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stasisLAX
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Time Magazine's 25 People To Blame For Economy

Mon Feb 16, 2009 11:49 pm

Time Magazine's most recent edition is "playing the blame game" regarding the ongoing global financial crisis.

"The modern civilized state claims a monopoly on punishment. Mobs with pitchforks, vigilantism, frontier justice — all seem sweaty and coarse compared with the men in powdered wigs duly processing the law. But as this crisis makes clear, we are in a new frontier now, in financial badlands created by technology and globalization, with no maps and few rules, and the law has not caught up to us. Until it does, we are left with the old sanctions: symbols and shame. That still leaves the problem of knowing whom precisely to scorn. "Capitalism," John Maynard Keynes once argued, "is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone." It is tempting to blame the whole political-industrial complex, starting with whoever first had the idea of lending $750,000 to someone making $17,000 a year; the regulators who said that was O.K. and the politicians who encouraged them; the financial geniuses who rolled up all those mistakes into a big ball of bad loans, chopped them up and sold them; and above all, the presiding executives who got performance bonuses whether they performed or not, buying and selling things whose value they could not possibly know, finding ways to reduce risk that instead greatly increased it, unleashing on the markets what Warren Buffett called "financial weapons of mass destruction."

The problem with smashing the whole system, however, is that it's a lazy answer to a fierce challenge. Modern capitalism has created unprecedented wealth in our lifetime, shown its power to lift people out of poverty and spread a culture of competitive genius. So we make a case for who got us here, and who might have saved us and didn't. Even faith itself can be faulted when it turns into blind optimism that sees no risk, hears no sirens. There are plenty of prosecutors who will have a chance to make their case against anyone who crossed a line. But there are also culprits who committed no crime, bankers and builders and prophets and Presidents, and the face in the mirror — since many of us in the mob now wish to punish those who gave us just what we asked for."

Source: http://www.time.com/time/business/article/0,8599,1878939,00.html

Top Five People to Blame for the Current Global Financial Crisis

1. Phil Gramm
2. Christopher Cox
3. Angelo Mozilo
4. Joe Cassano
5. Franklin Raines

Time's list of the top 25 people to Blame at: http://www.time.com/time/specials/pa...le/0,28804,1877351_1878509,00.html
"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety!" B.Franklin
 
EMBQA
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RE: Time Magazine's 25 People To Blame For Economy

Tue Feb 17, 2009 3:36 am

Bill Clinton only made 23...??? It was his administration that passed the legislation that allowed these now defaulting home loans to be issued.
"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
 
AGM100
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RE: Time Magazine's 25 People To Blame For Economy

Tue Feb 17, 2009 4:05 am



Quoting EMBQA (Reply 1):
Bill Clinton only made 23...???

Well they were hoping.... Time Mag ...  spin 

"This biggest problem the FM's have is your witch hunt sir" Barney Frank , Chis Dodd , Maxinne Waters at the 2000 HUD hearings. Oh well , who cares now .
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Confuscius
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RE: Time Magazine's 25 People To Blame For Economy

Tue Feb 17, 2009 4:15 am



Quoting EMBQA (Reply 1):
Bill Clinton only made 23...???

I voted 1 for him (innocent) and 10 (guilty) for George W. Bush.  bigthumbsup 
Ain't I a stinker?
 
EMBQA
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RE: Time Magazine's 25 People To Blame For Economy

Tue Feb 17, 2009 4:17 am

Quoting Confuscius (Reply 3):
I voted 1 for him (innocent) and 10 (guilty) for George W. Bush

Yea... do a little research before making a statement like that...........

http://articles.latimes.com/1999/may/31/news/mn-42807
http://www.businessweek.com/the_thre...chives/2008/02/clintons_drive.html

[Edited 2009-02-16 20:20:06]
"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
 
rfields5421
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RE: Time Magazine's 25 People To Blame For Economy

Tue Feb 17, 2009 4:19 am



Quoting EMBQA (Reply 1):
Bill Clinton only made 23...??? It was his administration that passed the legislation that allowed these now defaulting home loans to be issued.

Even if that were not fiction - Clinton, or any President, is not at a detail level to be a key architect of such legislation. The President is just the front man.

But the math proves conclusively the deregulation of banks and removal of the minimum compliance requirements is much more at fault for the financial sleight of hand that created the defaulting loans more than the legislation.

Given the fact that the majority of the defaulting, troubled loans are not those encouraged under the legislation - but the totally unregulated loans which have no connection to the low income programs.

The big problem though comes in one and one-half to two years when the first of the super balloon and the interest only loans made under regulations implement since 2001 start coming due.

Estimates are that for every failed loan currently, there will be two to three failures starting 2010.
 
Confuscius
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RE: Time Magazine's 25 People To Blame For Economy

Tue Feb 17, 2009 4:25 am



Quoting EMBQA (Reply 4):
Yea... do a little research before making a statement like that...........

I just voted again...the same results. Big grin
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EA CO AS
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RE: Time Magazine's 25 People To Blame For Economy

Tue Feb 17, 2009 5:15 pm



Quoting Confuscius (Reply 3):
Quoting EMBQA (Reply 1):
Bill Clinton only made 23...???

I voted 1 for him (innocent) and 10 (guilty) for George W. Bush.

Gosh, that's so weird! My votes are exactly the opposite and cancel yours out.

Repeatedly.  bigthumbsup 
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
Confuscius
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RE: Time Magazine's 25 People To Blame For Economy

Tue Feb 17, 2009 5:37 pm



Quoting EA CO AS (Reply 7):
Gosh, that's so weird! My votes are exactly the opposite and cancel yours out.

Repeatedly.

Oh yeah? I enlisted ACORN to do the voting! You lose!
Ain't I a stinker?
 
AGM100
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RE: Time Magazine's 25 People To Blame For Economy

Tue Feb 17, 2009 6:28 pm

Personally I believe the " DNC " should be on the list somewhere. They certainly jumped on the band-waggon and laid out the press briefings required to slow down the economy. I will concede that there was certainly problems in the system , but they grabbed the bullhorn and made sure we all new it over and over. They saw it as the golden rails to power , it just could not have worked out better for them.
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JakeOrion
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RE: Time Magazine's 25 People To Blame For Economy

Tue Feb 17, 2009 6:39 pm



Quoting AGM100 (Reply 9):
Personally I believe the " DNC " should be on the list somewhere.

Don't just blame the DNC AGM, the RNC is just as guilty for not at least attempting to stop this mess when they had the chance to do so.
Every problem has a simple solution; finding the simple solution is the difficult problem.
 
AGM100
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RE: Time Magazine's 25 People To Blame For Economy

Tue Feb 17, 2009 8:16 pm



Quoting JakeOrion (Reply 10):
RNC is just as guilty for not at least attempting to stop this mess when they had the chance to do so.

 checkmark 

For argument sake , there were warnings coming out of the committees looking into Sub prime. Simply put , it was dismissed by the Dem's ... and laughed at by Barney's friends. That being said , it does not excuse the republicans for not amping it up and breaking down the walls. The President should have taken the club into the chicken house early and often . He Failed the American people big time.

However , when the DNC needed a platform ... they simply kicked the leg out under the stool and grabbed a micro phone..errr CNN ...MSNBC , NYT. They could not run on the war in Iraq because it was getting cleaned up ... so they chose the economy and made it so.
You dig the hole .. I fill the hole . 100% employment !
 
pacificjourney
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RE: Time Magazine's 25 People To Blame For Economy

Tue Feb 17, 2009 8:50 pm

Glad to see that only Americans are to blame !

Has Time magazine gone completely down the shitter or what ?
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AGM100
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RE: Time Magazine's 25 People To Blame For Economy

Tue Feb 17, 2009 10:36 pm



Quoting Pacificjourney (Reply 12):
Americans are to blame !

Well we are the largest economy and largest manufacturer in the world ... so it is our responsibility to do it right . We have been betrayed by greedy insiders .. both in government and private sector. They are traitors , and should be dealt with as so.
You dig the hole .. I fill the hole . 100% employment !
 
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NZ107
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RE: Time Magazine's 25 People To Blame For Economy

Tue Feb 17, 2009 10:56 pm



Quoting Pacificjourney (Reply 12):
Glad to see that only Americans are to blame !

Since when was Wen Jiabao an American?
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allrite
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RE: Time Magazine's 25 People To Blame For Economy

Tue Feb 17, 2009 11:16 pm



Quoting NZ107 (Reply 14):
Since when was Wen Jiabao an American?

Doesn't he own America['s national debt]?  Wink
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WunalaYann
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RE: Time Magazine's 25 People To Blame For Economy

Tue Feb 17, 2009 11:17 pm



Quoting AGM100 (Reply 13):
Well we are the largest economy and largest manufacturer in the world ... so it is our responsibility to do it right .

I disagree. Not with the fact the US is the world's largest economy, but with the implication of your statement that the US "doing it right" would somehow absolve the rest of the world from devising and enforcing responsible banking regulations. I think it is a collective, global failure to assess and price financial and business risk that, while mainly originating from Wall St, has contaminated the vast majority of the world's financial hubs, to varying degrees.

As for some of "them" (whoever that is) being traitors, I think a few well-aimed FBI enquiries (in the US, and from other investigative agencies in other countries) will eventually lay responsibilities bare.

 Smile
 
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Aaron747
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RE: Time Magazine's 25 People To Blame For Economy

Tue Feb 17, 2009 11:36 pm



Quoting WunalaYann (Reply 16):
As for some of "them" (whoever that is) being traitors, I think a few well-aimed FBI enquiries (in the US, and from other investigative agencies in other countries) will eventually lay responsibilities bare.

Not by this administration. You forget where Mr. Obama went to school. I remain convinced that we won't see any of these crooks end up in prison where they rightfully belong.

A good commentary from a conservative writer on the subject of who these people (traitors, if you will) really are:

http://www.victorhanson.com/articles/hanson021609.html
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
WunalaYann
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RE: Time Magazine's 25 People To Blame For Economy

Wed Feb 18, 2009 2:42 am



Quoting Aaron747 (Reply 17):
Not by this administration. You forget where Mr. Obama went to school. I remain convinced that we won't see any of these crooks end up in prison where they rightfully belong.

Thanks for dashing my hopes... Although I was more hoping for them to pay back their giant bonuses and dividends and be kept at safe distance from anyone else's hard-earned money than to go to jail where they would contribute nothing while costing the taxpayer.

 Smile

Quoting Aaron747 (Reply 17):
A good commentary from a conservative writer on the subject of who these people (traitors, if you will) really are:

http://www.victorhanson.com/articles....html

Blimey. It is so sharp that I copied it into a Word document and am about to send it to one of my (Republican) friends who works on Wall St and cringes when she hears that the $18.4b bonuses paid to banking executives for the 2008 financial year are shameful. Thanks!!  Wink
 
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EA CO AS
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RE: Time Magazine's 25 People To Blame For Economy

Wed Feb 18, 2009 8:14 am



Quoting Confuscius (Reply 8):
Quoting EA CO AS (Reply 7):
Gosh, that's so weird! My votes are exactly the opposite and cancel yours out.

Repeatedly.

Oh yeah? I enlisted ACORN to do the voting! You lose!

 rotfl 

Well played!
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
Danfearn77
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RE: Time Magazine's 25 People To Blame For Economy

Wed Feb 18, 2009 8:18 am

The more shocking thing is that good old Gordon Brown doesnt even make the list.
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