AC773
Topic Author
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French Cars In America?

Sat May 05, 2007 6:49 am

Renault, Citroen, and Peugeot all used to sell their cars in the US - why did they stop? And more importantly, do you think they'll ever be brought back?

I know they're pretty much glued together, but I'm willing to make some sacrifices for that kind of style and individuality.  biggrin 
Better to be nouveau than never to have been riche at all.
 
ZBBYLW
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sat May 05, 2007 6:56 am

Quoting AC773 (Thread starter):
I know they're pretty much glued together, but I'm willing to make some sacrifices for that kind of style and individuality. biggrin

I would say if you want to have that individuality go for something like a Alfa Romeo. Individuality PLUS a decent car  Wink
Keep the shinny side up!
 
AC773
Topic Author
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sat May 05, 2007 7:15 am

Quoting ZBBYLW (Reply 1):
I would say if you want to have that individuality go for something like a Alfa Romeo.

There's a distinct difference between having interior bits fall off and having engine bits fall off!  Wink
Better to be nouveau than never to have been riche at all.
 
LH423
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sat May 05, 2007 7:18 am

I drove a Peugeot 307 in France last year. It was, for a mid-sized hatchback, pretty fun to drive. The manual transmission was pretty smooth and it had a nice pick-up. I'd definitely consider driving one if they came back to North America.

I heard that Peugeot was supposed to return to the US market several years ago. Apparently they decided otherwise. Rover was supposed to bring back their US line, Sterling, after a break from the market. But, we know what happened there.

Then again, my parents drove a 1988 Sterling when I was young. We got rid of it around 1995 and when we did it had around 250,000 miles on it (dunno exactly since the Speedometer and odometer stopped working). NOTHING, and I mean NOTHING in the car worked except for the radio and headlights. The dashboard lights didn't light up, the heating/AC system no longer worked, the fan stopped running. In the winter you had to wait for the heat to get pushed ot of the vents at their own pace. Sometimes the windows and electronic seats would move on their own. By the time we got rid of it, the only thing that really worked was the engine, manufactured for Rover by...Honda! British car, Japanese engine. No surprise what gave out first  Silly

LH423
« On ne voit bien qu'avec le cœur. L'essentiel est invisible pour les yeux » Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
 
cfalk
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sat May 05, 2007 7:33 am

Quoting AC773 (Thread starter):
Renault, Citroen, and Peugeot all used to sell their cars in the US - why did they stop? And more importantly, do you think they'll ever be brought back?

They got a reputation of being pretty flimsy cars. Anyone remember the Renault LeCar, Alliance and Fuego? Those cars were fine for European roads but were essentially laughed off the road here.

That does not mean that small cars can't find a market in the U.S. Look at VW and the Beetle and the Rabbit/Golf.

Side note: I remember when the smaller Jeep Wagoneer/Cherokee first arrived in the early 80's. At the time, Jeep was owned by AMC and Renault had bought a big chunk of AMC. The first time I sat in one, my friend and I noticed how flimsy the whole car felt - particularly the doors, and the first comment I heard was "Wow, we can see Renault had a lot of influence on this design."
The only thing you should feel when shooting a terrorist: Recoil.
 
tz757300
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sat May 05, 2007 7:55 am

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 4):
Jeep Wagoneer

Eh, they were around until 1991, and they were still full size. How do I know....I have one Big grin

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 4):
early 80's

1984, to be exact

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 4):
The first time I sat in one, my friend and I noticed how flimsy the whole car felt - particularly the doors,

Hahaha, Believe it or not, every single bolt in the AMC cars were metric...so I wonder how they got in there...? Such a pain to find 55mm sockets and things of the like.
LETS GO MOUNTAINEERS!
 
cfalk
Posts: 10221
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sat May 05, 2007 8:04 am

Quoting TZ757300 (Reply 5):
Eh, they were around until 1991, and they were still full size. How do I know....I have one

I meant when they went from a full-size, like this one:



To this POS:



Edit: Damn, you were right. They still sold the big ones until 1991 as the Grand Wagoneer.

[Edited 2007-05-05 01:06:02]
The only thing you should feel when shooting a terrorist: Recoil.
 
deltagator
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sat May 05, 2007 8:23 am

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 4):
Anyone remember the Renault LeCar

Unfortunately. LeCar is an ancient French word for "Piece of Shiat."

"If you can't delight in the misery of others then you don't deserve to be a college football fan."
 
AirCop
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sat May 05, 2007 8:27 am

Peugeot 505 Turbo Diesel had an 1984 which I purchased new a drove for eight years..Great car, great comfort, excellent mileage, very dependable. Peugeot just never caught on here, the models prior to the 505 were just outright ugly, lack of dealerships, parts. Would cost to much to re-enter the US market.
 
tz757300
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sat May 05, 2007 8:53 am

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 6):
To this POS:

Those must have not been total POS's because that line lasted until 2004, I believe.
LETS GO MOUNTAINEERS!
 
ozglobal
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sat May 05, 2007 9:03 am

Peugeot and Renault made a big re-entry into the similar Australian market around 2000 and have exploded in their market share. The Australian market is much more accepting of more efficient, smaller and mid-sized cars. The Peugeot 406 Turbo Diesel set a world range record in about 2001 on a single tank in Australia. The 307, 407 and 207 are excellent cars in finish and performance. I have driven a 307 Turbo diesel here in France for 3 years without a single glitch.

The only reason they wouldn't succeed in the US is consumer attitude, because finish, efficiency and reliability are not hallmarks of American cars and the reason Japanese cars have the market share they do there.
When all's said and done, there'll be more said than done.
 
1stfl94
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sat May 05, 2007 9:06 am

Citroen could probably do alright with the C6 in the States but other than that most French cars wouldn't really sell, except possibly the Renault Espace
 
AC773
Topic Author
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sat May 05, 2007 9:08 am

Quoting OzGlobal (Reply 10):
The only reason they wouldn't succeed in the US is consumer attitude, because finish, efficiency and reliability are not hallmarks of American cars and the reason Japanese cars have the market share they do there.

Yeah, but the French blast them both to kingdom come when it comes to design, safety, and innovation. I think there's a market, but only in certain parts of the country. If I were a French automaker, I would start a pilot program in California.
Better to be nouveau than never to have been riche at all.
 
AH332
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sat May 05, 2007 9:15 am

Hi,

Here in the US it's all about power and speed along with comfort. Although, that's starting to change with rising gas prices and more environmental concern, a V8 engine isn't as coveted as it was.

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 4):
They got a reputation of being pretty flimsy cars. Anyone remember the Renault LeCar, Alliance and Fuego? Those cars were fine for European roads but were essentially laughed off the road here.

You're right. If you think about it the car with the lowest horsepower here in the US is probably the Toyota Yaris at 109 hp. Not many French cars are made with more, unless you want a sedan or a SUV (but even then you barely get over 200 hp). people here in the US just wouldn't go smaller, less powerful yet more efficient cars. The idea of bigger is better is still there.

I personally love French cars, with Peugeor being my favorite cars. My cousin in Algeria has a 307, and it's an awesome car. I drove it and it was a nice ride. I would definately buy one here. But, sadly the market just isn't here.

Cheers,
Imad
Bledi Heya Al Djazaeer! // Next Flights: AB MIA-DUS-ORY, AF ORY-MRS-ALG
 
SJCRRPAX
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sat May 05, 2007 9:32 am

Quoting OzGlobal (Reply 10):
The only reason they wouldn't succeed in the US is consumer attitude, because finish, efficiency and reliability are not hallmarks of American cars and the reason Japanese cars have the market share they do there.

Don't kid yourself, French cars had an extremely bad reputation in America. The only chance they have is with the younger crowd who might not remember French cars. Three European brands were totally beaten out of America by Japanese cars, and those are Fiat, Renault, and Volkswagen. Volkswagen has made a come back of sorts. American car companies have been able to compete with the Japanese, partly because it's a home market, but for the older people who remember French cars most all of them will tell you that the American cars were better.

I must say I have rented out French cars while in Europe, and they were great cars as are the Fiats. In fact I can't think of any real bad cars made by anyone anymore, and that is why the Japanese need to watch out for Korean Cars, followed by Chinese Cars.
 
AC773
Topic Author
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sat May 05, 2007 9:48 am

Quoting SJCRRPAX (Reply 14):
Chinese Cars.

Hold on, that's saying a little much. Chinese cars are worse than rock bottom - they copy the shape without having any concept of basic engineering. When the first Chinese SUV arrived in Europe, EURO-NCAP gave it a safety rating of zero stars.  crazy 
Better to be nouveau than never to have been riche at all.
 
ltbewr
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sat May 05, 2007 10:19 am

All three fell off the map over the years due to poor workmanship vs. Japan brand cars, obsolete or odd designs or difficulty in making models that complied with Federal safety and pollution laws.
Citreon got out of the USA in them early to mid-1970's due to poor sales for their odd cars.
PSA/Peugoet has not sold cars in the USA since the 1990's, but still has an office in the USA (Lyndhurst, NJ) for old car parts sales as well as new parts sales USA car makers (like FWD drive shaft assemblies). Occasionally one can see a current model Peugoet cars being tried out here from their office. Don't forget too that they did buy out Chrysler Europe in 1977, and made parts for the NA Dodge/Plymouth Horizon/Omni model, (a version also sold in Europe) including some engines. Also as a result of that deal, a former Chrysler Europe/ex-Roots group UK plant became a plant for PSA models.
Renault imported various models from France to North American from the early 1950's to the mid-1970's including the 'Dauphine', the 10, the 16. They bought AMC/Jeep and owned them for most of the 1980's, selling it to Chrysler. During that time, they made models of the Renault 9 and 11 models in the USA (the Alliance), and imported the 5 (we called it the LeCar) and the Fuego sports model. They also made a version of a larger Renault model for the car line called the Eagle, to be sold by Jeep dealers as part of the sale to Chrysler. All of the Renault cars failed in the NA market and they have never returned. Besides, they own a chunk of Nissan, which makes some models in the USA so don't need to sell Renault models anymore. Renault also owned Mack Truck in the USA from the 1980's to several years ago (sold it to Volvo truck).
 
TSS
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sat May 05, 2007 11:03 am

Quoting TZ757300 (Reply 9):
Those must have not been total POS's because that line lasted until 2004, I believe.

Updating the venerable 4.0 liter AMC I-6 with electronic fuel injection and shoehorning it into the Cherokees around 1987 or so gave them new life and dramatically better performance. Originally they were only available with the same engines as Chevy Citations and S-10 pickups: A 2.8 liter Chevrolet V-6 or a 2.5 liter Pontiac I-4, both carbureted and both overwhelmed by pushing an SUV around.
Able to kill active threads stone dead with a single post!
 
mikey
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sat May 05, 2007 11:17 am

I used to drive a 1987 Peugeot 505STX. I wish that I did not gave it away but I had lots of problems with that car like stalls, streering wheels lock, and had a break failure while driving on the freeway ( luckly there was a traffic jam). I hardly see another Peugeot driving around (sometimes i see one once every 6 months or more).

Mike
Ex LAX, LGB, SNA aviation photographer
 
L-188
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sat May 05, 2007 12:11 pm

Quoting DeltaGator (Reply 7):
Quoting Cfalk (Reply 4):
Anyone remember the Renault LeCar

Unfortunately. LeCar is an ancient French word for "Piece of Shiat."

And yet B.A. Baracus managed to convert one into a tank during an episode of, "The A-Team". Sort of like a French M551 Sheridan. Ended up burning like one too.

Quoting AC773 (Reply 12):
If I were a French automaker, I would start a pilot program in California.

I could see people in San Fran and Seattle, WA wanting to buy french cars.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
rlwynn
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sat May 05, 2007 2:30 pm

The Nissan Versa is the Renault Clio platform. And the new Sentra is from the Megane platform.
I can drive faster than you
 
ozglobal
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sat May 05, 2007 6:32 pm

Quoting SJCRRPAX (Reply 14):
Quoting OzGlobal (Reply 10):
The only reason they wouldn't succeed in the US is consumer attitude, because finish, efficiency and reliability are not hallmarks of American cars and the reason Japanese cars have the market share they do there.

Don't kid yourself, French cars had an extremely bad reputation in America.

How am I "kidding myself". You re-stated my point. They are only blocked by 'consumer attitude', which in this case is disconnected from reality. They have a marketing challenge, but not an engineering, finish or efficiency one.
When all's said and done, there'll be more said than done.
 
cfalk
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sun May 06, 2007 12:09 am

Quoting L-188 (Reply 19):
And yet B.A. Baracus managed to convert one into a tank during an episode of, "The A-Team". Sort of like a French M551 Sheridan. Ended up burning like one too.

Dude, you just admitted to the world that you watched the A-Team and even know the characters' names after 20 years...  Silly
The only thing you should feel when shooting a terrorist: Recoil.
 
L-188
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sun May 06, 2007 2:07 am

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 22):
Dude, you just admitted to the world that you watched the A-Team and even know the characters' names after 20 years...

Camp value.

Actually I will also admit that I currently have 4 of the 5 seasons on DVD.

And what is wrong with Sgt. Baracas?

One thing that show did right IMHO is that they always had to use what was there to create some tool to get out of a situation.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
cfalk
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sun May 06, 2007 2:11 am

Quoting L-188 (Reply 23):
Actually I will also admit that I currently have 4 of the 5 seasons on DVD.

 crazy   eek   yuck 
The only thing you should feel when shooting a terrorist: Recoil.
 
L-188
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sun May 06, 2007 2:21 am

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 24):
Quoting L-188 (Reply 23):
Actually I will also admit that I currently have 4 of the 5 seasons on DVD.


It is still a lot better then a lot of the crap on TV these days.

The guys had to use ingenuity, nobody got killed (7 total in the series, only 1 wasn't shot by a bad guy), and a happy ending.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
SJCRRPAX
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sun May 06, 2007 2:25 am

Quoting OzGlobal (Reply 21):
How am I "kidding myself". You re-stated my point. They are only blocked by 'consumer attitude', which in this case is disconnected from reality. They have a marketing challenge, but not an engineering, finish or efficiency one.

The reason you are kidding yourself is because you seem to think that the finish, efficiency and reliability or French Cars is better than American Cars, and that is just not true. A reputation is a very hard thing to lose and French and Italian cars have a much worse reputation for reliability than American Cars. American Car companies are fighting the same perception as the French Cars are and it's been a losing battle, no matter how high their quality goes no one will believe it. The quality game is about over, all car companies the world over have achieved great quality due to advanced machine tools, CAD tools, electronic control systems in cars and robotics.

The new game will be price and in America this is how the fight will shape up.

American Car companies will have the home field advantage, as every country in the world has patrotic citizens who will only buy from the home team. American Companies will start more and more sourcing of parts and assembly from China to try to lower the cost. They also have some outstanding products in R&D in Hybrid technology and Hydrogen fueled cars.

Japanese cars will continue to use their quality reputation, while trying to figure out how to lower the total cost by using cheap Asian Labor. They also have outstanding R&D.

Korea is now putting out very high quality cars, and have the cost advantage over everyone.

So, the way I see it the French Cars are going to be left out. They will be more expensive than all the others, about the same or less in quality, and will not have the home field advantage. I'm not trying to slam French cars here, they are excellent cars. I just think in the American Market French Cars have the impossible task of beating out the Japanese, American and Korean competetion.
 
omoo
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sun May 06, 2007 2:32 am

I would love to be able to buy a Peugeot 504 in the US...  Silly
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fbgdavidson
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sun May 06, 2007 3:05 am

Quoting AC773 (Thread starter):
I know they're pretty much glued together, but I'm willing to make some sacrifices for that kind of style and individuality.   

And Americans cars don't feel like they've been glued together??? My wife and I (living in the US despite the flag  Wink) both have European cars but the majority of both our sets of co-workers drive American cars. One of our friends has an Expedition and that is biggest heap of crap I've come across. The whole binnacle dashboard thing rocks, bits don't fit properly, there are gaps in the dashboard of varying sizes and this car is only a year or so old.

Sure French cars aren't the best built, as my father says, if you park an Audi and a Citroen next to eachother and open the bonnets you'll see they are worlds apart. The Citroen will look like all the parts have been thrown in their by an epileptic chimpanzee whilst the Audi will have everything in its place and a place for everything.

Quoting AH332 (Reply 13):
Here in the US it's all about power and speed along with comfort.

Read: makes lots of noise upon acceleration without much increase in speed and drives like a couch with dodgy springs.
"My first job was selling doors, door to door, that's a tough job innit" - Bill Bailey
 
UTA_flyinghigh
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sun May 06, 2007 3:15 am

The French Embassy/consulates in the US run quite a few French cars, i.e a couple of 406s and 607s in DC and 307s in MIA. There was an XM in LA but I'm not sure if it's still there.

UTA  checkeredflag 
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TheRedBaron
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sun May 06, 2007 3:58 am

I have a Peugeot 206, having had over 20 diferent cars in my years driving is one of the best purchases I have done, and the only car I have kept for over 3 years... my next Peugeot will be a 407 coupe with the 3.0 liter engine..FTW!

http://arabam.milliyet.com.tr/fuar/2005/frankfurt/peugeot_407coupe.jpg
The best seat in a Plane is the Jumpseat.
 
rlwynn
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sun May 06, 2007 4:06 am

Quoting SJCRRPAX (Reply 26):
The reason you are kidding yourself is because you seem to think that the finish, efficiency and reliability or French Cars is better than American Cars, and that is just not true.

No, the finish, especially the efficiency and the reliability are way,way ahead of any American cars. If you have any up to date examples to the contrary, please share them with us.
I can drive faster than you
 
AC773
Topic Author
Posts: 1700
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sun May 06, 2007 5:21 am

Quoting Fbgdavidson (Reply 28):
And Americans cars don't feel like they've been glued together???

Of course they are! I didn't mention American cars specifically in my post, but as always, their generally atrocious design, performance, safety, efficiency, and build quality is implied.  Wink

Quoting Theredbaron (Reply 30):
my next Peugeot will be a 407 coupe with the 3.0 liter engine

 drool  You see, this is precisely the kind of thing I'm talking about. I've seen the 407 sedan/saloon before, but that coupe is simply gorgeous! Furthermore, I love the idea of never, ever seeing a car like mine on the road.

Quoting UTA_flyinghigh (Reply 29):
The French Embassy/consulates in the US run quite a few French cars

Wow! I wonder what their arrangement is for servicing. I'll be moving to the DC area one of these days and that would be the biggest obstacle to importing one.
Better to be nouveau than never to have been riche at all.
 
SJCRRPAX
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sun May 06, 2007 8:10 am

Quoting Rlwynn (Reply 31):
No, the finish, especially the efficiency and the reliability are way,way ahead of any American cars. If you have any up to date examples to the contrary, please share them with us.



My contention is it is hard to buy a bad car and reliability and quality differences between models is not that great. I don't see any evidence to suggest French built cars are anything special. Unlike you, I can't remember the last time I drove a car that I thought was a POS, I love them all...

The Fusion and the Mercury Milan were among the top-ranked family cars for predicted reliability, on par with the Honda Accord and the Toyota Camry. The magazine bases its reliability forecasts on information provided by consumers for the past three model years. In the case of the Fusion and the Milan, the rating is based on only one model year because the vehicles were new for 2006. More here->

http://abcnews.go.com/Business/wireStory?id=2642320&Business=true

The French are turning away from their Renaults, Peugeots and Citroens in record number and buying foreign cars. After years of declining interest, only 54 percent of French car buyers bought the national marques in 2006. Hardest hit was Renault, which lost 10 percent of its national sales and four percent globally. More here->


http://timescorrespondents.typepad.c...emner/2007/01/the_french_are_.html

Apparently Ford's quality is now on par with Toyota and Nissan, according to a new report released today. The RDA Group has released a report on the quality of 2007 model year vehicles. The group concluded that Ford, Lincoln and Mercury vehicles have the same quality levels as Toyota and Nissan in the first-quarter 2007 model-year Global Quality Research System report. More here -->

http://www.thetorquereport.com/2007/...ord_quality_is_on_par_with_to.html

Reliability list, French cars end up 14, 20 and 22. Volvo, Ford, are higher, and Vauxhall is #18. If you want to mention Nissan is part french, I'll mention Mazda is part Ford.

1 Mazda 17.88
2 Toyota 18.62
3 Honda 19.41
4 Subaru 19.82
5 Mitsubishi 20.04
6 Hyundai 22.35
7 Seat 22.69
8 Nissan 23.44
9 Mercedes 24.30
10 Daewoo 29.46
11 Volvo 31.09
12 Volkswagen 31.90
13 Ford 32.16
14 Peugeot 33.00
15 BMW 33.16
16 Fiat 34.31
17 Rover 34.73
18 Vauxhall 35.34
19 MG 36.25
20 Renault 38.20
21 Alfa Romeo 39.55
22 Citroen 39.59
23 Audi 39.76
24 Jaguar 42.16
25 Saab 42.87
26 Jeep 43.75
27 Land Rover 46.23


http://www.reliabilityindex.co.uk/trends7.html?apc=3128339010848601
 
Superfly
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sun May 06, 2007 8:12 am

Quoting L-188 (Reply 19):
I could see people in San Fran and Seattle, WA wanting to buy french cars.

LOL!  rotfl 

There is a guy in my neighborhood that collects French cars. He has a Citroen CV2, Delorean, Citroen D5 and a Le Car with the rollaway top.
The old style Citroen I see handful on the streets here. Also I know a older man that has a Pegeot 505 diesel stationwagon.

I'd like ot see French cars re-enter the US market. I hope they are more reliable today.



I also remember that A-Team episode. I need to go out and buy those DVD collections of the A-Team.
That was one of the best TV shows ever!  yes 
Bring back the Concorde
 
ozglobal
Posts: 2525
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sun May 06, 2007 9:10 am

Quoting SJCRRPAX (Reply 26):
Quoting OzGlobal (Reply 21):
How am I "kidding myself". You re-stated my point. They are only blocked by 'consumer attitude', which in this case is disconnected from reality. They have a marketing challenge, but not an engineering, finish or efficiency one.

The reason you are kidding yourself is because you seem to think that the finish, efficiency and reliability or French Cars is better than American Cars, and that is just not true.

I've lived and worked and driven in both countries as well as my home in Oz. Have you? The design of US cars is wasteful of space (inefficient) design is uninspired at best and quality (in my experience) marginal. My experience of Peugeot at least is streets ahead.
When all's said and done, there'll be more said than done.
 
SJCRRPAX
Posts: 961
Joined: Wed Dec 21, 2005 2:29 am

RE: French Cars In America?

Sun May 06, 2007 10:23 am

Quoting OzGlobal (Reply 35):
I've lived and worked and driven in both countries as well as my home in Oz. Have you? The design of US cars is wasteful of space (inefficient) design is uninspired at best and quality (in my experience) marginal. My experience of Peugeot at least is streets ahead.

I think we will just have to agree to disagree. I have worked for Italian Companies, and German Companies pretty much my entire adult life. I have spent extended periods of time in those countries and rented out countless numbers of cars, Fiats, Peugeots, Renaults, Vauxhalls, MB ... I have owned Toyotas, Hondas, General Motors, Chryslers, and Volkswagons and racked up 100,000 plus miles on all of them. I seem to find more difference between models in a brand than across brands. My opinion is the quality game is over and it ended in a near tie with the Japanese slightly ahead. The new game will be all about price, who can get the price down while keeping the quality up.

Oh yea, never been to Oz and have no desire. It seems like an awful long ways to go to look at an Opera House and some Kangaroos.
 
deltagator
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sun May 06, 2007 10:31 am

Quoting OzGlobal (Reply 21):
They have a marketing challenge, but not an engineering, finish or efficiency one.

Perhaps they don't have an engineering, finish, or efficiency problems anymore but I can guarantee you that the perception of French cars here in the States remains poor to sucky. I'm sure that nobody cares that Renault and Nissan are sharing body lines and such because they will remember crap like LeCar and stay away. It is a marketing problem but a very big one they will have a tough time overcoming if they ever decide to sell cars over here again.

Quoting SJCRRPAX (Reply 36):
My opinion is the quality game is over and it ended in a near tie with the Japanese slightly ahead.

Perhaps the numbers bear out as such but the continuing decline of American car sales against foreign cars is a telling sign. I'll put it to you this way...I remember when buying an American car you would wait a month or two and then take it back to the dealer so they could tighten up loose screws or flat out replace them since you were holding them in your hands. I've never done that with any of my Hondas.

Quoting SJCRRPAX (Reply 36):
The new game will be all about price, who can get the price down while keeping the quality up.

And given the US carmakers liabilities for pensions and such I seriously doubt they will be able to do it cheaply without outsourcing it all overseas.

Quoting SJCRRPAX (Reply 36):
Oh yea, never been to Oz and have no desire. It seems like an awful long ways to go to look at an Opera House and some Kangaroos.

No need to be a peckerwood. He's engaging you in a decent debate and you throw out insults. Not exactly mature of you. And for the record I've been to Oz twice and it is a wonderful country. If you think it is just an opera house and some kangaroos you're sorely mistaken and it's your loss.
"If you can't delight in the misery of others then you don't deserve to be a college football fan."
 
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PA110
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sun May 06, 2007 10:36 am

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 4):
They got a reputation of being pretty flimsy cars. Anyone remember the Renault LeCar, Alliance and Fuego? Those cars were fine for European roads but were essentially laughed off the road here.



Quoting DeltaGator (Reply 7):
Unfortunately. LeCar is an ancient French word for "Piece of Shiat."

For all you guys bashing the Renault 5 (or LeCar as it was known here), I owned not one but two of them. The first finally died after 275,000 miles, being driven 70miles each way to/from JFK Airport 6 days a week. It was so reliable, I went out and bought another to replace it. It was easy on gas, easy to drive around the city, and handled the East Coast winter ice and snow just great. I kept the 2nd car for 3 years, and only sold it when I moved from the suburbs into Manhattan, where it would have been too expensive to keep. LeCar's were simple and reliable. The only issue I ever had with the second car was that the plastic bushings in the gear shift lever would wear out fairly quickly, and I would have to replace them once a year. (took 5 minutes and cost less than $10).
It's been swell, but the swelling has gone down.
 
L-188
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sun May 06, 2007 10:56 am

Quoting PA110 (Reply 38):
For all you guys bashing the Renault 5 (or LeCar as it was known here),

I don't really recall bashing the car......oh wait....

Quoting L-188 (Reply 19):
Sort of like a French M551 Sheridan. Ended up burning like one too.

I guess I did....Comparing it to a 551 not the burning part  hot 

Still between a Lecar and a VW Rabbit of the same era, I would have to go with the wabbit.
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PA110
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sun May 06, 2007 11:06 am

Quoting L-188 (Reply 39):
Still between a Lecar and a VW Rabbit of the same era, I would have to go with the wabbit.

Oh, no way. Not in the Northeast, at least. VW Rabbits could rust completely through in a single winter from the salt spreaders during snow storms.
It's been swell, but the swelling has gone down.
 
L-188
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sun May 06, 2007 11:08 am

Quoting PA110 (Reply 40):
VW Rabbits could rust completely through in a single winter from the salt spreaders during snow storms.

We used to use our old one on the beach, Didn't rust out.

Made a pretty good fishing and coal picking buggy.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
mham001
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sun May 06, 2007 11:09 am

Quoting OzGlobal (Reply 10):
The only reason they wouldn't succeed in the US is consumer attitude, because finish, efficiency and reliability are not hallmarks of American cars and the reason Japanese cars have the market share they do there.

So what your saying is that the French wouldn't succeed because finish, efficiency and reliability are not hallmarks of French cars?
 
SJCRRPAX
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sun May 06, 2007 11:19 am

Quoting DeltaGator (Reply 37):
And given the US car makers liabilities for pensions and such I seriously doubt they will be able to do it cheaply without outsourcing it all overseas.

You are right, the new game is all about outsourcing and Japan and France will be playing it too.

Quoting DeltaGator (Reply 37):
No need to be a peckerwood. He's engaging you in a decent debate and you throw out insults. Not exactly mature of you. And for the record I've been to Oz twice and it is a wonderful country. If you think it is just an opera house and some kangaroos you're sorely mistaken and it's your loss.



Correct you are. Apologies to the great people of Oz. I just thought it was funny that he mentioned he lived in Oz and since I hadn't the implication was that I probably knew nothing about French cars, so I throw back a little humor. Maybe I should have used one of those smiley things.
 
TPAnx
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sun May 06, 2007 12:01 pm

As s git  old  --gotta ask,,,,anyone remember the Simca?? Drove one working for my college in
61. You had to turn a valve under the hood to get the heat to work..a muffler fell off on my way to meet an old girl friend who lived on the Main Line in Philly....gotta admit that the four speed tranny was fun to drive on the back roads...
TPAnx
I read the news today..oh boy
 
UTA_flyinghigh
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sun May 06, 2007 3:10 pm

Quoting AC773 (Reply 32):
Wow! I wonder what their arrangement is for servicing. I'll be moving to the DC area one of these days and that would be the biggest obstacle to importing one.

PSA (Peugeot Citroen) have a liaison office in the US (I don't recall if it is in DC or MI) for that purpose.
For the MIA consulate vehicles, they are shipped ove{r to the French Caribbean for their C-check  Wink

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VonRichtofen
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sun May 06, 2007 5:22 pm

I could see French cars returning to Canada before the US. Canada is more accepting of smaller more fuel efficient vehicles. Take the Smart Car for example. Been in Canada for almost 5 years now I think and they're only just entering the US market.

French cars are not the POS' they used to be, in fact they seem light years ahead of the crap coming of GM, Ford and Chrysler these days.

Kris
 
ozglobal
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sun May 06, 2007 6:18 pm

Quoting SJCRRPAX (Reply 43):
Correct you are. Apologies to the great people of Oz. I just thought it was funny that he mentioned he lived in Oz and since I hadn't the implication was that I probably knew nothing about French cars, so I throw back a little humor. Maybe I should have used one of those smiley things.

You mentioned you experience of different car markets and so I responded with mine. Since you seem to present yourself as something of an insider authority in the market you should have known that in the Oz market, similar to the US (as I pointed out earlier), French brands have gone from near zero about 10 years ago to a significant chunk. Get my point now?
When all's said and done, there'll be more said than done.
 
ozglobal
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sun May 06, 2007 6:20 pm

Quoting Mham001 (Reply 42):
Quoting OzGlobal (Reply 10):
The only reason they wouldn't succeed in the US is consumer attitude, because finish, efficiency and reliability are not hallmarks of American cars and the reason Japanese cars have the market share they do there.

So what your saying is that the French wouldn't succeed because finish, efficiency and reliability are not hallmarks of French cars?

Your question is not possible if your read the post. I'll leave you to re-read. Thanks.
When all's said and done, there'll be more said than done.
 
Alessandro
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RE: French Cars In America?

Sun May 06, 2007 8:38 pm

Well, US has always been rigid when it comes to protect their domestic brands, Citroën weren´t allowed to have the turning
headlights, LHM system wasn´t allowed for several years after europe.
I think France never will market cars in the US again, as for quality of cars, in Africa Peugeot and Mercedes are among the most common brands, hardly any Pontiacs nor Cadillacs there.
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