ANCFlyer
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Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Tue Apr 07, 2009 7:07 am

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009...tion-raids-ensure-accurate-census/

Seems we're going to try to stop enforcing Illegal Immigration laws so the Census folks can get a few more bodies counted.

Now I see why Obama pulled the Census under the White House wing . . . .
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Aaron747
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Tue Apr 07, 2009 9:09 am



Quoting ANCFlyer (Thread starter):
Now I see why Obama pulled the Census under the White House wing . . . .

No kidding - this has potential for the greatest exercise in gerrymandering since the 1960s. It's outrageous, it's an affront to rule of law in its most basic form, and everyone should start demanding that this get killed - NOW.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
BN747
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Wed Apr 08, 2009 9:46 am

Quoting Aaron747 (Reply 1):
No kidding - this has potential for the greatest exercise in gerrymandering since the 1960s. It's outrageous, it's an affront to rule of law in its most basic form, and everyone should start demanding that this get killed - NOW.

Oh please spare me the drama, these raids have been racist from the start! I know you're not Japanese, but your affinity for the people and the culture is no great secret..if people of Japanese ancestry were hunted down like latinos here...you'd be the 1st all over the map crying fowl. I've met/known so many people that are living here illegally it isn't funny! Canucks, Aussies, Kiwis, Chinese, Thais, Japanese, Latinos, every type of Euro you can imagine. And to single these people out with these stupid racist raids makes my skin crawl.

The sight I'll never forget nearly some two years ago was of two Immigration officers in full gear struting down Sunset Blvd. This really pissed me off because the last thing we need in a free America is uniformed officers of every persuasion crawling all over public streets. Before that I'd that I'd seen two full dressed Marine recruiters cruising down Beverly Drive in Beverly Hills (this was the peak the of the Iraq Invasion mind you)...it appeared these guys thought they'd get that 'thanks for serving our country' pat-on-the-back stuff they were getting everywhere at the height of the conflict...well it didn't play out that way here that day....as this was the bastion of anti-war fervor and a very anti-Bush area. I don't know what they were thinking..but after a barrage of icy stares..they jumped in their cars and get the hell outta here. Today, they could return and lunch would probably be on the house...the point is no one likes militarism or such images forced down their throats .. esp. when they can see the motivation behind it is bogus and false. That's where this whole immigration BS ticks me off...it's racist and we can do a better job at enforcing illegal immigration if chose to do so.

These raids need to end permanently!

BN747

[Edited 2009-04-08 02:49:15]
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
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Aaron747
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Wed Apr 08, 2009 10:44 am



Quoting BN747 (Reply 2):
That's where this whole immigration BS ticks me off...it's racist and we can do a better job at enforcing illegal immigration if chose to do so.

Raids are a better way of enforcing it for the illegal people already in the country - especially when they target exploitative employers. There's nothing racist about it - have you even looked at the majority of Border Patrol staff and ICE team members? Invariably Latino and Asian Americans are well represented on their staffs...don't give me that racist charge. My maternal grandparents are Mexican Americans and they don't pull out the racist charge either.

Quoting BN747 (Reply 2):
I know you're not Japanese, but your affinity for the people and the culture is no great secret..if people of Japanese ancestry were hunted down like latinos here...you'd be the 1st all over the map crying fowl.

Nonsense - I've met Japanese in LA overstaying student visas and gave them terse words about what they were doing. My wife's friend stayed over a year after her stint at Santa Monica College to "study English" ended, when she was actually just waiting till her American boyfriend proposed to her rather than leaving and risk ending it. Either way we told her it was dumb and illegal. My wife refused to report her but as a legal immigrant to Japan I wouldn't hestitate to report someone staying here illegally if I could verify it - why should they get a free ride when I had to satisfy the residency requirements, join the national healthcare system and pay taxes like everyone else?
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
BN747
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Wed Apr 08, 2009 11:32 am



Quoting Aaron747 (Reply 3):

Raids are a better way of enforcing it for the illegal people already in the country - especially when they target exploitative employers. There's nothing racist about it - have you even looked at the majority of Border Patrol staff and ICE team members? Invariably Latino and Asian Americans are well represented on their staffs...don't give me that racist charge. My maternal grandparents are Mexican Americans and they don't pull out the racist charge either.

The employing of 'one of them' to track 'them' ...and you think that tactic is new? Some slave owners use to have 'blacks' whip other black slaves so they could sleep easier at night. The practice of 'them policing them' is old as sand and racism at it's most clever.

Because those people have to eat, they have families to feed, it's a job. And no matter how much you justify it as 'it's against the law..those same enforcers end up hating themselves what they've done when look back and take an accounting of their contributions. But good to see you buying into the theory and practice.

Quoting Aaron747 (Reply 3):
Nonsense - I've met Japanese in LA overstaying student visas and gave them terse words about what they were doing. My wife's friend stayed over a year after her stint at Santa Monica College to "study English" ended, when she was actually just waiting till her American boyfriend proposed to her rather than leaving and risk ending it. Either way we told her it was dumb and illegal. My wife refused to report her but as a legal immigrant to Japan I wouldn't hestitate to report someone staying here illegally if I could verify it -

Most telling phrase...

Quoting Aaron747 (Reply 3):
My wife refused to report her but as a legal immigrant to Japan I wouldn't hestitate to report someone

My hat off to your wife, she's a pair made of steel and very attuned to the unequaled practice of enforcement. Your position..I can only shake my head in disgust...not because of so willing to rat someone out..but because of being someone who appears quite worldly, you so eagerly believe the 'illegality BS' con job being sold to the American people as an issue.

Why I don't fall for Joe Average getting all caught up in the whole 'immigration' thing? ...because they're being played like 1st rate chumps. I've seen so many wealthy foreigners leap frog over the slanted immigration rules because they have the financial might to do so..while typical immigrant must to jump thru hellish hoops just get a chance. And if you don't thing your average Congressman isn't aware of this..you're missing the boat by universal mile. Your wife understands something very basic that you clearly do not or have forgotten completely... and that is people without much 'want to better their situation', they are willing to risk it all in pursuit of it. They also know the laws you boast about .. are unjust and see others getting around it left and right. They're seen people encounter crooked immigration officials or taken for a ride by crooked immigration lawyers..they know what you preach about written in black & white omits the true stories seen in real life.

It's like the Saigon evacuation situation...you're in line with your family waiting..orderly. You know time is running out. A few other choppers land.. do you..

A) Stay put ' family, just be patient and wait....our turn will come.

B) Break the line, snatch up your family and race like hell to be 1st in line for the nearest chopper.

..you come off as Candidate A - all the way.

For many illegals knowing 'no real future' awaits them at home, and their financial resources are very limited...they can do the math...and count the choppers. Time is ticking. There but for the grace of god go I.


BN747
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N867DA
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Wed Apr 08, 2009 11:46 am

Can we ask the police to stop handing out speeding tickets for the three months before my auto insurance renews? I think that's the best way to ensure an accurate portrayal of my driving.  Yeah sure

This is just ridiculous.
A nation turns its lonely eyes to you
 
dxing
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Wed Apr 08, 2009 2:00 pm



Quoting BN747 (Reply 2):
Oh please spare me the drama, these raids have been racist from the start!

??? How is a raid intended to pick off illegals racist if the vast majority of the illegals are latino? Are there thousands of Tongans swimming across the ocean to get here that we don't know about?

Quoting BN747 (Reply 2):
These raids need to end permanently!

In other words we should not enforce the law. Well then I can certainly understand why you would have the position that they should be included in census.

As for myself, if you can't prove you are a citizen then you have no right to be counted, to vote, or to be taxed. If you are an alien and can't prove you are here legally at the drop of a hat, you get a free ride to the nearest border. I find it is my responsibility to have my passport with appropriate visa or immigration stamp on me at all times when I am travelling abroad.
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BN747
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Wed Apr 08, 2009 2:03 pm



Quoting N867DA (Reply 5):
Can we ask the police to stop handing out speeding tickets for the three months before my auto insurance renews? I think that's the best way to ensure an accurate portrayal of my driving. Yeah sure

This is just ridiculous.

Perhaps, but while the cops are ticketing you... do you think no one else is going to speed, make illegal U turns and run red lights? We do it ...because we tell ourselves..'Who is gonna know? Who is it gonna hurt?"... that is until we get caught.

BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
slider
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Wed Apr 08, 2009 7:04 pm

Impeachment proceedings should commence immediately. This is another flagrant violation of the US Constitution, plain and simple. It’s one of the very few enumerated and specified provisions of the Constitution and has been and is being deliberately torn asunder. The Census is now another political tool to be exploited by the party in power for the purpose of growing Federal government, further entrenching themselves in power, and stealing liberty.

Quoting BN747 (Reply 2):
Oh please spare me the drama, these raids have been racist from the start!

Erroneous. Nice strawman attempt though. I’m not going to insult your intelligence by suggesting you believe what you just said. Considering the overwhelming majority of illegals are in fact of a different race and don’t assimilate, naturally they stand out and therefore absolutely should be rounded up.
 
mham001
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Wed Apr 08, 2009 7:19 pm

We wouldn't need raids if the ACLU and immigrant rights groups didn't have the instant verification program tied up in court.
 
sv7887
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Wed Apr 08, 2009 7:34 pm



Quoting BN747 (Reply 4):
I can only shake my head in disgust...not because of so willing to rat someone out..but because of being someone who appears quite worldly, you so eagerly believe the 'illegality BS' con job being sold to the American people as an issue

Here's some facts on the matter:

When the meatpacking plants were raised, those illegal workers were replaced with Americans and for higher wages. Not so bad isn't it?

Source:http://www.columbustelegram.com/articles/2006/12/20/news/news3raid.txt

"At the four facilities for which we were able to obtain information, wages and bonuses rose on average 8 percent with the departure of illegal immigrants."

Kammer says that Swift used pay increases and signing bonuses to staff the plants after the raids, but bringing up wages wouldn't necessarily correlate to a hike in consumer prices."

http://thehill.com/leading-the-news/...-immigration-raids-2009-03-18.html

So to recap: Illegal immigrants were kicked out and replaced with Americans at higher wages? Oh such a bad thing....

Quoting BN747 (Reply 2):
Oh please spare me the drama, these raids have been racist from the start!

Ah, the race card once again...Tell them to get in line like my parents and brother in law did.

Quoting BN747 (Reply 4):
Because those people have to eat, they have families to feed, it's a job. And no matter how much you justify it as 'it's against the law..those same enforcers end up hating themselves what they've done when look back and take an accounting of their contributions. But good to see you buying into the theory and practice.

These people damn well know what they are doing and the risks associated with it. It's a direct insult to the millions of LEGAL immigrants like my family who waited in line. My dad could have played the same games to get into the UK but he didn't. He waited his turn, got a student visa and actually EARNED his right to stay in the UK.

But what that requires actually learning the language, studying. and working hard? Oops..You want to work in the best country in the world? You damn well earn that right...We sure did...
 
N867DA
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Wed Apr 08, 2009 9:31 pm



Quoting Slider (Reply 8):
Impeachment proceedings should commence immediately.

Why? It sounds like something that was done in 2000 under Clinton and 1990 under Bush Sr. I don't think they faced such scrutiny.

Quoting BN747 (Reply 7):
Perhaps, but while the cops are ticketing you... do you think no one else is going to speed, make illegal U turns and run red lights? We do it ...because we tell ourselves..'Who is gonna know? Who is it gonna hurt?"... that is until we get caught.

And if I am caught, I pay the fine and follow the law. Jumping the border and protesting for amnesty is like asking the police to let me break laws I don't like. Sorry, but it just doesn't work that way.

As a person born in a country with widespread poverty, I understand the reasons why some people try to come into this country illegally. But that doesn't make it right.
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UAL747
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Wed Apr 08, 2009 11:25 pm

I think some people are thinking that this is a Democrat win situation and a Republican loose situation, when in fact, it is not. Most of the states that would gain seats if immigration raids were stopped would be red states, and about twice as many blue states would lose seats.

UAL
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BN747
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Thu Apr 09, 2009 1:29 am



Quoting N867DA (Reply 11):
Quoting Slider (Reply 8):
Impeachment proceedings should commence immediately.

Why? It sounds like something that was done in 2000 under Clinton and 1990 under Bush Sr. I don't think they faced such scrutiny

Easy, that's because it's Obama in the chair and not Clinton or Bush.

Quoting N867DA (Reply 11):

And if I am caught, I pay the fine and follow the law. Jumping the border and protesting for amnesty is like asking the police to let me break laws I don't like. Sorry, but it just doesn't work that way.

You have never tried to wiggle out of a ticket? I must say, I'm batting at .500 in that department..and that's at the infraction..not going that to court to fight it crap.

But many of us don't 'follow the law' after that...we go right back to doing it again...

Quoting N867DA (Reply 11):

As a person born in a country with widespread poverty, I understand the reasons why some people try to come into this country illegally. But that doesn't make it right.

Very true, and agreed. And I'm glad you've a little more understanding as to 'why' versus the red-meaters who don't.

No it doesn't make it right, I must say..were it me, I'd have to say I'd be lying if I said 'I wouldn't try it'. Again, there but for the grace of god go I.

BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
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WarRI1
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Thu Apr 09, 2009 3:13 am



Quoting Mham001 (Reply 9):
We wouldn't need raids if the ACLU and immigrant rights groups didn't have the instant verification program tied up in court.

The ACLU was just handed a setback in Rhode Island in court. Our governor issued an order in the last year ordering all vendors doing business with the state to use E-Verify, this after we had illegal immigrants cleaning our courts and state buildings and copying documents at night. The ACLU of course disagreed and challenged it in court. They were overuled by the court, of course they vow to appeal. I say, kick them to hell out, if they came here illegally. Cheap Labor, once again.
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N328KF
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Thu Apr 09, 2009 3:25 am



Quoting BN747 (Reply 4):
My hat off to your wife, she's a pair made of steel and very attuned to the unequaled practice of enforcement. Your position..I can only shake my head in disgust...not because of so willing to rat someone out..but because of being someone who appears quite worldly, you so eagerly believe the 'illegality BS' con job being sold to the American people as an issue.

I want you to understand something, and I want you to get it into your skull, as hard as it might be.

You do not have to be racist and/or white to have a beef with illegal immigrants.

Many legal immigrants have a serious problem with illegals because they basically short-cutted the system and are trying to enjoy benefits without signing the guestbook on the way in. This is not a race thing. Legal immigrants are proud to have done everything properly and this issue incenses us. I don't care if the person is Mexican, African, Russian, or Canadian. They have to come in the right way or go back. Period.
When they call the roll in the Senate, the Senators do not know whether to answer 'Present' or 'Not guilty.' -Theodore Roosevelt
 
LAXintl
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Thu Apr 09, 2009 3:25 am

Legal or not, its critical these folks get counted as otherwise cities and States stand to loose large sums on money.

In Los Angeles City for instance, it was estimated the 2000 Census under count has cost the City loss of $200 million in the last decade in various funding, and has launched a campaign featuring celebrities to encourage full participation.

The people are here, and government is providing services from roads, to medical services so they might as well be properly reimbursed.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
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WarRI1
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Thu Apr 09, 2009 3:38 am



Quoting LAXintl (Reply 16):
Legal or not, its critical these folks get counted as otherwise cities and States stand to loose large sums on money.

Maybe if the cities and states did not get re-imbursed, they would throw them out like they should have in the beginning. I was just out in LA, I thought I was in a third world country. Too dam bad for sanctuary cities. Enforce existing law, never mind trying to make money on illegals.
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WarRI1
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Thu Apr 09, 2009 3:41 am



Quoting N328KF (Reply 15):
want you to understand something, and I want you to get it into your skull, as hard as it might be.

You do not have to be racist and/or white to have a beef with illegal immigrants.

 checkmark   checkmark 


I'll second that, these folks are always playing the race card.
It is better to die on your feet, than live on your knees.
 
BN747
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Thu Apr 09, 2009 8:42 am



Quoting N328KF (Reply 15):

You do not have to be racist and/or white to have a beef with illegal immigrants.

I never said that you had to be...

Quoting N328KF (Reply 15):
I want you to understand something, and I want you to get it into your skull, as hard as it might be.

Many legal immigrants have a serious problem with illegals because they basically short-cutted the system and are trying to enjoy benefits without signing the guestbook on the way in. This is not a race thing. Legal immigrants are proud to have done everything properly and this issue incenses us. I don't care if the person is Mexican, African, Russian, or Canadian. They have to come in the right way or go back. Period.

Now here's something for your thick skull called facts. Many wealthy people are circumventing the very same system by buying their way into legal status. It shouldn't be for sale. You're not griping about that..so you must approve of it. Immigrations raids should include rustling up white taxi drivers,hotel doormen/staff, bartenders, waiters who could illegally here from anywhere to Canada, New Zealand to Romania and France (I've met plenty)...but that isn't being done. It is the brown poor ones and them alone being harrassed by this one-sided racist behavior and like it or not..you're being played politically into supporting it whether you want to recognize that or not.

Quoting WarRI1 (Reply 18):
I'll second that, these folks are always playing the race card.



Quoting Sv7887 (Reply 10):
Ah, the race card once again.

And i'm just curious, do either of you experts have any idea when "the race card"
should be played.

BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
AGM100
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Thu Apr 09, 2009 5:02 pm



Quoting ANCFlyer (Thread starter):
Census folks

ACORN .... Already openly exposed as fraudulent and totally fixed left wing activist group... is now going to be counting people ? How convenient ... how sweetly convenient . How can this happen ?? How can a operative group so tied to President Obama ... and so exposed for voter registration fraud even be considered for the program ? Not to mention the census being organized from the executive branch for the first time ever . Amazing , just amazing.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009...akers-concerned-role-acorn-census/

The attention of ACORN and Al Sharp ton have now been directed to our state ( Az). Of course it is all about Red State operations. The DNC with ACORN are actively attempting to re write the political maps in the US . Now with ACORN making up the census (like voter reg) you can see how this will happen. But first ...they must get all of the illegals hiding out in Phoenix to jump on there side. Thus , they are going head to head with Sheriff Joe Arpaio .. the one person illegal aliens fear the most ... in the entire USA to be honest. Sheriff Joe will lose sadly... the mayor of Phoenix is nothing more than a operative for the left agenda and has openly lobbied for total amnesty.

Ya better pay attention to this ... but of course we are powerless to stop is now.
You dig the hole .. I fill the hole . 100% employment !
 
slider
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Thu Apr 09, 2009 5:54 pm



Quoting BN747 (Reply 13):
Easy, that's because it's Obama in the chair and not Clinton or Bush.

I’m on record as supporting the Constitution no matter the occupant of 1600. This is quite clear and established.

One must acknowledge, however, that this play for census control is far beyond what Clinton or Bush did.
 
mt99
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Thu Apr 09, 2009 6:00 pm



Quoting AGM100 (Reply 20):
Ya better pay attention to this ... but of course we are powerless to stop is now.

So.. which country will you moving too? Canada was a popular destination in the Bush years...
Step into my office, baby
 
Yellowstone
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Thu Apr 09, 2009 6:11 pm

I find it odd that people are complaining about the Obama administration trying to do their job properly. The 14th Amendment reads,

Quote:
Representatives shall be apportioned among the several States according to their respective numbers, counting the whole number of persons in each State, excluding Indians not taxed.

It's the administration's job to try to get the most accurate possible count of the number of "whole persons" in each state, which includes illegal aliens. I think (and I'm guessing several of you would agree with me) that apportionment should be based on legal residents, but that's not what the Constitution says. Until someone amends it, the administration has to count illegal aliens, and a temporary reprieve on immigration raids will help with that effort.
Hydrogen is an odorless, colorless gas which, given enough time, turns into people.
 
AGM100
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Thu Apr 09, 2009 7:05 pm



Quoting Mt99 (Reply 22):
So.. which country will you moving too? Canada was a popular destination in the Bush years...

Popular for Baldwin ,Suranden and her husband ..none of them had the nads to do it though .. ! No I will fight and die right here thanks .

Quoting Yellowstone (Reply 23):
It's the administration's job to try to get the most accurate possible count of the number of "whole persons

No argument there ... but if you can not see a side track plan here then I don't know what to say. Basically we have operatives for a political party , working to swell there voter ranks by including illegal immigrants as well as possibly plain old fraudulent counting ACORN style. As much as you may despise the other side ..we still need each other. If we end up with one all powerful party then none of us are served well.
You dig the hole .. I fill the hole . 100% employment !
 
santosdumont
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Thu Apr 09, 2009 7:24 pm

Just curious as to where the outrage is -- if any -- over the estimated 30,000 undocumented Irish living in New York City alone. (see the 8 April 2007 edition of the Los Angeles Times
"Pursuit Of Truth No Matter Where It Lies" -- Metallica
 
AGM100
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Thu Apr 09, 2009 7:44 pm



Quoting Santosdumont (Reply 25):
Just curious as to where the outrage is --

Making it a race issue is self defeating and dangerous . It will only create resentment if and when the illegals are all granted amnesty . My position is ...uphold our laws I don't care what color skin you have. period.
You dig the hole .. I fill the hole . 100% employment !
 
mt99
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Thu Apr 09, 2009 7:48 pm



Quoting AGM100 (Reply 26):
My position is ...uphold our laws I don't care what color skin you have. period.

You are fair man. Now, can you say that your position is shared by everyone?
Step into my office, baby
 
santosdumont
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Thu Apr 09, 2009 7:56 pm



Quoting AGM100 (Reply 26):
Quoting Santosdumont (Reply 25):
Just curious as to where the outrage is --

Making it a race issue is self defeating and dangerous .

Ultimately, I think it's human nature. If you were an adviser to (then) Senator Clinton, would you have pushed for her to support "Legalizing the Irish"?

It's interesting how so many commentators link the illegal immigration issue to the terrorism issue...with the implicit sub-text that (God forbid) the next Al-Qa'ida bomber is going to look like the Cisco Kid. It would be interesting to see reactions if the next (God forbid) Al-Qa'ida bomber looks more like Kiefer Sutherland.
"Pursuit Of Truth No Matter Where It Lies" -- Metallica
 
AGM100
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Thu Apr 09, 2009 8:12 pm



Quoting Mt99 (Reply 27):
You are fair man. Now, can you say that your position is shared by everyone?

I wish it was Mt ... unfortunately the left wing and pro amnesty crowd use racism as the weapon to soften our law enforcement . Look at that blow hard Sharpton out here talking about ICE being a racist operation . They actually are fighting cases where a illegal immigrant gets pulled over driving a car ... has no drivers license . He was arrested by PPD only to find out he has no citizenship paper work either, so ICE got involved. Sharpton is basically saying that it is a racist action ?? How can we ever survive with that kind of gibberish abounding. A man is in this country totally undocumented and our law enforcement is blamed for picking them up ? WTF ?

Hell the left wing speaker of the house called our law enforcement basically a racist threatening group ... just last month. What are we to do when our own S of the H is advocating against our own law enforcement ... its FU**ing outrages ! Its the sickness of power my man...

But we must ask ... why ? It is a effort to increase there voting block by 30 million. Simple.
You dig the hole .. I fill the hole . 100% employment !
 
santosdumont
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Thu Apr 09, 2009 8:37 pm



Quoting AGM100 (Reply 29):
unfortunately the left wing and pro amnesty crowd use racism as the weapon to soften our law enforcement .

Just for the sake of argument, if a friend of yours was an Irish national who was in the country illegally and you knew where other undocumented Irish congregated, would you tip off the Feds?
"Pursuit Of Truth No Matter Where It Lies" -- Metallica
 
mt99
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Thu Apr 09, 2009 8:40 pm



Quoting AGM100 (Reply 29):
racism as the weapon to soften our law enforcement . L

All the examples you quote are only one extreme. How about looking up some examples on the other extreme?
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BN747
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Thu Apr 09, 2009 9:48 pm



Quoting Santosdumont (Reply 25):
Just curious as to where the outrage is -- if any -- over the estimated 30,000 undocumented Irish living in New York City alone. (see the 8 April 2007 edition of the Los Angeles Times

Thank you so much for that post..and that's just a tip of the iceberg.

No one one arguing against me here is going to try and tackle that one with a twin-foot pole. Oh sure they'll play you cheap platitudes all day long such as..

Quoting AGM100 (Reply 26):

Making it a race issue is self defeating and dangerous . It will only create resentment if and when the illegals are all granted amnesty . My position is ...uphold our laws I don't care what color skin you have. period.

which means absolutely nothing. AGM's vocal cords are worn from previous immigration issues. This proves to the race card 'experts' that the current pursuit to 'illegal immigration' is racist (they won't admit it). But pursuit by Immigration officials of those 30,000 illegal Irish, and more than likely equal or higher number of Brits, Canucks, Germans, French, Czechs, Spaniards, etc..will never be pursued. And that's just in New York, add in Boston, New Jersey, Philly, Baltimore, DC, Chicago - you get the picture. It's huge! And they're taking up American jobs that pay far greater than what the illegal latinos are taking. Anyone?

BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
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WarRI1
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Fri Apr 10, 2009 5:02 am



Quoting BN747 (Reply 19):
And i'm just curious, do either of you experts have any idea when "the race card"
should be played.

I can only speak for myself, I have nephews and nieces with a Cuban heritage. I think of them exactly like all my other neices and nephews, I lived with my Cuban Brother-in-law and my sister. I do not like law breakers, plain and simple, I do not care where they come from, they are illegal, send them back. Let them get in line like my family did. Integrate into American society like my family did. The race card is played constantly by advocacy groups. To deny that point is rather naive.
It is better to die on your feet, than live on your knees.
 
AGM100
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Fri Apr 10, 2009 5:21 am



Quoting Santosdumont (Reply 30):
Just for the sake of argument, if a friend of yours was an Irish national who was in the country illegally and you knew where other undocumented Irish congregated, would you tip off the Feds?

Yes , But I would be man enough to talk to them first and let them know that they need to clear it up. Whats the deal with Irish ? ... I said I dont care where they are from its just the law.
Trying to make it a race issue is ridiculous.

Quoting BN747 (Reply 32):
And they're taking up American jobs that pay far greater than what the illegal latinos are taking. Anyone?

So I am all boxed up as a Latino hater huh BN ... ? foolish , and shallow. But is ends the argument in your mind ... so its also helpful to you.

Quoting Mt99 (Reply 31):
All the examples you quote are only one extreme. How about looking up some examples on the other extreme?

Why is it extreme? ... are you suggesting that we just drop all immigration laws and just let anyone in ?.

Why is this a problem? .. we have laws ... illegals break them ... and people don't care ? What other country can I just walk into , get a job and social security and just live ? Which one ?
You dig the hole .. I fill the hole . 100% employment !
 
BN747
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Fri Apr 10, 2009 6:32 am



Quoting WarRI1 (Reply 33):
Quoting BN747 (Reply 19):
And i'm just curious, do either of you experts have any idea when "the race card"
should be played.



Quoting WarRI1 (Reply 33):
I can only speak for myself, I have nephews and nieces with a Cuban heritage. I think of them exactly like all my other neices and nephews, I lived with my Cuban Brother-in-law and my sister. I do not like law breakers, plain and simple, I do not care where they come from, they are illegal, send them back. Let them get in line like my family did. Integrate into American society like my family did. The race card is played constantly by advocacy groups. To deny that point is rather naive.

Thanks for your answer to that difficult question, but the having these people as relatives is only the 1st step in understanding 'their race issues' in American society. And unless they are dark Cubans vs light -skin Cubans..that's a whole world of difference right there. And as you said "speaking for yourself'..that's your best foot forward on the race subject, unfortunately, there are people who have lesser contacts than you, yet they understand the entire race card scenario far better than you've explained (esp. the advocacy group description) for whatever possible reason. The average gay person probably understands it better than you because he/she's not viewing it thru relatives, he/she's living 'the difference'.

Quoting AGM100 (Reply 34):
Quoting BN747 (Reply 32):
And they're taking up American jobs that pay far greater than what the illegal latinos are taking. Anyone?

So I am all boxed up as a Latino hater huh BN ... ? foolish , and shallow. But is ends the argument in your mind ... so its also helpful to you.

You prior disclosed and shared positions on race arrived here before this thread was started. They spoke for you.

BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
AGM100
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Fri Apr 10, 2009 4:30 pm



Quoting BN747 (Reply 35):
They spoke for you.

OK , So I want to move to Australia .. I catch a flight and enter the country on a 7 day tourist visa. Then I just decide to stay .... I like it there and I can get a job and have a better life. So I evade law enforcement ... work for cash ... steal a identity or whatever . Then I get to go to the state clinic ... essentially steal money for Australian tax payers by using social services.

If I get picked up and booted out .... is that racist ? And since you don't no what ethnic heritage I am or what color I am ... what is the answer ?
You dig the hole .. I fill the hole . 100% employment !
 
santosdumont
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Sat Apr 11, 2009 6:47 pm



Quoting AGM100 (Reply 34):
Quoting Santosdumont (Reply 30):
Just for the sake of argument, if a friend of yours was an Irish national who was in the country illegally and you knew where other undocumented Irish congregated, would you tip off the Feds?

Yes , But I would be man enough to talk to them first and let them know that they need to clear it up.

Would you extend that same courtesy to somebody who happened to be "Messican"?
"Pursuit Of Truth No Matter Where It Lies" -- Metallica
 
AvObserver
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Joined: Sat Apr 06, 2002 7:40 am

RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Sun Apr 12, 2009 1:15 am

No matter what ethnic group is involved, immigration laws must be enforced. I don't care if the illegals happen to be blond, blue-eyed 36DD Swedish babes; the law is the law! We must stop the enormous drain on hospitals and other services; this amounts to tens of billions nationally every year. Illegal immigrants also kill several thousand Americans annually via road accidents and murder but it's politically incorrect for the liberal media to report those stats; they only talk about how the poor illegals are persecuted by efforts to enforce the law. Enough of the liberal demagogery! Illegal immigration is destroying the fabric of this country, partly by its undermining of respect for our laws and partly because many of the undocumented seem to have no desire to assimilate or become citizens. They're squatters who think they've a right to be here just because they made it here. That's a huge slap in the face of all immigrants who followed the law and applied for visas or citizenship the proper and lawful way. And with so many Americans out of work now, why should our lower income citizens and city youth be cheated out of jobs because unscupulous employers hire illegals for lower wages. That's B.S.! Bleeding hearters like BN747are swayed by arguments of illegals they live among but whatever their reasons for being here, they still came illegally. Laws still matter but if we don't enforce them, respect for authority diminishes as we see happening now. We can't allow screaming crowds at rallies and marches, often waving foreign flags, to cow our populace and our public servants. The 14th Amendment, originally passed so children of African slaves would automatically be birthright citizens, has been bastardized to apply to children of illegal immigrants. This must be repealed so illegals don't continue to gain footholds here through "anchor-baby" children. Illegal alien supporters scream "racist" at any and every effort to enforce our laws but many of them are the real racists by foisting an ethnic agenda on us. The National Council Of La Raza who advocates for Hispanics is perfectly acceptable but any organization that would do the same for Caucasians is deemed racist today. There are even contingents of Mexican-Americans who advocate the retaking of the American Southwest for Mexico, arguing that the U.S. stole its land in the 1800's. The liberal media never mentions these extremists but they continue to demonize those who simply argue for immigration law enforcement. This is nonsense! It's left-wing demagogery and it MUST stop!
 
AGM100
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Joined: Thu Dec 04, 2003 2:16 am

RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Sun Apr 12, 2009 5:41 pm



Quoting AvObserver (Reply 38):
I don't care if the illegals happen to be blond, blue-eyed 36DD Swedish babes;

Racist ! Big grin Good post ,

Quoting Santosdumont (Reply 37):
"Messican"?

Of course , why wouldn't I ? I am assuming you are talking about Mexican nationals . Living here in the US illegally , ? Yes I would turn them in if the situation warranted. Obviously I am not going to go around looking for them , but if I say had someone apply for a job at my company with fake of no papers .. hell ya I would turn them in white , brown blue or green.
You dig the hole .. I fill the hole . 100% employment !
 
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Dreadnought
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RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Sun Apr 12, 2009 9:25 pm



Quoting BN747 (Reply 2):
That's where this whole immigration BS ticks me off...it's racist and we can do a better job at enforcing illegal immigration if chose to do so.

What do you have to offer as an alternative? Landmines on the border? machine-gun nests? A 15-foot electrified and brightly-lit and monitored fence along the entire border? Those are the only ways to stop them coming in illegally. Once they are actually in the country, what solutions apart from raids can you offer?
Forget dogs and cats - Spay and neuter your liberals.
 
AvObserver
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Joined: Sat Apr 06, 2002 7:40 am

RE: Illegal Immigration Vs The Census

Mon Apr 13, 2009 2:50 am



Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 40):
Quoting BN747 (Reply 2):
That's where this whole immigration BS ticks me off...it's racist and we can do a better job at enforcing illegal immigration if chose to do so.

What do you have to offer as an alternative? Landmines on the border? machine-gun nests? A 15-foot electrified and brightly-lit and monitored fence along the entire border? Those are the only ways to stop them coming in illegally. Once they are actually in the country, what solutions apart from raids can you offer?

Immigration enforcement ISN'T racist; that's just more demagogery the Open Borders crowd uses to undermine enforcement. I agree we need to better target employers of illegals but raids and deportations must continue also. I don't want to hear that crap from the likes of IL congressman Luis Gutierrez and my own NJ Senator Bob Menendez that we need to stop them because it separates parents from their kids. Repeal that 14th Amendment Birthright Citizenship for those kids and send them back with their folks. Those people use that loophole to get rooted in this country and we citizens end up paying for them one way or the other. Back in 1986 when Reagan gave about 4 million illegals amnesty, the American people were promised this would never have to be done again; that the borders would be secured and all illegal migration stopped. The government lied then so here we are again. Those 4 million should've all been deported the way Eisenhover rounded up and deported several million during the 50's. It was done then; it could be done now BUT for the lack of political will in D.C. since too many of our reps. are either on the take from businesses who profit from hiring illegals or loyal Democrats bowing to an apparent party mandate to embrace illegals as future voters, regardless of the costs they inflict. The Obama Administration appears, not surprisingly, to be on the wrong side of this argument, given that both he and McCain pandered shamelessly to pro-illegal activist groups during the presidential campaign. New DHS Chief Janet Napolitano seems to be thoroughly politicized and appears poised to halt the raids and maybe even to scrap the Border Fence Initiative which should've been built long ago. A fence is hardly the whole answer to stopping illegals but provides a useful speed bump in slowing them down, giving the Border Patrol more time to respond and catch them. My early assessment of Napolitano is that she'll be feckless and knuckle under to NCLR and other pro-illegal activists because she's Obama's stooge and he's hell bent on comprehensive immigration reform, aka another amnesty. It seems so many our leaders just don't care that most citizens and legal immigrants broadly oppose amnesty for illegal immigrants as was amply demonstrated in 2006 and 2007 when public outcry ended efforts in Congress to enact it, until now. Until we have a C.I.R. that puts legal Americans first, that opposition won't go away and if Congress and the President try to force it down our throats as before, you'll see citizen outrage as never before. Pitting citizen outrage against the brazen demands of the pro-illegal contingent is a recipe for massive civil strife if not outright civil war.

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