NAV20
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Bali Bombers Executed In Indonesia

Sun Nov 09, 2008 4:32 am

The October 2002 nightclub bombings in Kuta on the Island of Bali has been described as 'Australia's 9/11.' 202 people were killed, and many others horribly burned; the majority of them Australian tourists. It was especially sad that many of the dead and injured were youngsters, a high proportion of them being sportsmen celebrating the end of the Australian football season.

The three people who loosed off the bombs were eventually caught, tried, and sentenced; and have now been executed by firing-squad.

http://www.theage.com.au/world/bali-...ombers-executed-20081109-5ko7.html

I would like to thank the Indonesian authorities for catching and sentencing these people according to their law; a very courageous act, since their action will not be at all popular with the large number of militants in Indonesian society. Thanks are also due to the Australian Federal Police and the Diplomatic Service, who spent year upon year in patient negotiation with the Indonesian Government to make sure that the case was properly investigated; and even to our politicians on both sides of the political fence, all of whom 'closed ranks' and supported the campaign without a word of dissent.

As to them being executed; I have an open mind on the subject of the death penalty. We don't have it any more in Australia. But there's no doubt that, given that Indonesia still has it, no-one could possibly deserve it more than these three..........
"Once you have flown, you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skywards.." - Leonardo da Vinci
 
HB-IWC
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RE: Bali Bombers Executed In Indonesia

Sun Nov 09, 2008 8:13 am

Here in Indonesia, there is clearly a heightened police and security presence, for fear of retalatory action by extremist militants against western targets, including hotels, apartment buildings and upscale shopping malls as well as various tourist centers accross the country. Let's not forget that, apart from the 2002 Bali bombing, Muslim extremists were also responsible for a second Bali attack as well as the blasts at the Jakarta JW Marriott and the Austrialian embassy.
 
QANTAS077
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RE: Bali Bombers Executed In Indonesia

Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:20 am

bad move, should've left them to rot in a far corner of Indonesia, instead I suspect we'll see more terrorist activity in Indonesia, certainly doesn't look good for 3 of the Bali 9 either.
 
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SOBHI51
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RE: Bali Bombers Executed In Indonesia

Sun Nov 09, 2008 11:15 am

And not a minute too soon.I know this inhuman but they should have been burned to death.Same as a lot of their victims.
I am against any terrorist acts committed under the name of Islam
 
fridgmus
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RE: Bali Bombers Executed In Indonesia

Sun Nov 09, 2008 1:11 pm

Well done and Thank You Indonesia!  bigthumbsup 

And another Well Done and Thank You to the Australian authorities!  bigthumbsup 

Hope the bastards rot in Hell!
The Lockheed Super Constellation, the REAL Queen of the Skies!
 
MadameConcorde
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RE: Bali Bombers Executed In Indonesia

Sun Nov 09, 2008 8:09 pm

Some atrocious form of torture might have been a better solution. Killing them is too easy on these horrible people. To in-human behaviour, in-human consequences and punishment. That death penalty is too light.

Quoting SOBHI51 (Reply 3):

There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
 
ME AVN FAN
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RE: Bali Bombers Executed In Indonesia

Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:28 pm



Quoting NAV20 (Thread starter):
As to them being executed; I have an open mind on the subject of the death penalty. We don't have it any more in Australia. But there's no doubt that, given that Indonesia still has it, no-one could possibly deserve it more than these three..........

-
As much as I am against the death penalty, as Indonesia has it, it is correct that it was carried out
-

Quoting SOBHI51 (Reply 3):
they should have been burned to death

-
Justice wherever is to be done according to the law in place and NOT in the way of "lynch justice"
-

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 5):
Some atrocious form of torture

-
medieval torture chambers at work ? no, you cannot equal mentality and methods of such folks
 
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WarRI1
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RE: Bali Bombers Executed In Indonesia

Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:40 pm

No mercy for them, just killers of innocent people.. They deserved to die.
It is better to die on your feet, than live on your knees.
 
ME AVN FAN
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RE: Bali Bombers Executed In Indonesia

Sun Nov 09, 2008 10:14 pm



Quoting WarRI1 (Reply 7):
No mercy for them, just killers of innocent people.. They deserved to die.

-
What they "deserved" is not the point. The point is that they got punished in accordance with Indonesian law.
 
CupraIbiza
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RE: Bali Bombers Executed In Indonesia

Mon Nov 10, 2008 12:31 am

My personal feelings of vengence wanted them to be removed from this earth. My logical side thinks that unfortunatley this is exactly what they and their supporters wanted. i.e martyrdom. As Qantas077 stated they should have been locked in a jail, with no access to the outside world. No visitors, no correspondence, no frigging internet access like they had.
Everyday is a gift…… but why does it have to be a pair of socks?
 
JoshSixtySeven
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RE: Bali Bombers Executed In Indonesia

Mon Nov 10, 2008 12:33 am



Quoting Fridgmus (Reply 4):
Well done and Thank You Indonesia!

Couldn't agree with you more.

A firing squad seems rather leniant however, I'm sure we could have come up with something FAR more intresting for these animals.
Speed has never killed anyone, it's suddenly becoming stationary that gets you...
 
NAV20
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RE: Bali Bombers Executed In Indonesia

Mon Nov 10, 2008 1:46 am

Looks like a case of 'so far so good' up to now.

The Indonesian security forces are on high alert and Australia has a travel warning out, as you'd expect. But the funerals of the three killers were attended by mobs numbering hundreds rather than thousands, and although there was TV coverage of a bit of 'pushing and shoving' against the police lines, there was no out-and-out violence.

All the signs so far are that militants are very much in the minority in Indonesia. The rest of the place seems to be well aware that they depend on foreign investment, and in particular on the tourist trade (which was, of course, pole-axed by the original Bali bombing).

Full marks too to this bloke. If only more Muslim religious leaders would spell this message out:-

"The head of Indonesia's top Islamic body, the Majelis Ulama Indonesia, denounced the three bombers, saying they had not died as martyrs as they wished.

"To die as a martyr is impossible; people who kill cannot be said to be martyrs unless it is war," MUI head Umar Shihab told detik.com.

"I think it's not right. We are not at war. We are in peace and what they did, they killed Muslims."


http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au...story/0,25197,24626909-601,00.html
"Once you have flown, you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skywards.." - Leonardo da Vinci
 
photopilot
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RE: Bali Bombers Executed In Indonesia

Mon Nov 10, 2008 2:28 am



Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 5):
That death penalty is too light.

 checkmark   checkmark   checkmark 

Quoting JoshSixtySeven (Reply 10):
A firing squad seems rather leniant however, I'm sure we could have come up with something FAR more intresting for these animals.

Personally, I'd have buried them with a slice of Ham in their mouth. Kind of make the rest of the radicals think twice about spending eternity tasting a piece of pork. Martyrdom for these people is seen as some sort of divine ending, so we have to make not death itself abhorent, but what follows has to be the deterent. Hence my solution.
 
Stealthz
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RE: Bali Bombers Executed In Indonesia

Mon Nov 10, 2008 5:39 am

It has been reported that Amrozi, the defiant, smiling one faced the firing squad looking pale and scared... seems only proper to me!
If your camera sends text messages, that could explain why your photos are rubbish!
 
WunalaYann
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RE: Bali Bombers Executed In Indonesia

Mon Nov 10, 2008 6:11 am



Quoting QANTAS077 (Reply 2):
bad move, should've left them to rot in a far corner of Indonesia, instead I suspect we'll see more terrorist activity in Indonesia, certainly doesn't look good for 3 of the Bali 9 either.



Quoting CupraIbiza (Reply 9):
My personal feelings of vengence wanted them to be removed from this earth. My logical side thinks that unfortunatley this is exactly what they and their supporters wanted. i.e martyrdom. As Qantas077 stated they should have been locked in a jail, with no access to the outside world. No visitors, no correspondence, no frigging internet access like they had.

Agreed with you guys.  checkmark 

Unfortunately.
 
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SOBHI51
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RE: Bali Bombers Executed In Indonesia

Mon Nov 10, 2008 6:45 am



Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 6):
Justice wherever is to be done according to the law in place and NOT in the way of "lynch justice"
-

I was in Bali 48 hours after the bombing.Went to see the area.Even from a distance you can still smell the odor of burnt bodies.It was terrible.Smell stayed with me for months.Maybe if you went there you will have my same sentiments.
I am against any terrorist acts committed under the name of Islam
 
MadameConcorde
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RE: Bali Bombers Executed In Indonesia

Mon Nov 10, 2008 7:56 am



Quoting SOBHI51 (Reply 15):

I was there the week after, in Ubud. Denpasar airport was totally deserted, so was Ubud. I took a taxi up to the mountains to stay with my same Balinese family as usual. I did not want to go to Kuta. Never seen Ubud so empty of tourists, hardly one of them. Everybody had gone.
There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
 
ME AVN FAN
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RE: Bali Bombers Executed In Indonesia

Mon Nov 10, 2008 4:43 pm



Quoting SOBHI51 (Reply 15):
.It was terrible

-
What I mean is that the Indonesians were correct to carry the sentence through, as it is justified. Had those men done the same in Western Europe, they would have got life-sentences but not death penalties as the death penalty in Western Europe is abolished. So that it in a way is quite good that they did it in a country where executions still are carried out.
 
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LTU932
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RE: Bali Bombers Executed In Indonesia

Mon Nov 10, 2008 7:09 pm



Quoting CupraIbiza (Reply 9):
My logical side thinks that unfortunatley this is exactly what they and their supporters wanted. i.e martyrdom.

 checkmark 

As much as I am for the death penalty, this unfortunately could have the unwanted side effect that those who were executed, died as martyrs in the eyes of other islamic terrorist.

I would have been in favour of torture and a daily 23 hour a day hard labour shift, simply to crush their spirits, and to crush their bodies, so they would spend the rest of their lives begging for mercy and forgiveness.
 
ME AVN FAN
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RE: Bali Bombers Executed In Indonesia

Mon Nov 10, 2008 7:24 pm



Quoting LTU932 (Reply 18):
I would have been in favour of torture and a daily 23 hour a day hard labour shift, simply to crush their spirits, and to crush their bodies

-
The lawful state is indivisible. You canNOT have a decent and correct law state on Monday, Wednesday and Friday, and a state retaliating against illdoers by some medieval methods on Tuesday and Thursday.
 
NAV20
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RE: Bali Bombers Executed In Indonesia

Tue Nov 11, 2008 1:53 am



Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 19):
You canNOT have a decent and correct law state on Monday, Wednesday and Friday, and a state retaliating against illdoers by some medieval methods on Tuesday and Thursday.

Couldn't agree more. If we sink to their level of savagery we will simply be proving that we are no better than they are.

Quoting Photopilot (Reply 12):
Personally, I'd have buried them with a slice of Ham in their mouth. Kind of make the rest of the radicals think twice about spending eternity tasting a piece of pork.

And THAT would be proving that the 'radicals' are right, in the sense that Christians, Muslims, and Jews are locked into an endless, hate-filled religious war.

In any case, in practical terms, such actions would be counter-productive. The majorty of people worldwide, regardless of their religions, simply want an an end to terrorism and conflict, so that they can get on with living out their lives in peace. If we answer terrorist outrages with outrages of our own, we are simply increasing support for the 'hard-liners' in Muslim countries.

That's why episodes like Guantanamo, Abu Ghraib, and the recent policy of bombing Afghan and Pakistani villages are so ill-advised. They give the radicals ample evidence of our 'wickedness' to use in their recruiting campaigns.

The only chance of ever winning this struggle is to win over the 'hearts and minds' of the ordinary people in the Muslim world. And we won't stand a chance of doing that if we continually answer terrorism with terrorism.
"Once you have flown, you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skywards.." - Leonardo da Vinci
 
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DocLightning
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RE: Bali Bombers Executed In Indonesia

Tue Nov 11, 2008 4:01 am

I have so many different thoughts on this.

First, I could care less what happens to the bombers. Kill them, jail them for life, whatever you want. Just don't let them go free where they can do this again.

The problem is that killing them (or imprisoning them for life) does nothing to prevent this from happening again. They WANTED to die. They are martyrs now and, if their beliefs are correct, they are enjoying the 72(?) virgins.

So, what's the solution? Perhaps a public demonstration of the Chinese "Death by 1000 Cuts"? (Look it up if you're not familiar, but I recommend you do so on an empty stomach).

I just don't know...
-Doc Lightning-

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PPVRA
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RE: Bali Bombers Executed In Indonesia

Tue Nov 11, 2008 4:25 am

Perhaps a good old tarring and feathering can avoid the whole martyrdom thing. Make it an annual event type thing.

 Wink
"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
 
PPVRA
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RE: Bali Bombers Executed In Indonesia

Tue Nov 11, 2008 4:32 am

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 6):

Justice wherever is to be done according to the law in place and NOT in the way of "lynch justice"

Oh bummer, no tarring and feathering I guess. I should have read the thread first  


You are correct, though.

[Edited 2008-11-10 20:32:42]
"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
 
Dougloid
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RE: Bali Bombers Executed In Indonesia

Tue Nov 11, 2008 4:36 am



Quoting DocLightning (Reply 21):
The problem is that killing them (or imprisoning them for life) does nothing to prevent this from happening again. They WANTED to die. They are martyrs now and, if their beliefs are correct, they are enjoying the 72(?) virgins

That's called specific deterrence.
If you believe in coincidence, you haven't looked close enough-Joe Leaphorn
 
babybus
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RE: Bali Bombers Executed In Indonesia

Tue Nov 11, 2008 11:50 am

The trouble with state executions is that they are often using the excuse to get rid of any state enemies.

Let's hope they caught the right people and shot the people actually responsible for that hideous crime.
and with that..cabin crew, seats for landing please.
 
NAV20
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RE: Bali Bombers Executed In Indonesia

Tue Nov 11, 2008 12:37 pm



Quoting DocLightning (Reply 21):
The problem is that killing them (or imprisoning them for life) does nothing to prevent this from happening again. They WANTED to die.

DocLightning, my impression (from seeing them many times on TV, they had almost unlimited access to the media) was that they were so cocky because they expected one of their many appeals against the death penalty to be successful - and that then, one day quite soon, they would have been released under one of the amnesties which are common under the Indonesian system.

They were probably fortified in that belief by the fact that the guy who - in all probability - indocrinated them, and masterminded the bombings, Abu Bakar Bashir, got away with a derisory 30-month sentence and is now free as a bird and still spouting hatred of all non-Muslims, and most moderate Muslims too:-

"MIM: Indonesia is the world's largest Muslim country so there should be no surprise at the slap on the wrist for radical Islamist cleric Bashir, who sanctioned the Bali nightclub massacre, which killed more then 200 people. The lenient sentence provoked outrage in Australia and the United States.

"The photos of the smiling defendants should be a broad clue to the West that many Indonesian legal and justice officials are openly sympathetic to the Islamist agenda of the defendants and that the victims of the terrorist atrocities could not have expected that Muslims would sentence fellow Muslims to appease 'infidel' Westerners.

"The question is as to how long until Bashir will be considered for release, as is the case of bomber Ali Imron, whose lawyer requested Indonesia's president pardon him on the grounds that 'he had shown remorse' and his cooperation with the investigation "had been a big help to Indonesia".

"The corruption is so rampant that it was even documented in a Jakarta News article entitled: Indonesia Mentally ill".

"The mental illness metaphor aptly characterises the schizophrenic mindset of Muslims, who harbor sympathy for the terrorists as co religionsist, and balk when, under pressure from the West, they, are expected mete out justice in accordance with the Western concept of a 'rule of law'. The camaraderie of Indonesia's law enforcement officials with convicted terrorists is the best indication of where the country's true loyalities lie."


http://www.militantislammonitor.org/article/id/474

It's difficult to escape the conclusion that while Indonesia is prepared to sacrifice the small fry on the altar of 'international public opinion,' the prominent militants with high-level establishment contacts will continue to escape with a slap on the wrist.

Nevertheless, I cannot believe that young blokes anywhere will willingly face death just on the basis of religious beliefs. As a practical guy, I think that it's much more likely that they were promised that their bosses' contacts would ensure that they'd never even be arrested - still less executed. And that, right up to the end, they were told that it was 'all arranged' and their appeals would be successful.......

I can only hope that their fate will make it more difficult for evil bastards like Abu Bakar Bashir to recruit the next bunch of eager volunteers to loose off bombs.........
"Once you have flown, you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skywards.." - Leonardo da Vinci
 
ME AVN FAN
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RE: Bali Bombers Executed In Indonesia

Tue Nov 11, 2008 4:31 pm



Quoting Babybus (Reply 25):
trouble with state executions

-
"STATE executions" ? as opposed to "private executions" ? No, the point of course is that the justice-system is to be as independent of the political leadership as possible.
-

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