9VSPO
Topic Author
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Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Wed Sep 06, 2006 3:23 am

One minister and four government aides are among 17 normally loyal Labour MPs who have written to Tony Blair urging him to quit. Personally I couldn't care less. Margaret Thatcher was eventually pushed. Is Blair going the same way?
 
aero145
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Wed Sep 06, 2006 3:27 am

Quoting 9VSPO (Thread starter):
One minister and four government aides are among 17 normally loyal Labour MPs who have written to Tony Blair urging him to quit. Personally I couldn't care less. Margaret Thatcher was eventually pushed. Is Blair going the same way?

I want this guy away from the politics. Please don't think that I don't know a single thing about this guy.

 talktothehand 
 
MYT332
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Wed Sep 06, 2006 3:30 am

Oh I don't mind, Blair or a Scotsman? Caught between the devil and the deep blue sea.
One Life, Live it.
 
RichardPrice
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Wed Sep 06, 2006 3:31 am

Blair needs to go, and while I disagree with a scottish constituency MP having control in the UK (since we cant vote on their laws), I would rather have Brown over Prescott.
 
Banco
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Wed Sep 06, 2006 3:59 am

Quoting RichardPrice (Reply 3):
Blair needs to go, and while I disagree with a scottish constituency MP having control in the UK (since we cant vote on their laws), I would rather have Brown over Prescott.

UK laws are no problem. It's them voting on English affairs that is.

And I'm quite sure that Gordon Brown would be thrilled to have it presented as a choice between him and Prescott. Prescott won't stand.

There's no desperate requirement for Blair to stand down now. These people calling for him to go are those that never liked him in the first place. He'll go sometime next year I would think.
She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
 
IFEMaster
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Wed Sep 06, 2006 4:20 am

In the grand scheme of things, what would really be accomplished by him going now, versus next year or early 2008? Not much. Unless Cameron screws up royally, I think it's likely that the Tories will win back power at the next general election, so why step down and give Brown the job when he's only going to be in it for 18 months?
Delivering Anecdotes of Dubious Relevance Since 1978
 
rammstein
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Wed Sep 06, 2006 4:39 am

He who wishes to be rich in a day will be hanged in a day. --Leonardo Da Vinci
 
wrighbrothers
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Wed Sep 06, 2006 4:48 am

I personally think he should go in his own time, rather than being bullied into it by a few MP's and the press, if he did that, the press will gain some high ground, and will begin to think of themselves as the voice of the public.
A quick exit would be disastrous, the new leader needs time to settle in and learn the ropes, if he's got the aid of the prime minister, this will be easier for all of us, and it also means no radical sudden changes.
He has said he will go before the next general election, and he will do that, I don't know why we are so obsessed with him leaving.

Quoting Myt332 (Reply 2):
Oh I don't mind, Blair or a Scotsman? Caught between the devil and the deep blue sea.

Tony Blair is Scottish.

Quoting 9VSPO (Thread starter):
One minister and four government aides are among 17 normally loyal Labour MPs who have written to Tony Blair urging him to quit.

And there were 45 people who signed a letter, giving their full support to him.

Wrightbrothers
Always stand up for what is right, even if it means standing alone..
 
cosec59
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Wed Sep 06, 2006 6:34 am

Apparently he has announced he will give up the leadership before next year's party conference
Rules are for the obedience of fools but for the guidance of wise men
 
MYT332
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Wed Sep 06, 2006 6:40 am

Quoting Wrighbrothers (Reply 7):
Tony Blair is Scottish.

Well he may have been born there but bah, he lived in Durham, or was it Newcastle?
One Life, Live it.
 
BAxMAN
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Wed Sep 06, 2006 7:19 am

I would imagine that Tony Blair, on a personal level, desperately wants to reach his 10 year anniversary as British PM on 1st May 2007. This would be quite a milestone if/when he achieves it. I bet he would also like to out-reign Margaret Thatcher, but realises this is an unrealistic situation if he intends to leave power of his own accord rather than being publicly evicted by members of the cabinet.

I am frequently a bit bemused by people who, somewhat vitriolically, demand that demon incarnate Blair leaves. Are they so politically naive that they think Blair's replacement - whether it be Gord Brown, Prezza, Comrade John Reid or Davey Boy Cameron - will herald a new era? That 'new era' will last all of 12 months until real life makes a mockery of opposition made pledges. Then, we'll have more of the 'same old same old' that we've had for, oooh, about 50 years.

That said, the Tories should exile Cameron to St Helena or The Falklands if he loses the next election. It's being handed to him on a nice, shiny silver platter.
I need to get laid
 
gkirk
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Wed Sep 06, 2006 7:53 am

Get rid of him. Get rid of that traitor Brown too...
When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
 
GDB
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Wed Sep 06, 2006 8:15 am

A lot of this rhetoric around this bugs me.

I agree with Labour MP Tony Wright, that this is self indulgence writ large by many MP's, it's not as if he's not going to resign, he's made that clear (to his cost), it's not as if Labour losing next time is certain, this is not John Major's post 1993 period, nor Jim Challaghan's post winter 1978/9 either.

Funny how recently elected Labour MP's are the ones really pushing now, no experience of in fighting helping to cause a long period in opposition, like Major, like Labour in the early 80's.

Beyond MP's, the media shrieking about having to have a general election immediately, should Brown succed Blair.
What? Like Thatcher to Major, Wilson to Challaghan, Macmillian to Douglas-Home, Eden to Mamillian, Chamberlin to Churchill, Baldwin to Chamberlin.
That's the last 70 years, with no general elections with the above transistions, since they were in mid term, only Churchill's ascent was in extreme circumstances, though arguably Eden going after Suez was after a single, major crisis.

Blair did win last year, didn't he?
That's another one they moan about-his numbers of votes was not proportionate to the seats gained, in England Labour polled less-think on GKirk and Co, that's influence, Scotland independant within the EU would never have that, if they could leave Wales off the map, they won't give a shit about you.
And those poorer Eastern European nations, recently joined, will be well before Scotland in the queue for handouts, to replace the English ones.

In 1951, Labour got more votes, the Tories won with more seats, Major polled a record number of votes in 1992, but had just a 21 seat majority, compared to Thatcher's landslides.
 
BMIFlyer
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Wed Sep 06, 2006 8:18 am

Does anyone really care?  silly 

No matter who is elected, they all turn out the same - they make promises, then break em  Sad



Lee
Sometimes You Can't Make It On Your Own
 
Banco
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Wed Sep 06, 2006 6:00 pm

Quoting GDB (Reply 12):
Funny how recently elected Labour MP's are the ones really pushing now, no experience of in fighting helping to cause a long period in opposition, like Major, like Labour in the early 80's.

But you have to appreciate that Blair has never been particularly popular with Labour MP's or membership. He undoubtedly pulled the party to the right and (as was bleedin' obvious to all but the more lunatic leftwingers) became electable as a result. These people supported Blair because he delivered power, not because they either believed in him or supported him.

Equally, for about 7 years, Blair was entirely bulletproof, and won that third election. Having perhaps foolishly said he wouldn't seek a fourth term, he became fair game, and those same people that never particularly liked him saw their chance.

I'm not sure Gordon Brown is going to be any better for Labour. Being Scottish, and sitting for a Scottish constituency is going to be a handicap with an English electorate that sees a Scottish Parliament, no English equivalent, and the UK government dominated by Scots. It won't be explicit, but no-one should doubt that there is irritation. Every time the government puts forward some initiative affecting only England, the Tories will be quick to point out that it won't affect the Prime Minister. And that's the problem with the imbalanced constitution as it is now.

Even if none of the above happens, Brown isn't going to be the panacea for all ills. At the moment he has the advantage of not being the Prime Minister. The best people are always those not in charge.

Quoting GDB (Reply 12):
Beyond MP's, the media shrieking about having to have a general election immediately, should Brown succed Blair.
What? Like Thatcher to Major, Wilson to Challaghan, Macmillian to Douglas-Home, Eden to Mamillian, Chamberlin to Churchill, Baldwin to Chamberlin.

This is true. But it won't affect those calls, and those demands were made also on each and every occasion listed above.

Quoting BMIFlyer (Reply 13):
No matter who is elected, they all turn out the same - they make promises, then break em

Actually, Labour have broken rather few promises. They've been quite careful about that. There does need to be some recognition that governing is difficult. Labour's overall record hasn't been too bad, and the country is still doing rather well. As GDB point out, this isn't the dying days of a government like Major's was.
She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
 
Thom@s
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Wed Sep 06, 2006 6:13 pm

Quoting Gkirk (Reply 11):
Get rid of him. Get rid of that traitor Brown too...

Charles Kennedy for PM!

Signed GKirk.
"If guns don't kill people, people kill people - does that mean toasters don't toast toast, toast toast toast?"
 
BA787
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Wed Sep 06, 2006 6:21 pm

My views on this are, look at the opposition.

Tony ain't great but when compared to the Ming and Campbell he comes out on top. Campbells a hypocrit, Ming Campbell spends most of his time asleep. At least Tony makes an effort to win us. If we still had the alchy in charge of the Libdems i'd vote for him all the way. Not that I can vote, but he was great.


But Gordon Brown ain't so bad, but I still think Tony's better.


He should stay until we get a better proposition
 
ME AVN FAN
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Wed Sep 06, 2006 7:04 pm

Quoting Banco (Reply 4):
There's no desperate requirement for Blair to stand down now.

did he, or did he NOT, promise Brown to step aside after a certain period, which now is past ?

Quoting Gkirk (Reply 11):
Get rid of that traitor Brown too...

WHY a "traitor" ?

Quoting Gkirk (Reply 11):
Get rid of him

Why really ? just because of his "link-up" with GWB, or why ?
 
Banco
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Wed Sep 06, 2006 7:29 pm

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 17):
did he, or did he NOT, promise Brown to step aside after a certain period, which now is past ?

Lots of speculation, little information. Only the two of them know what was said. Besides, it quite frankly has sod all to do with what they might or might not have agreed between them, this is for the position of Prime Minister, not who goes next on the pool table. It isn't in the gift of either of them.

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 17):
just because of his "link-up" with GWB, or why ?

As in any nation, foreign affairs are rarely the reason for the fall of a leader. Undoubtedly, Blair has been harmed by Iraq, but ultimately, it's doemstic politics that is the main matter.
She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
 
ME AVN FAN
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Wed Sep 06, 2006 10:19 pm

Quoting Banco (Reply 18):
it's doemstic politics that is the main matter.

ok so far. But am I completely out of track to assume that his performance overall is between good and excellent ? and the second question, does anybody think that Brown will be a better PrimeMinister than TonyBlair ?
 
GDB
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Wed Sep 06, 2006 11:31 pm

I think Iraq is the exception to the rule here, on foreign policy.
Except perhaps for Suez in 1956, you have not had such a large number opposed to a war, but Suez was over quickly with little (British ) loss of life.

Partly due to the public persona of the US President, which, like it or not, for most in the UK, either/or attracts ridicule, scorn, incredulity ('HE's in charge?') or even fear.

The missing WMD's, the quite insane levels HM Government went to sell this idea, the vindictivness afterwards (I saw Alistair Campbell's unscheduled, eye-popping, barging into the Channel 4 news programme in June 2003, then once seated and miked up, his incredible rant).

Anyone who has seem the superb political satire, 'The Thick Of It', the 'Malcolm Tucker' press officer character, so brilliantly played by Peter Capaldi, will not only recognise Campbell, but know his excesses, rages, almost Basil Fawlty like mania, might just be under playing the real Campbell.

So why didn't Labour lose last year?
The Tory opposition had been as much for the Iraq war as Blair, unlikely as it would have been, had they opposed it in 2003, they'd have won.
Generally good economy or not.
Charles Kennedy did, but his is a quite small party, anyway, his own performance was a factor in them just doing OK, but not the breakthrough they expected.
Kennedy admitting his alcoholism in January, quite frankly, only surprised many in that he had gone on so long.

The rising death toll, the lack of progress, and whilst it's certainly no excuse, nor can we say Islamic terrorism-home grown at that, would not have hit us anyway, Iraq looms large in this too.

Considering how the long years of Northern Ireland, more conventional if unexpected wars like the Falklands, enjoyed majority public support-or at least in N.I.'s case, acceptance, it is significant how Iraq, maybe soon Afghanistan, has impacted on a voting population, whose armed forces only had the year 1968, since WW2, not on operations somewhere.
 
ME AVN FAN
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Thu Sep 07, 2006 12:16 am

Quoting GDB (Reply 20):
I think Iraq is the exception to the rule here, on foreign policy.
Except perhaps for Suez in 1956, you have not had such a large number opposed to a war, but Suez was over quickly with little (British ) loss of life.

Partly due to the public persona of the US President, which, like it or not, for most in the UK, either/or attracts ridicule, scorn, incredulity ('HE's in charge?') or even fear.

-
so that, to say it again, whenever a majority of British people do NOT exactly adore President Bush and are not particularily enthusiastic about the boy-friendship between Tony Blair and GWB, a majority of Brits find the performance of Tony Blair rather good. Correct ?
-
ok. and how many people really and seriously expect Mr Brown to be a better PrimeMinister of the U.K. ?
 
Banco
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Thu Sep 07, 2006 12:22 am

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 19):
But am I completely out of track to assume that his performance overall is between good and excellent ?

Well, any assessment invariably depends on a person's political viewpoint. It's virtually impossible to be genuinely objective about that. The economy is always the most important political issue, and it has remained in pretty good shape (even excellent shape compared to the rest of Europe) throughout his tenure, but there have been problems elsewhere. Whether they are any worse, or in any greater number than would afflict any government is hard to say, but even if Blair's overall Premiership is regarded as a good one, it doesn't ultimately change Enoch Powell's truism that all political careers end in failure.



Quoting GDB (Reply 20):
I think Iraq is the exception to the rule here, on foreign policy.

No, I would disagree with that. The most vitriolic voices on Iraq have always been those who were bitterly opposed to it in the first place - indeed many of those voices who would be bitterly opposed to virtually any war.

Blair undoubtedly suffered a loss of credibility on the matter, but it should not be forgotten that divisive as the subject was, a majority of people in this country were in favour of invasion at the time. Nevertheless, there always was a solid 30% or so bitterly opposed to any action there, and with the failure to find WMD's those voices have got louder.

But Iraq wasn't a major political issue at the last election. Given a stable economy, that was the one opportunity for a major foreign affairs issue to actually be a big point at an election. As you rightly say, of the major parties, only the Lib Dems were steadfast in their opposition, and had Iraw been an electoral issue they absolutely undoubtedly, certainly would have benefitted. And what happened? The Lib Dems had a pretty terrible election, demonstrating beyond question that Iraq was far from being uppermost in the minds of the electorate.

That this should be the case at a time when the country was generally relatively happy with the government's domestic performance is an even stronger piece of evidence: There was ultimately one stick with which to beat the government, and it just didn't do them much harm at all. It was the pro-war Tories who benefitted, and no-one else.

Quoting GDB (Reply 20):
it is significant how Iraq, maybe soon Afghanistan, has impacted on a voting population

I'm sorry that just not the case. If you read the various analyses of psephologists and opinion-pollsters the very issue that had them crawling over the results was the very lack of any Iraq-factor.
She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
 
azza40
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Thu Sep 07, 2006 1:00 am

I think i read before that he said he shall resign on 31st May, 2007

Aaron  swirl 
Not been on here for a good 2/3 years!
 
GDB
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Thu Sep 07, 2006 1:09 am

Well, the support for the invasion was marginal, and opposition was well beyond the usual suspects, of course, once the fighting started, support rallied, and stayed that way until it became clear that the aftermath was going to be a disaster.
Compare support for Iraq, with for the UK military, the far more risky Falklands war, with the worst period of Northern Ireland in the early 70's, with Afghanistan in 2001.

I just cannot remember relatives of dead servicemen taking 1000's of votes in Blair's own seat at the general election, or of any PM, in any other conflict.
Symbolic? Yes, but the whole thing has destroyed trust in Blair, right across the board.
Enboldened his long term opponents too.
Iraq is not a big doorstep issue, but trust is, and when you ask more about the source of distrust?
It feeds in with the (non) performance of the Home Office, immigration etc.
'He can send troops to Iraq but cannot (add as applicable).

I know many life long, staunch, moderate, Labour voters who since Iraq detest Blair, who were supportive generally of previous military actions, who are not against being US allies even.
They are keen to cite Harold Wilson resisting strong US pressure to send, even if only for political reasons, British troops to Vietnam.

It's not a collapse the government issue, rather a weeping sore.
Blair was rightly feted for his good judgement and vigour on foreign policy, though hard not to improve on Major, until Iraq.
Sending servicemen to maybe die is the most important decison a PM can make.
Blair was, is, a believer on Iraq, but if enough people really do think he is doing the bidding of a foreign power-even an ally like the US, whether this is true or not matters little, they will think him unfit to be PM.
 
wrighbrothers
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Thu Sep 07, 2006 4:27 am

Quoting GDB (Reply 24):
Well, the support for the invasion was marginal, and opposition was well beyond the usual suspects, of course, once the fighting started, support rallied, and stayed that way until it became clear that the aftermath was going to be a disaster.

But the support for Labour will continue to drop until Tong has gone, and the troops have left Iraq, the problem is, that even if Blair leaves, the fact that they lead us into the war, will remain, and unfortunately, there's no quick way out of Iraq unless we want the country to completely dissolve into civil war, which would make the ruling government even less popular.

Quoting GDB (Reply 24):
Compare support for Iraq, with for the UK military, the far more risky Falklands war, with the worst period of Northern Ireland in the early 70's, with Afghanistan in 2001.

But there were true reasons for those wars.conflicts which the British public agreed with, Northern Ireland, terrorism was too close for our liking, and of
course, once the IRA targeted Lord Battenburg, it all flared up, which rallied support for the on going conflcit.
Falklands, under the leadership of Mrs Thatcher, and the fact that it was still our turf, kept British support up for it.

Afghanistan, well, it was not long after 9/11, and the western world was paranoid with terrorism, and there we thought was where the terrorists were, and also, the death toll from Afghanistan is over half that of the death toll from Iraq, and that conflict has been going on for 2 more years than Iraq.

Quoting GDB (Reply 24):
They are keen to cite Harold Wilson resisting strong US pressure to send, even if only for political reasons, British troops to Vietnam.

indeed, but from what I believe, the war was already in progress, and the death toll, certainly by the late 1960's was very high, I think the average death toll was something like 2 a day, although don't hold me to that.
Unfortunately, like Vietnam, Iraq is un familiar ground for us in terms of the terrain, we aren't used to fighting wars in the dessert.

We must remember the things that he did good for us, not just the bad things, as that is all to easy to do, and that will perhaps give you the wrong perception of the man, leadership under a new Labour leader, will not be much different to what it is now, so we must see why we are actually calling for him to resign.

Quoting Azza40 (Reply 23):
I think i read before that he said he shall resign on 31st May, 2007

Or, perhps they have set that date, as it is quite a-while off in the short term, and this means he can depart earlier, and under less scrutiny and bad press than if he announced he was leaving next month.
The press have put a whole lot of fuel on the fire, becuase at the end of the day, they want a good story to cover, perhaps we need to stop reading a quality news paper like the sun, or watching some disgruntled ex MP bad mouthing Tony Blair, and really consider it, un oppiniated.
The press have a knack of driving people's opinions one way or another, like herding sheep into a field, mindlessly being drifted by the news paper, without really thinking.

Wrightbrothers
Always stand up for what is right, even if it means standing alone..
 
Humberside
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Thu Sep 07, 2006 5:41 am

Another Parlimentary Private Secretary has now resigned. Thats the 7th one to go today, as well as the Junior Defence Minister
Visit the Air Humberside Website and Forum
 
9VSPO
Topic Author
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Thu Sep 07, 2006 6:01 am

Quoting Humberside (Reply 26):
Another Parlimentary Private Secretary has now resigned. Thats the 7th one to go today, as well as the Junior Defence Minister

What gets me is that all these people wouldn't even be in their jobs if it wasn't for Tony Blair. If they hadn't resigned then they should be sacked.
 
Banco
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Thu Sep 07, 2006 6:43 am

Quoting 9VSPO (Reply 27):
If they hadn't resigned then they should be sacked.

They signed the letter calling for Blair to go. The only thing that surprises me is that Blair hadn't sacked them before they got a chance to resign.

I find the behaviour of some of the Labour MP's quite extraordinary. There's no schism within the party, no massive divergence in policy. Replacing Blair with Brown won't make a massive difference at all. All they're doing is giving the Tories a huge helping hand. They're completely crackers.
She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
 
9VSPO
Topic Author
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Thu Sep 07, 2006 6:50 am

Quoting Banco (Reply 28):
Replacing Blair with Brown won't make a massive difference at all. All they're doing is giving the Tories a huge helping hand. They're completely crackers.

 checkmark 

But these people are saying that they are hearing basic labour suporters on the ground saying they want Blair to go and that's why they are doing this.
 
Banco
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Thu Sep 07, 2006 6:54 am

Quoting 9VSPO (Reply 29):
But these people are saying that they are hearing basic labour suporters on the ground saying they want Blair to go and that's why they are doing this.

Or, in other words, they don't even have the guts to say it's their own viewpoint.  Yeah sure
She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
 
GDB
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Fri Sep 08, 2006 2:56 am

Of course, Brown is not coming out of all this looking too good either.
Like his non apprearence during crisis all too often.

He is the runaway favourite to succeed Blair, but someone who has acted as he had at times, with his elephantine memory for any slight, real or perceived, against him, raises questions.

Plus, the history of those egging on others trying to unseat a PM, themselves making it to No.10, is not a good one.
Heseltine, Keith Joseph from the Tories, Benn under Labour, to name those from just the last 30 years.

It will probably be Brown, but take a tip, keep an eye on Alan Johnson.
(Who? Yep-who, just like Major in 1990).
 
ME AVN FAN
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Fri Sep 08, 2006 2:59 am

Quoting GDB (Reply 31):
Alan Johnson

Whoooo is Alan Johnson ?
 
9VSPO
Topic Author
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Fri Sep 08, 2006 3:03 am

If I were Blair I'd just sack all the whingers.

God forbid we ever get that looney Cameron in Number 10. That's the time to really worry.  scared 
 
9VSPO
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Fri Sep 08, 2006 3:04 am

If I were Blair I'd just sack all the whingers.

God forbid we ever get that looney Cameron in Number 10. That's the time to really worry.  scared 
 
cosec59
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Fri Sep 08, 2006 3:06 am

Quoting 9VSPO (Reply 33):
If I were Blair I'd just sack all the whingers.

Looks like the "whingers" have effectively sacked Tony the phoney.

Quoting 9VSPO (Reply 33):
God forbid we ever get that looney Cameron in Number 10. That's the time to really worry.

And you've based that comment on what?
Rules are for the obedience of fools but for the guidance of wise men
 
GDB
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Fri Sep 08, 2006 3:10 am

Cameron? He'll be Tory Blair rather than Tony Blair.
Which might be needed for them, look how Maggie's favourites Hague, Duncan-Smith and Howard fared.
 
9VSPO
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Fri Sep 08, 2006 3:12 am

Quoting Cosec59 (Reply 35):
And you've based that comment on what?

He's in India isn't he? And instead of meeting the real people on the street over there he's canvassing millionaire businessmen for funds for the Tory party. Everything he does is just a fake photo opportunity!  Angry
 
cedars747
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Fri Sep 08, 2006 3:15 am

Quoting Rammstein (Reply 6):
After www.byebyeberlusconi.de, it's time to open www.byebyeblair.com

What about www.byebyeaznar.com
Alex!!!
Tengo una pasion por la aviacion !لدي شغف للطيران !I have a passion for aviation !Jeg har en lidenskap for luftfart!j'ai
 
ME AVN FAN
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Fri Sep 08, 2006 3:18 am

Quoting Cedars747 (Reply 38):
What about www.byebyeaznar.com
Alex!!!

but isn't that history ?
 
cedars747
Posts: 2584
Joined: Sat Dec 10, 2005 8:04 am

RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Fri Sep 08, 2006 3:20 am

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 39):
but isn't that history ?

Yes ,but he belong to the same collection  Wink
Alex!!!
Tengo una pasion por la aviacion !لدي شغف للطيران !I have a passion for aviation !Jeg har en lidenskap for luftfart!j'ai
 
ME AVN FAN
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Fri Sep 08, 2006 3:23 am

Quoting Cedars747 (Reply 40):
but isn't that history ?

Yes ,but he belong to the same collection Wink
Alex!!!

ok, true, but I would NOT go back to Anthony Eden and thelike
 
cosec59
Posts: 2618
Joined: Thu Jun 23, 2005 2:59 am

RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Fri Sep 08, 2006 3:29 am

Quoting 9VSPO (Reply 37):
Everything he does is just a fake photo opportunity!

 Yeah sure
Rules are for the obedience of fools but for the guidance of wise men
 
cedars747
Posts: 2584
Joined: Sat Dec 10, 2005 8:04 am

RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Fri Sep 08, 2006 3:29 am

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 41):
ok, true, but I would NOT go back to Anthony Eden and thelike

Than let's go over to www.byebyebush.com "the only one missing in this collection"
Alex!!!
Tengo una pasion por la aviacion !لدي شغف للطيران !I have a passion for aviation !Jeg har en lidenskap for luftfart!j'ai
 
Humberside
Posts: 3223
Joined: Sun Jan 01, 2006 12:44 am

RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Fri Sep 08, 2006 5:58 am

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 32):
Whoooo is Alan Johnson ?

Education Secretary and 'Hull West and Hessle' MP. He's come through the ranks of government very quickly in the past few years
Visit the Air Humberside Website and Forum
 
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par13del
Posts: 6661
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Sat Sep 09, 2006 1:13 am

No intention to make light of the situation but a couple questions:

1. Blair just recently won re-election by the people right?

2. Those now calling for his ouster, are they calling for new elections or they
just want him removed as party leader and thus prime minister, assume
the law is similar to my country where the party leader is also the
prime minister

3. Does this mean that he was used to regain the office of prime minister
for the party, so that they could give it to someone who could not
gain the office through the ballot box?

4. Is this a "coup"?
 
RichardPrice
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Sat Sep 09, 2006 1:19 am

Quoting Par13del (Reply 45):

1. Blair just recently won re-election by the people right?

Yes, a little over a year ago.

Quoting Par13del (Reply 45):
2. Those now calling for his ouster, are they calling for new elections or they
just want him removed as party leader and thus prime minister, assume
the law is similar to my country where the party leader is also the
prime minister

They want him removed as party leader and thus prime minister.

Quoting Par13del (Reply 45):
3. Does this mean that he was used to regain the office of prime minister
for the party, so that they could give it to someone who could not
gain the office through the ballot box?

The likely successors all got voted in in the last election, so thats not a consideration. Also you dont vote for the office, just the seat.

Anyone elected can be asked by the Queen to form a government, usually it happens to be the leader of the majority party.

Quoting Par13del (Reply 45):
4. Is this a "coup"?

No, in British law, the office of the prime minister doesnt actually exist - this is a Labour leadership crisis and nothing more.
 
Banco
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Sat Sep 09, 2006 1:30 am

Quoting RichardPrice (Reply 46):
No, in British law, the office of the prime minister doesnt actually exist

It does now, I believe. It became an official position in about 1910, I think, when it was merged with First Lord of the Treasury - though de facto the position of Prime Minister has been around since Walpole in 1721.
She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
 
BigOrange
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Sat Sep 09, 2006 1:40 am

Blair should have resigned after he was found to be lying about WMD's, along with his puppeteer Bush.

Not that Gordo is any improvement. Bring back Maggie Thatcher  Wink
 
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par13del
Posts: 6661
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RE: Should Tony Blair Go Now?

Sat Sep 09, 2006 1:49 am

Thanks for the reply RichardPrice.

Regarding my 3rd point, would the party have won the election if Tony Blair was not the leader? His successor may have won his seat, but during the election that is all he represented to the voters, not the possibility of being prime minister.

I understand that this has happened before, but on the previous occasions when it did happen, was any thought given to going back to the people for a vote? I'm certain, the constitution does not demand it, just asking from a political point of view, as those pushing for his resignation proclaim to be doing it for the good of the country, so why not let the country also decide on his successor as prime minister not party leader by calling early elections, say next year after the new leader is chosen.

The additional question this raises for me is, how much of the current party's agenda and programs were personally shaped by Blair, will a new leader now have his own agenda and programs which he/she would now push unto the population, is this fair to the voters? Would the opposition allow this new leader to serve out the entire term without an early election, what could they do?

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