ojas
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Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Thu Sep 18, 2008 8:01 pm

Recently when I flew into Washington DC from Doha, at the immigration there was a cop shouting, US citizens and Green card holders first!!!. That is these guys were allowed to stand in line before us, and there was a simultaneous arrival of an AF flight from Paris having a nice population of Indians as well. Collectively all the Non US citizens and the line was specifically meant for Indians as I saw no European there was well, just Indians and few Arabs. It was not even a line it was like a separate enclosure. At that time I guess 17 of the 24 or 25 counters were open, but still we had to wait while all other US citizens who arrived later were allowed to go before us. Is this fair?

On the other side the Immigration officer was "normal" with a straight face, and on my departure next day, the TSA officials were so very nice and well spoken even when I had an "SSSS" on my boarding pass ( At that point I thought I'm gonna get grilled like a steak")

The point is the whole episode made me felt humiliated to the core and never had I been treated like a refugee or an illegal immigrant till date. That is the reason I share this episode with you guys.

To clarify things I do not hate or dislike the people in America, and in fact in just one week I have had so many pleasant experiences with the people around. I really feel good when I interact with the people around. They are all very wonderful people. But a lousy welcome at Washington is not going to be erased from my mind easily.

I hope I have able to convey my thoughts properly, and that there is no ire or hatred feeling being transmitted through my post.
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N867DA
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RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Thu Sep 18, 2008 8:08 pm

I've always seen separate lines for US citizens and non-US citizens. I've stood in both, and its pretty hard to say which line moves faster. Sometimes the non-US citizen line is packed with people who hardly know what a visa is. And sometimes the US citizen line has a lot of people who get to the counter and start digging through the laundry in their roll-on for a passport.

I've seen that generally, if a US citizen gets in a non-US citizen line there won't be any objection (and vice-versa), but I have never heard of US citizens being allowed to cut in a general line!
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lowrider
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RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Thu Sep 18, 2008 8:13 pm



Quoting N867DA (Reply 1):
but I have never heard of US citizens being allowed to cut in a general line!

Nor have I, but it may be a matter of simple expediency. That is, they can process the citizens and green card holders faster, and thereby reduce the number of people in line more rapidly. A consideration if there are additional international flights arriving in the near future.
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Mir
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RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Thu Sep 18, 2008 9:41 pm



Quoting N867DA (Reply 1):
I've always seen separate lines for US citizens and non-US citizens.

So have I. And that's the proper way to do it. Unless you have only one person working, you should have seperate lines.

Quoting Lowrider (Reply 2):
it may be a matter of simple expediency.

Perhaps, but it still looks very bad, and as the OP said is a horrible way of welcoming someone to the country. And where does it stop? More international flights arrive, with more US citizens, and they keep going first?

Quoting Lowrider (Reply 2):
they can process the citizens and green card holders faster, and thereby reduce the number of people in line more rapidly. A consideration if there are additional international flights arriving in the near future.

With 17 counters open? I've seen immigration run smoothly with two lines with as few as 10 counters open.

Either one of two things happened: whoever was running IAD screwed up big time, or there was some situation that meant that non-US citizens couldn't be cleared, and the OP, unfortunately, got caught in it.

-Mir
7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
 
lowrider
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RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Thu Sep 18, 2008 10:11 pm



Quoting Mir (Reply 3):
Either one of two things happened: whoever was running IAD screwed up big time, or there was some situation that meant that non-US citizens couldn't be cleared, and the OP, unfortunately, got caught in it.

I could very easily believe the first one, but I was trying to think of what the simplest explanation might be.

Quoting Mir (Reply 3):
Perhaps, but it still looks very bad, and as the OP said is a horrible way of welcoming someone to the country. And where does it stop?

Sure it does, but that does not mean it was intentional or malicious. I didn't mean that they would bump US citizens ahead from an following flight, merely that they were making room in the customs area to accomodate the next flight. The US is not alone in unpleasent customs experience either. Pretty much the only time I have a pleasent experience entering any country, my own included, is when I am working, and not always then. The rest of the time I am looked at as if I have come for the express purpose of bringing down their civilization. Or at least that is the perception I get. Canada is the exception. They have always been friendly.
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misbeehavin
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RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Thu Sep 18, 2008 10:57 pm



Quoting Ojas (Thread starter):

I've entered the country over a hundred times through a dozen airports and have never seen anything like that. I think you got stuck in a one off situation. Doesn't make it right or excusable, but it's not the norm.

Quoting Lowrider (Reply 4):
Canada is the exception. They have always been friendly.

Canada's the worst in my experience! They've always looked at me and everyone else like we're there to steal jobs from Canadians. We even had a companywide email sent out a couple of years ago that instructed all employees travelling to Canada on business to tell immigration that we were there for a "meeting". Not "business" and not to "meet with a client".

But that's at the airports. The officials when crossing into Canada by road have always been real friendly (and pretty!).

My easiest experience has always been in France, but that's because most of the time they haven't bothered to even look at my face!
 
N867DA
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RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Thu Sep 18, 2008 11:02 pm



Quoting Lowrider (Reply 4):
Canada is the exception. They have always been friendly

I LOVE Canadian immigration and customs. Ordering at Burger King is more complicated than dealing with Canadian immigration!

I would bet that IAD just messed up. It may even be a technical glitch...did IAD lose internet for a while?  Silly
A nation turns its lonely eyes to you
 
CPDC10-30
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RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Fri Sep 19, 2008 8:37 am



Quoting Lowrider (Reply 4):
Canada is the exception. They have always been friendly.

I've found it completely the opositte - Canadian customs constantly give me attitude and ask tons and tons of nosy questions (even though I am a Canadian citizen!). They just don't seem to understand that it is possible for a Canadian citizen to move to another country and come back to visit - and not to live! I have had to explain this every time I come to visit from the UK.

USA customs have always been very good, whether in Buffalo, Lewiston, Orlando, Toronto (pre clearance), or Detroit.

UK Customs have never asked me any questions, and they always allow my partner to use the EU line (even though he is Canadian with UK premanent residency).
 
CV990A
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RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Fri Sep 19, 2008 11:23 am

The immigration hall at IAD is fairly small, and every time I've used it, the non-citizen line has been packed. A few times, the INS Agents/Cops haven't let anyone off the mobile lounge once it arrives at the building becasue the hall is simply too full. I wonder if the OP means to say non-citizens weren't allowed into the building as their line was too long, but US citizens were allowed off, as in my experience that line is almost always much shorter, and the agent at the door of the mobile lounge didn't explain why.
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ojas
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RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Fri Sep 19, 2008 1:33 pm



Quoting CV990A (Reply 8):
I wonder if the OP means to say non-citizens weren't allowed into the building as their line was too long,

Yes this too had happened, but I knew that the hall was packed hence we were kept in the mobile lounge.

After we entered the hall we were directed to the left hand side and then after we non US citizens formed a queue, we were kinda locked in an enclosure till all the US citizens and green card holders were given the chance to go first.
Great leaders don't tell you what to do ... they show you how it's done!
 
Dougloid
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RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Fri Sep 19, 2008 3:49 pm



Quoting Ojas (Reply 9):
Yes this too had happened, but I knew that the hall was packed hence we were kept in the mobile lounge.

Don't let it get you down.

Try and keep in mind what happened here and its connection to air travel.

As it happens if it cost you a couple hours out of your life I'd be perfectly happy to buy you lunch on behalf of my fellow yanquis.

If you ever get to Iowa look me up.


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iairallie
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RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Fri Sep 19, 2008 3:57 pm



Quoting Lowrider (Reply 2):
but it may be a matter of simple expediency. That is, they can process the citizens and green card holders faster, and thereby reduce the number of people in line more rapidly.

This is the reason why that happened pure and simple. It was not some sinister racist plot to make you feel unwelcome. Get over it. You yourself pointed out that the immigration hall was very crowded. It makes sense to clear out as many people in the shortest amount of time possible so that they can fit everyone in the room and not have people stranded in mobile lounges. US-Citizens are generally quicker to process as there are no visa or immigration issues.

I've gone through many times in my life as a Non-US citizen and as a US citizen I have not noticed any difference in how I am treated. I've been treated rudely as both and kindly as both.
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ojas
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RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Fri Sep 19, 2008 4:06 pm



Quoting Dougloid (Reply 10):
Don't let it get you down.

Try and keep in mind what happened here and its connection to air travel.

As it happens if it cost you a couple hours out of your life I'd be perfectly happy to buy you lunch on behalf of my fellow yanquis.

If you ever get to Iowa look me up.

I did not complain about that. If you read my opening post, it is the way we were held back as some refugees that irked me and made me feel humiliated. Not the time I lost or that I missed a connecting flight.
Great leaders don't tell you what to do ... they show you how it's done!
 
ojas
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RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Fri Sep 19, 2008 4:13 pm



Quoting IAirAllie (Reply 11):
This is the reason why that happened pure and simple. It was not some sinister racist plot to make you feel unwelcome. Get over it. You yourself pointed out that the immigration hall was very crowded. It makes sense to clear out as many people in the shortest amount of time possible so that they can fit everyone in the room and not have people stranded in mobile lounges. US-Citizens are generally quicker to process as there are no visa or immigration issues.

To tell you, the US citizens and green card holders were MORE in number. Plus why did they make us wait in a separate line and let the US citizens and green card holders of the flight arriving around 15 minutes after us go before us?

Non immigrants on that particular day were less, and like everyone here pointed out having separate counters for both US and non US citizens is the best thing to do.

The hall was crowded, but it had more to do with the small hall of Dulles airport. If it cannot handle 2 wide body arrivals at the same time, it is a bad thing.
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iairallie
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RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Fri Sep 19, 2008 4:30 pm



Quoting Ojas (Reply 13):
To tell you, the US citizens and green card holders were MORE in number.

Yes they generally are.

Quoting Ojas (Reply 13):
The hall was crowded, but it had more to do with the small hall of Dulles airport.

The two above quotes only make it more obvious why this was done.

Let me try explaining more clearly.

Lets say the hall fits 500 people but you have 800 people who need to go through.

500 are US citizens the rest of the 300 are foreign nationals.

US citizens on average take under a minute to process (in my experience much less than that even). Non-resident foreign nationals take much longer.

You need to make room for 300 people who are waiting uncomfortably in mobile lounges.

The fastest way to do this to clear a large chunk of US citizens in a short period of time.

By clearing US Citizens first you decrease the wait time for the entire group at large thus decreasing the possiblity of missconnections from a larger percentage of the group.

It would be much slower and increase the mobile lounge waiting time to process on a random first come first serve basis.

In larger immigration halls this is not an issue.
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ojas
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RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Fri Sep 19, 2008 5:02 pm

I take your explanation. It is convincing, this could be the way IAD organize things.
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N867DA
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RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Fri Sep 19, 2008 5:14 pm



Quoting IAirAllie (Reply 11):
I've gone through many times in my life as a Non-US citizen and as a US citizen I have not noticed any difference in how I am treated. I've been treated rudely as both and kindly as both.

Not always. The first time I returned to the United States after getting citizenship, the officer noticed that my passport was issued just 3 week earlier, smiled at me and said, "welcome home". What a feeling!

Your explanation has been the best one so far. I've never been through IAD's immigration but it sounds like great fun.
A nation turns its lonely eyes to you
 
N1120A
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RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Fri Sep 19, 2008 5:16 pm



Quoting Lowrider (Reply 4):
Canada is the exception. They have always been friendly.

Actually, I have had more difficulty and rude treatment from Canada Customs than anywhere else in the world. After that, the UK.
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
lowrider
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RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Fri Sep 19, 2008 8:04 pm



Quoting Misbeehavin (Reply 5):
Canada's the worst in my experience!



Quoting CPDC10-30 (Reply 7):
I've found it completely the opositte



Quoting N1120A (Reply 16):
I have had more difficulty and rude treatment from Canada Customs than anywhere else in the world.

You all have me stumped. I have entered through Thunder Bay, Dryden, Toronto, Hamilton, Oshwa, London, Montreal (both airports), Fredricton, Moncton, Halifax, and Gander, and have always been treated well, often better than on the return to the US. I just always try to be respectful, have the necessary paperwork in order, and generally do my part to make the process as easy as possible.
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iairallie
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RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Fri Sep 19, 2008 8:06 pm

It sure was a thrill using that US passport the first time! It's always nice to hear a welcome home after you've been overseas a while.
Enough about flying lets talk about me!
 
ojas
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RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Fri Sep 19, 2008 8:46 pm



Quoting Lowrider (Reply 19):
I just always try to be respectful, have the necessary paperwork in order, and generally do my part to make the process as easy as possible.

because of which my immigration process took barely a minute. After that it took not more than 2 minutes to get out of the airport. I had bypassed the customs as I had nothing to declare.
Great leaders don't tell you what to do ... they show you how it's done!
 
N1120A
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RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Fri Sep 19, 2008 9:13 pm



Quoting Lowrider (Reply 19):
I just always try to be respectful, have the necessary paperwork in order, and generally do my part to make the process as easy as possible.

By that you insinuate we were not. For my part, I have always been courteous, even speaking French to the agent at St. Armand/Phillipsburg who had me sent in with the little yellow slip for an immigration questioning with a guy who made idiotic attempts to catch me saying something contradictory ("How long you staying in Montreal?" "Only as long as it takes to drive through, I am on my way to Ottawa, remember?"). While not going to that extreme, twice at YYZ did I have extremely brusque and discourteous agents.
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
fbgdavidson
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RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Fri Sep 19, 2008 9:33 pm



Quoting Lowrider (Reply 4):
The US is not alone in unpleasent customs experience either.

I thought we were talking about immigration? The only time someone at customs has ever muttered anything more than 'OK, you're free to go' is when I was coming into the country using advance parole documents. Why customs and not immigration processed me on that I'm not sure...

Quoting CPDC10-30 (Reply 7):
UK Customs have never asked me any questions, and they always allow my partner to use the EU line (even though he is Canadian with UK premanent residency).

Customs upon entry into the UK isn't split up depending upon residencies/passport.

Quoting CV990A (Reply 8):
I wonder if the OP means to say non-citizens weren't allowed into the building as their line was too long, but US citizens were allowed off, as in my experience that line is almost always much shorter, and the agent at the door of the mobile lounge didn't explain why.

Thank you for the most logical explanation!  thumbsup  Like you I've arrived at IAD off international flights more times than I care to remember. Fortunately I pick my flights so I tend to avoid the most congested times but I have been in the immigration hall when it is full and more busses with passengers have arrived.

Quoting Ojas (Reply 13):
To tell you, the US citizens and green card holders were MORE in number. Plus why did they make us wait in a separate line and let the US citizens and green card holders of the flight arriving around 15 minutes after us go before us?

To say you were humiliated to the core is frankly ridiculous and I say grow a pair!

All airports I've flown into internationally that I can recall at this moment separate passengers for immigration purposes. It isn't some form of racism anything as absurd as you suggest it is for simple logistical purposes. As someone who has used both the visitors and US Citizens/Green card line many times they never move to accommodate more people in one line versus the other. If there's no more room in the visitors line they aren't going to start sending people through the US citizens line.

It makes sense doesn't it to call the US citizens forward from the mobile lounge if there is room to process them, then everyone wins. They're happy to get through to baggage claim faster and you have more room to sit down and wait until there is room, rather than stand in the perpetual maze of tensa barriers shuffling along.
"My first job was selling doors, door to door, that's a tough job innit" - Bill Bailey
 
lowrider
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RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Fri Sep 19, 2008 10:23 pm



Quoting N1120A (Reply 21):
By that you insinuate we were not.

I don't know what you do. I am just stating what I do and the results I get. I have entered at various times for work and pleasure. Even when I landed carrying 6000lbs of explosive material, I was treated with a high degree of courtesy and respect. That time I expected them to be more circumspect, but they were not.
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comorin
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RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Fri Sep 19, 2008 11:22 pm

Ojas,

I'm sorry that you had an uncomfortable experience with immigration. I've heard similar complaints before, and can offer some thoughts:

In your specific situation, I think the pragmatic explanation by IAirAllie makes the most sense, even though it wasn't the most tactful or welcoming thing to do. Coming from a culture where your guest is always more important than yourself, you must have felt this 'welcome' a bit of a slap in the face. Just don't take it personally, they are just civil servants trying to do their job.

I think the Indian traveler tends to have this type of hypersensitivity, be it US Immigration or flying on a Western carrier (not to lump you in this group!). As a passenger, you will be better treated if you act in a Westernized way. This, of course, implies that there is something inferior about acting like an Indian. Question is, as a fare-paying pax, should you have to adjust to them, or should they adjust to you?

The Indian traveler has also gone through the wringer trying to get a visa to visit the US - the journey starts off on a humiliating, inquisitional note before the first step. Finally, as ex-colonials, Indians will always be sensitive about how they are treated in the West. Point is, nobody in the West really cares. A friend, nominated a Fellow at the Institute for Advanced Study by J.R. Oppenheimer, gets no respect either when he visits...

If you look at the other side of the coin, The US has been flooded with foreigners trying to get in as immigrants. Immigrants are seen as evil people that take away jobs. The H-1 flood certainly hasn't helped. Every non-European visitor is given the eagle eye on landing.

Fortunately, I see a macho tradition at Immigartion giving way to a more professional and multi-cultured generation at JFK and EWR. It's not like they are going to greet you with leis someday, but change is in the air. The US is a great country because things are always improving!

As a US citizen myself, I would like the Department of State to apply even humanitarian standards to all visitors, regardless of nationality. CIS agents should be trained to reflect America's great tradition of customer service, and less so as hard-core cops. Hopefully these agents will someday be the best in the world, even better than the UK (My personal world standard).

Just remember that anywhere in the world, there are good and bad folks. Once you get past the gauntlet, it really is a decent country, full of generous people like Dougloid.

One final word - it takes more guts to be sensitive than to be a thick-skinned person, but when in Rome...  Smile
 
ojas
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RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Fri Sep 19, 2008 11:47 pm

Comorin, I agree to every word you said. I'm aware that I belong to a culture which is way different.

As you know the whole process of getting a VISA is pretty difficult. But let me tell you, the Americans at the US consulate in BOM are very good people, hats off to their efficiency. Same goes with the INS officers, who were doing their job. Had this gone as what it happens at major airports like separate counters, I would not have said a word about it. And to tell you so far I have had a very pleasant experience solely because I knew the entire process beforehand and was ready for something worse.

All I had to say is that specific incident that occurred was not good. Being an Indian and staying in the middle east through my childhood, I have been on extreme receiving end of discrimination. There are so many stories to tell that even you would fume up.

I knew USA is a country which respects every culture ,all people and I still say the civilians here are wonderful people( and so are the girls, but let us keep this discussion elsewhere), but the way we were kept in hold was something at that time I felt humiliated.

Now just see this, some sensible people like you and Iairallie who took the pains to explain me what could have happened and indeed I was convinced. Unlike some people sitting on the high pedestrian and passing judgments as to how I need to grow up. Maybe they are overgrown themselves. I never even uttered a word of racial discrimination, it is something some members start assuming.

I know the huge amount of illegal immigrants in the USA and understand every bit of it, and as non immigrants we will do everything to cooperate with the security of America. It will be our pleasure to do so.

In the Civil Aviation thread not one occasion is spared to call AI the worst airline et al, whereas I can count many airlines that are worse than AI. In my TR I gave a fair review of UA and about my experiences at IAD airport, no one will see the part where I said the TSA officials were nice to me. If there are some anti Americans here, they would have blown things out of proportion, but as I had said in the opening post itself, it is just a feeling and I had to tell you guys to find an answer as to what would have happened. Never did I say the Americans are bad or something like that. It is the mismanagement that I'm critical about.

However, I wrote about this to the airline and after validating the incidents of the day, they said they will take this issue for inspection.
Great leaders don't tell you what to do ... they show you how it's done!
 
iairallie
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RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Sat Sep 20, 2008 12:05 am



Quoting Ojas (Reply 25):
I never even uttered a word of racial discrimination, it is something some members start assuming.

It was somewhat implied by...

Quoting Ojas (Thread starter):
was specifically meant for Indians as I saw no European there was well, just Indians and few Arabs

and your subsequent commentary about how this "treatment" made you feel.
Enough about flying lets talk about me!
 
ojas
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RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Sat Sep 20, 2008 12:15 am



Quoting IAirAllie (Reply 26):
and your subsequent commentary about how this "treatment" made you feel.

urm yes, it can be implied like that, but I would like to clarify my intentions were not. It is just a narration of facts. The discrimination part was w.r.t US and Non US citizens and not about a race... I hope I'm expressing it properly.

I'm not crying about the fact that Indians are mistreated or something, and this statement is false IMO. My point was for the US and Non US citizens.

But this was also a fact that only people from the Indian Subcontinent and few Arabs were held back in the hall in a separate enclosure. As I say .. only a fact, I'm not drawing any conclusions.
Great leaders don't tell you what to do ... they show you how it's done!
 
comorin
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RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Sat Sep 20, 2008 12:34 am



Quoting Ojas (Reply 25):
Unlike some people sitting on the high pedestrian and passing judgments as to how I need to grow up.

Let me try and explain that too  Wink

North America was built by an amazing race of people - super tough, able to survive the harshest weather in the world, and accomplish amazing things. Unlike the great Mongol hordes, these pioneers, apart from an occasional scalp or slave, were a benign people. With this heritage, men here really get nervous if you show any feelings (unless you're drunk). If you want to get along, you will need to act really tough, regardless of how you feel. In the end, humanity will show, so forgive those sitting in judgement of you here! It's just another example of culture clash...

I do feel badly about your Middle East experience. I've been told not to employ any sub-continental professionals if I expect any business there. Again, I feel sorry for the less intelligent of our species, but am happy to sell there and take their money back to the good ol' US of A.

The good news about the US is that there's zero racial discrimination, perhaps less than any country I've been to.  thumbsup 

Look, there's always the occasional riff-raff in every country. Don't let the blockheads get to you - they can't help being who they are. (NOT referring to fellow a.netters  Smile )
 
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legacyins
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RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Sat Sep 20, 2008 4:14 am

More than likely, the reason for the delay was due to the US Visit system being down. For those of you not familiar, US Visit is the requirement of having your electronic finger prints and photos taken for all non immigrant visitors. If the system goes down, as it has a few times nation wide, there is no choice but to hold the passengers until it comes up again. There are back up procedures but there is a period of time that needs to go by before going to the back up systems.

US Citizens, Lawful residents and a few others are not required to leave their prints. This is probably why the Officer was yelling out for the above mentioned. It was wrong for not notifying the other individuals waiting without explaining the situation. All US airports have separate lines for US/LPR and visitors.

They have been having problems for the past month bringing in a new system. If I was to take a guess, I would say this is the reason. I have seen it before.
 
sr117
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RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Sat Sep 20, 2008 7:23 am

I had a similar experience at IAD a few months ago when arriving from BRU.., the number of agents asigned to US citizens was split evenly half and half, however us non-us citizens were made to wait about 40-60 minutes while US citizens breezed through. It would not have seemed unreasonable to have only 20% of the customs agents assigned to US citizens given the short processing time... it seems like quite unwelcoming to have guests wait so long at customs.

With regards to the comments about Canadian Immigration.. I can only agree.. I had a terrible time with Canadian immigration, they made me feel most unwelcome and guilty for being on a quick trip in wintertime. Fortunately the guy in secondary inspection was quite a nice guy, otherwise the experience would have been a total nightmare.
 
ojas
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RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Sat Sep 20, 2008 3:14 pm



Quoting Comorin (Reply 28):
Let me try and explain that too

Partially convinced, but I take your word.

I will inform you once I get an official reply from the airline and the reason for that.
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iairallie
Posts: 2326
Joined: Thu May 20, 2004 5:42 am

RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Sun Sep 21, 2008 2:17 am



Quoting Ojas (Reply 31):
I will inform you once I get an official reply from the airline and the reason for that.

The airline has nothing to do with the immigration process. They aren't likely to have any answers for you as the airline very little knowledge of how the immigration officials choose to conduct their duties.
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ojas
Posts: 1104
Joined: Mon Mar 10, 2008 10:23 am

RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Mon Sep 22, 2008 1:07 am



Quoting IAirAllie (Reply 32):
The airline has nothing to do with the immigration process. They aren't likely to have any answers for you as the airline very little knowledge of how the immigration officials choose to conduct their duties.

I know but fortunately when I mentioned this to my friend he suggested me to write to the airline. Having a degree of influence does help there.
Great leaders don't tell you what to do ... they show you how it's done!
 
Dougloid
Posts: 7248
Joined: Tue Jul 05, 2005 2:44 am

RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Mon Sep 22, 2008 2:42 pm



Quoting SR117 (Reply 30):
With regards to the comments about Canadian Immigration.. I can only agree.. I had a terrible time with Canadian immigration, they made me feel most unwelcome and guilty for being on a quick trip in wintertime. Fortunately the guy in secondary inspection was quite a nice guy, otherwise the experience would have been a total nightmare.

I think it depends on which person you draw. My experiences with crossing into Canada at Windsor and other places have been good. People were courteous and civil although the pace was a bit brisk. Coming back into the states was not so nice although all it amounted to was a certain snottiness although it must be said the stress level is pretty high for anyone who works in customs and immigration at the retail level.

I think a lot of people could benefit from charm school. Politeness and civility seem to have gone by the board.



Quoting Ojas (Reply 33):
I know but fortunately when I mentioned this to my friend he suggested me to write to the airline. Having a degree of influence does help there.

You might get some mileage with a nice letter to your ambassador. India's got a lot of horsepower these days.
If you believe in coincidence, you haven't looked close enough-Joe Leaphorn
 
Arrow
Posts: 2325
Joined: Wed Jun 19, 2002 7:44 am

RE: Washington DC Immigration ; Is It Fair?

Mon Sep 22, 2008 3:06 pm



Quoting Comorin (Reply 28):
North America was built by an amazing race of people - super tough, able to survive the harshest weather in the world, and accomplish amazing things. Unlike the great Mongol hordes, these pioneers, apart from an occasional scalp or slave, were a benign people.

Gimmee a break! There's already enough arrogance on this continent without you stoking the flames. And benign? The history of conquest in the last 200 years argues otherwise -- ask the Indians.

Quoting Comorin (Reply 28):
The good news about the US is that there's zero racial discrimination, perhaps less than any country I've been to.

No country in the world can boast zero racial discrimination, including the US. And you'll get arguments I'm sure about how the US rates compared with other democracies.

Quoting SR117 (Reply 30):
With regards to the comments about Canadian Immigration.. I can only agree..

Funny, I've heard this many times now. My own experiences with customs/immigration for both the US and Canada (plus a few European countries) has always been efficient and cordial, occasionally even friendly. The only place I got hassled was in Australia, and even that was pretty mild (and it was my wife's fault -- she had a huge tub of protein powder at a time when everyone was freaking out about anthrax).
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