T56A15
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Auto 1 Of Europe” Award To The Ford S-MAX

Mon May 14, 2007 8:22 pm

http://media.ford.com/newsroom/release_display.cfm?release=25606

What is wrong with this picture? FMC is struggling for sales here in the states and they can produce vehicles like this for the European markets. All they offer here is the Windstar.
 
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Francoflier
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RE: Auto 1 Of Europe” Award To The Ford S-MAX

Mon May 14, 2007 9:38 pm

I think the US market is not yet interested in compact minivans. They're all the fuss in Europe though. To put it quite simply, EVERYONE owes one there.... And I hate them.

They're great cars, economical, practical, they handle and perform good (especially that sporty version of the S-max with the 230 Hp engine...), but I don't think I'd buy one. Then again, don't blame me for changing my mind when I have 3 kids...
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David L
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RE: Auto 1 Of Europe” Award To The Ford S-MAX

Mon May 14, 2007 10:29 pm

Quoting Francoflier (Reply 1):
They're great cars, economical, practical, they handle and perform good (especially that sporty version of the S-max with the 230 Hp engine...), but I don't think I'd buy one.

My mum has one and it's nice but... I preferred the Focus she had before that. The driving position's just too high in the S-Max - it does feel like you're driving a van. I guess if you need the flexible rear seat arrangement that's another plus for it.
 
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KaiGywer
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RE: Auto 1 Of Europe” Award To The Ford S-MAX

Mon May 14, 2007 10:32 pm

Nice looking for being a minivan. The front kinda looks like a Focus.
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metroliner
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RE: Auto 1 Of Europe” Award To The Ford S-MAX

Mon May 14, 2007 10:39 pm

does kind of have a stupid name though. s-max... kind of controversial, with ten kids in the back and the current debate on parental discipline...
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Francoflier
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RE: Auto 1 Of Europe” Award To The Ford S-MAX

Mon May 14, 2007 11:17 pm

Quoting Metroliner (Reply 4):
kind of controversial, with ten kids in the back and the current debate on parental discipline...

Are you kidding? Now you can take your 3 kids to soccer practice AND lap 9'30 on the Nu'ring at the same time! I can't think of a better mid-life crisis solution when you haven't been able to kick your offspring out to the Uni yet...

  



[Edited 2007-05-14 16:22:35]
I'll do my own airline. With Blackjack. And hookers. In fact, forget the airline.
 
metroliner
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RE: Auto 1 Of Europe” Award To The Ford S-MAX

Mon May 14, 2007 11:19 pm

Quoting Francoflier (Reply 5):
I can't think of a better mid-life crisis solution when you haven't been able to kick your offspring out to the Uni yet...

leave the wife at home with the kids and go out on the bike...  Wink
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ACDC8
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RE: Auto 1 Of Europe” Award To The Ford S-MAX

Tue May 15, 2007 4:02 am

Quoting KaiGywer (Reply 3):
Nice looking for being a minivan. The front kinda looks like a Focus.

That's because it is a Focus. The Focus line-up in Europe is much more developed then the basic variants we are offered here in North America. Also, VW has a similiar product for the Golf called the Golf Plus.
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MAH4546
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RE: Auto 1 Of Europe” Award To The Ford S-MAX

Tue May 15, 2007 6:11 am

Quoting Francoflier (Reply 1):
I think the US market is not yet interested in compact minivans.

Kia and Mazda would have to disagree with you. The Mazda5 and Kia Rondo have done well in the US market.

Also,the S-Max is not a compact minivan. It is roughly the same size as a regular length Chevrolet Uplander, Kia Carnival, or Dodge Caravan, all sold in the US.

Quoting ACDC8 (Reply 7):
That's because it is a Focus. The Focus line-up in Europe is much more developed then the basic variants we are offered here in North America. Also, VW has a similiar product for the Golf called the Golf Plus.

The S-Max is not a Focus. The C-Max is a Focus, the S-Max is larger.

They need to slap a Mercury badge on the S-Max and Mondeo ASAP.

Until then, the European Transit Connect will be available in the US next spring, but it is aimed at commercial customers.

[Edited 2007-05-14 23:16:26]
a.
 
ACDC8
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RE: Auto 1 Of Europe” Award To The Ford S-MAX

Tue May 15, 2007 7:16 am

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 8):
The S-Max is not a Focus. The C-Max is a Focus, the S-Max is larger.

My mistake, I got the C and S-max confused, sorry.
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ABQ747
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RE: Auto 1 Of Europe” Award To The Ford S-MAX

Tue May 15, 2007 7:22 am

Quoting T56A15 (Thread starter):
What is wrong with this picture? FMC is struggling for sales here in the states and they can produce vehicles like this for the European markets. All they offer here is the Windstar.

Ford hasn't made the Windstar since 2003. The Fusion is doing well, and is eating up market share from Honda and Toyota.
The reason New Mexico is so windy is because Texas sucks and Arizona blows.
 
ACDC8
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RE: Auto 1 Of Europe” Award To The Ford S-MAX

Tue May 15, 2007 7:37 am

Quoting ABQ747 (Reply 10):
Ford hasn't made the Windstar since 2003.

Windstar was replaced/rebadged by the Freestar.
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foppishbum
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RE: Auto 1 Of Europe” Award To The Ford S-MAX

Tue May 15, 2007 10:41 am

Ford Mondeo~ I want Mondeo in the US!!!!!!!



Cheers,
foppish bum
Taiwanese-American :D
 
MAH4546
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RE: Auto 1 Of Europe” Award To The Ford S-MAX

Wed May 16, 2007 1:34 am

Quoting ABQ747 (Reply 10):
Ford hasn't made the Windstar since 2003. The Fusion is doing well, and is eating up market share from Honda and Toyota.

The Fusion is doing well. It isn't doing that well. Even when you combine Fusion sales with the Milan and MKZ twins, it still doesn't come close to outselling the Camry or Accord.

Quoting ACDC8 (Reply 11):

Windstar was replaced/rebadged by the Freestar.

Which is now being replaced by the stupidly name but awesome-looking Ford Flex.
a.
 
ABQ747
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RE: Auto 1 Of Europe” Award To The Ford S-MAX

Wed May 16, 2007 2:07 am

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 13):
Even when you combine Fusion sales with the Milan and MKZ twins, it still doesn't come close to outselling the Camry or Accord.

I never said the Fusion was outselling the Camry or Accord. Those cars have a loyal customer base since they have been around for years. The Fusion came out for 2006.
The reason New Mexico is so windy is because Texas sucks and Arizona blows.
 
ACDC8
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RE: Auto 1 Of Europe” Award To The Ford S-MAX

Wed May 16, 2007 3:43 am

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 13):
Which is now being replaced by the stupidly name but awesome-looking Ford Flex.

Is Ford still on schedule with the Flex for 2009?
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MAH4546
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RE: Auto 1 Of Europe” Award To The Ford S-MAX

Wed May 16, 2007 3:50 am

Quoting ABQ747 (Reply 14):

I never said the Fusion was outselling the Camry or Accord. Those cars have a loyal customer base since they have been around for years. The Fusion came out for 2006.

It isn't eating up market share, though, and you did say that. The Fusion has been a strong seller, but it is still doesn't even outsell the Chevrolet Impala, Chevrolet Cobalt, or the Ford Focus; and at the rate the new Dodge Avenger is selling, the Avenger is about to overtake it.

Quoting ACDC8 (Reply 15):
Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 13):
Which is now being replaced by the stupidly name but awesome-looking Ford Flex.

Is Ford still on schedule with the Flex for 2009?

Yes, it arrives next summer. The production model was unvieled, and it looks great. Too bad the name is absolutely ridiculous! They still have a year to decide it should be called Fairline. And yes, names are important, even if it is a good product. Ford learned that the hardway with the Ford Five Hundred and Mercury Montego.

[Edited 2007-05-15 20:55:38]
a.
 
ACDC8
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RE: Auto 1 Of Europe” Award To The Ford S-MAX

Wed May 16, 2007 3:55 am

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 16):
Too bad the name is absolutely ridiculous!

Agreed, but the name does seem to fit in their new line-up .... Edge, Flex, Fusion. At least Fords names are better then the current ones for Jeep ... Nitro, Patriot, Compass, Commander .... yikes!
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ABQ747
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RE: Auto 1 Of Europe” Award To The Ford S-MAX

Wed May 16, 2007 5:25 am

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 16):
It isn't eating up market share, though, and you did say that. The Fusion has been a strong seller, but it is still doesn't even outsell the Chevrolet Impala, Chevrolet Cobalt, or the Ford Focus; and at the rate the new Dodge Avenger is selling, the Avenger is about to overtake it.

Yes it is. It is selling a lot better than the Taurus. The Impala, Cobalt, Focus, and the Avenger are selling well only because they are favorites among the rental car companies. Who in their right mind would want an Impala?

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/7d/Wiki_cars1_009.jpg/800px-Wiki_cars1_009.jpg
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AsstChiefMark
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RE: Auto 1 Of Europe” Award To The Ford S-MAX

Wed May 16, 2007 5:39 am

Quoting Foppishbum (Reply 12):
Ford Mondeo~ I want Mondeo in the US!!!!!!!

They had Mondeos. No one bought them. So they shitcanned them. I owned two of them (the good ones...not the stripped-down rental car versions) and thought they were kick ass.

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ACDC8
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RE: Auto 1 Of Europe” Award To The Ford S-MAX

Wed May 16, 2007 2:16 pm

Quoting ABQ747 (Reply 18):
The Impala, Cobalt, Focus, and the Avenger are selling well only because they are favorites among the rental car companies

So is the Fusion.

Quoting ABQ747 (Reply 18):
Who in their right mind would want an Impala?

Lord only knows. Not my kind of car. But I do have to admit that they (the new ones) are much nicer than the last model.

Quoting AsstChiefMark (Reply 19):
They had Mondeos. No one bought them.

They were too small a car for the price they were asking, at least in Canada.

Quoting AsstChiefMark (Reply 19):
So they shitcanned them.

Unfortunately.
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MAH4546
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RE: Auto 1 Of Europe” Award To The Ford S-MAX

Wed May 16, 2007 2:56 pm

Quoting ABQ747 (Reply 18):
Yes it is. It is selling a lot better than the Taurus.

You mean the now-discontinued Taurus that last year was sold only to fleets? Or are you referring to the soon-to-be-Taurus Five Hundred, which was never meant to outsell the Fusion. Keep in mind that Ford (and Chevrolet, Dodge, and Chrysler) use two sedans to compete where Honda, Toyota, and Hyundai use one.

Quoting ABQ747 (Reply 18):
The Impala, Cobalt, Focus, and the Avenger are selling well only because they are favorites among the rental car companies.

You act like the Fusion is much different. It's not.
a.
 
ABQ747
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RE: Auto 1 Of Europe” Award To The Ford S-MAX

Wed May 16, 2007 3:10 pm

Quoting ACDC8 (Reply 20):
So is the Fusion.



Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 21):
You act like the Fusion is much different. It's not.

Ford is trying not to sell as many cars to the rental companies so they can keep resale values up. I'm starting to see a lot more import cars now in the rental fleets (Hyundais, Toyotas, Kias). There are still Fords out there, but not as many.

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 21):
You mean the now-discontinued Taurus that last year was sold only to fleets?

Yes.
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ACDC8
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RE: Auto 1 Of Europe” Award To The Ford S-MAX

Wed May 16, 2007 3:18 pm

Quoting ABQ747 (Reply 22):
Ford is trying not to sell as many cars to the rental companies so they can keep resale values up. I'm starting to see a lot more import cars now in the rental fleets (Hyundais, Toyotas, Kias). There are still Fords out there, but not as many.

I don't know about that, the rental company I used to work for has quite a few Fords on their lots, mostly Fusions. However, I do agree that they are getting more imports in their fleets. My old employeer has an impressive fleets of VW Jetta's and they're even TDi's ....  Wow! . The Toyota Echo/Yaris has always been a popular car at the rental companies, as is the Corolla and Matrix, however there are quite a number of Camry's on fleet now as well. Nissan still has a number of Sentra's and Altima's on fleet, I haven't seen any Versa's or many Maxima's around.
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KaiGywer
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RE: Auto 1 Of Europe” Award To The Ford S-MAX

Wed May 16, 2007 9:31 pm

Quoting ACDC8 (Reply 11):
Windstar was replaced/rebadged by the Freestar.

In their "genius" "all Ford models must start with F"

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 13):
Which is now being replaced by the stupidly name but awesome-looking Ford Flex.

At least they kept to the F  Smile

Quoting ABQ747 (Reply 18):
Who in their right mind would want an Impala?

My first reaction when I saw one, "Supersized Honda Civic"

Quoting ACDC8 (Reply 23):
I don't know about that, the rental company I used to work for has quite a few Fords on their lots, mostly Fusions. However, I do agree that they are getting more imports in their fleets.

GM, Ford cut sales to rental fleets
By Sarah A. Webster, Detroit Free Press
DETROIT — Next time you rent a car, it might be a Kia Optima instead of a Ford or Chevy. For Detroit automakers, that's a good thing.

To buoy the resale value of their cars and trucks, General Motors (GM) and Ford Motor (F) have slashed by 120,000 so far this year the number of vehicles they sell on the fleet market to rental car companies and other businesses.

The move might help vehicles that have reputations as rental specials, such as Ford Taurus and Chevrolet Impala, get back some luster.

[. . .]


Source: USA Today
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MAH4546
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RE: Auto 1 Of Europe” Award To The Ford S-MAX

Thu May 17, 2007 5:04 am

Quoting ABQ747 (Reply 22):

Ford is trying not to sell as many cars to the rental companies so they can keep resale values up. I'm starting to see a lot more import cars now in the rental fleets (Hyundais, Toyotas, Kias). There are still Fords out there, but not as many.

I understand that, I've worked in the auto industry and that is something that Ford, GM, and DaimlerChrysler are trying to fix. However, that doesn't mean much. A ridiculously high number of Ford, GM, and Chrysler products go to rental fleets. The numbers are significantly higher than Honda, Toyota, and Hyundai, but not as much as they used to be. Toyota and Honda still send very, very, very few cars to rental fleets.

Between September 2006 and February 2007, 33.9% of all Ford division vehicles went to fleet sales, compared to 17.2% of Hyundai sales, 9.9% of Toyota sales, and 1.9% of Honda sales. Honda fleet sales are so low, that Bentley sells a larger percentage of vehicles to fleets in the US than Honda.
a.
 
ACDC8
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RE: Auto 1 Of Europe” Award To The Ford S-MAX

Thu May 17, 2007 4:06 pm

Quoting KaiGywer (Reply 24):
GM, Ford cut sales to rental fleets
By Sarah A. Webster, Detroit Free Press
DETROIT --- Next time you rent a car, it might be a Kia Optima instead of a Ford or Chevy. For Detroit automakers, that's a good thing.

To buoy the resale value of their cars and trucks, General Motors (GM) and Ford Motor (F) have slashed by 120,000 so far this year the number of vehicles they sell on the fleet market to rental car companies and other businesses.

The move might help vehicles that have reputations as rental specials, such as Ford Taurus and Chevrolet Impala, get back some luster.

Like I said ...

Quoting ACDC8 (Reply 23):
I don't know about that

 Wink

But what I do know, is that most of the domestic cars in our (read ex-employer's) fleet are all leases on a 1 year term. When they are returned, they have an average of 12,000 - 15,000 kms on them and sell for just a couple of thousand dollars less then a new model. The imports are, for the most part, all bought outright and kept on fleet for 2 - 3 years then sold back to the dealer with an average of 60,000 - 80,000 kms on them.
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