PSA53
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Did Anyone Else Hear About The Lieutenant?

Thu Jun 08, 2006 8:07 am

I thought I would put this one out.
I was driving to my other store, listening
to my radio,when KNX1070 radio, here in LA,
broke a story,saying a Lieutenant,called to
go to Iraq.has refused.

Has anyone else heard about this one?
The media has gone silent and it wasn't
even on CBS radio national news.

Did he have a change of mind?
The story is about 1 1/2 old.
Any input?

[Edited 2006-06-08 01:12:44]
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AerospaceFan
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RE: Did Anyone Else Hear About The Lieutenant?

Thu Jun 08, 2006 8:10 am

I listen to KNX, too. I saw the news covered on the morning cable news channels. The lieutenant offered to serve elsewhere, but was refused.

I just found the following news link:

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2003044627_nogo7m.html

[Edited 2006-06-08 01:17:51]
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jetjack74
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RE: Did Anyone Else Hear About The Lieutenant?

Thu Jun 08, 2006 8:17 am

Yes, 1st LT Watada stationed at Ft Lewis near Lakewood, WA south of Seattle. According to KVI/Talk570, he's part of a Stryker Brigade that has receievd it's marching orders. The LT is a coward, plain and simple. He signed a contract to support and defend the Constitution against all enemies foreign and domestic. This guy doesn't even have any dependants. Iwould understand somewhat if he had kids, his unwillingness, but that wouldn't excuse it. He would still have to go. But he's a coward. He should of found another way to pay for his college education. COWARD!!!!!
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fumanchewd
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RE: Did Anyone Else Hear About The Lieutenant?

Thu Jun 08, 2006 8:21 am

What an idiot. I'm all for people's opinions but he is an officer. What kind of message does this send to enlisted men and especially his own men? An officer in the military should not behave like this. I would expect it from a small amount of 18-20 year old uneducated privates, seamen, or airman but not him.

Perhaps he should have let the Salvation Army pay for his education and training. If they gave him a post with that bell in a bad neighborhood it would be easier to leave.

[Edited 2006-06-08 01:28:03]
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fumanchewd
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RE: Did Anyone Else Hear About The Lieutenant?

Thu Jun 08, 2006 8:26 am

"He has an obligation to fulfill, and it is not up to the individual officer to decide when he is going to deploy or not deploy," said Jerry Newberry, a Vietnam veteran and director of communications for the Veterans of Foreign Wars. "Some other officer will have to go in his place. He needs to think about that."
In the time of chimpanzees, I was a monkey...
 
PSA53
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RE: Did Anyone Else Hear About The Lieutenant?

Thu Jun 08, 2006 8:28 am

Quoting AerospaceFan (Reply 1):
AerospaceFan

Thanks for the story.

A Lieutenant,like any other military officer,should know better.
Civilians make policy.Not the military.What a betrayal!
Any war is immoral,all Presidents have lied or made excuses
to get into a war.Bastard!

 thumbsdown 
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ANCFlyer
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RE: Did Anyone Else Hear About The Lieutenant?

Thu Jun 08, 2006 8:56 am

Coward . . . that's all it is. Plain and simple.

Like a few others . . . sign up for the benefits and doesn't want to give anything back. Put on the uniform to impress whomever, and then when the time comes to put up or shut up, he conveniently leaves his balls in his other pants . . .

Coward.

Welcome to Prisoner Status and Leavenworth. What a piece of crap.
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
mrmeangenes
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RE: Did Anyone Else Hear About The Lieutenant?

Thu Jun 08, 2006 9:03 am

Let's wait and see what he does when the actual order to report is issued.

I have an idea he'll be hiding in Canada by then-but this time, may find the reception noticeably cooler.  bomb 
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NeilYYZ
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RE: Did Anyone Else Hear About The Lieutenant?

Thu Jun 08, 2006 9:19 am

Quoting Mrmeangenes (Reply 7):
I have an idea he'll be hiding in Canada by then-but this time, may find the reception noticeably cooler

Find out where he goes in Canada and I'll go escort him back over the nearest border crossing. You don't get to pick and choose what assignments you get, you go where the Army tells you to, even if it is dangerous and as ANCFlyer said, you've left your balls in your other pants.
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jetjack74
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RE: Did Anyone Else Hear About The Lieutenant?

Thu Jun 08, 2006 9:57 am

Quoting Mrmeangenes (Reply 7):
Let's wait and see what he does when the actual order to report is issued.

Well, he's already violated Articles #117(making provoking statement), #89(Disrespecting a Superior Commissioned Officer) and #133(Conduct Un-becoming a Commissioned Officer) of the UCMJ. Lt Watada is hlding another press conference for grandstanding. Ridiculous, just ridiculous. Jerks like this make me fume. I have respect for servicemembers who are in opposition to the war, but serve out their time.

[Edited 2006-06-08 03:01:03]
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Confuscius
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RE: Did Anyone Else Hear About The Lieutenant?

Thu Jun 08, 2006 10:09 am

If he wanted to avoid serving in combat, he should have joined the Air National Guard.



....oops! different war. Nevermind.
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WrenchBender
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RE: Did Anyone Else Hear About The Lieutenant?

Thu Jun 08, 2006 10:28 am

Quoting NeilYYZ (Reply 8):
Find out where he goes in Canada and I'll go escort him back over the nearest border crossing.

Then please go find the bunch of deserters that are trying to claim refugee status and get rid of them.

He may be a coward but he at least appears to be willing to face the consequences of his actions.

WrenchBender
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TedTAce
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RE: Did Anyone Else Hear About The Lieutenant?

Thu Jun 08, 2006 10:32 am

Quoting Jetjack74 (Reply 2):
The LT



Quoting Jetjack74 (Reply 2):
pay for his college education.

Umm, if he's an officer doesn't he already have his education?  Yeah sure

JetJoke's irrational and emotional charge aside, this guy should get aired out to dry. Last time I checked this guy is supposed to be a leader, and his actions are not demonstrating any leadership qualities. If he was a 4 star general, this might make him a maverick, but @ Lt, he's a mid level manager on a good day and a supervisor level normally. Sometimes you have to eat the shit of the upper level managment, this guy is not a good team player. I hope he never gets past making the Fries @ Mc Donalds in the 'real world'
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ANCFlyer
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RE: Did Anyone Else Hear About The Lieutenant?

Thu Jun 08, 2006 10:58 am

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 12):
but @ Lt, he's a mid level manager

Not even close.

Looking at his uniform, he's wearing crossed rifles which means he's an infantry puke.

As a Lieutenant he's a low-level manager . . . on a good day. Perhaps, on a good day, in a squared away Infantry Platoon, he's got 30 people working for him.

In reality - he's got the pull of a scrub brush and the horsepower of a Volkswagen Beetle - the REAL decision maker is that Platoon Sergeant that has ten tmes the time in service as this Lieutenant. When the shit hits the fan, the troops will always ask, "What now Sarge"? You damn suer won't hear 'em saying "What now L T"?

He may be lucky enough to be a company executive officer . . . in which case he's no more than a glorified ticket puncher . . . . checking the latrine police, watching the mechanics in the motorpool, or checking the mess hall.

Regardless, TedT, JetJack's accusations are spot on . . . and what you know about the US Army, or the UCMJ, JetJack and I could probably piss into a thimble.

The guy's a gawddamn Coward . . . . paint a "P: on his back and send him to roost in Leavenworth!
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
fumanchewd
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RE: Did Anyone Else Hear About The Lieutenant?

Thu Jun 08, 2006 10:58 am

Quoting WrenchBender (Reply 11):

He may be a coward but he at least appears to be willing to face the consequences of his actions.

Like joining the military and having to follow orders?
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halls120
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RE: Did Anyone Else Hear About The Lieutenant?

Thu Jun 08, 2006 11:04 am

Quoting Jetjack74 (Reply 9):
Well, he's already violated Articles #117(making provoking statement), #89(Disrespecting a Superior Commissioned Officer) and #133(Conduct Un-becoming a Commissioned Officer) of the UCMJ. Lt Watada is hlding another press conference for grandstanding. Ridiculous, just ridiculous. Jerks like this make me fume. I have respect for servicemembers who are in opposition to the war, but serve out their time.

This is the kind of case JAG's on the prosecution side love. You could raffle off the right to be first chair on this one and hold one hell of a party with the proceeds. The charge sheet on this idiot is going to run several pages. On the other hand, this kind of case makes detailed military defense counsel hide.

I see a shitty mattress, iron bars, and foul food all served up in a certain midwestern facility for the the soon to be court-martialed young idiot.
"Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself." Mark Twain, a Biography
 
WrenchBender
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RE: Did Anyone Else Hear About The Lieutenant?

Thu Jun 08, 2006 11:06 am

Quoting Fumanchewd (Reply 14):
Like joining the military and having to follow orders?

He chose to disobey and he is still there, unlike Hinzman, Key and at least 10 others who deserted and ran to Canada to hide. I am disgusted that they have been allowed to stay here.

WrenchBender
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itsjustme
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RE: Did Anyone Else Hear About The Lieutenant?

Thu Jun 08, 2006 11:10 am

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 6):
Coward . . . that's all it is. Plain and simple.

 checkmark 

Nothing else can or needs to be said.
 
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jetjack74
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RE: Did Anyone Else Hear About The Lieutenant?

Thu Jun 08, 2006 11:33 am

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 12):
Umm, if he's an officer doesn't he already have his education?

Ummm, ROTC? Enlisted Commissioning Programme? OCS? If you become a commissioned officer, and you already have a 4 year degree, you are entitled to full tuition reimbursement for those who've already achieved the basic educational requirements to obtaining a commission. I myself could qualify for a commission, but I enjoy my enlisted job, and would have to forfeit my aircrew billet, which i'm unwilling to do.

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 12):
JetJoke's irrational and emotional charge aside, this guy should get aired out to dry

Well Ted, is it irrational to expect this guy to adhere to his oath of commission? Is it irrational to be angry at someone who is supposed to be setting an example as to what military bearing is? If this was a attorney violating his oath of confidentiality or Attorney/Client Privilege, would be irrational for his/her fellow lawyers to be outraged and angry. If a doctor violates the Doctor/Patient Privacy Act, would it irrational for fellow MD's to outraged and angry? This guy has barely been in this unit a year, and he's backing away from his duties, while fellow soldiers are going back for their 2nd and 3rd tours in the WOT. That's what sad part is.
I do have a theory that many here are sure to hoot. This could in fact be a plant for the anti-war crowd. Given the fact that his father was an anti-war advocate, I find it hard to believe this guy had any true intentions to begin with. He immediately comes out in the public forum to oppose being sent down-range. I have respect for servicemembers who oppose the war, but continue to serve until their contract is up. I remember someone on here posted an article about a Marine Corporal who returned from the Iraq war, and wrote an article about his opposition to war. That was fine, because he at least served his time and got out. He didn't upstage his fellow marines, and make a controversy over it. Irrational, huh? Well, i'm taking the highroad on this one. But if i'm being called irrational over this, that's fine, i'll take irrationality over cowardice anyday of the week.

[Edited 2006-06-08 04:40:55]
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TedTAce
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RE: Did Anyone Else Hear About The Lieutenant?

Thu Jun 08, 2006 11:41 am

Quoting Jetjack74 (Reply 18):
i'll take irrationality over cowardice anyday of the week.

oh, you mean FA jokes?

JJ, I just love getting your goat. I hope you realize that way deep down I do have some respect for you
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itsjustme
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RE: Did Anyone Else Hear About The Lieutenant?

Thu Jun 08, 2006 11:44 am

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 12):
JetJoke's irrational and emotional charge aside

TedTAce, not only do you lose credibility when you purposely distort the user name of someone you're quoting but it also makes you look like a childish ass. If you're going to resort to such pre-adolescent antics, perhaps you should take your rants over to myspace.com.

There was nothing irrational about JetJack74's post. As he said, this Lt. is a coward and should be disciplined as such.
 
TedTAce
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RE: Did Anyone Else Hear About The Lieutenant?

Thu Jun 08, 2006 12:02 pm

Quoting Itsjustme (Reply 20):
There was nothing irrational about JetJack74's post.

I disagree:

Quoting Jetjack74 (Reply 2):
This guy doesn't even have any dependants



Quoting Jetjack74 (Reply 2):
Iwould understand somewhat if he had kids, his unwillingness, but that wouldn't excuse it

Those are emotional arguments.

As for the other stuff, maybe you don't know our history.

Sure, one of these days our paths might cross, and he will kick the ever loving shit out of me. But not only will I not press charges, but I'll buy him a beer afterwards.
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BMIFlyer
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RE: Did Anyone Else Hear About The Lieutenant?

Thu Jun 08, 2006 12:11 pm

He signed up to Serve, and that means he has to go to where ever the military decide to send him.  yes 

What an idiot  Yeah sure

If he didn't want to go to war, he should have got a good civilian job.....



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NeilYYZ
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RE: Did Anyone Else Hear About The Lieutenant?

Thu Jun 08, 2006 1:51 pm

Quoting WrenchBender (Reply 11):
Then please go find the bunch of deserters that are trying to claim refugee status and get rid of them.

Give me a list of addresses and a total number that I have to send back over the border (that will help me decide which vehicle to bring, either the Camry, 4 Runner or Odyssey, of if need be I can rent a truck).

Quoting WrenchBender (Reply 16):

He chose to disobey and he is still there, unlike Hinzman, Key and at least 10 others who deserted and ran to Canada to hide. I am disgusted that they have been allowed to stay here.

As am I, it's pathetic, I would never expect America to harbor a Canadian deserter, and as such, Canada should be no different, even if we have decided not to participate in Iraq we don't have the be the country that accepts everyone opposed!
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jetjack74
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RE: Did Anyone Else Hear About The Lieutenant?

Thu Jun 08, 2006 2:27 pm

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 21):
Those are emotional arguments.

I was making the point, that my empathetic side of me would understand his unwillingness to go to war if he had a wife an kids at home. However I would not accept that as excuse from going with your unit on deployment. He signed a contract, and took an oath. He's just making pathetic excuses. Thousands upon thousands of mothers and fathers are going to war. He's just a cowardly excuse for half a man. Half a man would probably still go.

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 21):
As for the other stuff, maybe you don't know our history.

To say that we have a history is kinda overdramatising abit, don't you think. We just took pot-shots at one another. Water under the bridge.

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 21):
But not only will I not press charges,

Never happen, because.........

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 21):
and he will kick the ever loving shit out of me

this would never happen unless I was accosted first. Then standby for the floodgates of Whoop-ass to open. I don't initiate pre-emptive strikes.
Maybe an armwrestle. ANC can officiate.

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 21):
but I'll buy him a beer afterwards.

That's cool, i'm always up for boozer. I'll take a Pyramid IPA. thumbsup 
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columba
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RE: Did Anyone Else Hear About The Lieutenant?

Thu Jun 08, 2006 2:58 pm

Would this been is his first assigment to Iraq or has he been already dowb there ?
I know as a Lt he should know better and he knew what he was doing as he went to the Army but I also think it is easy to judge when you are sitting at your home computer and don´ t have to face the situation to go to Iraq.

Quoting AerospaceFan (Reply 1):
The lieutenant offered to serve elsewhere.

My grand-uncle -a former B-17 flight engineer- told me the following story that reminds me on that.
Before he went to the Army Air Corps he had a friend that did not want to serve with the military because he did not want to go to Europe or the Pacific in WW II. So that guy was trying to be smart and joined the Coast Guard instead.
Sine the Coast Guard had very small boats that could sail very close to the shore his unit was send to Japan where they -under heavy fire- were used to bring back wounded people to the ships.
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jetjack74
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RE: Did Anyone Else Hear About The Lieutenant?

Thu Jun 08, 2006 3:05 pm

Quoting Columba (Reply 25):
Would this been is his first assigment to Iraq or has he been already dowb there ?

This was first assignment anywhere. He was a new Lt fresh from infantry training in Oklahoma.

Quoting Columba (Reply 25):
I know as a Lt he should know better and he knew what he was doing as he went to the Army but I also think it is easy to judge when you are sitting at your home computer and don´t have to face the situation to go to Iraq.

That doesn't matter. He joined the army

Quoting AerospaceFan (Reply 1):
The lieutenant offered to serve elsewhere, but was refused.

This isn't an A La Carte military. You go where your orders tell you to go.
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