LON-CHI
Topic Author
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Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Thu Jul 27, 2006 11:14 pm

Breaking news headline on MSNBC:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14059185/

[Edited 2006-07-27 16:20:49]

[Edited 2006-07-27 16:21:33]
 
nkops
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Thu Jul 27, 2006 11:17 pm

here's the link.. although it doesn't mention Landis' name

http://today.reuters.co.uk/news/news...RUKOC_0_UK-CYCLING-TOUR-DOPING.xml
:evil:
 
LON-CHI
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Thu Jul 27, 2006 11:19 pm

This might explain why he never turned up for a race in Denmark today...

Tour de France winner is no-show in Denmark, Netherlands
 
Clogman
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Thu Jul 27, 2006 11:21 pm

Well what a surprise. Its Tour De France. Everyone is using sterioids and doping Big grin
 
deltagator
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Thu Jul 27, 2006 11:47 pm

Quoting Clogman (Reply 3):
Well what a surprise. Its Tour De France. Everyone is using sterioids and doping

It's only cheating if you get caught. And it appears that Phugly Phonak Phloyd possibly got caught. Ban him, fire him from his team, and treat him as a disgraceful cheater if it is found to be true.

I'm betting we get an excuse about how it was some pill for his hip injury that was unknowingly given to him by some doctor as the culprit.

All speculation though...let's get more details.
"If you can't delight in the misery of others then you don't deserve to be a college football fan."
 
Newark777
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Thu Jul 27, 2006 11:47 pm

I guess we have to wait for the results on his B sample, nothing is definitive until then. But as it has already been said, it's such a dirty spot as it is, this is just one more smear on its image.

If the Tour started this why, you can't be surprised for it to end this way.

Harry
Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
 
Newark777
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Thu Jul 27, 2006 11:48 pm

Quoting DeltaGator (Reply 4):
It's only cheating if you get caught.

No, cheating is cheating. You only get punished if you're caught.

Harry
Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
 
nkops
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Thu Jul 27, 2006 11:48 pm

Quoting LON-CHI (Reply 2):
This might explain why he never turned up for a race in Denmark today...

Yup... ESPN just confirmed it was Landis.... how stupid can you be??
:evil:
 
deltagator
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Thu Jul 27, 2006 11:55 pm

Quoting Newark777 (Reply 6):
No, cheating is cheating. You only get punished if you're caught.

I know. Just a quote from an old football (American style you Euroweenies!) coach on how to get away with illegal blocks. Of course that is a horrible travesty of sports that I would never condone with impressionable youth.  Wink
"If you can't delight in the misery of others then you don't deserve to be a college football fan."
 
Dougloid
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 12:04 am

This is a fucking disaster.....
If you believe in coincidence, you haven't looked close enough-Joe Leaphorn
 
Newark777
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 12:09 am

Quoting Dougloid (Reply 9):
This is a fucking disaster.....

Honestly, as bad as this is for Landis, this is just as bad for the Tour. Not only do they have to eliminate most of the front runners before the Tour even starts, but now they will probably have to strip the winner of his championship.

Makes the Tour and professional cycling look like a joke, and it will be a while before they gain much legitimacy back.

Harry
Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
 
prosa
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 1:04 am

Reports say that Landis had excessive amounts of testosterone, in other words steroids. That's a bit surprising because the benefits (so to speak) of steroids are more commonly associated with sports requiring explosive strength, not endurance sports such as distance cycling.
"Let me think about it" = the coward's way of saying "no"
 
9V-SPF
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 1:20 am

Quoting PROSA (Reply 11):
That's a bit surprising because the benefits (so to speak) of steroids are more commonly associated with sports requiring explosive strength, not endurance sports such as distance cycling.

That´s right but I suppose that, like it has been in a lot of other cases, these steroids were just one condiment of a very substantial cocktail. You don´t seriously think that if somebody is willing to cheat this way, he won´take advantage of all accessible drugs that he thinks he might benefit from in some way.
Cycling has been a dirty sport for centuries and if it doesn´t change now, it will never do.
 
ME AVN FAN
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 1:26 am

Quoting Clogman (Reply 3):
Its Tour De France.

I a good while ago heard from somebody who takes part in private "races" of the basically harmless kind, that unbelievably many participants are heavily doped. Don't know whether true, just wondered.
 
ME AVN FAN
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 1:30 am

Quoting Nkops (Reply 7):
.... how stupid can you be??

and why do the doctors in charge hand out medication of a strength to be detected ? do they speculate that there will be no testing ?
 
ltbewr
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 1:31 am

Apparently this postive sample was from after his amazing 'comeback' in the 17th stage. That had to raise red flags. No wonder he went into hiding the last few days, he probably knew he had a positive test. Of course, the 2nd "B" sample will be tested to confirm the 1st sample.
If it is confirmed, he brought shame to the Tour (if with its history of doping scandals, could it get worse?), himself, his fine religious family, his friends, his team, his sponsors and his country - the USA. He should also face criminal penalties under French Law.
If he is declared as doped, I would assume there will be an appeals process. Then if he loses that, then what happens to the title? Of course, the real winner never gets the public attention he deserved and that is sad too.
 
jonathan-l
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 1:32 am

Fact for speculation: Floyd Landis is Lance Armstrong's former teammate
 
9V-SPF
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 1:33 am

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 14):
and why do the doctors in charge hand out medication of a strength to be detected ?

 dollarsign  dollarsign  dollarsign 
 
Newark777
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 1:35 am

Quoting Jonathan-l (Reply 16):
Fact for speculation: Floyd Landis is Lance Armstrong's former teammate

My cousin also once ran into Barry Bonds on the street. He also plays football. Therefore he must be doing steroids.

Keep your little speculatory facts to yourself.

Harry
Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
 
2H4
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 1:37 am




Quoting Jonathan-l (Reply 16):
Fact for speculation: Floyd Landis is Lance Armstrong's former teammate

Nice flamebait, Jonathan. Way to contribute to a thread about Floyd.  sarcastic 




2H4


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greasespot
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 1:38 am

Two kinds of riders...

Those who are using drugs and those who have not been caught YET.

GS
Sometimes all you can do is look them in the eye and ask " how much did your mom drink when she was pregnant with you?"
 
2H4
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 1:42 am




Quoting Greasespot (Reply 20):
Two kinds of riders...

Those who are using drugs and those who have not been caught YET.

A 100% incorrect and shortsighted statement.

Not all riders use drugs, as you suggest. In fact, suggesting such a thing is a real slap in the face to the (many) clean racers out there. Very disrespectful, and surprising coming from you, Greasespot.




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Newark777
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 1:44 am

Quoting 2H4 (Reply 21):

Not all riders use drugs, as you suggest. In fact, suggesting such a thing is a real slap in the face to the (many) clean racers out there. Very disrespectful, and surprising coming from you, Greasespot.

The fact is, though, more and more people see cycling as a dirty sport, especially with the amount of people kicked out of the tour. It needs to get its act together fast.

Harry
Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
 
2H4
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 1:45 am




Quoting Newark777 (Reply 22):

The fact is, though, more and more people see cycling as a dirty sport, especially with the amount of people kicked out of the tour. It needs to get its act together fast.

I agree completely....but to suggest that all racers are dopers is way out of line.




2H4


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SInGAPORE_AIR
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 1:48 am

He apparently got tested positive for Testosterone.

What a shock (!)
Anyone can fly, only the best Soar.
 
dl021
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 1:50 am

If Landis is guilty then he needs to be banned from the sport.

Quoting Jonathan-l (Reply 16):
Fact for speculation: Floyd Landis is Lance Armstrong's former teammate

Will the French never let go of that, even though it's been investigated to death?

poor sportsmanship.
Is my Pan Am ticket to the moon still good?
 
9V-SPF
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 1:51 am

Quoting Jonathan-l (Reply 16):
Fact for speculation: Floyd Landis is Lance Armstrong's former teammate

Using this argumentation, you would have to accuse almost every rider of being a cheater...I´m not saying that this would be too far off target though.
 
greaser
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 2:01 am

In his defense, what about the meds he was taking for his hip condition?
IT MIGHT have been possible that a side effect of these meds would be increased levels in testosterone, which would in itself help him cope with the pain of his condition
Now you're really flying
 
Newark777
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 2:12 am

Quoting 2H4 (Reply 23):

I agree completely....but to suggest that all racers are dopers is way out of line.

Right, as with baseball and other sports.

I wonder how Robbie McEwen feels about all this....

Harry
Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
 
slider
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 2:17 am

Quoting Newark777 (Reply 10):
Makes the Tour and professional cycling look like a joke, and it will be a while before they gain much legitimacy back.

What a damn disgrace.

You know, I didn't give a rip about this Tour sans Lance, but got caught up with Landis's amazing comeback.....one of the greatest displays of heart and individual accomplishment in all the annals of sport.

Too bad it's all a fraud.

No better than Barry Bonds as far as I'm concerned.
 
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scbriml
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 2:18 am

Quoting LTBEWR (Reply 15):
Of course, the real winner never gets the public attention he deserved and that is sad too.

I agree this is a real downer. For the fans and for the other sportsmen involved.

I remember staying up in to the middle of the night to watch the 100m final at the 1988 Olympics in Seoul. I went to bed thinking I had just watched the greatest race of all time with 4 men running inside 10 seconds.

When the truth emerged, I felt as if I had been robbed. I felt even more for Carl Lewis and Linford Cristie who were robbed of being presented with their correct medals at an Olympic medal ceremony. I don't know what Lewis felt about eventually receiving the Gold, but I could understand if he felt it was tainted through no fault of his own.

Carl Lewis trivia:
His 1984 Olympic 100m Gold Medal was buried with his father.
Lewis was drafted by the Chicago Bulls in 1984 but never played for them.
Lewis was drafted by the Dallas Cowboys in 1984 but never played for them.
Lewis himself failed multiple drugs test in the 1988 Olympic trials but was not banned by the US Olympic Committee.
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana!
 
ZRH
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 3:22 am

Quoting Dougloid (Reply 9):
This is a fucking disaster.....

No it is fucking funny. I am laughing my ass off these morons.

Quoting PROSA (Reply 11):
Reports say that Landis had excessive amounts of testosterone, in other words steroids. That's a bit surprising because the benefits (so to speak) of steroids are more commonly associated with sports requiring explosive strength, not endurance sports such as distance cycling.

I learned that testosterone also helps you to recover much faster.

Quoting Jonathan-l (Reply 16):
Fact for speculation: Floyd Landis is Lance Armstrong's former teammate

I am 100% convinced that Armstrong was doped at all his victories (he only was more intelligent not to be caught). In fact I am sure that most participants of the Tour de France in the last 10 years were doped.

At the moment pro cycling and Italian football are the most ridiculous sports, their goal is cheating.
 
halls120
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 3:28 am

Quoting Newark777 (Reply 10):
Quoting Dougloid (Reply 9):
This is a fucking disaster.....

Honestly, as bad as this is for Landis, this is just as bad for the Tour. Not only do they have to eliminate most of the front runners before the Tour even starts, but now they will probably have to strip the winner of his championship.

Makes the Tour and professional cycling look like a joke, and it will be a while before they gain much legitimacy back.

Harry

I'm not so sure I'd stop at cycling. The use of performance enhancing drugs has made virtually every sport - especially at the professional level - suspect.

Quoting DL021 (Reply 25):
Quoting Jonathan-l (Reply 16):
Fact for speculation: Floyd Landis is Lance Armstrong's former teammate

Will the French never let go of that, even though it's been investigated to death?

poor sportsmanship.

And you are surprised the first person to make this link is from France?  Wink
"Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself." Mark Twain, a Biography
 
Newark777
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 3:39 am

Quoting ZRH (Reply 31):
I am 100% convinced that Armstrong was doped at all his victories

There's also people 100% sure that planes produce chemtrails. Doesn't mean shit.

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 32):

And you are surprised the first person to make this link is from France?

They've been the ones bitching about him for years. They just can't handle the fact an American dominated their premier international event, and now it's a tainted farce to boot.  biggrin 

Harry
Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
 
searpqx
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 4:05 am

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 32):
I'm not so sure I'd stop at cycling. The use of performance enhancing drugs has made virtually every sport - especially at the professional level - suspect.

As everyone has said, if verified with his 'B' sample, Landis deserves to have the book thrown at him. And of course, this doesn't help cycling's reputation, especially after the scandel that disqualified the favorites just before the race. But what I don't get is why the condemnation of cycling and almost no mention of other pro sports. Or have we just accepted that they're dirty and its not an issue any more?
"The two most common elements in the universe are Hydrogen and stupidity"
 
greasespot
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 4:11 am

Quoting 2H4 (Reply 21):
Very disrespectful, and surprising coming from you, Greasespot

Your right...I am Just pissed at the whole sport right now...This is the first year that i have not watched any of it or taped it for use while i am spinning this winter..


GS
Sometimes all you can do is look them in the eye and ask " how much did your mom drink when she was pregnant with you?"
 
2H4
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 4:15 am




Quoting Greasespot (Reply 35):
Your right...I am Just pissed at the whole sport right now

I can sympathize. The whole mess is a big step backward for not only racing, but the sport in general.  Sad




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SA7700
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 4:17 am

Quoting ZRH (Reply 31):
I am 100% convinced that Armstrong was doped at all his victories

Can you please present the evidence councillor? If not, you are out of order and technically a disgrace to your profession.


Rgds

SA7700
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Newark777
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 4:19 am

Quoting Searpqx (Reply 34):
But what I don't get is why the condemnation of cycling and almost no mention of other pro sports. Or have we just accepted that they're dirty and its not an issue any more?

None of the other sports have had so many leaders of the sport test positive for performance enhancing drugs. I mean, most people criticize Bonds, since he obviously took steroids, but the fact remains he didn't fail anything, and only a few other have in fact failed.

It's just so shocking to see nearly all the best cyclists get banned due to drugs.

Harry
Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
 
searpqx
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 4:24 am

Quoting Newark777 (Reply 38):
but the fact remains he didn't fail anything, and only a few other have in fact failed.

Because, at least in the states, players unions have done an amazing job of protecting the players from rigerous testing. And yet the circumstantial evidence is all but overwhelming that its just as epidemic in pro sports here. After every game, I'd love to see each player in the MLB, NBA, NHL & NFL put through the same set of tests that cyclists go through. Wonder what the results would be?
"The two most common elements in the universe are Hydrogen and stupidity"
 
Boeing7E7
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 4:29 am

He tested positive for "high Testosterone levels" on an "A" test. Dude's got a nut sack the size of Texas. Maybe it's just normal for him.



Think about it people. How stupid would one have to be at this stage of the issue in cycling to be doping?

[Edited 2006-07-27 21:43:19]
 
Newark777
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 4:35 am

Quoting Searpqx (Reply 39):
Because, at least in the states, players unions have done an amazing job of protecting the players from rigerous testing. And yet the circumstantial evidence is all but overwhelming that its just as epidemic in pro sports here. After every game, I'd love to see each player in the MLB, NBA, NHL & NFL put through the same set of tests that cyclists go through. Wonder what the results would be?

Trust me, I completely agree with you, but I'm just saying that the difference is that in cycling we have hard facts and test results to prove the problem, while in the rest of the sports it is still mostly allegations, and that info is just starting to come to light.

Quoting Boeing7E7 (Reply 40):
Think about it people. How stupid would one have to be at this stage of the issue in cycling to be doping?

I don't know, why don't you ask Jan Ulrich and Ivan Basso.

Harry
Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
 
greasespot
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 5:13 am

Archived urine samples from the 1999 Tour de France were later retested for the presence of synthetic erythropoietin, or EPO, which can boost an athlete's performance by increasing the oxygen available to muscles. Samples allegedly taken from winner Lance Armstrong at various points along the 2,290-mile route showed the probable presence of EPO in the 2004 tests, according to testimony and evidence in Texas arbitration hearings.

Results of the tests

A blood doping expert retained by litigants in the arbitration case testified that his analysis of EPO tests found results consistent with a series of injections during the Tour. A reading of 80% or higher was considered positive for EPO.

Prologue, July 3: 2004 analysis of sample taken after this 4.2-mile sprint showed reading of 100%. Such a level is consistent with an injection within hours of the race.

Stage 1, July 4: 89.7%.

Stage 8, July 11: The next sample tested was from this 34.8-mile time trial. A positive reading via "visual interpretation" but no percentage reported.

Stage 9, July 13: 96.6%. The first mountain stage.

Stage 10, July 14: 88.7%.

Stage 11, July 15: Missing.

Stage 12, July 16: 95.2%.


Source http://www.latimes.com/sports/cyclin...tory?page=8&coll=la-home-headlines

Quoting SA7700 (Reply 37):
Can you please present the evidence councillor? If not, you are out of order and technically a disgrace to your profession.

With out a B sample technically you cannot convict....However...

GS
Sometimes all you can do is look them in the eye and ask " how much did your mom drink when she was pregnant with you?"
 
2H4
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 5:20 am




Quoting Greasespot (Reply 42):
With out a B sample technically you cannot convict

Without a positive B sample, not only can you not convict...you cannot prove beyond a reasonable doubt that he was, in fact, doping...




2H4


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greasespot
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 5:26 am

Yes that is why he is still the champ.....However......The dots are not that far apart.......In fact they are almost close enough to make a straight line....

Take it how you want..

For me the eveidence is compelling enough.....but that is my opinion..



GS
Sometimes all you can do is look them in the eye and ask " how much did your mom drink when she was pregnant with you?"
 
2H4
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 5:29 am




Quoting Greasespot (Reply 44):
Take it how you want..

For me the eveidence is compelling enough.....but that is my opinion..

I see your point, but at the same time, I think it's unfair to burn him at the stake until we have 100% conclusive proof.

Do we have any idea when the B-sample results will be complete?




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Beaucaire
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 5:46 am

Phonak team :Tyler Hamilton -doped
Oscar Camenzind -doped
Santiago Perez -doped
Floyd Lendis-doped......

I though the Swiss only make good chocolates...
But then -Basel - is the european HQ for some big pharamceuticals...
Please respect animals - don't eat them...
 
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sebolino
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 6:31 am

Quoting SA7700 (Reply 37):
Quoting ZRH (Reply 31):
I am 100% convinced that Armstrong was doped at all his victories

Can you please present the evidence councillor? If not, you are out of order and technically a disgrace to your profession.

???

He was tested positive.
 
Newark777
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 6:36 am

Quoting Sebolino (Reply 47):
He was tested positive.

Thanks for the links. Until you provide them, you just sound like more of a whiny sore loser.

Harry
Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
 
2H4
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RE: Tour De France Winner Landis Tests Positive

Fri Jul 28, 2006 6:36 am




Quoting Sebolino (Reply 47):
He was tested positive.

A positive B-sample is required to confirm the allegations that he did something illegal, but even then, there are exceptions...




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