RussianJet
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US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Mon Jan 04, 2010 2:13 pm

The ban on those carrying HIV or suffering with AIDS entering the US has now been lifted, as promised.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/8438865.stm

The US was previously one of only a dozen countries to have such a ban.

This is a victory for common sense and human decency. Congratulations USA.
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ManuCH
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Mon Jan 04, 2010 2:44 pm

While this is a nice step forward, I have to ask myself: what sense did that ban make in the first place, and how effective was it?

Someone who has HIV doesn't carry a sign saying so. Who would stop an HIV positive person from lying when entering the US? I have never been taken a blood sample by an immigration official...

In Switzerland you can even get anonymous HIV tests - not even your healthcare provider will be notified.
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RussianJet
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Mon Jan 04, 2010 3:00 pm



Quoting ManuCH (Reply 1):
what sense did that ban make in the first place

You're right. In practical terms it was probably largely symbolic and not very oeffective at keeping any carriers of HIV or AIDS out of the country.
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UAL747
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Mon Jan 04, 2010 3:01 pm



Quoting ManuCH (Reply 1):
In Switzerland you can even get anonymous HIV tests - not even your healthcare provider will be notified

Anonymous HIV testing is quite prevalent in the US. In fact, I don't know of any major city that doesn't have it.

I find it odd that we had this bit of legislation for 25 some odd years, after we realized how it was spread, etc.

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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Mon Jan 04, 2010 4:03 pm



Quoting UAL747 (Reply 3):

I find it odd that we had this bit of legislation for 25 some odd years, after we realized how it was spread, etc.

I still find it odd that you still cannot donate blood if you are a male and have had any kind of sexual contact with a male after 1975, just because you may get AIDS/HIV. I'd love to see that ban removed.

I wonder how many guys have donated blood who have knowingly had relations with other men and have no diseases, but lied to the Red Cross to be a good citizen and donate blood to save lives?
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Mon Jan 04, 2010 5:10 pm



Quoting TZ757300 (Reply 4):
I still find it odd that you still cannot donate blood if you are a male and have had any kind of sexual contact with a male after 1975, just because you may get AIDS/HIV.

It's only a matter of statistics. Statistically, said group is more likely to have HIV than other groups. Even if it only makes me 0.000001% safer when getting a transfusion, I fully back this (odd) rule. After all, donating blood isn't a constitutional right - they may deny whoever they want.

Quoting TZ757300 (Reply 4):
wonder how many guys have donated blood who have knowingly had relations with other men and have no diseases, but lied to the Red Cross to be a good citizen and donate blood to save lives?

A lot of them. And I know several personally. I tell them all that they shouldn't be doing it... of course they don't listen.
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Mon Jan 04, 2010 7:26 pm



Quoting ManuCH (Reply 1):
While this is a nice step forward, I have to ask myself: what sense did that ban make in the first place, and how effective was it?

Fear. It made no sense. It made no more sense than Texas's (still standing) ban on selling sex toys "because they can transmit HIV."

Quoting ManuCH (Reply 5):

It's only a matter of statistics. Statistically, said group is more likely to have HIV than other groups. Even if it only makes me 0.000001% safer when getting a transfusion, I fully back this (odd) rule. After all, donating blood isn't a constitutional right - they may deny whoever they want.

I don't support it. A straight guy who has had unprotected sex with 40 women in his life can give blood and I, who have never once in my life had unprotected sex, can't? More people will die because of all the disqualifiers than will be saved. Yes, I've had to watch a patient die because I couldn't get blood for him.

Oh, in the U.S. you also can't give blood if you have ever since 1980 spent 6 months in England or 12 months in Europe because they worry about Mad Cow Disease. And if you've ever spent time in Africa, you're also out. Idiotic rules. Truly idiotic.

They can easily do tests on the blood. They can even run a viral genotype on the blood; it takes a few hours to do. Certainly better than living in a permanent critical blood shortage because only a tiny portion of the populace can donate.

Those of you who can give blood, please do.
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RussianJet
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Mon Jan 04, 2010 7:37 pm



Quoting DocLightning (Reply 6):
Oh, in the U.S. you also can't give blood if you have ever since 1980 spent 6 months in England or 12 months in Europe because they worry about Mad Cow Disease. And if you've ever spent time in Africa, you're also out. Idiotic rules. Truly idiotic.

They can easily do tests on the blood. They can even run a viral genotype on the blood; it takes a few hours to do. Certainly better than living in a permanent critical blood shortage because only a tiny portion of the populace can donate.

Those of you who can give blood, please do.

I agree. As long as blood is screened properly, everyone should be encouraged to give.  checkmark 
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Mon Jan 04, 2010 7:47 pm



Quoting UAL747 (Reply 3):

Anonymous HIV testing is quite prevalent in the US. In fact, I don't know of any major city that doesn't have it.

Even small towns do.

Quoting UAL747 (Reply 3):

I find it odd that we had this bit of legislation for 25 some odd years, after we realized how it was spread, etc.

1) It wasn't legislation. It was a rule promulgated by the Department of State that Congress didn't bother legislating away.

2) How many years did it take Reagan to even admit AIDS existed? You should be old enough to remember Ryan White and all the other sad cases.

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 6):

Oh, in the U.S. you also can't give blood if you have ever since 1980 spent 6 months in England or 12 months in Europe because they worry about Mad Cow Disease.

Only if you actually consumed beef  Silly
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captaink
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Mon Jan 04, 2010 8:19 pm

I think this has alot to do with the HIV/AIDS screening that is done on persons who have been approved for a Green Card. I assume such screening may not be done, and if it is, it won't be a determining factor as is the case presently.
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Mon Jan 04, 2010 8:45 pm

It's about time!!! What a ridiculous law this was.

Quoting TZ757300 (Reply 4):
I wonder how many guys have donated blood who have knowingly had relations with other men and have no diseases, but lied to the Red Cross to be a good citizen and donate blood to save lives?

I'm sure there are several who do. However, since blood is tested it really shouldn't be an issue.

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 6):
It made no more sense than Texas's (still standing) ban on selling sex toys "because they can transmit HIV."

LOL I had no idea about this. It's 2009 you'd think they would get their heads out of the sand by now.

Quoting N1120A (Reply 8):
2) How many years did it take Reagan to even admit AIDS existed? You should be old enough to remember Ryan White and all the other sad cases.

25,000 Americans had died before he even used the word AIDS in public. Reagan's record on AIDS is shameful to say the least.
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ManuCH
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Mon Jan 04, 2010 9:22 pm



Quoting DocLightning (Reply 6):
A straight guy who has had unprotected sex with 40 women in his life can give blood and I, who have never once in my life had unprotected sex, can't?

I know, and I am discriminated just the way you are. Still, I support the discrimination because apparently, statistics (if we count big numbers, not only you and me) are against us.

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 6):
They can easily do tests on the blood. They can even run a viral genotype on the blood; it takes a few hours to do.

This changes everything. At this point I ask myself: what tests are begin done? Aren't they good enough to beat the statistics? Are cheaper tests done so that some donors need to be excluded "just to make sure"? At the end, if I understand this correctly, it's only a matter of cost - and because of money, people die for lack of blood. Correct?
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Mon Jan 04, 2010 9:37 pm



Quoting Captaink (Reply 9):
I think this has alot to do with the HIV/AIDS screening that is done on persons who have been approved for a Green Card. I assume such screening may not be done, and if it is, it won't be a determining factor as is the case presently.

Do they require HIV tests of those who want Green Cards?

Quoting OA412 (Reply 10):
Quoting DocLightning (Reply 6):
It made no more sense than Texas's (still standing) ban on selling sex toys "because they can transmit HIV."

LOL I had no idea about this. It's 2009 you'd think they would get their heads out of the sand by now.

Oh that's not the reason, its just a really sloppy excuse.

Quoting OA412 (Reply 10):

I'm sure there are several who do. However, since blood is tested it really shouldn't be an issue.

Don't they also sterilize the blood with some sort of laser treatment anyway?
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Mon Jan 04, 2010 9:43 pm



Quoting ManuCH (Reply 11):

This changes everything. At this point I ask myself: what tests are begin done?

At this point, the test is for HIV antibody. The problem is that 30 days after HIV infection about 75% of people have the antibody and by 90 days it is 99+%. So someone who just got infected could have virus without antibody.

The antibody test is the oldest, cheapest, and fastest test. It can be done in as little as 20 minutes with the pre-made kits.

Viral genotyping is more technically demanding because it requires preparation to isolate the nucleic acids, then amplification by RT-PCR and then sequencing. It can be done, but it takes several hours even if done at maximum speed. If the genotype yields no typeable virus, then it is very unlikely that the sample is infected.

There is also viral load testing, which is similar but might miss someone who is infected but has a very low ("undetectable") viral load. A viral load gives you different information than a genotype, which not only can tell you whether there is virus present, but also what its drug resistance patterns are. A load just tells you how many copies of virus there are per milliliter of blood.

Quoting OA412 (Reply 10):

LOL I had no idea about this. It's 2009 you'd think they would get their heads out of the sand by now.

We're talking about Texas and sex here.

Quoting N1120A (Reply 8):

Only if you actually consumed beef Silly

Nope. Anyone. Doesn't matter if they're vegetarian. I'm, just the messenger; don't shoot me!
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Mon Jan 04, 2010 9:47 pm



Quoting N1120A (Reply 12):
Don't they also sterilize the blood with some sort of laser treatment anyway?

I'm not sure about that but I know that blood banks now have a nucleic acid test at their disposal which is able to identify the DNA of HIV and Hepatitis virus in a donor's blood making it that much less likely that infected blood will be transfused into a recipient.
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Mon Jan 04, 2010 10:49 pm



Quoting DocLightning (Reply 13):

Nope. Anyone. Doesn't matter if they're vegetarian. I'm, just the messenger; don't shoot me!

Well, I hate needles anyway, and I lived in England for longer than 6 months.

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 13):

Viral genotyping is more technically demanding because it requires preparation to isolate the nucleic acids, then amplification by RT-PCR and then sequencing. It can be done, but it takes several hours even if done at maximum speed. If the genotype yields no typeable virus, then it is very unlikely that the sample is infected.

PCR = Porn Career Requirement. This is how they do such a good job keeping the porn industry clean.
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Mon Jan 04, 2010 10:57 pm



Quoting RussianJet (Thread starter):
The ban on those carrying HIV or suffering with AIDS entering the US has now been lifted, as promised.

Well that's one less thing the TSA have to look out for at the minute  duck 

No, seriously, that's excellent news. As mentioned above it is more symbolic than anything else, but it does represent a major step forward in the destigmatisation and understanding of the disease.

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 6):
I don't support it. A straight guy who has had unprotected sex with 40 women in his life can give blood and I, who have never once in my life had unprotected sex, can't? More people will die because of all the disqualifiers than will be saved. Yes, I've had to watch a patient die because I couldn't get blood for him.

I'm going to present this from a similar point of view (although mainly UK based)

Its all about the epidemiology, as should the vast majority of medicine. As a gay man (or if we're being pedantic; a man who has sex with men (MSM)), you (and I) are more likely to have HIV than a straight man. No its not fair, and its a broad brush to use.

In general we have an adequate amount of blood to use as required. There are times where we may run a little low, but very rarely are we 'critical'. So surely it makes sense to take blood from the lowest risk members of the population?

A study published, admittedly a few years ago (Soldan & Sinka,Vox Sanguinis, 2003;84(4):265-273), estimated that there was a five-fold increase in risk of HIV entering the blood stream should MSM's be allowed to donate. For the National Blood Service which operates on the principle that 'one blood-borne disease transmission is one too many', I think it makes sense that the ban is enforced.

The evidence is up for review over the coming few months; I think since the above paper was published we will see a significant reduction in risk; tests have become more reliable, the disease is being caught earlier and treated more effectively for example. However the risk will still be higher. Whether this is significant, and whether the NBS (and the public) are willing to accept this risk, is up for debate.

PS I am a gay man, and would love to donate blood. I also have a medical background and am used to looking at evidence critically. The restrictions, at least until the new evidence is published, make sense.
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captaink
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Mon Jan 04, 2010 11:10 pm



Quoting N1120A (Reply 12):

Do they require HIV tests of those who want Green Cards?

Yeh currently it is part of the medical work up.
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Mon Jan 04, 2010 11:17 pm



Quoting DocLightning (Reply 13):
Quoting OA412 (Reply 10):
LOL I had no idea about this. It's 2009 you'd think they would get their heads out of the sand by now.
We're talking about Texas and sex here.

Yeah really. What the hell was I thinking?  laughing 
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Tue Jan 05, 2010 12:29 am



Quoting JER757 (Reply 16):

In general we have an adequate amount of blood to use as required. There are times where we may run a little low, but very rarely are we 'critical'. So surely it makes sense to take blood from the lowest risk members of the population?

The situation in the UK might be better than here, but here it's very often critical.
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comorin
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Tue Jan 05, 2010 12:41 am

Many people of Indian origin can't donate blood either: getting Hep A (Jaundice) is a rite of passage growing up there.
 
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Tue Jan 05, 2010 12:55 am



Quoting DocLightning (Reply 19):
The situation in the UK might be better than here, but here it's very often critical.

In which case, it may be worth taking the risk to gain the extra blood supply, its a decision to be taken on a country by country basis. As you say, you've seen a patient die through lack of available blood; over here I doubt many doctors could say that.
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Wed Jan 06, 2010 3:46 am



Quoting ManuCH (Reply 1):
Someone who has HIV doesn't carry a sign saying so. Who would stop an HIV positive person from lying when entering the US? I have never been taken a blood sample by an immigration official...

I believe it's more linked to residents. I got my Resident Card ("Green Card") recently and one of the tests was HIV. Without HIV negative you wouldn't got your green card.
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Wed Jan 06, 2010 5:45 am



Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 22):
I believe it's more linked to residents. I got my Resident Card ("Green Card") recently and one of the tests was HIV. Without HIV negative you wouldn't got your green card.

Yeh I mentioned that. So with this new law, it is not necessary to do an HIV test as part of the medical work up for a Green Card?
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Thu Jan 07, 2010 12:36 pm



Quoting ManuCH (Reply 1):
In Switzerland you can even get anonymous HIV tests - not even your healthcare provider will be notified.

However, in Switzerland you are not allowed to donate blood if you ever had a voluntary HIV test - so happened to a friend of mine. Go figure the sense behind that one out...
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Thu Jan 07, 2010 10:02 pm



Quoting AustrianZRH (Reply 24):

However, in Switzerland you are not allowed to donate blood if you ever had a voluntary HIV test - so happened to a friend of mine. Go figure the sense behind that one out...

Which is even more absurd because people who get regularly tested are less likely to be infected than people who have similar risk factors, but don't get tested.
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JRDC930
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Thu Jan 07, 2010 10:10 pm



Quoting RussianJet (Thread starter):
The US was previously one of only a dozen countries to have such a ban.

For good reason; this is a contagous disease.

Quoting RussianJet (Thread starter):
This is a victory for common sense and human decency

And a victory for ignorance in my opinion. In most medical cases dealing with contageous diseases, one tends to quarentine infected subjects; not invite them into the general population so they can pass on the disease...very foolish if you ask me; as if wee needed the number of people with aids to go up...
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Thu Jan 07, 2010 10:47 pm



Quoting JRDC930 (Reply 26):

Thank God people with your attitude were not the ones charged with making this decision.
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JRDC930
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Thu Jan 07, 2010 10:54 pm



Quoting OA412 (Reply 27):
Thank God people with your attitude

What, you mean COMMON SENSE? We need to worry about OUR population first, before we start taking in additional burdens. This will place heavier burdens on an already screwed up health care system. Not to mention it is a CONTAGIOUS DISEASE...a simple cut is all it takes to expose the virus to some one else. As if we needed more problems. Im all for being compassionate; but not when it comes to serious and contagious diseases like AIDS.
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Thu Jan 07, 2010 11:26 pm



Quoting JRDC930 (Reply 28):
What, you mean COMMON SENSE?

Your post is the very antithesis of common sense.

Quoting JRDC930 (Reply 28):
a simple cut is all it takes to expose the virus to some one else.

It's just a little bit more difficult to be infected with HIV than that. Perhaps a little education on the ways HIV can and cannot be transmitted is in order before you try and declare yourself and expert on the subject.
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JRDC930
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Thu Jan 07, 2010 11:38 pm

Well it looks like i read the OP wrong; i thought it was lifting the ban on immigration; my apologies. Oh wait im not allowed to make a mistake...  Yeah sure I still think its risky though; never know if they are going to have sex in the states. and i DO hope the ban on people immigrating with HIV doesnt get lifted.
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Thu Jan 07, 2010 11:49 pm



Quoting JRDC930 (Reply 32):
Well it looks like i read the OP wrong; i thought it was lifting the ban on immigration; my apologies. Oh wait im not allowed to make a mistake...

Well..you should have read the OP's thread or clicked on the BBC link  Wink

Quoting JRDC930 (Reply 32):
I still think its risky though; never know if they are going to have sex in the states.

The ONLY way to make sure this doesn't happen is to kill every single HIV+ve person in the USA  Yeah sure

These are things that simply cannot be enforced. How can anyone ensure a HIV +ve visitor (or a HIV +ve citizen for that matter) is not having sex with other people in the US? Its just crazy..
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N1120A
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Fri Jan 08, 2010 1:52 am



Quoting JRDC930 (Reply 28):
a simple cut is all it takes to expose the virus to some one else.

What is this, 1988?
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LipeGIG
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Fri Jan 08, 2010 2:51 am



Quoting Captaink (Reply 23):
Yeh I mentioned that. So with this new law, it is not necessary to do an HIV test as part of the medical work up for a Green Card?

That's right, i talked with my family doctor and he confirmed (he's authorized by immigration to condutct all the tests) that the HIV is not anymore requested as part of the Green Card Analysis.
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Fri Jan 08, 2010 6:26 am



Quoting AustrianZRH (Reply 24):
However, in Switzerland you are not allowed to donate blood if you ever had a voluntary HIV test - so happened to a friend of mine. Go figure the sense behind that one out...

Although it's the first time I hear this one, I think the rationale behind it is "if someone gets tested for HIV, it's because he's had some risky behavior, and therefore could have caught something else that we might miss while screening the blood". After all, you don't just get tested for HIV for fun.

Nonetheless, it doesn't make much sense...
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Fri Jan 08, 2010 4:01 pm

Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 33):
That's right, i talked with my family doctor and he confirmed (he's authorized by immigration to condutct all the tests) that the HIV is not anymore requested as part of the Green Card Analysis.

Excuse my language, but this is fucking asinine. If someone wants to a visa to visit the US, fine. People with HIV/AIDS shouldn't be excluded. If they want to immigrate, they should be immediately excluded. HIV/AIDS treatments are extremely expensive as are hospitalizations, which occur quite often in AIDS patients. What if this person doesn't have insurance? Furthermore, what happens if this person happens to infect more people in the US? That's not good, right? Aren't we trying to eliminate this disease? It's another huge expense pushed onto the taxpayer. And for what? Political correctness and a friendly Obama slap on the back to the homosexual activists. This makes absolutely no sense.

[Edited 2010-01-08 08:11:58]

[Edited 2010-01-08 09:42:49 by Diamond]
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ajd1992
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Fri Jan 08, 2010 4:15 pm



Quoting TZ757300 (Reply 4):

I still find it odd that you still cannot donate blood if you are a male and have had any kind of sexual contact with a male after 1975, just because you may get AIDS/HIV. I'd love to see that ban removed.

Here you can't give blood if you've ever done ANYTHING sexual with a man (if you're male), if you've had a tattoo within 6 months (understandable), if you've used a prostitute within 6 months, if you've been to Africa/Asia within 12 months, etc etc blah blah blah. Yet, lesbians are allowed to give blood freely.

And they wonder why they are always asking for more donors....  Yeah sure

Either way, this is a good thing for everybody. HIV isn't always caught by having unprotected sex obviously so this is a step forward.
 
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Fri Jan 08, 2010 4:29 pm



Quoting Ajd1992 (Reply 36):
Either way, this is a good thing for everybody. HIV isn't always caught by having unprotected sex obviously so this is a step forward.

Isn't HIV in the heterosexual community getting up to rates like those in the homosexual community?

HIV and Homosexuality in the same sentence was a thing of the past in my opinion. Right now I hear HIV and unprotected sex.
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Fri Jan 08, 2010 4:53 pm

They had a blood drive at my high school when I was 17. They said you had to be at least 17 to give, and also your systolic had to be 100 or greater. Mine was 95. I guess I kinda liked having an excuse to duck the needle, but I had lined up in the first place because I wanted to help!!!

Does BP really say something about the quality of the blood itself? I thought it just meant my heart's batteries needed recharging.

(Systolic is the first one, right? If your BP is "bla over boo" then bla is systolic and boo is diastolic? (Not that I know what those words mean either, but still.))

 Smile
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ajd1992
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Fri Jan 08, 2010 5:05 pm



Quoting Captaink (Reply 37):
Isn't HIV in the heterosexual community getting up to rates like those in the homosexual community?

HIV and Homosexuality in the same sentence was a thing of the past in my opinion. Right now I hear HIV and unprotected sex.

That's why I specifically didn't put unprotected gay sex, because I know straight sex is just as risky. Apparently straight white women are most at risk (at least in the UK) but there is a lot of blame on the gay community.

But hey, it gives me more of an excuse not to give blood. Apparently being scared of needles isn't enough, but now I can just say I'm not allowed Big grin But to be brutally honest, if they don't want my blood then that's fine, all the more for me. I've never had full sex with a man, yet I'm not allowed to give blood. I suppose it's fine that I've had unprotected (with contraception, might I add) sex with a woman, that doesn't matter to them as long as it's not been up some guy...  Confused  Yeah sure

https://secure.blood.co.uk/c11_cant.asp

All we need now is a vaccine for HIV and we'll be a lot better off.
 
captaink
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Fri Jan 08, 2010 5:37 pm



Quoting Ajd1992 (Reply 39):
But hey, it gives me more of an excuse not to give blood. Apparently being scared of needles isn't enough, but now I can just say I'm not allowed Big grin But to be brutally honest, if they don't want my blood then that's fine, all the more for me. I've never had full sex with a man, yet I'm not allowed to give blood. I suppose it's fine that I've had unprotected (with contraception, might I add) sex with a woman, that doesn't matter to them as long as it's not been up some guy... Confused Yeah sure

It's amazing that these uninformed double standards exist in 2010 huh.. :S
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JRDC930
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Fri Jan 08, 2010 6:14 pm



Quoting JCS17 (Reply 35):
If they want to immigrate, they should be immediately excluded. HIV/AIDS treatments are extremely expensive as are hospitalizations, which occur quite often in AIDS patients. What if this person doesn't have insurance? Furthermore, what happens if this person happens to infect more people in the US? That's not good, right? Aren't we trying to eliminate this disease? It's another huge expense pushed onto the taxpayer. And for what? Political correctness and a friendly Obama slap on the back to the homosexual activists. This makes absolutely no sense.

Agreed. I can see a bit more leniency when it comes to just visits, but under no circumstances should they be allowed to immigrate; let their native country deal with that problem; we already import almost everything we buy; as if the promiscuity culture didnt already produce high rates of the disease, theres no need IMO to import more disease as well.
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OA412
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Sat Jan 09, 2010 10:04 am



Quoting JCS17 (Reply 35):
People with HIV/AIDS shouldn't be excluded. If they want to immigrate, they should be immediately excluded.

Excluding those who are HIV positive from immigrating to any given country made sense in 1985 when the routes of transmission were still not completely understood but this is 2009 and given what we now know about HIV/AIDS such a policy makes no sense.

Quoting JCS17 (Reply 35):
Furthermore, what happens if this person happens to infect more people in the US? That's not good, right?

You assume that those who know that they are HIV positive are out there infecting others. You assume wrong. The vast majority of people who are living with HIV are much more apt to take precautions so that they do not infect their partners.

Quoting JCS17 (Reply 35):
It's another huge expense pushed onto the taxpayer. And for what? Political correctness and a friendly Obama slap on the back to the homosexual activists.

This isn't about political correctness or appeasing gay activists, it is about ethical correctness. This change in policy most certainly came about as a result of the threats that Uganda was making to execute those with HIV/AIDS. Furthermore, I'm sure the Obama administration consulted medical professionals prior to making such a change in policy. I trust that these professionals are well aware of the pros and cons of eliminating such a ban.

Quoting JCS17 (Reply 35):
This makes absolutely no sense.

On the contrary, it makes perfect sense.
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ManuCH
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Sat Jan 09, 2010 12:26 pm



Quoting Captaink (Reply 37):
Isn't HIV in the heterosexual community getting up to rates like those in the homosexual community?

HIV and Homosexuality in the same sentence was a thing of the past in my opinion. Right now I hear HIV and unprotected sex.

Unfortunately, HIV is still more common in homosexuals than heterosexuals, according to statistics.
Never trust a statistic you didn't fake yourself
 
RussianJet
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Sat Jan 09, 2010 12:36 pm



Quoting JRDC930 (Reply 26):
For good reason; this is a contagous disease.

I suggest you read up on how HIV is transmitted.

Quoting JRDC930 (Reply 26):
And a victory for ignorance in my opinion. In most medical cases dealing with contageous diseases, one tends to quarentine infected subjects; not invite them into the general population so they can pass on the disease...very foolish if you ask me; as if wee needed the number of people with aids to go up...

I suppose you think that AIDS can be acquired from sharing toilet seats or breathing the same air? Why the hell would you quarantine people who carry HIV or suffer with AIDS? People living with HIV or AIDS are no dangerous sat in the same room as you or sharing the same facilities with you than anyone else would be.

Quoting OA412 (Reply 27):
Quoting JRDC930 (Reply 26):

Thank God people with your attitude were not the ones charged with making this decision.

 checkmark  A good thing indeed.

Quoting JRDC930 (Reply 28):
Im all for being compassionate;

You could have fooled us. There is a distinct lack of compassion in a great number of your posts, both on this subject and several others.
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JRDC930
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Sat Jan 09, 2010 10:14 pm



Quoting ManuCH (Reply 43):
Unfortunately, HIV is still more common in homosexuals than heterosexuals

Not to nit pick but the way you worded this implies youd prefer to see HIV become more common in heterosexuals. Am i correct in assuming that is not really what you meant to say?
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DocLightning
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Sun Jan 10, 2010 2:20 am



Quoting JRDC930 (Reply 26):

And a victory for ignorance in my opinion. In most medical cases dealing with contageous diseases, one tends to quarentine infected subjects; not invite them into the general population so they can pass on the disease...very foolish if you ask me; as if wee needed the number of people with aids to go up...

I hope that you never get infected. You think you're immune because you're a good Catholic, but it just takes that one tainted blood transfusion. I wonder if you would subject yourself to such voluntary quarantine.
-Doc Lightning-

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JRDC930
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Sun Jan 10, 2010 2:45 am



Quoting DocLightning (Reply 46):
but it just takes that one tainted blood transfusion. I wonder if you would subject yourself to such voluntary quarantine.

I have no problem with the people who aquired HIV through no fault of their own, you know blood transfusions, or stuff like that. I just dont sympathyze with those who aquired it because of promiscuity; something one CAN control. Besides in a first world country it is VERY unllikely youll catch HIV from a blood transfusion; hospitals are supposed to check for that, and if you do get it from that; well you can still sue the hospital i suppose.
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OA412
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Sun Jan 10, 2010 2:49 am



Quoting JRDC930 (Reply 47):
I just dont sympathyze with those who aquired it because of promiscuity

Right because people are out there actively trying to get infected.  Yeah sure
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DocLightning
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RE: US Ends AIDS/HIV Immigration Ban

Sun Jan 10, 2010 2:53 am



Quoting JRDC930 (Reply 47):

I have no problem with the people who aquired HIV through no fault of their own, you know blood transfusions, or stuff like that. I just dont sympathyze with those who aquired it because of promiscuity; something one CAN control.

Do you sympathize with a quadruplegic who became that way because they were skiing?
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