sbworcs
Posts: 667
Joined: Fri Oct 21, 2005 11:19 pm

The Child Support Agency

Mon Dec 17, 2007 11:11 pm

Would like some other opinions on this -

My sister and her husband split over 5 years ago. They had 2 children who now live with my sister. He moved to Spain and has not paid a penny since - apparantly the CSA is only interested ito chase overseas if a UK court grants an injunction against the father YET a uk court will not issue one as he is not in the armed forces or working for a UK company overseas - according to UK law he is not financially liable for the children

My sisters new fiance is also divorced - his ex wife was unfaithful and had a child by another man - the reason for the divorce. YET - during the divorce procedure his and her lawyers kept telling him that his ex wife was entitled to more as their was a child of the relationship?

How - on the one hand the UK law let people get away with paying nothing for their children (even though there are reciprocal enforcement rights on this sort of thing between the UK and spain) and then on the other state that another part of the law means that a person can be "penalised" for want of a better work for a child that he has DNA proof is not his?

Any one care to shed any light on this??
The best way forwards is upwards!
 
ANCFlyer
Posts: 21391
Joined: Mon Nov 15, 2004 3:51 pm

RE: The Child Support Agency

Mon Dec 17, 2007 11:19 pm

I can tell you that the entire Child Support process in the United States is broken beyond all comprehension.

My fiance's daughter recieve zippo from that dead beat sperm donor of theirs. He's a felon - diddling little kids and skipping bail and skipping Child Support payments. Before his escapades with kids and bail, he was still a dead beat piece of shit.

The local Child Support Enforcement folks have attempted over the years to track him down, and at one point succeeded. Generally, they are over worked, under funded and useless. Typical gov't agency.

Note to anyone that cares: I have never, and will never, miss a payment to my ex-wife for my daughter. You see, my Father is a dead beat also. Who never paid a damn thing from 1969 until whenever . . .

For those that owe Child Support and don't pay - I say kiss my ass you irresponsible louse.

Getting any support from overseas will be nearly impossible. Whether you're in the Uk, the US or Spain. Simply nearly impossible.

Too bad parents - because there are dead beat mothers as well - are so irresponsible where their off spring are concerned . .
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
Bofredrik
Posts: 1133
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 1999 4:17 pm

RE: The Child Support Agency

Mon Dec 17, 2007 11:33 pm

In Sweden is it very difficult to avoid paying and it does not
matter why a couple with a child (or more) is split up.
I pay 200 USD (but in Swedish Kr...) per month for my
daughter, age 15, who lives with my ex wife. And that is
despite that i have not seen the daughter since she was 10.
Why? My wife did meet a new guy and said "we do not need you".
But i have to pay... We have laws that should give me right
to see my daughter and i have been in court but the mother
do not want to cooperate. And mothers here have MORE rights!

OK, if a father or mother do not pay will they be hunted by the
the "system". And they will get the money. It is nothing you can
avoid. And i know they do what they can if some have moved
to another country.

The law say (more or less): "We do not care what you or
your partner have done. If somebody is hurt, sad, angry etc.
WE JUST WANT THE MONEY to the child".
 
767Lover
Posts: 3254
Joined: Fri Sep 26, 2003 6:32 am

RE: The Child Support Agency

Tue Dec 18, 2007 12:26 am



Quoting Sbworcs (Thread starter):
My sister and her husband split over 5 years ago. They had 2 children who now live with my sister. He moved to Spain

Well, the fact that a "man" (to use the term loosely) would put that much geographic distance between himself and his two children is telling enough.
 
N1120A
Posts: 26467
Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:40 pm

RE: The Child Support Agency

Tue Dec 18, 2007 12:29 am



Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 1):

For those that owe Child Support and don't pay - I say kiss my ass you irresponsible louse.

I bet you like picking those types up

Quoting Bofredrik (Reply 2):
We have laws that should give me right
to see my daughter and i have been in court but the mother
do not want to cooperate

If she wont cooperate, get the court to force her to do so.
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
ANCFlyer
Posts: 21391
Joined: Mon Nov 15, 2004 3:51 pm

RE: The Child Support Agency

Tue Dec 18, 2007 1:33 am



Quoting N1120A (Reply 4):
Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 1):

For those that owe Child Support and don't pay - I say kiss my ass you irresponsible louse.

I bet you like picking those types up

Not nearly as much as I enjoy picking up Abusive spouses . . . particularly of the male gender . . .
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
N1120A
Posts: 26467
Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:40 pm

RE: The Child Support Agency

Tue Dec 18, 2007 1:56 am



Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 5):

Not nearly as much as I enjoy picking up Abusive spouses . . . particularly of the male gender . . .

Goes without saying that I am sure "picking up" may well include a soft toss on the end  Wink
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
57AZ
Posts: 2371
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 2:55 pm

RE: The Child Support Agency

Tue Dec 18, 2007 3:29 am

Arizona's system (Department of Economic Security) has its faults, but from what I have seen they do make a good effort. A lot of the problem of nonpayment is simply that the agency has no other way to obtain employer information other than from one of the parties. We get countless letters filed weekly to the extent that the agency cannot garnish the wages of a deadbeat because the information they have is no longer current. That said, we do get a lot of letters of termination filed-most have no further information, but occasionally one does provide information on the party's new employment. To their credit, many of the parties do report their job or address changes.

I will also add that the Department of Economic Security does go after deadbeats when they have the chance. We do see a good number of Child Support Arrest Warrants on a regular basis (or at least we did when I worked the Bond Clerk position). One of the points that we were required to make clear to anyone paying a bond for a Child Support Arrest Warrant was that under no circumstances will the bond money be returned. Under the Arizona Revised Statutes, any bond payment made on a Child Support Arrest Warrant is deposited with the Department of Economic Security and applied to the amount of Child Support owed.
"When a man runs on railroads over half of his lifetime he is fit for nothing else-and at times he don't know that."
 
L-188
Posts: 29874
Joined: Wed Jul 07, 1999 11:27 am

RE: The Child Support Agency

Tue Dec 18, 2007 3:39 am



Quoting Bofredrik (Reply 2):
And mothers here have MORE rights!

Absolutely, The courts have consistantly ignored the role of the father.

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 1):
I can tell you that the entire Child Support process in the United States is broken beyond all comprehension.

I think there are a lot of Custodial males that would agree.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
Bofredrik
Posts: 1133
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 1999 4:17 pm

RE: The Child Support Agency

Tue Dec 18, 2007 9:28 am



Quoting N1120A (Reply 4):
If she wont cooperate, get the court to force her to do so.

I did that. And i got all rights from the court. 5 judges all said YES!
Then i went to the social service as they handle it after the court
decision and should help me to use my rights. But they just said:
"We do not care about the court. We will not force the child to see
you if the mother not want that". And here i am...
They always hide behind "what is best for the child". But no one
know the definition. But many use it...
 
oly720man
Posts: 5740
Joined: Fri May 21, 2004 7:13 am

RE: The Child Support Agency

Tue Dec 18, 2007 9:55 am



Quoting Sbworcs (Thread starter):
y sisters new fiance is also divorced - his ex wife was unfaithful and had a child by another man - the reason for the divorce. YET - during the divorce procedure his and her lawyers kept telling him that his ex wife was entitled to more as their was a child of the relationship?



Quoting Sbworcs (Thread starter):
and then on the other state that another part of the law means that a person can be "penalised" for want of a better work for a child that he has DNA proof is not his?

http://www.csa.gov.uk/en/PDF/leaflets/new/CSL301.pdf

Page 26


What happens if the non-resident parent denies they are the child's parent?


Sometimes, when a parent with care applies for child maintenance, the person they name as the non-resident parent denies they are the parent of the child.

Under the law, we can presume they are the child's parent in certain situations. For example:

when they are named on the child's birth certificate, or
if they were married to the child's mother at any time between the dates of conception and birth.

In these situations, the person named as the non-resident parent can go to court to try to prove that they are not the child's parent. But they have to pay child maintenance until the court rules that they are not the parent. If the court rules that they are not the parent, and the person has paid child maintenance to us to pass on to the parent with care, we will refund these payments in full.

If we cannot presume that the person named as the non-resident parent is the child's parent, we will interview both parents. We will suggest that they and the child take a DNA test. This is also known as a 'paternity test' and will tell if either of the people taking the test is not the child's parent.
wheat and dairy can screw up your brain
 
bablackpilot
Posts: 101
Joined: Sun Apr 09, 2006 3:36 pm

RE: The Child Support Agency

Tue Dec 18, 2007 1:24 pm

Well this is an area I can speak of from experience. California's system is totally screwed up.
First off, before the amount of child support was decided I was sending money and clothes to my kid, who by the way lives in another state. Then when the amount came out, the wouldn't reconize the stuff I bought and money I sent. They said "You did that out of the kindness of your heart"
So now, I'm hit paying back child support and because of the new laws out I can't get a passport till all of it's paid off (good bye airline job). On top of it they always make mistakes stating that they never recieve the payments when it's automatically comes out of my paychecks so they ding my credit rating.....(good bye house, car, credit cards)
Then the woman on the phone says....."Oh, the credit thing happens, it's an automated system"
So what do I say to the woman loving, man hating child support system....."F___K Y_U"
A word to the men out there, stay out of the system as much as you can........
My arrogance is only an issue between you and your self-esteem!"
 
ANCFlyer
Posts: 21391
Joined: Mon Nov 15, 2004 3:51 pm

RE: The Child Support Agency

Wed Dec 19, 2007 2:15 am



Quoting Bablackpilot (Reply 11):
A word to the men out there, stay out of the system as much as you can........

Perhaps true in some cases . . .

Not in mine.

I was divorced in 1995. The settlement didn't need attorneys, and all that expense and  redflag . We evenly divided the house and the profit from it's sale. We agreed - like mature adults - that Miranda would not become a pawn as so often happens.

In Alaska, the law says you pay for one child 25% of your GROSS income. No big deal. I pay about 35% all told. Not bragging, simply explaining. When my Father bailed out in 1969 and paid nothing forever I learned a valuable lesson. Ditto Jackie. The sperm donor that created Aarika and Shelby is a waste of air. A fleeing felon. He owe's more than he'll ever be able to pay.

I gladly take care of my daughter.

I registered with the CSED folks here in 1995. I have NEVER heard from them again. In fact, I was - by law - required to increase my amount paid when I retired and got my new job as my Gross Pay increased. My ex-wife went through the Alaska court system to cap my maximum payment at $1200 a month. She said I pay enough.

Fortunately, my ex and I are friends. She has a bank account for Miranda that has whatever $$$ she didn't use for school, extra-ciricular activites, summer camp, plane tickets, etc that continues to grow.

Not always the case that the supporting parent doesn't get the shaft.

WAY too often that the child(ren) becomes a pawn. What good is that? IMO, that's child abuse . . . inexcusable.
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
N1120A
Posts: 26467
Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:40 pm

RE: The Child Support Agency

Wed Dec 19, 2007 2:19 am



Quoting Bofredrik (Reply 9):
"We do not care about the court. We will not force the child to see
you if the mother not want that".

Then they are in contempt of those judge's orders and you should take them back to court, or take the police to enforce the order.
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
huskyaviation
Posts: 912
Joined: Mon Aug 27, 2007 4:38 am

RE: The Child Support Agency

Wed Dec 19, 2007 2:46 am



Quoting N1120A (Reply 13):
Then they are in contempt of those judge's orders and you should take them back to court, or take the police to enforce the order.

They may or may not be in contempt, but I would imagine Swedish law is different than American law.  Confused

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 12):
I registered with the CSED folks here in 1995. I have NEVER heard from them again. In fact, I was - by law - required to increase my amount paid when I retired and got my new job as my Gross Pay increased. My ex-wife went through the Alaska court system to cap my maximum payment at $1200 a month. She said I pay enough.

Sounds like you and your ex-wife were one of the rare breed to understand that the end of a marriage shouldn't punish the child the most.  bigthumbsup 

I thought there was a federal list of deadbeats now? Or is that still done at the state level if at all?
 
747srule
Posts: 388
Joined: Thu Mar 25, 2004 11:42 am

RE: The Child Support Agency

Wed Dec 19, 2007 7:48 pm

Real simple solution to this mess. Let both parents have the kid(s) 50% of the time. Split EVERYTHING right down the middle.We all know it won't happen, because the lawyers would all be out of business. They want nothing more than to keep dragging the parents into court so they can keep their gravy train rolling.
Jesus is the way,the truth,and the life
 
N1120A
Posts: 26467
Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:40 pm

RE: The Child Support Agency

Wed Dec 19, 2007 8:04 pm



Quoting HuskyAviation (Reply 14):

They may or may not be in contempt, but I would imagine Swedish law is different than American law.

It is and contempt is not handled in the same way, but court orders are still enforced.

Quoting 747srule (Reply 15):
Split EVERYTHING right down the middle.We all know it won't happen, because the lawyers would all be out of business.

Everything is split right down the middle here in California, and family lawyers do quite well. As far as custody disputes go, that issue is so nuanced and case specific, that you have to deal on a case by case basis.
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss

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