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HAWK21M
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Waterproof Laptops

Thu Jul 17, 2008 6:25 am

Anyone using Waterproof Laptops on Line Mx.
Out here with Four months of heavy rain a year.
The Existing Laptop needs to be placed inside the vehicle at all times,increasing snag rectification time due easy access to Softcopies of Aircraft Manuals.



Was considering the Toughbook U1.

Any views.

regds
MEL
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dl757md
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RE: Waterproof Laptops

Thu Jul 17, 2008 7:22 am

We use the Toughbook CF-18. Seems like a good laptop for mtc - very durable. I have issues with their stability but I think that's due to what our IT dept has done with them rather than the computer itself. Screen size is pretty small making navigating around wiring diagrams a chore but I don't know of a ruggedized laptop out there with a decent sized screen.

DL757Md
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boeing767mech
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RE: Waterproof Laptops

Thu Jul 17, 2008 11:27 am

We also use the toughbooks. Like DL757md stated they are okay for the MM but suck to use the Wiring Manual. I have used it while my hands where covered in skydrol. It didn't seem to bother it to much after we wipe the computer off. I have seen one take a dive off a work stand during a Elevator PCU change on a 757 and it still worked after the drop.

David
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HAWK21M
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RE: Waterproof Laptops

Thu Jul 17, 2008 4:26 pm



Quoting Boeing767mech (Reply 2):
I have seen one take a dive off a work stand during a Elevator PCU change on a 757 and it still worked after the drop.

Amazing.......This is some super strong notebook.

regds
MEL
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Starlionblue
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RE: Waterproof Laptops

Thu Jul 17, 2008 11:04 pm

Toughbook is really the "industry standard" waterproof, bump-proof laptop.

Quoting Dl757md (Reply 1):
I have issues with their stability but I think that's due to what our IT dept has done with them rather than the computer itself.

Sounds about right. The hardware is seldom to blame for that kind of issue.
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HAWK21M
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RE: Waterproof Laptops

Fri Jul 18, 2008 8:43 am

I normally use the AMM & FIM,But its true WDM does have an issue with screen size.
I'm working on a mobile office in a vehicle currently,so a larger 22" monitor will tackle these problems too.
regds
MEL
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Starlionblue
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RE: Waterproof Laptops

Fri Jul 18, 2008 8:47 am



Quoting HAWK21M (Reply 5):
I'm working on a mobile office in a vehicle currently,so a larger 22" monitor will tackle these problems too.

Yeah a well set up dock with a big monitor is a great idea.

The very largest laptops nowadays have 19 inch monitors. These do stretch the definition of "portable" to the breaking point. Not something you want to lug around too much. And besides they're not durable enough to use in a "mobile fashion".
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HAWK21M
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RE: Waterproof Laptops

Sat Jul 19, 2008 8:05 am



Quoting Starlionblue (Reply 6):
Yeah a well set up dock with a big monitor is a great idea.

The Convertor will supply the AC voltage via the DC Adapter to the equipment from the Vehicle battery.Adding in a Laser printer too,in case a hard copy is needed.
regds
MEL
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hercppmx
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RE: Waterproof Laptops

Sat Jul 19, 2008 11:13 am

Toughbook's are amazing The new Marine Corps aircraft squadrons use them a lot i.e. MV-22, C-130J. And if Marines can't break them very easily i'd have to say it's a good product.
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boeing767mech
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RE: Waterproof Laptops

Sat Jul 19, 2008 1:24 pm



Quoting HercPPMX (Reply 8):
Toughbook's are amazing The new Marine Corps aircraft squadrons use them a lot i.e. MV-22, C-130J. And if Marines can't break them very easily i'd have to say it's a good product.

I had heard when the DOD shopped out for the toughbooks they said it had to be GI proof, no just the Marines but all armed forces. The true test is they need to let the bag smashers at any airline work with them, I have seen them tear things up in ways I have never seen.

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HAWK21M
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RE: Waterproof Laptops

Thu Aug 07, 2008 5:02 pm

Anyone aware of the cost of the Toughbook.approx.
regds
MEL
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BAE146QT
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RE: Waterproof Laptops

Thu Aug 07, 2008 5:16 pm



Quoting HAWK21M (Reply 10):
Anyone aware of the cost of the Toughbook.approx.

Like any other PC hardware, it depends on spec. A 1.8GHz Core2 Duo with 1GB RAM and 80GB HDD is just over a grand, (GBP). Now, that translates to $2100 or so for us here.

But knowing what the world is like, that gives a US sticker price of about $1200 in reality.

(When products are sold in the UK, they just change the dollar sign for a pound sign - which means double the profit with the current exchange rate, (and they can sod off about shipping costs - the thing has already travelled from Taiwan so it makes no difference)).
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HAWK21M
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RE: Waterproof Laptops

Fri Aug 08, 2008 10:38 am



Quoting BAe146QT (Reply 11):
But knowing what the world is like, that gives a US sticker price of about $1200 in reality.

I've just added the approx amount in the 2009 Budget requirements..... Smile
regds
MEL
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Starlionblue
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RE: Waterproof Laptops

Fri Aug 08, 2008 11:37 am



Quoting HAWK21M (Reply 12):

Quoting BAe146QT (Reply 11):
But knowing what the world is like, that gives a US sticker price of about $1200 in reality.

I've just added the approx amount in the 2009 Budget requirements.....

Just remember that in the US there is no sales tax if you order online. (Yes yes I know that isn't 100% accurate...) I don't know about India. So factor that in. Also factor in support costs and such. I would say at least $2500.
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HAWK21M
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RE: Waterproof Laptops

Fri Aug 08, 2008 4:49 pm



Quoting Starlionblue (Reply 13):
I would say at least $2500.

I've stated a range between $1000-3000,depending on the features available at the time.
regds
MEL
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9VSIO
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RE: Waterproof Laptops

Fri Aug 08, 2008 4:53 pm

Are they truly waterproof (as in you can hold them submerged in water) or just splashproof?
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BAE146QT
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RE: Waterproof Laptops

Fri Aug 08, 2008 5:25 pm



Quoting 9VSIO (Reply 15):
Are they truly waterproof (as in you can hold them submerged in water) or just splashproof?

They're certified to MIL-STD-810F, Method 506.4, Procedure III (Drip) with the lid open, apparently.

My understanding of this test is that it's higher than just splashproof, (as it involves pooling water on the keyboard, etc), but that it's not the same as being able to use it while skin-diving.

From what I have seen of so-called green machines*, the port covers are to exclude dust and the like, not to prevent serious water ingress.

You also have processor cooling which requires a flow of air. Either it has a very efficient heat exchanger and internal air recirc, or the processor is open to atmosphere through complex baffles which protect it from splash/drip ingress. But I'm just speculating there.


* So-called because they are military spec, not because they're eco-friendly.
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HAWK21M
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RE: Waterproof Laptops

Sat Aug 09, 2008 1:13 am



Quoting 9VSIO (Reply 15):

Are they truly waterproof (as in you can hold them submerged in water) or just splashproof?

I read someplace,that they can function in 6-12 inches submerged in water.
regds
MEL
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RE: Waterproof Laptops

Sat Aug 09, 2008 1:38 am

Designers do realize that people spill, so good quality laptop and desktop keyboards nowadays have drain holes in the bottom. The keyboard frame is like a bathtub with holes in the bottom. If you pour something on it, the water will drip down to the bottom of the keyboard without entering the innards. It will then drain through holes to the bottom of the laptop (or desktop keyboard), bypassing the shiny stuff inside.

This doesn't mean they will handle being submerged of course, but the Toughbook might. You'll just have to check with the manufacturer.
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bingo
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RE: Waterproof Laptops

Sat Aug 09, 2008 5:01 am



Quoting Boeing767mech (Reply 9):
I had heard when the DOD shopped out for the toughbooks they said it had to be GI proof, no just the Marines but all armed forces. The true test is they need to let the bag smashers at any airline work with them, I have seen them tear things up in ways I have never seen.

The toughbooks are commonly mounted in the passenger side of Hummvees for comms purposes. I have seen half a dozen that have (helped) stop AK-47 rounds that came through windshields Iraq. Its a pretty amazing piece of gear. Dell recently released their version but its no where as durable.
 
gigneil
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RE: Waterproof Laptops

Tue Aug 26, 2008 5:33 am



Quoting Starlionblue (Reply 13):

Just remember that in the US there is no sales tax if you order online. (Yes yes I know that isn't 100% accurate...)

And almost never accurate for big companies like that. Dell, Panasonic, Apple, HP - all charge tax because they have business entities in every state.

MEL - go check them out for yourselves, they're a Panasonic product - http://www.panasonic.com/business/toughbook/toughbook-products.asp

NS
 
kbfispotter
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RE: Waterproof Laptops

Tue Aug 26, 2008 6:41 am



Quoting Dl757md (Reply 1):
Toughbook CF-18

That is what we use.

Quoting Boeing767mech (Reply 2):
I have used it while my hands where covered in skydrol. It didn't seem to bother it to much after we wipe the computer off.

I have seen one get a can of oil (either Skydrol or Mobile 1, I cannot remember what it was) spilled on it, and still work great... Apperently, when management was looking into them, a Panasonic rep came to the office with some and just threw them around, stomped on them, ect. and they still work fine. That says a lot about them I think...

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Starlionblue
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RE: Waterproof Laptops

Tue Aug 26, 2008 7:21 am



Quoting Gigneil (Reply 20):
And almost never accurate for big companies like that. Dell, Panasonic, Apple, HP - all charge tax because they have business entities in every state.

Quite. That totally slipped my mind.  Wink
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HAWK21M
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RE: Waterproof Laptops

Tue Aug 26, 2008 8:10 am



Quoting KBFIspotter (Reply 21):
I have seen one get a can of oil (either Skydrol or Mobile 1, I cannot remember what it was) spilled on it, and still work great...

If it can handle Skydrol,then its got to be really tough & amazing.
regds
MEL
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rwessel
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RE: Waterproof Laptops

Tue Aug 26, 2008 9:14 pm



Quoting Starlionblue (Reply 13):
Just remember that in the US there is no sales tax if you order online. (Yes yes I know that isn't 100% accurate...) I

Actually, every state, and some smaller taxing bodies, in the U.S. with a sales tax assesses a "Use Tax" on out of state purchases (of sales tax eligible items) on which no sales tax is collected by the seller. The amount is invariably identical. The buyer is obligated to pay the Use Tax.

That many (perhaps most) buyers fail to pay the tax they owe, is an enforcement issue, but the tax exists nonetheless.
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: Waterproof Laptops

Mon Dec 29, 2008 3:58 pm



Quoting Rwessel (Reply 24):
That many (perhaps most) buyers fail to pay the tax they owe, is an enforcement issue, but the tax exists nonetheless.

Wouldn't that be tough to avoid?
regds
MEL.
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rwessel
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RE: Waterproof Laptops

Tue Dec 30, 2008 4:47 am



Quoting HAWK21M (Reply 25):
Quoting Rwessel (Reply 24):
That many (perhaps most) buyers fail to pay the tax they owe, is an enforcement issue, but the tax exists nonetheless.

Wouldn't that be tough to avoid?

Not sure I understand the question.

If the seller and buyer were both in state A, the seller would typically be obligated by state A to collect sales tax on purchases, and remit them to the state. And be subject to significant penalties if they don't comply.

The problem with out-of-state transactions is that state A has no legal relationship with a seller in state B (unless that seller also has in presence state A), and cannot compel that seller to comply with state A's sales tax laws. So state A levies a "use tax," equivalent to the sales tax, and obligates the *buyer* to report their purchases and pay the tax. Here in Illinois you file an ST-44 form.

The problem is that this reporting relies on the honesty of the taxpayer, as the state has no practical means to determine what out of state purchases any given resident of the state has made. At least not any method that is economically viable - the state can't audit the out of state vendor (no legal authority), and auditing the taxpayers is an expensive process that will raise only a small amount of money (Illinois use tax on $5,000 of out of state purchases only amounts to $313 – and the average is doubtlessly far less than that).

And no enforcement equals widespread cheating. Although they do get some people, and especially businesses, during audits, often for unrelated matters. Or with some big ticket items (cars, which have to be registered anyway, are a good example).

http://www.revenue.state.il.us/taxforms/Sales/st44.pdf
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: Waterproof Laptops

Wed Dec 31, 2008 1:12 am



Quoting Rwessel (Reply 26):
The problem is that this reporting relies on the honesty of the taxpayer

Do you have a system of filing ones IT returns every year as is out here.
regds
MEL
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fridgmus
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RE: Waterproof Laptops

Wed Dec 31, 2008 10:48 am

We use the Toughbook CF-30.

With all the dust over here they work well. We use them in the rain sometimes as well. Never had a problem. I don't know what they cost, but I saw a guy with his personal CF-30 and I asked him if he wouldn't mind telling what he paid for it. He said with his configuration, approx $4000.00. OUCH!
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HAWK21M
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RE: Waterproof Laptops

Wed Dec 31, 2008 11:43 am



Quoting Fridgmus (Reply 28):
With all the dust over here they work well. We use them in the rain sometimes as well. Never had a problem.

How about impact damage?
regds
MEL....
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fridgmus
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RE: Waterproof Laptops

Fri Jan 02, 2009 11:28 am

Hi MEL,

We have dropped a few on to the ground (dirt/gravel) from about 4 feet up. It's only happened a few times and one of them twice. They hit the ground on their sides and they have continued to function, although the touch pad on one does not work but I don't know if that was caused by the fall. It occurred before I arrived here.

On most of them the touch screen function does not work, again, I don't know if that was the result of the fall. They do need to be serviced though. For what we do with them (sorry, can't tell you) they are the only laptop we can use.

Other than that, they work fine and they are never connected to the internet.

Take care,

F
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HAWK21M
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RE: Waterproof Laptops

Fri Jan 02, 2009 4:06 pm



Quoting Fridgmus (Reply 30):
We have dropped a few on to the ground (dirt/gravel) from about 4 feet up

I would think from a trestle 15ft drop functioning will be the ultimate test.
regds
MEL
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bristolflyer
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RE: Waterproof Laptops

Fri Jan 02, 2009 4:27 pm

How about one of these?  wink 

Computer 'review' starts a few seconds in.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I3IDKPVPdu4

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