five members. Both Liberal Democrats and the Conservative party wouldn't take part in the inquiry, feeling it was too restrictive and not going in depth enough.

Ultimately though...

"Its main conclusion was that key intelligence used to justify the war with Iraq has been shown to be unreliable."(3)

Now care to call me uneducated once again?
NO URLS in signature
 
andessmf
Posts: 5689
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2006 8:53 am

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Tue Mar 07, 2006 1:24 pm

Quoting Tbar220 (Reply 42):
North Korea has most likely acqured Nuclear weapons and Iran is well on their way to it

I always love when people give me an out, which you did. Who was the ex-president who made a deal with North Korea to give them NUCLEAR reactors in exchange for them behaving? Hint: not Bush

Second question: How has the European approach to dealing with Iran been successful??

Quoting Tbar220 (Reply 42):
The Bush Administration has admitted it was a mistake, and yet this evidence was part of the basis for invading Iraq.



Quoting Tbar220 (Reply 42):
As for the Butler Report

Dont pick and choose what you want. You SELECT to believe one side and not the other, this is BIAS. The Butler report still stands by the story about Saddam 'seeking yellowcake from Africa', almost exactly what the president said. The president NEVER said that Saddam was attempting to buy yellowcake from Niger. And this is information from your own Wikipedia quote, so dont just dismiss the parts you dont like.

'Wilson and the U.S. ambassador to Niger concluded that a sale, although possible, was highly unlikely'. Now this comes directly from your first reference. Since no proof was verifiable, Bush lied. If Saddam had obtained nuclear weapons, well, just see above about what YOU said about North Korea and Iran. You guys are all over the map, it is almost funny if it wasnt so serious.

Now go educate yourself about the 'Tet Offensive' during the Vietnam war. This makes it pretty clear that the US had DEFEATED the communist. Yet, the same media that taoday claims quagmire in Iraq, claimed defeat in Vietnam. Repeat again, we DEFEATED the communist. Politically, the Vietnam war then became unwinnable. Now, you tell me if the killing fields and other communist atrocities in SE Asia had still occurred if the US had been allowed to finish that war?

You see, your side claims to be for justice and for the little guy, but just in that war millions were killed by the same attitude you now carry. And thousands have died in Iraq needlessly because terrorist think we are weak, and get encouragement from people like you. At least I can sleep at night.
 
tbar220
Posts: 6706
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2000 12:08 pm

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Tue Mar 07, 2006 2:31 pm

Quoting AndesSMF (Reply 43):
You see, your side claims to be for justice and for the little guy, but just in that war millions were killed by the same attitude you now carry. And thousands have died in Iraq needlessly because terrorist think we are weak, and get encouragement from people like you. At least I can sleep at night.

So I've been called a racist and a sexist in this thread. Now are you calling me a communist and a terrorist sympathizer? Come on dude, grow up.
NO URLS in signature
 
andessmf
Posts: 5689
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2006 8:53 am

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Tue Mar 07, 2006 5:18 pm

Again, please dont make this easy on me. Im not lying about my age, Ill be 35 this year, I presume yours is less than 25.

I was not calling you anything, if I had I would have written it in my post. I simply meant exactly what I meant, people like you, who (now obviously) have no good understanding of how the world works, thinks that their position is at a higher moral plane. But your position is truthfully killing more people now, and before, than my position.

You could have taken the opportunity I gave you to give a good rebuttal to my position, but you didnt. You simply gave a comment that was frankly expected from somebody your age (less than 25). So if you cant defend your position, perhaps it is because you have no logical way to defend it.
 
tbar220
Posts: 6706
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2000 12:08 pm

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Tue Mar 07, 2006 11:19 pm

Quoting AndesSMF (Reply 45):
So if you cant defend your position, perhaps it is because you have no logical way to defend it.

I will not try and defend my position when...

(A)

Quoting AndesSMF (Reply 45):
I simply meant exactly what I meant, people like you, who (now obviously) have no good understanding of how the world works, thinks that their position is at a higher moral plane.

You say you are morally superior to me because not only are you older, but somehow you're more wiser. You are making sweeping generalizations not concise arguments.

And...

(B)

Quoting AndesSMF (Reply 45):
But your position is truthfully killing more people now, and before, than my position.

I'll "defend" my opinion when you drop this idiocy that its killing people. You flat out accused me earlier of being a communist and terrorist sympathizer. I won't bother arguing with such an extremist view.

When you can drop the ridiculing, the generalizations, and the assumptions, then we can talk. If my opinion makes me a terrorist sympathizer because I criticize Rice and the Bush Administration, there's some issues.

Until then, this isn't an honest debate.
NO URLS in signature
 
andessmf
Posts: 5689
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2006 8:53 am

RE: Spike Lee Trashes The Secretary Of State

Wed Mar 08, 2006 2:08 am

Quoting Tbar220 (Reply 46):

You say you are morally superior to me because not only are you older, but somehow you're more wiser. You are making sweeping generalizations not concise arguments.

Never said that, you assumed.

Quoting Tbar220 (Reply 46):

I'll "defend" my opinion when you drop this idiocy that its killing people

Then please tell me how it isnt.

Quoting Tbar220 (Reply 46):
You flat out accused me earlier of being a communist and terrorist sympathizer

Again, never said that.

Quoting Tbar220 (Reply 46):
I won't bother arguing with such an extremist view.

I could say the same thing.

Quoting Tbar220 (Reply 46):
If my opinion makes me a terrorist sympathizer because I criticize Rice and the Bush Administration, there's some issues

Yes indeed there are some issues, yours. You have still not defended your position. I never called you a sympathizer, that is something coming directly out of your mouth, if the shoe fits...

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: blacksoviet, coolian2, scbriml and 19 guests