prosa
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Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Tue Apr 14, 2009 6:56 pm

The Insurance Institute for Highway Safety crash-tested three of the new "minicar" models, putting each through a 40 mph offset frontal crash with a midside vehicle by the same manufacturer: Smart Fortwo vs. Mercedes C-Class, Toyota Yaris vs. Toyota Camry, and Honda Fit vs. Honda Accord. Suffice to say that the minicars failed. Dreadfully so. Shockingly so.

News article:
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/14/automobiles/14crash.html?hpw

IIHS report:
http://www.iihs.org/externaldata/srdata/docs/sr4404.pdf
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mt99
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Tue Apr 14, 2009 6:59 pm



Quoting PROSA (Thread starter):
. Suffice to say that the minicars failed. Dreadfully so. Shockingly so.

Thats like hoping a bike hold up against a semi.
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Superfly
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Tue Apr 14, 2009 7:51 pm

Uh-oh, this goes against the dominant belief that minicars are infallible, green, safe and good for the environment.
I don't expect this story to get much ink.
Just more proof that environmentalist don't give a damn about the safety of their fellow humans.
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Cadet57
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Tue Apr 14, 2009 8:09 pm

The other day I was on the highway and saw a suburban, and behind that was a smart. behind that was an explorer. If that suburban stopped. The pelvis of the Smart driver would be come a hood ornament for that Explorer. But hey, let them spend 20k and get 30mpg's on 93 octane!
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PHLBOS
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Tue Apr 14, 2009 10:09 pm



Quoting PROSA (Thread starter):

This report just simply vindicates what I've been saying for the last 30 years.
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LOT767-300ER
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 12:42 am

I saw a Yaris rear end a Ford F-250 last week. It was laughable at best. I didnt know if I should cry for the 2 inches of chipped paint on the pickup or if I should roll down my window and laugh at the stupid woman for driving in that worthless excuse of a go-kart who was being loaded into the ambulance.

Its amazing what people will do to compromise safety and try to defy pure physics.
 
767Lover
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 1:25 am

This might be a dumb question, but aren't these kinds of tests supposed to be carried out before the vehicle goes to market?
 
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Jetsgo
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 1:31 am



Quoting 767Lover (Reply 6):

The problem is, regardless of tests, airbags, technology, and anything else in these minicars, the law of physics simply overrides it all. It is impossible to make a Yaris stand up to a larger vehicle, let alone an average sized Camry.
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Cadet57
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 1:46 am

Whenever someone goes on about the Smart, I just show them this video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ju6t-yyoU8s

Still want a plastic eco-box?
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Superfly
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 1:48 am



Quoting 767Lover (Reply 6):
This might be a dumb question, but aren't these kinds of tests supposed to be carried out before the vehicle goes to market?

Not a dumb question at all.
You can sale anything under the guise of being 'green' and get away with it.
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bok269
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 2:43 am



Quoting 767Lover (Reply 6):
This might be a dumb question, but aren't these kinds of tests supposed to be carried out before the vehicle goes to market?

Tests are in fact done before a car goes on the market. However, there is a minimum threshold of survivability that needs to be met in the government tests. The IIHS tests (the ones this thread discusses) go above and beyond the government tests.
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Pyrex
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 2:48 am



Quoting Superfly (Reply 2):
Just more proof that environmentalist don't give a damn about the safety of their fellow humans.

And yet Europe seems to have road fatality rates similar to or less than those in the U.S....
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baroque
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 3:00 am



Quoting Pyrex (Reply 11):
And yet Europe seems to have road fatality rates similar to or less than those in the U.S....

Tsk tsk Pyrex, not allowed to point out nasty stats like that. Also no information on how much less likely you are to be hit being as how you are a smaller object. I always hire the smallest car possible to go to the airport on the principle that I am a smaller target.

Is this thread a plea to be allowed to build SUVs the size of a B double, including load?
 
GuitrThree
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 3:07 am



Quoting Pyrex (Reply 11):
And yet Europe seems to have road fatality rates similar to or less than those in the U.S....

And I would guess that's because Europe has a SMALL percentage of high speed roads (interstates) compared to the vast number of miles found in America.

That, and the fact that Europeans are just about forced to drive in these death traps, so usually its a small car vs small car crash, while in America, people who drive these smart cars face a much more higher percentage of collisions with larger personal vehicles such a mid and full sized cars and trucks.
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Superfly
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 3:22 am



Quoting Pyrex (Reply 11):
And yet Europe.......

 redflag   redflag   redflag 

This has NOTHING to do with Europe vs. the USA.
I was singling out environmentalist , NOT Europeans.
Worth noting, it was a European sedan (Mercedes C-Class) used in the crash test as being a safer car than the Smart car.
No mention of an SUV in this article.
Let's please stay on topic and discuss the facts mentioned in this article.
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Derico
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 3:55 am



Quoting GuitrThree (Reply 13):
That, and the fact that Europeans are just about forced to drive in these death traps, so usually its a small car vs small car crash, while in America,

Cars is one of the only areas I'm not for total freedom. I'm glad Europans are ''forced'' to drive death traps, which they are not in Europe since most cars are small.

It is not a right to drive a massive vehicle capable of producing incredible harm on others, and damage to the environment. This discussion is a mute point now anyways for the most parts people in the US are waking up to buying smaller cars. There's a reason your automakers are failed auto manufacturers. No one on Earth wants to drive huge vehicles when there is no legitimate reason (regular cargo) to do so. I say tax people that want to drive huge vehicles to death to pay for their wreckless driving habits (it's well known people that drive bigger vehicles
drive more aggresively), when they buy the car, and tax them to death again at the gasoline station with a special pollution/energy wasting tax. Pay to Play.

Quoting GuitrThree (Reply 13):
And I would guess that's because Europe has a SMALL percentage of high speed roads (interstates) compared to the vast number of miles found in America.

Check out a travel map of Europe. France, Germany, Holland, Belgium, Italy have just as dense if not more dense system of expressways, with England and Spain very close.
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GuitrThree
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 3:55 am



Quoting Superfly (Reply 14):
Worth noting, it was a European sedan (Mercedes C-Class) used in the crash test as being a safer car than the Smart car.

As they used the Accord vs Fit and a Camry vs Yaris.

They kept it in the family!! Pretty funny if you ask me.. They used a car built from the same company to show how fragile these things are!
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Pyrex
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 4:06 am



Quoting GuitrThree (Reply 13):
And I would guess that's because Europe has a SMALL percentage of high speed roads (interstates) compared to the vast number of miles found in America.

And you would guess wrong.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...ECD_countries_by_road_network_size

Quoting Superfly (Reply 14):

Sorry for singling you out, Superfly, but my point was that people here claiming that smaller cars are less safe are wrong. As an example of that, I gave Europe, which has a big predominance of smaller cars and is just as safe or safer than the U.S. I was not trying to do this a Europe vs U.S. thing.
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Falcon84
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 4:13 am

Well, since I don't need to pump up my gonads by driving a "HEMI", or some big-assed SUV that makes me feel like I have power, I'll stick with smaller, fuel-effecient cars, thank you.

They're only "death traps" because of the monstrosities some Americans feel they have to drive, even if they lose half their gasoline when they start the damn things.  Big grin
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greaser
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 4:35 am

I wonder how the Tato nano would fare.
Big version: Width: 416 Height: 300 File size: 33kb

something like this, perhaps?
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jush
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 5:43 am

Well, still, this little investigation ist just nicely put to fit American views that you need a bigger car.
Fact is: You need no test to say that a head on collision between a smart and a c class is no nice thing to be put in.
Same goes for c class vs. S-class at 40 or 50 mph.

Thing is though. In Europe these small cars drive around for ages and still the death tolls are coming down. The smart and the other cars are safe and pass all test (for example the NCAP test) perfectly.
It's a very one-sided test to let a big vehicle crash into a small one. Plus head on collision rarely occur. I would rather worry about side-collisions which are much more common.

Regds
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JJJ
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 8:12 am

Anyone have data on how what % of accidents/fatalities are head-ons?

I read something about rollovers accounting for a disproportionate amount of road casualties in the US.

Some food for thought: 2005 data of road fatalities per capita

US is at 14,75 dead per 100.000 people. The only euro countries over that number are Greece, Croatia, Belarus, Lithuania, Latvia and Russia.

Germany, for example, stands at 8,03, the UK at 5,81.

Quoting GuitrThree (Reply 13):
And I would guess that's because Europe has a SMALL percentage of high speed roads (interstates) compared to the vast number of miles found in America

You're wrong on that approach. Casualties on dual-lane high-speed roads are negligible. It's back roads with bad pavement, tight bends etc. that kill most road casualties and then, it's not crashing against another car what kills most people, but leaving the road and hitting an stationary object or rolling over.
 
lewis
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 8:27 am

It all depends on circumstances and the general environment on the road. In the US, most cars are medium to large in size, while in Europe most people ride on small/medium hatches.

I was once driving behind an H3 in Athens and I could clearly see that, in case of a collision, he would just drive over me due to the difference in height. Similarly, if I collided with a truck, even with my parents' sedan, chances are I wouldn't survive. If for some reason Americans decided to drive even bigger cars or trucks, you would stop feeling safe in a Sedan.

I hate the mentality that some people have in Greece that drives them to buy ther KIDS big SUVs so that they can be safe, but at the expense of other cars/pedestrians that they might hit due to reckless/inexperienced driving.
 
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OA260
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 9:45 am



Quoting Jush (Reply 20):
Well, still, this little investigation ist just nicely put to fit American views that you need a bigger car.

Very true. I have a Smart car and very happy with it. I have seen crashes where large top name cars have been mangled with the whole front off. One accident was where a BMW was overtaking and a lorry came the other way. The BMW went under the lorry and ripped the whole roof off and beheaded the driver. The Police told us to turn back rather than pass the other side of the road as it was too horrific. No car is safe.
 
racko
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 10:07 am

At least here, the vast majority of fatal accidents happen on country roads when drivers leave the road and hit a stationary object. That's why cars are crashtested for exactly these kinds of accidents, not for head-ons and not for planes crashing on their roof.

The famous Autobahn is actually very safe, even without a speed limit.
 
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cpd
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 10:15 am



Quoting Baroque (Reply 12):

Tsk tsk Pyrex, not allowed to point out nasty stats like that. Also no information on how much less likely you are to be hit being as how you are a smaller object. I always hire the smallest car possible to go to the airport on the principle that I am a smaller target.

Is this thread a plea to be allowed to build SUVs the size of a B double, including load?

I was going to suggest we do crash tests comparing the safety of the typical large car to a huge semi or a huge rail locomotive.

Then we can similarly say the large car is very unsafe. I'm sure you all get the point. I'm deliberately not mentioning that three-letter acronym...

So the point of this test must be that we all should drive around in big battering rams. That's the only thing I can gather from this.

Meanwhile in Australia - everyone drives ordinary cars, while others drive big battering rams and somehow, everyone seems to manage okay - and we don't see everyone rushing out to buy bigger cars in order to be safer.

I also must question the timing of this media article - it seems all too conveniently timed to coincide with a period of great pain for the big Detroit auto-makers.

Quoting GuitrThree (Reply 13):

And I would guess that's because Europe has a SMALL percentage of high speed roads (interstates) compared to the vast number of miles found in America.

Europe has a very dense system of high speed motorways - some of them are very high speed compared to USA.

But I know what things are like in the USA, everyone drives huge trucks, and the semis seem to move at stupidly high speeds compared to here, and the traffic - yikes. That was just in Seattle. It freaked me out.
 
A342
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 11:03 am

Back in 1999 or 2000, when the Smart first appeared, one of Germany's reputable car magazines crashed it against an S-class. It performed remarkably well, with the occupants sustaining only light injuries.
Exceptions confirm the rule.
 
lewis
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 12:11 pm



Quoting Racko (Reply 26):
At least here, the vast majority of fatal accidents happen on country roads when drivers leave the road and hit a stationary object. That's why cars are crashtested for exactly these kinds of accidents, not for head-ons and not for planes crashing on their roof.

When I bought my car I saw some collision tests online, and they had both collisions with stationary objects and with other cars. In both cases, the cabin seemed intact while the front was unrecognisable from absorbing most of the impact force.
 
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WildcatYXU
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 3:14 pm



Quoting Pyrex (Reply 11):
And yet Europe seems to have road fatality rates similar to or less than those in the U.S....

And you should add that most EU countries have higher speed limits than the US or Canada...

Quoting GuitrThree (Reply 13):
And I would guess that's because Europe has a SMALL percentage of high speed roads (interstates) compared to the vast number of miles found in America.

Where exactly in North America are these high speed roads? I'd really like to drive on one...
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mham001
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 3:46 pm



Quoting JJJ (Reply 22):
Some food for thought: 2005 data of road fatalities per capita

US is at 14,75 dead per 100.000 people. The only euro countries over that number are Greece, Croatia, Belarus, Lithuania, Latvia and Russia.

Germany, for example, stands at 8,03, the UK at 5,81.

A more relevant comparison would be the the amount of miles driven and the percentage of drivers vs the fatality rate. Im also wondering why Italy, who recent figures showed as the most dangerous drivers is not on your list now.
 
waterpolodan
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 4:09 pm

Not sure what's so shocking or worth arguing about with this article. Yes, the micro-cars are little death traps. Maybe some buyers like to believe that they are not, but unless they build them with carbon fibre reinforced crumple zones like an F1 car, there isn't much that can be done to prevent them from being crushed in an accident with a larger vehicle. That said, it's a trade off. The cars do get much better mileage, they are more maneuverable, they're easier to park, and they're generally more environmentally friendly and cheaper (with the exception of the smart, which I think is totally overpriced and absurd). It's the same story as it was in the 80s with cars like the Honda CRX. No one thought that would win any head on collision battles, but it got truly excellent mileage. If we buy cars because we don't want any danger at all from the vehicles around us, we'd all be driving M1 tanks, which is essentially what hummers and suburbans are  Wink. Personally, if I were in the market for a new car that is more efficient, I'd go for a new spec european diesel sedan. They've come a long way and with the urea canisters in the US application of the new engines they have acceptable emissions to go along with their strong performance and great mileage. The new BMW 335 diesel is a great example, over 400 lb/ft of torque and better than 26 MPG average economy in a recent Road and Track magazine test over several days of hard driving, which far exceeded the performance in terms of economy AND driving fun of the Audi A4 3.2 gasoline car they were comparing it to.


Quoting LOT767-300ER (Reply 5):
I should roll down my window and laugh at the stupid woman for driving in that worthless excuse of a go-kart who was being loaded into the ambulance.

That's sick, and there are far more mature ways of making your point than saying something like that.
 
JJJ
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 4:31 pm



Quoting Mham001 (Reply 38):
A more relevant comparison would be the the amount of miles driven and the percentage of drivers vs the fatality rate. Im also wondering why Italy, who recent figures showed as the most dangerous drivers is not on your list now.

Italy is comfortably below the US at 11,7. The most dangerous place to drive in Europe are the baltics

If there's some data on fatalities per mile driven, I'd love to see them. However, the IIHS website has some interesting data on US road fatalities at http://www.iihs.org/research/fatality_facts_2007/statebystate.html

Some snippets:

Motor vehicle death rates varied among states from a low of 6.5 deaths per 100,000 people in Massachusetts and Rhode Island, to a high of 30.3 deaths per 100,000 people in Mississippi.

Nationwide, 51 percent of passenger vehicle occupant deaths in 2007 occurred in single-vehicle crashes.

Which means that, exactly like in Europe, most fatalities happen by swerving off-road.

Sixty-two percent of passenger vehicle occupant deaths in 2007 occurred in rural areas. The state with the greatest proportion of passenger vehicle occupant deaths on rural roads was Vermont (98 percent).

Which means that, exactly like in Europe, fatalities generally happen in back roads.
 
Klaus
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 4:32 pm



Quoting Waterpolodan (Reply 39):
If we buy cars because we don't want any danger at all from the vehicles around us, we'd all be driving M1 tanks

Now imagine a head-on crash between two of those and you're back to square 1 again!  mischievous 
 
David L
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 6:41 pm



Quoting GuitrThree (Reply 13):
That, and the fact that Europeans are just about forced to drive in these death traps

 confused  We are? That news doesn't seem to have filtered down to the common people over here. "Mini" cars are still very much the exception. I drove 40-odd miles to Glasgow, round and about and then back again today and hardly saw any.
 
Pyrex
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 7:19 pm



Quoting JJJ (Reply 40):
from a low of 6.5 deaths per 100,000 people in Massachusetts and Rhode Island, to a high of 30.3 deaths per 100,000 people in Mississippi.

That has got to be exclusively down to the fact that Massholes don't drive a lot in general (Boston is not car-friendly and has good-ish public transportation), because when they do get behind a wheel they are hideous drivers!
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Cadet57
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 7:50 pm



Quoting Pyrex (Reply 44):
That has got to be exclusively down to the fact that Massholes don't drive a lot in general

So I guess the rest of us who dont live in Boston dont count?

Quoting Pyrex (Reply 44):
because when they do get behind a wheel they are hideous
drivers!

Speak for yourself. I happen to just be an impatient driver. Its all the other d-bags on the road I cant stand  Wink
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Pyrex
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 8:02 pm



Quoting Cadet57 (Reply 45):
So I guess the rest of us who dont live in Boston dont count?

Do you really need to ask? Big grin

I was making a generalization, obviously - of course that people that live outside of Boston do tend to drive more, but since a big percentage of the population lives in the Boston metro area and the state isn't that big to begin with I would venture to say that the average miles driven by Mass. residents per year is lower than the national average.

Quoting Cadet57 (Reply 45):
Speak for yourself. I happen to just be an impatient driver. Its all the other d-bags on the road I cant stand

Hey! I am actually a great driver! How else would I be able to notice that everybody around me drives so poorly?  Wink
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Cadet57
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 8:20 pm



Quoting Pyrex (Reply 46):
Do you really need to ask?

Considering most people out there had no qualms about increasing the gas tax but god forbid we touch their tolls, Yes. Lets just say that some of our more "colorful" residents out here resent having to pay for "the sins of the east"  Wink

Quoting Pyrex (Reply 46):
Hey! I am actually a great driver! How else would I be able to notice that everybody around me drives so poorly?

Exactly!  biggrin 
Doors open, right hand side, next stop is Springfield.
 
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Tugger
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 8:45 pm

I would say that this report proves several things:
1.) Large cars are more dangerous than small cars based on the laws of physics, and should therefore be limited in access and use to people who are experienced drivers only.

2.) Large cars should have a special tax applied to them as they are likely to cause more harm to others than a small car. Perhaps a tax based on weight. This would likely also solve the issue of a special gas-guzzler tax.

3.) Anyone seeking to drive a large car should be required to get special training and have a special license just like a truck driver has to because of the extra mass they are moving around. More mass takes more skill based on the fact that if they lose control of it, it will cause more harm.

4.) A corrolary to #3, a special license and training should be required to drive at high speeds (say over 55) due to the mass/acceleration effect.

That should solve the problem right there. I'm sure the IIHS would support these rules.

Tugg
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David L
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 8:59 pm



Quoting Tugger (Reply 51):

Pardon my ignorance but... you're being sarcastic, right?

A report suggesting that smaller cars are less safe than bigger cars indicates that bigger cars are less safe than smaller cars? My head hurts.  Smile
 
Klaus
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 9:17 pm



Quoting David L (Reply 53):
A report suggesting that smaller cars are less safe than bigger cars indicates that bigger cars are less safe than smaller cars?

The report actually does not say anything about the safety of larger or smaller cars as such. It just says that in an unsymmetric head-on crash the smaller car suffers more, which is logical.

Reducing the asymmetry might in fact reduce the damage overall, but we're speaking of a relatively small portion of real-life accidents anyway.
 
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Tugger
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 9:58 pm



Quoting David L (Reply 53):
A report suggesting that smaller cars are less safe than bigger cars indicates that bigger cars are less safe than smaller cars? My head hurts. Smile

Actually, it's that large cars are more dangerous to others around them than small cars!

Quoting David L (Reply 53):
Pardon my ignorance but... you're being sarcastic, right?

Yes, I am. But it is strangely logical: Who do you get rid of in the school yard, the bully or everyone else (or teach everyone to bully)?  mischievous 

Tugg
I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. -W. Shatner
 
bok269
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 10:26 pm



Quoting Tugger (Reply 41):

That would work if the small cars could fend for themselves. But in nearly every test, the Smart goes flying on impact.
"Reality is wrong, dreams are for real." -Tupac
 
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Tugger
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Wed Apr 15, 2009 10:37 pm



Quoting Bok269 (Reply 42):
That would work if the small cars could fend for themselves. But in nearly every test, the Smart goes flying on impact.

EXACTLY!! Those darned bully big cars are just mean and need to be taken off the road!

Tugg
I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. -W. Shatner
 
jush
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Thu Apr 16, 2009 5:49 am



Quoting Bok269 (Reply 42):
That would work if the small cars could fend for themselves. But in nearly every test, the Smart goes flying on impact

As much as I hate the Smart it is not too bad in crash test.

http://www.oeamtc.at/netautor/html_s...crashtest/mini/smartsidedetail.htm


It's in German but the color code of injuries is self explanatory. So enjoy. there's even a video.
And remember this test is from around 2000 so the actual Smart should be even better.




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jush
There is one problem with airbus. Though their products are engineering marvels they lack passion, completely.
 
Superfly
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Thu Apr 16, 2009 6:22 am



Quoting Jush (Reply 44):
the Smart it is not too bad in crash test.

That was not a collision with another moving car. It just slammed in to a stationary tool box and the car still gets airborne and is jumping all over the place.
Bring back the Concorde
 
AustrianZRH
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Thu Apr 16, 2009 7:23 am



Quoting Superfly (Reply 45):
That was not a collision with another moving car. It just slammed in to a stationary tool box and the car still gets airborne and is jumping all over the place.

A little statistics session for Austria (2008):

39,173 total accidents with injuries or fatalities
5,290 head-on collisions (the ones this thread is about)
these are 13.5%

679 people killed in total
175 in head-on collisions
accounts for 25.7%

If you factor in, that the likelihood of being killed rather than being "just" injured in a head-on collision is always higher than in a same-direction accident (higher relative velocity, thus higher dissipated energy in the accident), our European death-traps don't seem that bad...

To complete it, the injury statistics:
50,521 people injured in total
8,196 in head-on collisions
16.2%

source: http://www.statistik.at/web_de/stati...sunfaelle_2006_bis_2008_019893.pdf
WARNING! The post above should be taken with a grain of salt! Furthermore, it may be slightly biased towards A.
 
L410Turbolet
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Thu Apr 16, 2009 7:28 am

Quoting Superfly (Reply 45):
the car still gets airborne and is jumping all over the place

"Jumping all over the place" is totally irrelevant to whether the car is considered safe or not. What matters is whether and/or how much the passenger compartment gets deformed, whether or not parts of the interior move TOWARDS the passengers as a result of such deformation, whether or not the doors can be open without using force, how the airbags deploy, etc.

this Chinese icon of automotive engineering does not jump all over the place, yet the chances of survival on the front seats are very slim.


neither does this one (Chrysler Voyager), but the pedals moving all the way towards the driver's knees most likely dismember his legs anyway



[Edited 2009-04-16 00:34:48]
 
MD-90
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Thu Apr 16, 2009 7:58 am



Quoting Jush (Reply 20):
Well, still, this little investigation ist just nicely put to fit American views that you need a bigger car. Fact is: You need no test to say that a head on collision between a smart and a c class is no nice thing to be put in. Same goes for c class vs. S-class at 40 or 50 mph.

There's no way that there would be such a disparity between a C-class and an S-class as there was between a Smart and a C-class.

Quoting JJJ (Reply 21):
US is at 14,75 dead per 100.000 people. The only euro countries over that number are Greece, Croatia, Belarus, Lithuania, Latvia and Russia.

Germany, for example, stands at 8,03, the UK at 5,81.

I don't know about the UK but I know that Germany has driver licensing laws that are draconian in comparison to the United States.
 
jush
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RE: Minicars Perform Dreadfully In Crash Tests

Thu Apr 16, 2009 10:35 am



Quoting Superfly (Reply 45):
That was not a collision with another moving car. It just slammed in to a stationary tool box and the car still gets airborne and is jumping all over the place.



Quoting MD-90 (Reply 48):
I don't know about the UK but I know that Germany has driver licensing laws that are draconian in comparison to the United States.

Yes they are. Depending on how much time you invest and how talented you are the theory and practice will take you around 3-5 month to get your driver's license. This includes 12 90 minutes sessions of compulsory theoretical lesson plus 12 compulsory driving lessons which include highway, "cross country", night driving and so on. City lessons are not compulsory but the average driving lessons per person in my are is at around 20 - 22. I had only 19 and I still think it's unnecessary to have so many.

Anyway back to the topic. Jumping around does not make the car unsafe. In fact UK television show 5th gear slammed the smart into a concrete wall with 80 mph.

It jumped around but the rigid frame stayed in one piece. I admit though that the passengers had a bad chance of surviving the crash cause the rigid frame staying intact means the forces are transmitted to the rest of the car meaning the passengers.

Another problem in America is the state of vehicles.
In Germany we have a rather strict organization called TÜV which voids your permission to drive your car on the road in an instant if it is not safe.
My impression is that in America some really nasty cars are on the road which are falling to pieces. Real safety hazards with bad brakes and so on. Is this really true or is my impression deceiving the real situation. Is there a strict organization in America like the MOT in the UK?
What is necessary to be allowed to drive a car in the US? Driver's license, insurance and what else?


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jush
There is one problem with airbus. Though their products are engineering marvels they lack passion, completely.

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