VHVXB
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Kim Jong Ill Regrets Nuclear Tests

Fri Oct 20, 2006 7:26 pm

Quote:
SEOUL: North Korean leader Kim Jong-il expressed regret about his country's nuclear test to a Chinese delegation and said Pyongyang would return to nuclear talks if Washington backed off from its financial sanctions, a South Korean newspaper reported today.
"If the US makes a concession to some degree, we will also make a concession to some degree, whether it be bilateral talks or six-party talks," Kim was quoted as telling a Chinese envoy, the mass-circulation Chosun Ilbo reported, citing a diplomatic source in China.

Kim told the Chinese delegation that "he is sorry about the nuclear test," the newspaper reported

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au...tory/0,20867,20614995-2703,00.html
http://www.smh.com.au/news/world/kim...test/2006/10/20/1160851118110.html
What do you think? Should the world take this seriously or will we just see more tests to come from the N koreans?
 
kalakaua
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RE: Kim Jong Ill Regrets Nuclear Tests

Fri Oct 20, 2006 7:31 pm

Quoting VHVXB (Thread starter):

What do you think? Should the world take this seriously or will we just see more tests to come from the N koreans?

Come on... Someone with a face like this?

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MCIGuy
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RE: Kim Jong Ill Regrets Nuclear Tests

Fri Oct 20, 2006 7:37 pm

I'll bet he did! After getting turned over China's knee and getting a thorough spanking!  laughing 
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windshear
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RE: Kim Jong Ill Regrets Nuclear Tests

Fri Oct 20, 2006 7:43 pm

Actually I am 50/50 on this. I just read an in-depth article in Newsweek and it seems NK wants to negotiate, as their main concern (manic concern) is for their own existence. Guaranteeing their existence and showing NK "respect" was the Clinton administration's strategy, and it got them far.

I bet you China beat the crap out of them, in a diplomatic tone of course Big grin
I really think the US must initiate a new strategy, not a full concession, but at least a shift in attitude.

I would how ever also remind you that Iran is watching, and this makes the room for error very small. Foreign policy is difficult  Smile

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TransIsland
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RE: Kim Jong Ill Regrets Nuclear Tests

Fri Oct 20, 2006 7:45 pm

"I believe it is peace in our time."

He might regret the outcome of the test, whether it's because the Chinese are cussing him out, whether it's the Security Council's decision or whether it's the poor performance of the North Korean bomb, but I doubt he truly regrets having pressed the button.

So no, I don't believe a word he says, and I hope that nobody dealing with him will be as naive as Neville C. was in 1938 when dealing with a certain Mr Hitler.
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ANCFlyer
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RE: Kim Jong Ill Regrets Nuclear Tests

Fri Oct 20, 2006 7:45 pm

Quoting MCIGuy (Reply 2):
I'll bet he did! After getting turned over China's knee and getting a thorough spanking!  laughing 

Yup, I'll bet as Searpqx declared early on, China would deal with this in Chinese fashion, when they were ready, privately and without fanfare.

I'm sure Ole Krazy Kim got his penis smacked for this - hard - by the Chinese Gov't. Now he's almost backpeddling like a Duck coming in to Decoys.

Begs several questions though:

What about the future tests Krazy Kim delcared the North Koreans were going to accomplish?

If Krazy Kim performs more tests, what will China do? On the assumption they already did something anyway.

What will the US Gov't do?

Will Condi Rice have what it takes to get the six-party talks rolling again?

What will the Gov'ts of Japan and South Korea do now?
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HAWK21M
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RE: Kim Jong Ill Regrets Nuclear Tests

Fri Oct 20, 2006 8:14 pm

Talking from a Position of Strength  Smile
Thats what he thinks.
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NeilYYZ
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RE: Kim Jong Ill Regrets Nuclear Tests

Fri Oct 20, 2006 8:45 pm

I doubt he's sorry that he conducted the tests. I bet he's sorry that he's in crap over conducting them. And I wouldn't doubt that he'd test another one if the opportunity arose.
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garnetpalmetto
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RE: Kim Jong Ill Regrets Nuclear Tests

Fri Oct 20, 2006 8:54 pm

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 5):
What about the future tests Krazy Kim delcared the North Koreans were going to accomplish?

According to this article, http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20061020/ap_on_re_as/nkorea_kim_nuclear, he's told the Chinese he's not planning any future tests. Makes you wonder just what the Chinese said to Kim. . .
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KaiGywer
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RE: Kim Jong Ill Regrets Nuclear Tests

Fri Oct 20, 2006 9:02 pm

Without being an expert by any means, I think the US could take the first step and easen the sanctions. Of course if he screws up, back come the sanctions. The same goes for Cuba in my mind, ease the sanctions here as well. Both of these countries could benefit greatly from eased sanctions, and by doing this, the US might create new friends/allies.
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7474ever
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RE: Kim Jong Ill Regrets Nuclear Tests

Fri Oct 20, 2006 9:08 pm

North Korea is an excellent example that the world (UN) is completelty unable to prevent a dictature from getting nuclear weaponry...
 
PlymSpotter
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RE: Kim Jong Ill Regrets Nuclear Tests

Fri Oct 20, 2006 9:13 pm

I think he's trying to work the international political scene so to speak. He's gone and done what he wants by exploding the bomb - to show to the people of North Korea that he is still their all powerful leader who they should all respect, and now he's going to try and get back in the good books of the rest of the world by back peddling a little.

It doesn't matter if he is seen as weak by the world, the people in North Korea who really need to see that he is in fact weak are not allowed to because of news and media censorship, so its almost a win win situation for him, if he handles it carefully which he seems to be doing.

I also find it very hard to believe that China did not know that the nuclear test was going to take place.

Dan Smile
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KaiGywer
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RE: Kim Jong Ill Regrets Nuclear Tests

Fri Oct 20, 2006 9:15 pm

Quoting 7474ever (Reply 10):
North Korea is an excellent example that the world (UN) is completelty unable to prevent a dictature from getting nuclear weaponry...

Which then begs the questions... If we can't beat him with sanctions, why not attempt a partnership. Then he can have as many nukes as he wants for all I care, as he won't use them on us.
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7474ever
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RE: Kim Jong Ill Regrets Nuclear Tests

Fri Oct 20, 2006 9:35 pm

Quoting KaiGywer (Reply 12):
why not attempt a partnership.

Similar to the one in the cold war period ?
 
cfalk
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RE: Kim Jong Ill Regrets Nuclear Tests

Fri Oct 20, 2006 9:49 pm

Quoting VHVXB (Thread starter):
Kim told the Chinese delegation that "he is sorry about the nuclear test," the newspaper reported

About as sorry as I was the first time I got laid...

Quoting KaiGywer (Reply 12):
Which then begs the questions... If we can't beat him with sanctions, why not attempt a partnership. Then he can have as many nukes as he wants for all I care, as he won't use them on us.

The problem is that North Korea cannot allow itself to permit South Korea to remain independent once they broadcast to their own people that they have the Bomb and can stand toe to toe with the US.

This is their version of history (taken from the DPRK tourism website)





I'll leave you to browse the rest at http://www.korea-dpr.com/menu2.htm , but my point is that their people (including those in positions of power in the military) have been brainwashed that South Korea is an aboration that must be eliminated as soon as the imperialist yankees can be made to stop supporting it. They simply will not accept making peace when they have nukes - it would be tolerating the intolerable.

If I lived in Seoul, I would consider moving out.
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BHXFAOTIPYYC
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RE: Kim Jong Ill Regrets Nuclear Tests

Fri Oct 20, 2006 9:54 pm

Quoting KaiGywer (Reply 12):
Then he can have as many nukes as he wants for all I care, as he won't use them on us.

And you'd be willing to take his word on that?

Quoting Windshear (Reply 3):
Actually I am 50/50 on this. I just read an in-depth article in Newsweek and it seems NK wants to negotiate, as their main concern (manic concern) is for their own existence. Guaranteeing their existence and showing NK "respect" was the Clinton administration's strategy, and it got them far.

I was reading that last night. Without a doubt I would say that Kim Jung Ill's survival is the only thing on his mind. The Chinese had a "quiet word" in his ear for sure. They will not tolerate N. Korea misbehaving, and Kim knows that. I'm sure this whole nuclear issue is just a ploy to get more aid to prop up his regime.
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7474ever
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RE: Kim Jong Ill Regrets Nuclear Tests

Fri Oct 20, 2006 10:02 pm

Quoting BHXFAOTIPYYC (Reply 15):
I'm sure this whole nuclear issue is just a ploy to get more aid to prop up his regime.


You might be right about that. Still, he's extremly dangerous. The world simpy can not count on his word, no matter what his plans are.
 
BHXFAOTIPYYC
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RE: Kim Jong Ill Regrets Nuclear Tests

Fri Oct 20, 2006 10:20 pm

Quoting 7474ever (Reply 16):
You might be right about that. Still, he's extremly dangerous. The world simpy can not count on his word, no matter what his plans are.

Ditto with that nutjob in Iran, except that we DO know what his plans are.
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TedTAce
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RE: Kim Jong Ill Regrets Nuclear Tests

Fri Oct 20, 2006 10:22 pm

Quoting VHVXB (Thread starter):
Should the world take this seriously or will we just see more tests to come from the N koreans?

I say we should tell them that as soon as they are at the table we will back off the sanctions.
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Slovacek747
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RE: Kim Jong Ill Regrets Nuclear Tests

Fri Oct 20, 2006 11:16 pm

He better be sorry...or we'd light up his world like its the forth of July.

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HAWK21M
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RE: Kim Jong Ill Regrets Nuclear Tests

Fri Oct 20, 2006 11:28 pm

Quoting Slovacek747 (Reply 19):
He better be sorry...or we'd light up his world like its the forth of July.

Who cares about the "Sorry".Ask him to roll back the N Programme.
regds
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ltbewr
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RE: Kim Jong Ill Regrets Nuclear Tests

Fri Oct 20, 2006 11:44 pm

Sure he is sorry, like a drunk is the morning after and saying they won't drink again...until a few hours later.
We have to find some balanced way, especially with the cooperation of China to pressure North Korea's 'deal leader' into giving up his nuke program. Kim Jong Ill ought to worry about feeding his people, rather than working on a nuke program as food will more likely keep the loyalty of his people.
 
searpqx
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RE: Kim Jong Ill Regrets Nuclear Tests

Sat Oct 21, 2006 5:16 am

Quoting VHVXB (Thread starter):
What do you think? Should the world take this seriously or will we just see more tests to come from the N koreans?



Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 5):
I'm sure Ole Krazy Kim got his penis smacked for this - hard - by the Chinese Gov't. Now he's almost backpeddling like a Duck coming in to Decoys.

Like a couple of others have mentioned, he's not sorry for the test, but I bet he's very sorry he's pissed the Chinese off. He completely miscalculated their reaction and now he's playing nice to calm them down. I also think he's a little taken aback by the world reaction - he was assuming he'd be treated like Iran, endless discussions but no real action.

My guess is he's very concerned about the Chinese reaction and will do whatever it takes (the apology, especially in Eastern culture, is a very big deal, even if its aimed at China) to mollify them. He also now knows what their limits are. So, I fully expect him to abide by no more tests, but he will continue to develop his capabilities in secrets (since he got away with that before). As long as the Chinese keep the current line, so will he.
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LTU932
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RE: Kim Jong Ill Regrets Nuclear Tests

Sat Oct 21, 2006 6:04 am

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 5):
What will the Gov'ts of Japan and South Korea do now?

Slightly OT, but I saw a documentary once about Japan and some of their citizens being abducted by the DPRK, where the Japanese people were demanding that the abductees were to be allowed to return to Japan. Some people were even screaming for a much tougher Japan and even for their own nuclear bomb.

Given the sensitivity of the abductions of Japanese citizens by the DPRK in their foreign and domestic affairs, I wonder how the Japanese people have reacted to Krazy Kim's nuke test and if their anger on this will have a serious effect on Japanese defence and domestic politics.

Quoting KaiGywer (Reply 12):
why not attempt a partnership.

Because he will take advantage of any possibility to double cross the US and all others.

Quoting HAWK21M (Reply 20):
Ask him to roll back the N Programme.

Change the "ask" with "demand". China's role in this matter will be most critical. If they can continue to keep pressure on the DPRK regarding these tests, then perhaps they PRC can even persuade them out of the nuclear programme. However, this is highly unlikely IMO. Eventually Krazy Kim might dismiss the PRC as an ally of the US.
 
JGPH1A
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RE: Kim Jong Ill Regrets Nuclear Tests

Sat Oct 21, 2006 6:12 am

I can't believe nobody else has posted this...



it explains a great deal.... Smile
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7474ever
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RE: Kim Jong Ill Regrets Nuclear Tests

Sat Oct 21, 2006 8:01 am

Quoting LTU932 (Reply 23):
I wonder how the Japanese people have reacted to Krazy Kim's nuke test and if their anger on this will have a serious effect on Japanese defence and domestic politics.


Just guessing...they're thinking about getting nuclear weapons as well...?
 
DLKAPA
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RE: Kim Jong Ill Regrets Nuclear Tests

Sat Oct 21, 2006 8:22 am

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 5):
Will Condi Rice have what it takes to get the six-party talks rolling again?

All she must do is utter the words "Madelin Albright (or however it's spelled)" in Kim's presence, and he'll back down immediately, after a banshee-scream of "PLEASE DON'T BRING HER HERE AGAIN! PLEEAAASSEE NOOOO!"
And all at once the crowd begins to sing: Sometimes the hardest thing and the right thing are the same
 
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LTU932
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RE: Kim Jong Ill Regrets Nuclear Tests

Sat Oct 21, 2006 8:54 am

Quoting 7474ever (Reply 25):
they're thinking about getting nuclear weapons as well...?

I already mentioned that while commenting on the abductee issue shown in that documentary.

Quoting DLKAPA (Reply 26):
All she must do is utter the words "Madelin Albright (or however it's spelled)" in Kim's presence, and he'll back down immediately, after a banshee-scream of "PLEASE DON'T BRING HER HERE AGAIN! PLEEAAASSEE NOOOO!"

 rotfl   rotfl   rotfl 

I thought they were pretty chummy in each other's presence last time they met.



 Wink
 
halls120
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RE: Kim Jong Ill Regrets Nuclear Tests

Sat Oct 21, 2006 12:27 pm

Quoting Windshear (Reply 3):
Guaranteeing their existence and showing NK "respect" was the Clinton administration's strategy, and it got them far.

You are kidding, right? The North Koreans built the nuclear reactors Clinton promised them, from which they get fuel rods that can be reprocessed to produce even more nuclear weapons than they have now. Wasn't it 1998 when the CJCS testified that NK had no active ballistic missile program, and a week or so later, they test launched their first ballistic missile? Even Hillary concedes that the national security apparatus failed to effectively police North Korea's hidden efforts to reprocess uranium in the 1990s - but in a qualifier that is positively Orwellian - concludes that the framework agreement generally contained the threat.

We showed North Korea "respect" and what it gave us was North Korea behaving like a model citizen in public, but behind the scenes kept their nuclear programs on line.
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ConcordeLoss
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RE: Kim Jong Ill Regrets Nuclear Tests

Sat Oct 21, 2006 12:42 pm

Quoting 7474ever (Reply 10):
North Korea is an excellent example that the world (UN) is completelty unable to prevent a dictature from getting nuclear weaponry...

Same goes for Israel.
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7474ever
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RE: Kim Jong Ill Regrets Nuclear Tests

Sat Oct 21, 2006 4:22 pm

Quoting ConcordeLoss (Reply 29):
a dictature


Well, Israel, as far as I'm concerned, is a democratic country. Not a perfect one, but still it is. You have too be a fool not see to difference.

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