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HAWK21M
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Cricket Thread

Fri Jul 20, 2007 5:23 pm

With India playing England in England.
End of 1st day Eng 268/4.
http://card.cricket.indiatimes.com/default.cms?matchid=420
Looks a flat track.Bad toss to loose by the visitors.
regds
MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)
 
VHVXB
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RE: Cricket Thread

Fri Jul 20, 2007 5:36 pm

Quoting HAWK21M (Thread starter):

on a side note Murali has passed 700 wickets
 
kiwiinoz
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RE: Cricket Thread

Fri Jul 20, 2007 6:27 pm

Sorry....rant

I used to love cricket. If I was driving along and saw a club game, or any game, I couldn't help but pull over and watch for hours. I'd watch any two teams play, anywhere in the world, at any time on TV.

However the World Cup this year was the culmination of years of curruption, scandal, weakness, mis-management, and greed by the governing body of cricket, the ICC. What a bunch of tossers that bunch are. I have not watched a single ball of cricket since, and have no interest at all. I used to hear people moan about them but always believed that the game would be bigger than the dickheads that are charged with running it.

Unfortunately, I now think I was wrong. And believe me, I have no issue with professional sports organisations being bottom line focussed, I am in business after all. But every good business needs to have something other than revenue to define itself.

I hope like hell that the players can form some breakaway league run by people who can allow the game to grow and become great again.
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: Cricket Thread

Sat Jul 21, 2007 6:00 pm

Quoting KiwiinOz (Reply 2):
I hope like hell that the players can form some breakaway league run by people who can allow the game to grow and become great again.

Its happening out here though.
On the topic...Dramatic collapse by England on Day2.
regds
MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)
 
Kieron747
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RE: Cricket Thread

Sat Jul 21, 2007 9:15 pm

Great game, do you play yourself Mel?

My starring moment was playing for the B-team for Onneley, Staffordshire, England. I was the last man, and I didn't get out.. And was bowled on the last bloody ball of the innings!

Kieron747
Airliners.Net - The Jam Rag Of The Web.
 
VHVXB
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RE: Cricket Thread

Sat Jul 21, 2007 10:17 pm

Quoting HAWK21M (Reply 3):

The sub-continent is riddle with corruption I don't see it getting too far
 
bill142
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RE: Cricket Thread

Sat Jul 21, 2007 11:08 pm

Quoting KiwiinOz (Reply 2):
I hope like hell that the players can form some breakaway league run by people who can allow the game to grow and become great again.

India controls the ICC basically. It's a fragile peace. If India pulls out of it the game will go awry basically.
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: Cricket Thread

Sun Jul 22, 2007 12:16 am

Quoting Kieron747 (Reply 4):
Great game, do you play yourself Mel

I used to play during School & College days.Bowling Fast opening & Four down Right handed batting.Was a good fielder too.
Pity.Those were the younger days  Smile

Quoting VHVXB (Reply 5):
The sub-continent is riddle with corruption I don't see it getting too far

Theres already opposition from the BCCI.
regds
MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)
 
EK20
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RE: Cricket Thread

Sun Jul 22, 2007 3:02 am

7pm and England are still batting. The weather looks better than it does here!
 
BradWray
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RE: Cricket Thread

Sun Jul 22, 2007 10:53 am

Quoting EK20 (Reply 8):
7pm and England are still batting. The weather looks better than it does here!

England home games are always boring because of the amount of rain and overcast conditions we get! We should replace Lords with the 02 Dome (Millenium dome) so that rain is never a problem!

Bradley!
Hamilton: English for 'Alonso's bitch' :D
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: Cricket Thread

Sun Jul 22, 2007 12:01 pm

Quoting EK20 (Reply 8):

I remember my last vist to LHR for training purposes in June 2006.Sunrise was at 0500hrs & sunset after 2100hrs.Good for sightseeing even after 8 hrs in training  Smile
regds
MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)
 
David_itl
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RE: Cricket Thread

Mon Jul 23, 2007 7:19 am

Should be a good day tomorrow (if the weather holds). India 137-3 needing another 260odd to win tomorrow.

Anyway, story of the day is Ottis Gibson taking 10-47 for Durham today against Hampshire. Bowled unchanged throughout Hampshire's innings. One curious thing though - Michael Brown carried his bat for Hampshire - has this occurred before when a bowler has taken all 10?
 
Banco
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RE: Cricket Thread

Mon Jul 23, 2007 5:43 pm

Quoting BradWray (Reply 9):
England home games are always boring because of the amount of rain and overcast conditions we get!

What nonsense! The variety of conditions is what makes it interesting! At least it's a genuine balance between bat and ball. Overcast means it swings, and how many tests are completely ruined by rain? Not that many, and I wouldn't think any more than anywhere else either.

This test is a weird one, because with the two bowling attacks on display (England's is effectively the 2nd XI + Panesar, with not one of the first choice seamers available) you'd have expected the bat to dominate. But the increasingly awesome Pietersen apart, no-one has.
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HAWK21M
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RE: Cricket Thread

Mon Jul 23, 2007 11:26 pm

Looks like Eng heading for a win.
Surprisingly how the Indian team has slipped down from their Winning ways since Greg chappell took over as coach & when he left they still have not reached the old position.Its as if most are struggling.
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MEL
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gkirk
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RE: Cricket Thread

Mon Jul 23, 2007 11:29 pm

Cricket?

The message you were about to post is too short and probably not of any higher value to the topic at hand. You should think long and hard before posting a message in this forum and make it detailed and a valuable addition to the topic discussed.
 bored   snooty   thumbsdown   thumbsdown   talktothehand   yawn 
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dc9northwest
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RE: Cricket Thread

Tue Jul 24, 2007 1:17 am

Big version: Width: 150 Height: 113 File size: 2kb
Cricket


Cricket!!!

Too short a message... No relevance...
 
Banco
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RE: Cricket Thread

Tue Jul 24, 2007 1:45 am

Quoting HAWK21M (Reply 13):
Looks like Eng heading for a win.

Nah. One wicket needed and so naturally it pisses down.
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David_itl
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RE: Cricket Thread

Tue Jul 24, 2007 2:40 am

And abandoned, with the Indians celebrating in the dressing room as if it's a win for them.
 
BarfBag
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RE: Cricket Thread

Tue Jul 24, 2007 2:47 am

Quoting VHVXB (Reply 5):
The sub-continent is riddle with corruption I don't see it getting too far

Oh yes, the corruption in the ICC is merely the result of the subcontinent  Yeah sure All the travails that the last World Cup, incidently held on the other side of the bloody planet, are because of India and co, never mind the fact that we made an early exit. The fact that Malcolm Speed and co are a bunch of incompetent morons who made an utter sham of the spectacle final, among several other things, has nothing to do with it, of course. It's amazing the extent to which some people go with blame.

Money corrupts. The ICC wants to commercialize the game, and India is the commercial heavyweight of the cricketing world, generating revenue far in excess of anything the ICC ever dealt with before. The ICC will not get the monetary benefits unless it cedes control of the organization to a subcontinent-heavy authority. For decades, nations like India put up with ridiculous treatment from the Aus-Eng dominated ICC, which effectively ensured that their domestic seasons and Ashes events were not to be affected by series with other nations. In addition, touring subcontinental and Caribbean teams faced the sort of treatment the likes of Australia never did nor would have.

PS: I love the rain in England in summer  Smile
 
Banco
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RE: Cricket Thread

Tue Jul 24, 2007 3:09 am

Quoting BarfBag (Reply 18):
For decades, nations like India put up with ridiculous treatment from the Aus-Eng dominated ICC,

Very true.

Quoting BarfBag (Reply 18):
Malcolm Speed and co are a bunch of incompetent morons who made an utter sham of the spectacle final, among several other things

Also very true.

Yet it doesn't alter the fact of the problems of today ARE rooted to a fair extent in the domination India has, and the fact that the Indian board is more interested in cash and power than anything else. Hence the ludicrous situation with Zimabwe right now.

Quoting BarfBag (Reply 18):
PS: I love the rain in England in summer

It was an Indian fan who pointed out to me (whilst England were completely dominating a Test match) that he wasn't worried because it always rains if England look like they might win a game. I think I've mentioned that to you before. I can't remember the last time we were actually saved by the weather. Even if the forecast is for a monsoon, the coulds seem to mysteriously disappear for long enough for us to lose 9 wickets. But if it's the other way around? Pisses down.  Yeah sure

India a bit lucky with that appeal against Sreesanth from Panesar. Stone dead lbw that one. Makes up for the iffy one Dravid got, I suppose. That's cricket!
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BarfBag
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RE: Cricket Thread

Tue Jul 24, 2007 3:27 am

Quoting Banco (Reply 19):
Yet it doesn't alter the fact of the problems of today ARE rooted to a fair extent in the domination India has, and the fact that the Indian board is more interested in cash and power than anything else. Hence the ludicrous situation with Zimabwe right now.

I don't see the situation as any intrinsic corruptness of either side, but as a power struggle between an older establishment that refuses to cede power, and a new one with enormous pockets, that simply isn't willing to put up with the old nonsense any more. It's true that cricket administration suffers in the process, and I don't really care to justify it as 'that's what you get for mistreating us in the past' etc, but the past has a bearing on the present. The likes of Gavaskar, whose outrage against the MCC is a known anecdote, do have a significant say in how India acts against the ICC, even from within.

India have faced weather issues several times in the past, when close to victory . Besides, it would be churlish to attribute it merely to luck. Dhoni played a courageous innings, and Laxman contributed as well. It was an interesting test alright, though I didn't follow it much at all. As with KiwiInOz, I've progressively lost interest in it over the last few years.
 
Banco
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RE: Cricket Thread

Tue Jul 24, 2007 3:40 am

Quoting BarfBag (Reply 20):
and I don't really care to justify it as 'that's what you get for mistreating us in the past' etc, but the past has a bearing on the present

Exactly. And whilst I wouldn't begin to claim that anyone would else would be better in this regard, it really isn't good enough to invoke, even unconsciously, such a thing. It would have been better for them to set the example of exactly how a mature, rational, sensible board would run things, rather than behaving like spoiled brats who've finally got the house keys. It just doesn't help, and stores up trouble for the future when sufficient numbers are pissed off. Thumbing their noses at England and Australia might be deeply enjoyable in the short-term, but it isn't going to benefit India in the long run either.

Quoting BarfBag (Reply 20):
India have faced weather issues several times in the past, when close to victory .

Oh, I'm sure. It's just that England get shafted by the weather against everyone it seems! I'm not moaning, it's luck of the draw and I'm commenting on it in terms of a sense of amusement, not annoyance, but I honestly can't remember the last time rain saved us, but I can think of loads of times we've been robbed! Maybe that's a reflection on England winning more than they're losing in recent years!

Quoting BarfBag (Reply 20):
Besides, it would be churlish to attribute it merely to luck.

Heavens, no! You should know my cricketing views better than to think I would believe that. Luck goes in all directions, as I was saying. Dhoni did very well indeed, and deserves great credit. Though as an aside, had India lost I suspect a few eyebrows might have been raised about his willingness to take a single off the first ball of the over.

Funny though, isn't it? Given the two batting line ups and bowling attacks, you'd have thought the bat would really dominate this match, yet apart from a disastrous first hour on day one (the difference between the sides?) the bowlers have been wonderful on both sides, and only Pietersen really came to terms with it.
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BarfBag
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RE: Cricket Thread

Tue Jul 24, 2007 4:04 am

Quoting Banco (Reply 21):
It would have been better for them to set the example of exactly how a mature, rational, sensible board would run things, rather than behaving like spoiled brats who've finally got the house keys.

I don't see how they have the house keys. There's still an ongoing power struggle between the old and new establishments, and neither side has distinguished themselves much. It could be equally argued that rather than make an enormous rumpus about ceding power, the Asian bloc simply ought to have been graciously given their due, for they - India specifically - have an enormous part in bankrolling the game. Instead, it's descended into an ugly brawl tinged with racial overtones, that hardly helps general administration, instead spawning farcical WC finals and such patent nonsense as the Afro-Asiatic Cup (or whatever they called it). The issue is far from settled.

I was surprised by the Indian bowling. I really did not expect them to hold England down below 300 in both innings. They may be largely out first attack, but they're still largely ineffectual and/or inexperienced. The test went along expected lines; India are generally slow series starters. I did expect both sides to score more with the bat, particularly England.
 
Banco
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RE: Cricket Thread

Tue Jul 24, 2007 4:17 am

Quoting BarfBag (Reply 22):
There's still an ongoing power struggle between the old and new establishments

Ah, but India are completely dominant. There might be (and are!) disagreements, but Indian money makes India by far the most powerful nation. If you want an example, the Zimbabwe one is apposite. England and Australia want Zimbabwe removed from the Test playing nations because they are so clearly nowhere near the standard. India keep them in, because Zimbabwe will do their bidding entirely precisely because India keep them in! Indian money is something like two thirds of the global total, and the financially weaker nations are petrified of losing it, so India are the power broker. England and Australia are really the only two other nations in a healthy financial position, so naturally they don't follow the Indian line and offer disagreement.

Now, it does have to made clear that as the biggest financial power in the game, India SHOULD be the most powerful nation. So, no complaints at all about it. It's just a pity that all too often this means that the interests of cricket are ignored in the game of politics.

Quoting BarfBag (Reply 22):
tinged with racial overtones

How so? One of the frustrations always is that certain quarters tend to scream racism whenever someone disagrees. That's not usually India, however.

Quoting BarfBag (Reply 22):
I was surprised by the Indian bowling.

Zaheer Khan tends to bowl well in England. It may be that English conditions are those perfect for him. Certainly after his last tour here it was a bit surprising to see him fall away like he did. It could just be that he's ideal for here. Sreesanth looks a good prospect anyway, and I couldn't honestly say I knew much about RP Singh.

Kumble is just a fine cricketer and a gentleman. It's always a pleasure to watch him.
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Banco
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RE: Cricket Thread

Tue Jul 24, 2007 4:19 am

Quoting BarfBag (Reply 22):
and neither side has distinguished themselves much

Damn. Meant to add this bit in the previous post...


Yes, absolutely the case. The truth is they are always out for the cash where they can get it, irrespective of whether it is good for the game or not. A great recent example was the completely pointless Champions Trophy six months before a ludicrously bloated World Cup.
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BarfBag
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RE: Cricket Thread

Tue Jul 24, 2007 4:37 am

Banco: There's a reason why the Zimbabwe issue continues to play out. If it were indeed the case that India were utterly dominant and had no reason to pursue a vindictive stand, there really would be no reason to use them as a pawn in this manner. In reality, that really is not the case. You cannot pretend that the issue has already reached a decisive point when several festering issues remain alive with no real solution in sight. Having the financial power does not automatically translate to the level of desired control, and as long as it does not, there's no question of having the keys. As for the fallout, well, when elephants fight, the grass gets trampled.

I don't know much about SA)">RP Singh either, though I do know of Sreesanth - he's from my hometown, Cochin, and is one of the younger generation of Indians - very brash, in your face and probably a bit hotheaded. He got into a slanging match with Andre Nel - that ah, paragon of modesty himself - during the SA tour earlier this year. Did quite well there. It's interesting how fast the country, and the attitudes are among 2000s generation, has developed. Makes someone like me in his late 20s feel distinctly old.
 
Banco
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RE: Cricket Thread

Tue Jul 24, 2007 6:33 am

Quoting BarfBag (Reply 25):
You cannot pretend that the issue has already reached a decisive point when several festering issues remain alive with no real solution in sight.

No, that's fair comment.

Quoting BarfBag (Reply 25):
probably a bit hotheaded.

Given the hideous swipe he got out to, trying to smack Panesar into Essex, I can well imagine!

Quoting BarfBag (Reply 25):
He got into a slanging match with Andre Nel - that ah, paragon of modesty himself

Ahhhhh. I remember that! Was that him? Fabulous. Can't wait for him to try that with KP, he's not averse to dishing a bit back!
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HAWK21M
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RE: Cricket Thread

Tue Jul 24, 2007 5:35 pm

Quoting David_itl (Reply 17):
And abandoned

Lucky.But the team has to do a lot to pick up their forgotton batting.

Quoting BarfBag (Reply 25):
It's interesting how fast the country, and the attitudes are among 2000s generation

True with the new generaton.
regds
MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: Cricket Thread

Sun Jul 29, 2007 12:07 pm

2nd Day of the 2nd Test & India has a lead.
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MEL
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gkirk
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RE: Cricket Thread

Tue Jul 31, 2007 4:08 am

Damn, some of thon Indian blokes are pricks are they not?
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BarfBag
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RE: Cricket Thread

Wed Aug 01, 2007 1:40 am

As expected, India beat England comfortably in the second test at Trent Bridge, Nottingham, and go up 1-0 in the series.

Quoting Gkirk (Reply 29):
Damn, some of thon Indian blokes are pricks are they not?

What's a Scot doing taking the side of the English ?  Wow!
 
gkirk
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RE: Cricket Thread

Wed Aug 01, 2007 2:29 am

Quoting BarfBag (Reply 30):
What's a Scot doing taking the side of the English ? Wow!

Shocking, but seeing some of the highlights on the news, the behaviour of some of the Indians was appalling!
Still, good to see India hammered England in the second test  bigthumbsup 
When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
 
BarfBag
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RE: Cricket Thread

Wed Aug 01, 2007 2:37 am

Quoting Gkirk (Reply 31):

Shocking, but seeing some of the highlights on the news, the behaviour of some of the Indians was appalling!

Nah, we were no worse than the English were on the field. Both sides played hard. As for the news, it's all a vast English conspiracy to win Scottish hearts and minds through sympathy  Smile
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: Cricket Thread

Wed Aug 01, 2007 7:23 pm

Jelly beans gets the Bowlers going.Next test won't see any thrown on the pitch ever  Smile
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MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)
 
Banco
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RE: Cricket Thread

Sun Aug 05, 2007 6:26 pm

Quoting BarfBag (Reply 32):
Nah, we were no worse than the English were on the field. Both sides played hard.

From what I saw (and I missed most of the test as I was out of the country) both sides did rather more than play hard, both sides crossed the line. The third test will hopefully see an improvement in behaviour.

England probably feel a touch hard done by to come out on the losing side in that match, undoubtedly the toss had a major influence on the outcome. But that's cricket, and the truth is that India took their chance to win when it came along, and England didn't, in that first game.

So off to the Oval, and it should be interesting. England haven't lost at home for six years, so they'll be pretty determined, but India are a good side, and one that might just for once be performing well away from home. Should be intriguing.
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HAWK21M
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RE: Cricket Thread

Sun Aug 05, 2007 7:06 pm

Hows the oval wicket & weather like.
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MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)
 
BarfBag
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RE: Cricket Thread

Mon Aug 06, 2007 3:57 am

Quoting Banco (Reply 34):
but India are a good side, and one that might just for once be performing well away from home.

I don't get the story about India being poor tourists still. We've won more tests abroad than any other nation, bar Australia, since 2000. Except in New Zealand, where we played two tests on scandalously underprepared pitches just prior to World Cup 2003 in South Africa (which we were finalists in), we've won in every single test-playing nation - including in Australia, something hardly anyone can claim in the new millenium. The only downside is our inability to take outright series wins on more than the occasions we did.

We took a series lead in Australia, almost took a series win, and retained the Border-Gavaskar trophy during the away series. Both the 2005 Ashes and the seminal 2000-01 B-G series (esp the extraordinary 'Laxman's Test') were similar comeback wins, but the difference being that in the away series afterwards India were competitive and drew the series, winning in Adelaide and almost doing so in Sydney, while England got demolished 5-0 .

Regarding the Trent Bridge gamesmanship, I'm happy to see the Indians respond the way they did. As has been mentioned, India are rarely into such behavior, but I'm glad they reacted to provocation and hit back effectively.
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: Cricket Thread

Mon Aug 06, 2007 5:15 pm

Amazing recovery though gradual after Chappell quit,hopefully will reach the heights before he joined  Smile
regds
MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)
 
Banco
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RE: Cricket Thread

Mon Aug 06, 2007 7:47 pm

Quoting BarfBag (Reply 36):
The only downside is our inability to take outright series wins on more than the occasions we did.

That's the thing, you see. You didn't even win in the West Indies, and they're bloody awful.

Quoting BarfBag (Reply 36):
Both the 2005 Ashes and the seminal 2000-01 B-G series (esp the extraordinary 'Laxman's Test') were similar comeback wins, but the difference being that in the away series afterwards India were competitive and drew the series, winning in Adelaide and almost doing so in Sydney, while England got demolished 5-0 .

And the fact that the Ashes were five test series. Amazing though the 2000/1 series was, it being just the three tests means that in pure Test cricketing terms, it isn't comparable. As we see with the current series, one test win makes it very, very hard for the other team. Five tests is more of a true battle between sides.

Quoting BarfBag (Reply 36):
Regarding the Trent Bridge gamesmanship, I'm happy to see the Indians respond the way they did. As has been mentioned, India are rarely into such behavior, but I'm glad they reacted to provocation and hit back effectively.

I'm not glad about either of them. I'm not sure that India "responded" as such in the way you put it, that makes it sound like England were the guilty party and India just fired back. Hardly true, both sides behaved poorly. Sree Santh's beamer could have seriously injured Pietersen.
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HAWK21M
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RE: Cricket Thread

Mon Aug 06, 2007 11:31 pm

Except for the Jellybean trick & the Sreesanth Shouldering the English captain.The rest was great.
The beamer was not deliberate.
regds
MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)
 
Banco
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RE: Cricket Thread

Mon Aug 06, 2007 11:40 pm

Quoting HAWK21M (Reply 39):
The beamer was not deliberate.

Mmm. Not convinced about that at all. Even so, I would hastily point out I'm not one of those asking for him to be hanged, drawn and quartered for it.
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HAWK21M
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RE: Cricket Thread

Tue Aug 07, 2007 12:34 am

Quoting Banco (Reply 40):
Mmm. Not convinced about that at all

Your opinion.There was a quick apology too.
Thats something only the Bowler would know.
regds
MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)
 
BarfBag
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RE: Cricket Thread

Tue Aug 07, 2007 12:42 am

Quoting Banco (Reply 38):
That's the thing, you see. You didn't even win in the West Indies, and they're bloody awful.

You've got your facts wrong. We did.

Quoting Banco (Reply 38):
And the fact that the Ashes were five test series. Amazing though the 2000/1 series was, it being just the three tests means that in pure Test cricketing terms, it isn't comparable. As we see with the current series, one test win makes it very, very hard for the other team. Five tests is more of a true battle between sides.

You're merely nitpicking specifics. First you erroneously claimed the lack of a series win. Now you claim only 5 test series matter. You realize that while the India series was a 3er, the Aus series was a 4-test series ? I could argue that England were not faced with a team on par with what India faced in 2001, on a world record breaking run of 16 test wins, not knowing fallibility and failure. Compared to England, we had a relatively ragtag bowling with Harbhajan doing a singlehanded surprise demolition act.

Lets get over such puerile arguments. England did not redeem themselves, either in 5 tests or three, when defending their Ashes. What's the point in expounding about a 5 test series when you were demolished within 3 ? The Poms didn't even put up a fight. Next thing you know, you'll claim the Aussies really didn't care much about the India series, and despite the painful loss to India, and Steve Waugh's personal animosity with Sourav, it wasn't much of a contest.  Yeah sure

Quoting Banco (Reply 38):
I'm not sure that India "responded" as such in the way you put it, that makes it sound like England were the guilty party and India just fired back. Hardly true, both sides behaved poorly. Sree Santh's beamer could have seriously injured Pietersen.

Gamesmanship has a very thin line. The jellybeans could be termed ball/pitch tampering, which could have caused serious injury to an Indian batsman. It absolutely is the case that England were the prime perpetrators. Exactly how many India-England tests, or even generally India tests, are characterized by loutish behavior from India of the kind England demonstrated ?
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: Cricket Thread

Tue Aug 07, 2007 12:48 am

Quoting BarfBag (Reply 42):
I could argue that England were not faced with a team on par with what India faced in 2001, on a world record breaking run of 16 test wins, not knowing fallibility and failure.

I remember that comeback.Aus made it 17 in a row after winning the 1st test & almost made it 18,when the Fightback began & the run was stopped & Aus lost two consecutive tests thereafter.
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MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)
 
Banco
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RE: Cricket Thread

Tue Aug 07, 2007 1:34 am

Quoting BarfBag (Reply 42):
You've got your facts wrong. We did.

Oh? OK. What am I thinking of, then?  Confused

Quoting BarfBag (Reply 42):
You're merely nitpicking specifics. First you erroneously claimed the lack of a series win. Now you claim only 5 test series matter. You realize that while the India series was a 3er, the Aus series was a 4-test series ? I could argue that England were not faced with a team on par with what India faced in 2001, on a world record breaking run of 16 test wins, not knowing fallibility and failure. Compared to England, we had a relatively ragtag bowling with Harbhajan doing a singlehanded surprise demolition act.

Lets get over such puerile arguments. England did not redeem themselves, either in 5 tests or three, when defending their Ashes. What's the point in expounding about a 5 test series when you were demolished within 3 ? The Poms didn't even put up a fight. Next thing you know, you'll claim the Aussies really didn't care much about the India series, and despite the painful loss to India, and Steve Waugh's personal animosity with Sourav, it wasn't much of a contest.

That all seems unnecessarily aggressive.

We can agree or otherwise without such things, you know.

Anyway, it isn't nitpicking specifics. A truly great Test series really does need to be longer than three. I'll more than happily concede that the four Test series in Australia is rather more like it. Pity there couldn't have just been one more - especially given the score after four. Quite why you feel the desperare need to drag up the last Ashes I really don't know. Yes, England got thumped. And? It doesn't invalidate the previous series.

You seem to be under the impression that I'm somehow belittling what India achieved on those tours, and I'm not at all. But those tours notwithstanding, it is certainly true that India have struggled away from home - particularly so given their extremely powerful home record.

Quoting BarfBag (Reply 42):
It absolutely is the case that England were the prime perpetrators. Exactly how many India-England tests, or even generally India tests, are characterized by loutish behavior from India of the kind England demonstrated ?

Ah, OK. It's all England's fault. Right. At least I now know where you're coming from.  Yeah sure
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BarfBag
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RE: Cricket Thread

Tue Aug 07, 2007 2:52 am

Quoting Banco (Reply 44):
Oh? OK. What am I thinking of, then?

We haven't lost in the Caribbean since the mid 90s. We since drew and later won series' there.

Quoting Banco (Reply 44):
Quite why you feel the desperare need to drag up the last Ashes I really don't know.

For the same reason that you mindlessly go on about 5 test series being the real thing. How many of the Ashes series in the last 2 decades were worth the 5-6 tests they ran into ? The average cricket fan would have enjoyed the 2000s Border-Gavaskar series far more despite their 3-4 test length, except for the 2005 Ashes. The quality of the contest matters more than the number of matches.

Quoting Banco (Reply 44):

You seem to be under the impression that I'm somehow belittling what India achieved on those tours, and I'm not at all. But those tours notwithstanding, it is certainly true that India have struggled away from home - particularly so given their extremely powerful home record.

Banco, you've been repeatedly stating things you cannot back up. Since the start of the millennium, after the Cronje/Azhar saga and the associated tumult, we have won more tests abroad than at home. Why does 16 wins abroad and 14 wins at home translate to 'powerful home record' and 'struggled away from home' ? We have won MORE tests abroad than England during that time, and in fact more than every other test playing nation, bar Australia. We've won as many tests abroad during the 7 year period as during the previous 60 odd years, when we certainly were erratic travelers. We've beaten you at home, yet you have not beaten us in your own home series, either in the past, or in the present series. Your argument is without basis.

Quoting Banco (Reply 44):
Ah, OK. It's all England's fault. Right. At least I now know where you're coming from.

No, and actually, since you've decided to get into such childish nitpicking, here's my resposne - you (England) started it. Fielders and wickies have no particular authority to resort to verbal diarrhea at the batsman. If they do, then the nonstriker ought to be allowed to disturb the bowler in his runup as well. All this stuff about 'it's part of the game' is nonsense. England shouldn't resort to it if it can't take the heat it gets back.

[Edited 2007-08-06 20:03:34]
 
BigTom
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RE: Cricket Thread

Tue Aug 07, 2007 3:56 pm

Quoting BarfBag (Reply 45):
All this stuff about 'it's part of the game' is nonsense. England shouldn't resort to it if it can't take the heat it gets back.

Ah, but then you see it's only part of the game when it is done by England/Oz/NZ etc ... needs to be stamped out if indulged in by Ind/Pak/WI etc.
 
kiwiinoz
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RE: Cricket Thread

Tue Aug 07, 2007 4:46 pm

I think you should all work for the ICC
 
Banco
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RE: Cricket Thread

Tue Aug 07, 2007 4:55 pm

Quoting BarfBag (Reply 45):
For the same reason that you mindlessly go on about 5 test series being the real thing.

They are the real thing. England having four tests against the West Indies and just three against India this summer is crazy, India are a much stronger side. Of course it has to be an even contest for any series, be it three, four or five tests for it to be memorable, but that doesn't alter the point.

Quoting BarfBag (Reply 45):
Since the start of the millennium, after the Cronje/Azhar saga and the associated tumult, we have won more tests abroad than at home.

I've been trying to look up test series, not individual tests. You might find an easier way of representing that that I have been able to. In an honest spirit of enquiry, who were those tests against, because for any team, England or India, you can disregard Bangladesh and Zimbabwe?

Quoting BarfBag (Reply 45):
yet you have not beaten us in your own home series, either in the past, or in the present series.

Haven't said we have. You're being defensive again.

Quoting BarfBag (Reply 45):
England shouldn't resort to it if it can't take the heat it gets back.

What on earth are you on about? My view is that BOTH sides behaved poorly, I'm not on some kind of crusade to criticise India.
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HAWK21M
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RE: Cricket Thread

Tue Aug 07, 2007 5:07 pm

Quoting Banco (Reply 44):
it is certainly true that India have struggled away from home - particularly so given their extremely powerful home record

Not since last 5 years.

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MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)

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