B747forever
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F1: Off Season Thread

Thu Nov 01, 2007 5:35 pm

Think that it is time to start a new F1 thread. The other one reached about 225posts.


We can have this thread until the 2008 season begins.

Here we can discuss everything about F1, from the 2007season to things that will happen in 2008.

Hope this thread will survive and be good.

Best regards:

B747forever.
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B747forever
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Thu Nov 01, 2007 6:09 pm

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sudden
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Thu Nov 01, 2007 7:32 pm

So what do we know so far!?

We know that the Ferrari line up is done deal for 2008.
The same goes for BMW, and for Mclaren we know that Hamilton is.
Have any other teams actually confirmed their line up yet? It is a bit early, so no rush really.

D.C will probably hang on for 2008 with RBR, although I really dont know what he is doing in F1 anymore. He most have a rock solid sponsor with lot of cash!

Much depends on what Alonso will do, and many teams are on stand by until they know.
Strange as it is, I can actually see him going to Toyota. They have never really had a driver that came from the top of the grid and had a lot of knowledge, and maybe Alonso is just what they need to be able to show some real pace.
They sure have the financial stability to improve.
Thoughts on that one?


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legoguy
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Thu Nov 01, 2007 7:41 pm

http://en.f1-live.com/f1/en/headlines/news/detail/071101091454.shtml

This article seems to suggest that Ron Dennis will only let Alonso depart from McLaren as long as he joins a team without the backing of a major engine maker. So this would rule out Renault, Ferrari, Honda and Toyota. If this is true, and this is a very big IF, this leaves only Williams or Red Bull.

But to be honest, could Ron Dennis really be this unfair as to only allow him to leave to one of the lessor teams?
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sudden
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Thu Nov 01, 2007 8:02 pm

Quoting Legoguy (Reply 3):
This article seems to suggest that Ron Dennis will only let Alonso depart from McLaren as long as he joins a team without the backing of a major engine maker. So this would rule out Renault, Ferrari, Honda and Toyota. If this is true, and this is a very big IF, this leaves only Williams or Red Bull.

Sounds like bullshit to me. If another team wants him, they can buy him out.
Why even keep a driver that might not even want to be there!? What would his contribution be to the team anyway.


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B747forever
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Thu Nov 01, 2007 8:33 pm

Quoting Sudden (Reply 2):
Thoughts on that one?

I really doubt that Alonso will go for Toyota. More likely to go for Renault.

But if Alonso will get a really high salary from Toyota offered, I think he will go for them.
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tango29
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Thu Nov 01, 2007 8:35 pm

Quoting Sudden (Reply 2):
Strange as it is, I can actually see him going to Toyota. They have never really had a driver that came from the top of the grid and had a lot of knowledge, and maybe Alonso is just what they need to be able to show some real pace.
They sure have the financial stability to improve.

If Alonso has any sense he won't go to Toyota, i would say that by the start 2008 he will be back in
a Renault, but hey its F1 so anything can happen........
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legoguy
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Thu Nov 01, 2007 8:45 pm

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,12433_2836068,00.html

Rumors that Rubens Barichello will be demoted down to Super Auri.

Quoting Sudden (Reply 4):
Sounds like bullshit to me. If another team wants him, they can buy him out.
Why even keep a driver that might not even want to be there!? What would his contribution be to the team anyway.

I'm not quite sure I believe these rumors until Ron Dennis himself says something to the press.
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B747forever
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Thu Nov 01, 2007 8:47 pm

Quoting Legoguy (Reply 7):
Rumors that Rubens Barichello will be demoted down to Super Auri.

Please dont give this driver any more F1 seats. Think is better for Rubens if he just stop to drive in F1,
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kaddyuk
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Thu Nov 01, 2007 10:22 pm

Quoting B747forever (Reply 8):
Think is better for Rubens if he just stop to drive in F1,

Why? Rubens is a quality driver with buckets of experience... He's easily matched if not beaten button this year in a car that has been less than competetive!!
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BlueElephant
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 12:21 am

I was just going to start this thread...Anyway..i'm sure this will only be Part 1 of the Off Season Thread....

I'm starting to think that Alonso might end up staying at McLaren....which would definitely be interesting.

Alonso's Manager has said that Alonso can't be forced to leave...De La Rosa has made suggestions that he does think Alonso's leaving. I don't know if Alonso wants to leave right away...

All in all...I hope it all gets resolved soon because it seems that there's a lot of stuff behind what Alonso does.

I think once that is solved....Everything else will fall into place.

P.S. Does anyone else feel we're going to get at least one Indian Driver at the Spyker team?
 
bill142
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 8:19 am

Quoting Sudden (Reply 2):

D.C will probably hang on for 2008 with RBR, although I really dont know what he is doing in F1 anymore. He most have a rock solid sponsor with lot of cash!

RBR have confirmed their 2008 line up. Renault and Toyota are the only manufacturer teams to hold out on their line ups.

Quoting BlueElephant (Reply 10):
P.S. Does anyone else feel we're going to get at least one Indian Driver at the Spyker team?

Doubt it. The new owner has expressed a desire to have an Indian driver, but not at any cost.

Quoting B747forever (Reply 1):
Little turbulent with the Australian GP:

There has been talk the race will move to Queensland. The consortium interested has expressed a willingness to give Bernie what he wants.

Quoting B747forever (Reply 5):
But if Alonso will get a really high salary from Toyota offered, I think he will go for them.

That depends if your motivation is money, ala Ralf. Toyota need to go have a long hard look at their structure. This is where the Japanese teams are falling over. The guys back in Tokyo aren't giving them the autonomy to go do what they do best. Race cars.
 
Gman94
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 8:37 am

Quoting B747forever (Reply 1):
Little turbulent with the Australian GP:

Bring back Adelaide's street circuit, used to love that Grand Prix.
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B747forever
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 8:49 am

Quoting Kaddyuk (Reply 9):
He's easily matched if not beaten button this year in a car that has been less than competetive!!

Rubens has not beaten Button this year or even matched him. Button finished as 15th this yearn and Rubens as 20th. Button has taken 6pts and Rubens 0pts.
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moo
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 12:41 pm

Alonso has officially left McLaren for the 2008 season, but no announcement has been made regarding which team he will join.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/7074737.stm
 
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 12:55 pm

Quoting Moo (Reply 14):
Alonso has officially left McLaren for the 2008 season, but no announcement has been made regarding which team he will join.

The media here reports that he wants to join a small team to leave a door open for ferrari. If this is true, it would rule out Renault. Austrian Media reports that he expressed interest to join Red Bull.
 
B747forever
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 1:09 pm

Quoting Moo (Reply 14):
Alonso has officially left McLaren for the 2008 season, but no announcement has been made regarding which team he will join.

Here is the links from F1-live:

http://en.f1-live.com/f1/en/headlines/news/detail/071102130518.shtml

http://en.f1-live.com/f1/en/headlines/news/detail/071102131232.shtml
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sudden
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 1:21 pm

Quoting Moo (Reply 14):
Alonso has officially left McLaren for the 2008 season, but no announcement has been made regarding which team he will join.

That's more like it!

Quoting SandroZRH (Reply 15):
The media here reports that he wants to join a small team to leave a door open for ferrari

Very unlikely as Ferrari have 2 solid drivers, where one of them is the champ. So would he then be driving for a small team until their becomes a seat free at Ferrari? Not likely.

Quoting SandroZRH (Reply 15):
Austrian Media reports that he expressed interest to join Red Bull.

Why on earth would he join RBR? He is a champion, not a top midfield driver!

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bill142
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 1:30 pm

How disappointing. I hope McLaren have learnt their lesson regarding their equal status policy. Right now, after this season, I don't know what to feel about the team who I've followed throughout my F1 watching life and whether my support for them can continue.

Quoting SandroZRH (Reply 15):
The media here reports that he wants to join a small team to leave a door open for ferrari. If this is true, it would rule out Renault. Austrian Media reports that he expressed interest to join Red Bull.

Lets be honest, Renault is going to be his best option if he wants to win a championship.
 
B747forever
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 1:34 pm

Quoting Bill142 (Reply 18):
Lets be honest, Renault is going to be his best option if he wants to win a championship.

That is true. He will go for Renault. believe me.

Wonder who McLaren wants now, when Alonso has left the stall.
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sudden
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 1:36 pm

Quoting Bill142 (Reply 18):
How disappointing. I hope McLaren have learnt their lesson regarding their equal status policy

Ron Dennis still has his little boy Hamilton, so the only lesson learned would be to not hire any more champs.


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legoguy
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 1:39 pm

Quoting Bill142 (Reply 18):
How disappointing. I hope McLaren have learnt their lesson regarding their equal status policy.

Well actually, Fernando's own words...

"I know there have been suggestions of favouritism within the team and people say a lot of things in the heat of battle, but in the end I was always provided with an equal opportunity to win."

Whether he is telling the truth or not remains to be seen but no doubt he will lay into McLaren as soon as he joins another team.
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bill142
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 1:46 pm

Quoting Legoguy (Reply 21):
Well actually, Fernando's own words...

Speaking nicely about McLaren for the next 12 months was probably part of the agreement and is fairly standard for early terminations. When Alonso retires and he writes a book the truth about what happened, the spy saga, relationships with Hamilton and Dennis, will come out. These things all ways do, sooner or later.
 
B747forever
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 1:55 pm

Quoting Bill142 (Reply 22):
When Alonso retires and he writes a book the truth about what happened, the spy saga, relationships with Hamilton and Dennis, will come out.

Cant wait until that book comes out.
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emrecan
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 2:05 pm

Great news for Mclaren, Balonso fits well for Renault..
 
B747forever
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 2:18 pm

Quoting Emrecan (Reply 24):
Great news for Mclaren,

Cant say it is so good news for McLaren. Maybe without Alonso in the team Hamilton wont be as good as he was this season.
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emrecan
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 2:26 pm

Quoting B747forever (Reply 25):

Hamilton is the biggest nominee for next year's title. He never had a good relation with Fernando this year. If a good friend of him -like Kubika- will join the team, he will get the title (although I want a Ferrari win).
 
B747forever
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 2:45 pm

Quoting Emrecan (Reply 26):
If a good friend of him -like Kubika- will join the team, he will get the title (although I want a Ferrari win).

Kubica is goin´g to drive for BMW next season. So no Kubica or Heidfeld for McLaren.

Quoting Emrecan (Reply 26):
Hamilton is the biggest nominee for next year's title

How can you says so??? What makes him the biggest nominee for the WDC 2008???
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cornish
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 2:58 pm

Quoting Sudden (Reply 17):
Very unlikely as Ferrari have 2 solid drivers, where one of them is the champ. So would he then be driving for a small team until their becomes a seat free at Ferrari? Not likely.

I'm not convinced about the small team side of things, but at the same time I really can't see the logic in him going to Renault for just one season - for Renault's sake that is.

But I'm afraid that your view regarding Alonso at Ferrari is wide of the mark. Just about every seasoned F1 expert believes that alonso will be alongside Kimi at Ferrari in 2009. nobody thinks that Massa's newly signed contract means much in reality. Ferrari has a major power struggle going on at the moment between De montezemelo (Kimi's backer) and Todt (who Massa is tthe favourite of - remember todt's son is Massa's manager). De montezemelo is certain to win that battle and he has made no secret of his desire to have a Kimi and Alonso team at Ferrari. Kimi won't be bothered by Alonso coming as he doesn't worry about any other driver.

Things could come to a head at Ferrari and Alonso could conceivably end up there next season - but I doubt it as I suspect the McLaren agreement would preclude it.

Red Bull would be agreeable to a one year deal i suspect, as would Williams - with Nico Rosberg going in the opposite direction, as McLaren's preferred replacement - and rightly so.
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waterpolodan
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 3:08 pm

Quoting Cornish (Reply 28):
Just about every seasoned F1 expert believes that alonso will be alongside Kimi at Ferrari in 2009.

We'll see, but I really, really hope you're wrong. If he does end up at Ferrari, I hope Massa gets into another winning car as he's too talented to be pushed to the midfield by Alonso's move.
 
sudden
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 3:30 pm

Quoting B747forever (Reply 27):
Quoting Emrecan (Reply 26):
Hamilton is the biggest nominee for next year's title

How can you says so??? What makes him the biggest nominee for the WDC 2008???

I for one dare to say that Hamilton will not have as great of a season that he just had.

Several reason to why,
Kimi and Ferrari have now been able to set up the car according to Kimi's driving style, so he will be strong from day 1.
Massa will push hard as always.
BMW will be even stronger, I hope, then they were this season.
Alonso will be racing for another team. I want to see Alonso back in the Renault, but we see what will happen.

And most of all,
Hamilton will not have access to any champs telemetry data as he had this season!

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BlueElephant
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 3:30 pm

Well I can't say i'm completely happy that Alonso is leaving McLaren, because above everything else, he is a very good driver.

But I don't think his personality fits the team so well....

I think it might be Kovalainen or Rosberg at the team next year....That would surely be interesting.
 
B747forever
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 3:38 pm

Quoting Waterpolodan (Reply 29):
I hope Massa gets into another winning car as he's too talented to be pushed to the midfield by Alonso's move.

'

If it happens that Massa has to leave Ferrari to give Alonso place, I think he can go for BMW or even McLaren. But I really really hope that Massa and Kimi will drive for Ferrari a long long time ahead.

And if Alonso goes for Ferrari which I really doubt, we can see the same thing that happened between Hamilton/Alonso in Ferrari between Kimi/Alonso.

I think that it is better for Ferrari if they dont give Alonso any race seat with them.
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B747forever
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 3:42 pm

Quoting Sudden (Reply 30):
I for one dare to say that Hamilton will not have as great of a season that he just had.

Several reason to why,
Kimi and Ferrari have now been able to set up the car according to Kimi's driving style, so he will be strong from day 1.
Massa will push hard as always.
BMW will be even stronger, I hope, then they were this season.
Alonso will be racing for another team. I want to see Alonso back in the Renault, but we see what will happen.

And most of all,
Hamilton will not have access to any champs telemetry data as he had this season!

Aim for the sky!
Sudden

You are so right, so right. Agree to 100%.

And another thing welcome to my RU list.  thumbsup 
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B747forever
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 3:45 pm

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waterpolodan
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 4:07 pm

Quoting B747forever (Reply 32):
And if Alonso goes for Ferrari which I really doubt, we can see the same thing that happened between Hamilton/Alonso in Ferrari between Kimi/Alonso.

I doubt that same sort of situation would occur, Kimi is much too removed from any personal politics for that to happen, and I think Alonso would deeply respect his professionalism when it comes to the team and driving.
 
cornish
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 4:07 pm

Quoting Sudden (Reply 30):
And most of all,
Hamilton will not have access to any champs telemetry data as he had this season!

maybe not, but he has a seasons worth of telemetry and far more importantly a season's worth of actual experience on those tracks in an F1 car - worth far more than anybody else's telemetry.

Quoting B747forever (Reply 32):
And if Alonso goes for Ferrari which I really doubt, we can see the same thing that happened between Hamilton/Alonso in Ferrari between Kimi/Alonso.

De montezemelo has made it clear that Kimi and Alonso is his dream team. and Massa is seen as being in the opposition camp in the political world that is Ferrari - and de montezemelo wil lundoubtedly get the upper hand over Jean Todt in their battle.

But it is a different story if Alonso goes to Ferrari than it was this season. Alonso felt that he should be the automatic no.1 at McLaren as a double world champion with a rookie team mate. At Ferrari he would be up against a fellow world champion so no expectation of preferential treatment.

todt is close to leaving Ferrari by all accounts - and that would remove Massa's closest ally in the team.

But yes i agree, Massa should get an alternative good seat as he has really done a good job this season, on a fraction of Kimi's salary.
Just when I thought I could see light at the end of the tunnel, it was some B*****d with a torch bringing me more work
 
B747forever
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 4:16 pm

Quoting Cornish (Reply 36):
todt is close to leaving Ferrari by all accounts - and that would remove Massa's closest ally in the team.

maybe not, Todt son can take over the team.
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cornish
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 4:44 pm

Quoting B747forever (Reply 37):
maybe not, Todt son can take over the team.

not a chance. I'm not sure you realise how powerful de Montezemelo is in the Fiat empire.

as for Todt's son it is more likely that we will take over Torro Rosso or bring his own GP2 team into F1 at some stage.
Just when I thought I could see light at the end of the tunnel, it was some B*****d with a torch bringing me more work
 
legoguy
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 4:58 pm

Quoting Sudden (Reply 30):
Hamilton will not have access to any champs telemetry data as he had this season!

Funny that. Hamilton has not had access to Alonso's telemetry data for the latter half of the season and seems to have outpaced Alonso since, only to mess up himself with his inexperience. Although I would agree with you in that Kimi is the biggest contender for the World Championship. Somebody expressed it nicely in another thread. 'Kimi and his Ferrari are now in harmony and will be unstopable'. However I would not rule out Hamilton at all.

I would love to see how Kimi and Fernando would get on in the same team. Would Alonso complain when/if he got beaten by Kimi?
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B747forever
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 5:01 pm

Quoting Cornish (Reply 38):
not a chance

Okey, but you never know.

Quoting Cornish (Reply 38):
as for Todt's son it is more likely that we will take over Torro Rosso or bring his own GP2 team into F1 at some stage

That sounds better.
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cornish
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 5:36 pm

Quoting B747forever (Reply 40):
Okey, but you never know.

oh all sorts of things can happen in F1 that we didn't expect of course. But only someone with the surname Agnelli has more influence at Ferrari than de Montezemelo and Jean Todt may not even be around next year....
Just when I thought I could see light at the end of the tunnel, it was some B*****d with a torch bringing me more work
 
jamesbuk
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 5:37 pm

Quoting Legoguy (Reply 39):
Would Alonso complain when/if he got beaten by Kimi?

No, I think Alonso's beef was that a rookie was beating him whilst if a seasoned driver was beating him I think he would be ok with it - like whenever Fisi beat him, He didn't slag him off (as far as I'm aware)

rgds --James--
You cant have your cake and eat it... What the hells the point in having it then!!!
 
B747forever
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 5:38 pm

Quoting Cornish (Reply 41):
and Jean Todt may not even be around next year....

I really hope that we can see Jean Todt next year too, at least.
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legoguy
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 5:49 pm

Quoting Jamesbuk (Reply 42):

As far as I remember, Fisichella rarely beat Alonso. To Fisichella's credit he did win the Australian Grandprix however that was at the start of the season so Alonso would not have been to fussed. Hamilton beat Alonso once or twice at the start of the season and he did not fuss too much. It was only when Hamilton started becoming consistently fast did Alonso start to become wary.

Also Fisichella pretty much bowed down to Alonso and helped him to win the championship. e.g. tried hard to remain behind Alonso at the Chinese Grandprix 2006, etc etc.

I just honestly can not see Alonso at Ferrari with another World Champion currently there. Two World Champions in the same team rarely works, especially one of them has a fiery temper.

Ferrari currently have the perfect team. They have Raikkonen who is pretty much in top form and likely to win the championship next year, and they have Massa, the perfect team mate to back him up. Massa is fast enough to get Ferrari enough Constructor points, but not quite quick enough to challenge Kimi 100%.
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B747forever
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 6:26 pm

Quoting Legoguy (Reply 44):
They have Raikkonen who is pretty much in top form and likely to win the championship next year,

Hopefully we will see Kimi win again. Hopefully.
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sudden
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 6:35 pm

Quoting Legoguy (Reply 39):
'Kimi and his Ferrari are now in harmony and will be unstopable'.

If you are refering to my post I am guilty.
And no, I am not ruling out Hamilton, but in a way my mind tells me that he have been able to profit from all the negative hype this season.
And dude, make up your mind about the flag! LOL!


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LTU932
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 6:44 pm

Quoting Gman94 (Reply 12):
Bring back Adelaide's street circuit, used to love that Grand Prix.

I'd love to see Adelaide make an F1 comeback, but if Melbourne is out, Gold Coast, which also has a street circuit, would most likely replace Melbourne.

Quoting SandroZRH (Reply 15):
The media here reports that he wants to join a small team to leave a door open for ferrari. If this is true, it would rule out Renault. Austrian Media reports that he expressed interest to join Red Bull.

If FA joins RBR, this probably means that Webber is out. Nevertheless, I still think FA will go back to Flavio Britatore, even if only for 2 years or so. And I also agree with whoever said that Nico Rosberg going to McLaren. It would also be a bit of a prestige move for them, because ever since the Silberpfeile (Silver Arrows) came back, there has not been a German driver driving a Mercedes (except for Frentzen, who was the only German Mercedes driver in F1 when they came back as engine supplier for Sauber). A German driving a Silberpfeil would make good PR for them, especially if they get someone as talented as Nico Rosberg, who I'm sure learned a few tricks from his father and former F1 World Champion Keke Rosberg.
 
waterpolodan
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RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 8:02 pm

Quoting LTU932 (Reply 47):
If FA joins RBR, this probably means that Webber is out.

Red Bull would be pretty stupid to keep DC and get rid of Mark Webber under any circumstances... Webber did things with that car that it had no right to be doing this past year and I still think he's one of the 3 or 4 quickest qualifiers on the grid, though his race pace is in question because he's never had a car that could finnish a race.
 
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LTU932
Posts: 13072
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2006 12:34 am

RE: F1: Off Season Thread

Fri Nov 02, 2007 9:08 pm

Quoting Waterpolodan (Reply 48):
Red Bull would be pretty stupid to keep DC and get rid of Mark Webber under any circumstances... Webber did things with that car that it had no right to be doing this past year and I still think he's one of the 3 or 4 quickest qualifiers on the grid, though his race pace is in question because he's never had a car that could finnish a race.

Yes, but since DC has apparently extended his contract, with the possibility of Alonso joining, it's more likely that Webber, and not DC, is out.

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