san747
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Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Tue Aug 01, 2006 2:09 pm

This is a thread similar to my South Park thread:
Your Opinions On South Park? (by San747 Jul 31 2006 in Non Aviation)

Basically, I believe that the Beatles are the greatest muscial group in modern history for several reasons.

1. What other group has ever been the catalyst of such a major social phenomenon like Beatlemania? Bands like The Who and Led Zeppelin, though great, never had such an all-encompassing effect on culture like the Beatles did. I know the Beatles had unusual circumstances that definitely facilitated their popularity (Kennedy assassination, the country for the 3 months between it and the first Ed Sullivan appearance was ripe for new "heroes"), but Beatlemania would definitely have been a very quick passing fad if there wasn't some true talent and appeal behind it.

2. Their amazing body of work. Though they were only a group for around 10 years (counting from their early German stints in 1960), they wrote nearly 300 songs (and I'm pretty sure I'm underestimating here), all very diverse. Obviously, there are some I like better than others, but if you look at the songs in a bigger sense, they are all very skillfully written.

3. The evolution and maturity of the band's work. If someone who had never heard the Beatles before heard "She Loves You" and "A Day in the Life" (just examples, this could apply to any of their pre-1965 and post-"Sgt. Pepper work), they would probably not guess that they were by the same group. The Beatles were very innovative with their work, introducing the sitar to western music, being the first to use backwards tracks, and having George Martin as a producer helped a lot. He was committed to helping the Beatles achieve their desired sound in every album they made together, especially the later albums.

4. Their post-breakup success. All of the Fab Four were successful once they went solo, albeit some more so than others. George scored in 1971 (?) with "All Things Must Pass" and the single "My Sweet Lord", unfortunately, none of his subsequent solo work reached the same success as that first album.

Paul McCartney hit it big solo with "Ram" and obviously is still going strong, releasing "Chaos and Creation in the Backyard" (reviewed by many as his best work since "Ram") in September 2005, and staging a tremendously successful US tour that fall (I was lucky enough to see his November 26th show in Las Vegas, it was amazing!)

John obviously had an interesting last 10 years of life post-Beatles, recording very raw and emotional solo albums that enjoyed success in some cases, and complete commercial failure in others. With the birth of Sean, he took 5 years off to be a stay-at-home dad, returning to the studio only months before his untimely murder... One can only speculate what he could've achieved had he been alive today.

Ringo still plays and had success with his various bands and albums later, especially in the 80s. I must admit, however, I don't know as much about his solo post-Beatle work as I do the others!

FAVORITE SONGS-
I guess I would have to go by album...

A Hard Day's Night

  • I Should've Known Better
  • Any Time At All
  • I'll Be Back

Abbey Road

  • Something
  • Oh! Darling
  • I Want You (She's So Heavy)
  • Polythene Pam
  • You Never Give Me Your Money
  • She Came in Through the Bathroom Window
  • The End

Beatles for Sale

  • Honey Don't

Help!

  • The Night Before
  • I Need You
  • Yesterday

Let It Be... Naked

  • Get Back
  • Let It Be

Magical Mystery Tour

  • Magical Mystery Tour
  • I Am the Walrus
  • Flying

Please Please Me

  • I Saw Her Standing There
  • Please Please Me
  • P.S. I Love You
  • Do You Want to Know a Secret?

Revolver

  • Taxman
  • And Your Bird Can Sing
  • Got to Get You Into My Life

Rubber Soul

  • Drive My Car
  • Think for Yourself
  • I'm Looking Through You
  • If I Needed Someone

Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band

  • Fixing A Hole
  • Lovely Rita
  • Sgt. Pepper's (reprise)
  • A Day in the Life

White Album

  • Back in the U.S.S.R.
  • While My Guitar Gently Weeps
  • Helter Skelter
  • Blackbird

With the Beatles

  • It Won't Be Long
  • All I've Got to Do
  • All My Loving
  • Don't Bother Me
  • 'Till There Was You
  • I Wanna Be Your Man


Others- Day Tripper, Komm Gib Mir Deine Hand ("I Want to Hold Your Hand" in german), Sie Liebt Dich ("She Loves You" in german), and the english equivalents of the last two...

Whew... So after all that, I'm just interested in your opinions of the Beatles. As per the South Park thread, don't post something stupid or not contributing to the thread, and back up any opinions/statements with reasons... Have at it!

-san747  wave 
Scotty doesn't know...
 
Cadet57
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RE: Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Tue Aug 01, 2006 2:17 pm

Without a doubt. My most favorite band of all time. Im only 18 but feel as If I knew them as if it were 1962. Idk where I became interested but I think its the fact that their music is timeless and any generation can recognize the quality and beauty of their work.
Doors open, right hand side, next stop is Springfield.
 
san747
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RE: Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Tue Aug 01, 2006 2:25 pm

Quoting Cadet57 (Reply 1):
Without a doubt. My most favorite band of all time. Im only 18 but feel as If I knew them as if it were 1962.

I know exactly what you mean... Watching the Ed Sullivan shows w/the Beatles on DVD made me feel just like that. That February 9th show, when they start singing the first words of "All My Loving" is actually fairly moving to me, because it's basically the sunday evening that really changed America forever... 73,000,000 viewers watched that night, 40% of America's population at the time...
Scotty doesn't know...
 
Pulkovokiwi
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RE: Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Tue Aug 01, 2006 2:27 pm

They were good but Stones are better hehe and The Kinks are seriously underrated.
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tercer
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RE: Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Tue Aug 01, 2006 2:32 pm

The Beatles suck! The Monkees, now there is a band!  old 

It's politically sensitive, but it's going to happen.
 
Bobster2
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RE: Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Tue Aug 01, 2006 2:41 pm

I fell in love with the Paul McCartney live concert albums, and I haven't listened much to Beatles studio albums since. Live is better.
"I tell you this, no eternal reward will forgive us now for wasting the dawn." Jim Morrison
 
bhmbaglock
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RE: Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Tue Aug 01, 2006 2:44 pm

One of my all time favorites but honestly not as important to me as they were back in the seventies.

On a side note, if you haven't ever seen the PowerPuff Girls episode "The PowerPuff Girls meet the Beat-Alls" you have to get a copy and see it. Almost every line from every character comes directly from Beatles songs. It is absolutely hysterical!
Where are all of my respected members going?
 
tercer
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RE: Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Tue Aug 01, 2006 2:46 pm

Quoting San747 (Thread starter):
Beatlemania

Some Beatlemania trivial for you. There was a Powerpuff Girls episode called "Meet the Beat-Alls" that was written with lots of Beatle references (listed on the following link)...


Beatles References in "Meet the Beat-Alls"


It's politically sensitive, but it's going to happen.
 
san747
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RE: Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Tue Aug 01, 2006 2:58 pm

Quoting Tercer (Reply 7):
Some Beatlemania trivial for you. There was a Powerpuff Girls episode called "Meet the Beat-Alls" that was written with lots of Beatle references (listed on the following link)...

Interesting... Not because of the references themselves, but because I'm wondering if the show's primary audience (I'm gonna go out on a limb here, but I'll say young to pre-teen girls) would understand a lot of those references... Some of those quotes and allusions in there are such that you'd have to know the Beatles pretty well to know of them.
Scotty doesn't know...
 
tercer
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RE: Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Tue Aug 01, 2006 3:08 pm

Quoting San747 (Reply 8):
Interesting... Not because of the references themselves, but because I'm wondering if the show's primary audience (I'm gonna go out on a limb here, but I'll say young to pre-teen girls) would understand a lot of those references... Some of those quotes and allusions in there are such that you'd have to know the Beatles pretty well to know of them.

I saw an interview with the shows creator and if I remember correctly it was, of course, drawn for the kids but written for the parents.
It's politically sensitive, but it's going to happen.
 
Banco
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RE: Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Tue Aug 01, 2006 4:56 pm

Quoting San747 (Thread starter):
Bands like The Who and Led Zeppelin, though great, never had such an all-encompassing effect on culture like the Beatles did.

Not forgetting the Stones, the Kinks et al.

The point about the Beatles was that they were the first. What they did changed the rules for all the others. If you want to take two of the other big bands that were just starting out at the time the Beatles hit - the Stones and the Who, albeit not necessarily in the full line-ups - they were at the time playing skiffle music or R and B (real R and B, not the stuff that gets called it nowadays) covers; it was the Beatles, writing their own music, that gave those two bands (and the Kinks) a big jolt and made the requirement for self-penned music imperative.

In that period, many a band fell by the wayside as it became apparent they didn't have a songwriter. So the Beatles impact was massive and undeniable. Where you go from there in later years comes down to how much you like them or not. Once the Beatles had blazed a trail, others followed, and then both the Beatles and other bands fed off each other (for example, Helter Skelter was a deliberate answer to the Who) to the benefit of all.

Equally, the Beatles demonstrated how to crack America, and of the two other bands that followed doing the same (Stones and Who - you can ignore Zeppelin to some extent as they were so much later) the principals freely admit studying exactly how the Beatles did it so they could do the same.

Now personally, I'm not that big a fan of the Beatles, I find the songs fine, but the musicianship rather too basic and limited. But hey, that's me. The point is that by being genuine innovators in those early days, they made all that followed possible, and that's a staggering achievement. Given the British domination of the rest of the decade, studying their impact on British musical culture - encouraging vast numbers of people to pick up a guitar and so on - is crucial, even more so that what they did in the US.

One area where I tend to disagree with Beatles "lore" is that Sgt Pepper wasn't quite as new and unprecedented as is often claimed. Plenty of other bands were doing things equally radical, the Beach Boys' Smile, the Who's Sell Out are just two examples. But because of who the Beatles were, it is perhaps understandable that they get given most of the credit.
She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
 
Pulkovokiwi
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RE: Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Tue Aug 01, 2006 5:15 pm

Must not forget the influence of Sir George Martin.
I thought I was wrong but I was only joking!
 
gunsontheroof
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RE: Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Tue Aug 01, 2006 5:25 pm

Most of their material is superb. "Revolver" is one of my favorite records of all time.

Best group of all time? Maybe. My favorite? Hardly.
 
baylorairbear
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RE: Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Tue Aug 01, 2006 5:26 pm

Quoting BHMBAGLOCK (Reply 6):
On a side note, if you haven't ever seen the PowerPuff Girls episode "The PowerPuff Girls meet the Beat-Alls" you have to get a copy and see it. Almost every line from every character comes directly from Beatles songs. It is absolutely hysterical!

Did a grown man just tell me to watch the PowerPuff Girls?  faint 

I enjoy all of the Beatles' standards, which, I think, averages about one song per album. My mother, being from that generation, was a fanatic, and has first editions of all Beatles albums.

BAB
I'm just skipping stones...
 
bhmbaglock
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RE: Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Tue Aug 01, 2006 9:15 pm

Quoting Baylorairbear (Reply 13):
Did a grown man just tell me to watch the PowerPuff Girls?

Yes! You will obey. Seriously, if you like the Beatles at all you will probably be in pain from laughing by the time it's over. They did a really good job.
Where are all of my respected members going?
 
Cadet57
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RE: Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Wed Aug 02, 2006 5:57 am

Quoting BHMBAGLOCK (Reply 14):

Yes! You will obey. Seriously, if you like the Beatles at all you will probably be in pain from laughing by the time it's over. They did a really good job

Beleive it or not, I have or had idk if its still round, that episode off limewire. Cracks me up
Doors open, right hand side, next stop is Springfield.
 
CastleIsland
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RE: Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Wed Aug 02, 2006 6:50 am

Quoting Banco (Reply 10):
but the musicianship rather too basic and limited

I understand what you are saying, Banco, and the Beatles are my "best band ever." I remember reading some quote about a comment a music reviewer made back in 1964 about the ending of some tune (I forget which - I think it's off With The Beatles), and the "aeolian cadence" or some such. The Beatles had no idea what he was talking about, but they were sophisticated enough in their chord voicings to create a sound that was completely unique at the time. It's actually far more complex than it sounds, and that's what makes it seem basic, if you follow me.

In my mind, McCartney was the best musician in that band. Listen to some of the bass lines he fires off on Abbey Road - particularly on I Want You (She's So Heavy) and "You Never Give Me Your Money".
"People don't do what they believe in, they just do what's most convenient, then they repent." - Dylan
 
Sabena332
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RE: Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Wed Aug 02, 2006 7:00 am

Quoting Pulkovokiwi (Reply 3):
They were good but Stones are better hehe

I agree, I like almost all Stones songs but only very few from the Beatles. My personal taste for their music aside, they were a great and a very successful band, so much is for sure.

Quoting Pulkovokiwi (Reply 3):
and The Kinks are seriously underrated.

"Waterloo Sunset" is a friggin great song from them!

Patrick
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halls120
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RE: Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Wed Aug 02, 2006 11:06 am

Don't know if there is a "best" band, but they are clearly a contender.

My favorites are side 2 of Abbey Road and the entire White Album.
"Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself." Mark Twain, a Biography
 
vaporlock
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RE: Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Wed Aug 02, 2006 11:30 am

The Beatles = AMAZING....

Phyllis  bouncy 
 
san747
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RE: Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Wed Aug 02, 2006 11:36 am

Quoting CastleIsland (Reply 16):
I understand what you are saying, Banco, and the Beatles are my "best band ever." I remember reading some quote about a comment a music reviewer made back in 1964 about the ending of some tune (I forget which - I think it's off With The Beatles), and the "aeolian cadence" or some such. The Beatles had no idea what he was talking about, but they were sophisticated enough in their chord voicings to create a sound that was completely unique at the time. It's actually far more complex than it sounds, and that's what makes it seem basic, if you follow me.

Exactly. A reviewer (maybe the same one you mentioned) said the Beatles made great uses of 5ths, 7ths, 9ths and triads, and John said he didn't know what he was even talking about. I have a guitar chord/tab book with all the songs the Beatles wrote themselves, and they have some very unusual/complex chords in some songs. Out of 194 songs in the book, I can play maybe 50 of them, and I have 4 years of rythym guitar experience.

Quoting CastleIsland (Reply 16):
In my mind, McCartney was the best musician in that band. Listen to some of the bass lines he fires off on Abbey Road - particularly on I Want You (She's So Heavy) and "You Never Give Me Your Money".

I love both songs, and they do have great basslines, though those particular two you mention also have distinctive guitar riffs in them as well.

McCartney was definitely best, followed closely by George. John originally let both into his band in the late '50s because they knew more chords than him...
Scotty doesn't know...
 
kaddyuk
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RE: Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Wed Aug 02, 2006 12:04 pm

I've got their Number 1's Album... Its great listening and my favourite is 8 Days A Week... Big grin
Whoever said "laughter is the best medicine" never had Gonorrhea
 
fumanchewd
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RE: Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Wed Aug 02, 2006 12:31 pm

I am not a fan of their pop crap. Love me do and those types of songs were, IMO, the modern day equivalent of the Backstreet Boys. It was only when they took a more active role in writing that their stuff becme superb.

White Album and Sgt Pep are awesome.

I actually like the Beatles and Zep about the same. I think that the Beatles were revolutionary but I believe that Zep had more quality work over a wide range of genres (blues, rock, country, experimental, raggea, classic instruments, etc.).
In the time of chimpanzees, I was a monkey...
 
pbottenb
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RE: Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Wed Aug 02, 2006 2:00 pm

Quoting San747 (Thread starter):
Rubber Soul

Drive My Car

Think for Yourself

I'm Looking Through You

If I Needed Someone

My personal favorite album
 
747srule
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RE: Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Thu Aug 03, 2006 8:46 am

THEY SUCK!! I am SO TIRED of this overexposed,overated group. They are played on oldies,classic rock(they do not belong in that genre) and soft hits radio to the extent that I don't even listen anymore. Along with the Stones,two bands I can't stand. What will it take to reunite the beatles? Two bullets!!!
Jesus is the way,the truth,and the life
 
baylorairbear
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RE: Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Thu Aug 03, 2006 8:56 am

Quoting 747srule (Reply 24):
THEY SUCK!! I am SO TIRED of this overexposed,overated group. They are played on oldies,classic rock(they do not belong in that genre) and soft hits radio to the extent that I don't even listen anymore. Along with the Stones,two bands I can't stand. What will it take to reunite the beatles? Two bullets!!!

You're pretty sour for someone who says:

Quoting 747srule (Reply 24):
Jesus is the way,the truth,and the life

BAB
I'm just skipping stones...
 
cfcuq
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RE: Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Thu Aug 03, 2006 11:00 am

Quoting CastleIsland (Reply 16):
In my mind, McCartney was the best musician in that band. Listen to some of the bass lines he fires off on Abbey Road - particularly on I Want You (She's So Heavy) and "You Never Give Me Your Money".

If you read the credits on the album liner, the bassist on most studio recordings was actually Klaus Voorman. Paul was the bassist in public, usually played keyboards in studio. Their original bassist, Stu Suttcliffe (pardon spelling) was a member of the group because he had some limited success as an artist (actually sold some paintings) and therefore had some $$ to assist them getting started. Unfortunately, Stu died of a brain hemmorage during their Hamburg days. The original drummer, Pete Best, was replaced by Richard Starkey just prior to their frst big gig in Liverpool.
If you like the harmonies in their early work, listen to Badfinger. They were proteges of the Beatles, and were the first group signed to the Beatles own label, Apple Records. I have a million more, just ask ....
 
JAGflyer
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RE: Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Thu Aug 03, 2006 11:00 am

The Beatles were truly amazing. By far the best band of the century. I do not see the hype about Led Zep. Everyone seems so in shock when I say "I don't really like Led Zeppelin". They just never seemed that good to me. Now, Pink Floyd. There is a good rock band.
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OzarkD9S
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RE: Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Fri Aug 04, 2006 1:02 am

Quoting BaylorAirBear (Reply 25):
You're pretty sour for someone who says:

Quoting 747srule (Reply 24):
Jesus is the way,the truth,and the life

BAB

 bigthumbsup 

Simply put, The Beatles accomplished more in the short 7 years they were a recording unit than anyone else in the history of music, starting with the first drumbeat banged out by homo erectus.
Coast to Coast and Border to Border, Ozark Flies YOUR Way!
 
rammstein
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RE: Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Fri Aug 04, 2006 1:05 am

I'm sorry for the fans, but it's just a matter of taste. An my taste says that Beatles songs are so booooooooring...

[Edited 2006-08-03 18:06:26]
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GDB
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RE: Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Fri Aug 04, 2006 5:08 am

Without them, music today would be utterly different, if a bunch of religous fanatic rednecks hated them, burned their material Nazi style, (we seem to have one one here), that's better yet.

Any popular musician worth their salt knows this, even if what they are doing sounds totally different.
The Beatles were to popular music what the 707 was to jet airliners.

Has any group, in such a short time, transcended their early disposable pop routes, to such massive effect?

The key was songwriting, you a had, when he got the chance, a competant writer in Harrison, you had McCartney-who even if somehow popular music as we know it had not emerged, would have done something significant in whatever form popular music became.
Then Lennon, the provocative one, the snarl to McCartney's often crowd pleasing.

But there was interchange with these 'roles', they bounced off each other.

The Beach Boys, their only real US rival, had Brian Wilson.
But that was all. He was a genius, but one disliked by 'don't fuck with the formula' Mike Love.
Love, the biggest wanker in music.
(Will the record company ever release his live recorded concert tirade against the Beatles, Stones, Kinks, all those 'Limey Faggots' who had unsurped him (huh?) by the late 60's)
Not while his lawyers live and breath sadly.

But the Beatles, McCartney in particuar, had a massive respect for Wilson, McCartney rates 'Pet Sounds' as his favourite ever album.
But on release in 1966, Pet Sounds sold poorly.
Odd, the Beatles has the equally innovative 'Revolver' as a major success.
Mr Love had it seems the sales numbers on his side.

Wilson would attempt a follow up even greater, but not succeed, sending him into that head of his, the album not really emerging until the 21st Century.

Another factor, though driven by the Beatles massive success, was giving up live touring in 1966.
The rednecks out for them, Phillipine dictator Marcos sending his thugs after them after they snubbed his ghastly wife, the pure treadmill of it all.
Their later US dates had the army of fans screaming so loud, no one could hear the group, they often just said expletives rather than the lyrics.

This would allow a renewed focus in the studio, with the results we all know about.

Remember, they started out not with huge ambition to be stars, not with a 'plan', not with TV, video, advertising exposure.
That's a more modern idea, great for hyping mediocre performers.

They were four ordinary boys from Liverpool who were having a laugh, enjoyed the 'delights' of Hamburg, would likely made a bit of money, then soon settle down to a more normal job and family.

They had been inspired by Elvis of course, but his massive, highly packaged success, was seen as the exception.
Groups were a novelty, not long term like singers.

In the end, living that life was too much for them, but by 1969/70 they knew that those years would define their lives forever, no matter what they would go on to do as individuals.
'You're going to carry that weight a long time'
Indeed.
 
IFEMaster
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RE: Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Fri Aug 04, 2006 5:11 am

Excellent composers and song writers that couldn't sing or play (and those that remain alive still can't sing or play).
Delivering Anecdotes of Dubious Relevance Since 1978
 
san747
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RE: Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Fri Aug 04, 2006 5:40 am

Quoting GDB (Reply 30):
The Beatles were to popular music what the 707 was to jet airliners.

That's a perfect analogy! That pretty much sums up the effect of the Beatles there...

Quoting IFEMaster (Reply 31):
Excellent composers and song writers that couldn't sing or play (and those that remain alive still can't sing or play).

That seems a little oxymoronic... You're not implying that the Beatles were not genuine musicians, are you? Because they most definitely were (and still are)...
Scotty doesn't know...
 
IFEMaster
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RE: Your Opinions On The Beatles?

Fri Aug 04, 2006 6:15 am

Quoting San747 (Reply 32):
That seems a little oxymoronic... You're not implying that the Beatles were not genuine musicians, are you? Because they most definitely were (and still are)...

I don't see the oxymoron. They were wonderful songwriters and composers. Their composition on a musical level is great, especially in their later material. But when it came to playing their instruments or singing the songs they'd written, the quality is poor. Honestly, Paul McCartney has an incredibly weak voice, both he and John Lennon have/had a limited vocal range with plenty of flat/sharp performances recorded. Ringo had problems with keeping time. George had problems with his rhythm and would fluff his lead lines on a regular basis. None of them were what I would call good musicians. Genuine musicians, but not good musicians.

Also, it's worth remembering - being good in a live situation is very different to being good in the studio. What is accomplished on record is very often not a reflection of a musicians capability, even back in the day when all they had was a couple of reel-to-reels, a four channel mixer, and a red light labelled "Recording".
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