varigb707
Posts: 1236
Joined: Wed May 10, 2006 6:02 am

Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Sun Sep 30, 2007 1:44 pm

I'd appreciate any comments or suggestions. Thank You.
First, I said 'hey' and then I said 'now'. "Hey Now!" - Hank K.
 
Longhornmaniac
Posts: 2958
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2005 2:33 pm

Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Sun Sep 30, 2007 1:46 pm

No!!!!

Not until SP1 comes out.

Cheers,
Cameron
Cheers,
Cameron
 
mham001
Posts: 4179
Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2005 4:52 am

Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Sun Sep 30, 2007 3:32 pm

I just installed Vista in a separate partition on a Thinkpad T30 with 1 gig of ram and can't figure out what all the angst is about. It is working excellent with the included drivers, no conflicts yet and is decidedly faster than XP on the same comp. That said, it isn't offering me anything I really need as this comp won't handle the graphic upgrades.
 
md90fan
Posts: 2798
Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2005 11:15 am

Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Sun Sep 30, 2007 5:06 pm

Just brought a new computer that came with Windows Vista, sure is a noticeable improvement over 'XP.

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d136/dev323/blog%20material/PictureorVideo021.jpg
http://www.devanwells.blogspot.com/
 
FlyKev
Crew
Posts: 1295
Joined: Mon Jan 16, 2006 5:34 am

Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Sun Sep 30, 2007 6:33 pm

Yes.
But why?
Its a lot easier to use, it runs a lot smoother and it is a lot safer.
People will knock Vista fast, saying "It doesnt run xxxxx", well, I adopted Vista 5 days before its official launch and it worked with all but one of my games then. I now have both Home Premium and Ultimate editions now, and they both seem great.
The most important thing however is to consider your current hardware.
You'll need at least 1GB of ram (more is better, 2GB runs best)
A good processor, such as a Pentium 4 (3ghz +), or an AMD athlon 64 3400+
A decent graphics card (nvidia 6 series, or ati X1500 or higher)
Make sure you have the above specs. and you are willing to spend a small amount of time refamilirising yourself with the new layout, and you will be fine.
Feel free to PM me if you do want more information, Im happy to help.

Kev.
The white zone is for immediate loading and unloading of passengers only
 
Klaus
Posts: 20578
Joined: Wed Jul 11, 2001 7:41 am

Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Sun Sep 30, 2007 7:24 pm

If you've got a relatively new up-to-date gaming PC and playing the newest games is a priority for you, Vista will be required for a growing number of them.

If your PC is somewhat long in the tooth already and is to be replaced in the foreseeable future, it looks a bit differently.

In that case a Mac or MacBook can be the better option for you. It all depends on what you're using the computer for, but there are relatively few uses where PCs are actually the better choice nowadays.

From experience, people have very little difficulty getting used to MacOS X and the only remorse is usually that they didn't do it earlier. Apple hardware is generally solidly designed and built and well-equipped, but it really shines through the operating systems and the applications.

Current Macs can run Windows XP or Vista as well, so you can move your existing setup over without having to switch it all over to the respective Mac equivalents all in one go. There are even utilities that let you move your exact system setup into a virtual environment on the Mac without even having to re-install everything.

One thing that anybody under Windows should be aware of is that the move to Vista will not be the last painful transition: Vista is still split into separate and widely incompatible versions for 32 bit and 64 bit - they will ultimately abandon the 32 bit version which is still largely compatible with XP and force users to make that cut again.

By contrast, Apple is right now introducing the new MacOS X 10.5 Leopard - which comes in just one full-featured version (no crippled low-grade versions available) which is already 64 bit but still supports the existing 32 bit infrastructure, drivers and applications alike.

Especially compared with the still-looming Windows transition with its painful incompatibilities and driver issues it will be low-impact and rather painless while still providing the full capabilities of 64 bit (even the soon superseded MacOS X 10.4 Tiger is already 64 bit on the lower levels).

It's of course entirely up to you, but most people who really know both systems well usually go for a Mac when they have a choice, which should at least make you a little curious to have a good look and then decide well-informed.
 
ZakHH
Posts: 1570
Joined: Fri Jul 08, 2005 11:32 pm

Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Sun Sep 30, 2007 8:38 pm

Quoting VarigB707 (Thread starter):

If you have a stable XP installation, I would keep it. If you would like to try Vista, you can install it on a separate partition / hard drive. That way, you can try Vista, but still have your good XP installation as backup, in case something won't work under Vista, or you don't like it.

I have just gotten a new PC (Core 2 Duo E6750, ASUS P5K-E board, 2 GB DDR2-800 RAM), and installed XP first. I will get Vista in a few days and install it as second OS.

I guess most drivers will work fine under Vista, and most known security issues have been patched. (Not that I wouldn't bet my ass that there are thousands yet to be discovered, at least we speak about a Microsoft product Big grin ).

And I would not say that you definitely have to wait for SP1. Usually, most patches and fixes included in a service pack have been issued as single updates before already. So if you keep your Windows updated on a regular basis (which is heavily recommended), service packs are not that important. They come handy when you freshly install the OS later on. Then you have to install only 1 service pack, instead of 999 single updates.
Tired of a.net? Join a friendly aviation community!
 
aero145
Posts: 2867
Joined: Tue Jan 04, 2005 4:59 am

Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Sun Sep 30, 2007 8:54 pm

Quoting Klaus (Reply 5):

Lol Klaus. I'm a happy Mac user, just like you, but reading all your adverts is funny. No offense, just funny.  Smile
 
Klaus
Posts: 20578
Joined: Wed Jul 11, 2001 7:41 am

Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Sun Sep 30, 2007 9:13 pm

Quoting Aero145 (Reply 7):
I'm a happy Mac user, just like you, but reading all your adverts is funny. No offense, just funny.

Supporting users becomes a habit after a while.

It's simply information. Most Windows users stick with it mainly because they think they didn't have another choice. Which is sad - and fortunately not true.
 
N231YE
Posts: 2620
Joined: Tue Jul 25, 2006 9:24 am

Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Sun Sep 30, 2007 11:12 pm

Speaking of Vista SP1...I have read that it is due sometime here shortly (autumn of 2007). Not sure how true it is, or if it has been postponed...
 
cwapilot
Posts: 1085
Joined: Mon May 01, 2000 7:10 am

Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Sun Sep 30, 2007 11:44 pm

I just don't understand the "problems" people have with PCs. I, for one, have never had any. One Compaq laptop, one Dell notebook and 2 Dell desktops later, and nothing. What I find is that people screw things up to the degree that they can't fix them, and allow a salesman at Best Buy to convince them that buying the newest $350 wonder is more of a benefit than having someone repair their PC. The $350 special, I think, is the key. With Macs, you don't have the option of buying anything BUT a $2000 premium system. That same $2000 can go a bit further with PC equipment of the same quality.

Macs are idiot-proofed out of the box. I idiot-proofed my friend's PC by allowing him to use the computer only in "user" mode, so that nothing he could do would mess up the system. He hasn't had a hiccup in 2 years, and I saved him a $2000 to $3000 trip to the Mac store.

Macs now use the same processors as PCs, and the interface differences between Vista and the Mac OS aren't that overwhelming. The fact is, you still have to run Windows on the Mac to be able to run all of the PC applications you want to run. Why spend the extra cash? I don't try to act as the anti-Klaus and propogandize people away from Macs, as he does with PCs, but I just like to move people past what really sells Macs: the hype, the cool looks and the smug "i'm smarter than you because I have a Mac" mentality. Do any of those things make your computer work better?

It all boils down to personal preference. If you wonder why your $2000 Mac works so much better than the $350 HP Best Buy special, then you need your head examined. That Mac sure as hell better work better than that POS, just like the $2000 PC will also work much better than the POS. The difference is, if the $350 POS is all you need, and you don't try to take it beyond its capabilities (I don't know how many people I've seen angry that their Celeron can't run Flight Sim) you have that option with a PC, not a Mac.

As far as security...keep your copy of Windows updated! It practically does it on its own anyhow. There are also many freeware firewalls and antivirus programs out there that are just as good or better than the expensive stuff. Also, as Macs become more widespread, so too does the interest hackers take in creating viruses for them.

To your question: to upgrade or not to upgrade? Well, don't upgrade. Buy a full copy, back up your files and do a clean install. Something almost always goes wrong on an upgrade...something that is a true problem with Windows. Secondly, if your PC runs XP efficiently, and you do not significantly exceed Vista's minimum requirements, keep XP. By the time XP is no longer supported, you will have a new PC anyway. Most of the games that will require Vista (which probably means DirectX 10) will also require an expensive new graphics card and much more memory, which your current system may or may not be able to accommodate.
Southside Irish...our two teams are the White Sox and whoever plays the Cubs!
 
itsjustme
Posts: 2727
Joined: Sun Apr 25, 2004 6:58 pm

Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Mon Oct 01, 2007 12:32 am

Quoting Klaus (Reply 5):
In that case a Mac or MacBook can be the better option for you.

As usual, we have to hear from Klaus as to why he thinks a Mac is superior to a PC. Klaus, his question was should he upgrade to Vista from XP not should he change from PC to Mac. Take your hijack attempts elsewhere.

As to your question, it appears that Microsoft themselves are acknowledging their customer's unwillingness to make the Vista jump. Check out this article: http://www.pcworld.com/article/id,137826-c,xp/article.html

[Edited 2007-09-30 17:42:02]
 
aloges
Posts: 14842
Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2006 3:38 am

Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Mon Oct 01, 2007 12:55 am

Quoting Cwapilot (Reply 10):
With Macs, you don't have the option of buying anything BUT a $2000 premium system.

Before I read on: that is simply not true. The Mac mini starts at $599 (plus taxes, presumably) in the US.
Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.
 
cwapilot
Posts: 1085
Joined: Mon May 01, 2000 7:10 am

Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Mon Oct 01, 2007 1:18 am

$600, no display, no keyboard and mouse...$1300 with those luxury items, and without adding on any of their limited upgrade possibilities like additional memory or HD space, or any of the Mac applications that are supposed to be the main attraction. But, really neat looking.
Southside Irish...our two teams are the White Sox and whoever plays the Cubs!
 
aloges
Posts: 14842
Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2006 3:38 am

Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Mon Oct 01, 2007 1:29 am

Quoting Cwapilot (Reply 13):
$600, no display, no keyboard and mouse...

Which the §350 special usually doesn't have either...

Quoting Cwapilot (Reply 13):
$1300 with those luxury items

...and its buyer would certainly not spend $700 on a display, mouse and keyboard. They'd go for cheap there, too, choosing something else than the Apple items.

Quoting Cwapilot (Reply 13):
without adding on any of their limited upgrade possibilities like additional memory or HD space

Again, which $350 PC buyer would care about those? Please don't compare apples to oranges (yes, I know, terrible pun).

Quoting Cwapilot (Reply 13):
or any of the Mac applications that are supposed to be the main attraction

iLife is included. That right there is the ace up the sleeve and would cost serious money in separate purchases for a PC.

Quoting Cwapilot (Reply 13):
But, really neat looking.

And ergonomic and actually supported by the company selling it and...
Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.
 
GQfluffy
Posts: 3072
Joined: Tue Apr 19, 2005 1:25 pm

Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Mon Oct 01, 2007 1:38 am

Quoting FlyKev (Reply 4):
Its a lot easier to use, it runs a lot smoother and it is a lot safer.

 no  Maybe for someone who's never touched a machine with 95/98/XP, but for someone who's dealt with all systems, albeit I was a bit young with 95, XP is much more user-friendly then Vista. I've had both XP and Vista installed on my machine (Dual Core Duo 2.93 Ghz X6800, 4 GB RAM, 512 MB X1900 Crossfire Vid Card), and I've never had so many issues with an operating system. To me, Vista made 98 look stable as all hell. I'll be forced to use Vista in a few years kicking and screaming, but for now, XP is here to stay.

Quoting FlyKev (Reply 4):
I adopted Vista 5 days before its official launch and it worked with all but one of my games then.

That's great and all that it works with your games, but some of us use much more then just games. Vista just now works with AutoCAD '08. Any other AutoCAD program before '08 came out doesn't do squat on a Vista machine. There a quite a few programs I have on my machine that I use for both school and work everyday that won't work with a Vista operating system. It's not as backward friendly as people say it is...

If you're new to computers, or not that hardcore into diving in and customizing the crap out of an operating system, fine, go with Vista.... If not, then stay the hell away for as long as you can.
This isn't where I parked my car...
 
cwapilot
Posts: 1085
Joined: Mon May 01, 2000 7:10 am

Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Mon Oct 01, 2007 1:38 am

Nitpick all you want...the point is, it's a $1300 system. It should be expected to perform better than the $350 wonder which does, in most cases anymore, come bundled with a keyboard, mouse and display. The average $350 user is not going to go elsewhere to get the display and keyboard anymore than they are going to choose upgrades...if the mac experience is what it is supposed to be, they will go to the mac store and leave with everything they need, ready to go right out of the box. That would, therefore, include the display. Plus, if you go without the items mentioned, it's still $600, and $600 systems do come with those items, notwithstanding the cheaper ones.

It may be a perfectly good system, that's not what I'm arguing. It is a system that should be expected to perform better than the base PC.
Southside Irish...our two teams are the White Sox and whoever plays the Cubs!
 
aloges
Posts: 14842
Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2006 3:38 am

Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Mon Oct 01, 2007 1:54 am

Quoting Cwapilot (Reply 16):
Nitpick all you want.

Nitpick? Pointing out that the $600 20" "Apple Cinema Display" isn't necessary and far from the only option is now nitpicking?!

Quoting Cwapilot (Reply 16):
the point is, it's a $1300 system.

It is not. It's perfectly simple, if you want to ignore it, that's your choice.

Quoting Cwapilot (Reply 16):
It should be expected to perform better than the $350 wonder which does, in most cases anymore, come bundled with a keyboard, mouse and display.

Keyboard and mouse, yes, but not a display. I did a bit of surfing at bestbuy.com, nothing suggests their cheapest systems come with displays. But even so, yes, a $600 Mac should of course be expected to perform better than a $350 PC - also when running Windows.

Quoting Cwapilot (Reply 16):
The average $350 user is not going to go elsewhere to get the display and keyboard

But what suggests they'll buy a new display, keyboard and mouse when their old ones still do the job well enough for their needs and wishes? All anyone needs for that are video and perhaps PS/2 to USB adapters.

Quoting Cwapilot (Reply 16):
It may be a perfectly good system, that's not what I'm arguing. It is a system that should be expected to perform better than the base PC.

Indeed - my point is that your claim:

Quoting Cwapilot (Reply 10):
With Macs, you don't have the option of buying anything BUT a $2000 premium system.

was incorrect. I certainly am not a Mac worshipper, even thought the things do impress me each and every time I use them, I just don't like unfair comparisons.
Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.
 
jrowson
Posts: 323
Joined: Sat May 29, 2004 7:18 am

Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Mon Oct 01, 2007 2:07 am

I'm not upgrading to Vista yet...why?...simply because I don't need it. XP does and runs everything that I do in a stable manner. Crashes have been extremely rare under XP, so it ain't broke, so i'm not going to meddle with it.
Vista just plain annoyed me at work yesterday. I wanted to print something off the net onto a Xerox all in one which is 3 months old. Plugged it in and the laptop then spent ages trying to install the drivers only to tell me that they are not compatible, at which point the internet decided to fail so i couldn't go online. It's also very slow on the basic laptop i was using. You certainly need something with a decent turn of speed.
James Rowson. Canonite and lover of all things L. JAR Photography.
 
cwapilot
Posts: 1085
Joined: Mon May 01, 2000 7:10 am

Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Mon Oct 01, 2007 2:49 am

Best Buy routinely has sub-$500 system bundles that include displays. Maybe not this week, but they regularly do. I was in a store yesterday, and they had a display with 3 such systems as an in-store special. Last week or the week before they actually had a $350 bundle, after rebates, that also had a printer. That machine can't be anywhere near the quality of the $600 Mac. But, I'll bet if your only purpose is to web surf and email, it is perfectly adequate. The problem is, some genius will buy it and try to run high end software on it.

The point is, people that complain about PCs are usually those who buy the cheapest things they can find, try to run them beyond their capabilities, and a Mac is pushed at them as the solution. So, the unfair comparison are these higher priced Mac systems containing premium components versus run of the mill, bargain basement PCs, when they could get a similarly or better equipped premium PC for the money they would spend on a Mac. It's not better just because it's a Mac...it's better that what they had because it would be an upgrade over what they already had whether a Mac or a PC.

Apple marketing, throught their gimmicks, unique packaging and the propogation of the myth that using their product is "smarter", is able to convince people to fork over the extra money. Marketing, however, doesn't give you a better product. Credit them...it's good business.

My point...if Apple built a discount Mac and only had available components that would fit that price range, people would have the same sort of issues. There are also more configuration options on PCs, which are routinely mismatched, even by the retail stores selling them. That's why I nevery buy out-of-the-box PCs. If more components were compatible with Macs, there would be those issues too. What I tire of are the blanket, categorical statements like "It's a Mac, so it works," as if PCs don't, or your own, "And ergonomic and actually supported by the company selling it..." PCs come in many different configs and from many different companies, with varying degrees of tech support. You get what you pay for, and if you pay as much as you have to for a Mac, you sure as hell BETTER get better than some cheapo, off the shelf system that's not even meant for what you want to do.
Southside Irish...our two teams are the White Sox and whoever plays the Cubs!
 
bagpiper
Posts: 1050
Joined: Mon Nov 13, 2006 11:24 pm

Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Mon Oct 01, 2007 3:17 am

ok, really, guys, he asked a simple question:

Should I upgrade from Windows XP to Windows Vista?

He did not ask whether to get a Mac or not. Yes, we know Mac's are the world's greatest thing ever - they can do everything windows can, and more, and can even run the very windows that you guys slander. Why does every computer thread have to get so far off track? It gets old. And don't give me the BS about how you're just "informing the world". If they read Non-Av often, they sure as hell know about Macs. For me, to the point that Mac fanboys actually are keeping me from buying a Mac. You remind me of the christians that tell people "You're going to hell if you don't become a Christian" right when they first see them. /rant

In response to the question:

I was running XP on an old laptop for a long time. I finally bit the bullet and built a new computer. Specs:

Gigabyte 690G motherboard (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128056)
AMD Athlon 64 X2 4400+
1GB 677mhz RAM
160GB IDE 7200RPM drive for Vista OS
80GB SATA 7200RPM drive for storage
DVD-ROM
DVD-/+RW with LightScribe (lightscribe is freaking amazing)
ATI Radeon X1650 pro

Runs Vista like a charm. 1 gig of ram is fine, but I'm thinking about upping it to 2 gig. Also, the integrated graphics on the moboard run Aero just fine, but I have a real video card, too.

Everything I use runs fine. Adobe CS3 (dreamweaver, photoshop, acrobat, flash, fireworks) all work fine. iTunes, Open Office, Avast anti-virus, everything works fine.

I love the new look and feel. It seems so light and airy. The new sounds are cool - instead of the "clunk" sounding XP sounds, Vista has a nicer chime to it.

Sidebar is cool, but I turned it off.

Things seem more organized. I use the integrated search allll the time. Icons stay arranged on the desktop how you want them (biggest pet peeve of mine with XP). Everything works so much better, and actually runs faster than XP did on the same machine.

A few things to note: Turn off UAC (User Account Control) - it pops up messages every time you want to run something, asking if you really want to run it.

Ignore Media Center. It sucks.

Do a full, fresh install, not an upgrade from XP. Also, reformat the disk before installing. (BTW - Vista installed in 10 minutes flat on my computer).

Vista runs just as fast with Aero on or off. (http://www.firingsquad.com/hardware/windows_vista_aero_glass_performance/)

AMD has confirmed this, too. Just as long as you have a halfway decent video card (or a high end integrated one), you'll be fine.

Lastly, you could wait until SP1 comes out - but why? You'll get the update for free, and everything works fine now. Big deal. I'd say go for it!

Hope that helps!
 
gigneil
Posts: 14133
Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2002 10:25 am

Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Mon Oct 01, 2007 3:21 am

I have had zero issues with Vista. It is a wild improvement over XP in performance and stability, even on an older machine I installed it on.

I find Windows clunky and cumbersome in any event, but Vista is almost usable.

NS
 
tz757300
Posts: 2724
Joined: Mon Aug 08, 2005 6:21 am

Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Mon Oct 01, 2007 3:22 am

I like Vista better than XP. Sure, it takes a while to get used to but once you do you'll like it. I haven't had any problems with it yet and seems to run everything like it should. I do wish I had more RAM (I have 1GB) but it works very well with what I have. Only thing I don't like about it is the slow start-up, so I leave the computer on.
LETS GO MOUNTAINEERS!
 
TUNisia
Posts: 1515
Joined: Thu Aug 19, 2004 3:24 am

Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Mon Oct 01, 2007 3:24 am

Quoting Klaus (Reply 5):
If you've got a relatively new up-to-date gaming PC and playing the newest games is a priority for you, Vista will be required for a growing number of them.

With VISTA you still can't force refresh rates (some of us still use 20"-24"+ flat CRTs for gaming) as you can in XP.

[Edited 2007-09-30 20:25:00]
Someday the sun will shine down on me in some faraway place - Mahalia Jackson
 
bagpiper
Posts: 1050
Joined: Mon Nov 13, 2006 11:24 pm

Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Mon Oct 01, 2007 3:27 am

Quoting TUNisia (Reply 23):
With VISTA you still can't force refresh rates (some of us still use 24"+ flat CRTs) as you can in XP.

check your video card driver control panel. Mine (ATI) lets me adjust refresh rates.

Quoting TZ757300 (Reply 22):
Only thing I don't like about it is the slow start-up, so I leave the computer on.

Slow startup? I turn my computer on, once it goes through BIOS checks, etc, and loads the Vista loader screen, it stays there for *maybe* 4 seconds, then shows login screen. It takes me all of 20 seconds from the time I hit the on button on the computer, to when I can be on A.net front page. (yes, I timed it. I'm that much of a nerd... I know)

Kinda fast, IMO.
 
tz757300
Posts: 2724
Joined: Mon Aug 08, 2005 6:21 am

Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Mon Oct 01, 2007 3:36 am

Quoting Bagpiper (Reply 24):

Slow startup? I turn my computer on, once it goes through BIOS checks, etc, and loads the Vista loader screen, it stays there for *maybe* 4 seconds, then shows login screen. It takes me all of 20 seconds from the time I hit the on button on the computer, to when I can be on A.net front page. (yes, I timed it. I'm that much of a nerd... I know)

Kinda fast, IMO.

Wow, it takes me what seems like eons to for the whole process to finish, like 1-2 min.
LETS GO MOUNTAINEERS!
 
bagpiper
Posts: 1050
Joined: Mon Nov 13, 2006 11:24 pm

Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Mon Oct 01, 2007 3:40 am

eesh! I'm sorry!

Does your hard disk have slow read times or something!?
 
tz757300
Posts: 2724
Joined: Mon Aug 08, 2005 6:21 am

Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Mon Oct 01, 2007 3:43 am

Quoting Bagpiper (Reply 26):

No clue, all I know is that its slow.
LETS GO MOUNTAINEERS!
 
bagpiper
Posts: 1050
Joined: Mon Nov 13, 2006 11:24 pm

Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Mon Oct 01, 2007 3:50 am

Quoting TZ757300 (Reply 27):

well... hmm. I purposely got fast memory, fast FSB on the motherboard, and a good CPU... maybe the combination of those things makes it boot fast.

OEM manufacturers (like Dell, HP, etc) often cheat on FSB speeds, memory speeds, etc. Can't imagine that would make a whole lot of a difference, though.
 
zak
Posts: 1926
Joined: Mon Sep 22, 2003 12:17 pm

Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Mon Oct 01, 2007 3:51 am

just get this here, burn the cd and boot it to test:
http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu
10=2
 
bagpiper
Posts: 1050
Joined: Mon Nov 13, 2006 11:24 pm

Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Mon Oct 01, 2007 4:02 am

Quoting Zak (Reply 29):
just get this here, burn the cd and boot it to test:
http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu

Fedora is waaaaaay better. KDE is much nicer than gnome. But I think thats for a different topic. Notice this is a discussion about XP and Vista  Wink
 
StarAC17
Posts: 3400
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2003 11:54 am

Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Mon Oct 01, 2007 4:23 am

Quoting GQfluffy (Reply 15):
Maybe for someone who's never touched a machine with 95/98/XP, but for someone who's dealt with all systems, albeit I was a bit young with 95, XP is much more user-friendly then Vista. I've had both XP and Vista installed on my machine (Dual Core Duo 2.93 Ghz X6800, 4 GB RAM, 512 MB X1900 Crossfire Vid Card), and I've never had so many issues with an operating system. To me, Vista made 98 look stable as all hell. I'll be forced to use Vista in a few years kicking and screaming, but for now, XP is here to stay.

Thats your experience and I had the opposite one besides a few driver issues but I have the follwing system and my Vista runs faster than XP did by far.

AMD Athlon 64 3000+
1GB Ram
280GB HDD space split between a 160 GB and 120 GB HDD
Nvidia Geforce 6600GT (Runs Aero fine)

The only issue I have had is with the Nvidia drivers is that almost every time the system starts I get this poping up. "Display driver nvlddmkm stopped responding and has successfully recovered" and because of this I use the 100.65 drivers as they don't cause that issue (these drivers gave me one BSOD as well, not a vista problem but a Nvidia driver one). If anyone knows how to fix that let me know please.

Another thing that Microsoft gets a lot of the blame for is that when things don't work a lot of the time its because 3rd party manufacturers make substandard drivers which cause problems as well as 3rd party software leaving the system vulnerable. With a Mac a lot of the software used is also made by Apple and fully compatible and causes less issues. Something in the EU MS gets in trouble for as they can't include Media Player with Windows sold there but Apple can have I-tunes and Quicktime with OSX without any problems.
Engineers Rule The World!!!!!
 
tmatt95
Posts: 476
Joined: Sat Sep 17, 2005 9:31 pm

Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Mon Oct 01, 2007 5:21 am

I think that it XP serves you well, I would not upgrade to Vista. Get as much mileage out of XP as possible and save some money at the same time.  Smile

Quoting Zak (Reply 29):
just get this here, burn the cd and boot it to test:
http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu

I am viewing this forum right now using a Ubuntu laptop I brought from Dell with Ubuntu pre installed. Everything worked from the get go and my parents were amazed at how quickly I was up and running. I am very pleased with Ubuntu and the way Linux runs (practically everything is incredibly easy and for the few things that I have had difficulties with, there is a lot of help on the ubuntu forum (http://ubuntuforums.org/)

Quoting Bagpiper (Reply 30):
Fedora is waaaaaay better. KDE is much nicer than gnome. But I think thats for a different topic. Notice this is a discussion about XP and Vista Wink

The great thing about open source and linux in particular when it comes to operating systems is that when one OS makes an advancement (they do all the time), they all do.
 
sv2008
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Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Mon Oct 01, 2007 5:59 am

Just bought a laptop with Vista and prefer it to XP. I hated XP it was full of anyoing features (like being forced to restart the computer after updates, and auto running flash disks) which Vista mostly fixes.

I wouldn't upgrade, just wait until until you buy a modern PC with it pe installed, but i think Vista is definatley an improvement on XP which was never really good.
 
bagpiper
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Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Mon Oct 01, 2007 6:16 am

Quoting Tmatt95 (Reply 32):

The great thing about open source and linux in particular when it comes to operating systems is that when one OS makes an advancement (they do all the time), they all do.

tell me about it. But still, I prefer Fedora over any other distro I've tried.

Trust me, I've tried a lot. I've got 3 servers I run, two running Fedora (one 6, and one 7), one running Debian. I have a testing server running CentOS (almost like Fedora - also based off RedHat). While I don't claim to know Linux inside and out, I have a good feel for it. IMO, KDE is better than Gnome. Granted, some of the Gnome tools are nice. I know I can put KDE on Ubuntu, but it turns into a POS... which is what Kubuntu is.

Debian is nice... but still, Fedora beats 'em all, IMO.  Wink
 
IFEMaster
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Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Mon Oct 01, 2007 11:16 am

Quoting VarigB707 (Thread starter):
Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVIsta?

Read this and then make your decision:

http://chris.pirillo.com/2007/09/28/vista-rants/

There's not a chance in hell you'd find me using Vista on any of my machines.
Delivering Anecdotes of Dubious Relevance Since 1978
 
TUNisia
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Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Mon Oct 01, 2007 12:23 pm

Quoting Bagpiper (Reply 24):

check your video card driver control panel. Mine (ATI) lets me adjust refresh rates.

NVIDIA here
Someday the sun will shine down on me in some faraway place - Mahalia Jackson
 
bagpiper
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Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Mon Oct 01, 2007 12:50 pm

Quoting TUNisia (Reply 36):
NVIDIA here

My laptop (which was running XP, though) had a control panel that let me adjust the refresh rates. It was running an Nvidia card, and the control panel was the same version that went on Vista, so I'd assume that it would have the same feature in vista, too.

But maybe not...
 
Klaus
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Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Wed Oct 03, 2007 3:41 am

Quoting Cwapilot (Reply 10):
With Macs, you don't have the option of buying anything BUT a $2000 premium system. That same $2000 can go a bit further with PC equipment of the same quality.

Oh, come on. It looks a lot as if you've never bothered to take a closer look over the fence.

And taking a closer look is what it's really about.

Quoting Cwapilot (Reply 10):
Macs are idiot-proofed out of the box.

You can't idiot-proof anything more complex than a slice of bread - and that's probably pushing it already!  silly 

What's true, however, is that Macs are designed top to bottom for ordinary people really being in control of the system they own and use. Some people will always have it easier with that than others, but the consistent experience is that keeping a Mac running is simply not the chore it is with a Windows PC (or with Linux, while we're at it).

Quoting Cwapilot (Reply 10):
Macs now use the same processors as PCs, and the interface differences between Vista and the Mac OS aren't that overwhelming.

The superficial similarities don't tell the whole story by far. The main difference is how the two systems are organized and how they interact with the users. Ask anybody who has some experience with Windows and MacOS and they'll tell you that the superficial varnish is not what makes the real difference.

Quoting Cwapilot (Reply 10):
The fact is, you still have to run Windows on the Mac to be able to run all of the PC applications you want to run. Why spend the extra cash?

Yeah, why indeed? There are native Mac applications for almost every purpose. But if you already have a copy of Windows and if you don't want to switch over all in one go (or if there are other reasons why you occasionally want or need to use a specific Windows application), you can on a Mac. You're just not limited to Windows as you're on a normal PC (Linux is simply not a realistic option for most people).

Quoting Cwapilot (Reply 10):
I don't try to act as the anti-Klaus and propogandize people away from Macs, as he does with PCs, but I just like to move people past what really sells Macs: the hype, the cool looks and the smug "i'm smarter than you because I have a Mac" mentality. Do any of those things make your computer work better?

No. The only reason why there even is a sustained level of hype about Apple is that their products validate it. You're falling for a widespread misconception when you're mistaking the peripheral hype for the significant substance at the core of the Apple phenomenon.

Quoting Cwapilot (Reply 10):
It all boils down to personal preference.

When you really know the alternatives, it does. Otherwise you may just be stuck by default with the only thing you happen to know. At least know what you're deciding against!

Quoting Cwapilot (Reply 10):
If you wonder why your $2000 Mac works so much better than the $350 HP Best Buy special, then you need your head examined.

Aloges has already debunked that myth above.

$2000 already buys you a full-service and high-quality 24" iMac package which you'd find quite difficult to match with a PC that was actually comparable.

If you're looking for the frugal route, you'll go for a Mac mini for $600 and add a low-cost keyboard, mouse and screen. You'd be well below $1000 and yet have a Core 2 Duo CPU, digital video and audio ports (in and out!) and an excellent full-version software package instead of the cheapo crap- and cripple-ware on most PCs tacked on to a crippled OS version even well above that.

You really ought to take a real look instead of just parroting outdated prejudices!

Quoting Cwapilot (Reply 10):
As far as security...keep your copy of Windows updated! It practically does it on its own anyhow. There are also many freeware firewalls and antivirus programs out there that are just as good or better than the expensive stuff. Also, as Macs become more widespread, so too does the interest hackers take in creating viruses for them.

It is very unlikely for many reasons that the Mac will ever reach or exceed Windows in vulnerability. At this point you don't even need an "antivirus" application on a Mac (this may change some day - but six years into MacOS X it hasn't yet). And zero to tens of thousands of active threats (as under Windows) would be a very tall order indeed...

Quoting Cwapilot (Reply 19):
It's not better just because it's a Mac...it's better that what they had because it would be an upgrade over what they already had whether a Mac or a PC.

The primary difference is in the operating system. Apple hardware is designed very well (both technically and aesthetically), but there's a reason why people who know both Windows and Macs overwhelmingly choose the Mac: It's usability. And that's a lot more difficult to achieve than just having colourful windows and using a mouse.

Quoting Cwapilot (Reply 19):
Apple marketing, throught their gimmicks, unique packaging and the propogation of the myth that using their product is "smarter", is able to convince people to fork over the extra money. Marketing, however, doesn't give you a better product. Credit them...it's good business.

They build products which just don't suck (or suck significantly less than the rest). The hype is an inevitable consequence of that - people's own experience and word of mouth can be much more powerful than even the biggest marketing budget could ever hope to be if the products actually deliver.

Quoting Cwapilot (Reply 19):
My point...if Apple built a discount Mac and only had available components that would fit that price range, people would have the same sort of issues.

Nope. They would have some of the same hardware issues but the software advantage would stay. And that's 90% of the difference.

Quoting Cwapilot (Reply 19):
What I tire of are the blanket, categorical statements like "It's a Mac, so it works," as if PCs don't, or your own,

Please just use a Mac for a decent while instead of just talking about it. You'll probably be surprised.

Quoting Cwapilot (Reply 19):
PCs come in many different configs and from many different companies, with varying degrees of tech support.

With the variations usually happening well below Apple's level. Customer satisfaction surveys are quite consistent about that.

Quoting Cwapilot (Reply 19):
You get what you pay for

If only. Even expensive PCs (which can be comparable to Macs in design and build quality) are still saddled with the same old Windows - and usually with a mess of crapware, badly packaged hardware drivers and mutual finger-pointing between the manufacturer, Microsoft and the suppliers of the hardware components and their drivers instead of actually helpful support.

Even when you're using a Mac with Windows, Apple provides a consistent, well-tested and regularly updated driver package with Boot Camp which works with minimal fuss. Some people even went so far as to claim that Macs were the best Windows PCs there are. I'd say that's pushing it, but you get the idea.

Quoting GQfluffy (Reply 15):
I'll be forced to use Vista in a few years kicking and screaming, but for now, XP is here to stay.

I would of course recommend you to consider the alternatives as well, but at least you should skip the current 32 bit intermediate stage of Vista which will later have to be ditched yet again for the 64 bit version which will become the standard then (see my earlier post).

Vista is completely DRM-ified as well - don't expect to be able to install or play back whatever you want under Vista 64. Everything not explicitly approved by Micosoft will be and will remain verboten. Otherwise you can kiss media playback and other uses of the same system goodbye.

Compared to that, MacOS X is decidedly liberal. And 32 + 64 bit out of the box, in just one single version with Leopard.

Quoting Bagpiper (Reply 20):
For me, to the point that Mac fanboys actually are keeping me from buying a Mac. You remind me of the christians that tell people "You're going to hell if you don't become a Christian" right when they first see them.

Rubbish. My advice to people is to check out an alternative. And given the fact that most people's main remorse has turned out to be that they didn't switch over earlier, having a closer look won't do any damage to anybody (except maybe to Steve Ballmer and his office furniture  mischievous  )

Quoting Bagpiper (Reply 20):
ok, really, guys, he asked a simple question:
Should I upgrade from Windows XP to Windows Vista?
He did not ask whether to get a Mac or not.

It's the answer an increasing number of people are giving to exactly that same question. And the vast majority of those who did can't imagine ever going back.

mollie sterling » it does my heart good…
http://duggmirror.com/apple/Look_at_them_apples/9489b70ab55692ffcac3ec776aa50a1f_img_6672s.jpg

Missouri School of Journalism: Student Wireless Laptop Requirements Beginning Fall 2005

[Edited 2007-10-02 21:04:52]
 
Goldenshield
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Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Wed Oct 03, 2007 4:05 am

Klaus-

Using the example of a university that basically forces their students to buy a Mac because of the iLife package is used in some way in every class, and then passing it as "These students were smart to buy a Mac because it's better than a PC" is a poor argument.

Also, saying that a PC is limited to Windows when the Mac can run both OSX and Windows is a farce, because Apple inherently programmed OSX to run only on Apple hardware. Is that fair competition? No, I think not.
Two all beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles, onions on a sesame seed bun.
 
Klaus
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Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Wed Oct 03, 2007 4:20 am

Quoting Goldenshield (Reply 39):
Using the example of a university that basically forces their students to buy a Mac because of the iLife package is used in some way in every class, and then passing it as "These students were smart to buy a Mac because it's better than a PC" is a poor argument.

I didn't. It's just a really nice picture and a symbolic foreshadowing of the rapid expansion of Apple's market share.

And, of course, there are good reasons why the university came to those recommendations:

Missouri School of Journalism: Student Wireless Laptop Requirements Beginning Fall 2005:

Quote:
Q. What brand or model should I buy?
A. The faculty has designated Apple Computer as its preferred provider for two primary reasons: (1) Apple's OS X operating system is based on Unix, which makes these computers far less susceptible to viruses than other computers. Viruses are a serious problem on university campuses. (2) Apple iBook and PowerBook computers come bundled with iLife, a suite of applications ideal for learning the basics of photo editing, and audio and video editing. We'll use those programs in several classes. Incoming students will receive information on recommended models and pricing in February of each year.

Q. What if I prefer a Windows-based machine?
A. That's an option, but it's one we do not recommend unless you plan to make a career of computer-assisted reporting. By the time you purchase photo, audio and video software for a PC, you probably will have spent more than you would if buying a comparable Apple Computer. Buy a PC if you prefer to do so, but make sure it is wireless and has Microsoft Office. Almost 100 percent of last year's freshmen chose Apple computers.

Quoting Goldenshield (Reply 39):
Also, saying that a PC is limited to Windows when the Mac can run both OSX and Windows is a farce, because Apple inherently programmed OSX to run only on Apple hardware. Is that fair competition? No, I think not.

Would you give the big bully who's extorting everyone out of their lunch money an advantage just because he's retarded?   

[Edited 2007-10-02 21:22:20]
 
Goldenshield
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Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Wed Oct 03, 2007 6:26 am

Quoting Klaus (Reply 40):
Would you give the big bully who's extorting everyone out of their lunch money an advantage just because he's retarded?

And now calling names? I have respect for you because you don't go to low blows, but then you do this, Klaus.
Two all beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles, onions on a sesame seed bun.
 
Klaus
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RE: Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Wed Oct 03, 2007 6:52 am

Quoting Goldenshield (Reply 41):
And now calling names? I have respect for you because you don't go to low blows, but then you do this, Klaus.

What are you talking about? This was about your claim that Apple was competing "unfairly" against a near-monopoly completely dominating the market for the last two decades.

How can you relate my statement to yourself?  eyebrow 
 
CaptOveur
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RE: Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Wed Oct 03, 2007 7:21 am

Quoting Goldenshield (Reply 39):
Using the example of a university that basically forces their students to buy a Mac because of the iLife package is used in some way in every class, and then passing it as "These students were smart to buy a Mac because it's better than a PC" is a poor argument.

Agreed. University faculty usually lives in a bubble.. A bubble where Apple is a good option, along with a few other fallacies of life.

Quoting Klaus (Reply 40):
And, of course, there are good reasons why the university came to those recommendations:

Actually those are shitty reasons. What do you think is going to be on their desk when they get to a job with a small to mid sized newspaper with a limited budget? Everybody but Klaus guessed it.. A PC.
Things were better when it was two guys in a dorm room.
 
Klaus
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RE: Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Wed Oct 03, 2007 7:35 am

Quoting CaptOveur (Reply 43):
Agreed. University faculty usually lives in a bubble.. A bubble where Apple is a good option, along with a few other fallacies of life.

Yeah - a system that's actually easy to use and efficient in getting things done. Nobody in "real life" would ever want to use something like that...!  silly 

Quoting CaptOveur (Reply 43):
Actually those are shitty reasons. What do you think is going to be on their desk when they get to a job with a small to mid sized newspaper with a limited budget? Everybody but Klaus guessed it.. A PC.

Limited budgets are harder hit by the usually rather high costs of support and reliability issues of Windows systems than by a moderate one-time expense and efficient and reliable operation thereafter. And especially media-related organisations are about the worst examples you could have picked - they're among the ones with the highest percentage of Macs even now, and for good reasons. As exactly the example above illustrates. (Scientific research is another area with a relatively high Mac concentration.)
 
aloges
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RE: Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Wed Oct 03, 2007 7:46 am

Quoting Goldenshield (Reply 39):
Apple inherently programmed OSX to run only on Apple hardware. Is that fair competition? No, I think not.

First of all, it's Aplle's choice what sort of system they want their OS to run on. Don't like that or Windows, get Linux. What Apple are doing is make sure their OS runs mostly on systems designed for it, reducing a possible gazillion "I can't get my graphics card to work" complaints. Second, is "fair competition" really something that should be said in the same room as "Microsoft"?  Wink

Anyway,

Quoting Klaus (Reply 38):
you should skip the current 32 bit intermediate stage of Vista which will later have to be ditched yet again for the 64 bit version which will become the standard

 checkmark  If the computer allows for it, that's the way to go.
Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.
 
StarAC17
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RE: Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Wed Oct 03, 2007 10:03 am

Quoting Klaus (Reply 38):
Oh, come on. It looks a lot as if you've never bothered to take a closer look over the fence.

And taking a closer look is what it's really about.

I could get a Mac if I wanted to but I have no need for it because I maintain my PC and it never has frozen since I have put Vista on it except for what I mentioned in Reply 31 which wasn't a windows issue. If I can make Windows work and its stable and does what I need it to with no issues, show me a Mac that can run Flight Sim with no loading times and lag at 30 FPS then I would probably but it. (My PC can't do this but when I want a new one it will hopefully do it.)

Quoting Klaus (Reply 38):
It is very unlikely for many reasons that the Mac will ever reach or exceed Windows in vulnerability. At this point you don't even need an "antivirus" application on a Mac (this may change some day - but six years into MacOS X it hasn't yet). And zero to tens of thousands of active threats (as under Windows) would be a very tall order indeed...

When 90% of the market is running Macs including businesses are running them and this stays true then you will be right and not a minute sooner. Its an unfair comparison as hackers have no big incentives to attack macs when they can mess up a Windows system and screw up a lot such as airline check-ins. Windows now has security in place but the hackers will eventually find a way around it, just like people always find a way to beat copyright protections. Can you say that this is 100% the case with a Mac.

I agree with you on one point and that is the fact that PC manufacturers put all this trial crap on their system that you can't get rid of and is never used and causes a lot of problems and this isn't the fault of Microsoft. Apple doesn't do this and therefore off the bat there is less issues with Macs and the reason that I have learned to install Windows Clean with the right drivers and without trail stuff. This is the reason that my PC that was bought custom in June 2005 out performs my mom's laptop that was bought in April.
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Tom12
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RE: Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Wed Oct 03, 2007 10:14 am

I'd have to say yes aswell. It is a lot better by comparison to WinXP.


Tom
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aloges
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RE: Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Wed Oct 03, 2007 11:05 am

Quoting StarAC17 (Reply 46):
hackers have no big incentives to attack macs when they can mess up a Windows system

Can't you imagine how incredibly "cool" and "1337" a successful mass hack of Mac OSs would be?
Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.
 
gigneil
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RE: Should I Upgrade From WinXP To WinVista?

Wed Oct 03, 2007 11:58 am

Quoting Aloges (Reply 45):
First of all, it's Aplle's choice what sort of system they want their OS to run on.

Yes, and that is precisely WHY Mac OS X is vastly superior to Windows. It's a closed ecosystem, it gives Apple ultimate control of the marriage of hardware and software.

Windows can't compete, because they're not playing the same game. Is it fair? No. Does that mean anything? Yes. It means buy a Mac.

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