bagpiper
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Drought In The South

Thu Nov 15, 2007 4:55 am

Old article: http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1674054,00.html , but it gives a good perspective on the drought. Fortunately, its raining right now in some places here in the ATL.

I'm sure a lot of you have been seeing stories of how bad its getting.

Crazy thing is... there's no backup plan. Around me, they're threatening to turn off the water for four days out of the week if things get really bad.

However, I'm wondering how much water they recycle back into the water system. They can extract water from human waste, leaving only dry, packed cubes of the waste, sanitize the hell outta the water, and send it back through the system, right? So - why not recycle sewage? It comes out perfectly clean, and you only have to add from the lakes what water evaporated in the process, or what people watered their plants with (illegally), or what leaked out.

Not to mention the Army Engineers letting out water... and Alabama (which gets water from GA's reservoirs) has no restrictions.

So - if worse comes to worse, what will happen?
 
57AZ
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Drought In The South

Thu Nov 15, 2007 6:05 am

You'll see water being trucked in from afar and vast water use restrictions. This is something that was developing years ago and no one paid attention. Atlanta is not in a very good spot for a major city-the Atlantans figured that out well before the Civil War. They settled along the banks of a couple of unnavigable bodies of water-not terribly smart for a day and age dependent on water transportation.

Most likely, you'll see a ban on use of potable water for purposes such as washing cars or watering. Here in Arizona, only gray water can be used for outdoors purposes. We also have tighter water use standards for home appliances due to the scarcity of water here.
"When a man runs on railroads over half of his lifetime he is fit for nothing else-and at times he don't know that."
 
AirTranTUS
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Drought In The South

Thu Nov 15, 2007 6:29 am



Quoting 57AZ (Reply 1):
Here in Arizona, only gray water can be used for outdoors purposes.

Isn't that for commercial entities though, such as golf courses? I'm pretty sure most residences here use normal water to landscape with. The pictures I have seen of the reservoirs in the ATL area are really shocking. Very low. Reminds me of Lake Mead a bit. Cities need to find sustainable sources of water, especially dry ones like LAS.
I love ASO!
 
LAXspotter
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Drought In The South

Thu Nov 15, 2007 8:21 am

So what happening in Georgia, particularly Atlanta area now? I saw a couple of reports on the low reserves of water, what are the restrictions and new measures now?
"Patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel" Samuel Johnson
 
garnetpalmetto
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Drought In The South

Thu Nov 15, 2007 1:15 pm



Quoting 57AZ (Reply 1):
vast water use restrictions

We've got that problem up in NC - a good portion of the state is under severe drought conditions and an outgoing city councilman in Chapel Hill proposed a measure that would ban outdoor watering - forever. As it is, the cities that make up the Triangle all have various restrictions - right now in Raleigh, I believe, certain houses can only water their lawns on certain days (I believe even numbered houses can water 3 days out of the week, odd numbered houses can water the other 3 days out of the week, and nobody can water 1 day out of the week)
South Carolina - too small to be its own country, too big to be a mental asylum.
 
bagpiper
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Drought In The South

Thu Nov 15, 2007 2:21 pm



Quoting Garnetpalmetto (Reply 4):
right now in Raleigh, I believe, certain houses can only water their lawns on certain days (I believe even numbered houses can water 3 days out of the week, odd numbered houses can water the other 3 days out of the week, and nobody can water 1 day out of the week)

We've had that for years in Atlanta.

Right now, we have a complete outdoor water use ban, unless you're on a well or use creek water. Or, you can capture excess water from the house (A/C condensation, get the cold water from the shower while you're waiting for the hot water, etc) and use that outside.

We're now being fined for any "excess water useage". If you don't cut your water usage by 1/3 (I think) from the previous month, you get fined. They're a little scarce on the details, though.

Next step is for the county to cut off water one day a week, and slowly increase that up to 4 times a week.
 
ConcordeBoy
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Drought In The South

Thu Nov 15, 2007 2:24 pm



Quoting Bagpiper (Thread starter):
They can extract water from human waste, leaving only dry, packed cubes of the waste, sanitize the hell outta the water, and send it back through the system, right? So - why not recycle sewage?

Is this done in any western nation?

I can imagine how detrimental this would be for business, as I'd go out of my way to steer well clear of any city doing such; and I'm sure I wouldn't be alone in that once word got out.
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
bagpiper
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Drought In The South

Thu Nov 15, 2007 2:59 pm



Quoting ConcordeBoy (Reply 6):

I can imagine how detrimental this would be for business, as I'd go out of my way to steer well clear of any city doing such; and I'm sure I wouldn't be alone in that once word got out.

Yes, it is done in some cities in the US.

Not sure what the big deal is.... its all the same water anyways. I'm sure that glass of whatever drink you just took a sip of has some water that had been in some fecal water at some point in time during the world.

Sure, if you sit there and ponder it while sitting in the bathtub, its kinda gross.... but... with the amount of chlorine that goes in Atlanta water, NOTHING can survive. It almost tastes like pool water.
 
57AZ
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Drought In The South

Thu Nov 15, 2007 3:01 pm



Quoting AirTranTUS (Reply 2):
Isn't that for commercial entities though, such as golf courses?

That's basically true. I think that it will eventually find it's way into the building code for smaller residential structures eventaually. Here in TUS, some of the outlying towns are attempting to slow growth by driving up the cost to connect to the municipal water system up significantly.
"When a man runs on railroads over half of his lifetime he is fit for nothing else-and at times he don't know that."
 
deltagator
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Drought In The South

Thu Nov 15, 2007 3:43 pm



Quoting LAXspotter (Reply 3):
So what happening in Georgia, particularly Atlanta area now?

A fair amount of finger pointing. Not surprising given the peckerwoods that run the city of ATL and Fulton County. Nothing is ever their problem...it's always someone else's fault.

The funny thing is my area of town (Marietta) has had enough rain this year to keep our yards green and lush. Heck we had two straight weeks earlier this year of a good hour to two hour long rain every afternoon.

Quoting LAXspotter (Reply 3):
I saw a couple of reports on the low reserves of water, what are the restrictions and new measures now?

No outdoor watering unless you have a waiver for new planting of a lawn among a few other things. No rationing as of yet but who knows. The funny thing is that they keep talking about Lake Lanier drying up but that isn't the case. At a certain point the water level will fall below the level that it can go through the gates at Buford Dam and get trapped behind it. If it comes to that they'll figure something out to get the water from the lake.

Back in late 2002 when we were in another bad drought (fixed by the massive rains of 2003 - 2005) I was up at Lake Lanier around this time for a business meeting. The lake levels was down 25-30 feet at that time and passing by the lake the other day it wasn't anywhere near that low.

Quoting 57AZ (Reply 1):
Atlanta is not in a very good spot for a major city-the Atlantans figured that out well before the Civil War.

But yet it was then and still is a very large metro area so I think the location has worked out just fine. What is your point?

Quoting 57AZ (Reply 1):
They settled along the banks of a couple of unnavigable bodies of water-not terribly smart for a day and age dependent on water transportation.

Hence the large amount of railroads that came through the city. Again, what is your point other than to show your ignorance of the city?
"If you can't delight in the misery of others then you don't deserve to be a college football fan."
 
bagpiper
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Drought In The South

Thu Nov 15, 2007 3:58 pm



Quoting DeltaGator (Reply 9):
The funny thing is my area of town (Marietta)

We can't be further than... say... 30 minutes max from each other... probably closer. Thats kinda weird. I always thought you were in Florida... DeltaGator, as in the football team. Figured you were a Delta employee down in FLL or MIA or something.


/random
 
deltagator
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Drought In The South

Thu Nov 15, 2007 4:30 pm

Nope, Delta because that's what I fly every week. Gator because I am an alumnus and grew up in Florida. I've been living in ATL for 10+ years now and had family here as long as I've been alive.
"If you can't delight in the misery of others then you don't deserve to be a college football fan."
 
PPVRA
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Drought In The South

Thu Nov 15, 2007 4:45 pm

Maybe we the government should start looking at bottled water tax credits instead of taxes, let's dry up someone else  bigthumbsup 
"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
 
PPVRA
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Drought In The South

Thu Nov 15, 2007 5:27 pm



Quoting PPVRA (Reply 12):
Maybe we the government

Oops, I meant to say "the" government. .
"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
 
luv2fly
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Drought In The South

Thu Nov 15, 2007 5:34 pm

I'm curious what exactly is a "dought"
You can cut the irony with a knife
 
travelin man
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Drought In The South

Thu Nov 15, 2007 6:40 pm

I don't understand how the city can rely on basically one water source (Lake Lanier). Given that droughts have occurred here in the past, did anyone think, hmmmm.... it might be a good idea to get some back-up reservoirs in place?

What if (god forbid) some terrorist or something poisoned Lake Lanier? What the hell would Atlanta do for water?

It seems like very poor planning on the city's/region's part.
 
LAXspotter
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Drought In The South

Thu Nov 15, 2007 6:58 pm



Quoting DeltaGator (Reply 9):
The funny thing is that they keep talking about Lake Lanier drying up but that isn't the case

No Rivers, Aqueducts, no water from Moutains? That what keeps us alive in Southern California
"Patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel" Samuel Johnson
 
deltagator
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Drought In The South

Thu Nov 15, 2007 8:08 pm



Quoting Travelin man (Reply 15):
What if (god forbid) some terrorist or something poisoned Lake Lanier?

Blackbird? How do you compromise Travelin Man's user account?  Wink Cut out the conspiracy theories. The lake is full of drunken hillbillies year round so they are doing just fine filtering out the redneck piss poison today.

Quoting Travelin man (Reply 15):
What the hell would Atlanta do for water?

Drill wells like they have done over in Rockdale County.

Quoting Travelin man (Reply 15):
It seems like very poor planning on the city's/region's part.

We don't all pull our water from Lake Lanier. The city of Marietta gets it from wells among other ways. ATL itself is run by a bunch of criminals disguised as Civil Rights leaders and they have nobody to blame but themselves for the mess they are in. Hopefully their cock ups won't screw us all.
"If you can't delight in the misery of others then you don't deserve to be a college football fan."
 
N1120A
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Drought In The South

Thu Nov 15, 2007 8:17 pm



Quoting ConcordeBoy (Reply 6):

Is this done in any western nation?



Quoting Bagpiper (Reply 7):

Yes, it is done in some cities in the US.

Irvine, CA was designed and built with 2 water systems. One, a grey water system for watering and other outdoor use. The second, a conventional water system for in house use.
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
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falstaff
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RE: Dought In The South

Thu Nov 15, 2007 8:20 pm



Quoting DeltaGator (Reply 17):
The lake is full of drunken hillbillies year round

They will keep real trouble makers out. Back in 1989 "they" said the Mississippi River was going dry. It was very low. In fact many ship wrecks were found high and dry. By 1993 the river was over flowing. Things happen in cycles. Before long ATL will have more water than they can shake a stick at.
My mug slaketh over on Falstaff N503
 
deltagator
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RE: Drought In The South

Thu Nov 15, 2007 8:34 pm



Quoting Falstaff (Reply 19):
Things happen in cycles. Before long ATL will have more water than they can shake a stick at.

Yep. It comes and goes here.

1986 was a very bad drought year and Lakes Lanier and Allatoona were both very low.

2000 through 2002 were very dry and the lake levels were low.

2003 through 2006 were very wet and the lakes were overflowing.

2007 has been dry but then localized places (like my neighborhood) have been plenty wet.

Like all weather patterns and economies it is all cyclical and will change over time.
"If you can't delight in the misery of others then you don't deserve to be a college football fan."
 
57AZ
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RE: Drought In The South

Thu Nov 15, 2007 10:18 pm



Quoting DeltaGator (Reply 9):
Quoting 57AZ (Reply 1):
They settled along the banks of a couple of unnavigable bodies of water-not terribly smart for a day and age dependent on water transportation.

Hence the large amount of railroads that came through the city. Again, what is your point other than to show your ignorance of the city?

Actually, the only reason that the railroads came through Atlanta was that the State of Georgia had to build a government owned and operated line from Atlanta to Chattanooga in order to access the Tennessee River there. Had that not happened, the other private railroads would never have connected to Atlanta. For the record, I have probably forgotten more Georgia (and Tennessee) history than you have ever learned.

Here in AZ, we are now limiting growth by connection fees. In the town I live in, the connection fee for a private residence is now about $5,000 while connection fees for businesses are now about $75,000.
"When a man runs on railroads over half of his lifetime he is fit for nothing else-and at times he don't know that."
 
deltagator
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RE: Drought In The South

Thu Nov 15, 2007 10:33 pm



Quoting 57AZ (Reply 21):
For the record, I have probably forgotten more Georgia (and Tennessee) history than you have ever learned.

If you say so. Whatever strokes your ego there sparky. Can you tell us about the time you invented the Cotton Gin?
"If you can't delight in the misery of others then you don't deserve to be a college football fan."
 
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falstaff
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RE: Drought In The South

Fri Nov 16, 2007 12:38 am



Quoting AZ" class=quote target=_blank>57AZ (Reply 21):
Here in AZ, we are now limiting growth by connection fees. In the town I live in, the connection fee for a private residence is now about $5,000 while connection fees for businesses are now about $75,000.

Does that limit growth? I can see most people and business add it into the cost of doing business. Seems like a great way for the city/county to make money.
My mug slaketh over on Falstaff N503
 
RJdxer
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RE: Drought In The South

Fri Nov 16, 2007 1:40 am



Quoting Falstaff (Reply 19):
Back in 1989 "they" said the Mississippi River was going dry. It was very low. In fact many ship wrecks were found high and dry.

I keep saying that an enterprising person would go get a decent metal detector and start spending their weekends walking the dry lake bed at Lanier, especially around what were the party spots and docks. No telling what you would find.
Warm winds blowing, heating blue skies, and a road that goes forever. I'm going to Texas!
 
sleekjet
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RE: Drought In The South

Fri Nov 16, 2007 1:49 am

Here in Texas, we are now more afraid of water running out than oil running out. And in Texas, that's something.
II Cor. 4:17-18
 
767Lover
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RE: Drought In The South

Fri Nov 16, 2007 2:00 am



Quoting Bagpiper (Reply 5):
We're now being fined for any "excess water useage". If you don't cut your water usage by 1/3 (I think) from the previous month, you get fined. They're a little scarce on the details, though.

Really? I just paid my DeKalb County water bill and it said nothing of the sort.

Quoting DeltaGator (Reply 9):
No outdoor watering unless you have a waiver for new planting of a lawn among a few other things.

The facility manager of one of my corporate clients in town got a whole bunch of emails from employees complaining that the sprinklers were on. She had to issue an email explaining that they had just sodded and would only be watering a short time.

People have really started taking this seriously! We bought a used black car in September and still haven't washed it.
 
bagpiper
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RE: Drought In The South

Fri Nov 16, 2007 2:49 am



Quoting 767Lover (Reply 26):

Really? I just paid my DeKalb County water bill and it said nothing of the sort.

Well, Cobb County is being the strictest of the metro counties. Again, I personally don't pay the water bill... I can clarify what is happening exactly if you want.
 
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scbriml
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RE: Drought In The South

Fri Nov 16, 2007 8:35 am

I saw this on CNN News yesterday.
http://edition.cnn.com/2007/US/11/13...outhern.drought.ap/?iref=hpmostpop

Praying for rain on the steps of the capitol? When will the 21st century arrive in the deep south?
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana!
There are 10 types of people in the World - those that understand binary and those that don't.
 
767Lover
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RE: Drought In The South

Fri Nov 16, 2007 12:28 pm



Quoting Scbriml (Reply 28):
Praying for rain on the steps of the capitol? When will the 21st century arrive in the deep south?

Oh Jesus. I wondered how low it would be before someone commented on it,

This was such a HUGE controversy. Gasp! Horrors!

However, as someone who doesn't pray and doesn't attend church, I could freaking care less. If the governor wanted to pray about it, and hold a prayer service, does it affect me? Nope. Before anyone says "well it is your tax dollars," my feeling is that there are always going to be things that government does that appeal to some group of people that I am not part of. Would I care if the governor attended a Gay Pride parade on the state's time? Or a Hispanic Day rally?

It kind of did affect me....because hours after the service we got a good strong dose of rain!
 
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falstaff
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RE: Drought In The South

Fri Nov 16, 2007 1:41 pm



Quoting Scbriml (Reply 28):
Praying for rain on the steps of the capitol? When will the 21st century arrive in the deep south?

What is wrong with a little prayer?  pray 
My mug slaketh over on Falstaff N503
 
ConcordeBoy
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RE: Drought In The South

Fri Nov 16, 2007 5:35 pm



Quoting Bagpiper (Reply 7):
sitting in the bathtub

...which, BTW, is something I never do. Bleckh!

Showers it is for me. Could never understand how people could just sit there wallowing in what they just washed off of themselves!
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
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scbriml
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RE: Drought In The South

Fri Nov 16, 2007 5:40 pm



Quoting ConcordeBoy (Reply 31):
Could never understand how people could just sit there wallowing in what they just washed off of themselves!

Perhaps some of us are already clean when we get in?

Anyway, there's nowhere to put the scented candles and wine glasses in the shower!  wink 
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana!
There are 10 types of people in the World - those that understand binary and those that don't.
 
CaptOveur
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RE: Drought In The South

Fri Nov 16, 2007 5:45 pm



Quoting Sleekjet (Reply 25):
Here in Texas, we are now more afraid of water running out than oil running out. And in Texas, that's something.

The Edwards Aquifer under San Antonio was within a couple feet of an all time high this summer.
Things were better when it was two guys in a dorm room.
 
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scbriml
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RE: Drought In The South

Fri Nov 16, 2007 5:49 pm



Quoting Falstaff (Reply 30):
What is wrong with a little prayer?

I thought you were supposed to have separation of state and church?

Anyway, if god does control the weather, you'd have to ask why he inflicted drought conditions in the first place. Or did he just forget to send some rain that way, and a quick prayer "reminded" him? Then there's the hurricanes, tornadoes, tsunamis, earthquakes, etc. Why does he inflict all that on us? Or is it all just to test our faith?

I apologise if I've offended anyone, I'm feeling more cynical than usual today.
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana!
There are 10 types of people in the World - those that understand binary and those that don't.
 
bagpiper
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RE: Drought In The South

Fri Nov 16, 2007 6:03 pm



Quoting ConcordeBoy (Reply 31):
Showers it is for me. Could never understand how people could just sit there wallowing in what they just washed off of themselves!

I agree! Its gross.... there's all the cheese (uncuts), floating around. Ugh.
 
deltagator
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RE: Drought In The South

Fri Nov 16, 2007 7:22 pm



Quoting Scbriml (Reply 34):
I thought you were supposed to have separation of state and church?

A Governor taking time to pray on the steps of the capitol building with a group in no way, shape, or form is state sponsorship of religion, Christian, Jewish, Muslim or otherwise. It's his personal time to do with what he wants and since the capitol steps are public ground they can do pretty much whatever they please. It's no worse than Presidential candidates invoking the name of God in a speech, going to a church to campaign, etc.

It wouldn't bother me if you had a damn Santeria goat offering on the steps (as long as they cleaned up after themselves) if it made folks happy.

Quoting Scbriml (Reply 34):
I apologise if I've offended anyone, I'm feeling more cynical than usual today.

Nah, all valid questions as well and ones I wonder about myself from time to time. Of course your questions are nothing compared to the athlete's that thank God for the win as if God cares about sports and took the time to grace one team with his presence over another. Wiat a minute...scratch that....how do we explain the Cleveland franchises inability to win any championships? I guess God must hate them  Wink
"If you can't delight in the misery of others then you don't deserve to be a college football fan."
 
srbmod
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RE: Drought In The South

Fri Nov 16, 2007 9:23 pm



Quoting DeltaGator (Reply 9):
The funny thing is my area of town (Marietta) has had enough rain this year to keep our yards green and lush. Heck we had two straight weeks earlier this year of a good hour to two hour long rain every afternoon.

What shocks me is to go on Hwy 92 between Old U.S. 41 and U.S. 41. You go over the Lake Acworth dam and look to the left and see that Lake Acworth is nearly full; look to the right, you see the trickle that is Allatoona in that area. I remember back around Memorial Day, Allatoona was nearly full.

Quoting DeltaGator (Reply 20):
1986 was a very bad drought year and Lakes Lanier and Allatoona were both very low.

By 1994, the lakes were back above full pool because of Tropical Storm Alberto parking itself over the state for several days. I remember in 1992, Lanier was only down maybe 6-8' as opposed to the 12-15' it had been from 86-90. I used to go to Lanier several times a year as a Boy Scout, as the council had (And still has) a huge campground on Lanier. In '94, I was on the staff of the Junior Leadership Training Camp and remember paddling in some low-lying branches in a cove where the water was up nearly 3'.

Quoting RJdxer (Reply 24):
I keep saying that an enterprising person would go get a decent metal detector and start spending their weekends walking the dry lake bed at Lanier, especially around what were the party spots and docks. No telling what you would find.

I've seen some folks doing that. Some of the islands are the really good places to hunt for stuff. With the water being done, you could walk to some of them (at least those not in the main channel) without getting your feet wet.

Quoting Bagpiper (Reply 5):

We're now being fined for any "excess water useage". If you don't cut your water usage by 1/3 (I think) from the previous month, you get fined. They're a little scarce on the details, though.



Quoting 767Lover (Reply 26):

Really? I just paid my DeKalb County water bill and it said nothing of the sort.

They're doing it here in Clayton County as well. IMHO, they waited a little too late to start charging for excessive water use. If they would have done this say 6 months ago, we'd probably be in a little better shape.

Where I live, we actually are in good shape water-wise. We don't depend on any rivers for our water, as over the years, the Clayton County Water Authority has built or bought lakes for drinking water use. They can use the Flint River or Cotton Indian Creek if they need to (before they started building and buying lakes, they were our main water sources.).
 
bagpiper
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RE: Drought In The South

Fri Nov 16, 2007 9:29 pm



Quoting Srbmod (Reply 37):

Hmm... I wonder what Cobb County uses primarily? Allatoona? Or do we get it from Lanier, too?
 
deltagator
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RE: Drought In The South

Fri Nov 16, 2007 9:44 pm



Quoting Srbmod (Reply 37):
By 1994, the lakes were back above full pool because of Tropical Storm Alberto parking itself over the state for several days.

IIRC we literally had 40 days and nights of rain that summer. All the flooding down in south Georgia from the Flint River that swamped Albany and Americus among other cities. I swear I remember seeing something about how downtown Americus (up on the hill) was surrounded by water or darn near close to being cut off from the rest of the city.

Quoting Bagpiper (Reply 38):
I wonder what Cobb County uses primarily? Allatoona? Or do we get it from Lanier, too

The Chattahoochee River and Lake Allatoona are the main sources. I would suspect that there are some wells in use as well plus some water treatment facilities that recycle water.
"If you can't delight in the misery of others then you don't deserve to be a college football fan."
 
767Lover
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RE: Drought In The South

Fri Nov 16, 2007 10:41 pm



Quoting Scbriml (Reply 34):
I thought you were supposed to have separation of state and church?

Nobody was required to attend. In my opinion it was no different from having a regular church service attended by the governor.

Quoting DeltaGator (Reply 36):
It wouldn't bother me if you had a damn Santeria goat offering on the steps (as long as they cleaned up after themselves) if it made folks happy.

 rotfl 

Quoting Srbmod (Reply 37):
Where I live, we actually are in good shape water-wise.

Clayton County in better shape than the rest of the metro area? Now that's something!
Just kidding,  biggrin 
 
ConcordeBoy
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RE: Drought In The South

Fri Nov 16, 2007 11:48 pm



Quoting Scbriml (Reply 32):
Perhaps some of us are already clean when we get in?

...yeah that makes sense for the general populace  Yeah sure

Quoting Bagpiper (Reply 35):
there's all the cheese (uncuts), floating around

Egad that's vile  Wow!
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
deltagator
Posts: 6170
Joined: Fri Sep 23, 2005 9:56 am

RE: Drought In The South

Sat Nov 17, 2007 12:06 am



Quoting Bagpiper (Reply 35):
Its gross.... there's all the cheese (uncuts), floating around. Ugh.

Dammit! I thought there was a standing order to keep RootsAir out of the ATL metro area.  Wink
"If you can't delight in the misery of others then you don't deserve to be a college football fan."

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