ammunition
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Krakow To Prague, Overland- Train/bus?

Fri Dec 22, 2006 6:57 am

Hi all, im off to Poland in January, and need to get to Prague. Ive had a look at some travel websites, which recommend an overnight train, taking 8 hrs.

I will be in Krakow, on the 4th, and would like to be in Prague by the 5th, so on overnight on the 4th, or a morning train on the 5th, unless there are alternatives to this (e.g. buses)

Has anyone done the route, or know how much it will cost, or how reliable trains/buses are.

Amo
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zruda
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RE: Krakow To Prague, Overland- Train/bus?

Fri Dec 22, 2006 7:15 am

The trains on KRK-PRG are OK, I used to take them for some six years, though not all the way to KRK, but I stopped in OSR. Not sure about the prices as the intl tkt price vary from the domestic fares. I would just recommend taking a day train instead of the overnight one, as theres a certain risk of being robbed. So if u take the night train, be sure all your valuables and IDs are securely placed under your head or in your underwear .) I also wouldnt recommend travelling on such a nite train drunk, as drunk foreginers are often a good target for the stupid thieves. But dont worry, its not like travelling on train is dangerous, only you should be aware of the fact that you can lose things pretty fast.
The EC labelled cars which serve the route are usually nice and clean and have good dining cars.
And let me know if u are staying in PRG, I can give you some advice about the city if you wish  Smile good luck and enjoy the trip
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ammunition
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RE: Krakow To Prague, Overland- Train/bus?

Fri Dec 22, 2006 7:39 am

Hey, thanks for the prompt reply. Do you have any idea about availability of the train? if i arrive on the day, will i be able to get a ticket for the same day?

I will be in prague for 3 nights, so any suggestions and recommendations would be appreciated.

thank you
Amo
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ammunition
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RE: Krakow To Prague, Overland- Train/bus?

Fri Dec 22, 2006 7:44 am

Also, is Poland, or Krakow more specifically, a safe place to travel alone? I have never been to eastern europe.
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sw733
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RE: Krakow To Prague, Overland- Train/bus?

Fri Dec 22, 2006 7:49 am

Quoting Ammunition (Reply 2):
Do you have any idea about availability of the train? if i arrive on the day, will i be able to get a ticket for the same day?

Should be no problem. YOu may not get a seat reservation, but you'll get a ticket.

Quoting Ammunition (Reply 3):
Also, is Poland, or Krakow more specifically, a safe place to travel alone? I have never been to eastern europe.

Poland is incredibly safe, and Krakow is probably the safest place in Poland. It's a great city and a great country. I do all my Europe travel in eastern Europe now, because it's so much cheaper (though it's increasing all the time), and I travel alone a lot (mostly in Hungary, Slovakia, and Poland).

You'll love it. Just be smart, and you'll be safe. Don't do stuff you wouldn't do in London or Paris or New York.
 
Alessandro
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RE: Krakow To Prague, Overland- Train/bus?

Fri Dec 22, 2006 8:20 am

For buses look at www.eurolines.com
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ammunition
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RE: Krakow To Prague, Overland- Train/bus?

Fri Dec 22, 2006 8:51 am

eurolines is no use, ive had a look.
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RE: Krakow To Prague, Overland- Train/bus?

Fri Dec 22, 2006 10:09 am

Quoting Zruda (Reply 1):
I would just recommend taking a day train instead of the overnight one, as theres a certain risk of being robbed.

Monster (sorry, couldn't resist) is probably referring to problems caused by certain ethnic group in Northern Moravia. Well, I used to travel there quite frequently using a night train in late nineties using a car train service between Poprad and PRG. Nothing ever happened to me, nor to my car.

[Edited 2006-12-22 02:24:46]
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RE: Krakow To Prague, Overland- Train/bus?

Fri Dec 22, 2006 10:15 am

Quoting WildcatYXU (Reply 7):
I would just recommend taking a day train instead of the overnight one, as theres a certain risk of being robbed.

Take the night train, dont waste a whole day on the train if you dont have to. You'll be fine on the night train...your odds of getting robbed are really small, especially if you use some common sense.
 
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RE: Krakow To Prague, Overland- Train/bus?

Fri Dec 22, 2006 10:28 am

I would take a sleeper on a overnight train. I don't know what are the prices now, but it used to be pretty affordable, even in first class, at least between Slovakia and Czech rep.
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RE: Krakow To Prague, Overland- Train/bus?

Fri Dec 22, 2006 7:58 pm

Quoting WildcatYXU (Reply 7):

yup, youre having it right  Smile well I have travelled on the route for many years and never been robbed, only sometimes I was really close to that. So I just want ed to warn Ammo. But the night train saves time indeed. The sleepers are very affordable (there are 2 categories, sleepers and couchettes, the sleepers being 6 ppl in a department) and if you are going on weeknights, I suppose you even can have all the department for yourself, I experienced it several times too.
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RE: Krakow To Prague, Overland- Train/bus?

Fri Dec 22, 2006 11:06 pm

Why don't you fly?  

LO KRK-PRG with stop in WAW - £70 Leave Jan 5th at 6am

[Edited 2006-12-22 15:07:52]
“Once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, an
 
ammunition
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RE: Krakow To Prague, Overland- Train/bus?

Sat Dec 23, 2006 9:50 am

thank for all your info, i will hopefully leave on the 4th, to be in prague for the weekend (and friday), i have considered flying, if it was not for this being a cheap adventure holiday, £70 seems far too much, when i am paying £93 for 5 flights.

For its convenience, however, i may still keep it in mind.


Amo
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RE: Krakow To Prague, Overland- Train/bus?

Sat Dec 23, 2006 10:36 am

Take the EC train. Better be safe than sorry.
 
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RE: Krakow To Prague, Overland- Train/bus?

Sat Dec 23, 2006 1:04 pm

Quoting Ammunition (Reply 3):
Also, is Poland, or Krakow more specifically, a safe place to travel alone? I have never been to eastern europe.

I will be in Krakow Jan 2-4. Its a relatively boring (but because I dont like those sheephumpers from the south) for me but nice if youre a tourist. Certainly safe in the city centre. Unfortunately my girlfriend and her family is from that area and she is making me go for 2 days. I am flying EuroLOT WAW-KRK-WAW for around $80USD per person so not too bad. Polish rail sucks, I rode Warsaw-Katowice-Krakow last march with a friend of mine between 12am-6am (Slowest train ever and in 2nd class) and by the time I got to Krakow I got so drunk with these Ukrainians from a different compartment that I needed a good breakfast at McDonalds to wake myself up.

Quoting SW733 (Reply 4):
Poland is incredibly safe,

HAHAHAHHAHA

 rotfl   rotfl   rotfl   rotfl   rotfl   rotfl 

Joke of the year, I almost fell out of my chair reading that one! Its safe if you stay where the tourists are and dont flaunt your things.
 
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RE: Krakow To Prague, Overland- Train/bus?

Sat Dec 23, 2006 3:23 pm

Right, i have booked the KRK-PRG flight via Warsaw, just for its convenience and the fact that i can confirm the trip, thanks for all your help everyone, greatly appreciated.

P.S. i payed £75 for the single

I'll take pics and hopefully do a trip report, my route for the trip is:
BHX-KRK SkyEurope 737
KRK-Warsaw LOT (operated by Eurolot) atr 72/emb 170
Warsaw-PRG LOT (operated by Eurolot) atr 42/ emd 170
PRG-Geneva FlyBaboo Dash-8 3
Geneva-AMS Easyjet 737
AMS-Milan Easyjet 737
Milan London (luton) Ryanair 737

Not entirely sure on a/c

If it wasnt for the LOT flight, the other 5 flights cost £93, which is why i was slightly apprehensive on forking out for it, but as it stands, £170 is not bad for 7 flights, averaging about £25 per flight.

What is there to do in Krakow?
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RE: Krakow To Prague, Overland- Train/bus?

Sat Dec 23, 2006 11:40 pm

Quoting Ammunition (Reply 3):
Also, is Poland, or Krakow more specifically, a safe place to travel alone? I have never been to eastern europe.



Quoting LOT767-300ER (Reply 14):
Joke of the year, I almost fell out of my chair reading that one! Its safe if you stay where the tourists are and dont flaunt your things.



Quoting Ammunition (Reply 15):
What is there to do in Krakow?

We were in Krakow two years ago and had no problems at all. It's a great city, and incredibly cheap. Of course take the usual precautions like not looking loaded -- that's a crazy thing to do ANYWHERE -- and you should have no safety problems. I never felt uneasy once in the city, even walking back to our hotel on my own at all hours of the night.

Things to do in Krackow: the biggest tourist attraction is Auschwitz, the former Nazi extermination camp which is WELL worth a visit. It's about an hour away by bus to Ozwiecim, and you can book tickets at the main bus station (I think it's beside the railway station). There are taxis offering to take you there, but the bus is for nothing and drops you outside the camp. You're better starting off early, say before 10, so you can do the two camps -- there's a free bus after you tour the main camp which takes you to Auschwitz 2 (Birkenau). Of all the day trips I've ever been on in my life, this was the most fascinating, absorbing, and, it must be said, draining, and that's saying something. We were glad to get back to Krackow and real life.

http://www.auschwitz-muzeum.oswiecim.pl/

Another great, and unique, trip is to the Wieliczka Salt Mines, again a bus trip from the city, probably about 30 mins away (your hotel or the tourist information office will give you details). Local buses leave every twenty minutes or so from the city centre: Spread over nine levels, it has 300 km of galleries with works of art, altars, and statues sculpted in salt. There's even a bar and cafeteria down there!

http://whc.unesco.org/pg.cfm?cid=31&id_site=32

And for something to eat, a great place to sample traditional Polish food is Chlopskie Jadlo (Peasant Kitchen), which has great food, a great atmosphere and is cheap. There are two of these restaurants in the city, both near the centre, with one just off the main square.

http://www.cracow-life.com/krakow/wh...taurants_details/8-Chlopskie_Jadlo

If you're looking for a hotel I can recommend a good, cheap one too. It's a great city which hasn't been overrun by tourists yet. You'll love it!

[Edited 2006-12-23 15:42:15]
 
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RE: Krakow To Prague, Overland- Train/bus?

Sun Dec 24, 2006 12:16 am

Quoting LOT767-300ER (Reply 14):
I needed a good breakfast at McDonalds to wake myself up.

Dude, I'd hate to see what you consider a bad breakfast...  vomit 
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RE: Krakow To Prague, Overland- Train/bus?

Sun Dec 24, 2006 9:00 am

just came from there. Trains are the primary form of transport in Poland and usually they run multiple times aday. I cant seem to get to the website right now but if you google something like poland trains or poland transport it will direct you to the polish site. very easy even if you dont speak polish.... the first column is where you are starting, the second is where you will end...imagine that.

cost to go half way accross the country is about 40 Z.... to give you and Idea, Grudziads (about the middle of the country)to Prague is about 14 hours....

edited for this:

This is one of the websites:
http://www.pkp.com.pl/

Basically you will need to google.pl and use key words like poland trains.

Good luck

[Edited 2006-12-24 01:07:56]
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RE: Krakow To Prague, Overland- Train/bus?

Sun Dec 24, 2006 6:22 pm

Quoting WildcatYXU (Reply 7):
is probably referring to problems caused by certain ethnic group in Northern Moravia.

Wow, this thread made it all the way until reply 7 before the first racist comment! Can't say I'm surprised, as if this had been a Czech board, it probably would have been back at reply 1.

Since my wife is from said "certain ethnic group," I can only say that the only problem she's had taking trains on routes in Northern Moravia and Slovakia is when she has been with fellow members of said ethnic group who have darker skin than she does, and there have been skinheads pacing the corridors and threatening them. Another friend from this ethnic group actually had to barricade himself and his family in their compartment for two hours going from Ostrava to Prague, until the conductor (luckily) had the guts to rescue them from three skinheads wielding knives. Generally this tends to happen not on the fast EC trains though.

__________________________________
Ammunition, the train is fine, but actually the bus is probably cheaper and faster (and more direct); you will probably have to change trains more than once unless you take a very long overnight train.

[Edited 2006-12-24 10:53:10]
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ammunition
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RE: Krakow To Prague, Overland- Train/bus?

Sun Dec 24, 2006 7:17 pm

Hey, thanks again for all your replies, i have booked the LOT flight from KRK-PRG via WAW

N229NW- having read ur post, i am slightly concerned, i have never been to eastern europe, and have little knowledge (though i am reading up on the history) of what tensions there are between communities.

Although sad, i understand judgements based on appearance can be made, and your comments on skin colour/appearance are worrying. Are there many racially/appearance aggrevated attacks within poland? Being of indian origin, i am a little concerned, but never enough that it would cause hesitation for going there.

Amo
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RE: Krakow To Prague, Overland- Train/bus?

Sun Dec 24, 2006 11:18 pm

Something else to do in Krakow, which might interest you, is the Shindler's List tour. It was shot on location in the city (passing off as Warsaw which was destroyed in the war) and there is a tour taking in the locations used. If you haven't seen the film it might be worth renting out the DVD before you go.
 
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RE: Krakow To Prague, Overland- Train/bus?

Mon Dec 25, 2006 3:01 am

Quoting N229NW (Reply 19):
Wow, this thread made it all the way until reply 7 before the first racist comment!

Ok, ask your wife what their politically correct word for themselves mean and how they call the majority population (and what it means in english). After decoding that, you'll see that xenophobia is alive and well among them, same as the majority population. And by the way, you're welcome to put your money where your mouth is and prove I'm racist.
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RE: Krakow To Prague, Overland- Train/bus?

Mon Dec 25, 2006 5:10 am

Quoting LOT767-300ER (Reply 14):
Joke of the year, I almost fell out of my chair reading that one! Its safe if you stay where the tourists are and dont flaunt your things.

Typical Polish pessimism I see.
/Milan320
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RE: Krakow To Prague, Overland- Train/bus?

Mon Dec 25, 2006 5:36 am

Quoting Ammunition (Reply 20):
Being of indian origin, i am a little concerned, but never enough that it would cause hesitation for going there.

Hi Amo,

As you know, the Roma also come from India originally, and their language is closer to Punjabi than any other current language. It is a pretty much totally different situation from Roma in the UK, where most "Gypsies" are white-looking and the issue is nomadism--the Roma in Eastern Europe mainly have been settled for generations if not centuries. The issue there is really one of skin color and urban ghettos.

All this means that yes, you will look a little like a Rom. But you really shouldn't have a problem in any of the major tourist areas (including pretty much anywhere in Prague, Krakow, etc. and tourist sites in the countryside). (I have much more experience of the the Czech Republic, but the situation is quite similar in Poland). There, people are used to dealing with darker-skinned foreigners and will assume you are foreign unless you start speaking local-accented Czech/Polish/Hungarian, etc. I wouldn't go traveling/wandering alone at night around more industrial, depressed places (like Ostrava in said Northern Moravia). There you might be more likely to be treated poorly, threatened or attacked just from your appearance.

Quoting WildcatYXU (Reply 22):
Ok, ask your wife what their politically correct word for themselves mean and how they call the majority population (and what it means in english). After decoding that, you'll see that xenophobia is alive and well among them, same as the majority population. And by the way, you're welcome to put your money where your mouth is and prove I'm racist.

Rom means "man/husband" in the Romany language, similarly to many other groups' names for themselves. Yes the Roma also have a word, as many other groups do, meaning "not one of us": Gadjo (derived from Sanskrit, originally meaning a civilian). And yes of course there are racist Roma, racist Black people, racist Indians, etc. Lord knows every group has more than its fair share of idiots of all types. Just because there are racists everywhere is no excuse. As for "proving you are racist," I don't know you or your daily actions. I can only say your comment is racist.

It's statistically true, for example, that more petty crime is committed by Roma in Eastern Europe, and by Black people in the US. However, over the last generations in the US, UK, etc. most people have realized that discrimination and socioeconomic factors contribute mightily to such statistics, and you'd not last very long in polite society in the US saying that mugging, shoplifting, and pickpocketing were "problems caused by a certain ethnic group" (your own words).

When you consider that in the Czech Republic, for example, 75% of Romany children (by the government's own admission) are segregated into special schools for the mentally retarded from a young age--effectively killing their opportunities--and that even if they are educated, they face intense housing and job discrimination (according to a recent survey in Lidove Noviny, the Czech paper, 75% of Czechs believe it is totally appropriate for private employers not to hire Roma based on their race, since they are private employers and can hire whomever they want), you can see some of the most obvious reasons that might contribute to the high welfare, unemployment, and petty crime rates among this minority. Such things are always a two-way street.

___________________________

Anyway, I hope Amo enjoys his trip, and I'm pretty sure he will.

[Edited 2006-12-24 21:39:55]
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RE: Krakow To Prague, Overland- Train/bus?

Mon Dec 25, 2006 6:28 am

Quoting N229NW (Reply 24):

FYI, there are more meanings to certain words. Roma means for instance a human, whereas gadzo (the word how the Roma population labels the others) means (at least in Slovakia) something like "redneck sucker".
And, by the way, there was really a problem with Roma gangs in northern Moravia in late 90's. Since then is forbidden to state the offender's ethnicity.

Just FYI, the Roma nation is considered an ethnic group thats a part of Caucasian race. In not politically correct word, white. And FYI again, I have several friends who despise the word Roma as a artificial word created by politicians. They say they're Gypsies, nothing else.

If you wish to discuss that, you're welcome to open a new topic, as we are totally off here. ANCFlyer, the next step is yours.
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RE: Krakow To Prague, Overland- Train/bus?

Mon Dec 25, 2006 6:37 am

Quoting WildcatYXU (Reply 17):
Dude, I'd hate to see what you consider a bad breakfast...

McDonalds McGriddles work on hangovers like nothing else.

Quoting Milan320 (Reply 23):
Typical Polish pessimism I see.

No. But you and I know the whole of Poland is not only Warsaw, Gdansk and Krakow city centers. Are you suggesting that if you go to a random neighborhood at night in say Calgary or Seattle and go to a random neighborhood in Lodz or Radom you are just as safe? Lets be realistic, Im hardly a pessimist. Im off to Warsaw this thursday anyways for New Years, should be a good time, certainly a better time than in this Hemisphere.
 
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RE: Krakow To Prague, Overland- Train/bus?

Mon Dec 25, 2006 6:56 am

Quoting LOT767-300ER (Reply 26):
McDonalds McGriddles work on hangovers like nothing else.

Well, I usually can't eat next day. At least not breakfast...
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RE: Krakow To Prague, Overland- Train/bus?

Mon Dec 25, 2006 8:11 am

Quoting N229NW (Reply 19):
Wow, this thread made it all the way until reply 7 before the first racist comment!

Wow, it took 19 replys until N229NW, our very self-righteous politically correct police jumped all over this thread and took it totally off-topic.

Quoting N229NW (Reply 24):
75% of Romany children (by the government's own admission) are segregated into special schools for the mentally retarded from a young age--effectively killing their opportunities--and that even if they are educated

The story is of course far more complex than Roma-apologist present it as poor victimized Roma being oppressed by those evil white Czechs.
Kids are put into special schools because they fall behind their peers.
They were so called "zero" grades established in elementary schools for Roma kids to enroll to so they can learn to speak Czech and adopt basic social and hygienic skills (because their parents tend to "forget" to teach them that).
If anyone killed any chance for progress it were those human rights do gooders who legally challenged the only leverage the authorities had to force parents to send kinds to school which was a school attendance being a condition for their welfare benefits to be paid to parents.
It worked until it was ruled unconstitutional, great pyrrhic victory for human-rights do gooders but they seem to not care about the fact that Roma parents returned to not caring about whether their kids go to school or not (their society has "different priority of values" we are being told) . It is obvious that the only way out from this dead end street is education.
I would also love to hear explanation why the second most numerous minority in the Czech Republic, Vietnamese, do not have the same problems Roma do. And they've began migrating over here only 20 or so years ago, unlike Roma who seem to go from bad to worse for centuries.
How come the Vietnamese, who come from completely different social and cultural background managed to establish themselves within the society without any major problems?
How come they are moreless self-reliant, hard working and quite well-off, certainly enought to afford to economically support immigration of their wider relatives from Vietnam.
How come their kids, speak Czech among themselves without any problem, usually belong among the best pupils in class and I doubt they will have to work their asses off in restaurants or on markets selling fake Nike and adidas stuff?

Quoting N229NW (Reply 24):
you'd not last very long in polite society in the US saying that mugging, shoplifting, and pickpocketing were "problems caused by a certain ethnic group"

Why? Is it because it's not true or because it's not politically correct to call a spade spade?
 
RichPhitzwell
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RE: Krakow To Prague, Overland- Train/bus?

Mon Dec 25, 2006 9:57 am

Quoting L410Turbolet (Reply 28):
Why? Is it because it's not true or because it's not politically correct to call a spade spade?

I spent two weeks by myself between north and south Poland. It is a poor country with proud people that have been rolled over many times and still are being rolled over. But I have to admit, I never felt unsafe. I felt very welcomed, but with differing values as my country. Polish people as a whole are very family orientated and value money less than the USA. If I ran around with bling bling everywhere being an idiot...maybe my experience would be different.

A spade can be a murder weapon or a great tool for productivity, but its still a spade.

My 2 cents.
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RE: Krakow To Prague, Overland- Train/bus?

Mon Dec 25, 2006 10:23 am

Quoting L410Turbolet (Reply 28):

Please, don't try to explain to him anything. He's probably one of the 17 year old high school graduates who came to central Europe in 1990 to teach us free trade. He's the master of the universe and knows everything.
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n229nw
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Joined: Sat Sep 04, 2004 4:19 pm

RE: Krakow To Prague, Overland- Train/bus?

Mon Dec 25, 2006 5:27 pm

Quoting L410Turbolet (Reply 28):

Wow, it took 19 replys until N229NW, our very self-righteous politically correct police jumped all over this thread and took it totally off-topic.

Actually, given the skin color of the original poster, and the theme of alerting him to specific precautions he should take on certain trains in industrial Moravia, I'd say that my initial post was quite relevant indeed, beyond the fact that I was replying to a gratuitous comment by another poster.

After Wildcat responded to that post and I back to him, well, sure, we're going off topic. I was going to agree that we might as well have wrapped up the discussion at that point, but since you've jumped in, I have no problem with continuing this discussion here if the moderators don't. And although I'm sure most of your questions were rhetorical and you don't actually want to hear any counter-arguments, what the hell...

Quoting L410Turbolet (Reply 28):
The story is of course far more complex than Roma-apologist present it as poor victimized Roma being oppressed by those evil white Czechs.

Sure. As I said, it is a two-way street. Certainly, however, the story is far more complex than the "Czech-apologists" (to use a term like yours then) present it, as the poor victimized majority population whose tax money all goes to supporting a criminal race that "doesn't want to work." (Again, I know barely any Roma who haven't been turned away from jobs by people saying "Sorry we don't hire Gypsies here...we had a bad experience with a Gypsy once." etc. and I’m glad that there is recently some better investigative journalism on this problem.) Ghettos, mass-unemployment, etc.; these are serious problems in any society, and the explanations are never simple.

Quoting L410Turbolet (Reply 28):
Kids are put into special schools because they fall behind their peers.

Again, not simple either. Every psychological and educational study shows that if you treat a certain group of kids in any classroom as stupid and have low expectations of them, they will live down to those expectations too. More to the point with the earliest separation of Romany children, there are tons of cases in which very young Roma are put in special schools because they speak a dialect, when any other kid immigrating to the country, even if they didn’t speak a word of Czech, would not be put in a school for the mentally handicapped but would be forced to learn the language and catch up. The intelligent Romany activists I know never pretend that Roma are perfect; they know there is a lot of work to do within their own community. So, yes, Romany parents should do more for their young kids’ earliest education and language skills, but these are typical problems of a vicious cycle.

Quoting L410Turbolet (Reply 28):
It is obvious that the only way out from this dead end street is education.

So here I couldn’t agree with you more. Forced integration of schools, besides everything else, will also help clear up a lot of mutual mistrust between groups. (By the way, my wife feels strongly that parents’ welfare benefits should be dependent on having their kids in school.)

Quoting L410Turbolet (Reply 28):
I would also love to hear explanation why the second most numerous minority in the Czech Republic, Vietnamese, do not have the same problems Roma do. And they've began migrating over here only 20 or so years ago, unlike Roma who seem to go from bad to worse for centuries.

Almost all of your arguments here have also been made about Blacks in America versus other groups. Again, specific histories of the way the groups have been in contact have more to do with it than anything else. (In the US, slavery, obviously—and with Roma in the Europe, there are many elements of a long history, including the Holocaust.)

This post is already very long, but one example worth considering is Koreans. In Japan, they are in much the same position as Roma in the Czech Republic or Blacks in the US, with long history of lower achievement, higher criminality etc. tied to long history of discrimination and mistrust. In the US, Koreans are near the top of the list in the way minorities achieve—higher than average test scores, financially successful, etc. Clearly, the specific history of Korean-Japanese interaction is a major factor, for all the reasons discussed above.

Quoting L410Turbolet (Reply 28):
Quoting N229NW (Reply 24):
you'd not last very long in polite society in the US saying that mugging, shoplifting, and pickpocketing were "problems caused by a certain ethnic group"

Why? Is it because it's not true or because it's not politically correct to call a spade spade?

Ummm. Because it is not true. But, you know, here I’ll just let your own words speak for themselves (and your choice of expression is particularly ironic here).
All Glory to the Hypnotoad!

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