ME AVN FAN
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A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Thu Jul 20, 2006 8:18 pm

Lebanese Prime Minister Fuad Siniora told Milan-based newspaper Corriere della Sera in an interview published Thursday that the Hizbollah has been doing the bidding of Syria and Iran, and that it can only be disarmed with the help of the international community and once a cease-fire has been achieved in the current Middle East fighting.
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oly720man
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Thu Jul 20, 2006 9:05 pm

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Thread starter):
that it can only be disarmed with the help of the international community

nice thought, but who's going to do it? Anyone trying to disarm Hizbollah will immediately be labelled as pro-israel/america by themselves and their supporters and there'll just be another round of name calling.

It's never going to happen, the situation is just too polarised and there's no-one who is both wholly independent and with the power to actually bash heads and get stuff done.
wheat and dairy can screw up your brain
 
bill142
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Thu Jul 20, 2006 9:13 pm

The Lebanese have to stand up to these groups themselves. Any poltical party with a militant arm shouldn't be accepted.
 
DLPMMM
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Thu Jul 20, 2006 9:21 pm

At this point, we might as well let the Israelis disarm Hezbollah. The international "peacekeepers" that are already on the Israel/Lebanon border have already shown the extent of their value (none).

After the Israelis sufficiently weaken the terrorists, then perhaps the Lebanese armed forces can exert control within their own borders and wipe out the remnants.

I doubt it though.
 
ME AVN FAN
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Thu Jul 20, 2006 9:48 pm

Quoting Oly720man (Reply 1):
but who's going to do it?

Tony Blair has offered to do so with British troops, but under U.N.-mandate

Quoting Bill142 (Reply 2):
The Lebanese have to stand up to these groups themselves.

How ? it is NOT a matter of "stand up", it is a military problem, and Lebanon does NOT have a strong enough army. Otherwise, Israel could NOT have gone beserk on Lebanese territory

Quoting DLPMMM (Reply 3):
The international "peacekeepers" that are already on the Israel/Lebanon border have already shown the extent of their value (none).

That force has been far far too weak, both personnel and equipment-wise. It in future will have to be a credible strong and able force, and not some "pathfinders units" .

Quoting DLPMMM (Reply 3):
the Lebanese armed forces can

that they are too weak for that job has become obvious previously. They might have a chance, if the Israelis repair the bridges of the Lungomare and lend them some modern military gear.
 
rolfen
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Thu Jul 20, 2006 11:17 pm

Chirac says peace in lebanon necessitates "coercive means".
I guess he means a multinational force that would disarm the hezbollah.
With 400 000 palestininan refugees living outside the juridiction of the leb army and police, and Hezbollah running their own little state with an army of several thousands guerillas, lebanon could use some help for sure.
rolf
 
oly720man
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Thu Jul 20, 2006 11:28 pm

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 4):
Tony Blair has offered to do so with British troops,

Have we got any left?
wheat and dairy can screw up your brain
 
Falcon84
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Fri Jul 21, 2006 12:36 am

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 4):
How ? it is NOT a matter of "stand up", it is a military problem, and Lebanon does NOT have a strong enough army.

Then Lebanon needs to tell its citizens to clear the South, and let Israel deal out just punishment to these terrorists.

Of course, the terrorists will try to melt back with the civilians, the cowards that they are.
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ME AVN FAN
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Fri Jul 21, 2006 12:38 am

Quoting Oly720man (Reply 6):
Tony Blair has offered to do so with British troops,

Have we got any left?

-

In case of doubt, some young Nepalese men have a real desire to help out the Brits ! and no bad feelings, the young gents have good techniques to survive, even under odd circumstances ! wish them all the success possible !
 
ME AVN FAN
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Fri Jul 21, 2006 12:40 am

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 7):
Then Lebanon needs to tell its citizens to clear the South, and let Israel deal out just punishment to these terrorists.

Of course, the terrorists will try to melt back with the civilians, the cowards that they are.

-
A) the ugly thing is that it already is happening, as thousands of civilians of those regions already HAVE "cleared" the border area.
B) the Hizbullah militia in reality canNOT move "back" as the civilians move into Sunni regions where the militias have no support
 
tu204
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Fri Jul 21, 2006 12:46 am

So if Hezbollah is disarmed, who will represent the interests of the Lebanese people? The prime minister? Yeah, right.
I do not dream about movie stars, they must dream about me for I am real and they are not. - Alexander Popov
 
Dougloid
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Fri Jul 21, 2006 12:50 am

Quoting Tu204 (Reply 10):
So if Hezbollah is disarmed, who will represent the interests of the Lebanese people? The prime minister? Yeah, right.

this is the funniest thing I've read all week.

Hezbollah's done a great fucking job representing the Lebanese people LOL...

A little more representation like that and there won't be anyone left.

That's like having the Crips represent the South Central Ladies' Garden Club and Sewing Circle.

Sheesh....whatta maroon.
If you believe in coincidence, you haven't looked close enough-Joe Leaphorn
 
tu204
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Fri Jul 21, 2006 1:00 am

Quoting Dougloid (Reply 11):
Sheesh....whatta maroon.

Ok, get off your ass and speak to people in Lebanon that are being bombarded and masacred by Israelis and tell THEM that Hezbollah is a terrorist organisation and that it should be disarmed. And then tell them that their government represents their interests and not Hezbollah, who seems to be the only group that actually gives a damn about what is going on in Lebanon right now. And you say that I am the moron.
I do not dream about movie stars, they must dream about me for I am real and they are not. - Alexander Popov
 
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n229nw
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Fri Jul 21, 2006 1:28 am

Quoting Tu204 (Reply 12):
tell THEM that Hezbollah is a terrorist organisation and that it should be disarmed. And then tell them that their government represents their interests and not Hezbollah, who seems to be the only group that actually gives a damn about what is going on in Lebanon right now.

Sigh...Most Lebanese people do not like Hezbollah, and were in the course of trying to dismantle them slowly. Syria did not like that of course. Granted, the country is split on many of these issues (hence the brutal civil war in linving memory) and there are Hezbollah supporters especially in Southern Lebanon (overall they got roughly 15% of the vote recently)...truly you have no idea what you are talking about...

Of course, this bombing campaign will surely run up Hezbollah support massively, and allow more people to be taken in by their rhetoric of speaking for the people, one of the many reasons why the bombing is rotten...

[Edited 2006-07-20 18:34:52]
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ME AVN FAN
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Fri Jul 21, 2006 2:22 am

Quoting Tu204 (Reply 10):
Hezbollah is disarmed, who will represent the interests of the Lebanese people?

Hizbollah only represents a part of the Shi'ites in Lebanon, while other Shi'ites feel rather represented by Amal. And Hizbollah is NOT representing the Sunnis and the Christians.
 
FOMEA
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Fri Jul 21, 2006 2:29 am

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 14):
Hizbollah only represents a part of the Shi'ites in Lebanon, while other Shi'ites feel rather represented by Amal

And some dont want to be represented by none of the Above.

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rolfen
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Fri Jul 21, 2006 3:08 am

Quoting FOMEA (Reply 15):
Signed
Me.

How many much more of you are they ?
You are the hope for the future. I'd like to know.

I respect and understang the hate against israel, but Hezbollah in my eyes is turning into a reincarnation of the Nazi party.

Hezbollah, take your stupid war, idelogy of fear, intolerant doctrine, and brainwashing propaganda back to Iran.

[Edited 2006-07-20 20:13:51]
rolf
 
dl021
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Fri Jul 21, 2006 3:19 am

Quoting Bill142 (Reply 2):
The Lebanese have to stand up to these groups themselves



Quoting ME AVN FAN (Thread starter):
Hizbollah has been doing the bidding of Syria and Iran, and that it can only be disarmed with the help of the international community and once a cease-fire has been achieved in the current Middle East fighting

I say that if he asks for help the international community must help him and his government disarm this group. But he must accept that it's not going to be easy and it will get bloody.

Quoting Rolfen (Reply 16):
I respect and understang the hate against israel

How can you respect hatred? This is the attitude that has allowed Hizballah to exist this way for so long.

Quoting Tu204 (Reply 10):
So if Hezbollah is disarmed, who will represent the interests of the Lebanese people? The prime minister? Yeah, right.

Hizballah doesn't represent anyone other than themselves and their financial and political sponsors from outside Lebanon.
Is my Pan Am ticket to the moon still good?
 
rolfen
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Fri Jul 21, 2006 3:20 am

Quoting Tu204 (Reply 12):
Ok, get off your ass and speak to people in Lebanon that are being bombarded and masacred by Israelis and tell THEM that Hezbollah is a terrorist organisation and that it should be disarmed. And then tell them that their government represents their interests and not Hezbollah

Problem is they're all afraid of a new civil war.

Actually most of them dont care about the hezbollah they just want to live in peace.
rolf
 
Mir
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Fri Jul 21, 2006 3:22 am

Quoting Tu204 (Reply 10):
So if Hezbollah is disarmed, who will represent the interests of the Lebanese people? The prime minister? Yeah, right.

You make the mistake of assuming that Hezbollah was representing the interests of the Lebanese people in the first place.

-Mir
7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
 
rolfen
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Fri Jul 21, 2006 3:40 am

Quoting Mir (Reply 19):
You make the mistake of assuming that Hezbollah was representing the interests of the Lebanese people in the first place.

Hezbollah represents the interests of iran.
rolf
 
L410Turbolet
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Fri Jul 21, 2006 3:57 am

Quoting Tu204 (Reply 10):
So if Hezbollah is disarmed, who will represent the interests of the Lebanese people?

Hizballah representing interests of Lebanese Christians (40% of population) or Lebanese Sunni Muslims?
Hmmm let me see... Maybe the government and parliament elected in free elections not some private army of religious fanatical puppets sponsored from abroad.

Quoting Tu204 (Reply 12):
Hezbollah, who seems to be the only group that actually gives a damn about what is going on in Lebanon right now. And you say that I am the moron.

You proved it once again.  Sad
 
AeroWesty
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Fri Jul 21, 2006 4:17 am

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 4):
Quoting Bill142 (Reply 2):The Lebanese have to stand up to these groups themselves.

How ? it is NOT a matter of "stand up", it is a military problem, and Lebanon does NOT have a strong enough army. Otherwise, Israel could NOT have gone beserk on Lebanese territory

I've been doing a lot of reading on the political and military make-up of southern Lebanon as a result of the hasty Israeli pull-out in 2000. It appears that it was so sudden that Hezbollah simply moved into the peace zone as the Israeli tanks were withdrawing in the night.

It's an interesting point in history, and I may do a post on it later.
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rolfen
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Fri Jul 21, 2006 4:45 am

Quoting DL021 (Reply 17):
How can you respect hatred? This is the attitude that has allowed Hizballah to exist this way for so long.


I have had the fortune of living 15 years of peace and easy life in this country so I know there's more then hate in this life.
When your house is destroyed and familiy members injured by israeli bomb... over and over again... you cannot but hate.
You have to understand that 7 israeli soldiers get killed and 2 get abducted, and israel accuses hezbollah of having carried out a terrorist act, then goes on killing 300 civilians in one week.

I do not support violence. I do not support palestinian terrorism. I do not support israeli disregard for non-israeli human life. I am just saying that I can understand palestinians.

[Edited 2006-07-20 22:13:40]
rolf
 
AeroWesty
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Fri Jul 21, 2006 4:58 am

Quoting Derico (Reply 25):

I must be having a brain seizure. I don't understand what that photo has to do with this issue.
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Derico
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Fri Jul 21, 2006 5:02 am

It's my 'violence/war' picture. Both concepts do achieve the same level of confusion amongst people.

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 26):
My internet was not shut down, the internet has shut me down
 
MD11Engineer
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Fri Jul 21, 2006 5:09 am

Quoting Rolfen (Reply 24):
Quoting DL021 (Reply 17):
How can you respect hatred? This is the attitude that has allowed Hizballah to exist this way for so long.


When your house is destroyed and familiy members injured because of an israeli bomb... over and over again... you cannot but hate.
I have had the fortune of living 15 years of peace and easy life in this country so I know there's more then hate in this life.
You have to understand that 7 israeli soldiers get killed and 2 get abducted, and israel accuses hezbollah of having carried out a terrorist act, then goes on killing 300 civilians in one week.

I think, after having watched the various conflicts involving Israel and it's neighbour states for almost all of my life (nearly 40 years now), that the various Arab militias and private armies are deliberately hiding behind the civilian population and are actively using civilian areas for their combat positions, so that any Israeli counterstrike will kill as many civilians as possible.
This is done for two reasons:
1) Dead or wounded civilians can be well used for propaganda purposes to increase the profile of the private army abroad.
2) The hatred (like yours) stemming from the casualties will help to recruit more fighters and support from the civilan population.

On the other hand, if the Israelis are not hitting back they will practically stand defenseless against any attack.

Jan
Je Suis Charlie et je suis Ahmet aussi
 
mia
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Fri Jul 21, 2006 6:52 am

I agree with disarming Hizbollah. But I also think that equally necessary is to disarm and end the financial subsidizing of the Zionist state of Israel.

We need to stop terror from all sources, not just those who seem convinient to disarm.
"Like all great travelers, I have seen more than I remember, and remember more than I have seen."
 
BA
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Fri Jul 21, 2006 9:07 am

Saad-Ghorayeb says it's symptomatic that while Hezbollah's demands were supported by the population, the group never achieved very good electoral results after participating in parliamentary elections for the first time in 1992. "What the people cared about were the issues, not armed struggle against Israel." Saad-Ghorayeb has noticed that during the first days of Israeli attacks on Lebanon even Hezbollah supporters accused the militia of being responsible for the sudden violence.

But after a week of de facto war, the mood is changing: "The army has proven only one thing during the last few days -- that is incapable of reacting." According to Saad-Ghorayeb, this has left the population with the impression that only Hezbollah can protect the Lebanese from Israel. What is more, the Lebanese are accusing their government of having bet on the wrong horse. The Americans -- under whose protective power the government placed itself following the murder of former Prime Minister Rafik Hariri in February 2005 -- are perceived as having ruthlessly abandoned the country. "The government has failed -- it's finished," Saad-Ghorayeb says.

The political scientist believes that a protracted conflict will strengthen Hezbollah politically. "The memory of who started the fighting has already faded after just a few days." The bombs that have transformed the southern suburbs of Beirut into an uninhabited crater landscape have caused even life-long political convictions to start to slip. "Today you'll meet Christians who will curse Hezbollah and then ask when the group is finally going to attack Tel Aviv."


http://service.spiegel.de/cache/inte...onal/spiegel/0,1518,427754,00.html

The Lebanese government is being criticized for sitting idly and not doing anything to defend the country from Israel. Today, Minister of National Defense, Elias Murr, announced that the Lebanese Army will join the fight against Israel if Israeli forces launch a ground invasion.

http://www.news24.com/News24/World/M..._East/0,,2-10-2075_1971234,00.html
http://www.gulf-daily-news.com/Story...ticle=150043&Sn=WORL&IssueID=29123



May they fight with honor and dignity, although they won't be able to deter Israeli forces.

Bhebek ya Lebnan
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Aleksandar
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Fri Jul 21, 2006 9:36 am

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 8):
In case of doubt, some young Nepalese men have a real desire to help out the Brits !

And they don't ask questions.

Quoting Tu204 (Reply 10):
So if Hezbollah is disarmed, who will represent the interests of the Lebanese people? The prime minister? Yeah, right.

Actually, yes. Return to the Cedar Revolution days.

Quoting Tu204 (Reply 12):
get off your ass and speak to people in Lebanon that are being bombarded and masacred by Israelis and tell THEM that Hezbollah is a terrorist organisation and that it should be disarmed.

I can't tell them that now because there is hardly anyone rational there these days, but things would change drastically once the peace is achieved.

I'm not telling a simple theory here, but hard true facts. The first day Belgrade was bombed, I was shocked by the reaction. As the war went on, even the hysterical support for Milosevic ceased. It erupted for one simple reason: country was bombed and people were supporting what they had no matter how bad and ugly it was. There were more emotions than rational thinking in that. Even during the bombing, one stupid thing Milosevic did sobered many. One of his opponents was killed on Easter Sunday in front of him home. When ceasefire was reached, overwhelming feeling could be described in two sentences: "It's us and you. You can run but you can't hide". Milosevic still had power, military, police. He was ugly and dangerous as he had never been before, but all of that wasn't enough for his survival. The culmination came on October 2000.

Comparing Serbia then with Lebanon now, there is one major difference. Hizbollah only has weapons. Like Milosevic, they can't count on chanted support. I do hope that Lebanese poeple would find courage to struggle that last obstacle to complete independence.
R-E-S-P-E-C-T
 
ANCFlyer
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Fri Jul 21, 2006 3:11 pm

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Thread starter):
the Hizbollah has been doing the bidding of Syria and Iran, and that it can only be disarmed with the help of the international community

Seems to me the IDF is doing a fine job of disarming them all by their lonesome. I say let 'em continue to kill off the terrorist Hezbollah and worry about the "international community" later.
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
ME AVN FAN
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Fri Jul 21, 2006 4:51 pm

Quoting FOMEA (Reply 15):
And some dont want to be represented by none of the Above.

thanks for that clarification. I am sure that MANY Shi'ites share your position.

Quoting DL021 (Reply 17):
But he must accept that it's not going to be easy and it will get bloody.

Does THIS matter ? HIS concern is that the main part of Lebanon can re-start business and life. And THIS is the priority.

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 22):
've been doing a lot of reading on the political and military make-up of southern Lebanon as a result of the hasty Israeli pull-out in 2000. It appears that it was so sudden that Hezbollah simply moved into the peace zone as the Israeli tanks were withdrawing in the night.

-
No, Hizbullah started up in the early 80ies, as a reaction to the Israeli invasion. They in the 90ies had to retreat southwards as having been in low demand north of the Litani, and for quite some years were in constant conflict with the Israelis.

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 30):
Seems to me the IDF is doing a fine job of disarming them all by their lonesome.

well, if you read Lebanese statements, you can see that almost nobody complains about Israeli actions south of the Litani
 
ly7e7
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Fri Jul 21, 2006 4:55 pm

BA,

For Lebanese army to confront IDF one simple thing has to occur: Hezbollah should not stand between them. But once that happens IDF will have no interest in fighting in Lebanon or against the Lebanese army.
2 things are endless: ignorance and space
 
OD720
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Fri Jul 21, 2006 6:10 pm

I have no support for Hezbollah since they represent non Lebanese interests. They should drop their arms and concentrate on domestic politics. Actually, they have proved better than some in some areas, specially agriculture and development of rural areas.

The Lebanese army is another story, I wholeheartedly support them. If they fight, let them fight in dignity but I hope they don't get dragged into it.
 
DLPMMM
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Fri Jul 21, 2006 7:44 pm

Quoting Tu204 (Reply 12):
And then tell them that their government represents their interests and not Hezbollah, who seems to be the only group that actually gives a damn about what is going on in Lebanon right now.

Yeah, right
 Yeah sure

And by the same logic, the Chechnyan terrorists are the only ones representing the interests of the Russian people.

Quoting Tu204 (Reply 12):
And you say that I am the moron.

I didn't, but if the shoe fits....
 
AeroWesty
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Fri Jul 21, 2006 7:47 pm

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 31):
No, Hizbullah started up in the early 80ies, as a reaction to the Israeli invasion. They in the 90ies had to retreat southwards as having been in low demand north of the Litani, and for quite some years were in constant conflict with the Israelis.

You totally missed what I said. It had nothing to do with when Hezbollah was formed.
International Homo of Mystery
 
ME AVN FAN
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Fri Jul 21, 2006 11:24 pm

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 35):
totally missed what I said

Not really. But the 2000 withdrawal of the Israelis was of relatively minor importance, in the framework of a development which had gone on since the 80ies
 
slider
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Fri Jul 21, 2006 11:35 pm

Disarm Hezbollah...  rotfl 

Yeah, good luck with that notion. That will never happen until they are entirely annihilated....wiped off the planet, period. That means Iran, Syria, and the Lebanese contingent. All of them, everywhere. It's the only thing they understand. It's like kudzu on a tree- unless it's totally wiped out, it will continue to propogate, grow and spread everywhere.

Quoting Rolfen (Reply 5):
Chirac says peace in lebanon necessitates "coercive means".

Well, get after it then Jacque....send the French troops if you feel so strongly.

Quoting Rolfen (Reply 16):
Hezbollah, take your stupid war, idelogy of fear, intolerant doctrine, and brainwashing propaganda back to Iran.

And get out of Detroit while you're at it! People overlook the domestic war we have here in the US even with the large contingent of Hezbollah sympathizers and Shiite Muslims here.

Quoting Rolfen (Reply 23):
I do not support violence. I do not support palestinian terrorism. I do not support israeli disregard for non-israeli human life. I am just saying that I can understand palestinians.

And I can understand and respect that thoughtful position and explanation. I don't disagree.

But the unknown future is the biggest concern.
 
semsem
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Sat Jul 22, 2006 6:35 am

TU204 whose talking? Russia flattened the poor Czechens. Today Russia supports Iran whose aim is to use Hezzbolah to destroy Israel and create havoc throughout the Middle East.
 
dl021
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Sat Jul 22, 2006 6:51 am

Quoting Rolfen (Reply 23):
You have to understand that 7 israeli soldiers get killed and 2 get abducted, and israel accuses hezbollah of having carried out a terrorist act, then goes on killing 300 civilians in one week.

I understand that the Lebanese people allow Hizballah to operate from their country without resistance and even support them in many areas. I understand that people have this unreasoning fear of Israel, who if desirous could have slaughtered thousands but has been particularly careful about trying to minimize civilian casualties when the enemy is hiding behind civilians.

Israel is reacting to an act of war by an extragovernmental force that is forcing itself on the legitimate elected government and it's being allowed to stay by a complicit populace that wants to go along to get along until the shit hits the fan.

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 31):
Quoting DL021 (Reply 17):
But he must accept that it's not going to be easy and it will get bloody.

Does THIS matter ? HIS concern is that the main part of Lebanon can re-start business and life. And THIS is the priority.

The priority should be to remove the instigator of hostilities, and the people who truly threaten the sovereignty of Lebanon.
Is my Pan Am ticket to the moon still good?
 
ME AVN FAN
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Sat Jul 22, 2006 7:17 am

Quoting DL021 (Reply 39):
I understand that the Lebanese people allow Hizballah to operate from their country without resistance and even support them in many areas.

no, the Lebanese people did NOT "allow" them anything but the leadership simply did NOT see a way to act against them. Neither "the people" nor the government did "support them in many areas".

Quoting DL021 (Reply 39):
I understand that people have this unreasoning fear of Israel

They did not have sufficient fear of Israel, who has stopped the way forward on which Lebanon has been, and quite successfully so. Quite to the contrary, they will have to build up a credible military force as a kind of deterrant against potential agressors

Quoting DL021 (Reply 39):
The priority should be to remove the instigator of hostilities, and the people who truly threaten the sovereignty of Lebanon.

no, the absolutely paramount priority will be to repair airport and seaport and traffic links ..... and wishes of the USA come second. The USA have revealed to be treacherous and not to be relied upon. Suppose that all those so heavily pro-US-American Lebanese now have re-learnt.
 
rolfen
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Sat Jul 22, 2006 9:50 am

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 40):
The USA have revealed to be treacherous and not to be relied upon. Suppose that all those so heavily pro-US-American Lebanese now have re-learnt.

That precisely is why I think that Lebanon has a very short windows to get rid of the hezbollah now, as all the word is watching. Because of all the attention, US or israel cannot turn their back and leave if lebanon ask for assistance.

The more we wait, the less likely we are to get any assistance if needed.

Sorry for talking about the hezbollah in these terms but understand there is no way the hezbollah can be left again with the choice of waging a war to israel whenever they want, in other worlds, lebanon has to control its south border, otherwise I'll be very sorry for this country and I'll leave, I'm not building a live in such an instable situation, and no sane investor will want to invest anymore in lebanon.

Now we know we will have to deploy the army. The question is... when? I say, the best time is now that the whole world is watching and offering assistance. But then, what do I know, I'm no expert in neither military strategy, or international diplomacy... just my 2 cents
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ME AVN FAN
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RE: A Ceasefire Is Needed / Disarm Hizbollah

Sat Jul 22, 2006 10:22 am

Quoting Rolfen (Reply 41):
Sorry for talking about the hezbollah in these terms but understand there is no way the hezbollah can be left again with the choice of waging a war to israel whenever they want, in other worlds, lebanon has to control its south border, otherwise I'll be very sorry for this country and I'll leave, I'm not building a live in such an instable situation, and no sane investor will want to invest anymore in lebanon.

THIS is what I stated before. I in last October read in the DailyStar that many potential investors finally refused to invest due to the Hizbollah matter. As long as they can do mischief anywhere, and maintain a separate army, the situation remains unstable. At present, the hope unfortunately HAS to be that Israel gets across the border and does the required "cleaning" in that particular area. A STRONG U.N.-force however WILL be required to stabilize the area.

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