dc10s4ever
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Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Sat Jun 10, 2006 9:51 am

While I am not a big fan of the south, I say BRAVO to this new law that OK just passed. If any sicko ever touches my daughter, I would kill him my self.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/...-09-okla-molester-executions_x.htm
 
lowrider
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Sat Jun 10, 2006 9:58 am

I am trying to understand what this has to do with the south. There are plenty of northern states with the death penalty. I agree this is a good law, but as someone who grew up in "The North", but currently lives in "The South", I do not understand the seemingly prevalent bias against this region.
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dc10s4ever
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Sat Jun 10, 2006 9:59 am

Because the south still has many ancient laws on the books like the lame Blue Law....
 
11Bravo
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Sat Jun 10, 2006 10:16 am

Quoting Lowrider (Reply 1):
I am trying to understand what this has to do with the south. There are plenty of northern states with the death penalty.

While that might be true, capital punishment in the US is very much a Southern phenomenon.

Executions since 1976, Top Ten:

Texas 366
Virginia 95
Oklahoma 81
Missouri 66
Florida 60
North Carolina 42
Georgia 39
South Carolina 35
Alabama 34
Louisiana 27

That's 82.4% of all US executions since 1976.
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jpetekyxmd80
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Sat Jun 10, 2006 10:18 am

"The last message you want to give an offender who has the life of a child in his hands is you might as well kill the child because he's already got the death penalty," said Brook, who runs the Virginia Capital Case Clearing House, which assists lawyers in death penalty cases. "This is a very stupid message."

 checkmark  checkmark 

Better to be a rape survivor than a murder victim, which I presume we'll see an increase in these states...
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lowrider
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Sat Jun 10, 2006 10:52 am

Quoting Dc10s4ever (Reply 2):
Because the south still has many ancient laws on the books like the lame Blue Law....

Again, not exclusive to the south. Furthermore, if the residents don't like it, they can lobby for it to be changed.
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ArmitageShanks
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Sat Jun 10, 2006 10:58 am

If any crime should be up for capital punishment, sex crimes should be.

Once a girl/woman has been violated they are never the same. A lot of the time it destroys that person forever.
 
mrmeangenes
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Sat Jun 10, 2006 11:49 am

I note it's for a 2nd conviction ; nonetheless, it will probably get knocked down by the courts.

Incidentally, sex offenders quite often murder their victims,and I doubt the death penalty would make any difference.

Incidentally, doesn't OK have a Democratic governor too ?
I see several of the states have Democrats at the helm,so I assume it's not a Republican/Democrat kind of thing.
gene
 
NeilYYZ
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Sat Jun 10, 2006 1:25 pm

Sounds like a good law to me. And I would doubt that the murder rate of people being raped goes up, there are rapists who are in it for the sexual pleasure and domination, and then there are those that go into it with murder being the summation of the act, two different types of people, I doubt that those that are in it for the domination, degredation and sexual pleasure will all of a sudden start murdering the victims just because the penalty is the same.
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TIA
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Sat Jun 10, 2006 1:36 pm

Quoting 11Bravo (Reply 3):
Missouri 66

MO is not in the South.
 
jpetekyxmd80
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Sat Jun 10, 2006 2:46 pm

Quoting ArmitageShanks (Reply 6):


If any crime should be up for capital punishment, sex crimes should be.

Um, that has to be one of the dumbest things i've heard in a long time. If any crime should be up for capital punishment, it is - DUH- murder.... Not saying theres anything wrong with thinking it shoudl be one, but that statement was pure ignorance.
The Best Care in the Air, 1984-2009
 
Newark777
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Sat Jun 10, 2006 2:49 pm

The treatment many child sex offenders get from fellow prisoners is probably worse than a quick lethal injection.

Harry
Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
 
mrmeangenes
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Sat Jun 10, 2006 9:50 pm

Quoting Newark777 (Reply 11):
The treatment many child sex offenders get from fellow prisoners is probably worse than a quick lethal injection.

I'm afraid that's in the realm of "urban legends" : may have been true at one time,but no more !

The typical serious offenders don't care about children one way or the other-mainly because all they REALLY care about is themselves.

Sex offenders piss and moan when they are sent to "treatment facilities" -mainly because they can't get out on parole as quickly,and because they get supervised a tiny bit more strictly.
gene
 
ANCFlyer
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Sat Jun 10, 2006 10:28 pm

As to the thread topic: I don't really see the downside here.

Anyone messes with my daughter - and well - lets just say there won't be any evidence left . . .
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
11Bravo
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Sat Jun 10, 2006 10:34 pm

Quoting TIA (Reply 9):
MO is not in the South.

I never said it was.  Yeah sure
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ANCFlyer
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Sat Jun 10, 2006 10:48 pm

Quoting TIA (Reply 9):
MO is not in the South.

Might as well be . . .ever been to the Ozarks> Branson? Can't get any more "Southern" than that, unless you're actually IN the south.

Missouri qualifies . . . easily.
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
LO231
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Sat Jun 10, 2006 10:52 pm

What has Czech Airlines to do with it?

Sorry, couldn't resist.

Regards,
LO231
Got both LO 788 frames already, next LO E95 and 734 BRU-WAW-BRU
 
TIA
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Sun Jun 11, 2006 12:08 am

Quoting 11Bravo (Reply 14):
Quoting TIA (Reply 9):
MO is not in the South.

I never said it was. Yeah sure

You're right. You never said that but your post seemed to imply it.

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 15):
Might as well be . . .ever been to the Ozarks> Branson? Can't get any more "Southern" than that, unless you're actually IN the south.

Missouri qualifies . . . easily.

I've actually lived in MO, and no, it does not qualify as "Southern."
 
11Bravo
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Sun Jun 11, 2006 12:34 am

Quoting TIA (Reply 17):
You're right. You never said that but your post seemed to imply it.

It didn't "seem to imply" anything. You interpreted it that way. The list was clearly labeled.

Quoting TIA (Reply 17):
I've actually lived in MO, and no, it does not qualify as "Southern."

The southern parts of MO are very much "Southern" in terms of culture and regional identity.

During the Civil War, Missouri was a "Border State", and along with Kentucky, had two separate governments, one Union and one Confederate. In my view, that makes it, to some significant degree, a Southern state.
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cfalk
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Sun Jun 11, 2006 2:21 am

Quoting JpetekYXMD80 (Reply 4):
"The last message you want to give an offender who has the life of a child in his hands is you might as well kill the child because he's already got the death penalty,"

I say execute the molester, and then execute dumb lawyers who make such stupid statements.

Child molestation is the most dispicable of all crimes, even beyond murder IMHO. It should be stamped out ruthlessly and without remorse.
The only thing you should feel when shooting a terrorist: Recoil.
 
jpetekyxmd80
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Sun Jun 11, 2006 6:51 am

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 19):
Child molestation is the most dispicable of all crimes, even beyond murder IMHO.

Uh...what? Would you rather have your child molested or murdered?
The Best Care in the Air, 1984-2009
 
satx
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Sun Jun 11, 2006 4:17 pm

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 13):
Anyone messes with my daughter - and well - lets just say there won't be any evidence left . . .

First of all, this almost looks like a police officer publicly sanctioning illegal actions, not that I'd ever put that past you; you've made comments like this before. Second, the chances that you'd somehow be a witness are probably fairly slim. Thus, you'd most likely be killing another human based primarily on the word of a child.

Children don't always understand and fully appreciate the consequences of their actions. Parents often think they know their child well enough to see through any lies, but that simply isn't the case. When I was a child, most of my friends and I could bluff our parents without much trouble and the more serious the lie, the more likely they were to believe it. If you later found out that you had possibly killed an innocent person, would you even admit to your actions?
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AR385
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Sun Jun 11, 2006 4:34 pm

Quoting 11Bravo (Reply 3):
Executions since 1976, Top Ten:

Texas 366
Virginia 95
Oklahoma 81
Missouri 66
Florida 60
North Carolina 42
Georgia 39
South Carolina 35
Alabama 34
Louisiana 27

That's 82.4% of all US executions since 1976.

I agree with you, but those numbers you are posting need to be run on a correlation model with the population of the state.

Quoting Mrmeangenes (Reply 7):
Incidentally, sex offenders quite often murder their victims,and I doubt the death penalty would make any difference.

That is not true. Sex offenders and murderers are a different kind of animal. Sex offender have a sichological pathology and what they are looking for when molesting is not murder. They are searching to satisfy some disfunctional desire in their minds.

Quoting JpetekYXMD80 (Reply 10):
Um, that has to be one of the dumbest things i've heard in a long time. If any crime should be up for capital punishment, it is - DUH- murder

Acroos the board, no. There are many reasons for committing murder and not all murders are the same. A cold blooded murder should see the death penalty I agree, but when a wife who's been abused for years snaps and kills hubby, it's just not the same.
 
jpetekyxmd80
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Sun Jun 11, 2006 4:39 pm

Quoting AR385 (Reply 22):

Acroos the board, no. There are many reasons for committing murder and not all murders are the same. A cold blooded murder should see the death penalty I agree, but when a wife who's been abused for years snaps and kills hubby, it's just not the same.

Well there are exceptions to every rule ,but I stand by my previous post in generalization 100%. Maybe could say first degree murder.
The Best Care in the Air, 1984-2009
 
cfalk
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Sun Jun 11, 2006 5:39 pm

I have a question for the liberals here who jump to say that murdering a child is worse than molesting them (I'm not talking about a peek up a skirt, which is bad enough, but all-out rape). Liberals also say that prison time is worse than the death penalty.

We have all heard countless interviews and reports of how victims of child sexual abuse live lives filled with horror and fear, and a variety of disfunctions all related to what happened to them. That appears to me to be no different to what you claim prison to be - with the exception that you are never "let out". The experience will haunt the child for life.

So, by liberals' arguments with the death penalty, child abuse is worse than prison, which is worse than execution - which itself has been called murder by many liberals.

So which is it?
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satx
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Mon Jun 12, 2006 1:20 am

I'm a liberal, so I'll take a shot...

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 24):
I have a question for the liberals here who jump to say that murdering a child is worse than molesting them (I'm not talking about a peek up a skirt, which is bad enough, but all-out rape).

First of all, I must take issue with your apparent contention that (American) liberals are somehow out of step with the rest of the country or the rest of the world. To my knowledge, it's generally accepted among most first-world states and countries that murder is a more heinous crime than sex crimes, including molestation. The view that sex crimes are equal to or even worse than death seems to be primarily a cultural view associated with some Muslim groups. Thus, we have the existence of 'honor killings' to 'save' the victim from a fate worse than death.


Quoting Cfalk (Reply 24):
Liberals also say that prison time is worse than the death penalty.

I'm a liberal and yet I'm not aware of any liberal consensus that states anything like that. I would think it's debatable unless you know more about prison than I do.

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 24):
We have all heard countless interviews and reports of how victims of child sexual abuse live lives filled with horror and fear, and a variety of disfunctions all related to what happened to them.

No doubt, but I don't agree that this implied that sex crimes are equal to or worse than murder.
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solnabo
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Mon Jun 12, 2006 3:46 am

Sorry, but what is the Blue Law??

Curious.

Micke//SWE  Confused
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satx
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Mon Jun 12, 2006 4:03 am

Quoting Solnabo (Reply 26):
Sorry, but what is the Blue Law??

Mainly refers to US laws that serve to prevent you from buying things, typically by forcing various businesses to close or shortening their hours of business and restricting what they can sell. The original idea was to give Americans fewer things to do beside go to Church. Freedom of religion, but not freedom from religion. Take your pick, but you better be out praying to something or else you'll be stuck at home mowing the grass.
Open Season on Consumer Protections is Just Around the Corner...
 
satx
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Mon Jun 12, 2006 4:12 am

More on blue laws...

United States and Canada, is a type of law restricting certain activities, particularly shopping hours, on Sunday. It had its roots in accommodating Christian Sunday worship, although it persists to this day more as a matter of tradition. The term blue law may have been first used by Reverend Samuel Peters (1735-1826) in his book General History of Connecticut, which was first published in 1781, to refer to various laws first enacted by Puritan colonies in the 17th century which prohibited the selling of certain types of merchandise and retail or business activity of any kind on certain days of the week (usually Sunday).

In Texas, for example, blue laws prohibited selling housewares such as pots, pans, and washing machines on Sunday until 1985; Texas as well as Colorado, Illinois, Indiana, Michigan and Minnesota car dealerships continue to operate under blue-law prohibitions in which an automobile may not be purchased or traded on a Sunday. Many U.S. states still prohibit selling alcohol on Sunday, or at least before noon on Sunday. Many unusual features of American culture � such as the fact that one can buy groceries, office supplies, and housewares from a drug store � are the result of blue laws, as drug stores were generally allowed to remain open on Sunday to accommodate emergency medical needs.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_law

Frankly, I'm surprised these laws weren't fully struck down a long time ago. What should I care if someone wants to buy a car on Sunday or pick up a bottle of liquor? With our new hard-line fundamentalist Supreme Court currently being built, I doubt these types of laws will face much in the way of new scrutiny for now.
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solnabo
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Mon Jun 12, 2006 4:35 am

@ SATX:

Thx for the info.

Micke  wave 
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cfalk
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Mon Jun 12, 2006 4:38 am

Quoting SATX (Reply 28):
Frankly, I'm surprised these laws weren't fully struck down a long time ago.

Because they are many and complex. Google "Stupid Laws" and you'll find web sites full of silly stuff dating back hundreds of years.

Did you know that in New York, jumping off the top of a building is punishable by death?  rotfl 

Check this one out. http://www.dumblaws.com/

Also know that these blue laws are traditional, and are much more lenient in the US than many other countries. For instance in Switzerland, practically the only thing you'll find open on Sunday are gas stations. All stores must shut their doors by 6 PM on Saturday. Other days of the week it might be 7 PM. Interestingly, a few years ago the Swiss voted on whether to repeal these laws (we vote on everything), and the people voted to keep them, because it ensured that the family stayed together more on evenings and weekends.
The only thing you should feel when shooting a terrorist: Recoil.
 
jpetekyxmd80
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Mon Jun 12, 2006 5:33 am

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 24):
I have a question for the liberals here who jump to say that murdering a child is worse than molesting them

What the hell is with this 'the liberals shit? Can't you try to defend a point of yours without invoking partisan politics that have absolutely no relevance to this discussion. To say this sentiment is a 'liberal thing' is just absurd. I'm positive an overwhelming majority of people in the U.S., Europe, wherever, would agree that murder is worse than molestation. It kind of strikes me as a pure common sense thing. Becauase you know what murder means? It means the person is DEAD. Their life is OVER. Oprah was raped multiple times as a child, and i'm pretty sure her life turned out better than being dead? I can't believe i'm arguing with such a nonsensical logic.

And whats with this death penalty crap now? Stay on topic, or is the only way you can argue something to use rash political generalizations with off-topic subjects?
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L-188
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Mon Jun 12, 2006 5:42 am

Quoting SATX (Reply 28):
Frankly, I'm surprised these laws weren't fully struck down a long time ago.

Actually a lot of these laws where ignored for decades prior to them actually being shot down or repealed. Even today there are cases where you can look through public laws and find all sorts of inane ones that made sense at the time they where written, haven't been enforced since the Roosevelt administration (that would be Teddy not Franklin) so people forgot about them and their existance.

For a while there there where a couple of authors that made some serious money going around and finding these old laws and putting them into "Stupid Law" books.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
AR385
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Mon Jun 12, 2006 6:55 am

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 30):
For instance in Switzerland, practically the only thing you'll find open on Sunday are gas stations.

In France, one day a week, I believe it's Saturday or Sunday "Les Grands Magasins" (more or less malls) have to close down, the idea being to protect the smal one owner corner street boutique shop or bakery etc.

I believe I agree with this.
 
piercey
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Mon Jun 12, 2006 7:36 am

Quoting JpetekYXMD80 (Reply 20):
Uh...what? Would you rather have your child molested or murdered?

Either happens and the person will be full of more lead then this pencil I'm holding.  Wink

Either way, all I have to say is, about d@mn time.
Well I believe it all is coming to an end. Oh well, I guess we are gonna pretend.
 
cfalk
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Mon Jun 12, 2006 3:45 pm

Quoting JpetekYXMD80 (Reply 31):
What the hell is with this 'the liberals shit? Can't you try to defend a point of yours without invoking partisan politics that have absolutely no relevance to this discussion. To say this sentiment is a 'liberal thing' is just absurd. I'm positive an overwhelming majority of people in the U.S., Europe, wherever, would agree that murder is worse than molestation. It kind of strikes me as a pure common sense thing. Becauase you know what murder means? It means the person is DEAD. Their life is OVER. Oprah was raped multiple times as a child, and i'm pretty sure her life turned out better than being dead? I can't believe i'm arguing with such a nonsensical logic.

And whats with this death penalty crap now? Stay on topic, or is the only way you can argue something to use rash political generalizations with off-topic subjects?

My point exactly. Being alive is better than being dead. So why do people keep saying that life in prison is a bigger punishment than the death penalty? Tha's my question.

(BTW, I am not for the death penalty - I'm just looking for the logic behind the rhetoric).
The only thing you should feel when shooting a terrorist: Recoil.
 
gunsontheroof
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Mon Jun 12, 2006 3:57 pm

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 24):
I have a question for the liberals here who jump to say that murdering a child is worse than molesting them (I'm not talking about a peek up a skirt, which is bad enough, but all-out rape). Liberals also say that prison time is worse than the death penalty.

We have all heard countless interviews and reports of how victims of child sexual abuse live lives filled with horror and fear, and a variety of disfunctions all related to what happened to them. That appears to me to be no different to what you claim prison to be - with the exception that you are never "let out". The experience will haunt the child for life.

So, by liberals' arguments with the death penalty, child abuse is worse than prison, which is worse than execution - which itself has been called murder by many liberals.

So which is it?

I suppose that you're correct in that life in prison is filled with horror, fear and a variety of disfunctions, but I'm not sure what you're getting at...the raped child didn't do anything deserve such a difficult life, whereas the rapist did. As far as opposition to capital punishment goes, I oppose it on the grounds that it's cheaper to keep a criminal in prison than it is to have them executed. I'm also inclined to believe that most people would rather die than spend life wasting away in a prison...I think that the number of people who try to kill themselves in jail is indicative of that.
 
baylorairbear
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Mon Jun 12, 2006 4:11 pm

Quoting Dc10s4ever (Thread starter):
If any sicko ever touches my daughter, I would kill him my self.

That's probably what the Hooter's girl's dad is saying right now.

BAB  silly 
I'm just skipping stones...
 
Gilligan
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RE: Sex Crimes In OK Can Get You Executed!

Mon Jun 12, 2006 10:11 pm

Quoting Newark777 (Reply 11):
The treatment many child sex offenders get from fellow prisoners is probably worse than a quick lethal injection.

Sure, that's why they are generally held in seperate areas or in solitary by themselves away from the general population. There may not be much honor among thieves but there is enough that the gp would meat out it's own punishment to these types if they were put out on the yard.

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 13):
lets just say there won't be any evidence left .

Alaska is a big state, and bears eat anything don't they?  wink 

Quoting TIA (Reply 17):
I've actually lived in MO, and no, it does not qualify as "Southern."

As a previous poster said, you must not have lived in southern MO. I have friends born and raised near the boot and over in SPI. They all talk with a southern accent and would be highly offended if you were to ever call them a yankee.

Quoting SATX (Reply 21):
When I was a child, most of my friends and I could bluff our parents without much trouble and the more serious the lie, the more likely they were to believe it.

They knew, they just didn't care. If it wasn't going to get you killed and would shut your bawling up they rolled with it. I've got two daughters and know now how my parents felt.
Warm winds blowing, heating blue skies, and a road that goes forever, I'm going to Texas!

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